NationStates Jolt Archive

I think at this point we should all take a deep breath and just calm down.

*takes deep breath*

I would just like to make a couple of things clear.

1) This is a shared computer with a dial up connection. I do not have as much time as many of you more....commited players, so please take this into consideration.

2) All this talk of a 'great rape' is making it looking likely that I may loose my access to this computer. Please tone down the sexual abuse angle before I loose the chance to respond.

3) My queen has not been kidnapped. The so-called 'official' confernce was not sanctioned by me, nor did my Eve Dworkings ever turn up. The official conference will be held in Feminany and has not started yet. If you wish to attend then please sign up here (http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=355571&page=1&pp=15).

4) Would everyone who is massing squillions of soldiers against me please stop and think for a minute. It takes years to prepare for war, contingency plans etc.

Also, very few nations would really go to war over something so petty. This is a nation of 6 million for christs sake. Please try and be slightly realistic (I realise that my own situation is slighty off the wall, however I find many of the governmental responces of warmongering nations simply unbelievable.)

5) Once again, my queen has not been kidnapped. I ask DA and the rest of the members of 'LOEL' to respect RP protocols and not RP my character.

Thank you.

Fair enough; it's nice to see at least you are being reasonable with this situation.

Good to see they didn't scare you off, you have my eternal support as you know and that will not change.

Thank you both. This situation has become more and more bizare and I'm just trying to get it all in order.

OOC: Well, personally I would advise you to ignore most of the morons who are declaring a war and claiming rape and so on. There are alot of more reasonable people to RP with and most of these people seem to have to prove their military might over a nation with less people then they have in their army.

Should anyone try say anything in regard to rape again, tell a mod. It's out of line and they shouldn't be suggesting crap like that.

The way thing are going you may be better off in the NS forum and not here where everyone declares war if you insult their leaders wife.

OOC: Welcome back. Suffice to say your thread caused quite a stir. I've already pledged my support for your sovreignty, and was an attendee at the so called "peace-conference" which was, unfortunately, a complete sham. I recommend you tell TLS to forget about his troops in your country, and start again with diplomacy.

Prepare for a long and very anoying day then, I suggest you IGNORE all current invasions since they have not let you post any defences wich is a rule in roleplaying ettique.

PS: Did you get my TG's? I'm having more problems with people not recieving my telegrams.

Thank you Iuthia and McLeod. I shall consider moving to the nationstates board, if this (for want of a better word) shit dosn't stop.

McLeod, I haven't had the time to read the whole peace conference topic. Could you give me a brief synopsis?

5) Once again, my queen has not been kidnapped. I ask DA and the rest of the members of 'LOEL' to respect RP protocols and not RP my character.



Ooc- I already canceled that, sorry about that. I also told my LOEL to not do anything involving you until we've all had time to sit and plan it out. Because I always request people plan stuff with me, I figure you deserve the same courtesy.


Ooc- Please contact me over chat function, I think we can work out a pretty darn good RP.

MSN= knightofmalta1096@hotmail.com

Yahoo= knightofmalta1096

Thank you Iuthia and McLeod. I shall consider moving to the nationstates board, if this (for want of a better word) shit dosn't stop.

McLeod, I haven't had the time to read the whole peace conference topic. Could you give me a brief synopsis?


Ooc- The peace conference was a waste of time, those who wanted to invade you spouted their hatred, those who wanted to defend you reiterated their defiance. It was a mess.

Dumpsterdam: I am IGNORING (in capitals) all invasions that wern't worked out with me first.

I'll just check TG's. I have had rather a lot of hate mail (sort of) so I haven't read everything.

If you didn't want to get mass invaded, you shouldn't have done something stupid like banning men. Cause and effect, and all that.
You really have noone to blame but yourself.

Dumpsterdam: I am IGNORING (in capitals) all invasions that wern't worked out with me first.

I'll just check TG's. I have had rather a lot of hate mail (sort of) so I haven't read everything.

Thats okay, just take it easy(like me :)) and take your time to read everything. If you find anything offensive just report it to the NationStates Moderators so that the people who are doing those kind of things will get punished.

If you didn't want to get mass invaded, you shouldn't have done something stupid like banning men. Cause and effect, and all that.
You really have noone to blame but yourself.

Please don't give her anymore shit then you people already have, please leave.

DA, sorry it'll have to be over TG.

Shildonia, grow up. Cause and effect? So every body who insults male pride deserve to be 'glassed'?

OOC: if those people were attacking you for your internal policies, you have a right to ignore them. they declared war on you because you outlawed males. your policies concern your country only, if you believe in something then it's your country do what you like. all the people attacking feminany, just think about this, france has a policy outlawing scarves for women's headdress, does the US agree with it? NO, but they don't go off and attack someone. Feminany didn't do anything to hurt you indirectly or directly, they didn't attack you in any way shape or form, including terrorism(to my knowledge, which is people attacked feminany beacuse it's outlawed to be a male in that country,), I may not agree with that policy but i don't go off and attack! thank's for listening to my rant and rave oh and TAG

DA, sorry it'll have to be over TG.

Shildonia, grow up. Cause and effect? So every body who insults male pride deserve to be 'glassed'?


Ooc- Check TG

McLeod, I haven't had the time to read the whole peace conference topic. Could you give me a brief synopsis?

OOC:

Easy. We all turn up. Other delegates spend twenty minutes talking about menu, make a series of ridiculous proposals, including $600 trillion fines, completely ignore diplomatic proposals, make vain threats with chemical weapons, talk of killing your civilians etc. Then it turns farcical with everyone drawing weapons, and someone kidnapping your queen until I reminded him she wasn't there, and that he might like to release the Prince's aide fairly quickly. Some further discussion, and a ridiculous proposal drawn up by belligerent nations prepared to send millions of men to "deal" with your nation.

And all that took nearly 30 pages.

It seems to be an unfortunate byproduct of this game that a lot of people don't even try to think like "real countries" and just automatically jump to an invasion or a declaration of war.

I pretty much responded the way my country was going to respond in the original thread (by a condemnation). The next steps for me would have been diplomatic and/or economic pressure to whatever extent a country you don't trade with or have diplomatic relations with can put upon you. I put a soft ignore on the events in the other threads when they started getting out of hand.

I don't like planning every detail of an RP beforehand, but I now see the value of some pre-planning (the RP I'm working on with Sdaeriji will be a case in point for pre-planning).

It seems to be an unfortunate byproduct of this game that a lot of people don't even try to think like "real countries" and just automatically jump to an invasion or a declaration of war.

I pretty much responded the way my country was going to respond in the original thread (by a condemnation). The next steps for me would have been diplomatic and/or economic pressure to whatever extent a country you don't trade with or have diplomatic relations with can put upon you. I put a soft ignore on the events in the other threads when they started getting out of hand.

I don't like planning every detail of an RP beforehand, but I now see the value of some pre-planning (the RP I'm working on with Sdaeriji will be a case in point for pre-planning).
That's basicly what i just said... in a lot less confuzling terms

You did something that was considered by many people to be morally wrong. The people who play NS may not be able to deal with real war criminals like Sudan, but we can deal with fictional war criminals such as yourself.
What you did was no different to the Holocaust, or any of the other genocides in history. It was ethnic cleansing, and many people on NS do not take kindly to genocide or ethnic cleansing. They like to stop it from happening. If you ignore them it will be extremely shoddy RPing on your part. You should accept the consequences of your actions, get mass invaded, and then go and make a new country and try not to annoy anyone.

You did something that was considered by many people to be morally wrong. The people who play NS may not be able to deal with real war criminals like Sudan, but we can deal with fictional war criminals such as yourself.
What you did was no different to the Holocaust, or any of the other genocides in history. It was ethnic cleansing, and many people on NS do not take kindly to genocide or ethnic cleansing. They like to stop it from happening. If you ignore them it will be extremely shoddy RPing on your part. You should accept the consequences of your actions, get mass invaded, and then go and make a new country and try not to annoy anyone.

Could we PLEASE not let this turn into a freaking flamewar like the last one? Great, thanks, and now anyone who wants to bitch go home and talk to a wall.

I am not flaming, I am merely stating my point.

OOC:

Easy. We all turn up. Other delegates spend twenty minutes talking about menu, make a series of ridiculous proposals, including $600 trillion fines, completely ignore diplomatic proposals, make vain threats with chemical weapons, talk of killing your civilians etc. Then it turns farcical with everyone drawing weapons, and someone kidnapping your queen until I reminded him she wasn't there, and that he might like to release the Prince's aide fairly quickly. Some further discussion, and a ridiculous proposal drawn up by belligerent nations prepared to send millions of men to "deal" with your nation.

And all that took nearly 30 pages.

Yep, sounds familiar. Accompanied by a lot of sexist machismo no doubt?

It seems to be an unfortunate byproduct of this game that a lot of people don't even try to think like "real countries" and just automatically jump to an invasion or a declaration of war.

I pretty much responded the way my country was going to respond in the original thread (by a condemnation). The next steps for me would have been diplomatic and/or economic pressure to whatever extent a country you don't trade with or have diplomatic relations with can put upon you. I put a soft ignore on the events in the other threads when they started getting out of hand.

