NationStates Jolt Archive

Scientists and nation's expert shipbuilders are needed to help construct a 'Super' battleship. the latest(modern) technology from various countries is needed to build a varied and well-balanced ship of exceptionally large size. payment to be agreed on a case by case basis.





(people who can provide stats(and sometime pictures) of things such as weapons systems, armor, lifeboat capacity, etc.

Just be careful not to fall for the temptation to make it too well rounded, or it won't be a very effective ship.

What roles do you intend it to fill? Shore bombardment? Anti-Shipping? Guns or missiles for the main armament?

I intend it to be shore bombardment, but more than able to defend itself in ship-to-ship combat. Trying to balance without 'being too well-rounded'

bump

Suggest you try a "Stretched" Iowa class with a VLS cell mounted just aft of the Fo'cstle. You'll lose a bit of speed, but you'll have a shore-bombardment platform that can also deliver missile bombardment, is almost immune to modern antishipping missiles, and can support significant anti-air and anti-shipping weapons with a fairly small crew (Only a few thousand.)

seems good, except for speed, i'll need pretty good speed, trying to figure out armor though.

Such a large ship would need defence from cruisemissiles, therefore the Farfeched Prospect military wants to help build this type vessel, by adding anti-missile systems

I give you the Goalkeeper

http://www.zevenprovincien.nl/fotomap%20bewapening%20en%20communicatie/Goalkeeper.jpg

The basic idea behind the goalkeeper is simple, "nothing get through masses" the goalkeeper is a Minigun that shoots 5000 grenades a minute to create a wall of steel on which any missile would crush itself.

For active radar systems I can deliver the Smart-L

http://www.naval-technology.com/contractor_images/thales5/Smart-L.jpg

The Smart-L is the latest in Prospect radar systems and the most advanced on the market at the moment, as normal radar uses radar waves to get a 2d picture of whats out there, the Smart-L uses radar, sound, infra-red and several other things to detect the enemy and display it in 3d. We at Prospect try to make these systems the standard in naval units around the world.

The Prospect military loves big guns and if you decide to take our offer to let us produce the radar and anti-missle defence we will add $1.000.000.000 to the project

The battleship is outdated. It's last great war was WW2. (althought the largest naval battle in history was in WW1, Battle of Jutland)

Battleships are far too expensive to build and maintain. If you look at it, the Battleship has everything, right? Cruise missle, huge 12" (I think) guns, anti-submarine stuff, etc. It has everything except planes. (I'm sure you can add helicopters)

Why have one ship that has everything versus many ships with a few things? You have destroyers with the big guns, missile frigates with, well, missiles, Hunter/killer subs for anti-sub warfare, Trident (type) subs for cruise and/or ICBMs. You lose one, you still have the rest, you lose the battleship, you lose everything.

From the desk of the Lord High CEO

As leader of Crossroads Inc I have a natural fondess to support all overly excessive projects that involve really really big guns. IE large tanks and battleships. As such I will be sending over some of our best scientists after they have just finised working on the B.O.L.O. project. << http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=118841&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0 >>

Also will will donate 500,000,000 to your cause.

Lord High CEO

The battleship is outdated. It's last great war was WW2. (althought the largest naval battle in history was in WW1, Battle of Jutland)

Battleships are far too expensive to build and maintain. If you look at it, the Battleship has everything, right? Cruise missle, huge 12" (I think) guns, anti-submarine stuff, etc. It has everything except planes. (I'm sure you can add helicopters)

Why have one ship that has everything versus many ships with a few things? You have destroyers with the big guns, missile frigates with, well, missiles, Hunter/killer subs for anti-sub warfare, Trident (type) subs for cruise and/or ICBMs. You lose one, you still have the rest, you lose the battleship, you lose everything.

I see this ship more as a main command vessel of a major fleet, no ship or plane would be able to get near it if it's fleet based

I've got Farfetched prospect down for the Anti-missile and radar systems, Crossroads Inc, describe what you have to offer

No, but a Nuke or large enough group of Cruise missiles would. And, if a nation has the technology, they could use use an EMP and shut it all down then walk right up and sink it.

i am going to put in EMP absorbant armor and firing a nuke at a battleship?, you would just get nukes fired back at you

I've got Farfetched prospect down for the Anti-missile and radar systems, Crossroads Inc, describe what you have to offer Ah yes.. Well from our current Tank program we have incredable experiance with designing masisve Cannon guns that can be used for your turrets as well as Recoil-Dampiners and High Impact projectile, (such as fireing a 'scatershot' of high explosive charges at Mach3 at a target.)

Farfetched prospect will take care of anti-missile systems. I will manufacture the armor

No, but a Nuke or large enough group of Cruise missiles would. And, if a nation has the technology, they could use use an EMP and shut it all down then walk right up and sink it.

Ah here's where the goalkeeper (tm) comes in, its fully capable to take-out cruise-missles. Nukes don't explode unless there ordered to by there programming, shoot them out of the air and your done. Emp is a differn't matter, but i'll think of something

Crossroads down for the guns, i'll need bigger-than-average guns

Ah here's where the goalkeeper (tm) comes in, its fully capable to take-out cruise-missles. Nukes don't explode unless there ordered to by there programming, shoot them out of the air and your done. Emp is a differn't matter, but i'll think of something Very good point Farfetched... Many people forget that Nukes, unlike most Other explosives... Do not "Blow Up" when you Blow them up...

prospect, got stats for the systems?

Goalkeeper

Goalkeeper is a shipborne close-in weapon system (CIWS) consisting of a 30 mm seven-barrel gun which provides a rate of fire of over 5,000 rounds per minute. Range is 200 m to 8 km. The system also includes tracking and search radar and a TV camera. These systems are interconnected to the Smart-L system

SMART-L

SMART-L is the latest in our 3D multi-beam volume search radar family, providing 400km coverage and 70° elevation. Highband frequenty gives it advantage over stealth targets.

anti-missile and radar systems done

$1 bilion has been transfert to your account, for construction of the prototype...Prospect would also want to suggest that the nations that work on the project ally

Crossroads Inc. Cannon Turret Systems

Boomers A large Cannon that fires a 20 to 50 lbs 'Slug' of Armour Piercing rounds at Mach3. The rounds spreads out like grape shot and impact over a wide surface on the target area.

