NationStates Jolt Archive

I've been thinking about this one for a while. It could center on some turkish empire or Arabic alliance who either take over Isreal OR already have it. HTen the Pope could call for a crusade and we build off of that. It may sound dumb, but this is a bit of a basic overview of the first post. It could start like this:

From the Hospitaller Wire Service
Jerusalem, the Holy Land
After an escalation of tensions in the past weeks, the Holy Land has erupted in full-scale warfare. A coalition led by _____ has launched an attack larger than that of the 1973 Six-Day war. ______ Forces are converging on Jerusalem as we speak. The Isreali military is in shambles. what will happen no one knows.

(Sorry I will post more later.)

the cardinals of Christworld are in negotiation with the Nation of Kaptaingood for the purchase of aero equipment and military equipment to equip our legions and zealots.

The cardinals would be most interested in benovelently bringing the love and peace of Christ to the infidels with the use of aero assault ships.

We tentatively commit at the completion of the new fleet two assault carriers, two destroyers and a cruiser and two divisions, one of zealots and one of legionaires.

ooc: will you allow the use of this technology? and i think just like the real crusades, I think after a number of years it is only fair that they repulse us with big losses to both sides coming to respect the ways of the other

what are the parameters of this RP (am a relative newbie but looking forward to a game).

Yeah, too bad that issue on genocide prevents UN members from participating....

Nicapolis would love to help in this worthy cause. The huge military and economic might of my country should be able to liberate the Holy Land. However, we are an Anglican nation and would not listen to a single word the pope would say.

ooc: perhaps an alliance of christian nations?

it would make for interesting RPing, mid battle the AOGers turn, the scientologists start doing something different, the orthodox capture a general of the anglicans etc?

also mid battle alliances between sunni's and lutherans turn on the others?

if you set out the ground rules, it could be a lot of fun! also athiest nations might want to play to stamp out neo christian imperialism without endorsing muslim values?

cheers

I already formed an alliance somewhat like you spoke of. It's called The Posse Comitatus (The Power of The Country). It's a mainly anti-Communist, Right-Wing, Christian alliance. For more info, please check this out: http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?p=7624883#post7624883

ooc: interested. I agree with Christworld. This sounds like fun.

I like the idea of a modern tech crusade But I'm roleplaying (starting to roleplay; I'm new at this) Serpent Country as a usually peaceful, secular island nation. So, Serpent Country will probably end up as a reluctant ally on the opposite side to whoever attacks it first (the Crusaders probably)? Maybe it could be a stepping stone on an alternate, island path to the holy land.

I'd like to see how the ground rules are set up, since I'm a newbie idiot.

My nation is Pagan, you can invade if you want to try to "convert the heathens." I think then we fight it to a long bloody standstill until you pull out or something?

we are joining

Is there any profit in it?

Maybe there could be 3 groups. The Christian group who launch a crusade, the Islamic group who are trying to hold on to the holy land, and the Jewish group who want to reclaim Israel as the land of the Jews. I will be no3 if required. I could probably get one or two other nations as well.

Maybe there could be 3 groups. The Christian group who launch a crusade, the Islamic group who are trying to hold on to the holy land, and the Jewish group who want to reclaim Israel as the land of the Jews. I will be no3 if required. I could probably get one or two other nations as well.

I never thought of that. I am glad that there is so much intrest. Right now I guess that to start this we would need a Turkish or Muslim nation to actually have some kind war. Anyone interested?

I think that do pull this off we would need factional leaders. I probably would be leading the Crusaders, but we would need someone to be in charge of the Turkish/Muslim alliance. I s anyone intrested in this?
Also, for those asking, there would be no immediate benefits, other than govenment contracts (like Halliburton) and whatever you can get from the Turks. Stealing property would be frowned upon. These rules would only apply to those who wished to act under the Crusader banner, though. I would allow the Turkish/Muslim leader free reign as to how he wished to run his campaign. The only definite rule is NO FUTURE TECH OR WMD's. Those tend to screw everything up, with some maniac coming out with star destroyers destroying every thing moving with a bio-bomb or something.
Yeah, too bad that issue on genocide prevents UN members from participating....

How So?

ooc: perhaps an alliance of christian nations?

it would make for interesting RPing, mid battle the AOGers turn, the scientologists start doing something different, the orthodox capture a general of the anglicans etc?

also mid battle alliances between sunni's and lutherans turn on the others?

if you set out the ground rules, it could be a lot of fun! also athiest nations might want to play to stamp out neo christian imperialism without endorsing muslim values?

cheers

Yeah, an alliance of Christian nations would work. As a matter of fact, I'm running a thread against an Islamic nation now (see Al Jabur al Shek/Xeraph thread). How about we use this thread to build a case against all Islamic nations, bearing in mind that there are "friendly" Muslims out there, as well as some pretty large and powerful Islamic nations.

