NationStates Jolt Archive

Early on in my adult years, I got away from prayer and I ultimately found that the further away from God I got, my life became worse for a variety of reasons. Since I have returned to daily prayer, I find myself more spiritually grounded, especially when patience, tolerance and forgiveness is required.

How often do you pray and how does prayer help you?

Obviously this thread is meant only for those who are of a spiritual/religious nature who also have a higher power that they pray to. Therefore, comment from atheists and non believers is discouraged.

In my faith prayer is sorta not there, instead the empahsis is obn constant meditation upon God. So in one way I never pray and I guess in another way I never stop?

why did you make the poll mulitple choice?

In my faith prayer is sorta not there, instead the empahsis is obn constant meditation upon God. So in one way I never pray and I guess in another way I never stop?
So you maintain a constant spiritual contact with God?

I used to...a lot. Until I found that out that, on average, things did turned-out the same when I did not pray.

Back in the day, pretty much only when I went to mass. Never really took any of it seriously. Shocking that I eventually left the church, no?

why did you make the poll mulitple choice?

So you can pick the top and the bottom options.

So you maintain a constant spiritual contact with God?

What is there to maintain? God is everything, everywhere, just by living one is in constant spirtual contact with God.

Never

Therefore, comment from atheists and non believers is discouraged.

Just passing by, and I found this part of your OP that I feel somewhat unNSGy.

So, just to show that I'm not discouraged at all, I don't pray, I don't think I should pray, and I'll never, ever, pray.

The phrase "God helps those who help themselves" seems significant at this time.

Even if you believe in God, wouldn't your time be better spent actively trying to achieve the goal rather than asking someone to do it for you?

In my opinion, prayer functions as a way to organize thoughts and create priorities. This isn't a bad thing. It's just more effective to do something to make them come true.

The phrase "God helps those who help themselves" seems significant at this time.

Even if you believe in God, wouldn't your time be better spent actively trying to achieve the goal rather than asking someone to do it for you?

In my opinion, prayer functions as a way to organize thoughts and create priorities. This isn't a bad thing. It's just more effective to do something to make them come true.

More than that, prayer is a request for guidance. It isn't so much "God, please take this problem away" as it is "Lord, please grant me the strength and the guidance to get through this."

http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/img/2007/bush-praying2.jpg

Good for guidance!

The other night my guild was making a run at 6-minute Maly and I got wtfpwned at the very end of Phase 2 but we were totally so close to making it and I was so tense that I got up and went to get water instead of watching to see if we were going to pull it off and while I was standing there I threw a prayer out to the universe begging that my guildies manage to pull it off.

They did.

Never. I don't lie to waste time.

More than that, prayer is a request for guidance. It isn't so much "God, please take this problem away" as it is "Lord, please grant me the strength and the guidance to get through this."
Yes. Prayer is for spiritual guidance and also to offer support to others who may be in distress.

I believe in prayer so deeply that I think it's a sin you are using prayer to achieve a certain state of mind, that you require strength from Jesus to provide you with patience, tolerance and forgiveness.

Prayer should simply be chatting with Jesus, not expressing thanks for the love or what that love gives you.

Imagine you had a friend who was always just - oh thank you, oh thank you for being my friend - after a while you'd be pretty bugged out by this friend, you just want to talk sports, politics, that American Idol episode and you can't get a word in edgeways due to the constant - oh thank you, oh thank you and, oh, by the way, can you just sort out my life for me as well, let me tell you how it sucks...

Jesus doesn't want you to feel grateful to him, you don't feel grateful to your best friend for anything other than how cool they are, so you have a beer and shoot the shit, no one 'prays' to their best friend.

Hopefully, at some point, you'd realise Jesus is an imaginary friend and you're chatting with yourself really, some people call it mad, others call it mental production of an anthropological representation of your natural internal dialogue.

Jesus is a pretty cool guy, eh kills aliens and doesn't afraid of anything.

Random/

Whoa! So you talk about American Idol in your prayers?

More than that, prayer is a request for guidance. It isn't so much "God, please take this problem away" as it is "Lord, please grant me the strength and the guidance to get through this."

Or prayer is praise for God and no other thing.

Whoa! So you talk about American Idol in your prayers?

Jesus thinks L'il Rounds is da bomb, possibly worth the second coming, it's a little known fact that the Virgin Mary was damn delectable, worth sacrificing one's son for.

You know it, you watch it.

Jesus thinks L'il Rounds is da bomb, possibly worth the second coming, it's a little known fact that the Virgin Mary was damn delectable, worth sacrificing one's son for.

:eek:

You know it, you watch it.

It would be pretty hard, considering I have no T.V.

Yes. Prayer is for spiritual guidance and also to offer support to others who may be in distress.

This is what I don't get...how is it support for others in distress? Your friend has cancer...wouldn't it be better to help with household tasks or visit them in the hospital rather than pray for their recovery? There's a tsunami in south east Asia....wouldn't it be better to volunteer your time rather than say a prayer?

Saying a prayer to show support only makes that individual feel better.

When I really really really need something. Or really really really want something.

It would be pretty hard, considering I have no T.V.

Pray to Jesus, he has cash.