Screechers The Ultimate in Armour Piercing shells, a large Depleted Uranium Shell with a Scramjet Rocket Built into it, can delive a 400lb explosive warhead deep into any ship, Building or bunker.

Auto-Wizz-Bang Auto-Wizz-Bangs fire slivers of steel-jacketed cryo-H, a few grams of hydrogen held as a slush at near-absolute zero temperatures. Magnetically accelerated to relativistic speeds by superconducting coils within the weapon's barrel, the cryo-H is compacted and heated until it reaches fusion temperatures. The devastating effect of the Auto-Wizz-Bang is the natural outcome of shooting at a target with tiny pieces of burning star traveling at near-light velocities. Damage, measured at several megatons/second, is caused both by fusion effects and by the release of considerable kinetic energy at impact. *Warning* This sytem reuires a MASSIVE Cannon and may only be practicle for land based turrets


P.S. If were going to make one of thes Super Über Battleships, it would be most Nifty if we could find an appropriate picture... A battleships that is mostly Future-looking, lots of big cannons, and looks much larger than a normal battleship...

an alliance is a pretty serious thing, how about just improved trade relations?,,,,,,,,need two turrets that fire 'Screechers'

an alliance is a pretty serious thing, how about just improved trade relations?,,,,,,,,need two turrets that fire 'Screechers'

Thats just fine with me, but i'll watch your backs anyway.....oh and i think the ship should have stealth features

it wont be a 'Super Über Battleship', it will be a fleet command ship, capable of shore bomabardment.

i need this to Intimidate people, they see a fleet with this at the head, and there will be no need for fighting. i don't need this to be steatlh, i need this to kill stealth

Oh, and considering we are manufacturing the ship does this mean we get production right on it?

if you're involved in building the ship, you get as much production rights as I do, though building many copies of this ship would be extremly cost-prohibitive

No kiddin' i only want 1 or 2, maybe more incase I increase my army

2 or 3 for a big nation, considering you base fleets around these. still need stats of engines, lifeboat capacity, firefighting systems, etc

i suggest Nuclear, 4 to 5 reactors, with about 10 props

any alternative to nuclear?






(always with the nuke)

Well we can't go Fusion, Diesel is not an option, solar would not be a good idea. Gas-turbine maybe.

go with the nuclear then.................(the world needs to develop an realistic alternative to nuclear power)

go with the nuclear then.................(the world needs to develop an realistic alternative to nuclear power)

Like I said "Fusion" but thats going into future tech..

with 5 nuclear reactors, this thing better not blow up :shock:

Don't worry, chance of a melt-down is really low and you can always shut-down a reactor.

lifeboat capacity,,,,,,,,,,anti-aircraft system,,,,,,,,

For anti-Aircraft I suggest Harpoon missile system or Vertical Launch System

Harpoon missile system

when you produce it you can put the finer details on yourself and call it a 'varient'

Let us all consider what is on the table here. Building a ship with the specs mentioned is fantastic - but - navy power is only necessary these days for the ability to deliver Air Power to a point of conflict.

We will never see open warfare on the sea (as Pyronea so wisely pointed out).

People - the next theatre is in the air and the space above.

We at A1 World Best can compete in the supply of arms as we have much experience with heavy vehicle industry. But I propose that we build a death star (tm) or equivalent to project air power to any point on the globe from space.

Call me for a quote. I give you best price!

still need crew, lifeboat capacity. what are we going to call it?

'craft would be too expensive when you modify them for atmospheric flight.(we're talking modern tech here)

this ship will be fleet command/ shore bombardment only ship to ship battling will be done by other ships in fleet

For crew i was thinking of like 6000, the ship would be highly modernised, so computers can take over humans for the most part.

As a name...................i havn't got a clue

5500 for crew, Intimidation class,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,got any better ideas

Chimerea class..... Overseer class, Amsterdam class

Chimerea class!

then thats settled then

if you don't wan't to add anything,,,,,,,,,,,construction will begin soon of the first 'Chimera' class fleet command/shore bombardment ship

OCC:Get some more people in on the project...im gonna gonna go to bed.....

me too,,,,,,,,,continue it tommorrow

i'll stay up for now,,,see if anyone else wants in

bump

I wouldn't recommend using the Harpoon Cruise Missile System.
As primarliy a Anti-Shipping weapon, it wouldn't function well against fast moving aircraft. However, I would advocate the Harpoon for Anti shipping and for use against some shore based targets. It is an highly effective missile system.

The Sea Dart system is a much more effective AA weapon, with limited Anti-Ship Capability, providing your class of warship with a modern, inexpensive and battle-proven medium range Anti-Aircraft system. Used in conjuction with a CIWS such as the 'Goalkeeper' or the much more advanced 'Vulcan Phalanx II', and the interlocking cover of the Escort Vessels, the SeaDart can create and impenatrable, dual layer 'umbrella' for ship based air defence.

Neptune Inc. A True Yorkshire Defence Contractor. New Whitby, TY.

I wouldn't recommend using the Harpoon Cruise Missile System.
As primarliy a Anti-Shipping weapon, it wouldn't function well against fast moving aircraft. However, I would advocate the Harpoon for Anti shipping and for use against some shore based targets. It is an highly effective missile system.

The Sea Dart system is a much more effective AA weapon, with limited Anti-Ship Capability, providing your class of warship with a modern, inexpensive and battle-proven medium range Anti-Aircraft system. Used in conjuction with a CIWS such as the 'Goalkeeper' or the much more advanced 'Vulcan Phalanx II', and the interlocking cover of the Escort Vessels, the SeaDart can create and impenatrable, dual layer 'umbrella' for ship based air defence.

Neptune Inc. A True Yorkshire Defence Contractor. New Whitby, TY.

I believe that the sea dart is now being fased out f service with the royal navy to make way for PAAMS systems

True enough, the Royal Navy are planning to phase out the Sea Dart for the PAAMS, but Neptune Inc doesn't hold the manufacturing contract for the PAAMS.
:wink:

We would recommend that the Sea Dart is fitted to this class of warship until the PAAMS system is more readily available. Neptune Inc would willingly adapt mounts for the Sea Dart to ensure conversion would cause minimal refit time, enabling more a effective naval presence.

