NationStates Jolt Archive

Reporter: "Good evening citizens of Rotovia and members of the international community. The Senate of Rotovia has finally met after months of delays, believed to be the result of the recent Supreme Court ruling which denied 'human rights' to Rotovia's Elven populace.

It was ruled that the phrase 'sentient' in the Decree of Rotovian Rights was to be defined soley by the Sentient Rights Act, which provided a clear and undispuable definition extending only to Humans and Nekos.

However, today the Senate will no doubt be locked in intense discussions over whether or not to amend the act to include Elves. This will be a long and ar...

We'll no cross live to the Senate Room where the Speaker of the House has yeilded the floor to our President..."

-------------------------------------

President: "Honourable Senators, we are all well aware of why we are here. And why we delayed so long to be here."

Senator: "Yeah, because someone started letting animals into Parliment"

Nekos Senator: "Are you insinuating I'm some kind of animal Senator?!"

Senator: "Implying?! Your are a bloody animal"

Speaker: "I warn the Member for Neopolis that racial slurs will not be tolerated. Neither will speaking out of turn. Mr President, if you will"

President: "I am going to plave a motion on the floor, infront of all of you is the Sentient Rights Act, Amended. I place the rights of these poeple in your hands."

Senator: "People?! Ha!"

Senator2: "Of Course they are people. My gardener is Elven..."

Senator: "So? Now anything that can yank weeds is sentient? I saw a monkey do that on the Discovery Channel. Is the monkey sentient now Alice?"

Senator: "Of course not, but...."

---------------------------

Reporter: "It looks as though this will be one Senate Session not soon forgotten. We'll be right back after a word from our sponsers.."

For background go here: http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=121407&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

"Well... better start warming up the transports for when the exodus starts..." Lord Tian said softly to himself, being half elven himself. "If they even allow them to leave."

President was about to ok the attack when he herd of this meeting.
"Commander delay that mission until we hear what happens in this meeting. It will prove to be most intriguing."
With this the great waiting game had begun.

"Well... better start warming up the transports for when the exodus starts..." Lord Tian said softly to himself, being half elven himself. "If they even allow them to leave."
OOC: Well considering they don't have passports...

President was about to ok the attack when he herd of this meeting.
"Commander delay that mission until we hear what happens in this meeting. It will prove to be most intriguing."
With this the great waiting game had begun.
OOC: I do believe I metnioned this "meeting" in the other thread.

For a long time Rotovia and the ANL have been close allies. So, as a friend to a friend, I implore the government to give Elvens human rights because they are living things and like human, have inalienable rights. How would us humans like it if the tables were turned. I would assume not very much. It is time we moved above racism and distcrimination and embrace all and value each other for our differences and our abbility to improve society. If Elvens are given human rights, than I will see that our relations are even more stronger.

May peace and prosperity be on the people and nation of Rotovia forever.

Your friends,
The Leaders Democrartic Socialist Union of The Aztec National League

The below signed approve of elvens reciving human rights:
-Premier Quetzalcoatl
-Viceroy Coyotepec
-Dr. Daruis Wellington, Minister of Foriegn Affairs
-Dario Luis Hernandez, Minister of Heatlh, Education and Social Welfare
-Warrior General Tlanextic, Minister of War
-Teouhitclan, Minister of the Environment
-Jorge Arroyo, Chief Soviet Congressman
-John Kirkland, Chief Represenative

For a long time Rotovia and the ANL have been close allies. So, as a friend to a friend, I implore the government to give Elvens human rights because they are living things and like human, have inalienable rights. How would us humans like it if the tables were turned. I would assume not very much. It is time we moved above racism and distcrimination and embrace all and value each other for our differences and our abbility to improve society. If Elvens are given human rights, than I will see that our relations are even more stronger.

May peace and prosperity be on the people and nation of Rotovia forever.

Your friends,
The Leaders Democrartic Socialist Union of The Aztec National League

The below signed approve of elvens reciving human rights:
-Premier Quetzalcoatl
-Viceroy Coyotepec
-Dr. Daruis Wellington, Minister of Foriegn Affairs
-Dario Luis Hernandez, Minister of Heatlh, Education and Social Welfare
-Warrior General Tlanextic, Minister of War
-Teouhitclan, Minister of the Environment
-Jorge Arroyo, Chief Soviet Congressman
-John Kirkland, Chief Represenative
"We thank our great and loyal ally, but this is a matter that must be handled by our democractically elected body"

-Pres Release

Reporter: "We cross back over live to our exculsive coverage of the Rotovian Senate Session..."