When I really really really need something.

http://pro.corbis.com/images/RF4465307.jpg?size=572&uid={D24F20AA-CE3C-4AC5-A9F7-D78C9ACC31E9}

Oh, very clever poll options.

The phrase "God helps those who help themselves" seems significant at this time.

Even if you believe in God, wouldn't your time be better spent actively trying to achieve the goal rather than asking someone to do it for you?

In my opinion, prayer functions as a way to organize thoughts and create priorities. This isn't a bad thing. It's just more effective to do something to make them come true.

Like an exorcism ritual.

Stop kneeling, people, start walking.

What is there to maintain? God is everything, everywhere, just by living one is in constant spirtual contact with God.

The act of constant prayer is an ongoing attempt to live one's life in the conscious knowledge that you, and therefore all beings, are one with god.

The other night my guild was making a run at 6-minute Maly and I got wtfpwned at the very end of Phase 2 but we were totally so close to making it and I was so tense that I got up and went to get water instead of watching to see if we were going to pull it off and while I was standing there I threw a prayer out to the universe begging that my guildies manage to pull it off.

They did.
Congrats to your guildies. :)

The act of constant prayer is an ongoing attempt to live one's life in the conscious knowledge that you, and therefore all beings, are one with god.

Indeed, that is the very point.

This is what I don't get...how is it support for others in distress? Your friend has cancer...wouldn't it be better to help with household tasks or visit them in the hospital rather than pray for their recovery? There's a tsunami in south east Asia....wouldn't it be better to volunteer your time rather than say a prayer?

Saying a prayer to show support only makes that individual feel better.
Of course, offering prayer is only one support. It is obvious that if one can also offer any other kind of support that would be good.

I don't pray -- well, what would be conventionally considered prayer -- anymore. The spirtuality and wonder I used to obtain from prayer I have found is all around me. For me, that's enough.

I believe in prayer so deeply that I think it's a sin you are using prayer to achieve a certain state of mind, that you require strength from Jesus to provide you with patience, tolerance and forgiveness.
Praying to be a better person is a sin? The Serenity prayer is a sin?

Praying to be a better person is a sin? The Serenity prayer is a sin?

Praying for things is not really the point.(as far as I'm concered) All prayer is about praising God, that and nowt else.

prayer is new age mumbo jumbo. everyone knows that what is really needed to gain the favor of the gods are the hearts of your enemies, cut from their still living bodies and delivered to the fire.

Obviously this thread is meant only for those who are of a spiritual/religious nature who also have a higher power that they pray to. Therefore, comment from atheists and non believers is discouraged.

I find that mildly offensive, due to it's exclusivist nature and the implied slight.

The act of constant prayer is an ongoing attempt to live one's life in the conscious knowledge that you, and therefore all beings, are one with god.

Ya know, oddly enough, I find this statement quite compatable with my own religious thoughts. It's quite in line with the Buddhist ideal of every moment being one of meditation...

Praying to be a better person is a sin? The Serenity prayer is a sin?

I'll answer in two parts:

Part A - If I believe in Jesus:
Yes, Jesus doesn't really want to hear your shit, he wants dialogue and discussion, whining through prayer, asking for 'the strength' to be a better person is really quite the burden, and he's already died on the cross for you. You were give free will, it's for you to make the right choices and thus be free to simply accept and chat with Jesus rather than continuously ask, continuously be grateful for actually failing to achieve your perceived ideal. Not making the right choice is a sin, therefore asking for the strength not to sin yet continuing to sin is also a failing, a sin.

Part B - If I don't believe in Jesus:
Not really, your 'Jesus' is actually a personification of your ideal self and prayer is an internal aural realisation of dialogue between your actual self and your ideal self. This actualisation of the dialogue is, in itself, no bad thing but what is bad is when your ideal self causes you to be ashamed of your actual self, either because your ideal is so high or your actual is so low.

So in and of itself it's no 'sin' but it can be harmful.

/random

Praying to be a better person is a sin? The Serenity prayer is a sin?

Honestly, to me, yes, "praying"/wishing that *I* become a better person is "sinful".

I, me, myself, self centeredness - centering everything around yourself is the "sin".

Note that I don't really believe in sin, but only stupidity. As a Zen writer I was reading recently put it "sin is stupid".

Usually at least once a day. Usually on the train. It is a nice time to reflect.

As often as I should.

It depends what one means by "prayer," honestly. I don't kneel and recite Hail Marys or anything like that, but I occasionally have little mental conversations with God about life. :p

Praying for things is not really the point.(as far as I'm concered) All prayer is about praising God, that and nowt else.
The Lord's Prayer is about asking for things and praising God.

The Lord's Prayer is about asking for things and praising God.

Ahh that don't count, it's Christian, and we know how illogical that whole thing is!:eek:

The Serenity prayer is a sin?

No, that's transcendant:


Take my love, take my land
Take me where I cannot stand
I don't care, I'm still free
You can't take the sky from me

Take me out to the black
Tell them I ain't comin' back
Burn the land and boil the sea
You can't take the sky from me

There's no place I can be
Since I found Serenity
But you can't take the sky from me...

It depends what one means by "prayer," honestly. I don't kneel and recite Hail Marys or anything like that, but I occasionally have little mental conversations with God about life. :p

Like Sojourner Truth?

