NationStates Jolt Archive

The Elias Aerospace Corporation has now published the design of the EA-60 Carrier Support Aircraft to conicide with the decision on the design of the future aircraft carrier expected later today. The aircraft will peform a variety of roles in different guises including early warning, electronic warfare and carrier on board delivery.

The prototype is under construction and first flight is expected in a few months time.

http://www.angelfire.com/ex2/unitedelias/csa-ts0036-12-01_5.jpg

It is almost guaranteed that export sales will be needed to support the program as the Elias Navy will not require that many aircraft.

Project partners are also welcomed.

The Crookfur has passed a dcision to place an intent to buy order on 120 of these aircraft (or funding if you want).

25 please

These can be launched from Nimitz Class Carriers, right?

The Crookfur has passed a dcision to place an intent to buy order on 120 of these aircraft (or funding if you want).

Actually we'd rather have you as a 20% partner and have you do the electronics and systems like on the bomber.

These can be launched from Nimitz Class Carriers, right?

yes

FC: we havent decided on all the versions yet so you cant order any just yet.

I will pre order then

I will join the project, as the good old E-2 Hawkeye is getting on a bit.

Anything you need doing especially?

I can do counter measures, landing gear, HUD, some basic electronics, and structure/aerodynamics.

FC: for a 10% stake you can do the landing gear, arresting gear and you can design a countermeasures package that would be optional on production models.

Providing Crookfur accepts, we will be offering no more partnerships in this project.

Ok

I will do all.

Want a description, or will I leave it until it is all confirmed.

wait until we finalise the other stuff.

Ok, I will get to work on thinking anyway.

The partnership sounds good to me (seems like i have a lot of reading to do ;) )

More formally:
The Kingdom of Crookfur signs the partnership agreement.

Great,Right now im thinking:

EA-60A development prototype
EA-60B Carrier Onboard delivery version
EA-60C Airborne Early Warning version
EA-60D Electronic Warfare version
EA-60E ASW/ASuW Version

Oh no....

I know nothing of stuff like this, I flew Tornadoes....

Any links to were I could learn about this stuff?

His Royal Heighness'es Defence Forces of Nichtstein are very interested in the products of EAC and will contribute, if needed.

His Royal Heighness'es Defence Forces of Nichtstein would also be interested in any other military hardware of United Elias production, namely - aircraft and ships(namely - carriers).

His Royal Heighness'es Defence Forces of Nichtstein are currently undergoing a full scale modernization of its hardware and quite "juicy" contracts are to be forseen.

If United Elias wishes more information we are always ready to provide it.

Thank you for your attention.

Here's pretty much everything:

EA-160 Fighter

http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=71886

EA-28 Light/Scout Helicopter

http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=66401

Tavor Assault rifle
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=59484&highlight=

EM-75 fleet Olier
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=60162&highlight=

EM-80 Combat Support Vessel.
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=59383

EAW-12 Cruise Missile
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=56000

EA-50 Trainer/Light attack turboprop
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=40977


EA-24 Muti-purpose helicopters
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=40824

EA-80 tactical tranpsort and tanker versions
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=38933

EM-140 Frigate
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=39617&highlight=

EM-100 Fast Attack Missile Boat
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=34800&highlight=

EM-90 Transport Ship
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=38804&highlight=

EM-120 Corvette
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=35757&highlight=

EA-70 Mini J-STAR
http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26456&highlight=

dude, consolidation :) make a storefront

plus a couple of things in devoplment:

http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=73661&highlight=

http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=74192&highlight=

you'll find a coupel of our carriers in this post pages 1 and 2.

http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=71531&highlight=

oh and this:


http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=73949&highlight=

dude, consolidation :) make a storefront

Yeah Im going to...tommorrow. Although I said that about three weeks ago, so dont count on it.

lol

Oh well.

Landing gear is pretty easy, arresting gear harder, and counter measures may sound like I dont know a thing....

dude, consolidation :) make a storefront

Yeah Im going to...tommorrow. Although I said that about three weeks ago, so dont count on it.

:shock:

His Royal Highness'es Defence Forces of Nichtstein High Commander now has something to keep him busy for some good time.

:shock:

Also maybe EA-60F Csarrier borne tanker.

I will commit to purchase after all UE is the official Naval supplier of Rylleh Security Forces... wil help any way I can.

