NationStates Jolt Archive

We know. Freedom Country itsnt the best at tanks. There are experts out there that have produced far better tanks at lower prices. They have been more versatile and practical.

Our first tank was designed for us by Crookfur, and was the FT-5, and was a relative success. It served us for a while and replaced the M1A2 with relative ease. Also was the FT-4, a light tank that would use numbers o its advantage. It turned out to be more of a success than the FT-5, as it now serves with an Electro Thermal Cannon, and is used for paradrop situations.

Then there was the FT-9. A relative behemoth, it packed a 30mm Gatling Gun, 40mm Chain Gun, .50 cal MG and a 130mm ETC. Relativily big and slow, it still serves as a backup tank, and for heavy firepower in assaults. The tank however, serving us most, is the T-80UM5 from Dark Terror. It serves us today as the MBT of choice.

However, the lack of the ability to build our own has leaft us short of numbers, and back to using the FT-5. So, we have decided to produce a new tank to surpass all. Advanced preview:

1st Concept
http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-9/387586/MBT.JPG

2nd Concept
http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-9/387586/MBT-TOW.JPG

3rd Concept:
http://www.gamingfiles.com/screenshots/27/others/screen013.jpg

These are the proposals. 1 and 3 use a new internal TOW system, while 2 uses the good old pod.

Buy the latest Bisonic GT series tanks, they can kill your FT-5 at 3km.

Texarnica would like to contribute our massive automobile manufacturing plants and their expertise in generating new versions of tanks to help Freedom Country. We will also donate 4.5 Billion dollars toward the development of this new tank. Our only condition is that we get a small discount should we consider buying these tanks.

Interesting FC. Always nice to see your developments. Lets see how it goes. Do you perhaps need extra funding?

Buy the latest Bisonic GT series tanks, they can kill your FT-5 at 3km.

Hahahaha....haha....go away.

Well, this thing is gonna kill yours at 3km.

Tex: Of course, and thanks.

*shrugs, and goes away*
Keep in mind Ill be there to point out all its mishaps when it comes out.

Hehe. I am unmishapping it here. Realistic, :D.

Bayorta, I will tell you when.

Well, when your using tanks what sort of combat are you facing usually? Urban? Wide plains? Mountains? Muddy lands? Well just build a tank that is best suited for the type of action you will use it for.

Well, when your using tanks what sort of combat are you facing usually? Urban? Wide plains? Mountains? Muddy lands? Well just build a tank that is best suited for the type of action you will use it for.

Hey, I remeber your first storefront......orbital laser systems.....

Anyway, we face mountains and urban, so we are building something like that.

But that is only in defence. Offence is different.

FC: Instead of building main battle tanks, for which you will be competing with Dark Terror, Attican Motorwerke, among other designers, you should build 'oddity' tanks, like bridgebuilders, motorized mortars, et cetera.

FC: Instead of building main battle tanks, for which you will be competing with Dark Terror, Attican Motorwerke, among other designers, you should build 'oddity' tanks, like bridgebuilders, motorized mortars, et cetera.

Why? because you dont think I will live up? I dont think so....

Hell, its easier, too. You can do whatever the hell you want with them.

No because:
1. You are competing with people who build more tanks
2. You are competing, and therefore, get less profits.

This tank would not stand up to either DTs or my top-of-the-line tank. Therefore, I would classify this as a medium tank (although my classification system sucks, because Leopard 2s are also MTs).

The other problem is that your cannon and turret are both at the front of the tank, and unless your powerplant ways a LOT, it will be front-heavy. It also has a large gap between the chassis and the turret.

Also, if you have small numbers of T-80UM5s, you could consider bulk-purchasing Leopard 3s from us, basically a slightly weaker version of the King Leopard.

http://www.kuattech.com/KingLeopard.png

No because:
1. You are competing with people who build more tanks
2. You are competing, and therefore, get less profits.

This tank would not stand up to either DTs or my top-of-the-line tank. Therefore, I would classify this as a medium tank (although my classification system sucks, because Leopard 2s are also MTs).

The other problem is that your cannon and turret are both at the front of the tank, and unless your powerplant ways a LOT, it will be front-heavy. It also has a large gap between the chassis and the turret.

Also, if you have small numbers of T-80UM5s, you could consider bulk-purchasing Leopard 3s from us, basically a slightly weaker version of the King Leopard.

http://www.kuattech.com/KingLeopard.png

To let you know, anything with 2 Guns in it is ingored by Freedom Country. Also, it has large top and rear armor amounts, for added protection.

And how, may I ask, do you build more tanks? How do you know (however you do, we are a very much aerospace country, hence our mountains).