OOC: Not heard much about PAAMS, need to brus up on my Naval Tech! :wink: I was right about the Harpoon though, eh?

Let us all consider what is on the table here. Building a ship with the specs mentioned is fantastic - but - navy power is only necessary these days for the ability to deliver Air Power to a point of conflict.

We will never see open warfare on the sea (as Pyronea so wisely pointed out).

People - the next theatre is in the air and the space above.

We at A1 World Best can compete in the supply of arms as we have much experience with heavy vehicle industry. But I propose that we build a death star (tm) or equivalent to project air power to any point on the globe from space.

Call me for a quote. I give you best price!

you obviously havent browsed the forum much (no offence intended) open sea warfare is a very real posibility and a regular occurnace.

True enough, the Royal Navy are planning to phase out the Sea Dart for the PAAMS, but Neptune Inc doesn't hold the manufacturing contract for the PAAMS.


We would recommend that the Sea Dart is fitted to this class of warship until the PAAMS system is more readily available. Neptune Inc would willingly adapt mounts for the Sea Dart to ensure conversion would cause minimal refit time, enabling more a effective naval presence.

OOC: Not heard much about PAAMS, need to brus up on my Naval Tech! I was right about the Harpoon though, eh?

Just occasionally go on the royal navys website to brush up. ye the harpoon is good. Whovere says the goalkeeper is a grenade launcher is wrong. Its a improved phalanx.

Whovere says the goalkeeper is a grenade launcher is wrong. Its a improved phalanx.[/quote]

I know what it is, the theory is that it makes a wall of steel, in my book thats a grenade launcher...........

AHOY HOY!!!

Im back and I found some way cool pics of what our Super Battle ship can look like..someone send my nation a T-Gram with an e-mail address and I'll send the image...

Also, one of us should begin writting up a "Technical Spec" sheet of the various weopon systems this sucker is going to have.

bump

i am going to put in EMP absorbant armor and firing a nuke at a battleship?, you would just get nukes fired back at you

While this was a late response... (was in school all day, this site is blocked by surf control >: |)

EMP absorbant armor? uhuh...

Anyway, I'll do the james bond thingy jiggy and take a satelite and focus the suns rays on the ship.

(might as well stop "well ill do this" "Then ill do this" now, we'll just keep countering each other...)

GoalKeeper=30mm
Phallanx=20mm
neither =grenade.
IC:The Holy Republic of Erinin would like offer the possible use of our MetalStorm© Ballistic Technology in the constrution of your ship.
Has we hope to spread its reputation as the premier weapons system it is.
MetalStorm can be found here http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=120690&highlight=

Dont mind the Store it is still under construction.

Erinin, what's the stats of your 'metalstorm' system

the date of this ship would be a couple of years(20)in the future, to allow for more efficient nuclear reactors, and the tech for emp absorbent armor, it won't be anything like lasers, except maybe things like the ABL

i home school, at different levels of high school, so i don't have to worry about surf control :lol:

MetalStorm is actually a new concept in ballistic technology, and not merely on system. It completely changes the way projectiles are fired.
from: fire retardent caniters into a burning building to 120mm anti aircraft rounds(currently the largest weapons system we offer).
MetalStorm imploys the Idea of immediate overwhelming force.
It is highly automated extremely efficient and perhaps the most demoralizing weapons system to an opponent short of NBC weapons.
here are the stats of our MetalStorm-'Kraken'
MetalStorm 120mm Anti-Air System.
MS120AAS(Kraken).
Performances
Rate of fire:1-1200 rounds per sec
Muzzle velocity: 945 meters per second
Range: 24,678 meters (= 13.3 mile [nautical, US])
Ceiling: 17,511 meters = (9.4 mile [nautical, US])
Crew:12
Targeting System: IR/optic/laser/radar compatable with mutiple interfaces,
none standard equiped.
Mobility: Static, or Naval option available.
Reloaded time:approx .5min.
Here watch the video WARNING it is 9min long.The Technology (http://www.metalstorm.com/04_videos/ms_introduction.html)


OOC:Please note that I have actually reduced the capability of my weapons system to be LESS effective then the RL version.

Metal storm....I remember that....up to a milion rounds a minute....very nifty, no mechanical parts..

http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=121873

This is my new store front so ts still under consturction. It is basicly for ships that relay on their guns rather than missiles and i have a ship that could be called a MOAB (mother of all battleships)

bump

Did everyone get the edited picture of the Super Battle ship I dug up? I e-mailed it to Farfetched I belive, I was hoping he could post it in the thread.

The battleship is outdated. It's last great war was WW2. (althought the largest naval battle in history was in WW1, Battle of Jutland)

Battleships are far too expensive to build and maintain. If you look at it, the Battleship has everything, right? Cruise missle, huge 12" (I think) guns, anti-submarine stuff, etc. It has everything except planes. (I'm sure you can add helicopters)

Why have one ship that has everything versus many ships with a few things? You have destroyers with the big guns, missile frigates with, well, missiles, Hunter/killer subs for anti-sub warfare, Trident (type) subs for cruise and/or ICBMs. You lose one, you still have the rest, you lose the battleship, you lose everything.

Battleships are far from outdated. They provide unparalleled shore bombardment for a lot cheaper than an aircraft carrier could, and mosyt ships built these days arent made to be able to withstand hits from big (16" and up) battleship guns. You add on some AA defense to a battleship and its a ship that can hold its own in any mission you send it on.

anti air-----MetalStorm 120mm Anti-Air System

radar-----------SMART-L



4?6? turrets with Screecher ammuntition


new Emp absorbent armor(suggest better?)

how about the anti-missile system...the other guy can whine what ever he want, its still an RP... if goalkeeper does what i say it does then it does that......I can even call it an alternative version.....

Sounds good to me, I know how pwerful Sentinal AntiMissle/Aircraft systems are today, Escpecially the Phalanx, its not hard to image how powerful they cpuld be with 'Near-future Tech' ...

And I agree with Skullzz, using modern tech, a Battleship can really be somethign to be feared.

anti air-----MetalStorm 120mm Anti-Air System

radar-----------SMART-L



4?6? turrets with Screecher ammuntition


new Emp absorbent armor(suggest better?)

Im in.