I will commit to purchase after all UE is the official Naval supplier of Rylleh Security Forces... wil help any way I can.

A nice prepayment of 200 million would be nice, obviously you get it back on aircraft when its ready.

Money Wired 200 Million :)

Thank you. :D

Thank you. :P :D

OOC: UE, this is seriously fantastic stuff, as can be expected of one of the best arms suppliers in NS. Keep it up.

IC: McLeod03 will donate money to cover any further costs in the prject, and will purchase a number of aircraft of all versions to replace our aging CSA fleet.

OOC: UE, this is seriously fantastic stuff, as can be expected of one of the best arms suppliers in NS. Keep it up.

IC: McLeod03 will donate money to cover any further costs in the prject, and will purchase a number of aircraft of all versions to replace our aging CSA fleet.

OOC: One of the best, or the best? 8)

IC: Thank you very much for your generous contribution, this will certainly expediate the design process

1 Sample of our revolutionary landing gear has been sent, with 4 sprins in each one, made of titanium and the higher section of Plastic Composite.

Each one ways little, but the compressed springs and air jets concealed in the bottom of each one would cushion hard landings.

6 samples have been sent. If these are not to satisfaction, we will make mark 2.

The Counter Measures we have are currently being sent.

Oh, and UE, I hope you do understand that while His Royal Highness'es Defence Forces of Nichtstein High Commander is busy with the threads listing your products, the Principality of Nichtstein will "provide" some funds, in order of 200-400 million USD for the project. :wink:

Also, is it okay if once I finish looking through your threads, putting up the numbers an all - I make a new thread where I list everything I buy with the exact prices or I send the list to you via T-Gram?

Any details of the countermeasures:

you can look here for some guidlines:


http://www.nationstates.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=71886

Standard Flares, and Chaffs.

Radar confusing pod:

Drops 100+ strips of a special metallic compound, which will project any transmitted radar beams off it, into space. These beams not only push the radar beams away from the target, but replicate the aircrafts target 2 times per strip, therefore producing 2 targets per strip. This means the whole thing creates 200+ targets for a missile/targetter to go for.

EMP rotating pod:

Mounted under the fuselage, behind a radar pod, this fires beams of EMP towards any targets, like missiles, and jams/confuses them, and therefore mangles them.

EMP rotating pod:

Mounted under the fuselage, behind a radar pod, this fires beams of EMP towards any targets, like missiles, and jams/confuses them, and therefore mangles them.

Hmmn I wonder wether thats possible? *shouts "Crookfur!"*

Might be going a little overboard (excuse the pun) for a carrier support plane.

It can be taken off.

It is optional, and is only on our bombers, which are kinda defencless without them.

It isnt that big, really.

Oh, and UE, I hope you do understand that while His Royal Highness'es Defence Forces of Nichtstein High Commander is busy with the threads listing your products, the Principality of Nichtstein will "provide" some funds, in order of 200-400 million USD for the project. :wink:

Also, is it okay if once I finish looking through your threads, putting up the numbers an all - I make a new thread where I list everything I buy with the exact prices or I send the list to you via T-Gram?

yes! start a new thread, don't telegram and thank you for your offer but we are pretty much set for cash now after some generous offers.

bump for Crookfur.

The EMP pod could work but it would liekly have to be large (ie vulcan plus sized) to get any usable sort of output.
Active counter measures in the form of IR dazzelers and active lasers (like the chinese anti missile launcher system) could work (we need the lasers for the ImRec missiles but maybe a beam that works aaginst both IR seakers and EO senosrs is likely possible, i know another case of designing to fight the last war...).
Ir dazzlers and counter opitc lasers are both in active use (although the lasers are just on tanks at the moment) so would be useful for the plane.

As for the cockpit would you say fighter style (as i use on my vulcans, mainly because the vulcan always did have fighter controls) or conventional larger aircraft layout?

A useful feature i should really mention on the bomber thread too is Fully independnet decoys (the US has just placed orders for over 1500 MALDs (Miniature Air Launched Decoy)
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/aircraft/systems/mald.htm


For the AWACS craft i would say we should aim for simply a flying sensor and coms relay post rahter than a full air control setup (this seems to be the way most are moving these days, even the E3 upgrades moves more of the work groundside and it seems to be a feature on the EMB-145 AEW&C platform) some operational caapicty could be maintained for emergencies and certain situations but with the recent increases in coms capability most of the work can be shiften else where).