Also, I dont plan to sell it any time soon.

Why would you ignore anything with 2 guns? Even the soviets in RL had tanks with two cannon.

And what do you mean 'And how, may I ask, do you build more tanks?'?

Why would you ignore anything with 2 guns? Even the soviets in RL had tanks with two cannon.

And what do you mean 'And how, may I ask, do you build more tanks?'?
Didnt say I did build more tanks.

I find 2 large cannons on one tank impossible. So I ignore it. Its stupid anyway.....

I build planes and helicopters. I dont do tanks.

We (americans) used a tank destroyer which had something like 4 106mm guns in world war 2.

We (americans) used a tank destroyer which had something like 4 106mm guns in world war 2.

Well, if there was an IGNORE cannon in RL.....

Still, tank destroyer.

We (americans) used a tank destroyer which had something like 4 106mm guns in world war 2.
Actually, Tank destroyers mottos are "Shoot 'n' Scoot", meaning the whole purpose behind the tank destroyers is to blow the shit out of one tank, and haul ass outta there. I dont think any american designers (or any designers with an engineering degree) would think of putting four cannons on one tank, because to even make that sucker move there would be practically zero armor, and maybe have a top speed of like 10 mph. So no, your trying to pull some bullshit trivia out of your ass to make yourself look smart.

We (americans) used a tank destroyer which had something like 4 106mm guns in world war 2.
Actually, Tank destroyers mottos are "Shoot 'n' Scoot", meaning the whole purpose behind the tank destroyers is to blow the shit out of one tank, and haul ass outta there. I dont think any american designers (or any designers with an engineering degree) would think of putting four cannons on one tank, because to even make that sucker move there would be practically zero armor, and maybe have a top speed of like 10 mph. So no, your trying to pull some bullshit trivia out of your ass to make yourself look smart.

Hey, any tank with 2 cannon sis still ignored, hehe.

Any more comments other than your tank is crap.

The MT-1500 Mammoth tank utilizes FOUR cannons and it works great!!!!
click the image to view a large one.

http://redalert2.bonusweb.cz/grafika/mammoth_s.jpg (http://members.lycos.nl/ccrenegade/pics/toolstrade/3.jpg)

The MT-1500 Mammoth tank utilizes FOUR cannons and it works great!!!!
click the image to view a large one.

http://redalert2.bonusweb.cz/grafika/mammoth_s.jpg (http://members.lycos.nl/ccrenegade/pics/toolstrade/3.jpg)

You are modern tech though.

Freedom Country: Unless you can give some kind of technological basis on why you would ignore a tank with two 130mm cannon, I will simply ignore FC, as I will ignore any country that ignores another countries main battle tank.

Well, when your using tanks what sort of combat are you facing usually? Urban? Wide plains? Mountains? Muddy lands? Well just build a tank that is best suited for the type of action you will use it for.

Hey, I remeber your first storefront......orbital laser systems.....

Anyway, we face mountains and urban, so we are building something like that.

But that is only in defence. Offence is different.

orbital laser systems? I think you got the wrong guy. Although I did propose the Doomdays Weapon hehe.

Well anyways if your going for urban and mountains then I suggest thicker armour on top and bottom of tanks. Range isn't important on heavy urban areas just accurate and devestating shots. Plus, give the gun a wider firing arc, to hit those high mountain tops or buildings. But, remember urban and mountain like terrain is a death trap for tanks. anti tank missiles launched from mountain tops, soldiers climbing out of sewers and putting anti tank mines under tanks. Many hiding spots for bazooka dudes, anti tank guns and mines. You would be best to limit tanks for defensive purposes.

Offense wise is a different matter. Going for cross country, give your tank speed, side and front protection from enemy fire and long range accurate shots.

Heavily forested areas will probably need heavy armour on all sides and top. speed can be sacrificed for power. So that you can tear through trees and rocks with ease. Range isn't an issue since there are alot of things that can stop your shots and hide your enemies. For swampy and muddy areas I would suggest not using tanks altogether.

Freedom Country: Unless you can give some kind of technological basis on why you would ignore a tank with two 130mm cannon, I will simply ignore FC, as I will ignore any country that ignores another countries main battle tank.

Well hey, since you put it that way.

It is still the most impractical thing Ive seen in a while.....after a doomsday machine :wink:

The King Leopard has a 2300HP Diesel Engine, and has independent power converters for the two cannon. It uses an intelligent AI system to independently elevate and turn the cannon (cannon is plural for cannon in tank terms). Therefore, with the proper AI, you can simply select your target and the tank will fire for you. You can even multifire thanks to the duel turrets. The main problems are: Slower, and you use a lot of ammo.