I don't like planning every detail of an RP beforehand, but I now see the value of some pre-planning (the RP I'm working on with Sdaeriji will be a case in point for pre-planning).

I have every ammount of respect for your responce, after all I wasn't expecting many people to agree with me. The reason I want any invasion preplanned is that otherwise I am going to get stampeeded by around 100 invading nations with myself getting the chance to respond every three pages or so (or I leave the computer for three hourse and find out there are 15 new pages), all accompanied by the mandantory rape and slaughter.

Yep, sounds familiar. Accompanied by a lot of sexist machismo no doubt?



I have every ammount of respect for your responce, after all I wasn't expecting many people to agree with me. The reason I want any invasion preplanned is that otherwise I am going to get stampeeded by around 100 invading nations with myself getting the chance to respond every three pages or so (or I leave the computer for three hourse and find out there are 15 new pages), all accompanied by the mandantory rape and slaughter.

Ooc- I can put on the agenda of the Security Council in the LOEL a motion that will have the council declare your populace citizens of the LOEL and as such they will be treated as LOEL citizens and fall under LOEL protection. But we'd not be able to help a nation with a ruler so despotic as Eve Dworking. So you surrender her to an LOEL tribunal, and your nation will come under League protection.

You did something that was considered by many people to be morally wrong. The people who play NS may not be able to deal with real war criminals like Sudan, but we can deal with fictional war criminals such as yourself.
What you did was no different to the Holocaust, or any of the other genocides in history. It was ethnic cleansing, and many people on NS do not take kindly to genocide or ethnic cleansing. They like to stop it from happening. If you ignore them it will be extremely shoddy RPing on your part. You should accept the consequences of your actions, get mass invaded, and then go and make a new country and try not to annoy anyone.

Genocide?

*blinks*

No he really is saying genocide.

If you bothered to do your research you would find out that no-one is being killed. Then again, it's not mandantory to get your facts straight before threatning war is it?

Genocide?

*blinks*

No he really is saying genocide.

If you bothered to do your research you would find out that no-one is being killed. Then again, it's not mandantory to get your facts straight before threatning war is it?

Well he can invade on watever terms he wants, just to help himself sleep at night.

Well he can invade on watever terms he wants, just to help himself sleep at night.
True, but that kinda gets you a bad RP record...

Ooc- I can put on the agenda of the Security Council in the LOEL a motion that will have the council declare your populace citizens of the LOEL and as such they will be treated as LOEL citizens and fall under LOEL protection. But we'd not be able to help a nation with a ruler so despotic as Eve Dworking. So you surrender her to an LOEL tribunal, and your nation will come under League protection.

*sighs in frustration*

I am not intrested in joining any imperial pact. I know perfectly well who you are (CM) and your treatment of women. So no thanks.

Also, if you had bothered to do your research, this was a democratically passed law. Eve Dworkings in no despot (hint: world benchmark political rights).

If you didn't want to get mass invaded, you shouldn't have done something stupid like banning men. Cause and effect, and all that.
You really have noone to blame but yourself.
So when are you going to war against Ienotheisa who banished all men well over a year ago? Of course, I suppose it's much easier rushing off to war against a nation with 7 million as opposed to almost 3.6 billion.

Pathetic.

*sighs in frustration*

I am not intrested in joining any imperial pact. I know perfectly well who you are (CM) and your treatment of women. So no thanks.

Also, if you had bothered to do your research, this was a democratically passed law. Eve Dworkings in no despot (hint: world benchmark political rights).


Ooc- Curtis Fabus was thrust into power in 1984 when a vote held of the generals from the civil-war decided he was the right man for the job. In the mid-lates 1980s (around 87-88) a vote held of the land-owning white male populace decided to make him dictator for life. It's all democracy, in one form or another.

Anyone leave her alone.

But I have one question.

How is your population going to go up, if you at got any males?

So when are you going to war against Ienotheisa who banished all men well over a year ago? Of course, I suppose it's much easier rushing off to war against a nation with 7 million as opposed to almost 3.6 billion.

Pathetic.
Thank you Hack! (no sarcasm there)

So when are you going to war against Ienotheisa who banished all men well over a year ago? Of course, I suppose it's much easier rushing off to war against a nation with 7 million as opposed to almost 3.6 billion.

Pathetic.

Perfectly pwned.

Anyone leave her alone.

But I have one question.

How is your population going to go up, if you at got any males?

Genetically Modified bacteria has long been used to produce insulin, we have just done the same thing to sperm.

And thank you Hack, you have summerised the situation perfectly. Tetosterone high males excerting thier phalus....I mean armys over feminism.

Genetically Modified bacteria has long been used to produce insulin, we have just done the same thing to sperm.


Ok. Have fun with that.

OOC:

:sigh:

Feminany, you're one of the better new RPers to come around (when it comes to creating stories and controlling yourself in situations like this), so you've earned my respect there. Also, don't be scared away from NS because of a few morons, that wouldn't be right. Not everybody here is a newbie bashing moron, there are plenty of us out there who are more than happy to help out a newbie (not to be confused with n00b) who is willing to learn the game and play it right (like you).

I don't know if you know who I am, but I'd be willing to take you under my wing so to speak. I've done this for several other players who were attacked when they just joined the site and they've blossomed into respectable RPers.

Plus, ICly my leader would probably be interested in a country with a strong willed female leader. He's kinda....wierd like that.

But anyways getting back to the topic at hand, I haven't been posting on the boards for a few weeks and I've noticed that things are rapidly degenerating again. Looks like I might have to make my presence known again and hopefully that will calm things down in I.I again. I'm willing to take the heat up against n00bs who ruin the game for others, Lord knows I've done it many a time (while being ridiculed as a n00b stomper at the same time). Just let me know and I'll extend my hand ICly.

Genetically Modified bacteria has long been used to produce insulin, we have just done the same thing to sperm.

And thank you Hack, you have summerised the situation perfectly. Tetosterone high males excerting thier phalus....I mean armys over feminism.


"For the sake of maintaining the fragile peace that currently seems to exist in the world, we are willing to have volunteers from our nation donate the required sperm as it is needed." Paul Stahlecker

OOC:

:sigh:

Feminany, you're one of the better new RPers to come around (when it comes to creating stories and controlling yourself in situations like this), so you've earned my respect there. Also, don't be scared away from NS because of a few morons, that wouldn't be right. Not everybody here is a newbie bashing moron, there are plenty of us out there who are more than happy to help out a newbie (not to be confused with n00b) who is willing to learn the game and play it right (like you).

I don't know if you know who I am, but I'd be willing to take you under my wing so to speak. I've done this for several other players who were attacked when they just joined the site and they've blossomed into respectable RPers.

Plus, ICly my leader would probably be interested in a country with a strong willed female leader. He's kinda....wierd like that.

But anyways getting back to the topic at hand, I haven't been posting on the boards for a few weeks and I've noticed that things are rapidly degenerating again. Looks like I might have to make my presence known again and hopefully that will calm things down in I.I again. I'm willing to take the heat up against n00bs who ruin the game for others, Lord knows I've done it many a time (while being ridiculed as a n00b stomper at the same time). Just let me know and I'll extend my hand ICly.

O_o

That is a very good offer, I suggest you take it.

OOC:

:sigh:

Feminany, you're one of the better new RPers to come around (when it comes to creating stories and controlling yourself in situations like this), so you've earned my respect there. Also, don't be scared away from NS because of a few morons, that wouldn't be right. Not everybody here is a newbie bashing moron, there are plenty of us out there who are more than happy to help out a newbie (not to be confused with n00b) who is willing to learn the game and play it right (like you).

I don't know if you know who I am, but I'd be willing to take you under my wing so to speak. I've done this for several other players who were attacked when they just joined the site and they've blossomed into respectable RPers.

Plus, ICly my leader would probably be interested in a country with a strong willed female leader. He's kinda....wierd like that.

But anyways getting back to the topic at hand, I haven't been posting on the boards for a few weeks and I've noticed that things are rapidly degenerating again. Looks like I might have to make my presence known again and hopefully that will calm things down in I.I again. I'm willing to take the heat up against n00bs who ruin the game for others, Lord knows I've done it many a time (while being ridiculed as a n00b stomper at the same time). Just let me know and I'll extend my hand ICly.

:GASP: was that a complement? wow feminany, i'd accept in a heart beat, if you don't know who AMF is don't be afraid to ask.

OOC: I would do this for any promising new RPer, because when I'm not posting I do drop in and read up on what's going on. And I hate seeing countless OMFG LOLZ 1 D3CL4R3 W4R ON J00 B3CUZ UR BL4CK!!!111 threads, and I hate seeing new RPers chased away because they help create an interesting new atmosphere.

Today's newb could be tomorrow's Pantera, or Melkor Unchained.

Really, this entire thing blew up in your face didn't it Feminany? If people contiue to discredit your nation do things old fashioned way! Put your fingers in your ears and start singing 'I'm not listening'. Simply, don't look at this thread, or threads of a similar nature again!

