NationStates Jolt Archive

Thanks to high subsizing we have attained something that looked and sounded impossible: using sound as a weapon. The concept of this fearsome technology is that ultra high sound waves "vibrate" structures apart. The range of the weapon is enormous, and the sound stops when it's absorbed or deflected by mountains or when it's too far from it's source. Everything is affected, inclduing tanks, airplanes and other vehicles; as long as they are within the cone.
Money was no problem thanks to previous sales of other things we have created and to donations from other countries.

A brief explanation on how it works:

http://siouxlandpaintball.com/jack/sales/ultrasound-system.jpg
http://siouxlandpaintball.com/jack/sales/explanation.jpg
As you may understand, this is only for sale for states who think that money is no issue. Interested people please send me a telegram.

small heads up thanks to Andmerica

Are you sure that you can build such speakers?

How do you activate it? Remote control?
How many years can they be operational?

Freaky. Glad I live in space. Sound doesn't carry in space.

Up in space, eh? :P

Wait. How do you control the cone of sound? I mean, it's all well and good that it spreads out and destroys a city, but what keeps it from spreading and continuing into other countries?

I was thinking on that.. :?

pretty cool weapon...who ever invented this is definatly a genious...but i am curious...how do u activate this weapon...and is there any feedback for from the nation that is setting it off?

How do you plan on powering this? Beyond that, it's a relatively solid bit of technology (I've done a lot of research in the past).

I'm sure it's against some international treaty. The collateral damage it causes would be immense.

Genocide will not be tolerated. Leveling a city full of civilians... discontinue this project.

The Sound waves will not mess up with the remote control waves?

Hope so.

And about the questions of the other users?

I'm sure it's against some international treaty. The collateral damage it causes would be immense.

I'm sure it's against some international treaty. The collateral damage it causes would be immense.

No, the question of: "Wait. How do you control the cone of sound? I mean, it's all well and good that it spreads out and destroys a city, but what keeps it from spreading and continuing into other countries?"

That's it.

It's mostly absorbed?!?!?!!!
You're talking about massive and I do mean MASSIVE amounts of sound. Only a small fraction of that would actually hit something. What about the rest and the sound that would continue on after it hits it target?

As for the sound flying off into space,think about what you just said. You're trying to tell me that your sound destroys a city and than magically bounces off into space?! No, actually, your sound would continue in a relatively straight path forwards until it left the earth. That would mean it would continue straight through numerous countries, with the wave getting larger as it went.

As you still haven't actually adressed these issues, we wait for your reply on them.

No, the question of: "Wait. How do you control the cone of sound? I mean, it's all well and good that it spreads out and destroys a city, but what keeps it from spreading and continuing into other countries?"

it's mostly absorbed when you hit a city and you can always lower the power/frequency. The maximum frequency causes total destruction. Half of it causes the destruction which can be compared to a large earthquake. However, I don't recommend using it to the full.

And the sound doesn't circle around the earth, it just fly's of into deep space. And if you aim on the right angle, you can wipe out entire cities without having to worry about possible unneeded casualties.

No, level of frequency will determine what is destroyed, not how much is destroyed. Power determines how much is destroyed. Make sense?

As for the soundwaves continuing and hitting other cities, sound dissipates over distance. If the city's far enough away, it probably won't matter.

So what is the range of one of these? How far from the target must the speakers be, and how far can sound that misses and isnt deflected go past the target?

It's not always the same. On an open plain it can be 500 KM, on top of a hill in can be 20 KM. It depends on the place where you are. The maximum effectivbe range on an open plain (with the speakers faced upwards; aming in a straight line) is 2500 KM

And does it lose power as it goes?

Is it possible to make "ultrasound shelters" out of some material which is able to withstand the sound waves, or would you just have to go a long way underground?

OOC: The main problem is finding the inherent frequencies of the buildings/structures/systems. That three speakers are being used might help cover a number of ranges, but unless you know exactly what materials were used, how the materials are joined, and in what proportions then you probably won't be able to do much damage, IMHO.

As far as 'power', the intensity (I) decreases exponentially over distances (by distance-squared rule...go twice the distance have 1/4 the intensity). If a structure is vibrationally dampened (ie, has some earthquake-protection features) then the effect would probably be minimal as the dampeners absorb the excess vibrations.

Also, thanks to the nonlinear nature of air, the devices probably won't have a range of more than a few km...since the frequency you send out will be split into several near-same but alternate frequencies. Because of this, I'd think that the range would probably never reach 500km (about 100 times the distance to the horizon from ground level...but that's another issue).

