NationStates Jolt Archive

To, Paris, France, Leader of Chellis.

From, Barracuda, Bulgaria, General Nomad, Foreign Affairs, Dr_Twist.

Dear Leader (No idea who it is?)

Over the last Few Days you have had Closed the Straight of Gibraltar, The Dr_Twist Government as you know has always been close to the Chellis Government, However the Closing of the Straight is only Interesting Tensions in an already Tension filled Area.

We are asking the Chellis Government to Reopen the Straight Immediately to non Naval Shipping at once as many life’s within Africa and Europe are being Affected by the what is seen as Illegal in the eyes of the Dr_Twist Government closing of the Straight.

The Straight itself must be reopened at once for non Naval Shipping, The Dr_Twist Government is also concerned that Chellis is abusing its power in the Area by using Economic Warfare upon smaller Helpless nations within the Region by Closing the Straight, We have requested the backing of NWO and RBA in this Matter that if the straight isn't reopened to non Naval Shipping within 24 Hours what is Seen as International Waters in the Eyes of the Dr_Twist Government request Naval Mobilization by NWO and RBA members in an attempt to Remove this Illegal Blockade in the Straight of Gibraltar.

Foreign Minister, General Nomad.

OCC: For those in Response to why I am Calling the Blockade Illegal is, Because no Nation in Nation States unless it is a requirement for an alliance or other Organization has actually agreed to Recognize other National Waters Making them all Technically International waters.

Dr_Twist.

From: President Raslin(In chellis, not france. Message is forwarded.)

To:Barracuda, Bulgaria, General Nomad, Foreign Affairs, Dr_Twist

Re: Strait

The only thing happening here is Dr.twist making tensions worse by making threats, while only a delicate peace exists in Europe. We have the right to close our waters. We are gaining excellent data from these exercises. Shipping can re-route through the suez, or wait the 5 more days for the strait to open. We are not damaging anyone that badly. 7 days wait is not that long.

It would take longer to force open the strait than 5 days. It makes no sense to force us to do this. It would create a war, and close the strait for much longer than five days. You are ruining peace.

From: President Raslin(In chellis, not france. Message is forwarded.)

To:Barracuda, Bulgaria, General Nomad, Foreign Affairs, Dr_Twist

Re: Strait

The only thing happening here is Dr.twist making tensions worse by making threats, while only a delicate peace exists in Europe. We have the right to close our waters. We are gaining excellent data from these exercises. Shipping can re-route through the suez, or wait the 5 more days for the strait to open. We are not damaging anyone that badly. 7 days wait is not that long.

It would take longer to force open the strait than 5 days. It makes no sense to force us to do this. It would create a war, and close the strait for much longer than five days. You are ruining peace.

To: President Raslin, Chellis.

From: Barracuda, Bulgaria, General Nomad, Foreign Affairs, Dr_Twist

Dear Sir.

All we are asking is that the Straight Reopens to Civilian Shipping we Understand that Naval Shipping would still be blocked and For Good reason, But all we Are asking is the reopening of the Straights to Civilian Traffic, Cargo Ships Oil Ships Passenger ships, Even if they were Given Naval Convoys.

This Blockade upon Civilian Shipping is nothing more then damaging and with no reason to Block Civilian Shipping as such should be allowed to continue to use the Straight.

General Nomad.

To: President Raslin, Chellis.

From: Barracuda, Bulgaria, General Nomad, Foreign Affairs, Dr_Twist

Dear Sir.

All we are asking is that the Straight Reopens to Civilian Shipping we Understand that Naval Shipping would still be blocked and For Good reason, But all we Are asking is the reopening of the Straights to Civilian Traffic, Cargo Ships Oil Ships Passenger ships, Even if they were Given Naval Convoys.

This Blockade upon Civilian Shipping is nothing more then damaging and with no reason to Block Civilian Shipping as such should be allowed to continue to use the Straight.

General Nomad.

From: President Raslin, Chellis.

To: Barracuda, Bulgaria, General Nomad, Foreign Affairs, Dr_Twist

It seems you don't understand why we have closed the straits for this. The exercise is consisting of special forces infiltrating our defenses, and we have been getting very good data off of this. Having civilian ships passing through would ruin the training, as we can't have our ships firing on civilian ships. While we do use non-lethal weapons for these purposes, if we had to check every civilian ship for special forces, then it would ruin the purpose. The training is in an inviorment where hte straits would be closed.

