NationStates Jolt Archive

All OOC talk and diplomacy can go here. Xiaguo, hurry up and attack!

~TAG~

BUMP for Taiwan

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OOC: I just want to clarify something with the possible former anti-Drapoel coalition members who seem to want to transfer there forces over to fighting me instead.

POJ, you said you had bases in Qinghai and Gansu. Im asking, since when?

Hudecia/POJ, how are you planning to get your men from a combat position in the southern ROK to East Turkestan, over a distance wider than the continental USA with much more challenging climates and a sea?

They will take trains. Xiaguo has a huge rail network which can deliver their forces to Gansu in 1-3 weeks. They also are not ALL in ROK, many are in Xiaguo.

Yes, they are in ROK. They just got finished fighting Dra-pol. Therefore, they must be picked up, re-equipped, shipped back, and then transported over an area greater than the contenental US.

First of all, they need not to equipt, as they have alreeady did. Its not like we just barely finished the war, it was RL almost a month ago and we are their for only occupational duty. And a cease-fire truce was set. And most forces ARE in Xiaguo.

Xiaguo has provided the main transport with the Xiannese Navy which simply ships them from ROK to Laoning which is controlled by Xiaguo.

The Last Strike

12:00 A.M
They were everywhere. Prowlers, the pride of the TPAF, EA-6B, began their first wave. They moved out over the trenches, barbwire, and foxholes of the Xinjiang/China Proper border and armed their HARM missiles. Their targets were the airbases of the ATPC (what the TPQD is referring to the coalition as, standing for anti-Turkic People's Coalition), located in Xizhang, Gansu, Nei Mongolia, and any other one's inside their range. Taiwanese airbases would not be targeted as official war was not declared between them. Sinoese, Xiannese, and especially Granzi airbases were supposed to be brought to their knees by this strike.

EA-6Bs flew over these airbases, and immediatly the ATPC radars were located. HARM missiles moved in immediately, slamming into the best SAM defenses the ATPC had. Boom boom, SAM after SAM was hit by HARMs. HARMs were not all. The EA-6Bs also had complicated jamming equipment, and this was brought to bear on all ATPC airbases.

As the last HARM missile hit the last Granzi SAM, another happened. Massive numbers of Tomahawks and TLAMs, coming from Lop Lake, moved high into the air and soared towards what was hopefully defenseless airbases full of sitting strike aircraft ducks. They came down with a massive explosion in Tibet, Gansu, Nei Mongolia, and elsewhere. Explosions ripped through all the airbases in the area. After the first Tomahawk went off, a massive bomber fleet, composing B-2s masked by stealth, took off in the wake of the extremely fast cruise missiles. They dropped their payloads all over the aforementioned targeted air bases, saturating the area with thousands of pounds of bombs before retreating.

They were followed by a short team of F-117As, F-35s, and B-52s, who all continued to drop bomb after bomb after bomb onto the airbases, in an effort to destroy or damage the ATPC air forces so much that the playing field was equal between Daylam-ATPC fighters.

Don't mean to spec whore, but that borders on godmodding:

*The Tomahawk is firmly subsonic (Mach 0.8) To reach Tibet, Gansu, and Inner Mongolia would require at least an hour.

*Any aircraft/ground radars (even the older ones) would pick up the EA-6s well before they hit the airbases. It would really only be possible for them if they flew in a terrain-hugging profile (which is really really tricky over mountainous terrain such as Gantsu and Tibet, and won't protect them from look-down radars.)

Who controls what now? I thought Daylam was already in China!

The Last Strike

12:00 A.M
They were everywhere. Prowlers, the pride of the TPAF, EA-6B, began their first wave. They moved out over the trenches, barbwire, and foxholes of the Xinjiang/China Proper border and armed their HARM missiles. Their targets were the airbases of the ATPC (what the TPQD is referring to the coalition as, standing for anti-Turkic People's Coalition), located in Xizhang, Gansu, Nei Mongolia, and any other one's inside their range. Taiwanese airbases would not be targeted as official war was not declared between them. Sinoese, Xiannese, and especially Granzi airbases were supposed to be brought to their knees by this strike.

EA-6Bs flew over these airbases, and immediatly the ATPC radars were located. HARM missiles moved in immediately, slamming into the best SAM defenses the ATPC had. Boom boom, SAM after SAM was hit by HARMs. HARMs were not all. The EA-6Bs also had complicated jamming equipment, and this was brought to bear on all ATPC airbases.