Ahh that don't count, it's Christian, and we know how illogical that whole thing is!:eek:

Pretty illogical, though probably no more than my beliefs are.

As often as I should.

:D

No, that's transcendant:


Take my love, take my land
Take me where I cannot stand
I don't care, I'm still free
You can't take the sky from me

Take me out to the black
Tell them I ain't comin' back
Burn the land and boil the sea
You can't take the sky from me

There's no place I can be
Since I found Serenity
But you can't take the sky from me...

Here's the prayer:

God grant me the serenity
To accept the things I cannot change;
Courage to change the things I can;
And wisdom to know the difference.

Living one day at a time;
Enjoying one moment at a time;
Accepting hardships as the pathway to peace;
Taking, as He did, this sinful world
As it is, not as I would have it;
Trusting that He will make all things right
If I surrender to His Will;
So that I may be reasonably happy in this life
And supremely happy with Him
Forever and ever in the next.

Me and I feature muchly in the serenity prayer...

I will be honest. I pray when I need money. The funny thing is it always seems to work.

I will be honest. I pray when I need money. The funny thing is it always seems to work.

http://symonsez.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/ingodwetrust.jpg

As often as I should.
\/ These /\
Never. I don't lie to waste time.

http://symonsez.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/ingodwetrust.jpg

It doesn't rain out of the sky. Just when I ask a friend comes and ask me to get him in shape (via playing the drill Sergent route) and will pay me 200 dollars for it.

Never.

Hmm, my views on religion would probably be found offensive considering most of other replies, but I feel the need to ask: what compels you to have faith? What does it achieve? I am not challenging your ideas, I am honestly curious about why religion plays a part in your life. I have always resented it because, to me, it suggested weakness and needing someone to support you at all times. Don't take offense! Just explain why and allow me to understand! Thanks in advance.

I admit I have, at certain points, sent out an "open letter" prayer, on the off chance that some God exists, most importantly asking that He/She/It let me in on His/Her/It's existence.

But really, I don't expect it will do anything. The hard work of one pair of hands does more than the prayer of a thousand.

In my faith prayer is sorta not there, instead the empahsis is obn constant meditation upon God. So in one way I never pray and I guess in another way I never stop?

That's how I use to be.

Early on in my adult years, I got away from prayer and I ultimately found that the further away from God I got, my life became worse for a variety of reasons. Since I have returned to daily prayer, I find myself more spiritually grounded, especially when patience, tolerance and forgiveness is required.

How often do you pray and how does prayer help you?

Obviously this thread is meant only for those who are of a spiritual/religious nature who also have a higher power that they pray to. Therefore, comment from atheists and non believers is discouraged.

Poll is made of phail... there's no "never" option.

I pray like...all the time. I don't know how often, it's a natural part of my life. It's not very formal most of the time......like a few minutes ago I was saying "hey, this really sucks" that's probably the extent of most of my prayers throughout the day.

Don't really pray much anymore.

It was meant to be offensive. It was meant to keep the topic focused on prayer and how prayer has helped the individual.

By which token, it should have options for 'not at all' helpful, etc - you ASSUME that prayer MUST be efficacious, and you ruin the potential for a perfectly good poll, to satisfy that assumption.

It wasn't meant to be offensive. It was meant to keep the topic focused on prayer and how prayer has helped the individual.
Edit...fixed

Poll is made of phail... there's no "never" option.

That's why I voted for all the options...
To skew the results

Depends on what you consider 'prayer'. the fold your hands and bow your head type? or the 'talking to God' type.

if the former, not as often as I should. but the latter? all the time. infact, if you see me mumbling to myself as I walk down the street... chances are I'm just talking with the Big G man...

When bad things begin happening, prayer becomes very significant, but for now, my life is fairly stable. I feel that I should pray more, kinda makes me feel bad when I'm not, seems like I'm taking what I have for granted.

Poll is made of phail... there's no "never" option.
^^ This.

no, that's transcendant:


Take my love, take my land
take me where i cannot stand
i don't care, i'm still free
you can't take the sky from me

take me out to the black
tell them i ain't comin' back
burn the land and boil the sea
you can't take the sky from me

there's no place i can be
since i found serenity
but you can't take the sky from me...
<3<3<3

I pray because I am thankful and also because I am troubled.

<3<3<3

Thank you! I thought that was entirely wasted...

:)

There's no "Never" option?

Poll is made of phail... there's no "never" option.

Nor is there a 'forever' or 'always' option, what an outrage, he needs to be aware of how much time many people like I commit to the FSM!

Where's the nevr option?

Nor is there a 'forever' or 'always' option, what an outrage, he needs to be aware of how much time many people like I commit to the FSM!

Did you ever read Franny and Zooey?

Jesus taught people to pray in this manner:

Our Father in heaven,
hallowed be your name.

(shows reverence and praise to God, first and foremost)

Your Kingdom come,
your will be done,
on earth as in heaven

(Shows submission of the person praying, to the one they are praying to. Its a sign of respect, and honor)

Give us today our daily bread.

(ask for the needs that you have)

Forgive us our sins,
as we forgive those who sin against us.