-----------------

Vice President: "I think what we should be focusing on is wheter or not Elven persons are sentient, and if so should they receive the same rights as granted to Humans and Nekos"

Senator2: "Why are we even discussing this? It's quite clear they are sentient..."

Senator3: "Says you..."

President: "Says medical science, look at the reports in your hands it's an undeniable fact"

Senator: "So is Human superiority!"

Scattered cheers.

President: "Oh, like white superiority?"

Senator: "Of course not... "

Reporter: "We cross back over live to our exculsive coverage of the Rotovian Senate Session..."

-----------------

Vice President: "I think what we should be focusing on is wheter or not Elven persons are sentient, and if so should they receive the same rights as granted to Humans and Nekos"

Senator2: "Why are we even discussing this? It's quite clear they are sentient..."

Senator3: "Says you..."

President: "Says medical science, look at the reports in your hands it's an undeniable fact"

Senator: "So is Human superiority!"

Scattered cheers.

President: "Oh, like white superiority?"

Senator: "Of course not... "

Bump, perhaps?

The President of Manoko brushed her long hair back revealing long pinty ears.
"As you may have noticed, I consider this a travesty, we consider ourselves no better or worse then yourselves and wish the same treatment likewise."

Dyelli Beybi is proud to announce it is 100% Elf-free. We never had any Elves. Pointy-eared funny creatures that look a bit like humans but more effeminate have been analysed in depth by scientists and decided to actually be a form of shrub, found to be highly combustable, it is ideal as kindling.

The President of Manoko brushed her long hair back revealing long pinty ears.
"As you may have noticed, I consider this a travesty, we consider ourselves no better or worse then yourselves and wish the same treatment likewise."
"For the purpose of this session your personnel beliefe is irrelivant, I may believe myself a deity, should you treat me as such. The Senate is currently debating wether, in Rotovia, Elves shall be considered sentient under the law."

-Attorney General's Office

{Tag; For Intelligence Purposes}

{Tag; For Intelligence Purposes}
That is vaguely disconcerting.

lalala bumpa

Reporter: "Good evening and thank you tuning in. The Senate is now adjourned for lunch. However and invitation has been extended to any nations with an intrest in this matter to speak when they return, either in person or via electronic hook up..."

CorpSac is wanting to speak, tell us when

If the elves cannot speak their own voice in a society, then they are obviouslly not sentient.

- Sovy K.

CorpSac is wanting to speak, tell us when
"The Senate has returned to Session. Your delegate has been assigned as the first speaker. Will you be using a sattilite link, or do you have a diplmat in Rotovia already?"

-Attorney General's Office

Sat link

"Good People of Rotovia your fighting over a stupid thing your asking are Elven People Sentient well i ask you this what is Sentient? thats simple its something that can think clearly Elves can think hell CorpSac would not be were we are in the stars if it was not for Elves, Do they try and Live we clearly they do, Do they make things learn speack well i can see they do. if you dam Elvens as beening Non Sentient then maby you should ask if Rotovias are. Elven people love, feel care they do all the same thing you do, declairing them non so is like saying White man is better then black Man or Black man is better then White. Look at yourself and say to the people all people black white elven and what ever elce you have am i sentient do i love, feel, care, think, or even know what you are if you dont then you cant say your Sentient"

Llama bump!

Over Satellite Link:

Good day to you honourable Senators, Mr. Speaker, and President of Rotovia. Before you make this decision, let me tell you a few things you may or may not know about this enigma known as the elven race.

The elves are an old race, claiming to have been around before mankind was born. Their empires were at their pinnacle centuries ago, and the human race had to struggle to compete with this oppressive species. Finally we have caught a break. Our race has fought it's way to the top of the pile, but the elves are still here, waiting to seize dominance. Waiting for us to slip up. We have the power to rule this universe, if we use it.

Why does humanity feel this obligation towards the elven race? We don't owe them anything. How often do you see elven nations reaching out to human nations, treating humanity with equality? The elves care nothing for us, they only seek to dominate! Elves aren't content to live in a human nation as equals. They will attempt to subvert the government to ensure the dominance of their culture. We've seen it before. How many times in the past has the elven witch-queen Sirithil ordered her fleets to beset human nations? I for one have lost count. Thousands upon thousands of human beings are no longer alive due to their recklessness with human life. And for what? A piddling handful of elven lives taken, often because they broke the law? Is that equality?! No! The only life elves care for is elven life.

In Wretchengard, elves were never granted rights. None whatsoever. Our last elves died years ago, and the lack of any rights is enough to keep them from coming back. No elf will ever look upon great Vhaldruin again. We are free of their arrogance and contempt for humanity, and someday we will secure humanity's dominance in this world once and for all.