Really, this entire thing blew up in your face didn't it Feminany? If people contiue to discredit your nation do things old fashioned way! Put your fingers in your ears and start singing 'I'm not listening'. Simply, don't look at this thread, or threads of a similar nature again!


OOC: By that same note...

Are you (or anyone else) going to attack me because I torture criminals, engage in total war against any target when needed, and clone humans? You could, but you probably wouldn't have alot of people in your corner.

So what makes people think they can just beat up on new players and ridicule them when they're not willing to fight someone their own size? I've fought them all, be it small or large nation, and I never do it for crap reasons like internal policies about men.

OOC: I would do this for any promising new RPer, because when I'm not posting I do drop in and read up on what's going on. And I hate seeing countless OMFG LOLZ 1 D3CL4R3 W4R ON J00 B3CUZ UR BL4CK!!!111 threads, and I hate seeing new RPers chased away because they help create an interesting new atmosphere.

Today's newb could be tomorrow's Pantera, or Melkor Unchained.
wow, if you that kinda prospect in her... i can't wait to see the RPs that'll come out of this...

wow, if you that kinda prospect in her... i can't wait to see the RPs that'll come out of this...

OOC: I've also thought about bringing my girlfriend to this site (very good at descriptive writing), but with the way things have gotten around here I'm kind of hesitant.

OOC: By that same note...

Are you (or anyone else) going to attack me because I torture criminals, engage in total war against any target when needed, and clone humans? You could, but you probably wouldn't have alot of people in your corner.

So what makes people think they can just beat up on new players and ridicule them when they're not willing to fight someone their own size? I've fought them all, be it small or large nation, and I never do it for crap reasons like internal policies about men.

Well, as you said it is far easier to just beat up on new players and hope nobody pays to much attention till it is to late and that player has left NS for good. Shame, but as with the Island of Rose it won't happen because people who care step in and take to the defence.

OOC: I've also thought about bringing my girlfriend to this site (very good at descriptive writing), but with the way things have gotten around here I'm kind of hesitant.
yeah... i still remember the good ol' days of summer 03

It appears that Automagfreek thinks very highly of you Feminany. This 'thread' may have got you many NS losers as enermies, but have won you lots of friends who actually mean something, so it's not all bad news really is it?

Having read the stickys on this site, I am well aware of who AMF is.

First off, you have my absolute respect for your writting abilities, and your sense of justice (however rough that justice may be).

My answer to your proposition is yes. We may have differnces, but I must put to survival of my nation first. On another note, it would be intresting to see how all of these RARR!!! nations respond.

I thank you for your kind offer. It is extremely reasonable and noble. However, details may need to be sorted out. Would Feminany become part of an Empire, or would she enjoy a 'special relationship'?

Again, thank you.

Having read the stickys on this site, I am well aware of who AMF is.

First off, you have my absolute respect for your writting abilities, and your sense of justice (however rough that justice may be).

My answer to your proposition is yes. We may have differnces, but I must put to survival of my nation first. On another note, it would be intresting to see how all of these RARR!!! nations respond.

I thank you for your kind offer. It is extremely reasonable and noble. However, details may need to be sorted out. Would Feminany become part of an Empire, or would she enjoy a 'special relationship'?

Again, thank you.

OOC: More or less a 'special relationship'. We could work something out where either my leader or my leader's son is interested in your Queen. Thus formal ties can be formed.

But that's just a rough suggestion. If you have any ideas/comments/concerns, feel free to send me a telegram.

I will do.

OOC: It's nice to see this topic is calming down a bit. The pig-pile was extremely distasteful.

Today's newb could be tomorrow's Pantera, or Melkor Unchained.Exactly. Though I also see the potential in Femininy the way you do with the way she's handling the freaky n00bish responses she's gotten thus far.

I'd like to say that you never know who's going to blossom into a great RPer, but you can usually tell who has potential right from the outset. Unfortunately, some potentially good RPers go bad and some just disappear for whatever reason. Some newbs start out with tremendous growing pains but eventually develop. You never know for sure what you're going to get.

Hmm...I am going to have to investigate this futher.

Exactly. Though I also see the potential in Femininy the way you do with the way she's handling the freaky n00bish responses she's gotten thus far.

I'd like to say that you never know who's going to blossom into a great RPer, but you can usually tell who has potential right from the outset. Unfortunately, some potentially good RPers go bad and some just disappear for whatever reason. Some newbs start out with tremendous growing pains but eventually develop. You never know for sure what you're going to get.



Ooc- I apologize for the way in which myself and the LOEL folks acted towards her. It was uncharacteristically lame. I guess we were probably all just mad at her for OOC stuff and tried to get her IC, and we all know better than that. I apologize on behalf of myself and the LOEL.

Seeing as the war attempt against Feminany was so badly conducted I will now repeat the list of nation placed on the Iuthian Blacklist for their lack of respect regarding national soveriegnity:

Generic empire
Sevaris
East Coast Federation
Jackdonia
Nikolaos The Great
Debian-Linux
Borman Empire (seriously suggested rape)
Roach-Busters
Chellis
Sir Peter the sage
Boghetto
CRACKPIE
Camel Eaters
AeroSpaceCity
UltraFunk
Disad
Schmeidrei (seriously suggested rape)

There may be more, but concidering the sheer stupidity of the thread I found these in I feel this aptly covers enough for me to know which nations to avoid having relations with in the future.

Certainly I'll defer if AMF is coming to your protection...however, my honour requires that I also pledge my support for the independence of Feminany.

Per my telegram to you, and now for the public record, Wolfish believes in the rights of all nations to exist peacefully within their own borders.

Should any chose to ignore the rights of Feminany, we would be prepared to offer assistance.

Aggressors be ware - Wolfish is once again active on the forums.

current pop: 2.9 (ish) billion.
armed services: 1% (thus 29 million)
tolerance for bullies: 0
chance to crack some heads: Priceless.

For everything else there's NationStates.

OOC: my leader or my leader's son is interested in your Queen. Thus formal ties can be formed.



Ooc: Yes but this raises the issue of her queen being the feminazi that she is (her actions against men suggest she is one), do you really think her queen will marry anybody other than a weak-will pushover of a man? (a man who acts like a woman should, because her queen acts like a man) I am certain the men in AMF act like real men, not pushovers, yes? Maybe her queen mellows out, eh? I'm sure AMF and Feminany will work out a great RP that we all will enjoy reading. :D

Just out of curiosity what ooc reasons?

To call godmodding?

Without going into stupid "boys are better than girls" arguments, and definitely avoiding contraditions like claiming one gender is superior and then signing of "yours equally"...

A population with a genetic defect causing 80% female 20% male births would soon be completely overrun by populations with more ideal ratios. That's why we evolved to have the birth ratios we do - they are the most advantageous to the population.

So.

Either the claim that this decision was democratically reached is a lie, or you are godmodding.

Personally I find it unlikely that the decision would be reached even if males were not allowed suffrage. I struggle to think of any females that I know who would vote yes to a proposal that would lead to their sons, husbands, fathers, grandfathers, uncles, male friends...all being deported or surgically mutilated.

So, without details of how this genetic flaw has survived when even a small disadvantage in evolutionary terms condemns a population to disappear rapidly, and without details of how this vote was passed in a fair democracy, I'm called Godmodding on the first, and either Godmodding or outright lies by a dictator masquerading as representing a democracy.

Alright, I am going to avoid you from now on...I can not seperate my personal abhorence of what you propose from my nations veiw which would be decidely "silly, stuipid Terrans"

A tech note:
producing sperm via bacteria is relatively impossible. Bacteria can not be used to build a specialty cell such as a sperm cell. It takes cells of higher organisms to do that.

For reproduction it would be far easier just to take two female eggs and combine them to form a complete zygolyte and then replace it in the womb. This would also elliminate any need of post birth sex surgery also...since the male chromosone would be non-existant.

(In many ways this would be a form of cloning.)

I can also see that you likely practice infacide or selected abortion of male children based on the population skew. Unless you have a major defect in male y chromozones of your population causing miscarriges of male children. Which would likely have been designed by someone.

I guess I won't claim godmodding just that your IC posts have been lies...

Just out of curiosity what ooc reasons?


Ooc- We all don't like feminazism, and we let our dislike get the better of us. (Something the LOEL has never done before and will never do again) Also we were all just greatly intrigued with the notion of sacking, pillaging, and mass raping against an all-feminazi nation. We were even discussing how to punish your queen if/when we got her. Somebody said, "Make her have a sex change!" somebody else said, "Let my kings bodyguards rape her!" somebody else said, "Hang her!" I said, "Sentence her to life in Mississippi, for her that would be a fate worse than death!"

I will now repeat the list of nation placed on the Iuthian Blacklist for their lack of respect regarding national soveriegnity:

Generic empire
Sevaris
East Coast Federation
Jackdonia
Nikolaos The Great
Debian-Linux
Borman Empire (seriously suggested rape)
Roach-Busters
Chellis
Sir Peter the sage
Boghetto
CRACKPIE
Camel Eaters
AeroSpaceCity
UltraFunk
Disad
Schmeidrei (seriously suggested rape)


May I ask why Debian-Linux is on that list? They were anti-war and concerned for Feminany, as far as I could tell.