(ensure that you are on the right standing with God. )

Lead us not into temptation,
but deliver us from evil.
(praying for rescue from the evil thoughts and ways of this world)

For the kingdom, the power and the glory are yours.
Now and for ever. Amen
(ending with another bit of praise)

I try to model my "set" prayers after this, meaning that there are certain times when I have set aside specifically for prayer, if I can't do it any other time of the day. However, in those time outside of this, i more or less just have a casual chat with God.

A relationship with God is very much like a relationship with another person. You respect them, you love on them, you do things for them, and you have constant communication. And the other person reciprocates that.

I pray because I am thankful and also because I am troubled.

Disturbed?

If, by prayer, you mean a one-sided discourse directed to being(s) who may or may not exist and who, if he/she/it/they exist at all, almost certainly doesn't listen, I do it occasionally: usually when I'm pissed about something.

In may case, this discourse may be considered venting since I expect no response or action to be taken.

Where is your "I don't pray" option?

If I really believed in supernatural beings of any stripe, I would prefer the ancient Greek method of praying, which was basically to offer a deal to the target deity: you do this for me, I'll do something for you.

A relationship with God is very much like a relationship with another person. You respect them, you love on them, you do things for them, and you have constant communication. And the other person reciprocates that.

"You love on them" interesting choice of words.

Then of course you find out God has been seeing you best friend behind your back....

"You love on them" interesting choice of words.

Then of course you find out God has been seeing you best friend behind your back....

A illustration of prayer found in the Catholic Church.

http://nymag.com/daily/intel/26_gossipgirl_lg.jpg

I'm an atheist who prays nearly every day...

Rationally, I'd say that prayer can be a very positive occurrence for some people. When serving as an honest and introspective function, prayer and meditation can help an individual to organize their lives, to identify problems, their causes and potential solutions and increase personal morale, especially in believers--and not just "goes to church to not make mom sad" believers either.

About once a day, usually at my desk in the evenings.

I clicked all of them because I could

Not as often as I should.

A illustration of prayer found in the Catholic Church.

http://nymag.com/daily/intel/26_gossipgirl_lg.jpg
I might pray so that goes where I want it to go.

Hmm, my views on religion would probably be found offensive considering most of other replies, but I feel the need to ask: what compels you to have faith? What does it achieve? I am not challenging your ideas, I am honestly curious about why religion plays a part in your life. I have always resented it because, to me, it suggested weakness and needing someone to support you at all times. Don't take offense! Just explain why and allow me to understand! Thanks in advance.
Not all religions are like that. You might want to specify what kind of religions you are talking about.

If I really believed in supernatural beings of any stripe, I would prefer the ancient Greek method of praying, which was basically to offer a deal to the target deity: you do this for me, I'll do something for you.
That's what I do. I don't even call it "prayer" because it's just not like what the Abrahamic religions call prayer at all. I call it "veneration," and it covers everything from simple acknowledgments of awareness of a god or spirit -- taking notice of the objects in my area that I associate with various spirits -- to the specific dealmaking you describe.

Never...

...I call it "veneration," and it covers everything from simple acknowledgments of awareness of a god or spirit -- taking notice of the objects in my area that I associate with various spirits -- to the specific dealmaking you describe.

Venerate has the same etymology as venereal. As in Venus. Yes, I enjoy the implications too.

I pray whenever I happen to think of it. Just not to Yahweh.

I'm an atheist who prays nearly every day...

Interested. What to?

Interested. What to?

Me.

Me.

nope

nope

You dare deny my divinity?

You dare deny my divinity?

You're a god?:eek:

You're a god?:eek:

Even better (fuck you Anselm).

Even better (fuck you Anselm).

So when I say ''Our Father who art in...'', I'm actually saying ''Our Hydesland who art in...'' and such? Oh my Hydesland!:eek:

You're a god?:eek:

Most people think,
Great God will come from the skies,
Take away everything
And make everybody feel high.
But if you know what life is worth,
You will look for yours on earth:
And now you see the light,
You stand up for your rights. Jah!...

We sick an' tired of-a your ism-skism game -
Dyin' 'n' goin' to heaven in-a Jesus' name, Lord.
We know when we understand:
Almighty God is a living man.

Most people think,
Great God will come from the skies,
Take away everything
And make everybody feel high.
But if you know what life is worth,
You will look for yours on earth:
And now you see the light,
You stand up for your rights. Jah!...

We sick an' tired of-a your ism-skism game -
Dyin' 'n' goin' to heaven in-a Jesus' name, Lord.
We know when we understand:
Almighty God is a living man.

Yes, I was right. God does posts on NSG. :D

Bob Marley

You dare deny my divinity?
Reform!

Bob Marley

Yes. I find his interpretation of Christianity to hold more meaning for me than the orthodox one.

Yes. I find his interpretation of Christianity to hold more meaning for me than the orthodox one.


Can't fault you there. I find myself at odds with most of the institutionalized/industrialized forms of Christianity myself.

That's fake me.

Bob rocks. His music is familiar.

A white friend of mine Aaron from back in the day went in to Rastafarism. I remember he quit drinking, quit smoking cigs .. and quit doing stupid shit. I figured it was a phase. Now 15 years later he is still. I'm glad it wasn't a 'phase' .. it did him well. I'd bet money right now .. if he hadn't changed his life in that way .. he would've wound up in prison.

It sounds very similar to me when I was saved.

