NationStates Jolt Archive

Update on the Doujin:

The hull and gun emplacements of the Doujin are now complete, now internal work should be completed within the next year. Revised Specifications will be published as soon as the Doujin is released from Dry-Dock.

Any nation wishing to take a tour of the Doujin is more than welcome to request it. Doujin will be calling a meeting with the 'Organization of Maritime Powers' to make it an official organization and sign documents aboard the Doujin.

The Doujin will not be released from drydock for a couple more years.

Doujin Class Flagship (http://www.geocities.com/doujincorp/doujinbb.html)

Like the other Doujin Navy vessels that are trimarans, the Doujin is very seaworthy and is a very steady gun platform. Even though many might consider that it would be hard to come up with an armor scheme that would give these three hulled ships a high level of protection, the Doujin class is very well armored and having three floating bodies makes the vessel harder to sink. In addition, the three hull design allows for a wider space for weapons, systems, and other vehicles than would be possible on a single hull design of about the same displacement.

The ship carries its powerful engines high in the primary hull which reduces the noise in the water greatly. While the ship is not as fast as was first thought and not as fast as the Trimaran destroyers or frigates, it is the fastest ship of its size ever constructed and on trial runs these huge ships have all exceeded 30 knots.

Like most of the Doujin Navy's larger ships, the Doujin Class has a sensor suite that is an improved version of the APAR 12 three-dimensional radar. This Phased Array radar system is more compact than the Aegis system used by most the modern world, and has greater tracking capabilities and range. The ship also has both a hull sonar system and a towed array sonar system.

The designers constructed the Doujin Class battleship using Radar Absorbent Materials extensively in the design. As a result, missiles using radar guidance to pinpoint locations on the Doujin have a decreased effectiveness. The Doujin also carries a powerful ECM system.

Model Type: BB-582 Class Battleship ( Doujin Class )
Crew: 7,250 (5,800 crewmen; 450 officers; 1000 military troops)
Speed: 32 knots maximum, 15 knots cruising
Range: Unlimited due to the Pebblebed nuclear reactor engines. Ship carriers six months of supplies and consumables on board.

Statistical Data:
Length: 981 meters (3266.7 feet)
Width: 350 meters (1166.55 feet)
Draft: 28 metres (98 feet) Empty, 32 metres (108 Feet) Full
Displacement:
Empty: 1,400,000 tons
Fully Loaded: 1,800,000 tons
Cargo: 28,000 tons of nonessential equipment and supplies. Each enlisted crew member has a
small locker for personal items and uniforms. Ships officers have more space for personal items. Most ship's spaces are taken up by extra ammo, armor, troops, weapons, and engines.
Builders: Navarre Navy Shipyards (Division of Doujinshi Corporation, located in The Freethinkers)
Price: Not for sale.

Weapon Systems:
20 x 30" Electro-Thermal Naval Guns 12 x 8" Electro-Thermal Naval Guns
36 x 3? BI Automated Gun Systems
11 x 30mm BI M/C AA Cannons
32 x 20mm BI M/C AA Cannons
12 x 7-barrel 122mm Unguided ASuW Mortars
4 x 60-Cell M/P PVLS (240 LRSSM/LRSAM)
8 x 48-cell Sylver VLS (384 ASTER-15/30 SAM)
48 x Egap Anti-Ship Missiles
46 x 20mm Phalanx CIWS (AA/AM)
4 x 660mm Magazine Launched Torpedo Tubes (for Mk 48 ADCAP torps, mines, MHROVs, 80 to be carried)

Aircraft:
The Doujin Class is capable of carrying up to 160 aircraft on her two full-length flight decks.