Alaric

Hah! Another Crusade that will be crushed by the forces of Islam, as those that were beaten by our ancestors so long ago. Try, if you dare........

Ali ben Notar

Hah! Another Crusade that will be crushed by the forces of Islam, as those that were beaten by our ancestors so long ago. Try, if you dare........

Ali ben Notar

Dear Ali ben Moron,

Youv'e got to be kidding. Maybe the Saracens were mighty in their day, but you are dealing with armies whose MT military can obliterate you, never mind the FT. Alaric of Xeraph is my liege lord, and the Grey Phoenix pledges full military support to the Empire.

Prince Vlad, in the Name of the Emperor

OOC: sounds cool. count me in. Can I ally myself with Israel and the Jews? My nation is religiously diverse, but historically we've helped Jews, Christians, and Hindus and fought Muslims.

and because of my OCD, I have to point to St. JOhn that the Six Day war was is 1967. 1973 was the Yom Kippur War.

Can I have Saudi Arabia and Iraq? :p If so, then I'm in. ;) What I mean, is that I want to conquer them after we recapture the Holy Land and route the Arabian armies.

I would be a nation defending israel if something like this happened(Against religions in general, but defending a religious crusade would take precedence over ignoring the conflict because of atheistic beliefs).

I would assume we would use our real nations, and maybe control some RL land too...or something along those lines...

perhaps an new thread started, by someone, calling for armies to retake Jerusalem!

I would like to play too. ;)

I think it would be fair that the parameters be set out first.

It would be fun replaying history, the allies conquor the cities, and most of the trade routs, infighting and bickering as well as a resurgant islamic army cuts supply, starts driving a wedge between the allies.

the trade routes are cut, the armies are fighting, forced back to acra, the Richard/henry(?) scene gets played out where the brits get betrayed by the french.

loius redoubles the attack, the last euro/christian forces get driven back to acra and constantinople where they hold out for a few decades under truce and occassional fighting.

the whole thing is a drain on the western economies, and we sack the byzantines and go home with the booty?

when do we start?

bump

I'm so in on this. Religiously, my nation follows the Generian Orthodox Church, so it might be interesting to have a secondary battle occuring between the Catholic Crusaders who follow the Pope, and my Generian Orthodox Christians who think that everyone who isn't one of them is the devil.

To actually start, we need a nation to run the Muslim nations. Are there any out there? :confused: The only nation that has expressed interest is Al Jabur al Shek, but he seems kind of new at this, and sounded as if he only wanted to shoot down this idea. Please TG me if you are interested.

All these proposed ideas are great, but I think that it would be easiest to stick to the main ideas. Unless maybe, it is some ethnic groups in areas conquered/liberated (depending on your view) make a civil war similar to Lebanon. But I say that becomes a separate thread AFTER Hostilities end between the Christians and the Muslim armies. Sort of like after WWII, when different groups (usually communists partisans or their opponents) fought each other for power (like Yugoslavia).

Also thanks for correcting my mistake. Isreal has been attacked over and over, so its easy toget the dates mixed up.

To actually start, we need a nation to run the Muslim nations. Are there any out there? :confused: The only nation that has expressed interest is Al Jabur al Shek, but he seems kind of new at this, and sounded as if he only wanted to shoot down this idea. Please TG me if you are interested.

All these proposed ideas are great, but I think that it would be easiest to stick to the main ideas. Unless maybe, it is some ethnic groups in areas conquered/liberated (depending on your view) make a civil war similar to Lebanon. But I say that becomes a separate thread AFTER Hostilities end between the Christians and the Muslim armies. Sort of like after WWII, when different groups (usually communists partisans or their opponents) fought each other for power (like Yugoslavia).

Also thanks for correcting my mistake. Isreal has been attacked over and over, so its easy toget the dates mixed up.

Xeraph has the Remnants of the Knights Templar. There were at one time 3 different nations who claimed them. The other two are no longer in existence. Xeraph has approx 2500 of them on the Palace grounds.

One small problem with the Jewish army... we were thrown out of Israel. We need a base somewhere, shall we just say that we set up temporary camp in the desert?

bump

bump

One small problem with the Jewish army... we were thrown out of Israel. We need a base somewhere, shall we just say that we set up temporary camp in the desert?