There are many ways to get things to nations if its urgent. If its not urgent, they can wait 5 days. Dr.twist is trying to deny chellis' right to close the straits, and we won't have this. We have the right!

After some Research, Since Chellis is Following Real Life water Territorial Claims upon the Gibraltar Straight. I would like the Chellis Government to look here as it gives you the Information needed on the Situation Clearly Outlining that the Chellis Government has Clearly Violated Spanish Waters.

http://www.gibnet.com/fish/waters.gif

http://www.gibnet.com/fish/waters.htm

Dr_Twist.

OOC:

I would like alert Chellis to the following:

http://www.gibnet.com/fish/waters.htm

You controlling Gibraltar does not mean you control the Staights as proven by above evidence, however you can close the straights by force (see Britain WWII), however this would be damned by many nations. You would also be in violation of Macabean Territorial Waters... :)

Whoops, sorry Twist didn't see you there :)

After some Research, Since Chellis is Following Real Life water Territorial Claims upon the Gibraltar Straight. I would like the Chellis Government to look here as it gives you the Information needed on the Situation Clearly Outlining that the Chellis Government has Clearly Violated Spanish Waters.

http://www.gibnet.com/fish/waters.gif

http://www.gibnet.com/fish/waters.htm

Dr_Twist.

These maps don't represent NS. Spain does not hold that section of morocco, so those waters dont count. We hold more than the part of gibraltar shown. We control the straits.

These maps don't represent NS. Spain does not hold that section of morocco, so those waters dont count. We hold more than the part of gibraltar shown. We control the straits.

Even If you did control that Part of Morocco which is still contested, You don't however hold any more then that Part of Gibraltar Shown as such if i Refer but to crucible thread, You clearly stated that you will only take control of the Fort of Gibraltar with possible control of the Region itself, Now Chellis your Ability to Close the Straight as far as i can see right now is Flawed, as such you must reopen the Straight as you are now Violating Spanish Waters, Which is an act of War.

Dr_Twist.

Even If you did control that Part of Morocco which is still contested, You don't however hold any more then that Part of Gibraltar Shown as such if i Refer but to crucible thread, You clearly stated that you will only take control of the Fort of Gibraltar with possible control of the Region itself, Now Chellis your Ability to Close the Straight as far as i can see right now is Flawed, as such you must reopen the Straight as you are now Violating Spanish Waters, Which is an act of War.

Dr_Twist.

OOC: Remember the maps? I controlled the region of gibraltar, not just the fort. I only sent troops to the fort part. Im sorry for any confusing. Gotta go to school, don't start anything.

IC: We will not be opening it. You attack us, you are the direct cause of millions of deaths.

OOC: Remember the maps? I controlled the region of gibraltar, not just the fort. I only sent troops to the fort part. Im sorry for any confusing. Gotta go to school, don't start anything.

IC: We will not be opening it. You attack us, you are the direct cause of millions of deaths.

Still the Pink on the Picture is the Region of Gibraltar, You don't have the Right to close the Straight, every Nation within Nation States will now be Reading this Thread and will Pickup that you don't have the Right to close the Straight itself.

I am now Requesting NATO step in to Request Chellis to Remove his Blockade of the Straight because of Right now he is Violating Spanish Sovereignty, Which is a Violation of International Law and is a reason for War.

Nations of the World you are Allowed to go Thought Spanish Waters as they are Protected by the Spanish themselves.

I am Sorry Chellis but you must Stand down you are now Causing a massive World Issue that is only making things worse in Europe, Only you can stop a Possible war in Europe now as you are now In Violation of Spanish Sovereign waters!

Dr_Twist.

OOC: Remember the maps? I controlled the region of gibraltar, not just the fort. I only sent troops to the fort part. Im sorry for any confusing. Gotta go to school, don't start anything.

IC: We will not be opening it. You attack us, you are the direct cause of millions of deaths.

OOC: Chellis, Gib is Gib only as in the big rock, there is no additional provinces with it. Besides, it doesn't matter because people can get through via sticking close to Ceuta. You cannot keep them closed without using your navy.

OOC: Just send subs to go under his blockade and then suprise him by surfacing on the other side of his ships. But they can be detected by radar, and I'm just assuming that he doesnt have any subs with his blockade.

