NationStates Jolt Archive

Suppose you see someone is pulling out a handgun and is likely to shoot you and you are unarmed - which of these two options is it better to try:

Run away in a straight line to put some distance between you and them

Run away in a zig-zig to try and stop them aiming at you

Run in a zig-zag.

Tell them they have the safety still on and then use that second of confusion to wrestle it off them. Works in every film.

Depends on the handgun and the starting distance.

Some handguns are only accurate at very short range, so if you're got a little distance, and they pull out one of those, a straight line might get you to an inaccurate distance before they fire.

Some handguns are accurate at great range, and if they pull out one of those, you'd be better off running a zig-zag.

Good luck! Who's shooting at you?

Good luck! Who's shooting at you?

Oh I am just preparing for the collapse of civilisation

Oh I am just preparing for the collapse of civilisation

That's why I have full military body armor under my bed.

I'd drop a smoke bomb and in the confusion, kick him repeatedly in the crotch. *nod*

I am guessing that accuracy drops off quite rapidly with distance (ignoring that it also drops off at very short distances). But the zig zagging technique becomes less effective at a distance of more than a few metres as the angle the person doing the shooting has to compensate for decreases.

I am guessing that accuracy drops off quite rapidly with distance (ignoring that it also drops off at very short distances). But the zig zagging technique becomes less effective at a distance of more than a few metres as the angle the person doing the shooting has to compensate for decreases.
I live in an urban setting (NYC). It's a short distance to most large, immovable objects/obstacle courses known as buildings.

I'll just stop the bullets with my katana.

I'll just stop the bullets with my katana.

A real man would have caught them with his teeth.

A real man would have caught them with his teeth.

I don't want to risk my teeth, 4 years of orthodontics is expensive.

Find the nearest stack of boxes, hide behind it, throw flash-bang at the guy holding a gun then run like hell. As every FPS has taught me, walls and large stacks of things always stop bullets, and if you look in one of the boxes near you, you will always find ammunition that you need at precisely that moment. ;)

Find the nearest stack of boxes, hide behind it, throw flash-bang at the guy holding a gun then run like hell. As every FPS has taught me, walls and large stacks of things always stop bullets, and if you look in one of the boxes near you, you will always find ammunition that you need at precisely that moment. ;)

Ever read John Dies At The End? Our heroes kill.....something and then find a box of .45 calibre bullets in its corpse. Awesome.

Circle round the bastard, melee-ing them furiously, and hope you get an assassination.

If all else fails start crying into your headset.

Circle round the bastard, melee-ing them furiously, and hope you get an assassination.

If all else fails start crying into your headset.

Don't forget to RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGEQUIT

Smack em in the face.

Find the nearest stack of boxes, hide behind it, throw flash-bang at the guy holding a gun then run like hell. As every FPS has taught me, walls and large stacks of things always stop bullets, and if you look in one of the boxes near you, you will always find ammunition that you need at precisely that moment. ;)

Boxes (and almost everything else) in Goldeneye 64 explode when shot.

frantically type "IDDQD" and then have at him with my chainsaw while the bullets bounce off me.

Boxes (and almost everything else) in Goldeneye 64 explode when shot.

There aren't flash bangs either. And doors can be shot through with certain weapons. That is, when they don't explode.
frantically type "IDDQD" and then have at him with my chainsaw while the bullets bounce off me.
IDKFA, BFG to the face.

Games, books, tv and films teach us unrealistic things. How many people have got themselves killed trying to shoot accurately while holding a gun on its side 'cos that's how the gangbangers hold them in videos.

Games, books, tv and films teach us unrealistic things. How many people have got themselves killed trying to shoot accurately while holding a gun on its side 'cos that's how the gangbangers hold them in videos.

I've heard that holding the gun that way can cause the slide to 'bite' the fleshy bit between your thumb and index finger. Hurts like a motherfucker and makes it even easier to prove you were shooting things. But then, I heard this from a book.

I've heard that holding the gun that way can cause the slide to 'bite' the fleshy bit between your thumb and index finger. Hurts like a motherfucker and makes it even easier to prove you were shooting things. But then, I heard this from a book.