You could have something similar to the Free French in WWII, hopefully not divided between Gaullists (as in Charles de Gaulle, I think tha the spelling) and Communists. They could link up with Spec ops of Crusading nations (becausethe area they would be in should be occupied by Turks), or, alternatively, go it alone and change alliances to which ever side suits you.

We still need someone to act as the turks, otherwise this just won't work.

Does the pretext actually have to be liberating Isreal? :p

Does the pretext actually have to be liberating Isreal? :p

The pretext of liberating Israel has long been the reason for many, if not all, of the original crusades. I contend that the present-day liberation of Israel would have to include the liberation of the Temple on the Mount from the clutches of Islam. It is a slap in the face of all that we hold dear, and a mockery of the Holy City of Jerusalem.
It would have to be determined which Islamic sect holds this area, and what protection, if any, is keeping this Mohammedan Temple from being removed. Once this has been accomplished, the Islamic Temple could either be re-dedicated to the God of Israel, or torn down and replaced with the Temple to be built in the Last Days.

The full complement of the Knights Templars are ready and willing to be deployed in this undertaking. They are fully armed with modern weapons, and have the full support of the Xeraphian government.

We ask all Crusaders to join us in this Crusade!!!!!!!!!

bump

The pretext of liberating Israel has long been the reason for many, if not all, of the original crusades. I contend that the present-day liberation of Israel would have to include the liberation of the Temple on the Mount from the clutches of Islam. It is a slap in the face of all that we hold dear, and a mockery of the Holy City of Jerusalem.
It would have to be determined which Islamic sect holds this area, and what protection, if any, is keeping this Mohammedan Temple from being removed. Once this has been accomplished, the Islamic Temple could either be re-dedicated to the God of Israel, or torn down and replaced with the Temple to be built in the Last Days.

The full complement of the Knights Templars are ready and willing to be deployed in this undertaking. They are fully armed with modern weapons, and have the full support of the Xeraphian government.

We ask all Crusaders to join us in this Crusade!!!!!!!!!


That's not what I meant to say. :headbang: I could come up with a good reason for my nation to invade Isreal.

don't forget the original crusaders were anti semitic.

It would be interesting to see a three/four way battle, or even temporary alliances between jews and muslims who at the time lived in relative peace.

Muslims pre-mongol invasion in the 13th? 14th? c were quite accepting of any monoethiast (sp?) religions, and their universities/colleges were learning centres for education, translation etc for jews, christians and muslims.

abraham was seen as leading prophet for all three religions and it was a period of enlightement through the islamic world, they were superior toolsmiths, farmers, teachers, scholars, weavers etc.

the mongol invasion changed the face of islam dramatically.

if anything christians at that time were limited in their learning philosophy, cosmology etc.

its fascinating how many medievil/renaissance painting show women and men wearing arab silks/gowns etc, in good christian scenes with words from the koran woven into the hems, inc. portraits of Mary and the christ himself.

OOC: Hmm... This is an original idea... TAG

Why not the thread owner St John Hospitaller kicking off the thread. wouldn't mind if Christworld gets a telegram of the thread title so I don't miss it off.

I reckon my nation with about 133 million compulsory military training, and a booming budget would have about 500,000 regular soldiers and 500,000 reserves and 500,000 conscripts/nasho's in the army, plus maybe 20 to 25 fighter squadrons 5 to 10 strike aircraft plus support aircraft, and a modest navy.

I reckon economically I'm somewhere round Japan consumer market economy, socially north korea/saudi/taliban however religious based (saudi but christian instead of islamic) and politically cuba/china with a theocratic rule of iron.

I think putting 10 to 20 divisions (100,000 to 200,000) would not be in appropriate and wouldn't destroy the nation economically or leave us overly vulnerable, the force would be a mix of regular, conscripts and reservists, with supply field hospitals etc.


with 10 christian nations that would be 1 to 2 million troops well trained and well equiped with moderate to poor morale vs. a unpredictable force of israelis whou wouldn't want to lose jerusalem, highly trained, high morale and high motivation, and maybe 5 to 10 million average to poorly trained, high morale high motivation but poorly equiped arabs plus a huge civilian and insurgent population badly armed, no training and suicide strike attitudes.

I think the outcome should replicate history, but there seems to be a lot of interest.

Hey. Could I be the guy that controls the Middle Eastern factions? I really do need that oil.

