NationStates Jolt Archive

Name says it all. OOC stuff here and not in the actual RP.

[tag]

Just to reiterate what guff said, I can controll the Canal through my colony of eritrea.

OOC: I think what people wanted to know was where you RPed taking it...

OOC: These are the full Morathanian forces in Europe:

Sweden

400,000 men (not including logistical personnel)

1st Army Corps

135,000 men
110 M1A2 Abrams Tanks
75 Challenger II MBTs
70 Crusader Artillery Pieces
17,345 M2 Bradley Fighting Vehicles
11,376 Hummers

7th Army Corps

150,000 men

155 M1A2 Abrams MBTs
110 Challenger II MBTs
90 Crusader Artillery Pieces
22,023 M2 Bradley Fighting Vehicles
18,562 Hummers

12th Army Corps

115,000 men
85 M1A2 Abrams MBTs
60 Challenger II MBTs
40 T-90 MBTs
55 Crusader Artillery Pieces
10,012 M2 Bradley Fighting Vehicles
8456 Hummers

Finland

150,000 men (Not including Logistical Personnel)

4th Army Corps

150,000 men

160 M1A2 Abrams MBTs
120 Challenger II MBTs
100 Crusader Artillery Pieces
20,148 M2 Bradley Fighting Vehicles
22,962 Hummers

Fleets in Europe

3rd Fleet (North Sea/GIUK Gap)

4 Nimitz Class Carriers
8 Charles De Gaulle Class Escort Carriers
4 Kirov Class Cruisers
12 Ticonderoga II Class AEGIS Cruisers
16 Arleigh Bruke Class AEGIS Destroyers
24 Oliver Hazard Perry Frigates
24 Super Orion Class Hydrofoil Corvettes

9th Fleet (North Sea/English Channel)

4 Nimitz Class Carriers
8 Charles De Gaulle Class Escort Carriers
4 Kirov Class Cruisers
12 Ticonderoga II Class AEGIS Cruisers
16 Arleigh Bruke Class AEGIS Destroyers
24 Oliver Hazard Perry Frigates

12th Fleet (Canaries)

4 Nimitz Class Carriers
8 Charles De Gaulle Class Escort Carriers
4 Kirov Class Cruisers
12 Ticonderoga II Class AEGIS Cruisers
16 Arleigh Bruke Class AEGIS Destroyers
24 Oliver Hazard Perry Frigates
16 Super Orion Class Hydrofoil Corvettes

OOC: Unfortunately, Morath, Guffingford only recognises the HP earth claims thread, so for the purposes of this war you don't have anything in Europe...

OOC: Actually you do not control the Red Sea or the Suez Canal. IDF has a strong presence in the region and would stop any attempt to block alliance shipping.

EDIT: If you look in the actual thread you can see that Guff allowed me to have Sweden and Finland for the sake of the RP. He okayed it and it is his thread so I accept that these are now my official claims for this RP.

Huzen Hagen posted the take over of Erithrea before jolt. I'm damn sure he did because I helped him. Austar Union even tried to declare war to us about it. Case closed.

IDF owns NOTHING what is listed in my RL claims thread. Earth 5? Don't even think about it. Oh yeah Morathania, if Russian Forces attacks (note the IF) then your play in Finland is over... I think. I don't know what Guffingford has to say about this, it's up to him and RF.

FYI, What's with RF and NATO? I talked to him and it's wrong.

OOC: RF won't attack Finland. He is helping in the invasion of Germany and in taking out Guff. Let me tell you NATO is not courting RF. I think he just wants to help NATO out of his own accord.

OOC: RF won't attack Finland. He is helping in the invasion of Germany and in taking out Guff. Let me tell you NATO is not courting RF. I think he just wants to help NATO out of his own accord.

I have some VERY diffirent thoughts about that my friend...

We will have to wait and see.

OOC: Ah sorry about that, Morath, I onyl read the early posts on that particular issue. Anyway, I want to see HH's thread. It being pre-jolt isn't good enough, I can provide you with a link to the first post I made back in April.

OOC: Ah sorry about that, Morath, I onyl read the early posts on that particular issue. Anyway, I want to see HH's thread. It being pre-jolt isn't good enough, I can provide you with a link to the first post I made back in April.

how about you stop being so damn lazy and have a look at both chellises and hp's thread (chellis last pages, hp first pages) and the link is there. Now i want all of you and your allys (including IDF) to post the links to their rl (earth1) claims or i wont recognise they come from where they say they do (morath exempted) and assume they are based on their NS nation. Your allys have already got off to a bad start rp wise (Hamptonshire takling near enough half of spain with 80'000 marines) so why dont you stop being so petty and we can get this moving.

As for IDF being near the suez (well he says he is) it doesnt matter. A ship going through the canal will have to pass eritrea and therein lies my ability to contorol it but an IC post coming up will clear this all up.

There's a link to it on the RL claims thread? I thought it was purged... no matter. It would have been easier if you had just told us that, or simply gotten the link by copying and pasting from the thread. I would now start an argument by saying "Why do you tell us to stop being lazy and research your claims whilst you at the same time want us to hand you our claim threads on a silver platter" but I wont, because that would cause pointless flaming. Anyway, I have no RL territory, so that demand doesn't affect me.

There's a link to it on the RL claims thread? I thought it was purged... no matter. It would have been easier if you had just told us that, or simply gotten the link by copying and pasting from the thread. I would now start an argument by saying "Why do you tell us to stop being lazy and research your claims whilst you at the same time want us to hand you our claim threads on a silver platter" but I wont, because that would cause pointless flaming. Anyway, I have no RL territory, so that demand doesn't affect me.

all you had do do was check both those threads first pages anyway. As far as im aware im listed as having a legit claim on both

So what was the 'it got purged' charade in aid of? Look let's just stop arguing and move on.

http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=336146

Quit bitching.

I found it, but thanks.

Secret IC (but it still belongs here... my allies know this info, nobody else does until the fleets are knocking on their doors):

Forces en route:
(please let my indents work)

First Expeditionary Fleet:
Battle Group Alpha:
1ST Subgroup:
1x Ocean Class Carrier
80x MiG-29s
20x F-109Ds
38x Su-33s
30x Su-34s
3x Thatcher Class Destroyers
1x Katori Class Cruiser
8x Defiance Class Frigates
1x Sea Wolf Class SSBN

2ND Subgroup:
1x Mackensen Class BB
3x Meteora Class Destroyers
1x Katori Class Cruiser
8x Defiance Class Frigates

3RD Subgroup:
1x Mackensen Class BB
1x Meteora Class Destroyer
2x Centaur Class Destroyers
1x Katori Class Cruiser
8x Lion Class Frigates

Battle Group Beta:
1ST Subgroup:
1x Ocean Class Carrier
90x MiG-29s
28x F-109Ds
30x Su-33s
20x Su-34s
3x Centaur Class Destroyers
1x Hiroshima Class Cruiser
7x Lion Class Frigates
2x Defiance Class Frigates
1x Sea Wolf Class SSBN

2ND Subgroup:
1x Thunder Child Class BB
3x Centaur Class Destroyers
1x Katori Class Cruiser
9x Defiance Class Frigates

Battle Group Gamma:
1ST Subgroup:
1x Lunar Class Carrier
60x MiG-29s
30x Su-33s
10x Su-34s
10x Sea Hawk Gunships
3x Suiheisen Class Destroyers
1x Hiroshima Class Cruiser
9x Defiance Class Frigates
1x Sea Wolf Class SSBN
2x Dreadnaught Class SSGN
1x Swordfish Class SSN

2ND Subgroup:
1x Infusion Class Carrier
60x MiG-29s
20x Su-33s
20x Su-34s
4x Suiheisen Class Destroyers
1x Katori Class Cruiser
9x Defiance Class Frigates
1x Dreadnaught Class SSGN
1x Swordfish Class SSN



Second Expeditionary Fleet:
Battle Group Alpha:
1ST Subgroup:
1x Infusion Class Carrier
65x MiG-29s
15x F-109Ds
10x Su-33s
10x Su-34s
3x Centaur Class Destroyers
1x Hiroshima Class Cruiser
8x Defiance Class Frigates
1x Sea Wolf Class SSBN

2ND Subgroup:
2x Formidible Class Carriers
16(each)x MiG-29s
8(each)x Su-33s
4x Suiheisen Class Destroyers
1x Katori Class Cruiser
8x Defiance Class Frigates

3RD Subgroup:
1x Thunder Child Class BB
3x Suiheisen Class Destroyers
7x Defiance Class Frigates
3x Dreadnaught Class SSGN
1x Swordfish Class SSN



Battle Group Beta:
1ST Subgroup:
1x Infusion Class Carrier
60x MiG-29s
15x F-109Ds
25x Su-33s
4x Meteora Class Destroyers
1x Katori Class Cruiser
7x Lion Class Frigates
1x Sea Wolf Class SSBN

2ND Subgroup:
1x Lunar Class Carrier
65x MiG-29s
10x F-109Ds
35x Su-34s
3x Centaur Class Destroyers
1x Hiroshima Class Cruiser
8x Lion Class Frigates

3RD Subgroup:
1x Mackensen Class BB
4x Centaur Class Destroyers
1x Katori Class Cruiser
7x Defiance Class Frigates


Battle Group Gamma:
1ST Subgroup:
1x Ocean Class Carrier
105x MiG-29s
33x F-109Ds
20x Su-33s
10x Su-34s
4x Thatcher Class Destroyers
1x Hiroshima Class Cruiser
8x Defiance Class Frigates
1x Sea Wolf Class SSBN

2ND Subgroup:
1x Mackensen Class BB
4x Meteora Class Destroyers
1x Katori Class Cruiser
7x Defiance Class Frigates



Third Expeditionary Fleet:
Battle Group Alpha:
1ST Subgroup:
1x Thunder Child Class BB
3x Centaur Class Destroyers
7x Defiance Class Frigates
1x Sea Wolf Class SSBN
2x Dreadnaught Class SSGN
1x Swordfish Class SSN

2ND Subgroup:
1x Infusion Class Carrier
70x MiG-29s
20x Su-33s
10x Su-34s
2x Centaur Class Destroyers
1x Hiroshima Class Cruiser
7x Defiance Class Frigates

3RD Subgroup:
1x Lunar Class Carrier
70x MiG-29s
10x F-109Ds
20x Su-33s
10x Su-34s
3x Centaur Class Destroyers
1x Katori Class Cruiser
7x Defiance Class Frigates


Battle Group Beta:
1ST Subgroup:
1x Infusion Class Carrier
70x MiG-29s
10x F-109Ds
10x Su-33s
10x Su-34s
3x Thatcher Class Destroyers
1x Hiroshima Class Cruiser
7x Defiance Class Frigates
1x Sea Wolf Class SSBN

2ND Subgroup:
2x Formidible Class Carriers
20(each)x MiG-29s
4(each)x Su-34s
2x Meteora Class Destroyers
1x Hiroshima Class Cruiser
2x Lion Class Frigates
5x Defiance Class Frigates

3RD Subgroup:
1x Mackensen Class BB
2x Meteora Class Destroyers
1x Katori Class Cruiser
7x Lion Class Frigates


Battle Group Gamma:
1ST Subgroup:
1x Ocean Class Carrier
109x MiG-29s
27x F-109Ds
13x Su-33s
19x Su-34s
3x Suiheisen Class Destroyers
1x Katori Class Cruiser
7x Defiance Class Frigates
1x Sea Wolf Class SSBN
2x Dreadnaught Class SSGN
1x Swordfish Class SSN

2ND Subgroup:
1x Mackensen Class BB
3x Suiheisen Class Destroyers
1x Katori Class Cruiser
6x Lion Class Frigates

Ok, my indents failed, but basically each fleet is divided into battle groups designated by greek letters, and then into subgroups that are numbered within each individual battle group. Carriers are followed by the planes on them.

And guess what? The only claims to the Suez and Israel that I recognize are those of United Elias and Western Asia. However, that is neither here nor there.

Here are the forces I shall be sending to Spain and Denmark.

Denmark (12 Cavalry Divisions)
Infantry: 38,400
Fighting Vehicles: 26,592 (13,296)
Tanks: 22,272 (5,568)
Artillery: 32,832 (10,944)
Pilots: 14,016 (5,472)
Support: 162,600
Total: 296,712


Spain (8 Armoured and 4 Mech Infantry Divisions)
Armoured Divisions
Infantry: 18,240
Fighting Vehicles: 15,520 (3,880)
Tanks: 7,608 (2,536)
Artillery: 15,552 (3,888)
Pilots: 8,072 (3,096)
Support: 40,320
Total: 105,312

Mechanized Infantry Divisions
Infantry: 9,600
Fighting Vehicles: 6,336 (1,584)
Tanks: 2,964 (988)
Artillery: 4,896 (1,224)
Pilots: 3,424 (1,344)
Support: 24,720
Total: 47,044

Tag, will enter full forces soon.

I'm sending 5000 men;
1 3rd Class commandship;
10 Aasimar Battleships
10 Bismark Battleships
12 Jaguar Cruisers
12 Belknap Cruisers
12 Kongo Destroyers
12 Cassius Destroyers
12 Perry Frigates
12 Brooke Frigates

2 JFK Carriers
2 Defiant Super Carriers

12 Trident Submarines
30 Lich Submarines

10 Visby corvettes

HP I'm not familiar with alot of those ship designs. Is their a place were a could see the specs for the classes of ships that you are using?

HP I'm not familiar with alot of those ship designs. Is their a place were a could see the specs for the classes of ships that you are using?

About which ones you want info?

Aasimar Battleships
Bismark Battleships
Jaguar Cruisers
Belknap Cruisers
Cassius Destroyers
Brooke Frigates
Defiant Super Carriers
Lich Submarines
Visby Corvettes

Sorry about their being so many but I really haven't heard of many of your ship designs.