Craft on the Doujin:
60 RF-37-2800 "Q"
60 RF-11D "Archangels"
10 C2-A Greyhounds
10 S3-C Vikings
10 AC-150 Tankers
10 ASW Sea King Helicopters

Systems:

APAR 12 Type B:
An incredibly advanced radar and computer system first developed for the Mackensen Class, it far surpasses the Aegis system on most other naval vessels. Powerful and flexible radar system that is comprised of four panels that each emit radar waves. If allowed by the horizon, the system can track out to 800 miles (1280 km) and can simultaneously track and identify up to 1392 targets at one time. The system controls missile launched from the long range missile launchers and the system track and guide each individual missile to a individual target for up to 476 targets. If a target is eliminated, missiles are automatically guided to a new target. The system can also control missiles launched from other linked vessels as well and can also act as fire control for gun mounts.

Both a upper-lateral anda lower-lateral array are fitted in order to ensure 360 degree coverage of the airborne theatre Two reserve arrays are also carried. Short-range AS18 Suites are installed to provide back CIWS guidance and close range tracking of multiple targets.

Advanced Hull Sonar (Adapted FT-SN22 Suite)
Mounted under the bow of the ship. Range of 25 miles (21.7 nm / 40.2 km). This hull sonar system has both a passive and active system built in, with the passive arrays also spread across the auxiallary hull flanks in order to ensure maximum sonar coverage. The Sonar system can track up to 48 targets at one time.

Advanced Towed Array Sonar System:
The system is basically a long and very sensitive sonar system carried behind the ship on a long cable. Range of 100 miles (86.9 nm / 160.9 km) in passive mode. This towed array sonar system has both a passive and active system built in. Sonar system can track up to 81 targets at one time.

Sonar Masking System:
The hull is designed to minimize noise from the hull and uses water bubbles to form a barrier against sonar as well.

Combination Radar Detectors and Active Jamming System:
Combination of radar detection systems (ESM) and an active jamming system. The system can detect another radar system at 125% of the range of the transmitting radar.

Command and Control Capabilities:
The Doujin Class Battleship was originally designed for Admiral Miller, Admiral in Chief of Doujin's Navy as his personal ship. The Flagship of the Doujin Navy, it's command and control facilities are extensive. It can track all Doujin Naval movements, and is directly connected with the GDnet Sattelite to provide real-time tracking of all Doujin ships. It is tied in with the defense systems along the Doujin coastline, and can effectively keep track of all enemy movements within sensor range of any Doujin vessel or defensive position. The Doujin Class battleship has more proccessing power than any other Battleship.

I must say that I have just viewed your website (and therefore, the Doujin) and would pay great gobs of cash just to have a tour of that enormous vessel. Name your price, and I shall pledge it up front.

There is no price, you may have a tour if you wish.

UPDATED DATA:

Doujin Class Battleship
Trimaran Super "Dreadnought"
©Copyright (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=40509&highlight=)

Like the other Doujin Navy vessels that are trimarans, the Doujin is very seaworthy and is a very steady gun platform. Even though many might consider that it would be hard to come up with an armor scheme that would give these three hulled ships a high level of protection, the Doujin class is very well armored and having three floating bodies makes the vessel harder to sink. In addition, the three hull design allows for a wider space for weapons, systems, and other vehicles than would be possible on a single hull design of about the same displacement.

The ship carries its powerful engines high in the primary hull which reduces the noise in the water greatly. While the ship is not as fast as was first thought and not as fast as the Trimaran destroyers or frigates, it is the fastest ship of its size ever constructed and on trial runs these huge ships have all exceeded 30 knots.

Like most of the Doujin Navy's larger ships, the Doujin Class has a sensor suite that is an improved version of the APAR 12 three-dimensional radar. This Phased Array radar system is more compact than the Aegis system used by most the modern world, and has greater tracking capabilities and range. The ship also has both a hull sonar system and a towed array sonar system.

The designers constructed the Doujin Class battleship using Radar Absorbent Materials extensively in the design. As a result, missiles using radar guidance to pinpoint locations on the Doujin have a decreased effectiveness. The Doujin also carries a powerful ECM system.