4) Would everyone who is massing squillions of soldiers against me please stop and think for a minute. It takes years to prepare for war, contingency plans etc.


Nah, most nations have some form of military doctrine which they follow for this sort of thing, it takes years to build up a military to invasion strength, but only a few months to prepare fro an invasion if the forces are already available

May I ask why Debian-Linux is on that list? They were anti-war and concerned for Feminany, as far as I could tell.

Maybe I read it wrong when I was putting nations on to the blacklist, it was alot of crap from alot of people, however I will need to make checks first.

Ooc: Yes but this raises the issue of her queen being the feminazi that she is (her actions against men suggest she is one), do you really think her queen will marry anybody other than a weak-will pushover of a man? (a man who acts like a woman should, because her queen acts like a man) I am certain the men in AMF act like real men, not pushovers, yes? Maybe her queen mellows out, eh? I'm sure AMF and Feminany will work out a great RP that we all will enjoy reading. :D

For your information, an agreement has been reached. It will be made public soon.

TLOW: I don't pretend to be a scientist (well, ok I did. I won't again).

Sorry about that, I wasn't lying I was just badly informed.

OOC: I too am glad to have seen things calm down a bit - it got annoying trying to sift through the other threads when the number of pages kept increasing by 2 or 3 for each one I finished reading... though I don't know why I bothered, given the moronity (is that a word?). of it all. You seem like you have plenty of potential, and I'm rather looking forward to future RPs with you myself.

IC: Though we may not be that much larger than you are, we too will offer our support to Feminany, as required. War is such a tasteless thing.

I was making arrangements with Debian-Linux to deliver humanitarian aid to Feminany in the event of the kind of horrors some were threatening. They were as outraged by the proposed invasion and atrocities as I was. We were also compiling a list similar to this, but yours seems comprehensive other than D-L.

OOC: I too am glad to have seen things calm down a bit - it got annoying trying to sift through the other threads when the number of pages kept increasing by 2 or 3 for each one I finished reading... though I don't know why I bothered, given the moronity (is that a word?). of it all. You seem like you have plenty of potential, and I'm rather looking forward to future RPs with you myself.

IC: Though we may not be that much larger than you are, we too will offer our support to Feminany, as required. War is such a tasteless thing.

OoC: *slaps self* I need to get myself to keep you two apart....otherwise I'm gona be sending troops to the wrong country :(

OOC: Given the amount of stupidity I've seen, I would like to point out this little number because it seems to be helping some people... RP Guide - Link (http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=355350)

Ok, I'll admit, it's advertising in a sense, but I'll make it legitimate by working hard on RPing my diplomat well in the peace thread which we entered yesterday (run by Feminany, not the others who had a peace thread without her).

given the moronity (is that a word?)


Moronity is the noun of moron, although I would have preferred to use "idiocy" but it's just a matter of personal preference.

Moron is a noun.

You can't be a moronity.

(run by Feminaria, not the others who had a peace thread without her).

This whole 'nearly identical name' thing is going to haunt me forever, isn't it? ;)

To call godmodding?

Without going into stupid "boys are better than girls" arguments, and definitely avoiding contraditions like claiming one gender is superior and then signing of "yours equally"...

A population with a genetic defect causing 80% female 20% male births would soon be completely overrun by populations with more ideal ratios. That's why we evolved to have the birth ratios we do - they are the most advantageous to the population.

So.

Either the claim that this decision was democratically reached is a lie, or you are godmodding.

Personally I find it unlikely that the decision would be reached even if males were not allowed suffrage. I struggle to think of any females that I know who would vote yes to a proposal that would lead to their sons, husbands, fathers, grandfathers, uncles, male friends...all being deported or surgically mutilated.

So, without details of how this genetic flaw has survived when even a small disadvantage in evolutionary terms condemns a population to disappear rapidly, and without details of how this vote was passed in a fair democracy, I'm called Godmodding on the first, and either Godmodding or outright lies by a dictator masquerading as representing a democracy.
OOC: I'm playing a nation of sapient gophers; surely her premise isn't too unreasonable.
Any help I can give you will be unimportant with AMF on your side, but Zeek tends to stick with his decisions unless someone convinces him that they are wrong, even if they're hopeless (e.g. trying to defend you in that earlier absurdity) or pointless (e.g. trying to defend you when AMF is already doing so).

This whole 'nearly identical name' thing is going to haunt me forever, isn't it? ;)

To be honest I thought I had been spelling her name wrong all along. Otherwise it would be correct...

This whole 'nearly identical name' thing is going to haunt me forever, isn't it? ;)
Yep!

OoC: *slaps self* I need to get myself to keep you two apart....otherwise I'm gona be sending troops to the wrong country :(

OOC KIDDING: They'd best be girls, or I'd have to arrest them. You can have a gun or a penis over here, not both. ;) Anyway, nevermind, as it's not what the thread is about.

Moron is a noun.

You can't be a moronity.


Main Entry:moron
Function:noun
Date:1910

1 usually offensive : a mildly mentally retarded person
2 : a very stupid person
–moronic \m*-*r*-nik, m*-\ adjective
–moronically \-ni-k(*-)l*\ adverb
–moronism \*m*r-**-*ni-z*m\ noun
–moronity \m*-*r*-n*-t*, m*-\ noun

Re: Moronity - you're right, damn you:-). Ah well...live and learn. I apologise.

Re: Sapient Gophers - You have to use a strange premise("gophers have become sapient and are the dominant species"), but the nation could still work. There is no way a human population with a 80/20 birth rate would survive. It's not a case of "but our nation works like that" unless you decide your nation isn't governed by the same cold hard sciencey stuff that the real world (and most other NS nations) are assumed to be. That hasn't been stated, and using that idea in an ongoing RP is surely godmodding?

Comedy example: You invade me. I say "you haven't adapted to the strange gravity round here, so all your forces are either crushed or dissapear into space"

That example is obviously godmodding, altering the very fabric of existence to justify something isn't fair if you are trying to RP with someone.

There is no way a human population with a 80/20 birth rate would survive.

Sure there is. Have the men be public property, or at least permit/encourage them to have four wives each. ;)

Maybe her geneticists are lying to her, and are secretly replacing her bacterialogical spermatic Folgers Crystals with sperm imported from Communist Mississippi / Decisive Action. Let's see if they notice ....

TWW: There are many things in the Nationstates world that would not 'work'. Genetically modified soldiers and nations occupying RL nations for example. I believe there around ten nations owning Russia. Yet these things are cast aside in the name of a good RP. Why is this any different?

Maybe her geneticists are lying to her, and are secretly replacing her bacterialogical spermatic Folgers Crystals with sperm imported from Communist Mississippi / Decisive Action. Let's see if they notice ....


Ooc- Could be, we've made the offer, and if their gov't accepts it, it's all good. :) Indeed the DA males are willing to personally donate the sperm to the women on an individual basis. This of course will entail the men meeting with the women for a short while. (I'll leave the rest to your imaginations)

>Sure there is. Have the men be public property, or at least permit/encourage them to have four wives each.<

That's starting to sound not so bad... :-)

Seriously, this would wipe out the population way before you were permitting/encouraging anything on a national level. If this was a mutation it would be dead within a few generations. If some alien race came and altered a tribe of cave dwelling early-humans to have an 80/20 ratio, that tribe would die off in favour of other nearby tribes with a 50.1/49.9 ratio. This is why species end up how they do. Given the nature of human beings, an almost 50/50 ratio thrives.

Recommended reading - "The Red Queen : Sex and the evolution of human nature"

>TWW: There are many things in the Nationstates world that would not 'work'. Genetically modified soldiers and nations occupying RL nations for example. I believe there around ten nations owning Russia. Yet these things are cast aside in the name of a good RP. Why is this any different?<

I was just pointing out that there is no feasible way such a measure could be passed democratically. It's a form of godmodding. Like if I claimed that I had 4 trillion soldiers trained up in my army. There's no way it could happen. If people want to go with it, that's fine by me - I was just a (slightly) knowledgable observer, who spotted a flaw.

However, I think you could make a more interesting RP by basing it in reality. If your Queen had some kind of irrational feelings against men, and was effectively a dictator, either overtly or covertly, that would make a more interesting RP in my view than one which relies on states which could not occur. You might even tempt me into my first RP - so far I've mainly lurked, and tried to point out stuff that couldn't happen.

As a footnote, I think GM soldiers probably are possible. Hope it never happens :-p

Seriously, this would wipe out the population way before you were permitting/encouraging anything on a national level.
The flaw in your argument is that she's not working within a closed system. Fact is, her population is just a tiny portion of the NS world, and the survival aspect doesn't enter into it.

The decision was supposedly justified using a quasi-scientific approach, but in reality it was a political decision. It may fail to thrive as a society, but she can certainly try it.

At the moment I can't suspend disbelief.

I know such a country could not exist (80/20 thing)
Do you know anyone, even rape victims, who would want men banned?
If the majority of people you know wouldn't want this, can you empathise with a group of people that would? Do they seem human?