Well, I'll be sending the following ground forces. They are going to be in Hamptonshire Spain of course, for the defence operations. The Mechanized Infantry Brigades (each with approx. 5000 men and about 60 tanks) will arrive first, followed by the lengthened shipment of the larger (and more immobile) divisions and their equipments. Obviously they aren't all going to arrive immediately, but the arrival of the quick brigades and my large fleet of large-scale transports will hopefully solve the problem.

8 Mechanized Infantry Brigades
3 Armored Divisions
4 Mechanized Infantry Divisions
2 Surface-to-Surface Missile Battalions
2 Artillery Regiments
2 Marine Corps Coastal Defence Artillery Regiments

Total: ~200,000 (with field support personnel)
Tanks: ~2200 total
Fighting Vehicles (IFV only): ~2800 total
Artillery Pieces (excl. Artillery Regiments, MLRS units, 105mm and 155mm towed guns): ~800 self-propelled

Forces include various Kodachi missile launchers, 105mm-155mm guns, anti-aircraft guns and missiles, rocket launchers, surface-to-ship missile batteries

Oh, that's right. I forgot my naval deployments.

1st Expeditionary Fleet
FlagDiv (1 Gehenna class SDV)
CVNRon (8 Morrigan class CVNs)
BatRon (1 Leviathan class SD and 7 Fenrir class DNs)
BatCruRon (12 Ryuho class BCGNs)
CruRon (16 Alexandria class CANs)
CruRon (16 Alexandria class CANs)
DevFlot (32 Gaea class DDGNs)
DevFlot (32 Gaea class DDGNs)
DevFlot (32 Revenge class DDENs)
SupFlot (32 Clan Grant AOEs)
SubRon (8 Upholder class SSNs)

2nd Expeditionary Fleet
FlagDiv (1 Gehenna class SDV)
CVNRon (8 Morrigan class CVNs)
BatRon (1 Leviathan class SD and 7 Fenrir class DNs)
BatCruRon (12 Ryuho class BCGNs)
CruRon (16 Alexandria class CANs)
CruRon (16 Alexandria class CANs)
DevFlot (32 Gaea class DDGNs)
DevFlot (32 Gaea class DDGNs)
DevFlot (32 Revenge class DDENs)
SupFlot (32 Clan Grant AOEs)
SubRon (8 Upholder class SSNs)

Aasimar Battleships
Bismark Battleships
Jaguar Cruisers
Belknap Cruisers
Cassius Destroyers
Brooke Frigates
Defiant Super Carriers
Lich Submarines
Visby Corvettes

Sorry about their being so many but I really haven't heard of many of your ship designs.

They can all be found on google, except the Aasimar and Defiant I believe, they were bought in a storefront a long time ago. I'll see if I can dig up a link about the Lich, that's the only design I made.

The Rosian Forces in Europe:

Ships:
5 Nimitz Class Carriers
25 United States Class Carriers
10 Iowa Class Battleships
10 Arleigh Burke Guided Missile AEGIS Destroyers
15 Los Angeles Class Submarines
10 Kiluaea Class Ammunition Ships
5 Kasier Class Oiler Ships
10 Safeguard Class Rescue and Salvage Ships
5 Mercy Class Hospital Ships
35 Chicago Class Escort Ships

7th Army Force:
48,000 Soldiers
4,000 BMP-3s
1,200 T-90s
40 RCH-1s (Chinooks)
32,000 Support Staff (including M.A.F.H. units)
8,000 Humvees
1,800 Ural 6 x 6 Medium Haul Trucks
240 ROH-1s (Blackhawks)
480 RTAP 155mm Medium Howitzers
160 RMLRS 120mm (Smerch) Rocket Artillery
80 Priests
180 RLAH-1s (Cobra Attack Helicopter)
160 RAH-1s (Hind)

Naval Air Force:
825 RF-1s (F-18s)
350 RB-1s (F-15Es)
60 E2-C Hawkeyes
100 EA-6s
165 RCH-1s (Chinooks)
75 RCP-1s (C-17s)
100 P-7s

These are my forces, tell me if I did something wrong.

My naval deployments are on the other thread in my official statement. I havent deployed any Imperial Guard divisions but I'll most likely deploy around 24 - 32 (which is 500,000 - 675,000 men).

Thanks I didn't know if those were RL ships or ships that you either disigned or bought that are not found in RL. Thats for the info.

HP, I own Israel, Western Asia hasn't posted in months. You gave him the land to lock me out. Everyone else reckognizes my claim to Israel and Sinai.

IIRC, you don't even have a nation since Guerrilistan took you over.

Huzen Hagen posted the take over of Erithrea before jolt. I'm damn sure he did because I helped him. Austar Union even tried to declare war to us about it. Case closed.

IDF owns NOTHING what is listed in my RL claims thread. Earth 5? Don't even think about it. Oh yeah Morathania, if Russian Forces attacks (note the IF) then your play in Finland is over... I think. I don't know what Guffingford has to say about this, it's up to him and RF.

FYI, What's with RF and NATO? I talked to him and it's wrong.
I own nothing because you blocked me out godmodder. You don't even have a nation. Guerrilistan owns you.

how about you stop being so damn lazy and have a look at both chellises and hp's thread (chellis last pages, hp first pages) and the link is there. Now i want all of you and your allys (including IDF) to post the links to their rl (earth1) claims or i wont recognise they come from where they say they do (morath exempted) and assume they are based on their NS nation. Your allys have already got off to a bad start rp wise (Hamptonshire takling near enough half of spain with 80'000 marines) so why dont you stop being so petty and we can get this moving.

As for IDF being near the suez (well he says he is) it doesnt matter. A ship going through the canal will have to pass eritrea and therein lies my ability to contorol it but an IC post coming up will clear this all up.
I claim Earth II land since I joined NS after Earth I was set in stone. I own Suez, but do undestand that the Red Sea can be shut off, thus I deployed ships and made an ultimatum.

Guff, the map of Spain you have is pure nonsense. I've already moved my men in to the positions indicated in my map.

I don't need a nation smartass because I own the Azores. 1st thing you're wrong about.

2nd thing, Praetonia declared the thread moot. He made the thing and you ignore that? Second thing, you're out because EVERYBODY OWNS A RL NATION IN THE THREAD.

And you're ignored now due to extreme ignorance and lack of basic reading skills. Have a nice day somewhere else mate

Guff, the map of Spain you have is pure nonsense. I've already moved my men in to the positions indicated in my map.

I made the map, Guff posted about Galicia way earlier then you did.

I dont own a RL nation. My troops are being shipped over in support of allies.

Crookfur doesn't own an RL nation but such is the postioning of our home land and holdings that they have a direct impact on the entire conflcit outside of central europe and the middle to far east.
and yes we are shipping vast amounts of supplies to allies...

Well, neither do I own a RL nation. My nation itself resides in the Pacific, and I'm pefectly capable of coexisting with "Earth I" nations (in fact, I owned England before giving them up about a year ago in October).

I have stated this a while back. I do not recognize HPs claim thread. I don't recognize Guffingford holding Iceland, BeNeLux, or west africa. Yet I am roleplaying here, out of courtesy. Again, this is not going on the HP claims list. So quite simply, IDF controls Israel in this RP. That, or Guffingford doesn't own BeNeLux or western africa. You aren't going to make me a target and use your rules on who owns what.

Anyways, about numbers

I have about 1/5th of my total military in France. This is about 22m men total, Naval assets included, and including those in Corsica and Spain. I have about 50,000 Nilsar MBTs, 12,000 Pouch Tank Hunters, 80,000 various IFV's, mostly Mirca IV's, about 40,000 aircraft in there, half of them cargo aircraft, and about 20,000 helicopters in France. I have probably around 400,000 various artillery pieces(75mm plus), ATGM's(Anything at the size of a Milan or larger), and AAA(Immobile or vehicle launched) in France. I believe I have about 400 divisions total, of various types. I also have a large number of other things, such as VAB-type vehicles, APC's, etc.

ooc:

Partial List of Hamptonian Assests in Europe-

Denmark-
3 million Royal Army Soldiers/Royal Marines
1.2 million Danish Self Defense Force Soldiers
5 Fighter Wings
4 Attack Helicopter Wings
1 Bomber Group
300 Royal Navy Warships attached to Denmark


Spain-
1.75 million Royal Army Soldiers/Royal Marines
50,000 Spanish and Basque Soldiers
5 Fighter Wings
4 Attack Helicopter Wings
1 Bomber Group
400 Royal Navy Warships attached to Spanish Operations


Scotland-
3 million Royal Army Soldiers
2 Fighter Groups
3 Bombers Groups
200 Royal Navy Warships attached to British Operations


I'm pressed for time and I can't find the right file, so I'll post the specifics later.

Well, my naval deployments (this, along with the aircraft deployment, should be treated as confidental information ICly):

-Carrier Battle Group (CVBG) 11 (1 Wilson Shire CVAN, 2 Fenrir CG, 4 Centaur DDG, 4 Cardinal DDG, 2 Revenge DD, 2 Timberwolf FFG, 2 Cougar FF, 2 Levianthan SSN, 1 Clan Grant AOE)
-CVBG 17 (1 Oppressor CVN, 2 Locke CGN, 3 Ballistae DDN, 3 Albatross DDGN, 3 Timberwolf FF, 2 Levianthan SSN, 1 Clan Grant AOE)
-CVBG 18 (1 Seina Niyobuchi CVN, 2 Locke CGN, 3 Ballistae DDN, 3 Albatross DDGN, 3 Timberwolf FF, 1 Supply AOE)
-CVBG 19 (1 Seina Niyobuchi CVN, 2 Locke CGN, 3 Ballistae DDN, 3 Albatross DDGN, 3 Timberwolf FF, 1 Supply AOE)
-CVBG 20 (1 Ocean class CVN, 2 Fenrir CG, 4 Centaur DDG, 4 Dauntless DDG, 2 Revenge DD, 3 Broadsword FF, 2 Trident SSN, 1 Clan Grant AOE)
-Bombardment Group (BomGrp) 3 (1 Toryu BB, 1 Yubari class BC, 1 Oyoda class BC, 2 Hiragi class CA, 5 Centaur DDG, 3 Cardinal DDG, 2 Levianthan class SSN, 1 Clan Grant AOE)
-BomGrp 2 (2 Toryu BB, 1 Yubari BC, 2 Oyoda BC, 4 Hiragi CA, 2 Firestorm Arsenal Ship, 4 Centaur DDG, 3 Cardinal DDG, 1 Supply AOE)
-Destroyer Group (DeGrp) 8 (6 Cardinal DDG)
-Destroyer Group (DeGrp) 12 (4 Revenge DD, 2 Cardinal DDG)
-Littoral Operations Group (LitOps) 12 (12x Tarantula LCS)
-Submarine Group (SubGrp) 7 (2 Dolphin II SSN, 4 Stymphalian SSGN - Donnerschlag Missile)
-SubGrp 8 (2 Dolphin II SSN, 2 Crossbow SSGN, 2 Kasatanov SSGN)

Aircraft:
(On Carrier - UAVs also present on BBs and BCs, and helicopters for almost all ships)
120x F-14F
24x F-30 Shiden II
240x F/A-18IEL
24x A-15A
24x A-6FL
16x EA-6HL
18X EA-18GL
34x E-2L
24x KA-6L
50x S-3L
16x ES-3L
30x SH-60L LAMPS X
20x EH-101L ASW
4x EH-101L AEW

(On land - in Hamptonshire Spain)
Tactical Fighter Wing 22 (72 F/A-22C Raptor)
Tactical Fighter Squadrons 772, 775, 776 (54 F/A-22C Raptor)
Tactical Fighter Wing 24 (72 F-28 Ostwind)
Tactical Fighter Squadrons 1022, 1024, 1025 (54 F-28 Ostwind)
Fighter Interceptor Squadronds 552, 553, 554 (54 F-125A Rapier)
Attack Fighter Squadrons 108, 109, 117 (36 A-114 Gunslinger)
Attack Fighter Squadrons 118, 119, 192 (54 FB-22C)
Attack Fighter Squadrons 121, 122, 123 (54 A-12C)
Bomber Squadrons 135, 136, 143 (18 B-52HLs, 18 B-1CLs, and 18 MB-52K Megafortresses)
Airborne Early Warning Squadron 31 (12 E-3L AWACS)
Ground Early Warning Squadron 33 (12 E-8L JSTARS)
Airborne Photoreconnisance Squadrons 67, 68 (12 RF-16D, 12 U-2)
Naval Air Corps Maritime Reconnisance Squadron 7 (12 P-7A)
Mobility Wings 15, 16, 17 (C-240, An-124, PelicanULTRA, KC-10L)
Electronic Intelligence Wing 12 (18 E-130LA/B/C Integrated Solo III/ABCCC)
Electronic Jamming Squadrons 51 (24 EF-35A)
Army Theatre Air Defence Sub-Groups 27 and 28 (8 Grendel SAM Batteries, 4 Skymer SAM Batteries, 4 Fire Arrow SAM Batteries)

IDF owning Israel would just be for the sake of RP. Just as I do not own Sweden and Finland in the HP thread but for the sake of RP Guff is allowing me to use those two countries to RP. I think we should allow IDF to control Israel for this RP and all other nations involved recognize the claims of all other nations for the sake of this RP.

IDF ships being sent to the North Atlantic: (ships taken from Med. fleet under command of Fleet Admiral Joseph Jacobson)

2 12 Tribes class super carrier (with 175 F-35Cs each)
1 Yorktown CVN (90 F-35)
2 Nimitz CVN (75 F-35C each)
2 Charles de Gaulle CVN (45 F-35C each)
6 Wasp II LHDs (18 Helos each)
2 Guillen dreadnoughts (including flagship USS Ozzie Guillen)
10 Arizona BBN
4 Iowa II BB
5 Payton BCG
8 Cherokee arsenal ships
9 Imperator arsenal ships
12 Kirov CGN
37 Ticonderoga II CG
28 Farragat DDG
56 Arleigh Burke IIA DDG
21 Ilan Ramon DDG
72 Chicago FFG
18 Oliver Hazard Perry FFG
48 various logistical ships
28 Galaxy SSN
12 Seawolf SSN
14 688i SSN
8 Upholder SSK
7 Kilo SSK
15 Tango SSK

Vastiva's holdings are in Antarctica, Pangea, and Manium. Our fleets and rapid-deploy troops were sent in support.