Model Type: BB-582 Class Battleship ( Doujin Class )
Crew: 7,250 (5,800 crewmen; 450 officers; 1000 military troops)
Speed: 32 knots maximum, 15 knots cruising
Range: Unlimited due to the Pebblebed nuclear reactor engines. Ship carriers six months of supplies and consumables on board.

Statistical Data:
Length: 981 meters (3266.7 feet)
Width: 350 meters (1166.55 feet)
Draft: 28 metres (98 feet) Empty, 32 metres (108 Feet) Full
Displacement:
Empty: 1,400,000 tons
Fully Loaded: 1,800,000 tons
Cargo: 28,000 tons of nonessential equipment and supplies. Each enlisted crew member has a
small locker for personal items and uniforms. Ships officers have more space for personal items. Most ship's spaces are taken up by extra ammo, armor, troops, weapons, and engines. Builders: Navarre Navy Shipyards (Division of Doujinshi Corporation, located in The Freethinkers)
Price: Not for sale.

Weapon Systems:
20 x 30" Electro-Thermal Naval Guns
12 x 8" Electro-Thermal Naval Guns
36 x 3? BI Automated Gun Systems
9 x 30mm BI M/C AA Cannons
20 x 20mm BI M/C AA Cannons
4x 60 Cell M/P PVLS
48 x Egap Anti-Ship Missiles
39 x 20mm/76 CIWS AA/Missile
4x 660mm Magazine Launched Torpedo Tubes (for Mk 48 ADCAP torps, mines, MHROVs, 80 to be carried)

Aircraft:
The Doujin Class is capable of carrying up to 160 aircraft on her two full-length flight decks.

Craft on the Doujin:
60 RF-37-2800 "Q"
60 RF-11D "Archangels"
10 C2-A Greyhounds
10 S3-C Vikings
10 AC-150 Tankers
10 ASW Sea King Helicopters

Systems:

APAR 12 Type B:
An incredibly advanced radar and computer system first developed for the Mackensen Class, it far surpasses the Aegis system on most other naval vessels. Powerful and flexible radar system that is comprised of four panels that each emit radar waves. If allowed by the horizon, the system can track out to 800 miles (1280 km) and can simultaneously track and identify up to 1392 targets at one time. The system controls missile launched from the long range missile launchers and the system track and guide each individual missile to a individual target for up to 476 targets. If a target is eliminated, missiles are automatically guided to a new target. The system can also control missiles launched from other linked vessels as well and can also act as fire control for gun mounts.

Both a upper-lateral anda lower-lateral array are fitted in order to ensure 360 degree coverage of the airborne theatre Two reserve arrays are also carried. Short-range AS18 Suites are installed to provide back CIWS guidance and close range tracking of multiple targets.

Advanced Hull Sonar (Adapted FT-SN22 Suite)
Mounted under the bow of the ship. Range of 25 miles (21.7 nm / 40.2 km). This hull sonar system has both a passive and active system built in, with the passive arrays also spread across the auxiallary hull flanks in order to ensure maximum sonar coverage. The Sonar system can track up to 48 targets at one time.

Advanced Towed Array Sonar System:
The system is basically a long and very sensitive sonar system carried behind the ship on a long cable. Range of 100 miles (86.9 nm / 160.9 km) in passive mode. This towed array sonar system has both a passive and active system built in. Sonar system can track up to 81 targets at one time.

Sonar Masking System:
The hull is designed to minimize noise from the hull and uses water bubbles to form a barrier against sonar as well.

Combination Radar Detectors and Active Jamming System:
Combination of radar detection systems (ESM) and an active jamming system. The system can detect another radar system at 125% of the range of the transmitting radar.