-tag-

The Union will support DR twist in this matter due to having interest in The striate

The Empire of Risban concurs with the venerable General Nomad of Dr._Twist. The strait must be reopened and this is a violation of International Law. The Empire of Risban will offer any support it can to the 'liberation' of the strait.

To: Nations Involved
Re: Gibraltar

Pilot implores all nations involved to seak a peaceful solution to the conflict before resorting to military force.

The IH Med Fleet(7th), currently just South of Italy has been put onto a higher state of the alert, as has the 6th Fleet in the North Atlantic which is currently en route to a joint training exercise with Macabee Naval units off the West coast of Spain.

OOC to outside.

President David Mitchell
Get our intellegence forces in Micronesia ready, run some high-level flights. Get as much information as we can, if anyone shoots, I want to know about it before the other side knows about it. That trading route is just as important to us and we can't have it marred in conflict.

General Alexander Shinshexi
Yes, sir.

Even If you did control that Part of Morocco which is still contested, You don't however hold any more then that Part of Gibraltar Shown as such if i Refer but to crucible thread, You clearly stated that you will only take control of the Fort of Gibraltar with possible control of the Region itself, Now Chellis your Ability to Close the Straight as far as i can see right now is Flawed, as such you must reopen the Straight as you are now Violating Spanish Waters, Which is an act of War.

Dr_Twist.

We own the region as well, we simply had no forces in there, as a sign of goodwill. Spain is divided into regions, and the maps showed we had the bottom most one. I will get a map of regions and point out which one I own.

---

We own the Section of Andalucia, the southernmost part, named Cadiz. The map we used on Cruicible showed us having it, but that map is a dead link now. Regardless, we own the waters between Gibraltar, Cadiz, and Morocco. We are in our rights to block it for four more days. The only people making an issue of this is Dr.Twist, who is destroying the peace process.

We own the region as well, we simply had no forces in there, as a sign of goodwill. Spain is divided into regions, and the maps showed we had the bottom most one. I will get a map of regions and point out which one I own.

---

We own the Section of Andalucia, the southernmost part, named Cadiz. The map we used on Cruicible showed us having it, but that map is a dead link now. Regardless, we own the waters between Gibraltar, Cadiz, and Morocco. We are in our rights to block it for four more days. The only people making an issue of this is Dr.Twist, who is destroying the peace process.

There has never been a Comment in the Past of Chellis ever taking the Region of Ceuta, Chellis the Lands are Spanish and you have never mentioned Taking them on any level, you are now claiming to take them where it benefits yourself, This Blockade continues to be Illegal.

OOC: Let him have them.

IC:

CTF-2 is currently in transit to the western area of the Bay of Biscay, two hundred kilometers of the Chellian French coast, well out of Chellian waters. Also, the Macabee Government has officially proclaimed the Bay of Biscay Macabees national waters - if the claiming of the Straits isn't illegal, this should be fine.

OOC:

6 Model class Carriers
5 Raus class Escort Carriers
4 Rommel class Battleships
15 Seydlitz class Cruisers
15 Clauswitz class Frigates
20 Manstein class Destroyers
40 Patrol Boats
10 Balck class Missile Boats
30 Toledo class SSNs
50 Assorted Logistical Shipping


For those naval wargames IH was talking about.

OOC: Let him have them.

IC:

CTF-2 is currently in transit to the western area of the Bay of Biscay, two hundred kilometers of the Chellian French coast, well out of Chellian waters. Also, the Macabee Government has officially proclaimed the Bay of Biscay Macabees national waters - if the claiming of the Straits isn't illegal, this should be fine.

OOC:

6 Model class Carriers
5 Raus class Escort Carriers
4 Rommel class Battleships
15 Seydlitz class Cruisers
15 Clauswitz class Frigates
20 Manstein class Destroyers
40 Patrol Boats
10 Balck class Missile Boats
30 Toledo class SSNs
50 Assorted Logistical Shipping


For those naval wargames IH was talking about.

IC: Chellis will not recognize more than 35km away from spain as being their waters. This is a desperate attempt to make conflict, and macabee's is working toward starting war.

OOC: Just send subs to go under his blockade and then suprise him by surfacing on the other side of his ships. But they can be detected by radar, and I'm just assuming that he doesnt have any subs with his blockade.