Please, think of your nation, your children, and your very species. Granting the elves equality would be a grave mistake. Thank you for your time.

Arman Grimwald
Lord of Foreign Relations

Electronic message from a Dyelli Beybian, seemingly a spokesman for the ministry of foreign affairs,

"It is felt that while Elves are not an issue in Dyelli Beybi, except on the Eastern border when some have been incinerated, that being the usual proceedure when treating potentially magical entities from the East, that giving them the same rights as humans would be a grave error.
Dyelli Beybi is one of many Provinces within the greater nation of Klatch, and we have in the past been threatened by elves. This was one of the many reasons the Nation of Klatch first came into existence, as a Union to oppose Elven agression.
Time and time again it has been demonstrated that while elves claim to be in favour of peace and love, their Governments act with vengefullness and hatred as well as display an unwillingness to forgive that is condemned when manifested in human states. It seems that when carried out by elven states it is keenly encouraged. Should Rotovia allow full rights to these creatures, it will undoubtedly result in further bullying from Elven Nations supposedly 'supporting their minority' while in fact simply going by their imperialistic dreams. Rotovia will become no more than a puppet of the elven Empire.
We pledge a willingness to aid Rotovia against enemy agression should it be the outcome, as assuredly it will be, from a positive result in parliament.

Speaker: "Are ther any other electronic uplinks or delegates wishing to speak on this issue?"

"Rotovia, its been a long time since our two nations crossed paths. Our Senate compliments you on your commitment to the ways of democracy that you have for so long held. Prespolis has shut itself off from the outside world for too long, our era of isolationism is at an end. Regardless of where this current debate in the chambers of the Rotovian legislature goes, I will be watching closely."

President J. Catalina

Bump

Bump?

The Kingdom of Joccia commends the government of Rotovia for their compassion in debating this subject.

Elves are well known to be sentient, there can be no other answer for their sly maliciousness. They do not use animal cunning, pure and well thought out evil is their meat.

We wholeheartedly urge the Government of Rotovia to recognise their sentience and purge themselves of this canker by any means. Do not let your soft hearts be swayed towards leniency, act with the sword!

OOC: I'm aware of the poll error, however it was better than having only no options.

*BUMP for final results!*

Reporter: "Today the Senate of the Allied States of Rotovia tallied it's final votes on the Elven Rights Act. In a landslide decision the Seante voted against the Bill and declared the Elven Race not to be Sentient. The vote was offically recorded at 97-3. With the lone votes of President Dionysus Baccheus, Senator Julia Aptiva and Senator Ivona Flemmings. The President refused to comment and reported vomited after the decision was read by the Speaker"

Dyelli Beybi finds the decision to be truly enlightened.

It depends what type of elves, tolken elves are clearly clever and sednent, ideed their more intelligant than humans, their cousans that have evolved later come ion two specise, Orcs which are evil clever and sceaming and like killing things, (We cull them) and Santa elves which and stupid things that have no intellegance. We only allow Tolken Elves in Aust, the others just cause truble.

It depends what type of elves, tolken elves are clearly clever and sednent, ideed their more intelligant than humans, their cousans that have evolved later come ion two specise, Orcs which are evil clever and sceaming and like killing things, (We cull them) and Santa elves which and stupid things that have no intellegance. We only allow Tolken Elves in Aust, the others just cause truble.

A conversation overheard by a reporter between a Rotovian senator and an emmisary from Arila:


"The church of Arila congratulates the ruling body of Rotovia with their final decision. The church believes the it unimportant if elves are sentient or not. They don't deserve rights in any case.

By their own admission, when were the elves born? I'll tell you... In the time of DARKNESS!!!! They wield magic, the taint of Hell." The emmisary looked up at the skies. "In the ongoing fight against evil, we must be ever vigilant"

As the two men entered an expensive restaurant, they moved out of earshot.

Press Release

This decision sickens me to the depths of my soul. I am ashamed today, ashamed of an institution I was once proud just to look upon. The Senate's ruling is unjust, and un-Rotovian.

Rest assured good people that this is not the end of the fight for Elven rights, and that we will see this Bill brought before the Senate again. And we will see it pass.

We will see justice done and truth spoken, and then and only then could I hold my head up high and say "yes, I am proud to Rotovian".

Rather than commenting on the legimaticy of the elven claim to sentinece and whether or not Rotovia should recognize them as such the CEP wishes to offer sanctuary to the Elven Rotovians. Our country recognizes any species as sentinent who can ask for it (and pass the new citizens test) If there is enough interest we will send a transport of some kind.