As the last HARM missile hit the last Granzi SAM, another happened. Massive numbers of Tomahawks and TLAMs, coming from Lop Lake, moved high into the air and soared towards what was hopefully defenseless airbases full of sitting strike aircraft ducks. They came down with a massive explosion in Tibet, Gansu, Nei Mongolia, and elsewhere. Explosions ripped through all the airbases in the area. After the first Tomahawk went off, a massive bomber fleet, composing B-2s masked by stealth, took off in the wake of the extremely fast cruise missiles. They dropped their payloads all over the aforementioned targeted air bases, saturating the area with thousands of pounds of bombs before retreating.

They were followed by a short team of F-117As, F-35s, and B-52s, who all continued to drop bomb after bomb after bomb onto the airbases, in an effort to destroy or damage the ATPC air forces so much that the playing field was equal between Daylam-ATPC fighters.

Typical, I have the least number of troops in the Xinjiang Theater, but I'm always attacked the most and given the most attention. Go figure. :P

OOC: Taiwan, the Xiannese defense systems are bordering on non-existent over Nei Mongolia/Gansu. I had total air control over Gansu and Nei Mongolia due to the sheer numerical superiority of my F-22s until you entered the war with your 10,000 fighters.
Now, with massive B-2 bombing of Xiannese rail systems, the latest gigantic air strike on Granzi and Sinoese bases, I'm pretty sure those Hudecian, POJ, and Xiannese troops wont be reaching Xinjiang anytime soon. :lol:

Granzi, Im just trying to knock people out of this war as fast as possible. By all accounts your air bases have received massive punishment.

OOC2: Taiwan, they are firing from the *EDIT* eastern edge of Xinjiang (Lop Lake). Are you sure it would take an hour?
Also, remember, this is the middle of the night as well.

For reference, my storefront:

http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=136559&highlight=

my post from the other thread (I obviously found the ooc thread)

OOC: Christians for Israel, I do not claim to control all of Iran. Just the northern sector. You would have to go through Syria and Iraq, aka Al-Anbar (a 2 bil+ nation), and then modern Iran before reaching my nation. Basically you don't have any effect on me since you are too far away.



ooc: I'm bringing this to this thread because I'm quoting from this thread.


The Daylami empire includes Northern Iran, Central Asia (Turkmenistan, Tajikistan, Uzbekistan, Kyrgystan), and Xinjiang province in China (known as East Turkestan in Daylam, it is the westernmost Chinese province).


Daylam you can't have it both ways. I actually posted a naval deployment to your area in the Dra-pol thread sometime back and then saw the above whereby you claim to be landlocked. The point of your post at the time was to try to landlock yourself from CFI. do not now try to reverse that. If you do, your reinfrcements will face the carrier battle group and sub hunter force I dispatched here one hell of a long time ago.

just a point, you would have had maybe 30 minutes to an hour heads up on the airstrke you and CFI are fighting about. Not enough time to relocate entire fighter wings and then turn around and relaunch during the same strike you ran from.

If so though, his f14s would still be in the area and could then catch your planes while they were attempting to launch.

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Daylam, if you claim access to the Arabian Sea with Southern and eastern iran being a "protectorate" of yours than the Arabian Sea is a lot closer from the ROK for both Hudecia and I than coming all the way around and then overland. I think I will be coming that way.

BTW Shoenix troops don't land until his transports figure a way around my carrier battle group and sub force already there.

(Daylam: If you ask me to post that deployment from the Dra-pol thread, which I will do; then I'm going to expect that you concede the point that these Shoenix transports could not have landed because they haven't gone by me yet, agreed?)
:D

OOC: Can you please RP his fleets? He tends to be a bit of a windbag.


Awww.... sorry if I make the game not fun for you Taiwan.....maybe you should go RP somewhere else if your going to start name-calling. (Not like I actually consider 'windbag' a word to take offense over if I was called it, which I was)

OOC: I was here first :P. I just hope you'll spend more time RPing and less time discussing how invincible your ships were, considering last time you went on for pages and pages about the ammo feed for CIWS.

(I was in a somewhat pissy mood last night. My apologies for the name calling)

Daylam, where are you?

The phone lines were turned on today in the new house. Sorry to be gone. Also, I think I was pretty generous in losing 2 Raptors for every Taiwanese plane lost, but I threw in the Hudecian fighters as well, too many casualties or too little?

Also, POJ, a massive air armada settting off from Israeli and having to move through all of Turkey is going to give me a hell of a lot more than 30 minutes to know about, buddy.

Regarding your infantry portable SAMs, it is too light for them to reach more than 15,000 feet, simply due to size constraints. The Patriot, which can hit 80,000 feet, weighs 1,500lbs (~750kg). The HUMRAAM weights ~330lb.

Regarding your infantry portable SAMs, it is too light for them to reach more than 15,000 feet, simply due to size constraints. They also don't have the radar needed. The Patriot, which can hit 80,000 feet, weighs 1,500lbs (~750kg). The HUMRAAM weights ~330lb.