OOC: Gee, I didn't know RADAR could detect underwater submarines. And here I've been using SONAR all along... :rolleyes:

We own the region as well, we simply had no forces in there, as a sign of goodwill. Spain is divided into regions, and the maps showed we had the bottom most one. I will get a map of regions and point out which one I own.

---

We own the Section of Andalucia, the southernmost part, named Cadiz. The map we used on Cruicible showed us having it, but that map is a dead link now. Regardless, we own the waters between Gibraltar, Cadiz, and Morocco. We are in our rights to block it for four more days. The only people making an issue of this is Dr.Twist, who is destroying the peace process.

HP told me to remind you that Andalucia is part of Guff's terrain Chellis, you did not take it or claim it.

And you do not own those waters they are the sovereign waters of Spain NOT Gibraltar, this is a fact and had you been any student of history you would know that the British never owned the straights but the fact that they imposed the closure of the straits to the Axis by naval force and gun batteries. You have no legal rights to claim the straits are being under your direct control, they are more under Macabean and Chellis control, thus you can never blockage with Macabean consent. You argue in the face of evidence, when you present none yourself, if you have any evidence produce it for christ's sake.

HP told me to remind you that Andalucia is part of Guff's terrain Chellis, you did not take it or claim it.

And you do not own those waters they are the sovereign waters of Spain NOT Gibraltar, this is a fact and had you been any student of history you would know that the British never owned the straights but the fact that they imposed the closure of the straits to the Axis by naval force and gun batteries. You have no legal rights to claim the straits are being under your direct control, they are more under Macabean and Chellis control, thus you can never blockage with Macabean consent. You argue in the face of evidence, when you present none yourself, if you have any evidence produce it for christ's sake.

OOC: The evidence is simple. He states it is his. End subject.

OOC: The evidence is simple. He states it is his. End subject.

I Stated i own France, Thats right i Stated it End of Subject its mine!

I Stated i own France, Thats right i Stated it End of Subject its mine!

OOC: Go ahead. Do it here if you really want it. (http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=371814) See also this post. (http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=7533635&postcount=113)

Anything to stop the bickering with people who don't want to RP.

OOC: We are only bickering because Chellis is refusing to recognise hard RL evidence. Besides Chellis cannot close the straits unless he uses Naval power/Force and that is contravention of International Waters and Spanish Waters whatever bloody way you look at it.

OOC: We are only bickering because Chellis is refusing to recognise hard RL evidence. As for your evidence, Chellis isn't even on TPM's list for christ's sake.

OOC: This isn't court, its' a game and real life "evidence" is worthless here. You haven't gotten that point yet, and probably never shall.

That list allows you to claim whatever you want. Claim the whole world if you want to spend so much time dithering. I'm sure it will suit you. Makes for crappy RP, but what the hell, you're not interested in role playing, you're interested in playing shennanigans. Well, enjoy yourselves, you've shown over and over which aspect you are interested in.

I, on the other hand, am here to role-play and have fun. So, adieu. Our goals are dissimilar and likely will never meet.

It is too bad you are burying what could have been a decent Role Play in your twaddle, but to each their own. Again, adieu.

OOC: We are only bickering because Chellis is refusing to recognise hard RL evidence. Besides Chellis cannot close the straits unless he uses Naval power/Force and that is contravention of International Waters and Spanish Waters whatever bloody way you look at it.

OOC: Gee, you changed it. How do I put this - nobody cares. You've beaten the dead horse to powder. Did you have fun?

Seems rather joyless to me to dither so, but then again, I enjoy gaming, not bickering.

Adieu. Third times the charm.

OoC: Duno Vastiva but you always seem to get into arguments with my friends, do take note that you scream GODMOD and IGNORE 90% of the time so I don't think you RP that much.

Oh and don't worry, I'm currently compiling a nice work on NATO, and I'll make sure to mention you.

First Vast, I made no beeline to go insult you. That was uncalled for, I have simply been explaining that when you make an RL claim, you must respect RL aspects and conventions, you don't seem to understand this. I end up bickering with some people, because they don't recognise obvious precedents.

First Vast, I made no beeline to go insult you. That was uncalled for, I have simply been explaining that when you make an RL claim, you must respect RL aspects and conventions, you don't seem to understand this. I end up bickering with some people, because they don't recognise obvious precedents.