Command and Control Capabilities:
The Doujin Class Battleship was originally designed for Admiral Miller, Admiral in Chief of Doujin's Navy as his personal ship. The Flagship of the Doujin Navy, it's command and control facilities are extensive. It can track all Doujin Naval movements, and is directly connected with the GDnet Sattelite to provide real-time tracking of all Doujin ships. It is tied in with the defense systems along the Doujin coastline, and can effectively keep track of all enemy movements within sensor range of any Doujin vessel or defensive position. The Doujin Class battleship has more proccessing power than any other Battleship.

:arrow: :!: :arrow:

when it's on sale, i'd like to post a pre order for 2! DAMN THOSE THING ARE HUGE!!! I LOVE THEM :D

When I have enough money, I will purchase one.

We would love to have a tour...Admiral Gately is still in Doujin I believe, but I'm very behind on the conferences...(TZP here)

And with 160 aircraft, it's not much of a target, especially when used in the defense scheme I've planned for it.

lets sing the huge floating target song now

The Izistani goverment expresses wonder at this amazing ship.

lets all sing the "have you got a big enough gun" song instead, shall we :wink:

No one will be purchasing, as you can see on the Doujin's page in my storefront.. it is listed as "Not for Sale". Only one will be built.

Stupid question:

Can I have the production rights to make one for myself? :)

The Artitsan's have a massive amount of experience in Shipwright and construction of sea vessels. If you would allow, we would be more then willing to assist in the creation of several pieces, maybe the turrets or even the VLS systems. Believe me, we have experience in these fields. Only stipulation is, we would like to build one for ourselves afterwards. We will pay handsomly. Think of it, free construction, and we PAY you.

OCC: If I wasn't a future tech nation, I'd definatly be interested in one of those monsters. Super-dreadnaught is an understatement. So is "large, slow moving target" for that matter.

lets all sing the "have you got a big enough gun" song instead, shall we :wink:

Let's sing the "We can pelt it with bombs and torpedos and shells and missiles" song. :p

You know, or a direct nuke hit should mess it up pretty badly, then again I am without nukes...

Or you could swarm it.

Artitsa, the guns and systems are in place.. just minor internal work.. then system checks ..and all that stuff, "pre-launch" procedures that we do.

Artitsa, the guns and systems are in place.. just minor internal work.. then system checks ..and all that stuff, "pre-launch" procedures that we do.

So... are you saying No Dice? Cause that hurts mang.

PS. I HATE THESE FORUMS. HOW MANY TIMES MUST I PRESS SUBMIT!!

Yes I am and Yes the forums suck.

Yes I am and Yes the forums suck.

Ouch mang. Could we... get the designs... or I can always make my own... without the guns... and thousands upon thousands of VLS tubes... :twisted:

Yes, and you can also spend a million dollars per missile, while I have the power equiivalant of a tactical nuke at a much cheaper price with a long range of 500km ish (Depending on the shell used, normal range is lower)

Well then... how would you like to buy some Artitsan made Scramjet Naval rounds? Just ask the round size and we can give you discounts for bulk and factory direct. Just like our missiles which cost us next to nothing to make ;)

We already have SJR/RR, thank you for the offer, however Artitsa :)

(You are one of the more promising nations I have seen as of late. Good work.)

GAT DANG IT! Im trying to make a little cash on the side without resorting to making a storefront. Would you be interested in a TAMD Mk II? I can give you stats and such. They are very popular. I use them to great effect, infact I have been able to reduce fleets to 5 ships- 2 Super Medjved Battleships, and 3 TAMD Mk II's.

If it calls for alot of firepower, add on 4 Medjved's and 14 TAMD's ;)

Sorry Artitsa ;)

Between you and me, IE THIS IS NOW OUT OF CHARACTER, what are the sinking points. Is it broken into compartments so it can take on a certain amount of water or what? How many CM's do you think it would take to bring down that monster. Or should people just stockpile thermonuclear weapons?

Awww....poor Artista...come on Doujin, he is trying :)

lol artitsa.

Jim, check your email.

Like all good battleships she is compartmentalised. There are details soemwhere on various levels of armour and strutural intergrity.