I once worked in a store before it opened. We set up everything.. racks, shelves etc.

The management had set up these big ass speakers near the entrance.. One day nearing the opening.. one of the managers gathered us all up to the front and told us he would play some music on these big ass speakers.

He asked us all what we would want to hear. We had all different types there. Different ages, different races. I mentioned Bob Marley. He ignored it.

He chose AC/DC. I'm a fan of AC/DC. But to many in there the guitar sounded like noise. Also.. it wasn't coming out right.. it was screeching. ie sounded like shit.

The music went off for a few minutes. Then we heard Bob.

And it was good.

True story.

Obviously this thread is meant only for those who are of a spiritual/religious nature who also have a higher power that they pray to.
The reason that there is not an "never" option was explained in the OP which is reproduced above. It is a question about how often they pray.

And those who ask that question are just spamming the thread.

I once worked in a store before it opened. We set up everything.. racks, shelves etc.

The management had set up these big ass speakers near the entrance.. One day nearing the opening.. one of the managers gathered us all up to the front and told us he would play some music on these big ass speakers.

He asked us all what we would want to hear. We had all different types there. Different ages, different races. I mentioned Bob Marley. He ignored it.

He chose AC/DC. I'm a fan of AC/DC. But to many in there the guitar sounded like noise. Also.. it wasn't coming out right.. it was screeching. ie sounded like shit.

The music went off for a few minutes. Then we heard Bob.

And it was good.

True story.

And God created Bob, and saw that his music was good. But then God found this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8A3zetSuYRg

The reason that there is not an "never" option was explained in the OP which is reproduced above. It is a question about how often they pray.

And those who ask that question are just spamming the thread.

While many atheists are posting, you couldn't really expect them to not wander in. This is NSG and we love our religious debates. However, not having a never option also excludes those theists who don't pray, for whatever reason.

On a selfish note, I would have liked an 'attempting to always pray' option.

Wasn't CanuckHaven leaving after Obama won? There's a campaign promise I want fulfilled!

And God created Bob, and saw that his music was good. But then God found this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8A3zetSuYRg

That wouldn've went down well in Wal Mart. It would've given us a head ache.

The reason Bob Marley came into my mind.. was because it would meet the younger blacks, the older blacks... those of us who dug Bob anyway regardless and the older crowd could groove to the rhythm.

By which token, it should have options for 'not at all' helpful, etc - you ASSUME that prayer MUST be efficacious, and you ruin the potential for a perfectly good poll, to satisfy that assumption.
Sorry if my poll options are not to your liking, but I do believe them to be sufficient, and yes I do believe that prayer is good for the soul.

Wasn't CanuckHaven leaving after Obama won?
I changed my mind, so you don't need to worry about it anymore. :D

I changed my mind, so you don't need to worry about it anymore. :D


Welcome back then. :tongue:

Welcome back then. :tongue:
Thank you. :)

I'm an atheist who prays nearly every day...

Who do you pray to? :confused:

Venerate has the same etymology as venereal. As in Venus. Yes, I enjoy the implications too.
What did somebody before me say? Something about "loving on" them?

And God created Bob, and saw that his music was good. But then God found this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8A3zetSuYRg

I'm buzzzed , watched/listened. Very good.heh

Venerate has the same etymology as venereal. As in Venus. Yes, I enjoy the implications too.

That explains why Mur gets itchy red bumps every time she prays.

I don't pray, nor do I believe in heaven, hell, reincarnation, a personal god, a creator god, the devil, magic, souls, angels, demons, fairies or ghosts; nonetheless I have a deep religious reverance for the universe & all its myriad wonders, & enjoy the temporary role I play in it. Sometimes I meditate, but mostly I do what I can to make the future brighter for my wife & I, as well as for our daughter, who is the closest thing to magic or immortality that I'll ever encounter.

Every night, before I go to bed.

Sorry if my poll options are not to your liking, but I do believe them to be sufficient, and yes I do believe that prayer is good for the soul.

So what purpose does that poll serve, if you think you know it all in advance anyway and don't allow for non-compliant answers?













Hang on, forget I asked, I forgot that this mentality is the basis for most beliefs.

Thank you! I thought that was entirely wasted...

:)

Just thought I'd say that I appreciated it too.

Oh, and something relevant to the topic:
I was playing Diplomacy yesterday as Austria, and, after stabbing Russia, allowing me to consolidate my hold on the Balkans, found myself threatened by Russia, Turkey, and Italy. My prospects looked grim. So I sent out a prayer to England, asking him to attack Russia from the North, and to Italy, asking to end our long-running (and fruitless) war.

England agreed to grab St. Petersburg, and Italy is now my ally. I guess prayer really does work! :D

"Be happy and rejoice continually. Be unceasing in prayer. Thank God in everything, no matter what the circumstances may be, for this is the will of God for you."

So what purpose does that poll serve, if you think you know it all in advance anyway and don't allow for non-compliant answers?
As a self admitted aheist, why should you have any concern about this thread or my poll options?

Hang on, forget I asked, I forgot that this mentality is the basis for most beliefs.
So what you really want is to challenge my "mentality" and question my beliefs? And no, I am not looking for any response from you on this.

Where is the "never" option?