I live in a cave system, that's pretty safe. Use the black noise for non destructive death. As the angle of the cone isn't variable, then a large amount of the sound will miss the city, and the magnitude needed to cause massive damage will mean that the sound wave has to be powefull enough to keep going long after it's main target; deafening those too close.

Hm... I'm not expert, but thankfully I've got a friend in Car Audio who makes for great reference in these matters.


First may I ask that decibles are we talking about? Because the limit is about maybe 200... the current record being about 172.

Then I would like to know how, using current tech or even near future technology you managed to achieve such a high frequency without totally destroying the speakers in the process.

Of course, we don't know the details of the speakers so I can't fully debunk your technology... but speakers as we know it couldn't do this IMO.

How do you reach such a high frequency without resorting to just telling me its "bloodly big magnets"?

When you say sound you really don't have to hear it. It are vibrations in the air. And about all the other rules about speed, range and frequency; it's just a game. If we could't even imagine such things then nationstates would be much less interesting.

OOC: In that case I will Ignore your technology's use... even though all my buildings are fortified (and thus earthquake protected) I feel that you have failed to resolve key issues such as the notion that it would destroy itself before destroying any of my cities.

Firsty, nanobots aren't invented yet and people are selling them. Let's not dicuss the realistic issue. And a magnets power can be boost to stratospheric heights thanks to electromagnetism

OOC: Nanobots are ignored by Near Future tech nations such as myself, as well as those who are Modern Tech... oddly enough they are also ignored by alot of future tech...

Realism is important to alot of nations on NS, trust me on this...

We have this but on a much downsized scale. We have it mounted on the back of our Vodnik (its our improved HMVEE improved to be amphibious and much harder.) (http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=107030) We use it to imobbilise people in riots and disperse crowds. Very effective.

ehm... your ears only hear from 100 hz to 30000 hz. So you can't possibly hear my frequency

OOC: That has no relevance to what I asked.

Then I would like to know how, using current tech or even near future technology you managed to achieve such a high frequency without totally destroying the speakers in the process.


But I suppose using a frequency soooo high that it could destroy building doesn't risk destroying itself in the process? I mean, it's not like there is a alot of force invovled huh?

Even if we had the money and need for this weapon, we would not use it for the diplomatic and human cost. It is highly indiscriminate and inhumane.

My Nation of hadium would like to buy such a weapon.

But I suppose using a frequency soooo high that it could destroy building doesn't risk destroying itself in the process? I mean, it's not like there is a alot of force invovled huh?

It's not the frequency that is force. The frequency must be tuned to the inherent frequency of the building. When the building is met by sound waves at the same inherent frequency, it begins to vibrate. With a continuing application of the energy, the building will begin to vibrate enormously, eventually ripping itself apart.

Magnitude is the force, and this imparts a high magnitude upon the targets...but I doubt that the magnitude will be maintained over the claimed ranges.

If you want to see the effects of such an action, do a google search for the "Tacoma-Narrows Bridge"...a famous example of a similar effect.

As far as the emitter panels go, they won't shake themselves apart, even if the target frequency is near the inherent frequency of the speakers...this is becuase the speakers are the impellers of the force and, by making the force, they do not pick it up again within themselves. I make a different device on NS that uses two, nearly identical ultrasonic waves with a high (though not as high) magnitude. When the waves begin to degrade in the air, the waves interact and drop to a state that generates an extremely high-pressure, nearly-audible (sub-acoustic) sound that effectively creates a localized blast wave. This can be used to take down human suspects without lethal force or to dissuade hostile crowds in a few fractions of a second. The ranges, however, are very small.

Magnitude is the force, and this imparts a high magnitude upon the targets...but I doubt that the magnitude will be maintained over the claimed ranges.

Makes sense I suppose. It just seems a bit much, looking at the basics of it all... I didn't think they could make something like that with our current understanding of science.

None the less, it's nice to have some information and I thank you, so it's likey that any nation could just bomb the hell out of it before anyone can get it into range... I also suspect that such technology isn't very durable to harsh conditions and bombardment.

How possible is it to find out the frequency of a building? Is it disernable from a range or is it simpley a matter of estimation?



On another point, wanting to be sure and all, are you saying that reaching these levels of cababilty possible with the current materials and technologies?

got anything below 20hz? then im interested

im not so sure i can manage the natural vibration frequency of any given structure but i know infrasound will make a nice mess of opposition troops....

got anything below 20hz? then im interested

im not so sure i can manage the natural vibration frequency of any given structure but i know infrasound will make a guranteed mess of opposition personnel....

