New fighter Improved F-4 Phantom, Partners wanted.
Of the council of clan
05-10-2003, 02:58
We would like to develop a new fighter on the F-4 Phantom platform.
We would like, better engines, improved Avianocis(look down, shoot down capability), Use of RAM(Radar Absorbent Materials) Fly by wire control systems, AMRAAM Compatibility. Possible Supercruise capabilty.
Of the council of clan
05-10-2003, 04:19
No one else is interested in helping devolop a improved F-4 Phantom, I'd do it myself but i'm fuzzy on what to do with it.
Try to base it off that israeli F-4 which matched the F-18 in performance.
Of the council of clan
05-10-2003, 05:36
Try to base it off that israeli F-4 which matched the F-18 in performance.
hmmm. could you provide a link?
hmm, I have been working on an improved F-4 fighter bomber for quite some time (still not ready :roll: ), and there is an improved isreali F-4 already as mentioned (F-2000 or F-4-2000? ) i think so i dunno take those into consideration when you make yours, I would posibly be interested in craeating both a pure fighter variant and a fighter/bomber version of my phantom
Of the council of clan
05-10-2003, 05:45
well thrust Vectoring and Supercruise would definetly make it a better aerial superiorty fighter, a titanium construction would probalby add more payload(stronger lighter airframe with stronger engines?) and RAM on the leading edges of the Radar cross section.
Crimmond
05-10-2003, 05:59
well thrust Vectoring and Supercruise would definetly make it a better aerial superiorty fighter, a titanium construction would probalby add more payload(stronger lighter airframe with stronger engines?) and RAM on the leading edges of the Radar cross section.OOC: My dad was a Marine mechanic in the mid80's and worked on the F4C. He said that thrust vectoring would put way too much stress on the airframe, even strengthened. The plane's shape just isn't designed to give it that much agility.
Crookfur
05-10-2003, 14:08
A decent radar and a new cockpit would make the Phantom a far nastier customer and shouldn't be that difficult, if you want i'll do some specs for installed systems.
Of the council of clan
05-10-2003, 15:25
A decent radar and a new cockpit would make the Phantom a far nastier customer and shouldn't be that difficult, if you want i'll do some specs for installed systems.
that would be appreciated. Could you do the Fly By Wire system as well?(your doing better avionics right)
Crookfur
05-10-2003, 15:27
Yep a fly by system would be integral to any upgrades (if you are aiming for a HMSS then fly by wire is pretty much needed, well not needed but since you are incorperating lots of electronics anyway...)
Of the council of clan
05-10-2003, 15:43
oh and what engines should i get for supercruise, i'm looking for mach 2.5-2.8 max and Mach 1.3-1.5 supercruise
Crookfur
05-10-2003, 15:45
I'm not really up on engines to be honest, sensors/ targeting systems and cockpits are where Crookfur arms have been concentrating.
Of the council of clan
05-10-2003, 15:52
Thats cool, whatever help you can give. you want to be considered a 30% partner in this aircraft?
United Elias
05-10-2003, 15:54
Im good on engines and I have F-4s in service.
A key problem with the airframe though is that the negines are positioned right next to each other as opposed to the Mig-29 and Fi015 etc where there is space in between. This caused many losses over Vietnam where an engine fire can spread to the other one easily.
Of the council of clan
05-10-2003, 15:59
Im good on engines and I have F-4s in service.
A key problem with the airframe though is that the negines are positioned right next to each other as opposed to the Mig-29 and Fi015 etc where there is space in between. This caused many losses over Vietnam where an engine fire can spread to the other one easily.
is there anyway of spacing the engines out a lil more and adding some more insulation?
I have a base one, we can add some better radar and etc to it.
F-4X Super Phantom
Great affordable Multirole aircraft with improved manueverability.
Power Plant: Two General Electric turbojet engines with afterburners and thrust vectoring
Thrust: 20,000 pounds
Length: 62 feet, 11 inches
Height: 16 feet, 5 inches
Wingspan: 38 feet, 11 inches
Speed: 1,700 mph
Ceiling: 60,000 feet
Maximum Takeoff Weight: 62,000 pounds
Range: 1,200 miles.
Armament: 10 AAM's, AGM-65 Maverick missiles, AGM-88 HARM missile capability, and one fuselage centerline bomb rack and four pylon bomb racks capable of carrying 15,500 pounds of general purpose bombs.
Canards for added manueverability
Countermeasures provided by state of the art systems
Crookfur
05-10-2003, 16:24
Thats cool, whatever help you can give. you want to be considered a 30% partner in this aircraft?
We would be delighted.
Of the council of clan
05-10-2003, 16:25
I have a base one, we can add some better radar and etc to it.
F-4X Super Phantom
Great affordable Multirole aircraft with improved manueverability.
Power Plant: Two General Electric turbojet engines with afterburners and thrust vectoring
Thrust: 20,000 pounds
Length: 62 feet, 11 inches
Height: 16 feet, 5 inches
Wingspan: 38 feet, 11 inches
Speed: 1,700 mph
Ceiling: 60,000 feet
Maximum Takeoff Weight: 62,000 pounds
Range: 1,200 miles.
Armament: 10 AAM's, AGM-65 Maverick missiles, AGM-88 HARM missile capability, and one fuselage centerline bomb rack and four pylon bomb racks capable of carrying 15,500 pounds of general purpose bombs.
Canards for added manueverability
Countermeasures provided by state of the art systems
well yours is where i got the idea, but I want more speed out of it, and a greater payload. and to have RAM, Titanium skin. But i guess the Canards are a good idea. Hmmm.
I wouldn't worry about speed, it's top speed is already near mach 2.4. I would concentrate more on improving range and payload. RAM isn't much good because it will just increase the weight and drag, which will decrease range, decrease speed, and decrease load carrying capability.
Of the council of clan
05-10-2003, 16:31
I wouldn't worry about speed, it's top speed is already near mach 2.4. I would concentrate more on improving range and payload. RAM isn't much good because it will just increase the weight and drag, which will decrease range, decrease speed, and decrease load carrying capability.
ok, i would like to add 80% to the range and 70% to payload, and dammnit i want supercruise.
United Elias
05-10-2003, 16:32
Im good on engines and I have F-4s in service.
A key problem with the airframe though is that the negines are positioned right next to each other as opposed to the Mig-29 and Fi015 etc where there is space in between. This caused many losses over Vietnam where an engine fire can spread to the other one easily.
is there anyway of spacing the engines out a lil more and adding some more insulation?
difficult without redoing the airframe, but we can add better indulation like titanium and kevlar lining and anyway modern turbofans have better fire suppresion technology anyway.
I wouldn't worry about speed, it's top speed is already near mach 2.4. I would concentrate more on improving range and payload. RAM isn't much good because it will just increase the weight and drag, which will decrease range, decrease speed, and decrease load carrying capability.
ok, i would like to add 80% to the range and 70% to payload, and dammnit i want supercruise.
that's insane, even the F/A-18 E/F has only about 40% larger payload and range. Without heavily modifying the airframe I would stick to about 35-40%