Yes and as i stated Earlier in this Post even if they didn't follow this, Nations technically would not have Territorial water's making this Ability to Close the Straight yet Again Illegal because it is being Held in International Waters.

I am on the Verge of getting NWO RWC and RBA to ignore Chellis Blockade and put an Official Ignore on Vastiva.

These maps don't represent NS. Spain does not hold that section of morocco, so those waters dont count. We hold more than the part of gibraltar shown. We control the straits.

Ok, I'll remember that rule "Officiall maps dont count on NS"
I'll claim Andorra then, offcourse i will own the entire southern part of France. What did you say, France is yours? Sure it is, but not the Southern half! The RL map of France does not represent France on NS.

We own the region as well, we simply had no forces in there, as a sign of goodwill. Spain is divided into regions, and the maps showed we had the bottom most one. I will get a map of regions and point out which one I own.

We own the Section of Andalucia, the southernmost part, named Cadiz. The map we used on Cruicible showed us having it, but that map is a dead link now. Regardless, we own the waters between Gibraltar, Cadiz, and Morocco. We are in our rights to block it for four more days.

The link is dead? How conveniant! This is like those borderguards in the Sevaris-crisis, they were never RPed but Sevaris had to pay damages for them.
Again; i will claim Andorra. I wont send no troops to Southern France and the link with the map on, will (accidently, a coincidence offcourse) be dead. Then i'll say Bordeaux is mine.

The only people making an issue of this is Chellis, who is destroying the peace process
Thats better.

IC: Most militaries try to hide their training exercises and search or make a terrain that fits the requirements. Chellis provokes half the world and blocks international traffic for more than a weak and simply refuses to even negotiate the reopening. You are the one who is endangering Peace, not Dr Twist.
I want Gibraltar to be given to a neutral party! Chellis clearly lacks the responsibility to own a seastrait.

OOC: Vollmeria, Dr.Twist, be idiots and leave this RP if you want. Im not dealing with your bullshit, that simple. I own the region, the maps showed it as such. This is what Im RP'ing with. If you don't recognize my claims, leave. I'm not recognizing any of your dipshit claims, and if you dont like it, leave.

OOC: Vollmeria, Dr.Twist, be idiots and leave this RP if you want. Im not dealing with your bullshit, that simple. I own the region, the maps showed it as such. This is what Im RP'ing with. If you don't recognize my claims, leave. I'm not recognizing any of your dipshit claims, and if you dont like it, leave.

1)Flamebait!

2)Correction; nobody (exept maybe Vastiva, but he's not important) recognizes your claim over Cadiz.
Its simple: You own the region? prove it(link!!).

3)I dont have any 'dipshit claims' and i dont want any 'dipshit claims' so there is nothing for you recognize. The Macabees owns Spain.

I'm trying to play a game here, and i dont want cheaters.
Oh, i'm not an idiot so i'll stay until you've given me a good argument or proof that you own Cadiz.

OCC: For those in Response to why I am Calling the Blockade Illegal is, Because no Nation in Nation States unless it is a requirement for an alliance or other Organization has actually agreed to Recognize other National Waters Making them all Technically International waters.

Dr_Twist.
OOC: So I can position an SSBN right off your coast and it's legal, right?

EDIT: *Watches the latest NATO vs [insert alliance here] n00bfest go up in a massive cloud of OOC smoke*

OOC: So I can position an SSBN right off your coast and it's legal, right?

EDIT: *Watches the latest NATO vs [insert alliance here] n00bfest go up in a massive cloud of OOC smoke*

OoC: Yup, don't mind the ASW units tho...

Benderberg condemns this blockade and stands with its allies against the Chellis claims of controling the straight. We will re-route our shipping to Suez to avoid a conflict, but demand Chellis opens up the straight to avoid a war.

IC:

Our fleet will stay just where it is off your French coast for the joint exercises with Independent Hitmen... oh wait, scrath that... just to rub it into Chellis' face that the Spanish have claimed the Bay of Biscay as their own waters we'll move the primary ASW perimeter and AWACs of CTF-2 fifty kilometers off the coast of France. (The second ASW being fifty kms behind that, the third another fifty behind that, and the main fleet fifty behind the third..there's also a CAP around the third ASW.)

Eredron urges moderation in this affair, and discourages nations from acting rashly.

I'm trying to play a game here, and I dont want cheaters.