News Confrence In the Capitol Building
ON CNN
"We of the Tolkien Elves run our own country very efficientaly, but if we entered Rotovia we our considered not sentient! How can this be just and true?We demand that a bill be proposed to the U.N. for Elves Sentiency."

"There you have it folks," reporter Salvainis Grey reports,"President CeleKorn of RESF speaks out against the injustice done in Rotovia's Senate.It is clear that this will be a battle long fought."

The Eternal Dominion of Wretchengard commends Rotovia for taking action against the elvish threat. You will be better for it, that I promise.

Arman Grimwald
Lord of Foreign Relations

CNN: The Chancellor of Nuevo Kowloon's comments on the recent ruling in Rotavia on the Sentience of Elves...

The Nation of Nuevo Kowloon offers free passage into our lands to any and all Rotavian-born Elves. We also condemn this horrid and despicable choice to class a whole segment of a nation's populace as animals.
Shame on you.
Shame on You.
SHAME on YOU.
How DARE you? HOW can you LIVE with yourselves! What's next? Germ bombings to "Ethnically Cleanse" your Human Population? Slavery, perhaps??? When you start to make distinctions as to who should be given basic rights, based on mere physical appearances... Will you next bring forth the spectre of Colonialist Aggression? Maybe enslave someone and class him as an animal for looking different, having a different skin-tone, or maybe eyes that aren't perfectly blue and European?
DAMN your Senate, damn your judges, We of the world community have seen who is non-sentient here, who is not aware of themselves, and it is not the Elves who have this defect in your nation.
I am ashamed to say that you Rotavians are human, because of how your action reflects on my people.
May your Ancestors give you what you deserve, and may your children show you all the respect that is proper for your actions. It is my sincere hope that you live in interesting times, that you recieve all that you have worked for in the most appropriate manner possible, and that your leaders should have the most spiritual experience known to man.
Good-night.

News Confrence In the Capitol Building
ON CNN
"We of the Tolkien Elves run our own country very efficientaly, but if we entered Rotovia we our considered not sentient! How can this be just and true?We demand that a bill be proposed to the U.N. for Elves Sentiency."

"There you have it folks," reporter Salvainis Grey reports,"President CeleKorn of RESF speaks out against the injustice done in Rotovia's Senate.It is clear that this will be a battle long fought."
We shall help you in this plight. Rovena I was freinds with you but you have been warned and hell hath no fury like an elf scorned!

CNN: The Chancellor of Nuevo Kowloon's comments on the recent ruling in Rotavia on the Sentience of Elves...

The Nation of Nuevo Kowloon offers free passage into our lands to any and all Rotavian-born Elves. We also condemn this horrid and despicable choice to class a whole segment of a nation's populace as animals.
Shame on you.
Shame on You.
SHAME on YOU.
How DARE you? HOW can you LIVE with yourselves! What's next? Germ bombings to "Ethnically Cleanse" your Human Population? Slavery, perhaps??? When you start to make distinctions as to who should be given basic rights, based on mere physical appearances... Will you next bring forth the spectre of Colonialist Aggression? Maybe enslave someone and class him as an animal for looking different, having a different skin-tone, or maybe eyes that aren't perfectly blue and European?
DAMN your Senate, damn your judges, We of the world community have seen who is non-sentient here, who is not aware of themselves, and it is not the Elves who have this defect in your nation.
I am ashamed to say that you Rotavians are human, because of how your action reflects on my people.
May your Ancestors give you what you deserve, and may your children show you all the respect that is proper for your actions. It is my sincere hope that you live in interesting times, that you recieve all that you have worked for in the most appropriate manner possible, and that your leaders should have the most spiritual experience known to man.
Good-night.
Press Release

No person, and we use this term loosely, may exit Rotovia without a valid passport so do not presume to remove populace from our borders.
Condemn the Seante all you will, but it is the democratic body of law that governs Rotovia and it reached it's decision on proffesional advice from the international community.

Your childish comments will be ignored and we remind your nation t hat the Senate will not stand top have it's honour or integrety challenged. Much less by the likes of you.

CNN: The Chancellor of Nuevo Kowloon's comments on the recent ruling in Rotavia on the Sentience of Elves...