I would consider developing a very well armoured naval platform forsimilar sized guns ;)

Oh btw, Doujin, Im not too bothered if you let the Leviathan go on common sale now.

Can't get a break can I...

Would you be willing to assist me in creating a rapid response destroyer/cruiser? or just a plain cruiser? Mine grow old, and I tire of them.

Could always just buy something I have already, but that could be aranged i guess

I also prefere my own, you get what you want. But thats for the customer who knows what they want. Plus I use more eastern bloc systems and missiles. So yeah can you contact me on either AIM or MSN:
KoRnSOAD4 for AIM
and booze_hound6969@hotmail.com.

Sucha childish name, I REALLY need to change my email. :lol:

Oh and for incentive, we will be paying several billion for your troubles.

i cant wait till this ship is built so i can see if i can take it out

If you wish to spark a war between me and my allies then that is fine.

the ship is such a big target that it is just itching to be taken out

Your choice.

Freethinkers: that is one beautiful boat.

Hats off to you & doujin for taking something like this and justifying it.

Ouch mang. Could we... get the designs... or I can always make my own... without the guns... and thousands upon thousands of VLS tubes... :twisted:

One 500lb bomb on the lid of them might just make them catch fire and go off, wouldn't be pretty.

The Federation of Wetland has been following the events around your new battleship with great interest. We already tried to get in to the naval conference you were hosting, but we were refused. We hope that this time you will allow us to send a representative for the tour on your new ship.

President Janus Hollander
Federation of Wetland

Is a ship that size even possible? One of its gun turrets are almost as big as an Iowa class battleship.

Yes, Welsh Kingdoms, it is.

It is possible, with extensive work on the rame and the use of good, high quality materials :D

There is a reason this thing cost the best part of $150 billion to build, and 25 odd years to build.

It is possible, with extensive work on the rame and the use of good, high quality materials :D

There is a reason this thing cost the best part of $150 billion to build, and 25 odd years to build.

id go with thatbut maybe nly 20 years to build

:arrow: :!: :arrow:

bump

TAG

>>bUmP<<

The Federation of Wetland has been following the events around your new battleship with great interest. We already tried to get in to the naval conference you were hosting, but we were refused. We hope that this time you will allow us to send a representative for the tour on your new ship.
We sent this a while back but have not yet received a response. We would like to repeat it now and hope that you will look on our request with favor.

President Janus Hollander
Federation of Wetland

Ah, sorry. Yes, you can have a tour of the ship as soon as she is released from Dry Dock.

Thank you.

You are welcome :)

Bump

No disrespect for a ship of that size, but, don't the turrets seem a bit overkill? One half that size could knock anything out I think, surely you could put more turrets of useful size on and have a better ship?
doesn't stop me wanting one though.

16" shells don't do as much damage as you believe. One broadside from the Doujin to, for example, an Iowa Class Battleship would completely rip the Iowa Class apart (The Iowa would be on the receiving end of about the same amount of damage as a tactical nuke). The Guns also make up for it's lack of being able to get incredibly close to shore.

ONE shell would pprobably sink an Iowa, if not completely disable it. A broadside would probably wreck an entire battlegroup.

No disrespect for a ship of that size, but, don't the turrets seem a bit overkill? One half that size could knock anything out I think, surely you could put more turrets of useful size on and have a better ship?
doesn't stop me wanting one though.
This is designed for engaging major shore installations and large battleships. Battleships are quite resilient, far more so than many people think. They are especially resistant to missiles and gunfire, and while these can render them combat ineffective when delivered in sufficient quantities, what it actually takes to sink a battleship is extreme. The Doujin wants to take a battleship out, completely, with one salvo.