Klington, what exactly would you bring to the project?

IC:Erinin would recommend along with the MetalStorm-Kraken.
You use the Goaltender, The 120mm can be used at range while the purpose of the Goaltander is close-in, A mix of the two would provide formidable air-defense at multiple ranges.
Plus the use of the Goaltender for part of the anti-air would reduce some expense in ammunition.
30mm are cheaper then 120mm. While Erinin doesn't doubt the weapons systems abililty when used with the proper targeting system.
The Goaltender is designed for the job of in your face action, should the Kraken fail, the Goaltender takes up the slack.
OOC:
I have also been discussing the ballistics of the MetalStorm system with an old artillery friend of mine.
He speculates that since the recoil is not delivered until the between the 3rd and 8th round has exited a barrel. That a large cal. naval gun could be designed to deliver rapid two round and round 'bursts' while only recieving the recoil impact of a single shot.
According to Dywere(The RL creator of the Metal Storm) Large cal. weapon should not be a problem as long as the platform can handle the sustained recoil, given that if you 'ripped' 3 rounds from a large naval gun, while only being dealt the impact of single shot, turns the gun into a nightmare for enemies on the recieving end of bombardment.
SO I will try to work out the specs on a large cal naval gun and what it would take for a ship to carry such a weapon.
i will try and hurry, (really started a few days ago when I first read this thread, a few more hours and I might have worked out).

AHoy hoy again!

Well I finally got the edited picture up.. Behold! The first Artists rederings of what Our new Jointly Produced Super Battleship shall Look like!

http://www.roadfly.org/bmw/classifieds/cars/image.php?Id=99401&type=temp

how about the anti-missile system...the other guy can whine what ever he want, its still an RP... if goalkeeper does what i say it does then it does that......I can even call it an alternative version.....
You dont need to call it an alternative version, offer alternative ammunition, 30mm HE, that wouldnt be Farfetched, sorry, pun intended.
BUt with some of the armour protection used on soviet missiles you would be better off with DPU or Tungstan/Carbon AP. I have read RPs where people had heavily 'armoured' missiles, a ridiculous concept for anything to go mach3 and be armoured be you run into that kind of thing.
Just offer ammo varients.
Nice to see someone else likes the Goalkeeper, I always see phallanx.
I was going to add it to my storefront till I saw your (tm).

NIce pic Crossroads Inc.

yes very nice, good you send it to me

anyway, all the constructors on this project are welcome to join the TRIAX alliance...

more info here

http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=122118

Some notes (no I don't really intend to participate, though if you want, I could modify my basic super 120,000 ton BB hull to fit your standards though):

1. Battleships hail from an era where there was no effective defense against antiship weapons (there still is no defense against shells) other than heavy armor, so they have it. In fact, even some WWII light cruisers can stop missiles like the Exocet and Harpoon by virtue of armor alone. There are no missiles in production that are even marginally effective against an Iowa. Soviet naval officers have in fact repeatedly stated that they were deftly afraid of the Iowas, as they didn't have anything they thought would be effective against them.

2. Battleships are better suited against underwater threats as well. An Iowa was designed to withstand underwater explosions equivalent to 700 lbs of TNT with no damage, and would have been even better if there had been proper intelligence (they underestimated Japanese weapons). 700 lbs is equivalent to a 500-1000 lb class mine, or a light (and even some 21" ones) torpedo. A modern vessel of sufficient size could be designed to withstand anything short of nuclear torpedo/mine/depth charge.

3. Battleships have been proven effective since WWII. In Korea, they were used to telling effect against coastal installations. In Vietnam, they were poorly used (only being assigned targets after aircraft failed to destroy them, usually with heavy losses), but the North Vietnamese were so afraid of them that they refused to even consider negotiations while a battleship was in the area. In the Gulf war, they again proved themselves to be unrivaled bombardment platforms. And, as stated, the Soviets were terrified of them, often more so than they were of the American carriers. The intimidation factor still exists, and that alone makes these effective weapons.

4. The goalkeeper is probably one of the top 3 gun-based CIWS systems. The other two are the Oerlikon 35mm Millenium Gun, and the Metalstorm. Of the three, I'd choose the Millenium Gun. Metalstorm has a higher hit chance, but is more easily overwhelmed (the barrels have to be replaced after being fired, and it can go through them too quickly in a missile attack). The Phalanx is quite dated now, and is what the armored missiles are protected against. Another, and better, option for CIWS would be an antimissile missile like the RIM-116 RAM. Though expensive, it has a better hit chance, and about 5 times the effective range of any gun-based CIWS. My best advise, however, is a mix of both guns and RAM launchers. With their small size and requirments, it's not too difficult.

5. For other air defense, there are some choices. For medium range, the Aster and ESSM are solid choices, as is the Soviet Yezh (SA-N-12/SA-17). For long range, there are only two contenders IRL: the US SM-2 and Soviet S-300 (SA-N-6/SA-10). All these missiles are VLS loaded, though the US ones are more versatile, as cruise missiles can be fired from the same launchers.

6. Be careful with the loadout. You don't want to go overboard. If this is, say, 120,000 tons, your maximum would be about 12 20" guns or 16 18", or possibly 20-21 16" guns. With the ship pictured, I'd go with 15 18" guns.

Update: Ship prototype, request for adding systems

http://members.lycos.nl/voicustyle/Image5.jpg

Isn't NS flowing on liquid-time or something along those lines? So why not give the number of real life days that it would take to construct the ship instead?

- Sovy K.

Isn't NS flowing on liquid-time or something along those lines? So why not give the number of real life days that it would take to construct the ship instead?

- Sovy K.

realtime is the real life days.....so construction would take 1 to 2 weeks in real life

Erk, sorry, that came out wrong. *shakes his head* Gotta stop posting on these forums.

What I ment by is why not post the number of actual days that would take to complete the vessel, not 'real life' days. This is because I am under the impression that NS operates under liquid time that is relevent to each RPer. 1 real life day may be 1 week in NS terms one day, then the next day a year could go by. I hope you better understood what I ment by.

- Sovy K.

method of escape? if this thing is destroyed you'd want a really fast way out. good job Prospect with the pic and systems,,,,,,,,,,what heli would we use for it?

well...the heli-pad is large enough for 4 choppers.....seahawks, or seakings. Ospreys would be good to

I have a SAM to give you.

