NationStates Jolt Archive

Arribastan is looking to refit 17 Iowa Class Battleships for modern use.
It is currently outfitted with the standard 1983 armament of:
9 16-inch/50 caliber Guns (Mark 7) (406mm)
12 5-inch/38 caliber DP Guns (Mark 12) (127mm)
4 20mm/76 CIWS Anti-Aircraft/Missile
32 BGM-109 Tomahawk Cruise Missiles
16 RGM-84 Harpoon Anti-Ship Missiles

We would like to get larger guns for better bombardment and a better speed than the current 33 knots.

we will also take bids on new battleships for ground bombardment instead.
~Emperor J.D. Alcanzar

With vast amounts of expertise in engineering surface combatants, the Elias Marine Corporation would like to bid for the contract, we will present a proposal within 24 hours for your attention and review.

United Elias, your bid is welcome. We know the quality of your engineering, and use some of your helicopters in our special forces.
~J.D. Alcanzar

bump

While we cannot offer you refits we can offer you with the Frunze-Class BBN here is a link. (http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=346420&page=1) It has 9 18 inch guns and can reach 36 knots.

While we cannot offer you refits we can offer you with the Frunze-Class BBN here is a link. (http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=346420&page=1) It has 9 18 inch guns and can reach 36 knots.We will consider your nation's offer as well.

Crookfur Naval manufacturing would be interested in placing a bid. We have an extensive working knowledge of the Iowa class vessels (we did have 8 but after a couple of "projects" we only have 5 left).

We woudla dvise how ever that without a complete rebiuld and redesign of the the hulls the top speed isn't goign to get anything major in terms of upgrade, the current engines take up a good portion of the hull and you would need to totally re shape the hull to get any real advance, thus it would be cheaper to buy new vessels than upgrade the speed, not that 33knots is slow anyway...

As a quick sketch of a proposed refit:
Add additional generator capacity to the engine system
replace the existing 3x3 16" guns with 3 turrets of 2 17"/60cal G1407 ETC guns.
replace the 6x2 5" guns with 4 155mm G99 or 160mm G109mm AGS turrets and two 12 round launchers for SAM4B CIMS
Upgrade the 4 20mm CIWS to 6 35mm Millenium gun CIWS
replace the harpoon launchers with 4x4 tube SAM11N box launchers

benefits:
While gun number is drastically reduced the overall reach is increased with the AGS mounting able to hit targets at upto 180km (dpending on version) and the priamry guns beyond that (using SABOTed ERGMs), it should be noted that all your gun would now outrnage the old harpoon boxes.
Air defence capability increases dratically, SAM4B is our alternative to RAM but based on Starstreak and SAM11 is a naval SAM based on our SAM10 land based missile.

If youa re interested we would be happy to work out a mroe detailed proposal and pricing structure.

Alternatively we have a rnage of Battleships we could offer.

Since no corporation in United Elias currently produces large size naval guns needed for this project we would welcome the idea of a joint contract with Crookfur where we would provide missile systems and that nation provides gun systems, and other systems can be worked out between us.

Decide between yourselves and come up with a bid. We have plenty of time, so don't hurry.
~J.D. Alcanzar, Emperor

A joint bid would be a msot welcome opertunity.

OOC: since my missile systems aren't that detailed its probabaly for the best.
I suppose systems wise unless i actually do some details on any of my ship based electronics beyond names i think UE would be best choice for msot things bar the gun control systems.

As to the exact primary guns our range is a little bit limited in that we only currently offer, 12, 15, 17 and 20" ETC guns, personally i would go with the 15s but you did ask for something bigger

A joint bid would be a msot welcome opertunity.

OOC: since my missile systems aren't that detailed its probabaly for the best.
I suppose systems wise unless i actually do some details on any of my ship based electronics beyond names i think UE would be best choice for msot things bar the gun control systems.

As to the exact primary guns our range is a little bit limited in that we only currently offer, 12, 15, 17 and 20" ETC guns, personally i would go with the 15s but you did ask for something bigger
I.C.I should have said more useful in shore bombardment (more fragmenting or more explosive power per round. either one is good for us)
~J.D. Alcanzar
OOC: Shall we continue this conversation by TG?