Crookfur:

Yeh I agree on having the command and control handled on the ground thats what I did when designing my EA-70 (http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-8/329267/Bo-2-1.jpg)

I think we should go for side by side more conventional style controls but sill with a HUD and other fighter like features. F

For the different versions what would you suggest for crew, beaaring in mind the AEW%C version would only need minimal onboard control.?

Also, I was thinking of usig one of those any idea what the range of a radome is? Like 150nm?

Bump.

Ok

EMP Pod idea taken away.

IR dazzlers thought of, and being added, and you can do the optical laser thingies Crookfur.

Landing gear arrived.

Arresting gear being designed.

when they come out, the east islandian command would like to buy some.

until then, if you needhelp, we'll see if we can help.

Crookfur:

Yeh I agree on having the command and control handled on the ground thats what I did when designing my EA-70 (http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2003-8/329267/Bo-2-1.jpg)

I think we should go for side by side more conventional style controls but sill with a HUD and other fighter like features. F

For the different versions what would you suggest for crew, beaaring in mind the AEW%C version would only need minimal onboard control.?

Also, I was thinking of usig one of those any idea what the range of a radome is? Like 150nm?

Yeah by fighter controls i ment a HOTAS type setup rather tan tandem seating or anything

As for Crews i suggest the following:
AWACS: 3 (pilot, co pilot and systems monitor/engineer)
ASW: depends on how much you want to handle on board but about 4 (maybe even 3 if C2 is handled surface side)
EW: proabaly 4

I would proabably say design for a 4man cockpit that can be modified to the different versions and uses say have the 2 pilot stations and 2 work areas for sensor/systems crews.

When you say the rnage of the radome do you mean the main AEW sensor? in which case the E2C is quoted at 550km plus or the counter measures?

yes the AEW radar, Crookfur care to develop a new one? Im thinking a non rotating aerodynamic thing i.e whats on the picture :)

Lets make it of a two crew side by side cockpit, construction of a 1/4 size model has begun to test aerodynamics.

Freedom Country's military wishes to be a bigger pert of the project, though we are satisfied with what percentage we currently have.

We wish more of a part.

We are glad to hear our ideas are being used, and we are also glad to hear that the first prototype model is being made.

FC: Can we use either your Defiant or Nimitz for a week or so to test it on carriers? Not for a while though.

Sure

4th fleet is having a complete refit, so a Defiant is free.

You can borrow it for a while, until 4th fleet goes on active service again. The 2nd fleet is scheduled for refit, so you can borrow its Nimitz....

yes the AEW radar, Crookfur care to develop a new one? Im thinking a non rotating aerodynamic thing i.e whats on the picture :)

Lets make it of a two crew side by side cockpit, construction of a 1/4 size model has begun to test aerodynamics.

I'll have a stab, i assume some sort of phased array electronically scanning one will be needed.
cockpit sounds good :).

If you want to test on different aircraft classes i have a selection.


FC: you already have most of my tech on the laser system (you got it with those tanks i designed you) so you could proabably design that part.

Okay then....

The laser is being developed currently for aircraft, the Flares are dazzling ones, the radar pods have arrived, and the arresting gear is being developed (I dont have a clue how they work)

Crookfur:
Do you think its possible for us to combine the Electronic warfare role with the ASW role, since our carriers don't really have enough space to accomodate so many aircraft types.

Maybe we could fit do inividual versions and a cobined version where to change role you just use a different crew and different weapons.

Well, EW electronics take up a lot of space, and require more crew. They also require sensors etc.

ASW requires room for sonobuoys, sonar gear, torpedoes, sensors etc.

I would say its impossible, unlesss the airframe is huge.

good point. though it is larger than the EA-6 Prowler and the S-3 Viking.

You would have to merge the E-6 and S-3 together, which is sze consuming.

And the crew area would be pretty cramped, and not very easy to work in in combat.

It would be very silly to do that, as it would be ramped, difficult to work in, and have safety risks, like hard to escape, missiles, emergencies etc.

Unless all the EW gear is compacted, put on the bottom of the aircraft and redesigned, it would be really hard.

and weight would be a problem too, for carrier ops.

ok fine, just an idea.

Just saying it wouldnt work, lol

EW is becoming a more needed role now, in the age of information.