It is the best SAM in the world, changed from an AAM to a SAM.

AA-3C/D/E/F Air to Air Missiles

AA-3C sitting on runway
http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/missile/acimdcar.JPG

Concept

Freedom Countries origonal adavanced, long range surface to air missile, now upgraded by Kazakhstania. With various upgrades, including thrust vectoring (on later models) and advanced range. Its range is 250 kilometres, which is capable of dowing most fighters before they do any damage to friendly air and ground units.

Speeding at upwards of Mach 4 after being launched from a SAM site, it can home in on any units it gets a lock on.

Guidance

This is the real plus point. It uses both Radar Guidance, Heatseekers, Thermal and Laser to guide it. This means that if one gets jammed, the others will still function. It does not have an inbuilt radar, but rather a reciever, meaning that as long as the launchers Radar is on, it can be guided to its target.

As soon as it closes to within 9/11/13 Kilometres (C/D/EF Versions) it can then switch to Heatseeking, meaing it can use both radar and Heatseeking, should one get jammed. When it closes to 3/4/5 Kilometres (C/D/EF) it can change also to Thermal, picking and keeping to the target relayed to it by Radar/Heatseeking. At 2 Kilometres (all versions) it can use laser, a pinpoint accurate system that can guide the missile to the enemies cockpit, where it is programmed to hit the top side of the aircraft.

It has several maneuver when launched. When initially launched, it climbs higher than the launch point (5,000 feet higher). It then levels out, and flies in pre programmed height to the enemy. When within 1 kilometre, it pulls up, and dives on the top side of the enemy. When close, it slows to just over the enemies speed, and varioes sub muunitions fire the nose cane outwards, n a fireball. This makes a nice hole for the missile (which has a smaller undercone, behind the prime one) to fly into, milliseconds after. The warhead explodes downwards, into the enemy.

Info

The whole missile is 4.6 metres long, and fits into most bomb bays, ot onto the inner wing of most fighters. Using an FC-JASM warhead, it holds enough power to down any fighter, or cripple any Heavy Bomber (B-52, Tu-160 and the like). Also, using FC-IPAD pre charges under the nose cone, it can propel the nose cone and guidance systems 50 metres forward, in a fireball.

Heavily maneuverable in later versions due to thrust vectoring (causes by various hydraulics driven slides at the rear, it can follow the majority of fighters through up to 31G turns. To evade the jammers, it has electrnonic scramblers changing the guidance frequency and process every 0.5 seconds. But the real genius is that if it is within Heatseeking range, if the radar gets jammed it has Heat to fall back on.

An all round useful weapon, used by Kazakhstania and Freedom Country to great extent. The E version has been used extensively and the F version has been used well in the latest wargames. We hope you like it.

We hope you enjoy.

Where to put it?

Where to put it?
I wouldn't bother. The missile would be nowhere near as good as he claims. There are too many guidance systems pulling it down, and the flight path/intercept method is far too complex. It would also be obscenely expensive.
For maneuverability, if he's stating the missile can do 31g, most fighters can evade it easily (31g is needed to intercept a fighter doing a little over 6g. For modern aircraft, that's not that good). If he's claiming that it can intercept a fighter going at 31g, that's just godmodding, at least for modern tech, as it requires more than twice what even the most agile current missile can do.

I wasn't sure about the ratings of the G's.

The flight profile is damn simple actually, just a couple of preassigned things.

The guidance systems are multiple, which means at closer range it cant really get jammed.

It's one of the worlds most effectves missiles, how many G's do you suggest?

*Wakes up and checjs the thread* Whoa Hey! Way to go Farfeteched, very very nice editing on the Battleship Pic. Adds a lot of legitamasy to what were doing I guess...

Clan Smoke Jaguar, Thanks a lot also for your comments!

http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=118505

Here are some good battleships

Biggest to Smallest:
Huron Class, 85,000 tonnes, 6x18.1" Guns
Great Lakes Class, 80,000 Tonnes 12x16" Guns
Connery Class 65,000 Tonnes, 9x16" Guns
Clan Class 55,000 Tonnes, 6x16" Guns
Iowa Class 57,000 Tonnes, 9x16" Guns


All of these ships have an assorted array of missiles and guns, not to mention carrying AEGIS (Except the Iowa) And being nuclear powered (Except the Iowa)

CSJ, The MetalStorm 120mm, isnt even really a CIWS, note the range.
This is what makes up for the potential to overwhelm the system.
It far exceeds the ranges of Goaltender, or Millenium.
However, precisely the reason why I suggested a goaltender/MetalStorm combo was because MetalStorm 120mm is NOT a CIWS.
Its true strength lies in aircraft engagement, it engages at ranges most pilots would be waiting for missile strike at. With the proper targeting system it could engage incoming 'slow' missiles well before the Goaltender or Millenium, then when the (if) the missile comes into range the CIWS takes over. There by greatly increasing the chances of disabling the missile.

No jet fighter has the structural integrity to take a hit from a 120mm shell.

Farfetched, I did the specs for a 'burst' fire capable 16"(I used the 16s off the Iowa as a starting point and did the math from there) naval gun.
However it seems we are using 20" guns(thats HUGE, the Yamamoto only carried 18")
Post the specs for the gun, or tele me with them and can work out a 3round 'burst' mode for shore bombardment purposes.
Also I am assuming the Main Guns will fire AP, and HC rounds just like the 16s, so if you have the munitions specs and charge load for firing that speed up my calculations better for recoil compensation.
I need muzzle velocity, round weight, and pounds of pressure at impact at maximum range and point blank range to also calculate reasonbly armour and/or concrete penetration.
If you want that done at all.

You should contact Crossroads Inc. for info on the gun....he is the one that developed it

The KASHTAN Air Defence Gun/Missile System is intended to provide self-defence for surface ships against high precision weapons (anti-ship and anti-radar missiles, air bombs), fixed and rotary wing aircraft, as well as to engage small sea and coastal targets.

The system is developed as a modular structure comprising a command module and combat modules (from one to six, depending on ship displacement).

The command module ensures IFF procedures, target acquisition and designation, and data generation for gun/missile fire.