Also, the "not as often as I should" option is silly. People should pray whenever they feel like it, whenever they feel the need for prayer whether it be for comfort/advice/whatever talking aloud about your problems and pretending that a benevolent someone is listening helps with.

An aside: I would say that I don't meditate enough though, in that I enjoy meditation but don't often take the time to do it. Maybe this is what you mean by "should".

No, that's transcendant:


Take my love, take my land
Take me where I cannot stand
I don't care, I'm still free
You can't take the sky from me

Take me out to the black
Tell them I ain't comin' back
Burn the land and boil the sea
You can't take the sky from me

There's no place I can be
Since I found Serenity
But you can't take the sky from me...

Great words!

Sorry if my poll options are not to your liking, but I do believe them to be sufficient, and yes I do believe that prayer is good for the soul.

Good for the "soul" but not for the body: http://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/31/health/31pray.html

And patients who knew they were being prayed for had a higher rate of post-operative complications like abnormal heart rhythms, perhaps because of the expectations the prayers created, the researchers suggested.

As a self admitted aheist, why should you have any concern about this thread or my poll options?

1. It's NSG...
2. There should be a never option for those religious people that don't pray (they exist you know).

As a self admitted aheist, why should you have any concern about this thread or my poll options?


So what you really want is to challenge my "mentality" and question my beliefs? And no, I am not looking for any response from you on this.

No, what I'm wondering is why you made a skewed poll like that, knowing full well that most posters here will jump at the opportunity to skew it even further?

Fairly often. I pray often, but briefly, all throughout the day.

I pray to Loki about twice a week. Usually, I'm at a blackjack table.

Please explain why there's no "I see no reason for prayer" option.

Please explain why there's no "I see no reason for prayer" option.
\/ This \/
As a self admitted aheist, why should you have any concern about this thread or my poll options?
:rolleyes:

Tell me, Dyakovo, where did the mods give you permission to declare who may and may not post in this thread?

Tell me, Dyakovo, where did the mods give you permission to declare who may and may not post in this thread?

He was merely restating that if you're an atheist, why should you care about a thread that deals with how often do you pray? Not if you pray, but how often. If you're an atheist, and don't pray, then you have no reason to be in this thread other than to cause trouble, or possibly whine for attention. Unless the thread degenerates into a debate about something that does pertain to you, which it has not... Yet.

Are you guys arguing? I can't tell. Fight! fight! fight! go, destroy!

Are you guys arguing? I can't tell. Fight! fight! fight! go, destroy!

Hulk Smash! :p

He was merely restating that if you're an atheist, why should you care about a thread that deals with how often do you pray? Not if you pray, but how often. If you're an atheist, and don't pray, then you have no reason to be in this thread other than to cause trouble, or possibly whine for attention. Unless the thread degenerates into a debate about something that does pertain to you, which it has not... Yet.

In case you haven't noticed, it IS possible to discuss thigns people don't care about without flaming others. But since the overly religious people here seem to think that people like myself are second-class citizens, I think I'm done posting in this thread.

In case you haven't noticed, it IS possible to discuss thigns people don't care about without flaming others. But since the overly religious people here seem to think that people like myself are second-class citizens, I think I'm done posting in this thread.

You claim to be treated like s econd-class citizen, even on here, but you are not. Yet you treat the Religious as second-class citizens, and then expect special treatment. It isn't going to happen. And if you don't care about a subject, there is no reason to be posting about it. Because you wouldn't care. But you do care in some way, otherwise, you would have remained out of the thread completely.

He was merely restating that if you're an atheist, why should you care about a thread that deals with how often do you pray? Not if you pray, but how often. If you're an atheist, and don't pray, then you have no reason to be in this thread other than to cause trouble, or possibly whine for attention. Unless the thread degenerates into a debate about something that does pertain to you, which it has not... Yet.
Dude, that's a fucked up argument. I don't pray- and yet I'm here laughing at all the people who do.

2. There should be a never option for those religious people that don't pray (they exist you know).

Yeah I hear there's an abundance of them.

Dude, that's a fucked up argument. I don't pray- and yet I'm here laughing at all the people who do.

So laugh, but don't whine about how they aren't offering a special option just for you. You obviously care about the matter in some form, even if it's just for humorous matters, SL claimed not to care at all. Perhaps my wording is off (as it often is)

Yeah I hear there's an abundance of them.
Interesting. Who did you "hear" this from?

only when the need is greatest......never. Why isn't that an option?

That explains why Mur gets itchy red bumps every time she prays.
Response: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v427/vonbek/117741625470.gif

He was merely restating that if you're an atheist, why should you care about a thread that deals with how often do you pray? Not if you pray, but how often. If you're an atheist, and don't pray, then you have no reason to be in this thread other than to cause trouble, or possibly whine for attention. Unless the thread degenerates into a debate about something that does pertain to you, which it has not... Yet.I'm an atheist, and I read this thread because I wanted to read about other people's take on the subject. Atheists can have a reason to read the thread other than 'whining.'