As to the whining on the part of HP and the rest - shut it. Period. This entire RP is being done out of courtesy by Chellis and by his allies. Stop the Godmoddery, stop the attempts at rewriting maps, and quit being babies, it's annoying.

IDF owns Israel and can shut the Suez from the North. Huzen Huzen can shut it from the South. I've got subs on the bottom in the middle. Nuff said?

Guffington, if you want France or any of the other contested areas, you'll have to fight for them. Period. Stop the rapid advance crap, it's annoying and you'll end up playing with yourself if you keep acting as though everyone else is here for your convenience. I only know of one other player on NS who acts like you, and I'm a hairsbreath from believing the accusations.

And Holy Panooly - if you even THINK about ignoring combatants, this entire thread shuts down. You dont' get to pick and choose. The "it didn't happen" thread already proved enough about your skills to make me ill, don't prove me right as well.

Now start acting like adults and lets play this out. Or keep whining, your choice.

I have posted in the other thead that ships have been deployed to the Gulf of Aden and southern end of the Red Sea, just in case HH acts on his threats.

Twist, when did you ever take north italy, btw? If you didnt, how are you on the franco-italian border?

Twist, when did you ever take north italy, btw? If you didnt, how are you on the franco-italian border?

That's what I'm asking too.

OOC: The Composition of the Sarzonian forces headed to the North Sea:

1 Calypso-class super dreadnaught
1 Forrest-class aircraft carrier (75 aircraft, including 40 ZaS 27M fighters. Other fighters include the Seabolt.)
2 Nelson-class light carriers (40 aircraft each, including 20 ZaS 27Ms)
2 Bastion-class battleships
2 Volunteer-class battleships
1 Truxtun-class battlecruiser
2 Alliance-class supercruisers
5 Randolph-class heavy cruisers
6 Ithaca-class light cruisers
10 County-class AA destroyers
15 City-class general purpose destroyers
12 Furtive-class frigates
5 Julianus-class SSGNs
12 Skipjack-class SSNs

Okay, this is a continuation of the satellite/concealment discussion that was about to pop up.

Guffingford: I don't expect you to know this because we haven't RPed together before, but I'm going to explain the capabilities of my spy satellites. They take extremely high-resolution digital photos (think of being able to blow the image up to ten-foot size photos that are commonly used for spysat pictures and still be able to see fine detail down to feet and inches) in four spectrums.

Visible Light: Your standard full-color photos, fairly easy to fool if you know what you're doing.
IR: Doesn't rely on coloration but heat signature, but any competent engineer shouldn't have a great deal of trouble setting up heat blinds and decoys.
UV: This is far harder. If you've ever put a plastic leaf and a real plant under a ultraviolet lamp, you'll immediately notice the difference. Because of photosynthesis a real plant will glow in the light but a plastic plant will just reflect the light back. Now obviously anything that has a camo net over it still won't be visible to the sat, even with UV, but that's where the next spectrum comes in.
Radar: If you've ever opened a science textbook and seen that yellowish picture of the Nile with its dried-up and buries tributaries, that's a radar sat image. Officially the sat belongs to NASA, but it's widely, if unofficially, acknowledged that the picture was taken by an advanced NRO satellite. Basically it doesn't matter what you use to cover something, it's going to be seen by whatever spysat that is using the radar spectrum for photos.

But the fact remains all satellites can only look straight down to earth. There are ways to get around those tricky satellites though.

That's not necessarily true, but even if it was, what does it matter? I am, after all, talking about finding ground targets.

I agree with SS. With new Spy Satelites that have IR and UV capabilities Camo is useless. Camoflague, normal Camo nets, only work against normal vision. A camera for example would have a hard time finding a camoflagued installation but a camera that is IR capable would be able to see the heat signatures of men and machines under the Camo thus rendering it inaffective. Almost all of the NATO nations, to my knowledge, have spy satelites. It would be impossible for you to hide a defense structure the size of the Maginot line from Recon Planes and Satelites.

Also why use spy sats you can fly a rather plain looking aircraft about 50km inside of your border and gets good imagry for a good 50+km of your opponents side, yes it isn't full top down but it can see through gaps spy sats can miss, this assumes the fortifications are soemwhere near the border anyway...

OOC: Guff you can't say in your posts "I see all of your movements with my spy sats" and then say "but you cant see me because my sites are invisible so :P."

OOC: Guff you can't say in your posts "I see all of your movements with my spy sats" and then say "but you cant see me because my sites are invisible so :P."

Well, I do shoot down all unauthorized satelites in Chellian Spacial areas, so he can't really use satelites to spy on France, etc.

Huzen Hagen posted the take over of Erithrea before jolt. I'm damn sure he did because I helped him. Austar Union even tried to declare war to us about it. Case closed.

IDF owns NOTHING what is listed in my RL claims thread. Earth 5? Don't even think about it. Oh yeah Morathania, if Russian Forces attacks (note the IF) then your play in Finland is over... I think. I don't know what Guffingford has to say about this, it's up to him and RF.

FYI, What's with RF and NATO? I talked to him and it's wrong.
I thought some one had posted this wasn't going by your RL thread or anyone elses.

HP, I own Israel, Western Asia hasn't posted in months. You gave him the land to lock me out. Everyone else reckognizes my claim to Israel and Sinai.

IIRC, you don't even have a nation since Guerrilistan took you over.
For the purpose of this rp, I recognize IDF owning the canal. He is the only one that is rping that territory right now.

For the purpose of this rp, I recognize IDF owning the canal. He is the only one that is rping that territory right now.
For this RP they are letting me own the Canal.

One question for DT.
Do I still have those 10 million troops in your nation or is that out for this rp?

For this RP they are letting me own the Canal.I was close.

*looks over glasses*

You do realize you have allies on both sides of this conflict, right? Or did you happen to miss that?

The nation that hired me to trash CM's satellites and provoke an incident a while back now wants me to set a spark in this highly charged situation so that the ball gets rolling.

My question is, can I even participate in this at all? I don't know if you want a postmodern nation.

If so, then I'll set said spark... I want to get paid :cool:

The nation that hired me to trash CM's satellites and provoke an incident a while back now wants me to set a spark in this highly charged situation so that the ball gets rolling.

My question is, can I even participate in this at all? I don't know if you want a postmodern nation.

If so, then I'll set said spark... I want to get paid :cool:

What the hell?

According to what I got from reading the thread, everyone is ramping up to Defcon 1 but there are no hostilities yet and cooler heads may prevail. A certain party wants me to make sure that cooler heads do NOT prevail and that a major war breaks out.

Is that a lttile clearer?

According to what I got from reading the thread, everyone is ramping up to Defcon 1 but there are no hostilities yet and cooler heads may prevail. A certain party wants me to make sure that cooler heads do NOT prevail and that a major war breaks out.

Is that a lttile clearer?

Let me put is this way- Don't interfere

According to what I got from reading the thread, everyone is ramping up to Defcon 1 but there are no hostilities yet and cooler heads may prevail. A certain party wants me to make sure that cooler heads do NOT prevail and that a major war breaks out.

Is that a lttile clearer?

OCC: I certainly I your kidding right? I don't want war the reason why this Hasn't Exploded yet is because of the Amount of firepower on each side. We don't want this Firepower killing innocent citizens, sure a War is what NS needs but not on this Level, a war like this could easily draw a line in NS if it hasn't already as i have talked to a few nations that now think the counter balance to NATO has arrived. But we don't want a war on this Scale. Also i didn't even know this Thread existed till just then :p

Axis Nova leave while you still can because if You Started anything your head will be on the Chopping Block.

Dr_Twist.

If I am allowed to get in on this, obviously I would be making it look like someone ELSE other than I started things. Why do you think I posted in the OOC thread first?

Let me put is this way- Don't interfere

What does it say Axis Nova...?

We don't want this to Explode no one does we want Peace and i am sure NATO does as well, So ill Say it Again Leave while you Still can.

What does it say Axis Nova...?

We don't want this to Explode no one does we want Peace and i am sure NATO does as well, So ill Say it Again Leave while you Still can.

First of all, it's the United Alliances. This isn't a NATO vs. anyone RP. Three alliances (the OMP, Victoria Alliance, and NATO) as well as numerous independent nations have come together to face down this threat to European stability. It's the United Alliances.

Secondly, Axis Nova your interferences helps no one.

First of all, it's the United Alliances. This isn't a NATO vs. anyone RP. Three alliances (the OMP, Victoria Alliance, and NATO) as well as numerous independent nations have come together to face down this threat to European stability. It's the United Alliances.

Secondly, Axis Nova your interferences helps no one.

May i point out that the other Side Contains the Alliances RBA RWC and a few other Alliances, including Extremely Close allies to Dr_Twist. Europe has Always been seen as a Stronghold of Allies and we will NEVER EVER let an ally get invaded in Europe.

Dr_Twist.

May i point out that the other Side Contains the Alliances RBA RWC and a few other Alliances, including Extremely Close allies to Dr_Twist. Europe has Always been seen as a Stronghold of Allies and we will NEVER EVER let an ally get invaded in Europe.

Dr_Twist.

The United Alliances exists only because there is a threat of invasion, we will only respond to an attack. Our side didn't start this situation, but our side wants to end it.

The United Alliances exists only because there is a threat of invasion, we will only respond to an attack. Our side didn't start this situation, but our side wants to end it.

As stated again and again, we will not adopt a 1st Strike Policy in this Situation, the UA did start this situation by beginning to buildup forces in and around Europe and because Europe is an Allied Stronghold we had no Choice but to ATLEAST match those forces being built up in and around Europe.

Dr_Twist.

As stated again and again, we will not adopt a 1st Strike Policy in this Situation, the UA did start this situation by beginning to buildup forces in and around Europe and because Europe is an Allied Stronghold we had no Choice but to ATLEAST match those forces being built up in and around Europe.

Dr_Twist.

Did you read the first part of the thread, Guffingford started the build up.

Did you read the first part of the thread, Guffingford started the build up.

Well I wouldn't blame him you invaded Spain when he did and that would create tensions and because you would have forces there you could easily invade Guffingford Controlled Spain, and because he was simply putting forces in defensive positions you then begun a buildup, then when that happened we begun a buildup to match that buildup to protect our ally from possible invasion.

Dr_Twist.

Well I wouldn't blame him you invaded Spain when he did and that would create tensions and because you would have forces there you could easily invade Guffingford Controlled Spain, and because he was simply putting forces in defensive positions you then begun a buildup, then when that happened we begun a buildup to match that buildup to protect our ally from possible invasion.

Dr_Twist.

You may also want to read his parts about his buildups along the boarders of France and Denmark.

You may also want to read his parts about his buildups along the boarders of France and Denmark.

Well i wouldn't blame him there ether from what Happened both yourself and Chellis would of Striked him for his invasion of Spain.... While yourself Invaded Spain because NATO and its allies wouldn't approve of such a move by him... but His Moves were legal as there was no official owner of the country at that time and yourself even profited from the situation by invading Spain your self to make a so called "Buffer" between himself and France... Now why would a Buffer be needed if he Has access to France from else were?

Dr_Twist.

Right, time to steam in - since I'm on the side opposing Guff. My nation uses what used to be some of French Polynesia as a base of ops, btw, along with a few other islands in the area. Not convenient but it works.

I was asked to join by Dr. Twist - i have no current land claims in any remaining world (mine were in the very first world and it has long since dropped off the bottom of the inactive list (like in 2003)) Therefore my forces only control the land they are on, currently a chunk around Hamburg.

Force correlation is:
20 Divisions.
Each division is like the below 18th Heavy Armored Division.
7th Armored - Mk VIII/MkIX Iscariots
101st Armored
174th Armored
177th Armored
200th Light Armor - Mk VII Iscariots
32nd Light Armor
3rd Artillery - 155mm Tube Arty
143rd Artillery
28th ADF - 1/2 MetalStorm Point Defense systems, 1/2Exalted Missile Systems
213th ADF
8th Infantry
9th Infantry
42nd Infantry
199th Infantry
1021st Infantry
523rd Infantry
127th Blackhawk II
32nd Apache III

Each Individual Vehicle Brigade has 1024 Vehicles, each Infantry brigade has 10240 Infantry.

I am also using 15 Naval Task forces, each has 1 Solar Dawn Class SBB, 4 Nemesis Class BC and 4 Collins Class DS (destroyer type/submarine)

For the tech i invented, including but not limited to the Solar Dawns, Nemesis, Iscariots, MSPDs, Exalted Missiles look here:
World@War (http://s7.invisionfree.com/worldatwar) The tech pages are split into type, I am Iraq there...

-taggified-

My fleet in the Atlantic is moving to the Eastern Med to back up the homeland

*looks over glasses*

You do realize you have allies on both sides of this conflict, right? Or did you happen to miss that?
I know this full well, which is why WHittier will be neutral and instead try to help broker a peaceful settlement to the crises.
Step 1: Whittier proposes the establishment of demilitarized zones.

My fleet in the Atlantic is moving to the Eastern Med to back up the homeland

OCC: How do you plan to Get Throw DT and RF Ships have Blocked the Med side of the Canal and there is a large allied Naval Presents from Italy back making any entrance past Italy or north of the Suez impossible without Allied Permission.

OCC: How do you plan to Get Throw DT and RF Ships have Blocked the Med side of the Canal and there is a large allied Naval Presents from Italy back making any entrance past Italy or north of the Suez impossible without Allied Permission.

OOC: Please make an effort to read the earlier pages of this thread and the IC thread.

As a personal favor, can you please do a little spell and grammar checking before you put up your posts; your style of writing can at times be quite taxing to the eyes.