This RP has got too cool down for a sec so we can sort out some key facts.

1) Charging 1 miilion men indicates human wave tactics. Charging through minefields as if they don't exist is hugely demoralizing for troops and massing that many men into a small area is asking for a massacre.

2) Hudecian troops (as I've said before) are some of the best equiped and trained... so even if you claim to outnumber me 10 to 1 my troops can fight you on even terms. Remeber.. I am twice your age Daylam and have an army a fraction of your size.

3) Daylam can not claim to have so much equipment... it is godmodding... heck.. when I was his age I was avoiding wars like the plague not charging into them as if I could take on the world.

Any comments/suggestions on these ideas?

OOC:


..."They are attacking with over a million men?" General Chellis asked rhetorically. "Good... with that many men they'll be so uncoordinated they'll be easily destroyed."...

You cant assume that his troops will be uncoordinated and easily destroyable. This is godmod #1.


Haha... I was quoting one of my favourite generals... when he was outnumbered 10 to 1 this is the statement he made. I was not saying that is what happens.

I dont care who you were quoting. Saying "Good...with that many men they'll be so uncoordinated they'll be easily destroyed" is predicting what happens.



...Only 2 of the remaining 3 shifts of Hudecian strike aircraft were launched at the approaching Daylami forces, making minch meat out of their pathetic mobile AA weapons and other packs of armed forces...

Its his job to report any sort of casualties whatsoever, not yours. If those AA guns have the chance to fire at you, then you have to report at least some damage. This is godmod #2.

Daylam does this all the time (check his battles with Xiaguo). Still I didn't give any definate numbers, I was giving a general idea of what happened, so it is not godmodding.

I dont care what Daylam does, im not his mother. You dont have to be precise for it to be godmodding. If you say 'making minch meat out of their pathectic mobile AA units....' then it is godmodding. Hell, he could have only lost one unit in that raid.



Rushing, bayonets drawn, into the murderous cross fires set up by Hudecian forces, the battle-hardened veterans of the Drapol campaigns fell the Daylami troops by the thousands. Daylam may have 1.5 million rookie combat troops attacking, but Hudecia had 200 000 of the best trained and equiped troops in the world. It would take a lot more than Daylam had to crack these nuts.

Once again, you cant report your enemies losses. Saying 'Drapol campaigns fell the Daylami troops by the thousands' is a godmod. Also, you cant assume the 1.5 million troops are rookies. A good majority may be veteran fighters. This is godmod #3

His nation is extremely small, he has a larger navy than I do, he claims to have more armour than I do... etc...

I think I have the right to claim that all 1.5 million of his men aren't vets. Besides.. vets of what wars?! This is the first major war Daylam is involved in.

No, you dont have that right. His soldiers could have been extensively trained in the arts of war. You never know. Saying 'Drapol campaigns fell the Daylami troops by the thousands' is still, and always will be, a godmod (especially because you gave a number).



The demoralized and exhausted Daylami forces, who had been forced to rebuild their defences several times a day and be ready to evacuate their positions at a moments notice, would be forced back today in face of the greater abilities and skills of the Hudecian Armed Forces.

Once again (wow this is getting boring), it is not your place to say that the Daylami forces are 'demoralized and exhausted'. Also, you cant assume that his forces will be forced back. This is godmod #4



Wow.. I am getting tired of saying this... he can not ignore my air raids on his lines... he had to move his men around into tunnels to hide from my strikes, he had to rebuild them.. and now he wants them to go charging through minefields... jeez... soldiers aren't machines.. they fear just like everyone else and get tired just like anyone else. If he won't recognize that then I have to tell him.

You dont have to be saying any of this. You could just take it that you godmodded some and admit it. Those are HIS soldiers, not yours.. and it is his job to RP them.



Don't godmod.

.... Dont godmod?.... In that rambling RP you yourself managed to produce 4 class A instances of godmodding. Congrats.... and think twice before you accuse someone else of godmodding.

Well... as I have just shown.. I didn't godmod. and if I did... he godmodded worse... so... why don't you stop and watch your ally godmod?

Again, it is not my job to watch Daylam. Im pretty sure my ally can make sure his things are straight. Its just, when I was reading through your RP, I could easily pick things out that show that you need to stop saying other people are godmodding when you own RP's might be culprits of godmodding.

1) So if I RP that one of my soldiers saying "why don't we nuke them?" and another person says "yeah thats a great idea", it means that I just launched nukes? Of course not...

It's called character RP, where you take the position of a person in the battle and give his/her perspective on the issue.

2) If you claim not to care about Daylam's godmodding then why are you giving me a hard time. He is godmodding worse than anything I have seen since Anti-Terror Army and my RPing is debatable at best.