16" shells don't do as much damage as you believe. One broadside from the Doujin to, for example, an Iowa Class Battleship would completely rip the Iowa Class apart (The Iowa would be on the receiving end of about the same amount of damage as a tactical nuke). The Guns also make up for it's lack of being able to get incredibly close to shore.
Actually, that's a bit of an overstatement. A full broadside from this vessel is nothing compared to a tactical nuke, even with total damage being considered. In explosive power, it would be equivalent to the bomb load of one or two heavy bombers, not much more.

Each shell delivers about 36,000 lbs of explosiver power. All together that is 720,000 lbs of explosive power, or about 3,300 metric tons of TNT.

Now, a tactical nuke varies, of course.. with the smallest being, what artillery? at 500 tons... but it stays in the low thousands. Of course, the Doujin is different as its spreads the explosive force out, with 20 different points of explosive contact. In total explosive output, then yes - it would be equal to a small tactical nuke. The targeted area, however, would look as if twenty very large bombs have been dropped.

Each shell delivers about 36,000 lbs of explosiver power. All together that is 720,000 lbs of explosive power, or about 3,300 metric tons of TNT.

Now, a tactical nuke varies, of course.. with the smallest being, what artillery? at 500 tons... but it stays in the low thousands. Of course, the Doujin is different as its spreads the explosive force out, with 20 different points of explosive contact. In total explosive output, then yes - it would be equal to a small tactical nuke. The targeted area, however, would look as if twenty very large bombs have been dropped.
That sounds like assuming that the entire weight of the shell is in explosive. The total shell will likely weigh in the range of 20-25,000 lbs (shouldn't be much larger for practical reasons). However, you have to account for the shell case and fuze, as well as the explosive filler. Since this is not a simple demolition charge, but a penetrating warhead (well, unless you're stupid enough to think a demolition charge would hurt a battleship . . . ), a good portion of the shell's weight will go into a casing needed for penetration and fragmentation. This leaves maybe 30% of the total shell weight for a bursting charge, and considering past naval rounds, that's quite generous. Even accounting for the disparity between modern explosive fillers and TNT, this shouldn't have more than 60%, of the shell weight in explosive power. And again, that's being quite generous. Look into other shells, and you'll see that I could say it should be less than half that and still be quite accurate.

My initial calculations were off a bit, so I'll revise it to about 2-5 heavy bombers, depending on type. Max of 0.136 kilotons. There may be nuclear weapons in that class, but that is well below the category of "tactical nuke," which, depending on the source, will either refer to weapons in the class of the original A-Bombs (5-25 kilotons, which is what I was thinking of), or smaller 1-5 kiloton weapons. Sub-kiloton weapons are known as micro-nukes.


edit: Btw. Your calcs were off too. 720,000 lbs can't possibly equal 3.3 million kilograms. Try knocking off a few zeroes.
720,000 lbs is 326,530.6 kg. 1 metric ton is 1000 kg. Even your caculations should come up with a sub-kiloton yield of 326.5 metric tons, or .3265 kilotons.

OOC: Haha, those ships are waiting to be sunk.. lol. All is would take is some heavy bombers with decent air cover, a jet packed with high explosive flying at mach-3 into the side of it, or like said before, a tactical nuke. In taking that ship out, the chances are you would have lost alot more money than I would have (if it was my missile, bomb, plane, or whatever that destroyed it). I am not doubting the 'strength' of battleships, I just think that this one in particular is a big waste of time and money.

Maybe in your mind, Dancing Moose.. and if you think a single jet packed with high explosives flying at mach 3 is going to do the job (basically a cruise missile, Dancing Moose.. as that is what early cruise missiles were. (aka Japanese Kamikazes)) then you need to get a reality check.

Lol, except cruise dont go mach 3. If the ship got hit in the right spot, then the ship would take some moderate-high level damage. However, I probably wouldnt go for this strategy due to a low sucess rate. To help balance the battleship technology in NS, me and Shinoxia have developed two primary and one backup measures of technology that would ensure the fate of these ships. We will make a thread indicating what these are probably tomorrow, and I will provide you with a link, Doujin, if you wish.