We of the Mikosolf Corperation would like to add a bid. With our combination of deconstruction plants (for removal) and modular construction can reconstruct these ships to fit your needs.

As you have provided a base concept on what you need we need to know only one thing, Modern or post-mod?

Thank you, once that is answered we will get back to you with modified designs for your Iowa class battleships.

Mikosolf reserves the rights to reuse the designs created in any/all of their ships.

OOC:In answer to your question, rich people, we are a modern-tech nation.
IC: we would love to have another bid to prevent a monoply on the part of crookfur and UE. I have always found that competition seems to lower prices.
~J.D. Alacanzar

Thank you, we should have some ideas for design/retrofitting in a week (1 rl day).

Thank You,
Mikosolf Corperation

I.C.I should have said more useful in shore bombardment (more fragmenting or more explosive power per round. either one is good for us)
~J.D. Alcanzar
OOC: Shall we continue this conversation by TG?

Tgs are good for me.

same with me, get the guns sorted out ten TG me what you have deicded and I can think up other stuff

7 20-inch (508mm) guns
10 10-inch (254mm) guns
(Same missile load)

As to the engine we must inquire whether you want to stay with the steam turbines or would be willing to go to gas turbine engines? However, sliming the bow of the ship (with slight reduction in armor) would achieve faster speed just as well as enhancing the engine.

((OOC: could not find stats on output on the ships steam turbine engines.))

Chardonay is willing to sell bolt on ablative armor packages, ranging from reactive ceramic decapping plates to full belt enhancements.


The ceramic Reactive Decapping Plates are the simplest form of add on armor, and improve protection against kinetic warheads dramatically. The hard, brittle plates deform the incoming projectile's tip which degrades its performence against the main belt armor. The plate then shatters, robbing the warhead of kinetic energy and potentially causing the premature detonation of smaller shells.

Arkady Pridubla,
Vice President in charge of Exports, DCA

7 20-inch (508mm) guns
10 10-inch (254mm) guns
(Same missile load)

As to the engine we must inquire whether you want to stay with the steam turbines or would be willing to go to gas turbine engines? However, sliming the bow of the ship (with slight reduction in armor) would achieve faster speed just as well as enhancing the engine.

((OOC: could not find stats on output on the ships steam turbine engines.))Gas turbine engines are fine. Sliming would be acceptable as well. The gun enhancements look acceptable. Now I require the cost alone. When Crookfur and UE are done, we will compare the bids and determine.
Chardonay: No thank you
~J.D. Alcanzar, Emperor

7 20-inch (508mm) guns
10 10-inch (254mm) guns
(Same missile load)


Turbines Four 270,000 hp gas turbine engines
Shaft Horsepower 250,000 (253,841 mph)
Maximum Speed 41.0 knots @ 252 rpm
Nominal Endurance 18,000 nautical miles @ 12 knots - 1945
Inboard Screws Two 17 foot 6 inch (5.182m) five-blade
Outboard Screws Two 18 foot 3 inch (5.563m) four-blade
Rudders Two, 340 sq. ft. (31.6 sq. m.) each
Bow armor: Slightly concave “)(“ meeting at a 18 degrees with slight removal or armor at “joint” to improve water flow and reduce eddies which would increase drag.

Cost to retrofit:
Four engines, 35k a piece
Reshaping bow, 12.3k
Armament replacement, 84k (for the total retrofit) (will take off 42k if we can keep removed parts)
Total: 236,300 (per ship) (non kept parts)
194,300 with removed parts “sold”

A Few Rich People:
i woudl ask how exactly you intend to fit 7 20" on an iowa...

The rough and ready (but remarkably accurate) formula indicates that for every 2" increase in calibre you decrease the number of possible guns by a third so for 20" guns you would be looking at a whole 3 weapons

your 10"s are also way over the top of what would be possible and wouldn't be at all practical unless you are somehow going to add mountings, turret motors and ammo feeds for another 4 turrets.

Your hulla nd engine modifications are also totally impractical and your prices far far too low.

OOC: Gah, your right, made a slip supposed to meet at 18 degrees (one less than oringinal).

As to prices, don't actually "pay" for the labor (company credit) so I can cut out those expensives, mostly paying for the raw materials.