OOC: Please make an effort to read the earlier pages of this thread and the IC thread.

As a personal favor, can you please do a little spell and grammar checking before you put up your posts; your style of writing can at times be quite taxing to the eyes.

OCC: Sorry about that its a computer habit I see it if people understand the msg why make it hard 4 yourself....?

Also IDF would be recognized as owning those States in the Middle East Because this is based of HP's Thread, not Chellis's Sorry but that’s how it is... However normally i do Recognize IDF as owning those States.

OCC: Sorry about that its a computer habit I see it if people understand the msg why make it hard 4 yourself....?

Also IDF would be recognized as owning those States in the Middle East Because this is based of HP's Thread, not Chellis's Sorry but that’s how it is... However normally i do Recognize IDF as owning those States.

I mean absolutely no offense, but it does make it harder for people RPing with you when they have to read a passage multiple times to catch what you are saying.

This whole incident is not really based in anything-- Morathania doesn't control Sweden and Finland in HP's or Chellis' threads but in this RP he does. Chellis doesn't,and neither do I in principle, recognize Guffingford's land claims, but out of the spirit of the RP it is being recognized. Same with IDF, in this RP he controls what he RPs as.

I mean absolutely no offense, but it does make it harder for people RPing with you when they have to read a passage multiple times to catch what you are saying.

This whole incident is not really based in anything-- Morathania doesn't control Sweden and Finland in HP's or Chellis' threads but in this RP he does. Chellis doesn't,and neither do I in principle, recognize Guffingford's land claims, but out of the spirit of the RP it is being recognized. Same with IDF, in this RP he controls what he RPs as.

I got ya now, Yer thats Acceptable.

As stated again and again, we will not adopt a 1st Strike Policy in this Situation, the UA did start this situation by beginning to buildup forces in and around Europe and because Europe is an Allied Stronghold we had no Choice but to ATLEAST match those forces being built up in and around Europe.

Dr_Twist.

As this is the OOC thread - are you blind? Guffington started this by invading Spain and threatening Chellis-held France. Go back to the beginning of the IC thread and read. Then read how Guffington invaded Spain and Portugal.

Who would have been whomped on? Guffington. Period. And they knew that. So they lied out of their asses to you. And you went for it, hook, line, and sinker.

You're being duped. Very well duped. You've been made into an absolute patsy - excellent work by Guffington. Gotta admit that. Never ever seen anyone used and made fool of so completely before. You've even got your friends and allies dancing to Guffington's tune.

You're being sucked into a war by someone out on a crusade. So either you know about it, or you're a patsy. A or B. Which is it? I really want to know. Because either you're a lying sack, or you get a big sticker labelled "SUCKER" on your forehead.

Do show one action by Chellis or Hamptonshire or by ANY UA member prior to Guffington's actions. Any. C'mon, I'm waiting. That's right, you can't. Why? Because there wasn't one.

So, which is it? Sucker or Liar?

And more to the point - what are you going to do about it?

It's Guffingford, not Guffington.

OCC: How do you plan to Get Throw DT and RF Ships have Blocked the Med side of the Canal and there is a large allied Naval Presents from Italy back making any entrance past Italy or north of the Suez impossible without Allied Permission.

Because they are already in the Atlantic so they don't need the canal, the shortest route is for Gibraltar

Because they are already in the Atlantic so they don't need the canal, the shortest route is for Gibraltar

OCC: how do you plan to get past Italy?

It's Guffingford, not Guffington.

That wasn't really needed.

DT: It's not like you can stop us from getting around Italy, not unless you want to start a war. Besides, most of the people in the UA are members of the Organization of Maritime Powers, which means that if you piss us off we have the capability to make sure your navies cease to exist on anything but paper in short order.

DT: It's not like you can stop us from getting around Italy, not unless you want to start a war. Besides, most of the people in the UA are members of the Organization of Maritime Powers, which means that if you piss us off we have the capability to make sure your navies cease to exist on anything but paper in short order.


Hahahahaha. Oooooh loook at me im in the Maritime Powers, that means that we must have a massive navy!

Oh wait numbers dont particularly matter when a tactical nuke in an atmospheric explosion will short circuit every system on your ships, leaving them floudering defenceless!

Also we probably have more than you.

DT: It's not like you can stop us from getting around Italy, not unless you want to start a war. Besides, most of the people in the UA are members of the Organization of Maritime Powers, which means that if you piss us off we have the capability to make sure your navies cease to exist on anything but paper in short order.

Maybe you are blind to the shear number of Nations between 2.5-4.5 Billion that have offered Support and have promised the Defense of Europe, We can guarantee that we will match any Naval Power your so Called Maritime Powers alliance can put in Place, for some reason People are forgetting that you aren’t messing with noobs here, You are asking for war from nations that were created during the time of December 2002 to Midway 2003, and there are a lot of us. You may concentrate on Naval Power my friend but as Proved in every war since World War 2 Air Power is now the Most Important part of Any War, and we can guarantee that we will match what ever is mobilized to Europe.

Nations to Date that have Offered Support in Europe if Europe is invaded.

Myself 3.3 Billion+
Russian Forces 3.8 Billion+
Imperial Forces 3.8 Billion+
Armacor 3.8 Billion+
Malatose 3 Billion+
The Bisons (I am not sure what nation he is using) 3 Billion+
Independent Hitman 3.2 Billion+

You Must remember you are Threatening an Old Collection of Powerful Nations that have lived thought and seen some of Nation states biggest Events, Including the GDODAD invasion of Europe in May 2003.

There are a lot More Nations expected to add there names to this List as time goes on and other nations that refuse to show there face unless the fighting even begins.

From this Alone anything UA has moved to Europe would be easily outnumber in no time at all.

Don't forget the RWC with plenty of 2 billion + nations.

Hahahahaha. Oooooh loook at me im in the Maritime Powers, that means that we must have a massive navy!

Oh wait numbers dont particularly matter when a tactical nuke in an atmospheric explosion will short circuit every system on your ships, leaving them floudering defenceless!

Also we probably have more than you.

It's called hardening. Look into it.

Also look into escalation and MAD while you're working.

It's called hardening. Look into it.

I will do.

OCC: how do you plan to get past Italy?


The ships are doing nothing but transiting the free seas. We aren't firing at your ships, but if you fire at ours, expect a good sized response from us.

I also want to point out that you shouldn't blockade the Northern end of Suez as that is my own waters you are blockading and that is an act of war. (I realize that you may have posted that in confusion to who owns Suez so I'll let you off the hook as long as the blockade on Northern Suez is ended)

VERY IMPORTANT LINK TO EUROPE. I ADVISE EVERYONE READS IT.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=361404

VERY IMPORTANT LINK TO EUROPE. I ADVISE EVERYONE READS IT.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=361404

You do know that as a rule of RP ettique if you don't want that to be ignored, you would have had to clear that with a member of the UA first. Since this attack occured over France, did you get the okay from Chellis?

Otherwise I could RP a nuclear explosion in one of my cities and blame it on Guffingford.

About this argument on who is stronger in this case, nation creation date doesn't tell who is stronger or not. I have (along with another nation) defeated three early 2003 nations in a previous invasion where they landed on my shores, but I have also seem early 2004 nation putting 2003 nations into their graves in other wars. Not only it depends on technology (or number, if you are somehow planning to do human wave attacks and all that stuff), but it also depends on how intelligent your field commanders are - an army field commander who decides to decides to land 1 million troops onto a hostile beach minimum air, artillery, and seaborne support, is frankly, an idiot. Regardless of what we argue about, we'll have to fight to see who will be the true victor.

My first inclination is to ignore this for the reasons stated by Hamptonshire. Unified Sith did you clear this with any UA member? Did you inform a UA member via email, IM, TG, etc. that this will be happening? Did you allow them to reply if you did send a message? If this is an attempt to strike a match in gas tank that is this situation you will have to pass that RP through with a nation on the other side of the table.

DT, you cant block off the area between africa and italy, thats blockading both my waters and international waters, both easily acts of war. Blockading the north of the suez is either blockading idf waters, international waters, or both.

And you've not actually said, as far as I can see, what you're blockading with...

VERY IMPORTANT LINK TO EUROPE. I ADVISE EVERYONE READS IT.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=361404

So you blew up yourself. Whoopie! Yep, just like Hitler's invasion of Poland.

And more proof you're a lying sack. Nice try, but you'd need to be brain dead to believe that was started by anyone other then you.

And that's "I advise everyone to read it".

DT, you cant block off the area between africa and italy, thats blockading both my waters and international waters, both easily acts of war. Blockading the north of the suez is either blockading idf waters, international waters, or both.

I'm still waiting to hear if the good Dr Twist is (a) a warmonger who is in on this contrived shenanigans or (b) a dupe of Guffingfolderoll, who has been suckered by fast talk.

Gotta be one of the two.


Vastiva will be sending normal shipping through the Suez, unescorted, in a normal post. We will also be actively broadcasting any attempt to impede, board, or hinder said shipping, to the entire world.

The ships - freighters and oil tankers - will move through the Suez, across the Mediterranian, to the ports in southern France. Once unloaded and loaded, they will retrace the same path.

Therefore, either you will intercept said fleet - an Act of War - or you will not. If the latter, why are you there?

And yes, Vastiva will go to lengths to broadcast the presence and disposition of any ships which attempt to impede it's voyage.

I'm still waiting to hear if the good Dr Twist is (a) a warmonger who is in on this contrived shenanigans or (b) a dupe of Guffingfolderoll, who has been suckered by fast talk.

Gotta be one of the two.


Vastiva will be sending normal shipping through the Suez, unescorted, in a normal post. We will also be actively broadcasting any attempt to impede, board, or hinder said shipping, to the entire world.

The ships - freighters and oil tankers - will move through the Suez, across the Mediterranian, to the ports in southern France. Once unloaded and loaded, they will retrace the same path.

Therefore, either you will intercept said fleet - an Act of War - or you will not. If the latter, why are you there?

And yes, Vastiva will go to lengths to broadcast the presence and disposition of any ships which attempt to impede it's voyage.

I am nether, but I have a question for you, Are you A Troll who is bent on finding an act of war for the war, or B a Puppet of some Nation around here trying to get a War to Breakout between 2 groups of powerful nations?

The Dr_Twist Naval Fleets will not violate any Nations Sovereignty by violating there Waters. The only Shipping that will be asked to Stop is Naval Vessels from UA, beyond that Normal Shipping will not be interfered.

I'd like to ask all players to remain calm and to refrain from personal attacks.

I am nether, but I have a question for you, Are you A Troll who is bent on finding an act of war for the war, or B a Puppet of some Nation around here trying to get a War to Breakout between 2 groups of powerful nations?

The Dr_Twist Naval Fleets will not violate any Nations Sovereignty by violating there Waters. The only Shipping that will be asked to Stop is Naval Vessels from UA, beyond that Normal Shipping will not be interfered.

Stopping any UA vessels in international waters is an act of war, if you force them to stop.

I am nether, but I have a question for you, Are you A Troll who is bent on finding an act of war for the war, or B a Puppet of some Nation around here trying to get a War to Breakout between 2 groups of powerful nations?

The Dr_Twist Naval Fleets will not violate any Nations Sovereignty by violating there Waters. The only Shipping that will be asked to Stop is Naval Vessels from UA, beyond that Normal Shipping will not be interfered.

http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?p=7139757#post7139757

As far as the above - so, if you are neither, you might explain why you are supporting the imperialist advances of Guff?

You state you want to have Spain and Portugal unoccupied so as to support VL's return - yet when the voices are counted, why is yours absent when it comes to calling for Guff to withdraw?

War is the furthest thing from our minds - but you do seem to be jumping to arms to defend an invader of Spain and Portugal who is intent on holding such lands, when the UA has been adopting a poise of peace - and yet you still bellow that the UA is "causing trouble". The UA appears to be the set of nations doing all it can to create a peace.

Where is your voice, Dr Twist?

Where do we see your voice raised calling Guff to stand down and withdraw from what you state you would like to see returned to VL?

You state you are blockading the Suez - is this the action of someone after peace?

You state you will impede shipping near Italy - is this the action of someone after peace?

So I repeat - either you are after a war, or you are swallowing a line of sheer crap from Guff (aptly named he is). It is one or the other, there is no middle ground. Facts and threads prove he is the invader - and minor research on your part will prove this. I posit instead that this is a planned action on your part, because only in such a position would you miss the opportunity to look at all the evidence, and see through Guff's deceit.

The World awaits your response.

http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?p=7139757#post7139757

As far as the above - so, if you are neither, you might explain why you are supporting the imperialist advances of Guff?

You state you want to have Spain and Portugal unoccupied so as to support VL's return - yet when the voices are counted, why is yours absent when it comes to calling for Guff to withdraw?

War is the furthest thing from our minds - but you do seem to be jumping to arms to defend an invader of Spain and Portugal who is intent on holding such lands, when the UA has been adopting a poise of peace - and yet you still bellow that the UA is "causing trouble". The UA appears to be the set of nations doing all it can to create a peace.

Where is your voice, Dr Twist?

Where do we see your voice raised calling Guff to stand down and withdraw from what you state you would like to see returned to VL?

You state you are blockading the Suez - is this the action of someone after peace?

You state you will impede shipping near Italy - is this the action of someone after peace?

So I repeat - either you are after a war, or you are swallowing a line of sheer crap from Guff (aptly named he is). It is one or the other, there is no middle ground. Facts and threads prove he is the invader - and minor research on your part will prove this. I posit instead that this is a planned action on your part, because only in such a position would you miss the opportunity to look at all the evidence, and see through Guff's deceit.

The World awaits your response.

For what seems to be the same Reason as UA supporting Imperialism in North Spain, They claimed it as a so Called Buffer State.

Why state something for one Nation but forget the other, the withdrawal would have to be a planned even pull out by both sides.

We have Yet to see UA raise there voice on what Hamptonshire took in Spain and called it a so called Buffer State.