OOC: Usually when you think someone is cheating you don't play with them when they are unwilling to stop "cheating". I've not read most of the thread, so I'm not taking sides, but if you don't recognise Chellis's claims in a thread about him and he's unwilling to change for you then you've got two clear options, the third one isn't so much an option and more of a bad move.

1. You can ignore him and thus leave the thread which is about these claims you don't recognise. This allows those who do recognise him to continue their play.

2. You can recognise his stuff and continue to join in this thread... you know that while you may not want to OOC reconogise his territory, but you could say, IC not recognise his territory. It's dangerous but it creates a situation. You're government doesn't pay attention to their threats and as such forces their hand and creates... plot!

3. Continue down this path where both sides flame one another in a childish manner until you ruin the thread, thus creating a phyrric victory which will result in the offending thread ending and alot of people disliking you.

I mean seriously... I don't entirely agree with the whole idea of real life territory claims so I generally don't RP in thread where they are involved. The only reason I'm interested here is because I like to know whats going on. Perhaps Chellis isn't being polite about his arguement, but you've reached the point where you know he won't change and you don't want to accept his "crap" so either pull out or accept it.

Chellis is fine with the macabee's having operations in the bay of biscay, as long as they dont enter into long established french waters, which don't extend far into the bay. We however will not be stopping any movements through what we see as international waters, and we condemn the macabee's for repetedly trying to start a conflict.

OOC:Vollmeria, accept my claims and you can continue RP'ing with me. Dont accept, and I will ignore you. Thats simpler for you, I hope?

Benderberg condemns this blockade and stands with its allies against the Chellis claims of controling the straight. We will re-route our shipping to Suez to avoid a conflict, but demand Chellis opens up the straight to avoid a war.

The strait will open in 36 hours, we hope this will be sufficient.

Hmm... So, Chellis, do you seriously still want to maintain your blockade of Spanish waters? You've seen the evidence, now, are you going to maintain the blockade?

Hmm... So, Chellis, do you seriously still want to maintain your blockade of Spanish waters? You've seen the evidence, now, are you going to maintain the blockade?

Seen what evidence? What are you talking about?

Seen what evidence? What are you talking about?
The evidence showing your blockade would have to intrude upon Spanish waters.

The evidence showing your blockade would have to intrude upon Spanish waters.

Spanish waters that are a part of the region of Cadiz, which we own. There is no damning evidence.

To Maintain Safety and Security in the Region, The Dr_Twist Government will be pulling away from this Issue, however your Blockade has Officially been Ignored because large amounts of evidence has been brought forward, But you continue to push aside the evidence to ignore the facts on the issue at hand.

As such, Dr_Twist Government Will not ignore Chellis, or his Claims on the Fort of Gibraltar, However other things to do with the Issue will be Seen as Floating issues as there is no Proof from the Chellis Government, This is in Reference to Cadiz, The Dr_Twist Also did explain that even if Chellis did control the Area of Cadiz, they still didn't have complete control of the straight as shown on the Diagram posted earlier in the Thread.

Further Operations done by Chellis in the Straight of Gibraltar will be ignored until Chellis is Prepared to Sit down with the Macabees and discuss Territorial water Claims in the Straight itself.

Thank you.

OCC: Also some people in this Thread need to grow up!

To Maintain Safety and Security in the Region, The Dr_Twist Government will be pulling away from this Issue, however your Blockade has Officially been Ignored because large amounts of evidence has been brought forward, But you continue to push aside the evidence to ignore the facts on the issue at hand.

As such, Dr_Twist Government Will not ignore Chellis, or his Claims on the Fort of Gibraltar, However other things to do with the Issue will be Seen as Floating issues as there is no Proof from the Chellis Government, This is in Reference to Cadiz, The Dr_Twist Also did explain that even if Chellis did control the Area of Cadiz, they still didn't have complete control of the straight as shown on the Diagram posted earlier in the Thread.

Further Operations done by Chellis in the Straight of Gibraltar will be ignored until Chellis is Prepared to Sit down with the Macabees and discuss Territorial water Claims in the Straight itself.

Thank you.

OCC: Also some people in this Thread need to grow up!

Chellis owns every part of territory on the shown maps of waters(Cadiz, Gibraltar, Morocco, section of morocco controlled by spain IRL), and they encompass the waters from shore to shore in places. Dr.twist can ignore the issue if it wants, but we maintain that entering our waters without our permission will be an act of war.