Kelanis recommends the usage of naturally resonating materials such as quartz in the usage of ultrasonics, rather than just building a giant loudspeaker and trying to deafen the planet.

Makes sense I suppose. It just seems a bit much, looking at the basics of it all... I didn't think they could make something like that with our current understanding of science.

Possible? Yes. Expensive and complicated as f*ck? Yes.

None the less, it's nice to have some information and I thank you, so it's likey that any nation could just bomb the hell out of it before anyone can get it into range... I also suspect that such technology isn't very durable to harsh conditions and bombardment.

The material is pretty well maintainable (probably as much as any advanced ATGM, which isn't to say that it's nearly as rugged as an AK-47)...thankfully, flat-panel emitters are fairly durable and composite plastic casings can protect it against most (not all) simple damage. It would still need a carrying case/protective covering.

How possible is it to find out the frequency of a building? Is it disernable from a range or is it simpley a matter of estimation?

By materials, there is a certain range of likely frequencies, but it would still have to have a fairly complicated sensory-relay system. It could probably be done with one speaker that is set to vary over a number of frequencies over time, with a laser rangefinder/inferometer to sense when the building vibrates especially powerfully in response...it might take a minute to get the calibration right for any building. I'd think that the application would be best for targeted urban destruction when involved with urban assault more than, say, a stand-off range weapon. If HMMWV-mounted, it could be used to attack a building that is suspected of hiding insurgents or snipers...but it might have to risk coming within sniping range for effective use.

On another point, wanting to be sure and all, are you saying that reaching these levels of cababilty possible with the current materials and technologies?

Absolutely, the device that I have made is already prototyped and in the process of being perfected IRL. The main issue would be developing the type of software that could determine the frequencies of target buildings and control the emitters and such...and a sufficiently powerful computer system to process and control everything. A small supercomputer could probably cut down the frequency-ID time to a decent level.

Thanks very much for bringing some reason to this discussion WA.

Sure, you could in theory generate some sound waves which would cause a structure to resonate with such force that it shakes itself apart, but to do so would require a good deal of luck regarding the construction style and materials (insomuch as not only are they weak to the shaking, but you know exactly what they are) and a massive amount of force. Some opera singers can hit the resonance frequency of glass and shatter panes of it, but the machine required to hit the resonance of steel would be so massive and expensive and probably impossible any way.

It's not the worst idea, but saying "I can destroy your city with my l33t sond system" does not really fly. A smaller unit with very little range, that could collapse concrete bunkers, say, on the other hand, would be much more possible and feasible to the bulk of those on NS.

It's not the worst idea, but saying "I can destroy your city with my l33t sond system" does not really fly. A smaller unit with very little range, that could collapse concrete bunkers, say, on the other hand, would be much more possible and feasible to the bulk of those on NS.

This is more or less what I mean... I'm just crap with words, thanks.

anything below 20hz is beyond human earshot, you can't hear it, but you can feel it. its a very deep, inaudible bass and the resulting damage can be profound, under the right conditions.

frequencies of 7-8 hz at high volume can rupture internal organs.

Other ranges below the 20hz range are attributable to a variety of mental and physical disturbances, visual impairment, confusion, disorientation, nausua, heightened aggression, to name a few.

i can supply references. if you can qualify your statements.

Holy panooly, you seem to confuse vibration frequency with energy. An example of a powerful, low-frequency vibration would be an earthquake. The initial tremors are audible as infrasounds only.
A high frequency with little energy will not make much of a weapon. Even if you could reach tens of thousands of kiloherzes, it wouldn't do jack if the volume were too low.

But a lower frequency can still vibrate at smaller or greater energy than ultrasound. I do not understand your example.

If you play that 20,000 kHz sound of yours at 0.5 decibels, for example, I have trouble believing that it will reduce distant buildings to rubble.

And how do you explain earthquakes destroying cities if not by the simple fact that their vibration is highly energetic and of a low frequency?

plese give me a tank and a aroplane :oops:

Yep, Kuttner, get conventional weapons elsewhere.

On-topic:
I still think an infrasound variant of this would have its uses.
Have you considered what this sound weapon could do when used underwater? Sound carries faster and farther in water. With the right frequency, it could be used against ship hulls.

We are highly interested in possible naval applications of this weapon.

If you can give us a price.... 8)