NationStates Jolt Archive

Are you Stalinist, Marxist or Leninist? Please vote.

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Actually, Im Kropotkinist.

OOC: HINT- Karl Marx was Socialist, no matter what stalin said. Read his work, then you'll know.

Another hint: Stalin was no communist, he was a dictator. To be more precise, the Soviet-Union was a dictatorship (However, I'm not sure about the first years after the revolution.).

BTW, I'm not a communist, but I do know some communists in RL.

(Does this topic belong in the International Incidents forum?)

I believe that this is an IC question. And yes, the Soviet Union was a communist dictatorship.

Was it Marx that said "Workers of the world unite, you have nothing to lose but your chains"?

Was it Marx that said "Workers of the world unite, you have nothing to lose but your chains"?
Yes, it is. The full quote is, "The workers have nothing but their chains to lose in this. They have a world to win. Workers of the world, unite!" It comes at the end of the Communist Manifesto.

Tiborita, you have even not quoted it correctly. The exact ending of the Manifesto is:

"The Communists disdain to conceal their views and aims. They openly declare that their ends can be attained only by the forcible overthrow of all existing social conditions. Let the ruling classes tremble at a communist revolution. The proletarians have nothing to lose but their chains. They have a world to win. Workers of all countries, unite!"

What about Maoists, Engelists and other Forms of Socialism not quite as well known?
Also, Communism was NOT what Marx was striving for. Socialism is. There are differences between the two, if subtle and hard to notice. Ironically, perhaps, Socialism was openly aggressive, but the idea behind communism was a less agressive approach to socialism........ though ultimately, that didn't happen.

Exactly, which is why I said I was Kropotkinist.

"All workers are paid due to their effectiveness in society"

Therefore, an excellent farmer with excellent crops and cattle could earn more than a doctor who is not doing his job correctly - the harder workers get the better rewards.

What about Menshevism? Or Engelism? Or American Democratism?

All petty prejudice.

The United Communist States of Zvarinograd believes in pacifist communism. Rather than a struggle, a conflict with bloodshed, there is passive resistance. We believe in global disarmament, diplomacy over war, and peace between communist/socialists and those who persecute or conflict with our ideology.

United Communist States of Zvarinograd

OOC:
Question not people's ideals, for you have your own to be questioned. There is no true path, but to seek a path.

Although my nation is for some reason turning capitalist (Stupid issues...), my leader is turning to socialist issues...

But i'd say he's a proper socialist. we don't act facist in communist clothing, nor do we build mountains of nukes when somone threatens us. We like our economy stable.

actually i consider myself an advanced communist. i beleive in communism only when it is done to the full extent, which can never happen, so communism will never work, so because of that im a conservative

a paper on communism i did a half ass job on: http://www.laogaming.com/images/russ/com.html

Exactly, which is why I said I was Kropotkinist.

"All workers are paid due to their effectiveness in society"

Therefore, an excellent farmer with excellent crops and cattle could earn more than a doctor who is not doing his job correctly - the harder workers get the better rewards.


so you are capitalist in a way

i'm Maoist

I'm a Marxist basically, but can turn into a capitalist in several situations.

No , thats only one part of Kropotkinism. Its Socialism, not communism, and everything is communally owned.

The Farmer doesnt own his farm, the community owns his farm and a set amount of his income goes to public works etc etc.

You cant be Maoist, but then turn capitalist. That doesnt work.

The PRC is strictly Maoist you revisionist pigs!

Marxism is the only true idiology! The Democtatic People's Republic of Amazonica is a 123% Groucho Marxist nation.

http://www.willamette.edu/~jgreenep/Marx%20Brothers%20copy.jpg

Exactly, which is why I said I was Kropotkinist.

"All workers are paid due to their effectiveness in society"

Therefore, an excellent farmer with excellent crops and cattle could earn more than a doctor who is not doing his job correctly - the harder workers get the better rewards.


so you are capitalist in a way
hardly-capitalism palces emphaiss on ownership of the means of production as being something that somehow trnasforms the owner into a more intelligent, morally superior, individual who somehow deserves to amke alot of money off the backs of mere humans. :roll: and Roania, liberal-democracy (what you cal american democratism for some reason) is an oxymoron.