The combat module comprises a gun/missile mount, a radar and optical control systems, a computing system, and power supply system. The integrated multi-channel control system provides simultaneous multi-target tracking in the radar and TV-optical modes. The firing turret mounts two blocks of GSh-30K six-barrel automatic guns with linkless feeding system and autonomous evaporation-type cooling system, and two SAM clusters.

The system also includes storing and reloading system to keep 32 SAMs in container-launchers in ship's under-deck spaces. Reloading time for a cluster of four SAMs does not exceed 1.5 min.

The KASHTAN system can be installed on ships with displacement greater than 400 t.


Basic Characteristics


Engagement zone range, km:
Missiles: 1.5 ... 8
Guns: 0.5 ...1.5
Altitude, m from: 5 to 4,000
Maximum target speed,: m/s 600
Kill probability: 0.96 ... 0.98
Number of targets engaged simultaneously: up to 6
Rate of gun fire, rds/min: 10,000 ... 12,000
Cartridge types: 30 mm with HE-Frag and Frag-T projectiles

http://www.rusarm.ru/Images/Kashtan.JPG

http://www.rusarm.ru/Images/Kashtan2.jpg

A real CIWS :D

OH, sorry bout that.

everyone like the KASHTAN?

bump

The battleship is outdated. It's last great war was WW2. (althought the largest naval battle in history was in WW1, Battle of Jutland)

Battleships are far too expensive to build and maintain. If you look at it, the Battleship has everything, right? Cruise missle, huge 12" (I think) guns, anti-submarine stuff, etc. It has everything except planes. (I'm sure you can add helicopters)

Why have one ship that has everything versus many ships with a few things? You have destroyers with the big guns, missile frigates with, well, missiles, Hunter/killer subs for anti-sub warfare, Trident (type) subs for cruise and/or ICBMs. You lose one, you still have the rest, you lose the battleship, you lose everything.

A battleship can take hits like no other ship can and would cost less then double that of a cruiser to build and 1/4 that of an aircraft carrier to maintain.

everyone like the KASHTAN?

We can add their weapons as support

You should contact Crossroads Inc. for info on the gun....he is the one that developed it

Clariffication:
Which Gun are we talking about? Im not sure We have added the 'Boomer' guns cannons to the ships, so far were only using my 'Screechers' High speed Cannon system. Those use 20" Cannons, The Battleship right now has 5 Main turrets and two smaller turrets.

The smaller turrets are Iowa Scale 18" Shots, Three of the Big Turrets are 20" Screechers. The other two turrets I guess are 'Up for grabs' but they would be 20" or more sized as well.

You should contact Crossroads Inc. for info on the gun....he is the one that developed it

Clariffication:
Which Gun are we talking about? Im not sure We have added the 'Boomer' guns cannons to the ships, so far were only using my 'Screechers' High speed Cannon system. Those use 20" Cannons, The Battleship right now has 5 Main turrets and two smaller turrets.

The smaller turrets are Iowa Scale 18" Shots, Three of the Big Turrets are 20" Screechers. The other two turrets I guess are 'Up for grabs' but they would be 20" or more sized as well.

He wants full info on the screechers....just post it all the data in the thread

just put them as screechers

As per Requested, Data on "Screechers"

The primary aspect of this weopon system is a 400lb Depleted Uranium Shell. The shell has a Scram-Jet Jacket built into it so, once fired from the 20" Cannon, The Scram-Jet activates allowing it to do one of two options.

#1: Using a 'Solid' Uranium Shell, The Scram-Jet Fires early, adding its speed to the speed from cannon shot, turning it into a fearsom Kinetic Energy Weapon that can easily tear into other ships.

#2 Using a 'Warhead' Half Uranium Shell, The Scram-Jet waits until the intial arch from the Cannon shot begins to derad, then fires. This will almost Double the effective range of the shot, giving the oppurtunity to Bombard targets well out of range of any conventional counter attack.

bump

As per Requested, Data on "Screechers"

The primary aspect of this weopon system is a 400lb Depleted Uranium Shell. The shell has a Scram-Jet Jacket built into it so, once fired from the 20" Cannon, The Scram-Jet activates allowing it to do one of two options.

#1: Using a 'Solid' Uranium Shell, The Scram-Jet Fires early, adding its speed to the speed from cannon shot, turning it into a fearsom Kinetic Energy Weapon that can easily tear into other ships.

#2 Using a 'Warhead' Half Uranium Shell, The Scram-Jet waits until the intial arch from the Cannon shot begins to derad, then fires. This will almost Double the effective range of the shot, giving the oppurtunity to Bombard targets well out of range of any conventional counter attack.
ScramJet 20" DPU shell- Nothing, absolutely Nothing short of a moutain could take a hit from one. Nothing. No armour in the world could....vicious idea.
Let me look up the closest thing to a real 20"incher I can find, you could probably fire standard shell from the Gun as welll as DPUs I assume.
The armour/concrete penetration on the Screecher concept will sound as much like a godmod as the fire rate of the metalstorm.
You are gonna have one hell of a mean battleship.
I t-gramed Cross, about pssibly using Metalstorm on the 18" guns to create a burst fire mode for shore Bombardment. Is everyone else cool with this Idea?

Second, I have question about the ships anti-stealth capabilty.
What is it- the L-Radar is nice, but you cant expect that one system to handle everything. You got any others farfetched?

First, Thanks to Erinin for the postive comments about the Screecher idea... I do admit it will be hard for people to actually take this serious, its Sheer Evil Power will make it seem like a Godmod..its not.. just really really Nasty :twisted:

Second.. A coment on Stealth... Screw It!!!

Ok, We are going to have the Mother of all Battleships here.. its going to be designed to look Evil and intimadate people... Stealth is not what we are going for... As far as Radar seeking missles.. Well, between Advanced Sentinal and phalanx systems.. I think we have that covered... Plus, when we use this Behemoth, its not like we DONT want people to know its coming....

So... Why wast space, moeny, and Energy on a Steath system when we can devote it to other things... Anyone ok with this?

i think he meant anti-stealth

as an addition to the SMART-L, I could add the SMART-S Mk2 system aswell,

SMART-S

The SMART-S Mk2 has full 3D coverage up to 70 degrees elevation and two operating modes (13.5 / 27 rpm) with 250/150 km range respectively. SMART-S Mk2 is optimized for medium-to-long range surveillance and target designation in complex environments such as the littorals with its mix of sea, land, islands, coastal rain and thunderstorms and multiple radar targets, including small surface targets, helicopters and anti-ship missiles. The range performance is matched with the requirements for modern AAW defence missile systems such as the Evolved SeaSparrow Missile (ESSM).