The same problem was in the original model of the M1911. The slide sometimes took some flesh with it when it slid forward again.

The same problem was in the original model of the M1911. The slide sometimes took some flesh with it when it slid forward again.

Actually, the original 1911 (and Browning High Power) had hammer bite, where your hand would get pinched between the hammer and the grip safety. Most modern 1911s have a beavertail now, so hammer bite isn't possible. Slide bite is only possible on the 1911 if you're holding the 1911 WAY too high.

BTW, here's a picture showing how an original style 1911 can bite with the hammer: http://www.theboxotruth.com/images/e45-2.jpg

Actually, the original 1911 (and Browning High Power) had hammer bite, where your hand would get pinched between the hammer and the grip safety. Most modern 1911s have a beavertail now, so hammer bite isn't possible.

Oh, thanks correcting that.

Suppose you see someone is pulling out a handgun and is likely to shoot you and you are unarmed - which of these two options is it better to try:

Run away in a straight line to put some distance between you and them

Run away in a zig-zig to try and stop them aiming at you

Run away, randomly changing the angle and speed at which I'm running away from the shooter. Oh, and while I'm doing that, I'm dropping prox mines so when he chases me, he gets fragged. :D

Suppose you see someone is pulling out a handgun and is likely to shoot you and you are unarmed - which of these two options is it better to try:

Run away in a straight line to put some distance between you and them

Run away in a zig-zig to try and stop them aiming at you

It depends on the distance. If it's point-blank it's better to grab his arms.
If it's like 50 m, dash for the nearest cover.

Didn't Mythbusters do this?

I'd just pity the fool with my golden chains and mohawk.

do what that one lawyer did when someone tried to shoot him. dodge and weave. he kept a small tree between him and his attacker. while he did get grazed, he wasn't fatally shot.

LEEEEEEEEEEEEEROOOOOOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYY JEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEENKIIIIIIIIIIINS!

You shout that then launch yourself at the attacker.

If it was a rifle, I'd know how to disarm them, but seeing it's a pistol, I'd zig-zag around the nearest corner, pick up a brick and wait. if the thug comes around, I smash his head and yell "FATALITY" in the mortal kombat voice.

Zig-zag. It has saved lives. And like Kat said, in an urban setting, it's not generally too far to something solid to hide behind. When that thing is in sight, I'd dive like I was stealing second hands-first (which you really oughtn't do, but), because you present a smaller target and you're less likely to get shot somewhere irreparable.

Am I just saving myself, or other people too?

Am I just saving myself, or other people too?

Just yourself

Scramble for cover, find a weapon, kill him.

Just yourself

Then you dive for the nearest cover and start figuring out what you can use as a weapon and how.

Are there people around in this scenario that I can use as human shields so they get shot instead of me?

Then you dive for the nearest cover and start figuring out what you can use as a weapon and how.

Assuming there was no immediate cover and running was the best option

Are there people around in this scenario that I can use as human shields so they get shot instead of me?

I like the way you think :)

I like the way you think :)

Its a bit troublesome. How much use is a soft human body for blocking bullets? But better than nowt, obviously.

I'd prolly either randomly get down on my belt buckle or bum rush 'em

out of the options cheesing it would be pretty safe but he won't hit you with either option barring he pulls out a hunting rifle which is far more likely in tealand

Games, books, tv and films teach us unrealistic things. How many people have got themselves killed trying to shoot accurately while holding a gun on its side 'cos that's how the gangbangers hold them in videos.

actually if your a complete idiot (being English and having a gun...yeah) the rounds are going to go completely over the targets head which I've always theorized is why ghetto folk do it sideways

Assuming there was no immediate cover and running was the best option

There are too many unanswered questions. The simple answer to your OP is to avoid running in a straight line through the shooter's ideal range.

Outside of that range, you can relax. Inside that range, and you act like you're about to be shot at, i.e. zig and zag until you get to cover or outside the range. Even further inside that range, and you might be able to close with the shooter.

Suppose you see someone is pulling out a handgun and is likely to shoot you and you are unarmed...

Why would I be unarmed? Unarmed is unprepared.