Also, I dont really need a reality check, as I was not the one to spend, what, 80-100 billion on a ship? Lol, everyone is entitled to there opinion, my friend.

Actually, the Russian cruise missiles this thing was built in mind to basically resist are hypersonic cruise missiles.

And, of course, using nuclear weapons justifies their general use in retaliation. Such is a slippery slope that we dont want to go down.

And what bomber pilot is gonna gladly take up a mission that will basically see him fly against a ship that carries roughly 150 odd anti-aircraft weapons as well as hundreds of the most advanced SAMs avaliable and with its own and its battlegroup airwings, safe in the knowledge that his weapons will cause only perpiheral damage if any at all. Wow, I admire the bravary of your pilots. Believe me, you may have more kamikazes than you bargained for.

It would far impact the loss of that ship upon your people due to the use of nuclear weapons than it would if you used them on my battleships (lol take a second, youll get it).

Getting a pilot to give his life to take down that one ship isnt a problem. Also, I dont think CIWS or other anti-aircraft batteries would be able to shoot something going mach 3 down buddy.

Like I said, our newly developed technology will soon be introduced.

Getting one pilot to lay down his life isnt a problem. Getting hundreds to do the same, with no garauntee of success...is somewhat more difficult. You would need, assuming the Doujin was in battlegroup, probably no less than a thousand aircraft in the combat theatre immediately surrounding the Doujin.

And, yes, I get the Doujin comment. But having two nuclear or more nuclear powers retaliating in full for one of your nuclear strikes would not benefit you all that much.

And this new technology sounds interesting. I hope its something more than a deep penetration cruise missile or something else equally daft.

Dude it wouldnt take a thousand jets packed with high explosive to sink that ship. To induce a good expected amount of damage on the ship (if not sinking it) would be to send 50 planes or less to kamakaze into it.

In a few minutes Shinoxia will make the new technology thread, except it will be in an RPed 'secret' form to ensure it wont be copied or responded to.

50 kamikaze pilots are not going to be found, and if they are.. then your Air Force is full of idiots. Lose their family and friends just to "try" to blow up a ship..

Even at mach three, the best hope you have is to penetrate the outer hull and penetrate two interior bulkheads, assuming the planes are reinforced enough to withstand the initial contact - which they probably are not..
and this is also assuming that you make it through without having any aircraft shot down. In reality, you are looking at two hundred planes or more planes to reduce the Doujin to an inoperable hulk, and thats excluding combat losses.


Battleships are quite resilient, far more so than many people think. They are especially resistant to missiles and gunfire, and while these can render them combat ineffective when delivered in sufficient quantities, what it actually takes to sink a battleship is extreme.


FYI Dancing Moose, the first "cruise missiles" were Kamikaze planes.

50 kamikaze pilots are not going to be found, and if they are.. then your Air Force is full of idiots. Lose their family and friends just to "try" to blow up a ship..

Sure I can, you have no right to tell me what I am capable of. They would not be idiots. To induce damage upon your 'invincible' battleship (as you portray it) would be a miracle. Men would gladly give there lives for this. Like the Japanese, only unmarried men usually flew kamakaze missions.

Even at mach three, the best hope you have is to penetrate the outer hull and penetrate two interior bulkheads, assuming the planes are reinforced enough to withstand the initial contact - which they probably are not..

Not if I hit it on the deck, or upper superstructure. You are highly underestimating the speed of Mach 3. At times three the speed of sound, that plane would not only dent that certain amount of armor where it hit, the high explosive would ensure damage, much less a hole. Your ship is not invincible Doujin, and you seem to be saying that no possible projectile or bomb could cause damage to this ship, unless you hit it in the same spot like 50 times, lol.

and this is also assuming that you make it through without having any aircraft shot down. In reality, you are looking at two hundred planes or more planes to reduce the Doujin to an inoperable hulk, and thats excluding combat losses.