Turrets, yes I am combining mountings as well as reinforcing others to support the slightly larger size of a the new turret. And if you want me to add inpricing for new mountings and motors I shall. (and if above explaination is non working for you I will recalc other prices as well).

You still fail to adress how you will achive the impossoble in regards to the main guns, consider this:
To make use of thier proposed 20" guns the japanese had to design a new battle ship massing a whopping 90,000tons and it could only hold 6 of them.
of course beyond 18"s an increase i size makes no real improvemnts unless you use very long barrels which in turn make your guns even heavier.

i restate by opinion that the maximum number of practical 20" guns that cna be mounted is 3 which will be be individually slower firing so while the throw weight per gun will increase the over all pirmary throw weight will drop significantly.
(i would suggest a good read at ww.warships1.com but its down just now).

Crookfur and UE appear to be winning the bid at the moment.
Crookfur, the 15 inch guns will be acceptable to us, as the longest range bombardment ever needed by our navy was only about 150 Km.
The price seems to be acceptable. As for the secondary loadout replacement, it is unnecessary
the next thing needed is to improve the speed or the number of CIWS mounts.
~J.D. Alcanzar, Emperor

The price i quoted for the secondary repalcements was in hindsight a bit excessive but you are the customer :)

the 15" option is a good choice and here by entered into the dev plan.

As to the CIWS crookfur would offer our version of the 35mm Millenium gun but UE liekly has soemthing nastier...

The price i quoted for the secondary repalcements was in hindsight a bit excessive but you are the customer :)

the 15" option is a good choice and here by entered into the dev plan.

As to the CIWS crookfur would offer our version of the 35mm Millenium gun but UE liekly has soemthing nastier...
In all probablity he does, if he ever posts. I think he expects you to tg him.
~J.D. Alcanzar, Emperor

((So I rushed, sue me))
Revised concept:

-Six eighteen inch (6x2) cannons.
-Keep six five-inch DP guns (extend barrel and more recoil for increased range)
-Add in four eight-inch laser guided ballistics turrets (over former 5 inch box)
-Over last two five-inch blocks two more tomahawk boxes (Forty Missiles)
-Dropping the harpoon missiles for 16 Yakhont supersonic ASM (maximum speed of M2-2.5, reaching a range of 300km with a hi-lo trajectory or 120km with a lo-lo trajectory)

Turbines Four 270,000 hp gas turbine engines
Shaft Horsepower 250,000 (253,841 mph)
Maximum Speed 38.0 knots @ 252 rpm
Nominal Endurance 18,000 nautical miles @ 12 knots - 1945
Inboard Screws Two 17 foot 6 inch (5.182m) five-blade
Outboard Screws Two 18 foot 3 inch (5.563m) four-blade
Rudders Two, 340 sq. ft. (31.6 sq. m.) each

Slight slimming of front bow by ½ a degree

Estimated total cost: 3-5 million per ship

We are a sea-faring nation, and will gladly refit the ships with better engines if you want. We will however not use the ones we use on our vessals, as that would involve a release of classified information. We do not know if the Iowa class has the hull strength to permit larger guns, but we will see.

A Few Rich People, your bid seems to be acceptable. However, we will wait for more information on the Crookfur-UE bid before we decide.
~J.D. Alcanzar, Emperor

In all probablity he does, if he ever posts. I think he expects you to tg him.
~J.D. Alcanzar, Emperor

Generally we use a combination of Kashtan systems and the Sea Bolt (http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=343394=) (scroll down to the bottom) Point Defence Missile System for close in defence.

While your looking at that post, please check out the othr systems and see if there is anything else you would particulaly like to fit to the Iowas and I'll see what I can do.

Generally we use a combination of Kashtan systems and the Sea Bolt (http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=343394=) (scroll down to the bottom) Point Defence Missile System for close in defence.

While your looking at that post, please check out the othr systems and see if there is anything else you would particulaly like to fit to the Iowas and I'll see what I can do.How about the Sea Bolt and the Sea Arrow systems? Production rights would also be needed for the missles involved. I believe that there are 17 battleships total.
~J.D. Alcanzar, Emperor

bump so i can find it again later