I wouldn't be able to get any involvement with the people this affected, because they aren't really people, like the people I meet everyday, or read about in good fiction.

What benefits do you think you could get to the RP by making it more believable? Do you think that you could get better RPers involved, who were interested in empathetic characters, rather than "OMG!!!11!!1111 I march into your country and kill all the girlz!!!1111111!!!!!"?

>The flaw in your argument is that she's not working within a closed system. Fact is, her population is just a tiny portion of the NS world, and the survival aspect doesn't enter into it. <

That's the crucial part of the argument! If it were a closed system, and only 80/20 people existed, it would have a chance of surviving. At least until some random mutation changed someone into a 50/50 person, and then their genes would quickly spread until the whole population was 80/20. But not being part of a closed system, unless all of NS is 80/20 - it wouldn't work.

If you are really interested in this, read that book I recommended. Lots of it is not directly relevant to this, but it's all interesting, and fun reading.

The simple fact that some people seem to forget is that Nation States is not real life. Not all of us play a utopia, some of us, this player included, play ruthless dictator states. Personally I think that some people (names withheld) reacted out of hand with their declaration of war. Feminany I hope we can put this event behind us and continue peacefully.

Freeform Role-play: Nationstates runs on the idea that you can roleplay anything you like however you like, however when an unfair advantage is artifically created by making up things to beat someone (see GODMODing) ignore is generally the first option. To balance the fact you can role-play anything, you can ignore anything, baring in mind that ignoring wars against you which are done with good reason to avoid damage will damage your reputation.

GODMODing: Basically this is what happens when you pull crap out of your ass to win a cooperative game. Here are some of the definitions of GODMODing... Feminany isn't GODMODing.

> Saying what happens to other people's stuff.

> Refusing to take any losses. Or lose. Ever.

> Having übertech, armies that are too large, etc.

[Source Link (http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=4612576&postcount=1)]

Conclusion: Feminany can RP her entire nation with whatever birth rate she likes because lets face it, she can't ignore her population rate on her statistics and when you take the population growth of NS it is inherantly unrealistic, but because it doesn't affect RP by making an unfair advantage, no one cares.

People role-play elves for crying out loud, my nation has elves, clangers and in rare cases, vampires. However, it's perfectly OK.

If you want to ignore femaniny you can do so... personally I like the way she has damaged so many idiots egos recently and he RP isn't too bad. She has potential and it would be interesting to see her RP a female only nation and it would be fun to interact with (oddly enough, the diplomat I'm sending is a lesbian and she has been long before this thread... it's tastefully done but it makes for an interesting twist).

So take it or leave it, she's not going to change because you don't like her science... but hey, some people role-play future tech nations and magic.

Both my nations treat both genders equally. This one supresses them both, and my other one will post an interesting IC offer for you later. Basically id agree with the sperm production thing, but you could always just pick donors, I suppose if you moved into post modern tech (not space travel but a few years past now) you could probably "engineer" sperm and add DNA of women to it. You could therefore just have XX babies. Ie women. Throw anough time and research into it. Some people call "godmod" if things arent exactly modern, but those of us with a more liberal RP style will let you off if your battlefield effectiveness is not increased without some tradeoff.

Im future tech so Im allowed to use super soldiers provided i dont use them to attack other nations without their permission, and as they are super soldiers I spend a lot on training them and equipping them, far more than most RL troops get and at costs levels that are realistic with the training they recieve.

Anyway I have a point, tha is that if it doesnt affect other nations and or your ability to affect them, its silly to care about it.

Oh, low civil rights doesnt equate to sexual inequality, though that said inequality would lower the rights level to the average of what the two genders get in practical terms.

I am not only not gonna ignore her. The Confederacy hereby offers it's hand in friendship to the Queendom. One of the principles I live by is "forgive and forget" and it's my hope that we can put these events behind us.

OOC: TWW, you're taking this way too seriously. This is freeform RP and she can do whatever she want, including having a populace that consists of nothing but women. Don't like it? Nobody's making you RP with her.


So what if it's not realistic by today's standards? If that's the case, some of the game's most interesting RPers (Siri, Melkor, Scolo, etc.) would be nothing more than godmodders. NS in itself is unrealistic, because no country grows by 5-7 million a day. If you want total realism, turn off the computer and go outside.

OOC:My other nation.

Used to be a pro business libertarian state. Still is, sort of, just sort of overpoweringly pro business.

IC:
We do not approve of your actions but you are not actually causing any large probelms or hurting many people (even if they ave to start again) and we see business opportunity.

Notquiteaplace offers you a choice of sperm if you wish all with the X chromosome if you want. (as modern techniques do make it possible to tell the two apart)

this would be very expensive and time consuming, so we can probably only do a few thousand at the moment per year (including AI), but if pay us in advance we could easily take on people and reasources and do this at a much higher rate, the cost however would be staggering Im afraid, this isnt cheap, but if you wish to ease your probelms and provide the best DNA of all (as you can chose from our best and worst) we could do maybe tens of thousands per year. The cost would be four thousand per customer though. This isnt fast or easy. The sucess rate would be assured though dueto the techniques we would use (sperm are cheap relatively, just try several times and implant the sucess(es).. its the actual process of extracting eggs and implanting that is costly.

Though we assume you have other alternatives, you may like that idea too.

Notquiteaplace does not discriminate between men and women, in any way. Which is why we have a 15% female frontline presence in our army. It is fact that women are generally smaller with lower muscle to mass ratios and so on, and we have high entry standards for our professional army. (voluntary) so not all men make it, even fewer women do. However this wider choice gave us the opportunity to raise the bar. Unfortunately this lowered the proportion further, but those up to the job are valued by our forces as much as the men.

I think that summarizes my views on this matter.

Genocide?

*blinks*

No he really is saying genocide.

If you bothered to do your research you would find out that no-one is being killed. Then again, it's not mandantory to get your facts straight before threatning war is it?

According to Dictionary.com (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=genocide), genocide is defined as, "The systematic and planned extermination of an entire national, racial, political, or ethnic group". Enforced sex changes for all male children sounds pretty systematic to me, and the fact the directive came from your Queen would suggest it is planned. Of course this may have changed later on in your thread, I stopped reading when Hattia got involved. He's a bit of prat quite frankly.
Your only defence would be to claim that exterminating an entire gender doesn't count, but I doubt that would work.

So when are you going to war against Ienotheisa who banished all men well over a year ago? Of course, I suppose it's much easier rushing off to war against a nation with 7 million as opposed to almost 3.6 billion.

Pathetic.

I don't even know who Ienothesia is. She is probably one of those people who stick to the Nationstates forum. I do not go there any more, because the place is infested with all manner of godmodding elves and space people who don't care about little things like facts.
Also, I didn't go to war with Feminany, though that is mainly because Hattia got involved first, and he is a derranged godmoder with even less regard for reality than the aforementioned space people and elves. Even if that weren't the case, I still wouldn't have bothered since there was no profit in it. I wouldn't have gotten much land since there were already lots of people involved, and Feminany seems to be a godmoder who invents her own biological nonsense and ignores anyone who responds negatively to stuff she does, so it wouldn't really be worth the effort to do anything.

*points shildonia at a post AMF made about a page back*


the sex change at birth sounds a little harsh though. And expensive. And gender cant be suppressed it comes through, your either male or female, no matter what body you are trapped in.

We know of a nation who would take your men and look after them as it is less cruel than forcing people to be something they are not.
It is called Abral Narth and maintains diplomatic relations with our nation. They are a poor simple folk and while we see them as backwards and foolish, they seem happy with themselves. Their prices are low anyway. they would be adopted by childless couple they assure me. The weather is good, they are in Australia, near the sea.

(OOC: its a puppet i raised its got no purpose other than to be a libertarian leftie state to balance the constant ring wingness i inflict apon myself with OS and NQP, i dotn RP it becasue its army is unimpressive and i dont want some n00b declaring war on it. Its good for the odd diplomacy, or was, i might re register it here.)

Feminany seems to be a godmoder who invents her own biological nonsense and ignores anyone who responds negatively to stuff she does, so it wouldn't really be worth the effort to do anything.

They GODMODed first (six pages of a war before she even got a chance to reply, anyone?), other then that making up science nonsense is what half of Nationstates do... so far I don't really see any GODMODs.

*points shildonia at a post AMF made about a page back*


the sex change at birth sounds a little harsh though. And expensive. And gender cant be suppressed it comes through, your either male or female, no matter what body you are trapped in.



OOC: Wouldn' it be easier to genetically reprogram the embryo before it develops to become only female? I think it would be.

And like Iuthia said, if we want to get picky, then here's a list of people that would be considered godmodders.

******

Automagfreek: First and foremost. RPing fantasy (demons and other spiritual things), magic (on occasion), and using organically cloned soldiers.

Melkor Unchained: Using orcs, gravships, and having a space fleet.

Menelmacar: RPing eleves and having vast spacefleets.

Draconian Imperium: RPing dragons and other fantasy characters.

Angelus: RPing highly advanced aliens.