Considering the project would include production rights for all, this would be cheaper

http://members.lycos.nl/voicustyle/Image5.jpg




we're going to have to fit all the systems on this picture

give me a list of additions and i'll do it

We still have the Two Back turrets Unassigned... What should we put in for them? Also I might suggest spreading the screechers out like this..

S=Screecher turret

Turrets
A(S)
B
C(S)
middle of Ship
D
E(S)

That way we would have two in front and one in back...Also, people currently on the Progect (please let me know if theres more)

The Atheists Reality
Farfetched prospect
Crossroads Inc
Erinin
Kazakhstania?

The Theoretical States recently applied our considerable IT and programming expertise in creating BAT-IIS.

BAT-IIS (BATtlefield Integrated Information System) is a powerful, simple to use software environment that allows a ship captain to monitor radar and sensor information, weapons targeting and status, navigational data, damage control and engineering, and a plethora of other ship functions and statuses in a easy to use and clear format. Not only is it capable of monitoring all aspects of the warship it is installed on, if other ships are similarly equipped, a fleet admiral or commander can bring up data on all other ships in his fleet-positional, targeting, damage status,etc. This allows the admiral to see at a glance how his fleet is dispositioned, and a current assesement of it's fighting strength and positioning. Data is transmitted by a triple-redundant ultraviolet emitter which is impossible to jam and is simple and reliable. Should ships stray out of LOS (line of sight) the software will use ships as a relay chain to get the information to the flag. Shoud the ship in question stray entirely outside LOS from all other vessels, it automatically switches to a VHF frequency hopping transmitter which is exceptionally difficult to jam.

In short, this software when properly integrated into your fleet provides both the individual ship's captain and the fleet admiral with peerless situational awareness and battlefield control. We can supply the software specifically modified to your systems and controls, along with installation and technical support personnel given a lead time of 2 months, for a lump sum price of 8.3 million Theoretical dollars, each additional vessel beyond the first can be similarly equipped for the paltry sum of 220 thousand Theoretical Dollars. This included all hardware (EMP and shock hardened computers, triple redundant, three different physical locations on board ship), sensors and radios, software, various integration intstrumentation for radars, etc and full installation, training and three year maintenance contract.

We look forward to doing business with you.

C. Melville Sharpe
Theoretical States Military Trade Advisor

Time and careful testing has proven that it is best to keep all turrets on ship that same size, then you don't have manuever to get a shot with the 20's and then have to move in to get a shot with the 18's, it would be best to equip it with 7 turrets of 20 inchers rather than 5 and 2. The 18's would be all but useless for anti-ship combat anyways because you would have anti-ship missles and such already, it would be best just to stick with one size all the way through.

I just thought I would add that for you guys to dwell on. It looks like a good ship, and it would serve a very good use as cannon shells are cheaper than missles. And by the way, are the cannons going to be controlled by radar or by optical and thermal sights?

Time and careful testing has proven that it is best to keep all turrets on ship that same size, then you don't have manuever to get a shot with the 20's and then have to move in to get a shot with the 18's, it would be best to equip it with 7 turrets of 20 inchers rather than 5 and 2. The 18's would be all but useless for anti-ship combat anyways because you would have anti-ship missles and such already, it would be best just to stick with one size all the way through.

I just thought I would add that for you guys to dwell on. It looks like a good ship, and it would serve a very good use as cannon shells are cheaper than missles. And by the way, are the cannons going to be controlled by radar or by optical and thermal sights?

The difference in turret size is there because uranium doesn't come cheap, incase of bombarding a target you can choose between differn't sizes for differn't targets.

the cannons will be controlled by a Radar/GPS system

Seraphim's Sword(18.1"/50)Naval Rifle.
Bore 18.1 inches
Mounted individually to aid in recoil dampning.
Recoil: 6'
Crew:75 (30 with MetalStorm)
Weight 162.4 tons(per barrel)
Length OA 831.9 inches
Weight Projectile 3219 lbs.
Muzzle Velocity 3,000 ft/s
Max. Elevation +65/-7 degrees
Max.Range 49,070 yards
Max.Effective Range 46,960 yards
Rate of Fire 2rnd/min basic--
(1rnd/3sec Single-3rnd/3sec'burst')With active MetalStorm.
Typical armor penetration:Horizontal 23.5 inches(at 46,960 yards)
Vertical 46.3 inches(point blank range).
The AP shell is capable of penetrating up to 56 feet of reinforced concrete.

Without exageration for the twenty inch 'Screecher'
you could easily double these stats for penetration(and call it conservative).
By my estimation the 20" screecher(though far lighter then the standard 18")
DPU round could easily give you
point blank(verticle) penetration in excess of 100inches of armour.
At range(Horizontal) 50 inches of armour.
Over 100feet of reenforced concrete.
The half and half screecher would loose penetration(some) but gain horrific range, absolutly horroific.
Sick.

Let me know if this design is ok for the 18s, it is a tweeked up version of the WWII Japanese 18/45.
You see what the 20s are potentialy capable of.
Not to mention the half and half Screecher, would get extended range(slight loss of penetration, but hell it has it to spare).
I like the BAT-IIS, Idea.
I like farfetcheds Smart-L and Smart-S combo.
Farfetched the Smart-L uses Global Positioning as one of it systems yes?
If Yes, then it could be used for OverTheHorizon targeting?
If no, we need to look into that, or have a spotter chopper aboard to extend our targeting capability.IMHO.

Time and careful testing has proven that it is best to keep all turrets on ship that same size, then you don't have manuever to get a shot with the 20's and then have to move in to get a shot with the 18's, it would be best to equip it with 7 turrets of 20 inchers rather than 5 and 2. The 18's would be all but useless for anti-ship combat anyways because you would have anti-ship missles and such already, it would be best just to stick with one size all the way through.