I am undecided on combined roles to be honest, for a combine drole platfrom the AEW would probabaly be the place to start as you could likely get msot of the gear in the radone leaving lots of room for the Ew or ASW equipment. but thena again they each would fly different mission parameters so you would likely need sperate aircraft anyway.

Of course by making the EW gear externally pod mounted or fixed into the weapons bay of the ASW version you might have a duel purpose aircraft. It likely wouldn't perform as well as a totally dedicated Ew platform but i could do the job...

HHmm perhaps the 2 operators have multi purpose work stations (ie a number of big MFDs) and the equipment is all mounted in a reconfigurable bay?
While this doesn't completely elimiate the 2 aircaft problem it does cut down on storage room a bit (but adds a bit of complexity) although to be honest this reconfigurable bay could also do your Refeuler...

Too be honest, with a carrier based aircraft, you want as little complexity as possible.

Carrier planes are complex enough, without adding computers and fancy stuff.

And could you tell me about arresting gear please?

lets stick to seperate EW and ASW but I suppose we could turn the ASW into a tanker, hardpoints in the wings for buddy hose and drogue pods, weapons bay for fuel?

Yeh, that is possible.

This is turning into a damn good plane.

the 1/4 size model has been completed and has shown to be aerodynamically sound. Computer models show a that the most appropriate engines for the design would be a pair of EPE-136M High bypass turbofan producing 14,690lb of thrust, the intakes would be located just aft of the wings.

Cool with the engines, and model.

I am a bit worried about the durability of the plane when it lands on a carrier.

This thing must be put through many, many landings on carriers, and I am not sure it will be able to put up with it, with its delicate shaped dome and connections, and somewhat cramped conditions.

Even with properly reinforced arresting gear, adn the landing gear I am giving it, it will not be able to put up to much.

Test in this area.

---Post deleted by NationStates Moderators---

BUMP

Work has begun on the full size prototype and we look forward to recieving the cockpit systems and simulator ffrom Crookfur once they are ready. Version specific electronics (i.e AEW radar, operator consoles etc) will not be reuqired until flight test of the prototype are complete.

FC:

we do not anticipate durability to be a problem as we are aiming for in our design to have as low as possible landin and takeoff speed. (although TO speed not really an issue with catapaults, the plane needs to be accelrating on landing to its takeoff speed in case it misses the arresting lines) These measures will mean it will not undergo the same stresses of carrier operation as aircraft such as the F/A-18 or F-14.

Just a small worry.

I am still worried about long term damage to the airframe, over a long period of time.

I hope the first prototype goes well.

Now, CAN WE GET BACK TO MY MRF?????

I have some ideas on senors etc that i came up with at work (yes my job isn't exactly rocket science) i'll post more dtrails tomorrow.

Radar system.
Crookfur proposes the New CFES MK1205N survielance radar. Using electronic ECM resistant scanning the MK1205N offers 360 degree detection of upto 3000 maritime and air targets at ranges out to 350NM (650km) and detailed scanning for fighter sized targets out to 630NM (1100 km).

The first 5 production version have been shipped to UE.
(yes its a combined role system but just about all the modern eletronically scanning radars offer maritime detection and i think a FLIR system could be added offering some degree of survace surevilance at out to 100miles).

once again excellent, thanks.

The EA-60A prototype had been completed and we are currently strating to peform gorund test on the airframe. The prototype features just a basic flight control sustem without any radar systems or other combat related avionics. Test pilots are being trianed in the new simulator to fly it.

Eboneeza Air Base, Western United ELias

The Sleek mettalic lines of the EA-60A prototype is rolled out onto the concrete, two test pilots nervously wave through the cockpit windows, and the ground crew back away as the engines whine to life. The tow vehile unlatches from the nose wheel and the plane edges towrads the runway uder it own power. Everything that could had been tested, now they actualy had to fly it.

Freedom Country waits with baited breath to see if the thing actually works.

Eboneeza Air Force Base, Western United Elias

The EA-60A taxixs out and lines up along the runway.

"Tower, Air Force One Five Zero, ready to go niner Right."

"Roger Five Zero, take off clearnace granted, good luck."

"Cleared for niner Right, thanks we'll need it."

The pilotgrasps the two throttles and pushes them forward steasdily, checking the flap lever and nodding to his co-pilot. The plane rolls down the runway faster and faster.

"V1....VR....Rotate" The plilot nudges back the stick and the plane gracefully takes to the air, the canards adjusting automatcally to maximise lift. "V2...Gear up."