How many people have got themselves killed trying to shoot accurately while holding a gun on its side 'cos that's how the gangbangers hold them in videos.

I wish I had a nickel for every idiot I saw try this at a range/gallery or elsewhere. The range master usually snaps them back pretty quick, if someone in their party doesn't.

I've heard that holding the gun that way can cause the slide to 'bite' the fleshy bit between your thumb and index finger. Hurts like a motherfucker and makes it even easier to prove you were shooting things. But then, I heard this from a book.

Well you would think a talking book wouldn't lie, but you never know.

Actually I was once at a firearm's training session where we got taught a bit about guns and aiming and firing etc, as well as being able to use a few. Anyway the point of this story is that our instructor was a guy who had spent 20 years in the army and left as a Sargent and had also been an instructor at Lone Pine barracks (where all infantry members of the RAA do special training). He said the reason why it is unwise to hold a gun on the side was because it was harder to control the recoil as well as being less accurate. He demonstrated this to us and he was only able to hit the target 20% of the time.

Well this is a trick question.

If I see somebody pulling a hand gun, by the time it has been pulled, well I'm not there!

Well you would think a talking book wouldn't lie, but you never know.

Actually I was once at a firearm's training session where we got taught a bit about guns and aiming and firing etc, as well as being able to use a few. Anyway the point of this story is that our instructor was a guy who had spent 20 years in the army and left as a Sargent and had also been an instructor at Lone Pine barracks (where all infantry members of the RAA do special training). He said the reason why it is unwise to hold a gun on the side was because it was harder to control the recoil as well as being less accurate. He demonstrated this to us and he was only able to hit the target 20% of the time.

20 years of service and left as a sergent? Bloody hell must be good at his job huh huh!!:p

Think I need someone with a paintball gun to test this out.

Think I need someone with a paintball gun to test this out.

Paintballs move too slowly to be an accurate test compared with bullets.

However, I could get some rubber bullets to test with. You won't die, but it might hurt like hell to get hit.

Paintballs move too slowly to be an accurate test compared with bullets.

However, I could get some rubber bullets to test with. You won't die, but it might hurt like hell to get hit.

Compared to the speed I run at I am not sure the difference in muzzle velocity of a paintball gun to a real gun will make a huge difference to the accuracy of the experiment.

Compared to the speed I run at I am not sure the difference in muzzle velocity of a paintball gun to a real gun will make a huge difference to the accuracy of the experiment.

Well, a paintball usually moves at right around 300 ft/s, while a bullet can move anywhere from 1,000 ft/s to 2,500 ft/s, depending on the gun, powder load, length of the barrel, weight of the bullet, etc.

Think I need someone with a paintball gun to test this out.

As Galloism mentioned, paintball ballistics aren't comparable to firearm ballistics (speed, projectile shape, and projectile weight being 3 major reasons). Also, the amount of recoil between a paintball marker and a firearm is markedly different.

As Galloism mentioned, paintball ballistics aren't comparable to firearm ballistics (speed, projectile shape, and projectile weight being 3 major reasons). Also, the amount of recoil between a paintball marker and a firearm is markedly different.

True, but I don't think that it means that the tactic that works best against a paintball will be the opposite one that works best with a real firearm. If zig-zagging is best when shot at with a paintball it is likely it is also best with real weapons.

Paintballs move too slowly to be an accurate test compared with bullets.

However, I could get some rubber bullets to test with. You won't die, but it might hurt like hell to get hit.

As Galloism mentioned, paintball ballistics aren't comparable to firearm ballistics (speed, projectile shape, and projectile weight being 3 major reasons). Also, the amount of recoil between a paintball marker and a firearm is markedly different.

agreed. so lets use real guns and real bullets.

now if you two will sign this waiver absolving the shooter of any responsibility of injury or death... :D

frantically type "IDDQD" and then have at him with my chainsaw while the bullets bounce off me.
Nice!

By pure chance, I did type that yesterday, along with IDBEHOLDA and IDKFA. :D

I'd run towards them. A couple bullets never killed anyone, right?

I'd run towards them. A couple bullets never killed anyone, right?