I just thought I would add that for you guys to dwell on. It looks like a good ship, and it would serve a very good use as cannon shells are cheaper than missles. And by the way, are the cannons going to be controlled by radar or by optical and thermal sights?
Actually, the best antishipping caliber for large guns is 14-16". Once you get above that, the range and efficiency begin to decrease significantly, as do rate of fire and accuracy. Big 20" guns look impressive, but with the exception of shore bombardment and close-range duels (which won't occur much due to radar advances), they weapon just doesn't cut it, especially as a 16" gun can put more ordnance on target in the same amount of time, and you can fit about 2 16" guns for every 20".
If you really wanted to mix armaments, which as said isn't the most advisable, I would say you should have smaller guns as the primaries, with a small number of larger guns to back them up should the ship get close enough. Otherwise, use a good number of smaller guns. For gun power, I wouldn't really go above 18".

CSJ, in RL, no one ever has gone above 18"(Japanese 18/45 was the largest naval gun floated)- the Japanese 18/45- was very comparable to the Iowa 16/50-
Except that it beat range.
I like 16s myself and did the orignal MetalStorm calcs on Iowa 16/50s.
However with physics behind Crossroads munitions they make an effective 20" gun possible.

Farfetched, do you do work on other systems besides Ship systems?
I need some for a tank I am piecing together.
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=120690&highlight=
Scroll down to the 'HighKing'MBT where you see ?s is where I need systems. Telegram me with any input.

Theoretical States idea sounds good..agree?

Farfetched, do you do work on other systems besides Ship systems?
I need some for a tank I am piecing together.
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=120690&highlight=
Scroll down to the 'HighKing'MBT where you see ?s is where I need systems. Telegram me with any input.

I can look into it...you want guidence systems?

---------

Yes, the smart-L uses GPS aswel as radar, making over the horizon targeting possible

so what range in miles/kilometers are we looking at?

Is it too late for the USSY to help?.

Yatonsa, what could you offer us?


this ship doesn't NEED much more! :twisted:

bump

Out of appreciation for TAR's assistance in its ongoing war against Galdanian oppression, several Ithuanian engineers have decided to assist TAR in development of its new battleship.

Scientists and nation's expert shipbuilders are needed to help construct a 'Super' battleship. the latest(modern) technology from various countries is needed to build a varied and well-balanced ship of exceptionally large size. payment to be agreed on a case by case basis.





(people who can provide stats(and sometime pictures) of things such as weapons systems, armor, lifeboat capacity, etc.
i know a thing or to about ships give me a few days ill see what i can do. my guess for a good ship u need 16-18 guns but instead of 4 sets of 3 take a turret off and add tomahawk missile silos or sumin

The provences are currently experimenting in ion propulsion for extreme long-range missle technology. We could make the technology available if you promised to test it on some of our dissenting neighbours in the UN; at a third of the usual price of course. REP

Yatonsa, what could you offer us?


this ship doesn't NEED much more! :twisted: I think I agree, not just that it doesn't need more, but at this point if we put much more on it would be God-Modding! I mean this ship Already IS the end all of Battleships, theres not much room left... We should begin weritting up the final list of what it has I think personally.

You know what they say about too many people 'Helping' on a project... can get overdone and muddled down...

The Mushroomosian Empire inquires why a battleship of such size is necessary. Aircraft carriers possess much more firepower, and have defense well in excess of that of a battleships air defense.

Why do you wish to spend this much to develop a gun filled target?

Oh geeze, I hate people who post in topics after only reading the last page.. . Here... read some reason why this isn't going to be a "Big Gun Target"


1. Battleships hail from an era where there was no effective defense against antiship weapons (there still is no defense against shells) other than heavy armor, so they have it. In fact, even some WWII light cruisers can stop missiles like the Exocet and Harpoon by virtue of armor alone. There are no missiles in production that are even marginally effective against an Iowa. Soviet naval officers have in fact repeatedly stated that they were deftly afraid of the Iowas, as they didn't have anything they thought would be effective against them.

2. Battleships are better suited against underwater threats as well. An Iowa was designed to withstand underwater explosions equivalent to 700 lbs of TNT with no damage, and would have been even better if there had been proper intelligence (they underestimated Japanese weapons). 700 lbs is equivalent to a 500-1000 lb class mine, or a light (and even some 21" ones) torpedo. A modern vessel of sufficient size could be designed to withstand anything short of nuclear torpedo/mine/depth charge.

3. Battleships have been proven effective since WWII. In Korea, they were used to telling effect against coastal installations. In Vietnam, they were poorly used (only being assigned targets after aircraft failed to destroy them, usually with heavy losses), but the North Vietnamese were so afraid of them that they refused to even consider negotiations while a battleship was in the area. In the Gulf war, they again proved themselves to be unrivaled bombardment platforms. And, as stated, the Soviets were terrified of them, often more so than they were of the American carriers. The intimidation factor still exists, and that alone makes these effective weapons..

Guys guys GUYS!

I gotta make several points.

Firstly:

An 120mm CIWS is pointless. SAM's are more effective against aircraft, and more accurate. An 120mm turret just takes up sapce. A small, 5km range SAM would be smaller, and you could fit in several missile launchers will reloaders into the space you could a 120mm turret.

Number two. Why not use several 16" Electro Thermal Chemical Cannons, which pack a real punch. These could be backed by some 18" inches ETC's. These are larger but pack one hell of a punch.

We would also need to sue some different shells. DU is great for armor piercing, but for shore bombardment it lacks. HE is also needed. Anyway, some of my views. Kashtan and some short range SAM's like Igla or Strela are needed.

As for the AA-3 placement, on top of the bridge, near the radar, near the rear and near the front, 4 turrets. As for Kashtan, up to 6 could be fitted on each side, one on the front and one on the rear. Golakepper is, I am afraid, redundent.

As for the AA-3 placement, on top of the bridge, near the radar, near the rear and near the front, 4 turrets. As for Kashtan, up to 6 could be fitted on each side, one on the front and one on the rear. Golakepper is, I am afraid, redundent.

Thats because goalkeeper is a last resort anti-missile system, not a AA gun

bump

i still think, that as it is now, this ship has sufficient weaponry.

bump

Yeah...lets kill this thread and announce the new class on the forum

i am posting it now

Linky?

right here

http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=122653

(trys to let thread Die)