I could go on and on. The point is simple: if everybody stuck soley to reali life / modern tech material, NS would get very boring very fast. I seriously don't see why we're having this discussion.

[b]IF YOU DON'T LIKE SOMETHING, IGNORE IT AND STOP POSTING![b] If all some of you are going to do is stalk from thread to thread shouting at Fem that you ignore her and that she's a godmodder, then that's just plain rude and makes you look like a n00b jackass.

*Nods in agreement*

I have no clue why your even bothering Iuthia, the people who declare her godmodding are also going to declare you godmodding because you have elves...

Ergo they can use the defense that no Godmodder can defend another Godmodder.

I doubt they would find the Var a very appealing idea either.

Orange state: RPing future technology.
Notquiteaplace: (for those of you who really like to call godmode) spent over a trillion and has created vaccines that RL hasnt yet.

I mean OMG!!!!!!11111 one hundred and eleven n00kular!

Godmode! Its not like we are doing it for RP purposes afterall! We dont just want to have nations that explore beyond the mundane or do what real ones wouldnt! We just want to win. Obviously.

Arent we all n00bs?

Im ignoring us all now.

:D

as for reporgramming... possibly, though the hormones in the womb and stuff would make the reprogramming something that would take a few tests and some research to get right first? (without spawning hermaphrodites or confused/deformed people in huge quantities)

I can tell you NQP would help with that for a price instead.... (they are pretty mercantile.. oh and I control them.. but Orange state doesnt as i just have one nation for RL and one for space.)

*Nods in agreement*

I have no clue why your even bothering Iuthia, the people who declare her godmodding are also going to declare you godmodding because you have elves...
The war against Feminany has been locked by a mod because all the nations involved ignored RP etiquette. Meanwhile, having elves isn't actually a GODMOD by the definitions of the sticky at the top of the International Incidents forum.

Whats more, the majority of role-play moderators have some form of fantasy element:

Melkor, Scolo and Menelmacar.


Thats assuming I was defending her... but ICly I wasn't defending her, I was condemning the idiots who would go to war over another nations internal laws.

Whats more, the point being made is that Feminany isn't a GODMODer. We alread know that the locked thread was incorrect but just because one role-player is acting out a fictional nation as having only females (We've seen fictional media do this before I may add) doesn't mean she's GODMODing.

They can't declare me GODMODing because by the definitions I haven't GODMODed.

I've often wondered what would happen if I turned up at some Lord of the Rings message board and proceeded to carpet bomb ElfTown with a squadron of B-52s. Odds are it wouldn't be looked on very favourably. There's a moral to this story.

I've often wondered what would happen if I turned up at some Lord of the Rings message board and proceeded to carpet bomb ElfTown with a squadron of B-52s. Odds are it wouldn't be looked on very favourably. There's a moral to this story.

"Get a UN resolution first"?

I've often wondered what would happen if I turned up at some Lord of the Rings message board and proceeded to carpet bomb ElfTown with a squadron of B-52s. Odds are it wouldn't be looked on very favourably. There's a moral to this story.

That's because a LOTR board is for LOTR material.

Nowhere on the NS game page or forums does it say that you are restriced in RPing only a modern tech or real life based nation. In fact, here's what the main game page says:

NationStates is a free nation simulation game. Build a nation and run it according to your own warped political ideals. Create a Utopian paradise for society's less fortunate or a totalitarian corporate police state. Care for your people or deliberately oppress them. Join the United Nations or remain a rogue state. It's really up to you.

I would love to see where it says on the game site or the forums that players are restricted in what they can RP.

*Runs in asking everybody if this is really an International Incident??*

In all honesty? Not really. It turned into a one, and in more ways than one...
*is the same player as hardheads, just is having interesting "situations" with which account he's signed in on the forums as*

*farts in the middle of the discussion between diplomats*

Now that is an international incedent!

happy now?

That will do

*Runs out reminding himself not to keep going into random threads simply to increase post count whilst desperately searching for a decent RP*

the best RPs are normally closed, semi closed, or restricted entry....

Feminany, you should realize a lot of people actually do respect OOCly, just that your internal policies prevent a lot of people from liking you ICly. Don't be discouraged, it's great that you took stirred up the forums as you did. Unfortunately, there are some members that declare war uncontollably (I used to be one of them :) ) and some that god mod uncontrollably as well. My advice is to keep it up, don't be discouraged by anyone with the 0MG n00b!!!!!1 attitude.

Enjoy Nationstates

>GODMODing: Basically this is what happens when you pull crap out of your ass to win a cooperative game.<

Cooperative game:

"We denounce your actions as inhumane and undemocratic"

Godmod Response:

"Actually they are democratic because the way science works in my country means that my population has an 80/20 birth ratio, and most of the women voted for outlawing men"

...

Cooperative game:

"I invade your country with 40 Infantry Divisions, supported by 5 divisions of Mk17 MBTs. My hundreds of cruise missiles and tens of stealth bombers attack your force concentrations wherever I see them"

Godmod Response:

"Actually none of your weapons work because the laws of science in my country are such that explosives don't work because of a universal suppresive force, so all my forces are ok. Oh, and Bernoulli's equations don't apply in my airspace, so all your planes fall out of the sky."

...

Both these responses rely on altering the fundamentals of science to defeat someone elses argument. If one is godmodding, so is the other.

Now I don't have a problem with that, and if you want to carry on RPing, that's fine - I steered well away from joining in IC, as I was too disgusted by some people's responses. But some people who were RPing (including Feminary) may not have realised that an 80/20 birth rate requires you to seriously alter the way the universe works. Bearing in mind that most or all of those people as national leaders would have science advisors I chose to reply OOC.

IC my reply would have been along the lines of:

"Our Dictator has been informed by his advisors that the claims you make are impossible. We advise all nations that an 80/20 birth ratio is not, and can not foreseeably be sustainable. We seriously question the integrity of the referendum on this subject, and are appalled at your delivery of falsehoods to the august leaders involved in this incident. We hereby call upon all nations to seek a peaceful and humane resolution to this matter, and require that to facilitate this Feminary open her borders to a multinational team of inspectors. These inspectors shall be mandated to enter hospitals and clinics, to collect birth data, and to oversee a rerun of the referendum, to ensure strict democratic principles are applied to an unbiased and fair vote. Failiure to allow this, or any evidence of officials attempting to mislead or decieve the inspection teams, will result in serious consequences for the government of Feminary."

OOC: But she isn't winning, you miss the point that your nation can still concider it wrong to do what she does, (I know I do) but her birth rate doesn't automatically win her the game.

The first example is how one nation RPs it's people, she may be a abberation but she can RP her people however she wants, what with this being freeform RP. It doesn't stop you from being offended that she still treats men badly... but oddly enough, she RPs people as she wishes in her nation. She doesn't force that 80/20 birth rate on others. Basically put; it doesn't directly affect you.

In the second example a legitimate attack has been made and they are forcing their crap onto other people in order to ignore damage. I can assure you that the first example may be concidered wanky by many, but any Mod will tell you it's not GODMODing.


Why don't you go bitch at some of the mods for having Elves, Orcs and Kzin? Or can you just not accept that someone wants to RP a nation full of sexist women? Does it hurt your ego or something, or perhaps you are just really riled up that someone wants to claim (though a genetic defect perhaps) that they mostly have women?

It's fiction, get over it.

Ooc- We all don't like feminazism, and we let our dislike get the better of us. (Something the LOEL has never done before and will never do again) Also we were all just greatly intrigued with the notion of sacking, pillaging, and mass raping against an all-feminazi nation. We were even discussing how to punish your queen if/when we got her. Somebody said, "Make her have a sex change!" somebody else said, "Let my kings bodyguards rape her!" somebody else said, "Hang her!" I said, "Sentence her to life in Mississippi, for her that would be a fate worse than death!"

You do of course realize that intolerance is intolerance, and changing the guise of the straw man you call "evil" changes nothing? That you're still just as intolerant - and therefore, silly as a pig in a tutu - if you don't like feminists, or Southerners, or blacks, or hispanics, or whites, or Democrats, or any such group?

That sort of hate just demonstrates a small mind and blinders.

Moronity is the noun of moron, although I would have preferred to use "idiocy" but it's just a matter of personal preference.

"Adverb" not "noun". As in "the state of being x".

Re: Moronity - you're right, damn you:-). Ah well...live and learn. I apologise.

Re: Sapient Gophers - You have to use a strange premise("gophers have become sapient and are the dominant species"), but the nation could still work. There is no way a human population with a 80/20 birth rate would survive. It's not a case of "but our nation works like that" unless you decide your nation isn't governed by the same cold hard sciencey stuff that the real world (and most other NS nations) are assumed to be. That hasn't been stated, and using that idea in an ongoing RP is surely godmodding?

Comedy example: You invade me. I say "you haven't adapted to the strange gravity round here, so all your forces are either crushed or dissapear into space"

That example is obviously godmodding, altering the very fabric of existence to justify something isn't fair if you are trying to RP with someone.