OOC: Usually when you think someone is cheating you don't play with them when they are unwilling to stop "cheating". I've not read most of the thread, so I'm not taking sides, but if you don't recognise Chellis's claims in a thread about him and he's unwilling to change for you then you've got two clear options, the third one isn't so much an option and more of a bad move.
In competition, you try to get rid of a cheater or encourage him to stop doing it. On a server that means flaming till he leaves or stop cheating and apologizes, bugexploits (considered cheating by clanbase) are a perfect example

1. You can ignore him and thus leave the thread which is about these claims you don't recognise. This allows those who do recognise him to continue their play.
I never ignore people, that is childish. i may however, ignore actions! By ignoring an action the player knows he wont get away with whatever he tried and (hopefully) wont do it again in another RP.

2. You can recognise his stuff and continue to join in this thread... you know that while you may not want to OOC reconogise his territory, but you could say, IC not recognise his territory. It's dangerous but it creates a situation. You're government doesn't pay attention to their threats and as such forces their hand and creates... plot!
I dont recognize it OOC (as you may have noticed) and i dont recognize it ICly( because it never happened ICly, what is there to recognize? he is claiming land that is owned and occupied by someone else)

3. Continue down this path where both sides flame one another in a childish manner until you ruin the thread, thus creating a phyrric victory which will result in the offending thread ending and alot of people disliking you.
I dont flame or insult others, i respect every player. I will 'attack' actions, when i'm sure they are wrong

I mean seriously... I don't entirely agree with the whole idea of real life territory claims so I generally don't RP in thread where they are involved. The only reason I'm interested here is because I like to know whats going on. Perhaps Chellis isn't being polite about his arguement, but you've reached the point where you know he won't change and you don't want to accept his "crap" so either pull out or accept it.
If i accept it, i give him the permission to do it again (This is not the first time he pulls of crap like this). So sorry, no can do!
My allies(The Macabees, since he owns Spain) are involved so it is my duty to help them. Pulling out is giving up and i'm not a quiter(Not to mention i'd be giving the cheater his way)

I dont agree with the real life claims either, so i'm already doing people a favor by accepting the possibility of RL claimed territory. I expect people to play that game correct,now you tell me: is that to much to ask?

OOC: Id like to remind everyone that the cruicible threads have been revived, go through your posts and find the threads, that may solve a few arguments. Heres a proposal:

1) If it turns out chellis did not control Candiz, he now does. That means he has taken it over and as such (once you have given him time to retract the claim if he wants) his blockade is as an act of war against both guffingford and the Macabees.

2) If it turns out chellis does own what he says he does then im not sure how you want to react but it is blockading an entire region and so alot of poeple may also want to either declare war or skip merrily along

OOC: Has anyone seen Vastiva RP, I've seen one poor bit on this thread that shows in no way the supposed master Rper that he seems to be (Ie: telling more experianced nations how to RP, and trying to take over threads ect.) can you actually show me sme decent RP anyone?

OOC: Either way, Chellis is commiting an act of war.

OOC: Has anyone seen Vastiva RP, I've seen one poor bit on this thread that shows in no way the supposed master Rper that he seems to be (Ie: telling more experianced nations how to RP, and trying to take over threads ect.) can you actually show me sme decent RP anyone?

OOC: Having read this thread, I couldn't agree more. There are a few other nations around these days that presume us older nations have forgotten everything about RPing. I've never witnessed Vastiva RPing, just b*tching to people.

OOC: Having read this thread, I couldn't agree more. There are a few other nations around these days that presume us older nations have forgotten everything about RPing. I've never witnessed Vastiva RPing, just b*tching to people.

I must completely Agree I have never ever seen him RP at all, all i see is him Bitching at other people.

Strange that.

OOC: Having read this thread, I couldn't agree more. There are a few other nations around these days that presume us older nations have forgotten everything about RPing. I've never witnessed Vastiva RPing, just b*tching to people.
I have seen him RP, it's on this thread. I'll find it in a second for you.

Here we go.


IC: Most militaries try to hide their training exercises and search or make a terrain that fits the requirements. Chellis provokes half the world and blocks international traffic for more than a weak and simply refuses to even negotiate the reopening. You are the one who is endangering Peace, not Dr Twist.
I want Gibraltar to be given to a neutral party! Chellis clearly lacks the responsibility to own a seastrai

Really well written isn't it.