Maybe you should read the post a little more carefully about what’s happening in the East Med. You are also Threatening the Peace yourself by sending Ships into a Volatile area to try and get a reaction from allied forces.

I have Stated again and again, the Allies of Europe only moved in to make sure NATO and its allies didn't take advantage of the situation that was happening in Spain to launch an invasion of a European allies, in Such the Allies of Europe begin Mobilization for the Protection of the Whole of Europe, a lot of Old Nations have seen the biggest wars in NS history breakout in Europe, from the GDODAD invasion of Russian Forces to the Genocide of ADK to the Dr_Twist Civil war, the Allies have always stood together and there foothold on Europe will never be weaken by an outside party that has in the past been major enemies of the Allies in Europe.

So unless you know the History of Europe you would never understand that when it comes to Europe any form of Buildup by outside Alliances and Nations especially NATO, we have no choice but to match them because of the Shear size of wars that have broken out in Europe between these 2 sides of the fence.

For what seems to be the same Reason as UA supporting Imperialism in North Spain, They claimed it as a so Called Buffer State.

Why state something for one Nation but forget the other, the withdrawal would have to be a planned even pull out by both sides.

We have Yet to see UA raise there voice on what Hamptonshire took in Spain and called it a so called Buffer State.

Maybe you should read the post a little more carefully about what’s happening in the East Med. You are also Threatening the Peace yourself by sending Ships into a Volatile area to try and get a reaction from allied forces.

I have Stated again and again, the Allies of Europe only moved in to make sure NATO and its allies didn't take advantage of the situation that was happening in Spain to launch an invasion of a European allies, in Such the Allies of Europe begin Mobilization for the Protection of the Whole of Europe, a lot of Old Nations have seen the biggest wars in NS history breakout in Europe, from the GDODAD invasion of Russian Forces to the Genocide of ADK to the Dr_Twist Civil war, the Allies have always stood together and there foothold on Europe will never be weaken by an outside party that has in the past been major enemies of the Allies in Europe.

So unless you know the History of Europe you would never understand that when it comes to Europe any form of Buildup by outside Alliances and Nations especially NATO, we have no choice but to match them because of the Shear size of wars that have broken out in Europe between these 2 sides of the fence.

GREAT! Then you support Guffingfords's complete withdraw from Spain and Portugal, RIGHT?

Let's see some actions matching these words.

I mean, come on, Unified Sith's sad attempt to ignite a war only further underlines everything I've been saying - you and all your allies are being manipulated into a war. Nothing UA has done has been beligerent. Everything Guff has done has been.

The logic here is really simple.

As things have played out, Chellis and Hamptonshire and the rest of the UA are supporting a free Spain and Portugal. ALL members of the UA have agreed to the treaty.

Ergo, everyone on this side is attempting peace.

On the other side, we have Guff, who is trying to keep Portugal and parts of Spain (isn't that against what you said your goals are, Dr Twist?).

We have Unified Sith and the sad attempt to start a war by blowing up his own leader in a method that is contrived beyond belief (or do you actually believe that one, Dr Twist?)

We have you attempting a blockade in International Waters which is an Act Of War if you follow through with it... NO WARSHIPS are moving through the Canal, only freighters and tankers. In other words - Civilian Commerce. Impeding Civilian Commerce is an Act of War.

Let your actions speak, Dr T. Words fail me utterly. You speak of peace, with words of history and precedence. Very well - show the world your words are not hot air, full of fury but signifying nothing.

Do something which shows your peaceful intentions.

Let's compile a list of who vs who in Crucible.

ALLIES (NATO, OMP and CAD)

The Incorporated States of Sarzonia is a massive, environmentally stunning nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, hard-working, cynical population of 1.083 billion have some civil rights, but not too many, enjoy the freedom to spend their money however they like, to a point, and take part in free and open elections, although not too often.

*****

The Federation of Morathania is a huge, devout nation, remarkable for its barren, inhospitable landscape. Its hard-nosed, hard-working, intelligent population of 850 million are effectively ruled by a group of massive corporations, who run for political office and provide their well-off citizens with world-class goods and services. Their poorer citizens, however, are mostly starving to death while being urged to go out and get real jobs. The populace has reasonably extensive civil rights, although these are mostly aimed at allowing them to buy whatever they like.

*****

The Grand Duchy of Hamptonshire is a massive, devout nation, notable for its complete absence of social welfare. Its hard-nosed, hard-working, cynical population of 1.202 billion are rabid consumers, partly through choice and partly because the government tells them to and dissenters tend to vanish from their homes at night.

*****

The Proletariat Commonwealth of The Island of Rose is a huge, economically powerful nation, renowned for its complete lack of prisons. Its compassionate, hard-working, intelligent population of 824 million enjoy extensive civil freedoms, particularly in social issues, while business tends to be more regulated.

*****

The Democratic Imperium of Praetonia is a huge, safe nation, renowned for its barren, inhospitable landscape. Its hard-nosed, hard-working, intelligent population of 924 million enjoy some of the most opulent lifestyles in the region, unless they are unemployed or working-class, in which case they are variously starving to death or crippled by easily preventable diseases.

*****

The Sultanate of Vastiva is a huge, safe nation, renowned for its complete absence of social welfare. Its hard-nosed, hard-working population of 493 million are either ruled by a small, efficient government or a conglomerate of multinational corporations; it's difficult to tell which.

*****

The Mercantilist Absolutism of Chellis is a massive, economically powerful nation, notable for its compulsory military service. Its hard-nosed, hard-working, cynical population of 3.686 billion are rabid consumers, partly through choice and partly because the government tells them to and dissenters tend to vanish from their homes at night.

*****

The Imperium of Scandavian States is a massive, economically powerful nation, notable for its compulsory military service. Its compassionate, hard-working population of 2.762 billion are either ruled by a small, efficient government or a conglomerate of multinational corporations; it's difficult to tell which.

Europe (RWC, RBA, Bision & allies)

The Union of Socialist Republics of Russian Forces is a massive, socially progressive nation, renowned for its compulsory military service. Its compassionate, cynical population of 3.763 billion are ruled with an iron fist by the dictatorship government, which ensures that no-one outside the party gets too rich. In their personal lives, however, citizens are relatively unoppressed; it remains to be seen whether this is because the government genuinely cares about its people, or if it hasn't gotten around to stamping out civil rights yet.

*****

The Socialist States of Dr_Twist is a massive, socially progressive nation, notable for its complete lack of prisons. Its quiet, industrious population of 3.319 billion are fiercely patriotic and enjoy great social equality; they tend to view other, more capitalist countries as somewhat immoral and corrupt.

*****

The Continental Socialist Empire of Imperial Forces is a massive, socially progressive nation, renowned for its compulsory military service. Its hard-nosed, cynical population of 3.712 billion are ruled with an iron fist by the socialist government, which grants its people the freedom to do whatever they like so long as it doesn't involve getting richer than anybody else or challenging the government.

*****

The Holy Roman Empire of The Macabees is a massive, economically powerful nation, remarkable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, hard-working, cynical population of 2.759 billion are ruled with an iron fist by the corrupt, dictatorship government, which oppresses anyone who isn't on the board of a Fortune 500 company. Large corporations tend to be above the law, and use their financial clout to gain ever-increasing government benefits at the expense of the poor and unemployed.

*****

The Soviet Socialist Republics of Malatose is a massive, economically powerful nation, remarkable for its punitive income tax rates. Its compassionate, cynical population of 3.206 billion are ruled by a mostly-benevolent dictator, who grants the populace the freedom to live their own lives but watches carefully for anyone to slip up.

*****

The Conglomerate of Armacor is a massive, economically powerful nation, notable for its barren, inhospitable landscape. Its hard-nosed, hard-working, cynical population of 3.883 billion are rabid consumers, partly through choice and partly because the government tells them to and dissenters tend to vanish from their homes at night.

*****

The United States of Independent Hitmen is a massive, economically powerful nation, renowned for its barren, inhospitable landscape. Its hard-nosed population of 3.247 billion enjoy extensive civil rights and enjoy a level social equality free of the usual accompanying government corruption.

*****

The Holy See of Guffingford is a massive, devout nation, notable for its punitive income tax rates. Its hard-nosed, hard-working, cynical population of 2.564 billion are rabid consumers, partly through choice and partly because the government tells them to and dissenters tend to vanish from their homes at night.

*****

The Imperial Dictatorship of Iron Blood is a massive, devout nation, renowned for its complete absence of social welfare. Its hard-nosed, hard-working, cynical population of 3.493 billion are ruled by a mostly-benevolent dictator, who grants the populace the freedom to live their own lives but watches carefully for anyone to slip up.

*****

The Eternal state of Unified Sith is a massive, devout nation, remarkable for its punitive income tax rates. Its hard-nosed, hard-working, cynical population of 1.301 billion are ruled with an iron fist by the corrupt, dictatorship government, which oppresses anyone who isn't on the board of a Fortune 500 company. Large corporations tend to be above the law, and use their financial clout to gain ever-increasing government benefits at the expense of the poor and unemployed.

*****

The Imperial Forces of Intelligent Neighbors is a massive, economically powerful nation, notable for its complete absence of social welfare. Its hard-nosed, hard-working, cynical population of 1.496 billion are ruled with an iron fist by the corrupt, dictatorship government, which oppresses anyone who isn't on the board of a Fortune 500 company. Large corporations tend to be above the law, and use their financial clout to gain ever-increasing government benefits at the expense of the poor and unemployed.

*****

The People's State of Momanguise is a massive, socially progressive nation, renowned for its compulsory military service. Its compassionate population of 1.334 billion are fiercely patriotic and enjoy great social equality; they tend to view other, more capitalist countries as somewhat immoral and corrupt.

I suppose I had better fufill my commitment towards the RBA. Guff, could you please add me to the 'Europe' list? What I can do remains to be seen until I can talk to someone in the Europe alliance. If any of you has MSN, my address is laurence_t@hotmail.com.

GREAT! Then you support Guffingfords's complete withdraw from Spain and Portugal, RIGHT?

Let's see some actions matching these words.

I mean, come on, Unified Sith's sad attempt to ignite a war only further underlines everything I've been saying - you and all your allies are being manipulated into a war. Nothing UA has done has been beligerent. Everything Guff has done has been.

The logic here is really simple.

As things have played out, Chellis and Hamptonshire and the rest of the UA are supporting a free Spain and Portugal. ALL members of the UA have agreed to the treaty.

Ergo, everyone on this side is attempting peace.

On the other side, we have Guff, who is trying to keep Portugal and parts of Spain (isn't that against what you said your goals are, Dr Twist?).

We have Unified Sith and the sad attempt to start a war by blowing up his own leader in a method that is contrived beyond belief (or do you actually believe that one, Dr Twist?)

We have you attempting a blockade in International Waters which is an Act Of War if you follow through with it... NO WARSHIPS are moving through the Canal, only freighters and tankers. In other words - Civilian Commerce. Impeding Civilian Commerce is an Act of War.

Let your actions speak, Dr T. Words fail me utterly. You speak of peace, with words of history and precedence. Very well - show the world your words are not hot air, full of fury but signifying nothing.

Do something which shows your peaceful intentions.

Of course i support the Complete and Utter withdrawal by BOTH sides from Spain and Portugal and that Includes the Province of Spain that Chellis has taken

What UA does is his own Business

There technically is no Blockade as Normal Shipping Vessels will not be stopped or interfered with, but if you go back and read the post it says and i Quote "ASKED" That’s right, UA ships would be ASKED to halt at those areas, it doesn't say anything about forcing them from the area it says ASKED, and then we have you Trying as much as possible to instigate a war in that area by sending in ships trying to get Allied forces to fire upon the ships.

You defiantly aren’t helping the situation my Friend if anything u are only increasing tensions between the two groups.

Actually i belive he is merely looking for clarification, which you have now provided.

How ever you still keep trying to put preasure on Chellis and hamptonshire to withdraw from the iberian region when they have already agreed to do so, it is Guffingford who is providing the stumbling block.

both sides made apparently hasty moves in iberia but the UA are willing to back down from this situation and grant autonity to the region again it is Guffingford whor efuses to give up his claims.

thus in short to take things further you should eprhaps change the aim of your preasure.


oh and Guff you forgot a few people...

Who?

Off the top of my head myself, IDF, CSJ and Omz222...

Some one has to take the Spear head in this so i am going to make the 1st Move, Guffingford, you have 48 Hours to Leave Spain and Portugal Completely, We are also Requesting that UA follow the Same Timeline, This includes Chellis controlled province in South Spain. We want all Forces to Be out of Spain and Portugal to cool down the Situation.

Good, but we trust UA to use the same deadline as we do. 48 hours.

Some one has to take the Spear head in this so i am going to make the 1st Move, Guffingford, you have 48 Hours to Leave Spain and Portugal Completely, We are also Requesting that UA follow the Same Timeline, This includes Chellis controlled province in South Spain. We want all Forces to Be out of Spain and Portugal to cool down the Situation.

Chellis only owns the military base of gibraltar, not the province itself. We see no reason to give up an actual military base, especially since we have a very small troop presense there, about a division. Our troops there don't infringe upon Spanish civilians. We are, however, willing to let in troops from other nations as a check to the base, and we will even shut down the heavy guns indefidentally. We can't give it back to anyone, because there is no civilian use for it. We would just be abandoning a military base. Chellis has no airforces there, no tanks or artillery. Just an infantry division, and see's no reason why something that is quite often not under spanish control should be ceeded. We hold old VL territories so no one else can take them, not so we can control them.

I don't think you get it Guffingford. If you try, even for a second, to make a move against territory controlled by any member of the UA we will bitchslap you so hard that when you can stand up straight again you'll be back in the Stone Age.

We'll follow whatever timeline pleases us, if you don't like it you can step up to get smacked around.

I don't think you get it Guffingford. If you try, even for a second, to make a move against territory controlled by any member of the UA we will bitchslap you so hard that when you can stand up straight again you'll be back in the Stone Age.