Hasn't stopped 50 cent.

tell them they have the safety still on and then use that second of confusion to wrestle it off them. Works in every film.

qft

20 years of service and left as a sergent? Bloody hell must be good at his job huh huh!!:p

Don't really know what you mean by this.

But in the Australia Army, promotions work differently, in fact there are only two Sargent ranks, Sargent and Staff Sargent. One is simply not promoted because they do a certain amount of training and a few other things (I can't remember since it was an ex-US Army serviceman that told me how to do it) but they also require a certain amount of years and have to prove they also have leadership qualities.

Open the console.
Quickly type "god"

done.

agreed. so lets use real guns and real bullets.

now if you two will sign this waiver absolving the shooter of any responsibility of injury or death... :D

http://img503.imageshack.us/img503/7538/owllolno2nx.jpg

Did you ever wonder why the military doesn't use paintball for training? Paintballs can curve (especially if there's a broken paintball in the breech or barrel, but even if the paintball seam lines up wrong in the bore) or burst in mid air (if there's a defect in the shell).

If you want to do a realistic test, why not use MILES gear?

I'd drop a smoke bomb and in the confusion, kick him repeatedly in the crotch. *nod*

Ninja-Clown college works for LG.

If they were within reaching distance I would not give them the chance to be ready to even fire. Otherwise its hard to know how I'd react since I tend to approach mortal danger in ways some people call insane.

Ninja-Clown college works for LG.

If they were within reaching distance I would not give them the chance to be ready to even fire. Otherwise its hard to know how I'd react since I tend to approach mortal danger in ways some people call insane.

I bet you didn't just sit there in easy reach, point and laugh at said mortal danger at least.

I bet you didn't just sit there in easy reach, point and laugh at said mortal danger at least.

Well there was this one time...

Well there was this one time...

No, when there's ballistic glass between the two of you, it don't count.

Hasn't stopped 50 cent.

More's the pity

More's the pity

I think there's a niche there to be exploited, wheelchair bound gangsta rappers. Xzibit can do a spin off show, Pimp My Wheelchair.

I think there's a niche there to be exploited, wheelchair bound gangsta rappers. Xzibit can do a spin off show, Pimp My Wheelchair.

"We heard you liked getting shot so we put a gun in your wheelchair"

I think there's a niche there to be exploited, wheelchair bound gangsta rappers. Xzibit can do a spin off show, Pimp My Wheelchair.

hmm tacking a guys wheelchair you say >_>

But in the Australia Army, promotions work differently

no you follow the Commonwealth system which isn't all that far off the American ergo this guy must of been a complete fuck-up (or more likely) who upset allot of people :p

after staff Sergeant comes the two Warrant Officer ranks which you can expect to climb to the top of after about 20 years or so

Ninja-Clown college works for LG.

If they were within reaching distance I would not give them the chance to be ready to even fire. Otherwise its hard to know how I'd react since I tend to approach mortal danger in ways some people call insane.

I bet you didn't just sit there in easy reach, point and laugh at said mortal danger at least.

Well there was this one time...

No, when there's ballistic glass between the two of you, it don't count.

Does nobody stick their finger in the gun barrel anymore? :(

Pull out a Smith and Wesson model 29 and say "Are you feeling lucky, punk?".:D

(Ignoring the fact I own no firearms of any kind...)

Pull out a Smith and Wesson model 29 and say "Are you feeling lucky, punk?".:D

(Ignoring the fact I own no firearms of any kind...)

You can always use your finger :)

Pull out a Smith and Wesson model 29 and say "Are you feeling lucky, punk?".:D

(Ignoring the fact I own no firearms of any kind...)

Liar! You know quite well that that tongue of yours is, in actuality, a firearm. You just won't admit it.

:tongue:

Liar! You know quite well that that tongue of yours is, in actuality, a firearm. You just won't admit it.

:tongue:
I admit nothing! (Not that I ever do) :tongue:
You can always use your finger :)
"You feeling lucky punk?"
"A... Finger? What are you going to do with that?"
"Do you really want to know?"
"Oh God! I'll leave now! Please, just... Just don't!"