Well Marx was a lunatic, in fact despite the fact that stalin was completely insane, Stalinism was better then marxism. For instance marxism and leninism had no place for womens rights. In fact they had mass deflowerings where they would line up thousands of women and have the red army deflower them. Modern Equal rights idea of communism ie everyone is a comrade/equal is from Stalin. One good thing he did for communism. Otherwise he was a bloody genocidal lunatic who's name is rightfully reviled lol

Well Marx was a lunatic, in fact despite the fact that stalin was completely insane, Stalinism was better then marxism. For instance marxism and leninism had no place for womens rights. In fact they had mass deflowerings where they would line up thousands of women and have the red army deflower them. Modern Equal rights idea of communism ie everyone is a comrade/equal is from Stalin. One good thing he did for communism. Otherwise he was a bloody genocidal lunatic who's name is rightfully reviled lol

You forgett to tell that the black homosexuall communists eat babys in the backyards. :D

You forgot to mention that unless Amazonica STFU then ill eat his nation and be fatter :P

And Kropotkinism isnt Capitalism, because if it was the Doctor would be still earning more because he has a "Higher Place in Society" Than the farmer, even if the farmer does more for the community.

Stalin was a brutal dictator who killed 20 million people. Maybe you don't know this but he also killed anyone that was not a communist and left their heads to rot on the streets of Russia. He also set up Gulag's or now known as consecration camps. He also made alliances with Hitler and went along with the guy until Hitler went against him. He also mocked his wife so badly she killed herself. Also When Lenin was having a stroke he was asked to be Lenin's voice in the party. Stalin did the opposite and used that power for his own political gain. So how can anyone admire a scumbag like that. He is no hero.

You forgot to mention that unless Amazonica STFU then ill eat his nation and be fatter :P

And Kropotkinism isnt Capitalism, because if it was the Doctor would be still earning more because he has a "Higher Place in Society" Than the farmer, even if the farmer does more for the community.

You can never silence the voice of the people, but what makes you think Kropotkinism is capitalism? I don't want to call you names but if you insist that Kropotkinism and Robbery are the same I have to!

I'm a Modern Marxist

Who do you prefere Groucho or Karl?

You forgot to mention that unless Amazonica STFU then ill eat his nation and be fatter :P

And Kropotkinism isnt Capitalism, because if it was the Doctor would be still earning more because he has a "Higher Place in Society" Than the farmer, even if the farmer does more for the community.

You can never silence the voice of the people, but what makes you think Kropotkinism is capitalism? I don't want to call you names but if you insist that Kropotkinism and Robbery are the same I have to!


Uh.... I didnt insist anything such. I AM Kropotkinist, and I AM Socialist...

And I can very easily silence the voice of your people. 8) We in the PSRH Call it Iron Fist Socialism :P

OOC:
Amazonica, where'd you get that picture of the Marx brothers?

FYI:

Marx Brothers,
U.S. comedy team whose main members were Groucho (Julius; 1895 - 1977), Harpo (Arthur; 1893 - 1964), Chico (Leonard; 1891 - 1961), Gummo (Milton; 1892 - 1961) left the team after their vaudeville days, and Zeppo (Herbert; 1901 - 1978) left in 1934. The Marx brothers made about a dozen movies (1933 -1946), Their anarchic humor made hits of such memorable movies such as Duck Soup and A Night at the Opera. They're completely irrelevant to Marxism, aside from the fact that they have the same name, Marx.

We're social democrats, our party in charge(currently) is like a more liberal/modern version of the Russian Menshevik party.

You forgot to mention that unless Amazonica STFU then ill eat his nation and be fatter :P

And Kropotkinism isnt Capitalism, because if it was the Doctor would be still earning more because he has a "Higher Place in Society" Than the farmer, even if the farmer does more for the community.

You can never silence the voice of the people, but what makes you think Kropotkinism is capitalism? I don't want to call you names but if you insist that Kropotkinism and Robbery are the same I have to!