The Nation of Nuevo Kowloon offers free passage into our lands to any and all Rotavian-born Elves. We also condemn this horrid and despicable choice to class a whole segment of a nation's populace as animals.
Shame on you.
Shame on You.
SHAME on YOU.
How DARE you? HOW can you LIVE with yourselves! What's next? Germ bombings to "Ethnically Cleanse" your Human Population? Slavery, perhaps??? When you start to make distinctions as to who should be given basic rights, based on mere physical appearances... Will you next bring forth the spectre of Colonialist Aggression? Maybe enslave someone and class him as an animal for looking different, having a different skin-tone, or maybe eyes that aren't perfectly blue and European?
DAMN your Senate, damn your judges, We of the world community have seen who is non-sentient here, who is not aware of themselves, and it is not the Elves who have this defect in your nation.
I am ashamed to say that you Rotavians are human, because of how your action reflects on my people.
May your Ancestors give you what you deserve, and may your children show you all the respect that is proper for your actions. It is my sincere hope that you live in interesting times, that you recieve all that you have worked for in the most appropriate manner possible, and that your leaders should have the most spiritual experience known to man.
Good-night.
Carm down my freind, you may be my ally and we both stand on the same points, but rember, their is no point getting yourself into trouble yet, especcally when most of your army has been massicared.

Rotovia I shall grant you a 3 day stand to undo your decision before me and my allys declare war on you.
You have 72 hours starting now.

Rotovia I shall grant you a 3 day stand to undo your decision before me and my allys declare war on you.
You have 72 hours starting now.
Do not presume to threaten us with war for following the democratic rulings of our government. We will not stand for such incolence, nor will we stand to have the honour of our most holy, sacred and revered instituation challenged. The will of the Senate is above reproach and has been the line between good and evil for two thousand years. If you wish to challenge our might than pray for a quick death.

-(acting) Minister of Foreign Affairs

News Confrence In the Capitol Building
ON CNN
"We of the Tolkien Elves run our own country very efficientaly, but if we entered Rotovia we our considered not sentient! How can this be just and true?We demand that a bill be proposed to the U.N. for Elves Sentiency."

"There you have it folks," reporter Salvainis Grey reports,"President CeleKorn of RESF speaks out against the injustice done in Rotovia's Senate.It is clear that this will be a battle long fought."
We shall help you in this plight. Rovena I was freinds with you but you have been warned and hell hath no fury like an elf scorned!

The Armed Republic of Dundaine is to enter this war on the side of the Elves Security Forces we are fully prepared to get our other allies involved.

For the love of all that you hold dear, gentlemen! Their President has already refused to sign this abhorrent act into Law-there is no cause for war, and threats of war will only entrench the bigots in their government deeper, and turn the opinions of their undecided against equality!

Show Reason, Show Restraint! (only show force if they do it first!)

"Humans speaking out in defence of elves are like children enchanted by flames" proclaimed Archbisshop Whilibarj in a press conference. "They will see themselves burned.
The Dark Lord gave the elves a beautifull appearance and magics to ensorcell the weaker of human minds. We are glad that most people in Rotovia see through this deception, and look upon the mockery this creature makes of the works of the Creator, with its pointy ears, its men that look like girls, and their incessant claims that they are on the side of good, *turns red with anger* WHILE WE ALL KNOW THEY ARE SERVANTS OF THE DARK LORD.
*takes a few deep breaths, and says coldly* It would be none to soon if they were all sent back to meet him..."

"Humans speaking out in defence of elves are like children enchanted by flames" proclaimed Archbisshop Whilibarj in a press conference. "They will see themselves burned.
The Dark Lord gave the elves a beautifull appearance and magics to ensorcell the weaker of human minds. We are glad that most people in Rotovia see through this deception, and look upon the mockery this creature makes of the works of the Creator, with its pointy ears, its men that look like girls, and their incessant claims that they are on the side of good, *turns red with anger* WHILE WE ALL KNOW THEY ARE SERVANTS OF THE DARK LORD.
*takes a few deep breaths, and says coldly* It would be none to soon if they were all sent back to meet him..."


Hmmm... we don't believe in magic. We've seen what RACISM can do, but we haven't seen or encountered anything that fits what you describe.
We Have experienced Biological Warfare, the atom-bombing of cities, and the horrors that come with those, including long-term effects.
We've seen what "Superpowers" will do if they get a mind to do it, and we've seen what good, old-fashioned human violence can do.
I don't think some pointy-eared person who speaks in riddles and lives a long time can match up in comparison to what has been done to us, and to others, throughout history by our fellow humans...
Whatever "Powers" you attribute to them pale in comparison to what irresponsible idiots with Bio-labs and irrational hatreds can do, will do, have done-usually prating on about either "Purity" or "The Proletariat" while they murder millions.
We don't have an Elven Populace, but we understand that some Nations do-and that most of those nations take a pragmatic approach and acknowledge them as being people-something many Humans don't even do with their own kind.