I could send it how ever many escort planes it could possibly take to get the kamakaze's past CAP, but still, it is pretty much impossible to shoot something at Mach 3.


Battleships are quite resilient, far more so than many people think. They are especially resistant to missiles and gunfire, and while these can render them combat ineffective when delivered in sufficient quantities, what it actually takes to sink a battleship is extreme.


FYI Dancing Moose, the first "cruise missiles" were Kamikaze planes.

Im not saying all battleships are bad, in fact they are quite resilient in battle than any other surface ships to a certain extent. All I am saying is that I believe your battleship in particular is a huge waste of time and money, given the original purpose of 'an all big gunned ship'.

50 kamikaze pilots are not going to be found, and if they are.. then your Air Force is full of idiots. Lose their family and friends just to "try" to blow up a ship..

Sure I can, you have no right to tell me what I am capable of. They would not be idiots. To induce damage upon your 'invincible' battleship (as you portray it) would be a miracle. Men would gladly give there lives for this. Like the Japanese, only unmarried men usually flew kamakaze missions.

Even at mach three, the best hope you have is to penetrate the outer hull and penetrate two interior bulkheads, assuming the planes are reinforced enough to withstand the initial contact - which they probably are not..

Not if I hit it on the deck, or upper superstructure. You are highly underestimating the speed of Mach 3. At times three the speed of sound, that plane would not only dent that certain amount of armor where it hit, the high explosive would ensure damage, much less a hole. Your ship is not invincible Doujin, and you seem to be saying that no possible projectile or bomb could cause damage to this ship, unless you hit it in the same spot like 50 times, lol.

and this is also assuming that you make it through without having any aircraft shot down. In reality, you are looking at two hundred planes or more planes to reduce the Doujin to an inoperable hulk, and thats excluding combat losses.

I could send it how ever many escort planes it could possibly take to get the kamakaze's past CAP, but still, it is pretty much impossible to shoot something at Mach 3.


Battleships are quite resilient, far more so than many people think. They are especially resistant to missiles and gunfire, and while these can render them combat ineffective when delivered in sufficient quantities, what it actually takes to sink a battleship is extreme.


FYI Dancing Moose, the first "cruise missiles" were Kamikaze planes.

Im not saying all battleships are bad, in fact they are quite resilient in battle than any other surface ships to a certain extent. All I am saying is that I believe your battleship in particular is a huge waste of time and money, given the original purpose of 'an all big gunned ship'.

OOC:
"What counts is not necessarily the size of the dog in the fight - it's the size of the fight in the dog."

Beautiful ship Doujin, but power projection and psychological warfare has become less effective in the NationStates world it seems, as leaders assume that reason comes before fear.

I also came here to tell you that, the gigantic airforce my country had, the Iron Falcon, was disbanded and the aircraft locked in high security hangars, all 350,000 aircraft, including attrition replacements, reserves, etc.

I decided that my country should turn to pacifism, as communists are being persecuted in a witchhunt. I want to improve the relationship between communists and anti-communists, to bring peace. I can't do that holding a gun, can I? Surely not.

The Free Land of Clan Smoke Jaguar
Received: 6 hours ago Q: How many aircraft traveling at mach 2.5+ and packed with high explosives would it take to completely disable the Doujin?

A: It really can't be done. The protection level is too high, and that method is guaranteed to be useless in disabling propulsion or main guns. Many secondary weapons will also be unaffected, and the flight decks are long enough to launch and recover many kinds of aircraft even if arrester wires and catapults are offline, though that could be stopped if the elevators are knocked out.
In the end, damage is based entirely on where they strike, but the technique was never effective against armrored vessels, as the Japanese discovered.
With a battlegroup, you could lose a few thousand just trying to break through defenses. Expect a failure rate of well over 95-100%, maybe a bit lower with sea-skimming.

(Sorry if you don't like people posting Telegrams, Clan Smoke Jaguar.)