The King Leopard has a 2300HP Diesel Engine, and has independent power converters for the two cannon. It uses an intelligent AI system to independently elevate and turn the cannon (cannon is plural for cannon in tank terms). Therefore, with the proper AI, you can simply select your target and the tank will fire for you. You can even multifire thanks to the duel turrets. The main problems are: Slower, and you use a lot of ammo.

And fuel. And it probably weighs about 100 tons and as is slow as a pig...

Not 100 tons. Using advanced armor composites (currently Ti/C, we plan on migrating to Diamond-laced composites), we are able to get the weight to 60tons, although it is still slow compared to other tanks.

Not 100 tons. Using advanced armor composites (currently Ti/C, we plan on migrating to Diamond-laced composites), we are able to get the weight to 60tons, although it is still slow compared to other tanks.

And a rather fat target.....

We (americans) used a tank destroyer which had something like 4 106mm guns in world war 2.


You may be thinking of the Ontos, a lightly armoured infantry support "tank" deployed by the US marines during veitnam, it featured 6 externally mounted 105 or 106mm (not sure) recoiless guns, it was useful until you realise that you had to get out of the tank to reload... but i saw alot of use supporting the marines.

Damn Godmodding Australians..

http://www.jed.simonides.org/tanks/sierra/sentinal_series/ac3exp/ac3exp_001.jpg

ACIII Sentinel Cruiser Tank mounting twin 25pdr guns

HAHAHA....

Oh well, I say again, if there was a ignore cannon in RL....

Those are tiny things though. I ignore twin 120mm cannons....

if you ignore twin cannons without any basis for the ignore, I ignore you. Simple as that.

Oh come on. Twin 120mm cannons.

Also, mainly because no tank has done it properly in RL, other than tiny maybe 50mm ones.

OOC:
Who needs three cannons? It would be better to mount one, but a good one.

- Joseph (Iosef, Russian pronunciation) Stalin

FC: Just because they don't do it in real life doesn't mean it isn't possible. Most governments are too cheap to do it. Twin 120mm cannon, made out of the correct alloy, can be light. If your powerplant is powerful enough, the tank can still be relatively fast, as well.

OOC:
He retains the right to ignore anyone he pleases, much to anyone who does have such weapons' discontent. However, I think ignore should only apply to the impossible and not the impractical. Still, his choice.

hey, twin 120mm cannons.

I think that is impossible. Dont argue, thats just my view. And I think its a bit stupid of him to ingore my nation if I ignore one TANK.

how many can i buy?

OOC:
None, read the topic name, New Tank In Development.

Ill donate 5 billion £ sterling to give the tank an advanced TOW system. As long as i get 4 prototypes 2 test.

New concepts.

**OOC:Sorry if this seems sexist but in RL women dont drive tanks(not that i know of, im not saying its fair but thats life)**

2 120mm guns in a tank is a load of crap because ud need an extra gunner, more ammo (meaning a bigger tank), slower and also a tank with one good 120mm gun can do just as good a job aswell as having the capability to fire more rounds in a smaller/faster tank.
And dont say that you dont need an extra gunner because if the gun busts up and can be mended then the tank has to be taken appart to get into the Gun. If it cant be fixed thats a load of weight that doesnt need to be there and is slowing the tank down. OK, now you say you can take the gun out, am i right? Well theonly problem is that the tank has more weight on one side. Solution? To make it so that the gun can be moved into the middle. This would make the tank extra expensive aswell as taking a long time. Youd have to be able to move the seats/equipment for the gunner because or else he cant get at his rounds. this means moving all the other seats/equipment too and by this time a replacement will have arrived or the war will have finished. If this hasnt happened then theyll have been destroyed by enemy fire or got a replacement!!!

Twin 50mms? The Sentinel pictured earlier- a very small tank by modern standards- had twin 87.5mm guns (best guess/vague memory off hand). The Germans built one with a 128mm gun and a co-axial 75mm, and had vague plans for twin 115mms, twin 128mms, and so on. It is quite possible, it's just not very practical. I don't see why they need be ignored when they could just as easily be knocked out. If your enemy uses them, all the better! They're attacking their own war industry for you.

But, what do I care? Carry on.

Extra gunner? Or extra autoloader.

The Germans with their Rheinmettal have done it again, developing a lightweight 120mm L47.5 or so gun, aimed at fully replacing 105mm tank guns. I have a link to that somewhere....

FC, I am ignoring you because half of my tank corps is King Leopards, which are dual 120mm cannon tanks.