As a member of the UN I request that your activities must stop at once, it violates both religous tolerance laws and genocide as well. Also it will brew up anti islamic sentiment in crusader's countries. Stop this or I will request the UN nation to start an Embargo

I still want to ally with Israel :D . Mossad, El Al, Israeli Defense Forces, Sayarot...badass.

As a member of the UN I request that your activities must stop at once, it violates both religous tolerance laws and genocide as well. Also it will brew up anti islamic sentiment in crusader's countries. Stop this or I will request the UN nation to start an Embargo

OOC> lighten up, bot-boy......this is a game, and this just happens to be one of the more interesting threads in the past couple of months.

bump

I'll play the faction that is defending the Middle East, but my nation wouldn't conquer it for religious reasons. Like I said, it would have to be about something like oil.

I'll play the faction that is defending the Middle East, but my nation wouldn't conquer it for religious reasons. Like I said, it would have to be about something like oil.


Xeraph would like to control the borders between the Arab States and Israel, sort of a demilitarised zone. We'll post 3500 Armored Troopers there to back up our active Templar Forces, as well as our shock troops, the New Advent Warriors. Templars and NAW totals are approx 4500 troops.

So that means that you want Isreal?

Nicapolis could easily supply 1 million troops to this righteous cause. We are a massive nation of 2.9 billion and have HUGE defence budget

Look given the lack of energy I'm going to kick of the thread.

also to the UN chiefs, this is a game, genocide was caused by the original crusaders, but 1. they were defeated, 2. the muslims forces conquered southern italy, most of spain and marched through south of france, and conquered much of eastern europe through the middle ages, so the war was two ways.

secondly many now consider the crusades morally wrong, but they did it anyway.

finally the crusaders were as much enemies of each as they were off the muslims, the french and brits were at each others throats, Constantinople was sacked by the allies, etc.

It was by all accounts some of the most intriguing, brilliant history, and also one of the darkest periods of history from a moral western perspective, up there with the nazi rampages through europe, the napoleonic wars, etc.

People just want to analyse the war from the perspective of modern technology.

http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=381717

Look given the lack of energy I'm going to kick of the thread.

also to the UN chiefs, this is a game, genocide was caused by the original crusaders, but 1. they were defeated, 2. the muslims forces conquered southern italy, most of spain and marched through south of france, and conquered much of eastern europe through the middle ages, so the war was two ways.

secondly many now consider the crusades morally wrong, but they did it anyway.

finally the crusaders were as much enemies of each as they were off the muslims, the french and brits were at each others throats, Constantinople was sacked by the allies, etc.

It was by all accounts some of the most intriguing, brilliant history, and also one of the darkest periods of history from a moral western perspective, up there with the nazi rampages through europe, the napoleonic wars, etc.

People just want to analyse the war from the perspective of modern technology.

Ok, I've been busy the past few days but ok, go ahead and start without me. Also, you are completely wrong in the assumption that this was the darkest period in Western history. The Crusades were launched in self defense. The Muslims may have conquered us had we not launched the Crusades. I will check out your thread, Christworld, but may launch one of my own soon if it isn't what I was thinking about.

no worries.

I might join your as well and play them as two events (ie in your reality, the one I started didn't exist, and similarly in the thread I started).

should be a fun RP.

I would say that defending from invasion your home is far more honourable than invading the home of another, so to say defeat suleiman(one of the many names attribed to this historical figure), was of the same worth as defeating the crusaders, or driving out the moors from spain.

cheers

CW.

Ok, I've been busy the past few days but ok, go ahead and start without me. Also, you are completely wrong in the assumption that this was the darkest period in Western history. The Crusades were launched in self defense. The Muslims may have conquered us had we not launched the Crusades. I will check out your thread, Christworld, but may launch one of my own soon if it isn't what I was thinking about.

OOC<> If you want to get technical about it, the Crusades were launched to locate and retain the Holy Grail, which just happened to be in the general region of Judea. If anyone has read "Holy Blood, Holy Grail" or the DaVinci Code, you'll agree. And even if it's a bunch of crap, it makes an interesting theory, and therefore an interesting thread.

wrong the Crusades were launched in response to a plea by the Byzantine Emperor Alexius Comnenus to the Pope asking him to get the Christian Princes to help him against the Turks. The Pope thought that it would be good for the Christian rulers to stop fighting eachother and fight the infidel. He just spiced it up and made them attack Palestine and not the Seljuk saultanate

Sry, started to post but didn't hit reply, so this is a little late.

I have begun a crusade thread its address is:

http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=382399