I'm an atheist, and I read this thread because I wanted to read about other people's take on the subject. Atheists can have a reason to read the thread other than 'whining.'
Once again, my poor choice of words fails me. I meant that as directed at SL, who proclaimed to have no interest in the subject, and also as an atheist. I concede that it was a very poor choice of words, and I needed my monthly nap at the time, so I apologize if I've offended you. (Which I seem to have)

Once again, my poor choice of words fails me. I meant that as directed at SL, who proclaimed to have no interest in the subject, and also as an atheist. I concede that it was a very poor choice of words, and I needed my monthly nap at the time, so I apologize if I've offended you. (Which I seem to have)Offended, nah. Just wanted to point out that atheist can have legitimate reasons for taking interest in this thread.

I can't think of the last time I was offended actually...

Response: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v427/vonbek/117741625470.gif

Nice... to the point(s)... and not quite as painful as your normal refutations. :D


as for those asking "WHY there is no NEVER option"

How often do you pray and how does prayer help you?

Obviously this thread is meant only for those who are of a spiritual/religious nature who also have a higher power that they pray to. Therefore, comment from atheists and non believers is discouraged.

The op is specifically asking about those who do pray. if you don't then fine. It's like some of the drinking or drug taking threads that don't supply a "I don't do drugs/I don't drink" option. CanuckHeaven is focusing this thread on prayer and those who do pray and why.

Tell me, Dyakovo, where did the mods give you permission to declare who may and may not post in this thread?

They didn't, I was showing CH's response/reasoning. It was CH, not I who felt there should be/are restrictions as to who should post and/or vote in the poll.

It is interesting to note that the "Not as often as I should" option has received the single highest tabulation, which suggests that at the very least some people know that they feel they need to pray more often.

Myself, I pray every morning to get focused on what lies ahead for the day, and at the end of the day, I offer a prayer of gratitude, while also reflecting on what went right and what went wrong. It works for me.

Edit: if during the day, something comes along that threatens to tip the balance towards the negative, I do my best to pray and level the situation.

In my opinion, prayer functions as a way to organize thoughts and create priorities. This isn't a bad thing. It's just more effective to do something to make them come true.
But there are plenty of times when you can't do something without organizing your thoughts and creating priorities. If you're praying for guidance, for example, there's the assumption you will follow through with whatever the guidance is as soon as you are given/discover it.
http://www.bay-of-fundie.com/img/2007/bush-praying2.jpg

Um...is it just me, or does George Bush have three hands in this picture?

Never - If I have a problem that can be resolved, I set about resolving it, if I have a problem that can not be resolved I set about dealing with the after effects.

Praying is a waste of time.

Never - If I have a problem that can be resolved, I set about resolving it, if I have a problem that can not be resolved I set about dealing with the after effects.

Praying is a waste of time.
I take issue with this phrase, and not just in reference to praying. I get what you mean, that prayer is ineffective, but "a waste of time?" Things people always say are a "waste of time" generally take less than ten minutes and, at least in the case of prayer, occur right before I go to sleep. Mortal I am, I don't feel my life is so short that the accumulated time I spend on prayer will significantly hamper the quality of my life, or make America less competitive in a global economy because I could have been making wingnuts during those ten minutes.
Please excuse my rant. I have just grown weary of the phrase. :wink:

He was merely restating that if you're an atheist, why should you care about a thread that deals with how often do you pray? Not if you pray, but how often. If you're an atheist, and don't pray, then you have no reason to be in this thread other than to cause trouble, or possibly whine for attention. Unless the thread degenerates into a debate about something that does pertain to you, which it has not... Yet.

Let me see how this would work if we applied it to other areas.


How often do you have abortions?

If you don't have abortions then you have no reason to be in this thread other than to cause trouble, or possibly whine for attention.

How often do you have gay sex?

If you don't have gay sex then you have no reason to be in this thread other than to cause trouble, or possibly whine for attention.

etc. etc.

No, Conservative Morality. we non believers have as much right to post in this thread, which is, after all, about a subject which affects us more than it affects most 'believers', given the discrimination and prejudice we suffer, as any believer has.

But there are plenty of times when you can't do something without organizing your thoughts and creating priorities. If you're praying for guidance, for example, there's the assumption you will follow through with whatever the guidance is as soon as you are given/discover it.

Um...is it just me, or does George Bush have three hands in this picture?

It is not you. The reason the fourth is not visible is because it is doing things it oughtn't.

I take issue with this phrase, and not just in reference to praying. I get what you mean, that prayer is ineffective, but "a waste of time?" Things people always say are a "waste of time" generally take less than ten minutes and, at least in the case of prayer, occur right before I go to sleep. Mortal I am, I don't feel my life is so short that the accumulated time I spend on prayer will significantly hamper the quality of my life, or make America less competitive in a global economy because I could have been making wingnuts during those ten minutes.
Please excuse my rant. I have just grown weary of the phrase. :wink:

I am not saying that prayer is inefficient, I am saying that is is ineffective. It is a waste of time in that it does not achieve anything. However, by the same token wanking is a waste of time. If however, it makes you feel good, then for you go ahead and do it. Just don't expect others to necessarily approve of it.

Let me see how this would work if we applied it to other areas.


How often do you have abortions?

If you don't have abortions then you have no reason to be in this thread other than to cause trouble, or possibly whine for attention.

How often do you have gay sex?

If you don't have gay sex then you have no reason to be in this thread other than to cause trouble, or possibly whine for attention.

etc. etc.