Uh.... I didnt insist anything such. I AM Kropotkinist, and I AM Socialist...

And I can very easily silence the voice of your people. 8) We in the PSRH Call it Iron Fist Socialism :P

If that is so that's fine with me. Kropotkinists have our respect, and I might remind you that your crappy third world nation is in a middle of a civil war, our tanks would easiely crush your pikemen and lance riders!

Rufus T. Firefly

Miniter of everything

OOC:
Amazonica, where'd you get that picture of the Marx brothers?

We're not Communists at all. Such filth is an insult to humanity.

go away

Stalin was a brutal, corrupt leader who would not hesitate to murder anyone who appeared to be opposed to his rule. Not even a Russian.

Lenin was a fiery revolutionary who set Russia down a corrupt, ideologically inane Communist path that would lead to its enventual collapse

Karl Marx made a good theory based on the time he was living in that people would be underpaid and not be able to afford the goods being produced resulting in a spiral of loss of profit that would result in sustinence farming, but it never materialized due his failure to account for little things like sales, and off-brand goods. The man was smart and the Russians liked his ideas of a utopia as compared to the grimy, poor fledgling capitolist nations of the west.

Right... Amazonica your starting to forget the fact im NOT a third world nation -

Hogsweat is a massive, economically powerful nation, remarkable for its devotion to social welfare.

Ive probably got more Nuclear/ICBM/Strategic/Biological/Chemical Missiles than you have Men

-but it concentrates mainly on Defence,

- Crime is totally unknown, thanks to the all-pervasive police force and progressive social policies in education and welfare.

-You have a popn of 18 Million - I, on the other hand, have 1.165.
Making my military, which is fully modern, at least 5 times the size of yours.

-If you dont STFU NOW then you'll die...

-If you dont STFU NOW then you'll die...

Why must you people always use this type of language to get your points across? Are you really that Uncertain of yourselves that you feel the only way people will listen to you is by being violent?

No... although... If Amazonica continues on threatening Many times bigger than him, then he will ahve to learn alot in the NS world.

And what does "you people" mean?

And what does "you people" mean?

You people= Left-Wing, Loud Minority, intolerable pests. any more labels you want me to say?

Why must you people always use this type of language to get your points across? Are you really that Uncertain of yourselves that you feel the only way people will listen to you is by being violent?

- I can't say I blame him. Amazonica is spouting so much moronic bullsh*t, that you'd think a marxist once stole his girlfriend ;)

And while the soviet union was a closer to a fascist dictatorship than to socialism, a lot of the things he states is simply not true.

/NA

Thank you NA. Your right about Amazonica, he should stop spouting BS.

Why must you people always use this type of language to get your points across? Are you really that Uncertain of yourselves that you feel the only way people will listen to you is by being violent?

- I can't say I blame him. Amazonica is spouting so much moronic bullsh*t, that you'd think a marxist once stole his girlfriend ;)

And while the soviet union was a closer to a fascist dictatorship than to socialism, a lot of the things he states is simply not true.

/NA

Well and what was that, if you allow me that question?

OOC:
Amazonica, where'd you get that picture of the Marx brothers?

From here: Propaganda Art (http://www.willamette.edu/~jgreenep/art.htm)

Why must you people always use this type of language to get your points across? Are you really that Uncertain of yourselves that you feel the only way people will listen to you is by being violent?

- I can't say I blame him. Amazonica is spouting so much moronic bullsh*t, that you'd think a marxist once stole his girlfriend ;)

And while the soviet union was a closer to a fascist dictatorship than to socialism, a lot of the things he states is simply not true.

/NA

Well and what was that, if you allow me that question?

The BS? Mainly because you called me a "third world country" and you said you would kick my ass...

Hold it!
You posted that I should STFU or you would eat my nation and be fatter! That is how it started. So I had no other choice but to call you names! Due to the missing apostrophe I misread isnt as is and thought you are calling Kropotkinism and Capitalism the same thing which you didn't. But the one who starded threatening an other nation was you!

Maybe... but you have to find the difference between an insult and calling somebody "third world". I apologise for my statements, and I hope you do the same.

Ohh yes and I am pleased to do so!