Uhm, George - who says they're going to be like that for a generation or two? Anyone can declare themselves anything - heck, in the States we have cults that hate sex and "outlaw" it. They usually go away quick.

Altitude alone can support such a birthrate - such as the fact pilots tend to have girls rather then boys. So there's some sort of explanation, that's the way it is - deal with it. And if you can't, don't play in her sandbox.

Simple.

It's a game.

If you can swallow the untold trillions of people in NS not completely obliterating the ecology of the planet, someone with an 80/20 mix is more or less a "yawn, ok, what else is on...".

>Sure there is. Have the men be public property, or at least permit/encourage them to have four wives each.<

That's starting to sound not so bad... :-)

Seriously, this would wipe out the population way before you were permitting/encouraging anything on a national level. If this was a mutation it would be dead within a few generations. If some alien race came and altered a tribe of cave dwelling early-humans to have an 80/20 ratio, that tribe would die off in favour of other nearby tribes with a 50.1/49.9 ratio. This is why species end up how they do. Given the nature of human beings, an almost 50/50 ratio thrives.

Recommended reading - "The Red Queen : Sex and the evolution of human nature"


Reality has little to nothing to do with NationStates. Consider that my people marry and interbreed with penguins. Nuff said?

I was just pointing out that there is no feasible way such a measure could be passed democratically. It's a form of godmodding. Like if I claimed that I had 4 trillion soldiers trained up in my army. There's no way it could happen. If people want to go with it, that's fine by me - I was just a (slightly) knowledgable observer, who spotted a flaw.

However, I think you could make a more interesting RP by basing it in reality. If your Queen had some kind of irrational feelings against men, and was effectively a dictator, either overtly or covertly, that would make a more interesting RP in my view than one which relies on states which could not occur. You might even tempt me into my first RP - so far I've mainly lurked, and tried to point out stuff that couldn't happen.

As a footnote, I think GM soldiers probably are possible. Hope it never happens :-p

Well, no.

One is numerically impossible (A nation of 4 million can't field 4 trillion soldiers).

However, assuming people would vote against something because it was stupid lacks understanding of humans. Consider people have voted to make pi equal to 3, to enforce "1 bath a year, whether it's needed or not"... I could go on, but the point is there.

People are stupid.

And who is to say it wasn't presented as a truly convoluted piece of bureacracy the people stared at and passed "for the good of the nation"?

Now stop kvetching and move on.

>Why don't you go bitch at some of the mods for having Elves, Orcs and Kzin? Or can you just not accept that someone wants to RP a nation full of sexist women? Does it hurt your ego or something, or perhaps you are just really riled up that someone wants to claim (though a genetic defect perhaps) that they mostly have women?<

Hooray for Ad Hominems.

By the way, I don't think elves, orcs or Kzin break fundamental rules of science do they? So that would be a strawman as well. Good going.

>The first example is how one nation RPs it's people, she may be a abberation but she can RP her people however she wants, what with this being freeform RP. It doesn't stop you from being offended that she still treats men badly... but oddly enough, she RPs people as she wishes in her nation. She doesn't force that 80/20 birth rate on others. Basically put; it doesn't directly affect you.<

Although it does directly affect the potential for others to make legitimate diplomatic attacks on the law and the way it was enacted, by altering fundamentals of science.

>In the second example a legitimate attack has been made and they are forcing their crap onto other people in order to ignore damage. I can assure you that the first example may be concidered wanky by many, but any Mod will tell you it's not GODMODing.<

Legitimate Diplomatic attack...forcing altered science on other people to ignore. Unless it's more acceptable to do this in diplomatic incidents than in wartime ones, which would be a shame, because I think the diplomatic ones are more interesting, and would rather see them protected from Deus ex...

By the way, I don't think elves, orcs or Kzin break fundamental rules of science do they? So that would be a strawman as well. Good going.


Immortal (As in, not aging past a certain level), disease- immune elves? Sounds like science breaking to me.

And now, do us a favour and shut up, it gets tiring. If you don't like it, don't post, but don't try to force your views upon others.

It's amusing, how you're currently doing something you ought to be against...

>Immortal (As in, not aging past a certain level), disease- immune elves? Sounds like science breaking to me.<

Actually, there are several real life species that don't age past maturity.

>And now, do us a favour and shut up, it gets tiring. If you don't like it, don't post, but don't try to force your views upon others.<

So when I said "If you want to go with it, that's fine" and explained why I didn't get involved IC and why I did OOC, where were you?

>It's amusing, how you're currently doing something you ought to be against... <

Don't really know what you mean here. I've made no Ad Hominem attacks, no Strawman arguments, and specifically stated that I've no problem with people carrying on with this, knowing the facts and chosing to accept the altered science. Just what did you mean?

>Immortal (As in, not aging past a certain level), disease- immune elves? Sounds like science breaking to me.<

Actually, there are several real life species that don't age past maturity.

I'm not aware of any real world species that have members who are 30,000 years old. Really, you're parsing to the point of splitting the proverbial hair at this point.

Hooray for Ad Hominems.

By the way, I don't think elves, orcs or Kzin break fundamental rules of science do they?

So you are saying that they are scientifically viable? Can you back this up?

The point of raising Elves, Orcs and Kzin was that they are fictional... however you seem to be forgetting and ignoring the fact that we are not role-playing real life. We are playing a co-operative story writing game and stories, in order to be interesting, don't follow science flawlessly. These humans could very well have undergone a highly unlikely evolution process which created their 20/80 birth rate... is it likely, does it follow reality? No... but then again, niether does most fiction.

Although it does directly affect the potential for others to make legitimate diplomatic attacks on the law and the way it was enacted, by altering fundamentals of science.

See the last argument; few players in Nationstates completely follow the laws of physics. Example: Many space nations conveniently ignore the problems with the limit of the speed of light, they explain it away in many different interesting technological ideas... but they can't be proven.

In this case, she ruined one part of your "diplomatic" arguement against her. If that is all you had to throw against her then you clearly don't have the imagination. She role-plays her nation how see likes, you choose to RP with her or not, if you don't like it, please don't bitch at her in her threads.

So she doesn't follow reality... but then again, how many nations RP perfect Communist systems despite the clear problems inherant in the idea? Personally I feel that in real life communism cannot work at a large scale because there is little incentive for people to all work for the same wage (among various other things). But you know what? It's a fiction, we RP our nations to suit the way we want to write stories about our nations.

You claim of GODMOD will only be aknowledged by you. It's not something the majority of NS recognises because we know it's a fictional game. She hasn't ignored damage; she's RPed her nation to suit her.

Splitting hairs?

As early as the 1930s (Bidder, 1932) it was thought that some species of fish do not show signs of senesence.

It is well documented that some species show no correlation between age and death rate. Although in a wild species injury, disease or predation will eventually get you, a civilised society of such a species could potentially have members thousands of years old.

These attributes can vary quite considerably. In fact even in the same species it is possible to find both types with negligible senesence and with much shorter lifespans. The implications this has for fantasy races (for example elves) is that you could even have one group of elves who lived short lifespans, and another that didn't age.

So you don't have to alter the rules of science to get such a society.

I have a suspicion that very few if any of the people this was immediately relevant to are reading it anymore :-) Oh well.

>In this case, she ruined one part of your "diplomatic" arguement against her. If that is all you had to throw against her then you clearly don't have the imagination. She role-plays her nation how see likes, you choose to RP with her or not, if you don't like it, please don't bitch at her in her threads.<

ARRRGH!

I had no argument against her! I didn't post IC at all! Please read what I wrote before you make assumptions like that. To summarise - I pointed out that what she claimed was not scientifically viable, in case that made a difference to either her arguments or those of other people who were posting IC. I even said that if people were ok with that, that was no problem. As for bitching I don't believe I've made a single personal attack against her.

If you want to debate the science, or the analogies I've drawn, that's fine, and I'll enjoy doing it. Please don't bitch at me though. That isn't fair.

>So she doesn't follow reality... but then again, how many nations RP perfect Communist systems despite the clear problems inherant in the idea? Personally I feel that in real life communism cannot work at a large scale because there is little incentive for people to all work for the same wage (among various other things). But you know what? It's a fiction, we RP our nations to suit the way we want to write stories about our nations.<

The 80/20 thing isn't a "Personally I feel" argument though. It's a "Science will not let you do this." I personally tend to believe that communism could work, though I would be first to admit I don't know enough about this particular field to be confident, let alone sure. But I recognise that opinion is a hell of a long way from anything even approaching scientific fact.

As for bitching I don't believe I've made a single personal attack against her..

I concider claiming someones role-play to be a GODMOD an attack on their role-playing capability if they haven't done anything to be grossly unfair. In this case she is RPing her nation as she sees fit and it's the other players job to ask her how she is RPing her people.

Meh, I'm sorry if I made that assumption earlier. Though it does seem like you have ignored the majority of the arguement which basically says:

It's fiction, get over it.

Ok, it sounds like we have a different idea of godmodding. I used the comparison between "all your planes fall out the sky because gravity is different here" and "actually it was democratic because evolution doesn't work here". One would definitely be seen as godmodding, so I thought the other was.