We'll follow whatever timeline pleases us, if you don't like it you can step up to get smacked around.

Have a napkin and some vaseline. I'm pulling out and you're thinking I'm going back only to start this whole mess again? Use the grey matter in your head.

PS: I'm not impressed.

I don't care if you're not impressed, just recognize the fact that if you piss me off you're going to wish you hadn't.

Somebody has some severe attitude problems

DT, are you blockading Suez? If you are, you should stop as you are blockading my own waters.

Guff people have to sleep you know. As Hamptonshire told you in the IC thread he was asleep when you made the announcement that you would withdraw if UA forces withdraw. Then after basically thirty minutes you start lashing out at Hamptonshire because he hasn't immediately responded. Excuse me but people can't be on continually. Thats why RPs take so long because people can't be at their computers 24/7. They have jobs or school and they definitely have to sleep. So next time you may want to check the time in the place where the person you are RPing with lives to see when he's on. Don't make the UA look belligerant because the one person who has forces in Spain was sleeping. Thats a low blow and you should appologize to Hamptonshire and you should retract the statements you said earlier about the UA being belligerant because Hamptonshire didn't immediately accept your withdraw. If you do that again I am going to make you go 24 hours without sleep just staring at a computer screen and the NS forums. Hah. Little joke, don't go crazy. But just remember to be considerate of people if they don't immediately reply.

Dr. Twist. Stop spewing BS. You said that you were blockading the Suez Canal. You are also impeding the flow of shipping through international waters in the Mediterranean both of which I consider moves which are made to bring about a war. You have said yourself that UA (NATO, as you said) will not attack first. The UA has constantly said that it wont lead a first strike. So why would you begin blockading the Suez Canal and impeding the flow of shipping through the Mediterranean? Unless you or one of your allies starts a war you have nothing to fear from NATO et al. Were not going to attack you unless you, or Guff, or US, or RF, or HP attacks one of us. So what if we move warships through the Suez or the Mediterranean. If you know that we wont conduct a first strike and you know that your group of allies wont conduct a first strike then why are you imposing a blockade and stopping the movement of UA shipping? Unless you know that one of your "allies" will conduct first strike and will strike a match into the gas tank of a situation that we have now. I just have a few questions. Just a little perplexed. I don't want snide remarks either I want a clear answer to the questions that I have put forward.

Somebody has some severe attitude problems

He got in our faces, I got in his back. If he has a problem with that then he needn't be mouthing off.

Yeah, Guff if you would just look at the location under my name you would see "Southern California". That's in the GMT -7:00 zone (due to Daylight Savings Time). Your little fit has done nothing to improve your standing and most likely after this RP is over I place you under an official IGNORE.

Oh, and Sith, you RP some future tech along with modern tech, in this RP we are modern tech only.

Here's a rant!

Okay, this thread has been numberwanking to the extreme degree. 12 Million men armies?! What?! I don't have that in my Armed Forces! Oy... the logistics would be insane yet you do it with a wave of the magic wand! Ta da!

The fact that COMMUNISTS are supporting a CHRISTIAN FASCIST NATION makes me go what the fuck?! What?!

Also... RPing the death of your leader... to start a war... common sense tells you WAR-MONGERING!!!

In fact, I just want to IGNORE this RP... but I can't cause I'm a nice boy!

Gah!

OOC: I hear ya man. Especially the Communists thing. Makes me feel like taking them all and banging their heads with a large spoon.

OOC: Chellis is moving 12,000 Nilsar MKI's off of the front lines, and replacing them with Nilsar MKII's and MKB's as they become available. We will be retrofitting all existing MKI's as resources are available. Many MKI's are being sent to Western Africa as well, to be retrofitted in WA factories and sent back to France.

Who?

*cackles* Oh God if you only knew....

*cackles* Oh God if you only knew....

If you only knew what's in store for you when you dare to invade...

Yeah, Guff if you would just look at the location under my name you would see "Southern California". That's in the GMT -7:00 zone (due to Daylight Savings Time). Your little fit has done nothing to improve your standing and most likely after this RP is over I place you under an official IGNORE.

I didn't saw your location so I'm going to be ignored? Excuse me for not reading a location. I'm not going to participate in peace talks, I'm handling it by myself.

I didn't saw your location so I'm going to be ignored? Excuse me for not reading a location. I'm not going to participate in peace talks, I'm handling it by myself.

Guffingford you're going to be IGNOREd because of the puppet issue, your poor claiming RPs, and your all too familiar attitude. As soon as this situation is over, my NS world will be decreasing by 4 nations (but only 3 players).

Guffingford you're going to be IGNOREd because of the puppet issue, your poor claiming RPs, and your all too familiar attitude. As soon as this situation is over, my NS world will be decreasing by 4 nations (but only 3 players).

Sorry but is the use of puppets an issue? If you're ignoring me but then, what will happen to your claims if you don't exist to me? And my poor claiming RP's? Have you seen yours? I don't care a single moment about you ignoring me. If you didn't like my claims, why are you RPing with me? Only because I'm a bigger puppet with many powerful allies. Yes that's it.

Emperor of Double Standards.

Sorry but is the use of puppets an issue? If you're ignoring me but then, what will happen to your claims if you don't exist to me? And my poor claiming RP's? Have you seen yours? I don't care a single moment about you ignoring me. If you didn't like my claims, why are you RPing with me? Only because I'm a bigger puppet with many powerful allies. Yes that's it.

Emperor of Double Standards.

will happen to your claims if you don't exist to me?
If HP, your Claims thread is fair and balanced, it wouldn't impact it at all.

And my poor claiming RP's? Have you seen yours?
I am far from the best by any means, but at least I go for realism and interactivity when possible.

I don't care a single moment about you ignoring me.
OH GOD NO!!! What shall I do?


If you didn't like my claims, why are you RPing with me? Only because I'm a bigger puppet with many powerful allies. Yes that's it.
I was doing the RP because out of the spirit of the RP Chellis was playing along, and on the NATO Boards Chellis asked for a little help.

As for your allies, some of them I still respect, others I don't. The puppet you are using may be large, but you are still a fourth rate RPer with a bad, petty attitude.

If HP, your Claims thread is fair and balanced, it wouldn't impact it at all.

But, you're ignoring me, Holy Panooly and my thread too? I'm being fair to the people who deserve it, not those kind of people who have double morale standards like you. First you RP with me and recognize the claims and now they're not good for Mr Hamptonshire?

I am far from the best by any means, but at least I go for realism and interactivity when possible.

Bombing cities is far from realistic indeed. I've never seen it happen. Your argument is flawed. Have you even read my claims? Probably not.

OH GOD NO!!! What shall I do?

Have a napkin.

I was doing the RP because out of the spirit of the RP Chellis was playing along, and on the NATO Boards Chellis asked for a little help.

First you RP with me and recognize the claims and now they're not good for Mr Hamptonshire? Isn't that a tiny bit hypocrite?

As for your allies, some of them I still respect, others I don't. The puppet you are using may be large, but you are still a fourth rate RPer with a bad, petty attitude.

Please don't flame me, otherwise I shall forward it to the mods!

Sorry but is the use of puppets an issue? If you're ignoring me but then, what will happen to your claims if you don't exist to me? And my poor claiming RP's? Have you seen yours? I don't care a single moment about you ignoring me. If you didn't like my claims, why are you RPing with me? Only because I'm a bigger puppet with many powerful allies. Yes that's it.

Emperor of Double Standards.

You must be incredibly stupid to not know that puppet wanking is horrible RPing etiquette. Hamptonshire, are we going to continue this RP or may I IGNORE this bunghole now?

Using puppets is a very bad RP style. I admit I have a puppet, but I only use it for future tech RPs that the Trekie within me demands.

What is happening here is one nation is using a puppet to help his main nation get land. That is very good grounds for an IGNORE. I will join my allies in ignoring you and your puppet master after this RP is finished.

You must be incredibly stupid to not know that puppet wanking is horrible RPing etiquette. Hamptonshire, are we going to continue this RP or may I IGNORE this bunghole now?

Cool it with the personal attacks. You can ignore a player, obviously, but calling them names is not acceptable FORUM etiquette.

Seeing as guffingford is pretty much saying he is a puppet of HP, I am hovering my hand over the button to ignore Guff. I don't deal with puppeteirs, quite simply. Its just another form of godmodding.

Seeing as guffingford is pretty much saying he is a puppet of HP, I am hovering my hand over the button to ignore Guff. I don't deal with puppeteirs, quite simply. Its just another form of godmodding.
especially when you are using the puppet to help increase your main nation's power like HP is using Guff for.

This is purely a SAD attempt by UA members to find any loop hole they can to avoid the situation, there is no violation on the Puppet level, He is not using any Puppet to bolster his numbers in this situation.

Nations use puppets all the time to get involved in situations to not let there allies know what’s going on, so they can heavy get involved in a situation without breaking or hurting any of its allies or alliance.

UA needs to understand that if u took this step and ignoring him because he has other publicly known nations that aren’t involved in the war you would have to ignore nearly every other nation here in Nation States because i can guarantee it that people will have more then one nation, and just the point that you know he owns that nation and you are trying to ignore him for it is just SAD. UA get over yourself on the puppet situation because it is complete BS!

Dr_Twist.

Sure, that may be what you do, but I'm sure the majority in the UA, would not accept this kind of "puppet abuse", so to say. If you are using two or more puppets in this, you are just being unfair to everyone who only has one nation in the conflict. If you control more than one nation (like me), most people won't like it if you have both (or more) enter in the conflict (or multiple conflicts with relations between each other) and if you are using your main nation to give some form of advantage to your puppets. I personally have other nations under my control, but I would never use them to gain advantage. In most RPers' minds, it's just wrong. Put it simple, in a chess game, I think that many people won't like it if you say that your king can move like a queen and a knight just because "you can".
I'm sure that most nations here are not concerned about Guff owning more than one nation, but it is how he uses them. There's a distinct difference between owning more than one nation OOCly, and using them to gain advantage unfairly.

That's just how I think. If I'm being too harsh, then I'm sorry, but these are just my thoughts on the whole OOC situation here.

Sure, that may be what you do, but I'm sure the majority in the UA, would not accept this kind of "puppet abuse", so to say. If you are using two or more puppets in this, you are just being unfair to everyone who only has one nation in the conflict. If you control more than one nation (like me), most people won't like it if you have both (or more) enter in the conflict (or multiple conflicts with relations between each other) and if you are using your main nation to give some form of advantage to your puppets. I personally have other nations under my control, but I would never use them to gain advantage. In most RPers' minds, it's just wrong. Put it simple, in a chess game, I think that many people won't like it if you say that your king can move like a queen and a knight just because "you can".
I'm sure that most nations here are not concerned about Guff owning more than one nation, but it is how he uses them. There's a distinct difference between owning more than one nation OOCly, and using them to gain advantage unfairly.

That's just how I think. If I'm being too harsh, then I'm sorry, but these are just my thoughts on the whole OOC situation here.

I understand were you are coming from but there is nothing written anywhere on the movements of using puppets like that as far as I am aware, and even if there was it would be suggestions only as I highly doubt mods would bring in such rules.

There are a lot of nations with puppets that use them on that level, the main two most known in NS on that level is Whitter and Garrison 2, They both do this all the time thus making if you ignore HP for this u are technically ignoring atleast those two and any other nations that use puppets on that level.

Personally I think this is just an attempt by UA to find some way to ignore the situation that’s happening in Europe because alliances like NATO have been able to do what ever they can for so long, now that there is nations prepared to standup to them UA wishes to get out of the situation.

I don't want war in Europe, Europe has seen to many wars, all we want is to cool the situation down as fast as possible.

Dr_Twist.

I understand were you are coming from but there is nothing written anywhere on the movements of using puppets like that as far as I am aware, and even if there was it would be suggestions only as I highly doubt mods would bring in such rules.

There are a lot of nations with puppets that use them on that level, the main two most known in NS on that level is Whitter and Garrison 2, They both do this all the time thus making if you ignore HP for this u are technically ignoring atleast those two and any other nations that use puppets on that level.

Personally I think this is just an attempt by UA to find some way to ignore the situation that’s happening in Europe because alliances like NATO have been able to do what ever they can for so long, now that there is nations prepared to standup to them UA wishes to get out of the situation.

I don't want war in Europe, Europe has seen to many wars, all we want is to cool the situation down as fast as possible.

Dr_Twist.

I ignore all players that puppetwank including Whitter and now HP.

As for NATO, what has NATO done on the international stage? You talking about "alliances like NATO", hate to say it but the RBA and the RWC are trying to same stuff; it's nothing new.

I'm still willing to sign and enact the Permanent Pan-European Non Aggression Pact, but as I only recognize Chellis' Claims Thread as legit and I ignore HP/Guff and now US, I would only be able to sign the Pact with those nations who have valid claims to European territory.

Sure, there isn't any formal rome set up by the mods (the mods isn't responsible for modding RPs anyways), but you have to know the fact that avoiding using "puppets" to gain advantage for one another is a commonly accepted rule here, and I can guarentee you that many nations here, does not accept this kind of act. if you want me to speak from my heart, frankly, I think that "puppetering" is just another form of godmodding. It's essentially getting something done by going through the backdoor (so to speak) and making the whole situation unfair. Sure, there are nations (as you pointed out) who accepts this, but you have to know that not only the members in the UA will not accept this kind of act, but also that not using puppets is making everything fair. It's again like chess: you could claim how your king just got to somewhat of a "uberking", and although it's not like the police will arrest you and send you to death row for doing such things, you are making the whole game unfair for your own advantage, which can often result in - frankly - few people wanting to play with you. These nations you mentioned can, in essence, play with their own rules, but they must face the fact that they cannot force people (with different thougths about this) to not avoid RPing with them.