Crusade, Purge, Purify, Liebensrahm, Dialectical Materialism...it all comes down to the same thing-mass murder of innocents for an ideal no human can live up to, under systems unfit for animals to endure long in.

I'm really quite glad you're all the way over there-between the Khmer Rouge to our west, and the ChiComs to our north, I think we have quite enough threats to our survival without dealing with religious fanatics motivated by bigotry.

Rotovia I shall grant you a 3 day stand to undo your decision before me and my allys declare war on you.
You have 72 hours starting now.

This aparent declaration of war is further evidence of the beligerent and imperialistic foreign policies of the Elven Nation.

Rotovia I shall grant you a 3 day stand to undo your decision before me and my allys declare war on you.
You have 72 hours starting now.

This aparent declaration of war is further evidence of the beligerent and imperialistic foreign policies of the Elven Nation.

OOC: Dammit, you took the words right out of my mouth! :P

Whilst Joccia is known as a peaceful and level-headed Nation, not given to prejudice and draconian measures, even we must protest at this Elven tirade of threats.

Our armed forces are currently occupied, however, we offer whatever aid we can to Rotovia in this time of internal difficulty.

Joccia institutes a ban on trading with all Nations of Elven Origin, unfortunately we now have no Elf population in our Nation, or we would have made them suffer :twisted:

*Via Satellite*

Greetings to you all. Your discussion caught my interest.
I wonder why you seek to wage war on the sentient folk known as the
elves, when it might serve your peoples to work alongide with and
learn from them.

If they are as intelligent as you make them out to be, surely there
could be a lot of knowledge to be gleaned from them, and much to
be gained from alliances with them.

Then again, I know not of the injustices that they may or may not
have wrought against you or your own peoples, so you may have reason
to slaughter them. But, to end my piece of advice: be warned - if they
are as intelligent as you make them out to be, they, too, would prove to
be a threat to you, even now.

Good day,

Haroun al-Arabel,

Sultan of Tsorfinn

The elves are no more intelligent then men. It is because the whole of their minds are bent towards wicked cunning and malice that they are a threat. It is impossible to work with the elves, for the always seek to usurp and dominate, on both a national level and on a species-wide level.

Arman Grimwald
Lord of Foreign Relations

OOC: That sounds like a lot of politicians that I've heard of in THE REAL world, yet no-one destroys them! And they certainly have it coming... :evil:

IC: Many in this world are conniving and traitorous, and yet people
manage to form alliances with them.

If they are no more intelligent than men, that implies that
there is the inherent possibility that they are exactly as
intelligent as men, and thus might prove to have their own
scientists, philosophers, etc, who might have knowledge that we as
yet do not.

This leaves me with two further suggestions: 1)
The nations who can find ways to work with them might
be able to glean knowledge and afterwards share with the rest of us.

2) The nations who cannot/will not work with them might find
better recourse through capture/torture of them.
If they are as inclined to malice as you say they are, they
might have it coming anyway and, as an added bonus,
why not gain knowledge from them?

Additional: Surely not all elves are evil?
Do what you will with those who seek malice against you, but
the ones who do no harm/are not evil, I suggest that they be not
harmed. Surely a working
peace could be made with them?

Food for thought.

Good Day,

Haroun al-Arabel,

Sultan of Tsorfinn

Does anyone have an embassy in Rotiva that refuges can flee to? Embassies are considered foriegn soil and the diplomats who'd be guilty of smuggling illegal aliens have diplomatic immunity. If this can be arranged we can arrange for some sort of pick up.

Note we will not violate Rotivian Waters or airspace as we do not wish to risk the consequences, all pick ups will have to take place in internationale waters.

Does anyone have an embassy in Rotiva that refuges can flee to? Embassies are considered foriegn soil and the diplomats who'd be guilty of smuggling illegal aliens have diplomatic immunity. If this can be arranged we can arrange for some sort of pick up.

Note we will not violate Rotivian Waters or airspace as we do not wish to risk the consequences, all pick ups will have to take place in internationale waters.
OOC: Actually alot of people do. I went through an embassy phase ages ago. Live to regrit it everytime I god to war and have a flood of diplomatic pleas to deal with.

I think I have an embewssy their.

You poor poor Elvan people!!! Please all of you who have been denied yor rights, come to Elvandair! A place where all of you will be recognized your individual and civil rights! Come to a non-opressive nation like that of your own.