I should definitely have been more tactful about how I put it - throwing the word "godmod" about was emotive and a bit silly. It was also bound to throw people on the defensive. I should have said

"Ok guys, science will not let you do that."

and left it either to her to change it, or to the people RPing with her to either accept it, or call godmod if she used it to dismiss their arguments.
---
On fiction:

Having all your planes die because gravity is different in my country is fiction too - does that make it an acceptable defense?

I think the problem is that I used the word Godmod. I should have pointed out the science, and let the people playing decide if they wanted to take it on. Seeing as it could have been an honest mistake, or even something they all agreed on, it wasn't fair to call it a Godmod until she used it knowing it was impossible, to ruin someone's argument.

So, a mixture of admiration, scorn and ridicule (sadly more of the last two) for people who replied with reasoned arguments, ad hominem attacks and strawmen respectively. And most importantly:

Apologies to Feminary for my badly worded post. I hope you took it as the guidance it was intended to be, instead of the attack that it could have sounded like.

"Ok guys, science will not let you do that."

I don't suppose you will now find more threads; for example people who RP magic (hint: there are alot of nations who do this) and tell them that science won't let them do that. You've picked the one feature of this nation which is pretty much the entire concept of her role-play and told her "No, you cannot do that because of science". She is trying to have a reasonably fresh idea (for NS at least) that women in her nation are dominant over the other sex.

I wouldn't be arguing about it if it was something small, but you are asking her to change her nations concept over a small scientific fact in a game which is fictional.

On fiction: Having all your planes die because gravity is different in my country is fiction too - does that make it an acceptable defense

If you are on another world (i.e a space nation) then it wouldn't be. But then again if someone is stupid enough to use planes on another world like that then it's their problem for making an assumption.

In the case with the 80/20 idea, Feminany started the RP, she is the author. She gives you the basic jist of what she is doing in her nation. In her mind woman are more in number, when people claim that she's killing half her populace or whatever it was and she points out that it's actually much less then that, as the author of her own thread she has given you the information to stop assumptions.

Lets say that the nation in your first example was called "Uranus" and they RPed the horrific genocide of their people and then a bunch of modern tech nations send planes to bomb him... but wait, he's a space nation but because it's his first post, no one has asked him. In which case your planes fail because there is no way they can fly to his planet. Is he GODMODing? No, because they made the assumption.

In otherwords... Feminany most likely provided her correction of peoples assumptions, her people are more likely to be female because she RPs a nation of feminists, maybe even "Amazons".

Yes, an 80:20 birth rate is so unrealistic, considering all the things that happen on NationStates every day. I mean, all of this stuff is highly realistic:

Magic
Terraforming planets within a generation
FTL travel
Dragons
Sentient Walruses
Psionics
Nations on Mars
Nations on Venus
Nations on the moons of Saturn, Neptune, Jupiter, and Uranus
Nations on Sedna
Nations on Mercury
Nations on the Sun
Grav-tech
Artificial Intelligences capable of breeding biologically
A nation on the bottom of the Mariana Trench
The Underwater Bubble
A world population in the tens-hundreds of trillions
Races immune to disease
Fallen gods
Gods that haven't fallen
Cloning fully grown humans
Humans who don't age
Cyberware
Mech(a)
Mach 4 fighters
Multi-kilometer-long space ships
Kilometer-long wet ships

And on, and on, and on, and on, and on.

Yes, an 80:20 birth rate is so unrealistic, considering all the things that happen on NationStates every day. I mean, all of this stuff is highly realistic:

Magic
Terraforming planets within a generation
FTL travel
Dragons
Sentient Walruses
Psionics
Nations on Mars
Nations on Venus
Nations on the moons of Saturn, Neptune, Jupiter, and Uranus
Nations on Sedna
Nations on Mercury
Nations on the Sun
Grav-tech
Artificial Intelligences capable of breeding biologically
A nation on the bottom of the Mariana Trench
The Underwater Bubble
A world population in the tens-hundreds of trillions
Races immune to disease
Fallen gods
Gods that haven't fallen
Cloning fully grown humans
Humans who don't age
Cyberware
Mech(a)
Mach 4 fighters
Multi-kilometer-long space ships
Kilometer-long wet ships

And on, and on, and on, and on, and on.

You forgot about Pokemon.

Actually a lot of those things are possible without changing science.

If the thread author is the only one who dictates what background the thread is set in then surely no thread author can ever Godmod? I think changes to the 'normal' world should be explicitly stated in the thread intro, otherwise anyone losing a war can say "Ah well, all my people have strange body chemistry, without it all your invaders die" and it's the invaders fault for makin the assumption things were 'normal'.

Given the RP guide sticky talks about trying to keep things as close to real life as possible I don't think that's unfair.

The point is that compared to all the other nonsense going on, an 80:20 female:male ratio isn't too difficult to believe.

Kilometer-long wet ships



Ooc- Ah, so you've heard of the Curtis Fabus Class Battleship?

Actually, an 80:20 ratio is much less feasible than a lot of those other things, even though it might at first glance sound more so (see previous science, I'm not dredging it up again).

I don't dispute people can play what they like - if everyone obeyed the "keep close to reality" bit of that sticky guide we certainly wouldn't see a lot of things.

This is one of the less feasible things, and I was just flagging it, same as I'd flag someone doing something in an otherwise realistic seeming war RP that mangled science.

One thing that I'm still curious about, if the females are getting pregenant from 'Sperm' made from bacteria, where is the genetic information coming from? The bacteria? are all this nations children blobs of jelly or something?

OOC:Poor you, you come from Ashford. I lived there a few years and left when i was 13. Good riddance, what a dump!

I guess she has several more realistic alternatives availble though doesnt she? Im sure she can work those instead. Or some simular

If the thread author is the only one who dictates what background the thread is set in then surely no thread author can ever Godmod?

No, the point was that the thread author is saying what happens in her nation and she didn't think to explain that in her nation they don't have as many males as they have females... when she explains it after someone made the assumption you (someone who isn't actually involved in the thread whatso ever) are claiming they are GODMODing... yet you are the only one who actually cares that a 80:20 birth rate is unrealistic.

My point was that as it is her nation she can describe her people as she wishes... you want to deny her that? Don't RP in her threads, you've made your point and only you seem to be bothered about her birth rate. As the player running her nation she can and will run it as she pleases...

You know what happens if you are found to be GODMODing by a mod? Nothing. It's not actually a crime as such, but a reason for ignore. The point is that in freeform RP, GODMOD claims exist to point out someone isn't playing fair and those who agree don't RP with them. Seeing as only a small insignificant part of Feminany is no concistant with reality it's perfectly acceptable for you to ignore her... claiming it's properganda works to, but you would be IC wrong if chose to RP with her, if you incisted on RPing with her and tested one of her people to test it you will find that she is right because she RPs her own people. If you are RPing with them, you've accepted what they've put forth.

Conclusion: Yeah, you are right, it's unrealistic but I don't care and I doubt everyone will care; ignore her or accept her claim.

OOC: Here's a question for you TWW:

Are you contributing to the game?

From what I've read, the answer is definatly no. All you're doing is blasting anothe rplayer for playing the game how she wants to. Unless you yourself plan on RPing your own society, then (with all due respect of course) piss off. Your argument is so frivolous it's beyond belief. NEVER in the history of NS has a player made as much of a stink about how a person RPs as you have.

Seriously, just drop it and move on. NOBODY CARES WHAT YOU THINK IS ACCEPTABLE, WE HAVE TO RIGHT TO RP AS WE WANT TO!!!

Yes, an 80:20 birth rate is so unrealistic, considering all the things that happen on NationStates every day. I mean, all of this stuff is highly realistic:

Magic
Terraforming planets within a generation
FTL travel
Dragons
Sentient Walruses
Psionics
Nations on Mars
Nations on Venus
Nations on the moons of Saturn, Neptune, Jupiter, and Uranus
Nations on Sedna
Nations on Mercury
Nations on the Sun
Grav-tech
Artificial Intelligences capable of breeding biologically
A nation on the bottom of the Mariana Trench
The Underwater Bubble
A world population in the tens-hundreds of trillions
Races immune to disease
Fallen gods
Gods that haven't fallen
Cloning fully grown humans
Humans who don't age
Cyberware
Mech(a)
Mach 4 fighters
Multi-kilometer-long space ships
Kilometer-long wet ships

And on, and on, and on, and on, and on.


OOC: I don't think there has been a 'respectable RPer' yet who hasn't done something to break the laws of modern physics / reality. Originality is what matters here, not reality.

Again TWW, if you want reality then turn off the computer and go outside.

OOC: I don't think there has been a 'respectable RPer' yet who hasn't done something to break the laws of modern physics / reality. Originality is what matters here, not reality.
Heh... actually, quite a few things on that list have been done by me, puppets of mine, or nations I role-play with actively.

Anyway, this thread has really gotten off track. Fem made her point, and has linked over to the thread for her conferency, this is quickly growing spurious and highly likely to burst into huge gouts of flesh-searing flames. Probably would be best if I just locked it and let everyone move on the conference.

Or not, if you're ignoring her.