As for the second accusation, I can tell you that as a member of this UA, this is a baseless claim. We do not ignore people just because this is going to turn to a huge war or this will inflict heavy casulties, but it's because of this puppetering thing going around in this RP ever since it began. You could call it your own perception, but if we want to ignore it just because we don't want to face teh challenge, we would have done it days ago. But the truth is simply, the oness in UA (including me, who have chosen to ignore this) are not ignoring this because of all the challenges and the likes, but are ignoring this because of the puppetering and the great unfairness and (in my opinion) unsportsmanlike attitude created by it.

Well, since I got the feeling in my mind out, I hope that you can understand what the situation here is deteriorating to. Frankly, starting an argument is not on my mind, but it seems that the moment has come where I will make my personal judgement on this case. Thank you for your understanding.

We are in our right to ignore HP. Puppeteering IS godmodding. I will admit I have puppets, but I've never had them interact or done an RP to benefit IDF. The only 2 puppets I've RPed with were Captain James T. Kirk (I still use that one for it's purpose, to do the occasional space RP that the Trekkie within me desires.) The other one is Daley's Chicago ( I only did joke RPs there to satirize the corruption of Mayor Richard M. Daley.)

What HP is doing is taking a puppet to fight along side his main nation. That is godmodding. If I brought in all my puppets so I could have more troops fighting and more land you would be crying foul. What HP did is godmodding and no self respecting RPer would do that or RP with someone who does.

DT, please explain to me how puppeteering is not godmodding.

I understand what you mean now and yes i agree with you, that type of puppet wanking shouldn't be allowed to make another nation bigger, so yes on that level i do agree.

The Dr_Twist Government will put this on the Table, We will turn back the clock and make Spain and Portugal a free Nation like it originally was and both sides will instantly demobilize instead of a straight out ignore, because you can ignore one nation but not all of us, so doing this would make it easy. The NAP thing will go on and so on but yer lets just kill the situation.

I understand what you mean now and yes i agree with you, that type of puppet wanking shouldn't be allowed to make another nation bigger, so yes on that level i do agree.

The Dr_Twist Government will put this on the Table, We will turn back the clock and make Spain and Portugal a free Nation like it originally was and both sides will instantly demobilize instead of a straight out ignore, because you can ignore one nation but not all of us, so doing this would make it easy. The NAP thing will go on and so on but yer lets just kill the situation.

I'd like to continue on with the plan that you and I came to agree on.


As for the specifics here is what I propose:
-Each "side" will choose 4 nations, the other "side" must agree to all 4 nations.

-Each nation may send up to 5,000 total troops- lightly armed, UN Peacekeeper-Style (aka. Blue Helmets) soldiers into Spain and Portugal to insure the safety of those two nations.

-All bases used by the IIPSF will be administered and owned by the Government of Spain or the Government of Portugal.

-The "command" of the Iberian International Peacekeeping and Sovereignty Protection Force (IIPSF) will alternate between one of that nations on one side and a nation on the other side on the 1st of every month.

-An attack upon Spain and/or Portugal will be an act of war against all nations that have signed the Iberian Peacekeeping and Sovereignty Treaty.


Once I find the agreement that Chellis and I came to in Cameroon, I'll post more specifics for the Iberian mission.

I will sign any such deal, Hamptonshire.

I'd like to continue on with the plan that you and I came to agree on.


As for the specifics here is what I propose:
-Each "side" will choose 4 nations, the other "side" must agree to all 4 nations.

-Each nation may send up to 5,000 total troops- lightly armed, UN Peacekeeper-Style (aka. Blue Helmets) soldiers into Spain and Portugal to insure the safety of those two nations.

-All bases used by the IIPSF will be administered and owned by the Government of Spain or the Government of Portugal.

-The "command" of the Iberian International Peacekeeping and Sovereignty Protection Force (IIPSF) will alternate between one of that nations on one side and a nation on the other side on the 1st of every month.

-An attack upon Spain and/or Portugal will be an act of war against all nations that have signed the Iberian Peacekeeping and Sovereignty Treaty.


Once I find the agreement that Chellis and I came to in Cameroon, I'll post more specifics for the Iberian mission.

The Dr_Twist Government believes this is a Step in the Right Direction for the Region.

I think the best nations for this from our side is:
Myself
Russian Forces
IH & IN

We also believe that if Chellis wish’s to Keep Gibraltar even if it is the Fort something needs to be added to the Agreement of it, because the Allies believe that chellis will use that position to take control of the straight.

Dr_Twist.

The Dr_Twist Government believes this is a Step in the Right Direction for the Region.

I think the best nations for this from our side is:
Myself
Russian Forces
IH & IN

We also believe that if Chellis wish’s to Keep Gibraltar even if it is the Fort something needs to be added to the Agreement of it, because the Allies believe that chellis will use that position to take control of the straight.

Dr_Twist.

The UA will have to come to an agreement, but Intelligent Neighbors and Russian Forces are completely unacceptable.

As for the issue of Gibraltar-- technically, and legally, Gibraltar is not Spanish territory. That said, I cannot in any way speak for Chellis, this issue will have to be taken up directly with him.

The UA will have to come to an agreement, but Intelligent Neighbors and Russian Forces are completely unacceptable.

As for the issue of Gibraltar-- technically, and legally, Gibraltar is not Spanish territory. That said, I cannot in any way speak for Chellis, this issue will have to be taken up directly with him.

Yes that is true but all we are looking for is some form of agreement on that Region in relation to the straight itself.

All we are looking for is permanent unrestricted access to the straight, and that Chellis would not legally be able to close the straight on the allies or it would be seen as a declaration of war on the allies.

We believe that this would only make the region more stable as a closing of the straight would only lead to more conflicts between the two parties.

Yes that is true but all we are looking for is some form of agreement on that Region in relation to the straight itself.

All we are looking for is permanent unrestricted access to the straight, and that Chellis would not legally be able to close the straight on the allies or it would be seen as a declaration of war on the allies.

We believe that this would only make the region more stable as a closing of the straight would only lead to more conflicts between the two parties.

Now, if we were all to sign the Permanent Pan-European Non-Aggression Pact, we wouldn't need to worry about future wars.

The UA will have to come to an agreement, but Intelligent Neighbors and Russian Forces are completely unacceptable.

As for the issue of Gibraltar-- technically, and legally, Gibraltar is not Spanish territory. That said, I cannot in any way speak for Chellis, this issue will have to be taken up directly with him.

We believe that each side should be allowed to choice who they want in.

If not we will like to pick and choice of who UA sends into Spain.

We can Understand why you wouldn’t want IN in Spain, but I can’t see why RF wouldn’t be allowed in.

Now, if we were all to sign the Permanent Pan-European Non-Aggression Pact, we wouldn't need to worry about future wars.

I have discussed this with Chellis already and in his eyes this is only a "temporary Peace Agreement" not a permanent one.

We believe that each side should be allowed to choice who they want in.

If not we will like to pick and choice of who UA sends into Spain.

We can Understand why you wouldn’t want IN in Spain, but I can’t see why RF wouldn’t be allowed in.

By having both sides agree, the potential for possible "accidents" will be avoided. Your side can pick who it wants in and only if the UA has a serious problem will it object.

As for RF- he threatened all the Scandinavian countries with military invasion and a communist overthrow of democratic governments. Denmark is a Scandinavian country.

I have discussed this with Chellis already and in his eyes this is only a "temporary Peace Agreement" not a permanent one.

It will take time for the mistrust and paranoia to ebb for both sides, but I think that once we all sign an agreement and stick to it for a length of time it will become "second nature" to us all.

By having both sides agree, the potential for possible "accidents" will be avoided. Your side can pick who it wants in and only if the UA has a serious problem will it object.

As for RF- he threatened all the Scandinavian countries with military invasion and a communist overthrow of democratic governments. Denmark is a Scandinavian country.

That was the old Russian Government.

And yes i agree with you on the Agreement side of things, Europe has seen many a war and both sides are trigger happy and we know that, It was only destined that we meet in the battlefield because of the size of both sides.

We hope that this will cool the situation down and even in the future a full European Alliance would be created for Europe’s Protection and defense.

OCC: I gtg soon so i might not be here shortly.

Chellis has no plan for war, but will not be caught with our britches down. We were fine with keeping it low profile, but if everyone is going to bitch about us having it, we need to make sure we keep it, its obviously important. Chellis has no reason to close the strait, but we must maintain the right to do so if it becomes nessecary.

That being said, chellis has not signed any treaties, including Hamptonshires. Chellis is not for war, but is also not decided on that, especially not knowing the specifics.

Chellis has no plan for war, but will not be caught with our britches down. We were fine with keeping it low profile, but if everyone is going to bitch about us having it, we need to make sure we keep it, its obviously important. Chellis has no reason to close the strait, but we must maintain the right to do so if it becomes nessecary.

That being said, chellis has not signed any treaties, including Hamptonshires. Chellis is not for war, but is also not decided on that, especially not knowing the specifics.

Chellis, the specifics are not yet worked out on anything, save for the framwork for the IIPSF, which is based on the agreement we made in Cameroon.

Chellis has no plan for war, but will not be caught with our britches down. We were fine with keeping it low profile, but if everyone is going to bitch about us having it, we need to make sure we keep it, its obviously important. Chellis has no reason to close the strait, but we must maintain the right to do so if it becomes nessecary.

That being said, chellis has not signed any treaties, including Hamptonshires. Chellis is not for war, but is also not decided on that, especially not knowing the specifics.

That’s just the point Chellis the allies are worried that you or others might use the location to even bring this around again, We do believe the chellis government that they are interested in Peace, but this is a Volatile area that can be easy used to bring tensions to the area once again, Thus the adding of such important part of the NAP.

This is the reason why we are pushing so hard and that something needs to be added about the location.

That’s just the point Chellis the allies are worried that you or others might use the location to even bring this around again, We do believe the chellis government that they are interested in Peace, but this is a Volatile area that can be easy used to bring tensions to the area once again, Thus the adding of such important part of the NAP.

This is the reason why we are pushing so hard and that something needs to be added about the location.

The difference is, chellis did not start this. We know this is true, and we know we dont want to fight. So we don't need to worry about us being aggresive, we wont be. If you don't believe us, well, sorry. Chellis gains nothing by giving up, or severly reducing gibraltar.

Ok, how is HP supposed to be using Guff to make himself more powerfull? Guff is a completely different nation to HP, they do not interact. You are ignoring him because he is bigger then you. Loads of people rp with puppets but so long as you dont boost yoru self its ok, don't you think that the mods would have taken action (i belive boosting yourslef through puppetering is a deletable defense) if they saw a need to?

I agree with the Hamptonshire/Dr Twist plan and I think all UA nations should sign it and allow its passage. Spain will be free, Portugal will be free and the main bone of contention will be dismantled. I think that this joint peacekeeping force is a good idea and will lead to a stable Iberian Peninsula. I am also happy that Dr Twist is being cooperative and is working with Hamptonshire for peace in Europe. We thank them for turning from their Bellicose ways and accepting peace as an answer to war.

I would also like to put Morathania forward as a candidate for command in the first month. We are a non-warlike nation who while being a UA member was not in the top tier during this RP. Also Morathanian troops have a good deal of training in Reconstruction and nation building. We have gone into several RL nations, like Fiji and Romania, and we have built up stable governments and have completely rebuilt Renovia from a nation with a theocratic regime and a dismal economy into a thriving free trust territory with a powerhouse economy and a constitutional monarchy with strong a strong democratic tradition. That is what we have to do in Spain and I hope that I can help.

Sorry but is the use of puppets an issue? If you're ignoring me but then, what will happen to your claims if you don't exist to me? And my poor claiming RP's? Have you seen yours? I don't care a single moment about you ignoring me. If you didn't like my claims, why are you RPing with me? Only because I'm a bigger puppet with many powerful allies. Yes that's it.

Emperor of Double Standards.
Huzen Hagan, Guff said he was a puppet right their. Also earlier in the thread when Vastiva had spelled Guffs name wrong HP was the first one to correct him. Also Hamptonshire got a TG from HP saying that Guff was his puppet and IN was his puppet. Talk to Hammie he knows more but thats as much as I know.

Huzen Hagan, Guff said he was a puppet right their. Also earlier in the thread when Vastiva had spelled Guffs name wrong HP was the first one to correct him. Also Hamptonshire got a TG from HP saying that Guff was his puppet and IN was his puppet. Talk to Hammie he knows more but thats as much as I know.

Intelligent Neighbors? A puppet of HP? Go and ask the mods for an IP check. We do NOT have the same owner. I never TGed Hampton about Guffingford being a puppet of HP, and whoever said that, it's plain bullshit. Who cares if we're the same? The RP was good until people like Hamptonshire fucked it up with their double moral.

Yes I am Holy Panooly, is that a problem?

Intelligent Neighbors? A puppet of HP? Go and ask the mods for an IP check. We do NOT have the same owner. I never TGed Hampton about Guffingford being a puppet of HP, and whoever said that, it's plain bullshit. Who cares if we're the same? The RP was good until people like Hamptonshire fucked it up with their double moral.

Yes I am Holy Panooly, is that a problem?

Bluntly, yes. It means your "fair to all" thread is a hoax, that you godmodded yourself huge land tracts from one puppet to another, and you've pretty well obliterated any respect you ever had as you've decided to play in a manner inconsistant with common rules of RP on NS.

Ok, how is HP supposed to be using Guff to make himself more powerfull? Guff is a completely different nation to HP, they do not interact. You are ignoring him because he is bigger then you. Loads of people rp with puppets but so long as you dont boost yoru self its ok, don't you think that the mods would have taken action (i belive boosting yourslef through puppetering is a deletable defense) if they saw a need to?

He is boosting himself. That's illegal.

And I'm going to be ignoring both puppets as this is the second time HP has proven he can't RP, the first being the sham Sirens of Titan terrorist thread.

And don't tell me "it didn't happen". The events might have been "removed by agreement" but I was still there, still read all that garbage. HP has been awarding Guff land on his own thread, in droves. He began this whole series of events just to assuage his flagging ego. Well, yippie, as soon as the paper is signed, tah tah and "good riddence to bad rubbish".