Here we go.



Really well written isn't it.

OMG, that is some of the best RP'ing i have seen all day, I Swear!

Oh my God, Aust are you actually Vastiva in disguise, that has to be some of the best RPin ever

OOC: The bickering on both sides has to stop NOW!!!! This is pathetic guys. This is a game, so please just sit back and realize that this is suppose to be fun. As for Chellis claims, I recall that the RWC accepted Chellis claims to Southern Spain during the Crucible threads. I'm not going to dig it up myself, but they are there so the waters on both sides of the straight belong to Chellis and thus he can do as he wishes there. I understand the frustration, but point out that IDF has given an alternative where Suez is open and I'm even supplying extra canal pilots to make things easier for everyone. I'm even letting RWC nations use the canal at will without extra charges despite the fact I'm having increased costs. Everyone please grow up before posting here.

OOC: FFS guys, the last twelve posts have been OOC: I am going as ask right now, if you don't plan on posting IC in this thread, please leave. If you don't recognize my claims, please leave. Vollmeria especially, if you continue I will go to the mods.

Here we go.

Originally Posted by V
IC: Most militaries try to hide their training exercises and search or make a terrain that fits the requirements. Chellis provokes half the world and blocks international traffic for more than a weak and simply refuses to even negotiate the reopening. You are the one who is endangering Peace, not Dr Twist.
I want Gibraltar to be given to a neutral party! Chellis clearly lacks the responsibility to own a seastrai

Really well written isn't it.

OOC: Post... #34 if I dont' miss my guess. Alas, I didn't write it.

*sighs* "Vollmeria" doesn't even look a bit like "Vastiva". Nice piece of propaganda though.

OOC: FFS guys, the last twelve posts have been OOC: I am going as ask right now, if you don't plan on posting IC in this thread, please leave. If you don't recognize my claims, please leave. Vollmeria especially, if you continue I will go to the mods.

Whose thread is this? Dr Twists
Does he recognize your claim? No
So who can ask me to leave this thread? Dr Twist

Go ahead, and tell the mods if you want, I have done nothing wrong here and i dont think they care about a RL territory discussion.

---

And indeed, it wasnt the best piece of RP i wrote there, sometimes i write really fast because i have other obligations. It doesnt really matter, noone responds to it anyway.

Whose thread is this? Dr Twists
Does he recognize your claim? No
So who can ask me to leave this thread? Dr Twist

Go ahead, and tell the mods if you want, I have done nothing wrong here and i dont think they care about a RL territory discussion.

---

And indeed, it wasnt the best piece of RP i wrote there, sometimes i write really fast because i have other obligations. It doesnt really matter, noone responds to it anyway.


OOC: Fine then. Im ignoring you. Thats alot easier.

OOC: Fine then. Im ignoring you. Thats alot easier.

Aye... it is.

OCC: God... and i thought i meddle in the worst fights in NS. No matter what... if chellis has the military capability to close it off, then maybe it is breaching international law but if he wants to be stubborn, you either negotiate or you have war. Play the game guys.

ICC: Russian Forces believes that all sides must settle down and have a diplomatic meeting to discuss about this crisis. RF's large baltic fleet is already in need to pass through into the mediterranian now. We ask Chellis to let this fleet pass now. If not... we will fight our way through.

OCC: God... and i thought i meddle in the worst fights in NS. No matter what... if chellis has the military capability to close it off, then maybe it is breaching international law but if he wants to be stubborn, you either negotiate or you have war. Play the game guys.

ICC: Russian Forces believes that all sides must settle down and have a diplomatic meeting to discuss about this crisis. RF's large baltic fleet is already in need to pass through into the mediterranian now. We ask Chellis to let this fleet pass now. If not... we will fight our way through.

As such the Dr_Twist Government will Aid Russian Forces in going thought the Pass if Chellis will not Open it for Russian Fleets.

While we would have let Russian Forces pass through if they had needed, there is no need for special crossing. Our naval exercises have ended, and the strait will be open for all traffic in three hours, we just need to finish cleaning up and everything. Once you reach the strait, it will be open.

thankyou for your consideration. Our Navy is greatful that you choose to let our fleet through.