No, Conservative Morality. we non believers have as much right to post in this thread, which is, after all, about a subject which affects us more than it affects most 'believers', given the discrimination and prejudice we suffer, as any believer has.

Once again, my poor choice of words fails me. I meant that as directed at SL, who proclaimed to have no interest in the subject, and also as an atheist. I concede that it was a very poor choice of words, and I needed my monthly nap at the time, so I apologize if I've offended you. (Which I seem to have)
It was not meant the way it was worded, I apologize.

I am not saying that prayer is inefficient, I am saying that is is ineffective. It is a waste of time in that it does not achieve anything. However, by the same token wanking is a waste of time. If however, it makes you feel good, then for you go ahead and do it. Just don't expect others to necessarily approve of it.
Prayer is not ineffective if it has the effect of making the person who does it feel better.

As to responses to demanding situations, they say god(s) help(s) those who help themselves. Those who pray instead of taking action, I would say are wasting their and probably other people's time. But in regard to prayer in addition to action, I'd say its like chicken soup -- it won't hurt to try it, so if you feel like it, go for it.

As stated earlier, I'm a dealmaking pray-er. In my belief system, there are gods and spirits in charge of all kinds of things, including things that usually we control ourselves to at least some degree -- such as good health, money, safe driving, etc. So, in my belief system, let's say you want to quit smoking, which most people find very difficult to do. An animist like me might pray to the gods of health for assistance in quitting, but that person would still have to do the work of quitting. It is believed that the gods will help an honest effort if possible, but they will not magically do our work for us. In fact, seeking help but not carrying our own weight on the project could invite the anger of a god -- they don't like having their time wasted with pointless requests, either. It's the same with other things animists typically pray for. If you want to be protected from traffic accidents, you can invoke the appropriate god, but you also better damn well drive properly yourself. If you want a good job, you can invoke the gods for that, but you had also better run your job search correctly. And so on.

My point is that, I agree that prayer in lieu of action is likely a waste of time, but prayer itself is not necessarily a waste of time. It can make the person feel better, more confident, etc. And also, at least some religions do not advocate prayer as a magical substitute for action. In my belief system, if you're going to pray to a god for help with something, you had better step up to the plate with your end of the deal, or else just stay the hell out of the shrine.

Prayer is not ineffective if it has the effect of making the person who does it feel better.

As to responses to demanding situations, they say god(s) help(s) those who help themselves. Those who pray instead of taking action, I would say are wasting their and probably other people's time. But in regard to prayer in addition to action, I'd say its like chicken soup -- it won't hurt to try it, so if you feel like it, go for it.

As stated earlier, I'm a dealmaking pray-er. In my belief system, there are gods and spirits in charge of all kinds of things, including things that usually we control ourselves to at least some degree -- such as good health, money, safe driving, etc. So, in my belief system, let's say you want to quit smoking, which most people find very difficult to do. An animist like me might pray to the gods of health for assistance in quitting, but that person would still have to do the work of quitting. It is believed that the gods will help an honest effort if possible, but they will not magically do our work for us. In fact, seeking help but not carrying our own weight on the project could invite the anger of a god -- they don't like having their time wasted with pointless requests, either. It's the same with other things animists typically pray for. If you want to be protected from traffic accidents, you can invoke the appropriate god, but you also better damn well drive properly yourself. If you want a good job, you can invoke the gods for that, but you had also better run your job search correctly. And so on.

My point is that, I agree that prayer in lieu of action is likely a waste of time, but prayer itself is not necessarily a waste of time. It can make the person feel better, more confident, etc. And also, at least some religions do not advocate prayer as a magical substitute for action. In my belief system, if you're going to pray to a god for help with something, you had better step up to the plate with your end of the deal, or else just stay the hell out of the shrine.
Absolutely. Faith without works is dead. God is not going to do for me what I can reasonable do for myself. However, there have been many times through prayer and meditation that I have been able to overcome situations that I believed were insurmountable.

I don't really accept the idea of a thread taking an "only people who agree with me are welcome" tone, so I'll submit that I don't pray and I don't believe in prayer. However, I'll also contribute something if anyone is interested: that having a sort of "count your blessings" attitude, even if you believe your blessings are a matter of circumstances rather than gifts from the Almighty, has been enormously helpful to me. Staying optimistic and avoiding self-pity is so important, and reminding yourself of how you have been blessed, so to speak, is very effective in keeping that attitude up. If prayer accomplishes that for a person, then I can accept that prayer can improve one's quality of life.

I am reminded of a quote from Kierkegaard, which goes: "Prayer does not change God, but changes him who prays." The effectiveness of prayer is measured in what comes about when someone prays, yes-- but not necessarily what one prays for.

I am not saying that prayer is inefficient, I am saying that is is ineffective.
To you, prayer is "ineffective", yet below you suggest that it may be effective for others.


It is a waste of time in that it does not achieve anything.
Again, prayer may be "a waste of time" for you, yet it is not "a waste of time" for those who believe in the power of prayer.

However, by the same token wanking is a waste of time.
That could be a whole new thread and you might find quite a few who disagree with you. :D

If however, it makes you feel good, then for you go ahead and do it.
Your consent is certainly not an issue.

Just don't expect others to necessarily approve of it.
The approval of others is also not an issue.