Bah! This is exactly why I don't mess with the Earths.

Well HP... this is a surprise coming from you... oy.

And if you need peacekeepers, TIOR is great![/shameless plug] :P

If UA needs help with peacekeepers, I'll volunteer.

He is boosting himself. That's illegal.

And I'm going to be ignoring both puppets as this is the second time HP has proven he can't RP, the first being the sham Sirens of Titan terrorist thread.

And don't tell me "it didn't happen". The events might have been "removed by agreement" but I was still there, still read all that garbage. HP has been awarding Guff land on his own thread, in droves. He began this whole series of events just to assuage his flagging ego. Well, yippie, as soon as the paper is signed, tah tah and "good riddence to bad rubbish".

You're the dumbest ignoramus on the whole planet along with Chellis. Seriously, when the maker of thread says it's a waste of time and writing you still love to make references to it. And if I'm so terribly biased and my thread is junk why the fuck do you chose to RP with me? Little arrogant hypocrite. Why am I writing an explanation when lobotomy patients like yourself don't even read them?

The Dr_Twist Government Believes that Peace Keeping duties should be cut down to 2 Nations per Side, We believe that myself and Independent Hitman would be the best choice for the Peace Keeping in Spain and Portugal. Pending on UA agreement

We would like UA to put forward 2 Nations to send Peacekeeping Forces to Spain and Portugal that will be agreed on by the Allies of Europe.

We think this is the best move.

However with Spain and Chellis owning that Fort it can still be seen as Chellis Lands giving him the Ability to affectively close the straight if need be, we can’t let this happen, we must have something entered into the agreement about this Chellis Controlled fort or this will be going no were something has to be agreed on.

Intelligent Neighbors? A puppet of HP? Go and ask the mods for an IP check. We do NOT have the same owner. I never TGed Hampton about Guffingford being a puppet of HP, and whoever said that, it's plain bullshit. Who cares if we're the same? The RP was good until people like Hamptonshire fucked it up with their double moral.

Yes I am Holy Panooly, is that a problem?


There is no way that HP is IN. I've interacted with IN too much to know that its not true.

You're the dumbest ignoramus on the whole planet along with Chellis. Seriously, when the maker of thread says it's a waste of time and writing you still love to make references to it. And if I'm so terribly biased and my thread is junk why the fuck do you chose to RP with me? Little arrogant hypocrite. Why am I writing an explanation when lobotomy patients like yourself don't even read them?
Lay off the flaming.

Unfree People
Forum Moderator

numbers of my peacekeepers landing at Porto (numbers below are per division/regiment):

5 Mechanised divisions:

Men - 4,000
M113A3 - 400
Mobile 120mm mortars - 100
Improved Tow Vehicle - 100
Challenger 2's - 180
Warrior IFV's - 60
Crusader artillery - 40

2 Armoured divisions:

Challenger 2's - 540
Warrior's - 180
Apache longbows - 60

2 Infantry regiments:

Men - 100,000
M-777 + Jeep - 1,000
A-10's - 10
Super Cobras - 200

5,000 Para's

note, aircover is for now being given carrriers but elements of the airforce will be moved their shortly

Huzen Hagen, are you still blockading the Red Sea? I'm asking because me and other nations are running the blockade as you speak. Please respond so we know whether or not you are still illegally blocking access to International Waters.

Huzen Hagen, are you still blockading the Red Sea? I'm asking because me and other nations are running the blockade as you speak. Please respond so we know whether or not you are still illegally blocking access to International Waters.

nope, thought i posted that a while back. At least i ment to

You're the dumbest ignoramus on the whole planet along with Chellis. Seriously, when the maker of thread says it's a waste of time and writing you still love to make references to it. And if I'm so terribly biased and my thread is junk why the fuck do you chose to RP with me? Little arrogant hypocrite. Why am I writing an explanation when lobotomy patients like yourself don't even read them?

Lay off the flaming.

Unfree People
Forum Moderator

*respectful bow to Unfree People*

Holy Panooly, the problem with you playing multiple roles in one conflict can be shown by a board-game example.

If you want to play Risk, would you want to play against someone who gets five different color armies when you get one? They get five times the resources, five times the cards, five times the turns - and all five are functioning as one unit.

This is why what you are doing is 'against the common sense rules of consensual role playing'.

Had you brought up what you were doing in the first post, the thread would have been entirely ignored by NATO and Chellis. That you kept it a secret - and awarded land tracts to your own puppet even in your own "Fair to Everyone" thread makes it questionable as to whether you are playing to win, or playing to have a good time.

I am in this entire "Crucible" thread because I was asked to be by Chellis, whom I know will give a good game.

Small review - Guff has overwritten others claims in order to "swiftly take" as much as possible. There were attempts to move others armies and other forms of "pushyness".

So far, NATO and the UA have been sitting. No provocations, no actions of any sort against anyone. Every action has been defensive.

So far, the OpFor has had one side decide a build up against your puppet was a "build against Europe!" (utterly false); OpFor has had one member blow up his own leader in an attempt to spark a war, which was another completely false justification; and there are all these long-winded speeches about how "UA is doing this" and "NATO is doing that" - when no evidence backs up any of the allegations. As yet, UA is defending what it theirs.

And that's it.

Will I be on any of your other threads? Not knowingly, though if you don't point out they're a puppet of, it makes it difficult. At first, Guff sounded like a reasonable player - it was when the impatient rush and pushyness appeared, it became unfun.

Do you have style? Yep. Sure you do. Some good writing too. But you're out to "win" a game that can't be won, and you forget there are other people on the other side of the screen who have just as much right and justification to be here as you.

So, after this, I will be ignoring you until such time as you demonstrate you can "play well with others". This isn't an attack, it's my preference for whom I wish to play with.

Thank you for your time.

Huzen Hagen - is it your intention to perform those Acts of War which are in violation of the temporary peace accords between the two sides?


Dr Twist (etc) - is it your intention to allow those troop build ups by Huzen Hagen, or are you serious about your wish for peace?

The Dr_Twist Government Believes that Peace Keeping duties should be cut down to 2 Nations per Side, We believe that myself and Independent Hitman would be the best choice for the Peace Keeping in Spain and Portugal. Pending on UA agreement

We would like UA to put forward 2 Nations to send Peacekeeping Forces to Spain and Portugal that will be agreed on by the Allies of Europe.

We think this is the best move.

This is acceptable to Vastiva, though we note both the UA and AoE should keep one peacekeeping nation in, and the peacekeepers should have a balance of forces - as in, each side should have equal troops and equivalent machinery.

Furthermore, it should be stated that any attempted landing of troops from other nations, or in excess of the agreed equivalences, can be taken as an act of war by the nation performing the imbalance.



However with Spain and Chellis owning that Fort it can still be seen as Chellis Lands giving him the Ability to affectively close the straight if need be, we can’t let this happen, we must have something entered into the agreement about this Chellis Controlled fort or this will be going no were something has to be agreed on.

We still see this as a non-issue, as it was not part of the original event. We also note that Chellis does not have ownership, but holds it for the government in Morocco as stated by Chellis (we are sure there are more details in this, but are unprepared to comment further).

Therefore, again, this cannot be part of a treaty.

I was still thinking of giving this at least an end. But instead of trying to reconcile, HP/Guff goes on a flame rampage.

So, I am ignoring Holy Panooly and Guffingford. Ignoring for lying, puppeteiring(puppet-wanking), godmodding, flaming, trolling, controlling lands I don't recognize as being held by the party, being immature in general, being a bad rper, and again and most importantly, puppet wanking. Its glad not to have to care about this, wish I had done this much sooner.

ooc// (yes i know this is an ooc board)
All Armacor forces disappear... , i was expecting a decent war RP, instead its just been a flame about the peace terms without even any fighting first :-(

re the puppet thing... i think puppets are generally fine as long as they are either
1) never used in the same conflicts (eg i have my main nation at 3.8B, one at 3B, one at 2.5B etc (down to 500M) for different levels of conflict)

2) if they are in the same RP for some reason (generally only possible cause they got dragged in by different ally groups) it is either announced, or they are played in such a way that no-one can tell...

2) if they are in the same RP for some reason (generally only possible cause they got dragged in by different ally groups) it is either announced, or they are played in such a way that no-one can tell...
It would be fun to have puppets on different sides of a conflict and having them duke it out

Well, I've already slapped on the IGNORE for HP/Guffingford, so count me out of continuing this RP.

I'm now officially ignoring Guff and HP. I guess I'm out of here.

I was still thinking of giving this at least an end. But instead of trying to reconcile, HP/Guff goes on a flame rampage.

So, I am ignoring Holy Panooly and Guffingford. Ignoring for lying, puppeteiring(puppet-wanking), godmodding, flaming, trolling, controlling lands I don't recognize as being held by the party, being immature in general, being a bad rper, and again and most importantly, puppet wanking. Its glad not to have to care about this, wish I had done this much sooner.

As my host has decided to vacate, I must follow.

Official IGNORE on Holy Panooly, Guffingford, and Unified Sith.

The Dr_Twist Government Believes that Peace Keeping duties should be cut down to 2 Nations per Side, We believe that myself and Independent Hitman would be the best choice for the Peace Keeping in Spain and Portugal. Pending on UA agreement

We would like UA to put forward 2 Nations to send Peacekeeping Forces to Spain and Portugal that will be agreed on by the Allies of Europe.

We think this is the best move.

We will agree to you, but the UA will need to discuss the inclusion of IH.

We will agree to the two nations per side, but now each nation will be able to send up to 7,500 Peacekeepers.

As for the UA- Hamptonshire and Omz222.

To all those ignoring HP because of 'puppetering', exactly where is he doing that? HP is not involved in the conflict, the only posts it has made is in an ooc context. Guffingford and HP are completely unconnected icly (save for the RWC) so your justifactaion for these ignores is non-existant.

Vastiva: I signed jack shit, as did IN. The troops are peace keepers, leaving a power vacum would, in any real life situation, create mayhem. We are doing you a favor

OOC: If I might interject, I think the main problem certain players have with it is that you wouldnt all have leaped to his aid had the player not been HP.

It was Guffingfords insistance to use Holy Panoolys nation claims thread as a basis for the RP. Now that I dont recognize his land claims, and I see HP's are unfairly given to Guffingford, I don't recognize his hold of lands like that. In my mind, no one has acknowledge his lands with claims except himself, puppeteiring.

To all those ignoring HP because of 'puppetering', exactly where is he doing that? HP is not involved in the conflict, the only posts it has made is in an ooc context. Guffingford and HP are completely unconnected icly (save for the RWC) so your justifactaion for these ignores is non-existant.

Vastiva: I signed jack shit, as did IN. The troops are peace keepers, leaving a power vacum would, in any real life situation, create mayhem. We are doing you a favor

No, you're warmongering. Which you know. Please decide to realize and accept that what you do is evident by your actions. Just as much as HP/Guffingford KNEW what he was doing was "illegal" and did it anyway.

You know what you are doing is warmongering. Period, end of statement. So stop trying to play the "oh no, I'm innocent, I'm helping you" game. It doesn't work here - it's too transparent.

Now, as Chellis has decided to Ignore the whole thread, there's nothing more to discuss. Your party fails, everything goes away, there's no cause for war as now there are two different realities - one with UA in it, and one with.... let's see... the puppetwanker and his puppets; the other puppetwanker who killed his own leader to spark a war; the grossly manipulated one who can't see what was going on because of his loyalist streak; and the "we'll occupy it because it's what's right for everyone else" twins.

Huzen - ok, how about I take and sell your computer because "it's what's best for you, I'm doing you a 'favor'." Doesn't fly, does it? Please stop insulting others intellegence, it just makes this whole thing look even sillier then it has become.

It would be fun to have puppets on different sides of a conflict and having them duke it outI did that during the Sarzonian Civil War. The puppet I had at the time (now defunct) actually fought against Sarzonia.

I saw this RP becoming a flame/ignore fest from the outset. That's why I only sporadically got involved.

And herein lies the problem.

It had potential. But was marred first by the hatred HP has for NATO because he got rejected. Then this thread turned into a flamefest instead of a "lets all play a fun game, here's what is going on". Lack of respect for the OpFor is a prime indicator that it's no longer a game, but something personal. And personal really doesn't have a place in an action like this.

Being able to disassociate the OOC from the IC is one of the marks of a good RP'er. But here? Have a good reread of this thread. "Our forces are SO much bigger then yours!" (ok, so why play?), "I'm cheating, I know it, but you're not gonna find out!" (yeah, sure), "Yes, I'm puppetwanking, is there a problem with that?" (Uhm, duh)... I could go on, but to what point?

when you lose sight of "its a game meant to entertain all involved" and make it into a "Us VS Them" in OOC - well, you have a problem and it's going to kill the RP. Because the other side is not going to have fun, and if it's not fun, why play?

I mean really. Dr Twist - saying in OOC "We're going to impede the peace process while we move troops into Iberia and Spain" would have been better then all this nonsense. And it's not like we can't all read what's going on. Admit it in OOC, and move on with it. Acting like the OpFor is blind and stupid is utterly ridiculous.

As to the others occupying and upsetting the peace process - yeah, sure, like you'd do that if this was real life. You're being dweebs, you know it, we know it, everyone knows it, did you have fun?

This has all become tiring. My suggestion is to bring down the curtain on the whole thing, as Guffingford/Holy Panooly/whatever his other puppets names are has moved over to the NS board.


OpFor - Opposing Forces

The Nations sending Forces Into Spain who aren’t Dr_Twist Forces of Independent Hitman forces from our Side have been contacted and have been requested to pull there forces from Spain.

As far as the Dr_Twist Government is aware there was a miss communication between the nations that begun mobilization of Forces into Spain.

Dr_Twist.

Vastiva: I signed jack shit, as did IN. The troops are peace keepers, leaving a power vacum would, in any real life situation, create mayhem. We are doing you a favor

Seems rather straightforward to me.

Again, as Chellis is IGNORING all this, is there a point to continuing?