FC, I am ignoring you because half of my tank corps is King Leopards, which are dual 120mm cannon tanks.
Thats no reason to ignore!!!
Oh well, its a freeish forum.

Gibralter-yes it is. If he ignores my military, I will ignore him. That simple. And to answer your comments:

We dont use gunners, autoloaders are king. More ammo = slower usually, but we also use a more powerful power plant. Two is better, especially since they have small motors that can turn them independently. We use advanced software to control their motion and assist the targeter in aiming and firing at enemy tanks. You really know nothing about how my tank is designed, you are assuming I am just modifying an Abrahms to have 2 cannon? Besides the fact that it is designed more like a Leopard, it is designed to work.

FC-How the hell is it impossible? You haven't answered that question.

Simply because no one else has done it.

Anyway, bigger, slower target and when u lose 'em (you will :wink: ) they will cost you more.

Its a bit like the Germans in WW2. They went for top quality tanks but couldnt build enough of 'em, and the many guns of the allies just smashed 'em.

Unlike the Germans in WW2, I have about 400mill people, and a huge industrial base. And the guns of the Sherman couldn't even penetrate the armor of a Tiger. It often took 5 shots to knock one out. Also, the King Leopard is the same height as the Leopard 2, it is slightly longer though. For most operations, though, we use the Cheetah Light Tank.

The reason no one else has done it is because in RL, people are CHEAP. The Kuklinski administration has poured money into military spending, therefore, the Attican military gets the best stuff. We can build King Leopards quite fast as we have factories devoted to building them, as well as a lot of technical expertise in building them. We expect in 10 years, though, they will be phased out and a new tank will be built. And I have faught wars using the King Leopards, it has Diamond-intermesh armor (took 20 years of research), and can absorb 120mm shots to it's front (sides will probably disable but not destroy it). In our war with FPC, the only King Leopards we lost were to mines, and newer tanks have anti-mine armor on the bottom.

But, as I said before, I prefer to use the Cheetah, as it is more mobile, can be airdropped, and has a 120mm cannon just the same, as well as TOW missiles. I also use the Leopard 2M, which is a modification of the Leopard 2A6, which basically turns it from a Main Battle Tank into a Medium Tank. Now, I implore you to stop ignoring dual cannon tanks, or at least, only ignore the ones that physically CANNOT do it (IE small powerplants, et cetera). My tank should physically be able to do it, it has a powerful enough power plant, uses Oxythane fuel (which I RP developed, but looking at the chemical formula, might actually work technically)...

If you unignore it, I might also sell you some Leopard 3s (Basically, King Leopards, but slightly modified for resale, IE not as powerful)...

The guns of the Sherman couldn't even penetrate the armor of a Tiger. It often took 5 shots to knock one out. Also, the King Leopard is the same height as the Leopard 2, it is slightly longer though.

Yes, but in WW2 there were 6 Shermans to 1 Tiger....

Even with a huge industry, some of its going to be hit in wartime....

True. We have a rather small tank corps, but we use our tanks quite often.

Germany did not have the infrastructure to mass produce tigers in large number, unlike the US. I, on the other hand, can produce a lot quite quickly. However, in war time, in the case that I lose the primary factories, we would switch from King Leopard production to Cheetah production, or, if necessary, Leopard 2Ms. King Leopards are designed to be a spearhead of an assault or defense.

Hmmm. Still, having half your Tank Force with them is a bit stupid....

So you use your Cheetahs a bit like the Romans used their Auxiliaries?

As skirmishers.

Anyway, you are unignored. I prefer to have numbers. 2 tanks on one of yours is great since your tank can olny target one at once.

OOC: They -can- target two, but only if they are within a 10 degree radius of one another, which would be rare, but the little motors can only move it so far! Plus, the target is trained to train both guns on one target rather than one on one, as it is more effective to hit a tank twice then two tanks once.

Our Cheetahs are fast, light tanks that can be dropped behind enemy lines. They can be used as skirmishers.

You have to remember, though. Two of your tanks on one of mine, you still have to comprehend that I have Cheetahs and Leopard 2Ms fighting support.

OOC2: 10 degree radius is range dependent, though. It is planned that we will remove support for dual targeting in the future as it is rarely used. The only campaign it was used in was the Second Attica-FPC campaign, and not with much success, due to old CPUs being used. Newer ones are in use, but, as I said, we prefer the penetrating action of two shells on one target than two shells on two targets.

Hmm...intresting design. I'd go on about the tank Im developing, although you porbably wouldnt care, and would ignore it, as it has two cannons (1x 125mm and 1x 90mm). Mounted over under combo, so no need for an extra loader or autoloader.