-Secretary of Elvan Welfare
Wilma Pilina Dantrul

IC: Although denying 'rights' to Rotovian elves is not the most benevolent act, we find the actions of the 'good' elvish nations to be far worse. They threaten war against a democratically elected government merely because of a law that it- no the Rotovian people chose to pass. The fact of the matter is, that although Rotovia's actions were somewhat in the wrong, the atrocious actions of these 'good' elvish nations greatly eclipse those of the Rotovian senate.

We have seen what the elves do to those who oppose them. How many innocent people have been killed by elvish hands? Over what? Over meaningless disputes like this. The Rotovian people have made their choice.

OOC: Great debate.

IC: Although denying 'rights' to Rotovian elves is not the most benevolent act, we find the actions of the 'good' elvish nations to be far worse. They threaten war against a democratically elected government merely because of a law that it- no the Rotovian people chose to pass. The fact of the matter is, that although Rotovia's actions were somewhat in the wrong, the atrocious actions of these 'good' elvish nations greatly eclipse those of the Rotovian senate.

We have seen what the elves do to those who oppose them. How many innocent people have been killed by elvish hands? Over what? Over meaningless disputes like this. The Rotovian people have made their choice.

OOC: Great debate.
If any harm comes to elves, as it has many times by uncaring humans, it is basiclly racism, and Aust will not stand for it. Elves may have killed many humans but how many of the firstborn have been killed by humans, in Aust elves are treated equally and we have no problems.

If any harm comes to elves, as it has many times by uncaring humans, it is basiclly racism, and Aust will not stand for it. Elves may have killed many humans but how many of the firstborn have been killed by humans, in Aust elves are treated equally and we have no problems.

Although Central Facehuggeria has no elves in our population, if there were we would treat them just like we would treat a human. We do not object to elvish nations protesting the seizure of elvish rights, we object to their warmongering. We object to their attempt to force their wills upon the people of Rotovia.

IC: Although denying 'rights' to Rotovian elves is not the most benevolent act, we find the actions of the 'good' elvish nations to be far worse. They threaten war against a democratically elected government merely because of a law that it- no the Rotovian people chose to pass. The fact of the matter is, that although Rotovia's actions were somewhat in the wrong, the atrocious actions of these 'good' elvish nations greatly eclipse those of the Rotovian senate.

We have seen what the elves do to those who oppose them. How many innocent people have been killed by elvish hands? Over what? Over meaningless disputes like this. The Rotovian people have made their choice.

OOC: Great debate.
If any harm comes to elves, as it has many times by uncaring humans, it is basiclly racism, and Aust will not stand for it. Elves may have killed many humans but how many of the firstborn have been killed by humans, in Aust elves are treated equally and we have no problems.

Can we no' get awa frae this "firstborn" pish?

The Elves were not the "firstborn" they were created in evil experiments on Orcs!

The dwarfs are provably the "firstborn" but they don't shout about it!

Why do you people continue to post here when this topic has been to a more current thread.
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=124648&highlight=
Occ: i guess i copied the wrong shortcut. Should be fixed now.

Why do you people continue to post here when this topic has been to a more current thread.
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=122141&highlight=

It appears that your 'more current thread' is actually this one!

IC: Although denying 'rights' to Rotovian elves is not the most benevolent act, we find the actions of the 'good' elvish nations to be far worse. They threaten war against a democratically elected government merely because of a law that it- no the Rotovian people chose to pass. The fact of the matter is, that although Rotovia's actions were somewhat in the wrong, the atrocious actions of these 'good' elvish nations greatly eclipse those of the Rotovian senate.

We have seen what the elves do to those who oppose them. How many innocent people have been killed by elvish hands? Over what? Over meaningless disputes like this. The Rotovian people have made their choice.

OOC: Great debate.
Read the Samarillion at a later date Mekalor created orks from captured elves.
If any harm comes to elves, as it has many times by uncaring humans, it is basiclly racism, and Aust will not stand for it. Elves may have killed many humans but how many of the firstborn have been killed by humans, in Aust elves are treated equally and we have no problems.

Can we no' get awa frae this "firstborn" pish?

The Elves were not the "firstborn" they were created in evil experiments on Orcs!

The dwarfs are provably the "firstborn" but they don't shout about it!

IC: Although denying 'rights' to Rotovian elves is not the most benevolent act, we find the actions of the 'good' elvish nations to be far worse. They threaten war against a democratically elected government merely because of a law that it- no the Rotovian people chose to pass. The fact of the matter is, that although Rotovia's actions were somewhat in the wrong, the atrocious actions of these 'good' elvish nations greatly eclipse those of the Rotovian senate.