3) Daylam has stated repeatedly that his AA units give my forces "a bloody nose" or stuff like that. So what I have done is exactly what he has done, so complain about him too.

4) I gave a general number again... fell by the thousands is general.. it means that I kicked his butt a lot. And yes I do have that right because Daylam has godmodded the size of his forces and I had him good.. running into a minefield is not smart at all and would cause thousands to tens of thousands of casualties.

5) So if I was to say that I haven't lost a single soldier in the entire mess it would be prefectly legitimate? After all, according to your logic, they are MY men, and MY job to RP them. Of course not... it'd be godmodding and others would point it out.

If someone is RPing badly, it is MY place to tell them, just as it is YOUR place to complain if you think I am godmodding (which I am not BTW).

Oh and yes it is your job to watch your ally to help him avoid the pitfalls of godmodding... which you are NOT doing...


If you want me to start RPing like Daylam I'd be more than willing to... then it'd end up being a godmod fest. I mean he retracts his statements after I point out flaws in his battle strategies, claiming that 'he didn't mean what he wrote'.

1) So if I RP that one of my soldiers saying "why don't we nuke them?" and another person says "yeah thats a great idea", it means that I just launched nukes? Of course not...

It's called character RP, where you take the position of a person in the battle and give his/her perspective on the issue.

2) If you claim not to care about Daylam's godmodding then why are you giving me a hard time. He is godmodding worse than anything I have seen since Anti-Terror Army and my RPing is debatable at best.

3) Daylam has stated repeatedly that his AA units give my forces "a bloody nose" or stuff like that. So what I have done is exactly what he has done, so complain about him too.

4) I gave a general number again... fell by the thousands is general.. it means that I kicked his butt a lot. And yes I do have that right because Daylam has godmodded the size of his forces and I had him good.. running into a minefield is not smart at all and would cause thousands to tens of thousands of casualties.

5) So if I was to say that I haven't lost a single soldier in the entire mess it would be prefectly legitimate? After all, according to your logic, they are MY men, and MY job to RP them. Of course not... it'd be godmodding and others would point it out.

If someone is RPing badly, it is MY place to tell them, just as it is YOUR place to complain if you think I am godmodding (which I am not BTW).

Oh and yes it is your job to watch your ally to help him avoid the pitfalls of godmodding... which you are NOT doing...


If you want me to start RPing like Daylam I'd be more than willing to... then it'd end up being a godmod fest. I mean he retracts his statements after I point out flaws in his battle strategies, claiming that 'he didn't mean what he wrote'.

(Thanks for numbering them, BTW)

1. Um, I dont know how this has anything to do with my first point, but I know that if you assume someones forces can be easily destroyed then its a godmod.

2. Because I trust Daylam can take care of himself and correct his mistakes, if he has any. You, however, cant seem to understand that you yourself are godmodding.

3. "a bloody nose"?..... Um ok.... I dont really know what that means but I am going to say this: Just because Daylam may mess up, doesnt mean you get to do the same thing.

4. Saying his troops were 'fell by the thousands' is a godmod. It is called: stating your enemies losses, plain and simple. Once again, I do not care if Daylam messes up, as I trust he can and will fix his mistakes.

5. They are your men. But if I, or anyone else, sees a mistake in your RPing, then they are at liberty to point it out, which I am doing now OOCly.

In the notion of a 'classic' argument, I will have to back up my point and say, yes, you are godmodding.

No, as I trust Daylam can fix his RPing problems. The only thing is, I dont trust you to fix yours. I doubt you trust me either. (Believe me, I will welcome any constructive critisism you may have torwards my RPing when I actually get to RP a fight, or battle.)

All I know is that I believe you, in particular, are godmodding. I do not care about Daylam. If he says that he did not mean what he said, then thats good.. at least hes trying to fix his IC RP mistakes.

Would it help if I got a RP referee in?

I copied the comments to IRC #nationstates. This was an extract of the response.

<Obsidian> It's just a general making an assumption
<Lietuveska> yeah
<Nathicana> Sheesh - do you see numbers? It's ic'ly betting on it.
<Ro|Bored> Yeh.
<Lietuveska> i mean
<Lietuveska> what they said
<Obsidian> Generals do it all the time.
<Nathicana> Don't take character's comments as being godmods. And Ro, I wasn't even speaking to you.

Ok, im not fully sure what that stuff is... but even if I was to wave what the character said, then there are still, what, three other things that are godmods?

Yes, that is borderline, but Daylam is doing the same.

So in the interest of maintaing a positve RP atmosphere, I've chosen not to nitpick about Daylam's presumptuas RPing. Can you do the same for this case?

Also, can you describe your african port facility?