Freedom congradulates you on thsi airframes first succesful flight!!!!

We wish to send several pilots to use your simulators, to learn how to fly the aircraft before we get it.

Hopefully within 75 days on the sims you could allow them to fly the aircraft?

We wish to send several pilots to use your simulators, to learn how to fly the aircraft before we get it.

Hopefully within 75 days on the sims you could allow them to fly the aircraft?

well hpefully but we're still writing the training manuals and operation envelopes.

Four more prototpes are under construction and they will be used as testbeds for the AEW$C, EW and ASW equipment, Crookfur please send this and it would be useful if you could do a summary like you did with the JTB.

Some Specifications:

All Versions:

Powerplants: 2x EPE-136M High bypass turbofan producing 14,690lb of thrust.

Performance: (varies slightly between versions)
Max Speed: 510 knots
Max Ferry Range: 2600-3200nm
Service Cieling:48,000ft


Armament:

ASW/ASuW Version
Internal Weapons bay for up to four torpedoes/mines/depth bombs.

Two wing hardpoints for Torpedoes/External fuel tanks or Harpoon/Yakhont/SLAM/Meverick or similar ASMs.

Two wing hardpoints for AIM-9X/ASRAAM/AA-12/similar short range air to air missiles.

Electronic Warfare version:

Not sure about this, can you have jamming pods or fire HARMs in an internal weapons bay, or shall we have more wing hardpoints instead?

bump for Crookfur I want to get this thing done.

Sorry about the delay i missed this thread on my last trawl through (no idea how).

Jammers and ARMs can likely be deployed from an internal bay (i use an bay mounted jammer on my EW vulcan and imagine that if you can fire harpoons or AMRAAMs from a bay mounting then HARMs are not a problem), we could also use the dorsal mounting for part of the jammer system.


Ok specfic equipment:

Standard on all models:

Cockpit: Fly by light controls, with side by side layout with choice of conventional yoke or fighter style stick control, full glass cockpit with 5 MFDs per station and forward and side wide angle HUDs (helmet disply compatable).

Operations Crew: 2 reconfigurable work stations in rear cockpit area, can be removed to make room for additional equipment.

Navigation: full open architecture navigation system with auto pilot, GPS, radio compas and advanced INS

Weapons and missions handling: full open architecture missions software, open standard stores managment system. For self defense giudance a MK5007 Multimode IR/EO system is employed. It features surface surveillance mode with 50x magnification and detection of targets at 180km. In air IRST mode up to 10 targets with ranges of up to 75km can be tracked.


Counter measures: duel mode IR/laser dazzler system, active ECM, chaff flare dispensers, automatic threat detection and countering system

CFES MK20B Warsphere Data link, integrates all onboard systems and provides digital links for the transmission of data to and from (and through ie using the aircraft as a relay) the aircraft features full voice and other coms systems with high level of encryption.

AEW/AWAC:
CFES MK1205N surveilance radar. Using electronic ECM resistant scanning the MK1205N offers 360 degree detection of upto 3000 maritime and air targets at ranges out to 350NM (650km) and detailed scanning for fighter sized targets out to 630NM (1100 km).

ASW/ASuW:
MK2010: optimised for naval surveillance operations, the MK2010 can detect periscope sized targets at over 200km (and ship size targets at over 500km).

MK8003 MAD

MK9505 Sonobouy handling system: Combines receiver, data interpretation with 128 channel processing and data transmission and display for over 100 sonobouys.

EW.

MK10015: targetable jamming system with emissions processing and interpretation system. Can provide broad band jamming over a wide range or localised effects against specific targets.



On the jamming system i'm finding it hard to find any decent stats to base it on but as i see it the MK10015 system can also act as an ELINT asset.

Does this all sound OK?

sounds great, when you say dorsal mounting I presume you are talking about the EF-111 and EA-6B fairing on the tail:

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ac/ef-111-00000005.jpg

Also ELINT would be useful, our RC-135s are rather sparse in numbers.

I was kind of meaning in a pod mounted where the radone goes on the AEW version but the tail would work.

Can I remind you I was doing the countermeasures, though help is much appreciated.

Okay well I guess we're ready to start a sales thead.

Lets just assume that esxtensive tests have been done and any glitches modified.

Oops sorry FC, got a bit too over eager.

Its okay.

I am caught up in stff for City of Freedom right now.