We have seen what the elves do to those who oppose them. How many innocent people have been killed by elvish hands? Over what? Over meaningless disputes like this. The Rotovian people have made their choice.

OOC: Great debate.
Read the Samarillion at a later date Mekalor created orks from captured elves.
If any harm comes to elves, as it has many times by uncaring humans, it is basiclly racism, and Aust will not stand for it. Elves may have killed many humans but how many of the firstborn have been killed by humans, in Aust elves are treated equally and we have no problems.

Can we no' get awa frae this "firstborn" pish?

The Elves were not the "firstborn" they were created in evil experiments on Orcs!

The dwarfs are provably the "firstborn" but they don't shout about it!

Presuming that the semi-literate people of Aust mean that piece of Elvish propaganda by Tolkien - The Silmarillion. Tolkien was well known for twisting Norse and Germanic legend to his own ends.

We hate the dwarfs, but fair is fair, they were first according to legends that are far older than Tolkien's stories.

IC: Although denying 'rights' to Rotovian elves is not the most benevolent act, we find the actions of the 'good' elvish nations to be far worse. They threaten war against a democratically elected government merely because of a law that it- no the Rotovian people chose to pass. The fact of the matter is, that although Rotovia's actions were somewhat in the wrong, the atrocious actions of these 'good' elvish nations greatly eclipse those of the Rotovian senate.

We have seen what the elves do to those who oppose them. How many innocent people have been killed by elvish hands? Over what? Over meaningless disputes like this. The Rotovian people have made their choice.

OOC: Great debate.
Read the Samarillion at a later date Mekalor created orks from captured elves.
If any harm comes to elves, as it has many times by uncaring humans, it is basiclly racism, and Aust will not stand for it. Elves may have killed many humans but how many of the firstborn have been killed by humans, in Aust elves are treated equally and we have no problems.

Can we no' get awa frae this "firstborn" pish?

The Elves were not the "firstborn" they were created in evil experiments on Orcs!

The dwarfs are provably the "firstborn" but they don't shout about it!

Presuming that the semi-literate people of Aust mean that piece of Elvish propaganda by Tolkien - The Silmarillion. Tolkien was well known for twisting Norse and Germanic legend to his own ends.

We hate the dwarfs, but fair is fair, they were first according to legends that are far older than Tolkien's stories.
Semi-literate ARE YOU COMLETTLY SANE? Older ledgians do not exist in Aust of dewarves, in fact this is the first we have heard of them, elves however appear in most of the ledgians of Aust and we have written everdence from 59,000 years ago that they existed.

Ah, well, there you have it then:

The first dwarven writings have been dated as coming from 59001 years, 3 months, 2 days and 4 and a half minutes ago.

It is of no concern to us. Other forms of miscellaneous flora have been around for much longer than these so called 'elves'. No matter how long they have been around, they should immediately be exterminated before they can cause any more harm than they already have.

OOC: At the risk of looking geeky now, according to Tolkien, the dwarfs were the first to be created, BUT, since the upper god had meant for the elves to be the first born, he ordered all dwarves into a long sleep. So apart from those 7 fathers of dwarfdom being alive for about half an hour or so, elven record extends much further back in history, since the rest of dwarf people appear around the same time humans do.

And as for tolkien mixing legends and all, I agree, but lets stick with those, as everyone knows tolkien, yet if we all take our own nations legends on magical beings we'll soon have little folks on the backs of unicorns fighting against halfbeasts and cannibals with earthmagic to take controll of trollcountry and a sacred oaktree ;-)

OOC: At the risk of looking geeky now, according to Tolkien, the dwarfs were the first to be created, BUT, since the upper god had meant for the elves to be the first born, he ordered all dwarves into a long sleep. So apart from those 7 fathers of dwarfdom being alive for about half an hour or so, elven record extends much further back in history, since the rest of dwarf people appear around the same time humans do.

And as for tolkien mixing legends and all, I agree, but lets stick with those, as everyone knows tolkien, yet if we all take our own nations legends on magical beings we'll soon have little folks on the backs of unicorns fighting against halfbeasts and cannibals with earthmagic to take controll of trollcountry and a sacred oaktree ;-)

Hey Bigjob!

Who're yoo tae talk aboot wee folk, ya scunner!
The Wee Free Men were aye first in onny queue, an' we'll batter any Bigjob who says we werena'

Can yer mutha sew, Bigjob?.....

We bow to the mighty Feegle

Aye, that'll be right!

Nae King, Nae Quin, Nae Laird, Nae Master, we'll no be fooled agin!

Tae the people o' the Quin - Whatch yersel's, ya scunners!