NationStates Jolt Archive

My reason is money. It might have been banned by racism (I'm still not sure of that.. I actually think it was a scape goat), but I think it's kept banned by money.


What 'legit' doc you know is gonna guide you to smoke some dope in stead of taking these pills here for nausea?
What doc is going to tell you this plant , that hasn't got a mass producer that they can make millions off of can give you the same or better effect?

"It grows on the vine ..doesn't take any cultivation .. The gov can't control it's sell ... ie there is no cultivation to control .. ie they can't control money on it"


What think ye?

Waits for arguments. Begins popping popcorn.

Marijuana is illegal because you touch yourself at night. *nod*

I'm pro marijuana. It shouldn't be illegal by all common sense. I don't like people getting records and going to prison over it. It's beyond ridiculous. Especially since alcohol is legal. No I'm not saying ban booze. Nor tobacco.

haha thank y'all for replying. I saw no one ... so I replied to myself to get the ball rolling lol.

I blame the hippies they always ruin everything fun.

Nope.

Early in the twentieth century in the United States, there was this weird puritanical movement that did their damndest to get everything fun banned. They succeeded, for a time, with alcohol, but because of the mainstream proliferation of booze, the ban was impossible to maintain. Everyone used it, everyone hated prohibition, and that was that. Cannabis fell victim to a similar group, but due to the fact that its regular use had not, and has not penetrated into society in the way that booze has, it was impossible to develop a constituency for legalization. The issue evolved from the initial moral concern. As time wore on with dope criminalized, it became associated in the popular consciousness with criminality. So, by the middle of the latter half of the century, it wound up that it was no longer a morality issue, but a law and order issue. Further changes occurred, the counter-culture, before burning itself out, managed to associate marijuana with stupid hippies who sailed the failboat with their social movement. Many of those hippies who went "respectable" began to associate marijuana with the incompetence, stupidity and foolishness of that time period, and as a result, wanted their own kids to have nothing to do with it.

Over time the issue has changed, it's a policy that has taken on a life of its own, and I severely doubt that change on the matter is even remotely possible. Marijuana and drug policy has taken on a life of its own, out of the control of any of the relevant stakeholders. Not that I don't support legalization, I wholeheartedly do. MJ should be completely and totally legal, but, it isn't, and it won't be, because of issue and group politics.

And, no, it has nothing to do with idiotic conspiracy theories about money.

Waits for arguments. Begins popping popcorn.

I'd actually think we'd mostly agree here on this forum. Maybe a few who don't. But their reasoning is meh.

I'd just like to know why people think pot is illegal.

And of course what would be their way of decriminalizing it.

Marijuana is illegal because you touch yourself at night. *nod*

I'm siding with LG on this one.

The US loses huge amounts of money on its 'war against drugs', and they would make a nice little revenue from taxation if they did legalise. I highly doubt it's about money, unless the US gov is incredibly stupid.

I'd actually think we'd mostly agree here on this forum. Maybe a few who don't. But their reasoning is meh.

I'd just like to know why people think pot is illegal.

And of course what would be their way of decriminalizing it.

Oh, I know, I'd be one of the people who thinks it should be illegal (but not jail time worthy)

But I'm not gonna argue it because I just am waiting for stupid trolls like Blunt (ironic, huh?) to show up and say something failworthy.

The US loses huge amounts of money on its 'war against drugs', and they would make a nice little revenue from taxation if they did legalise. I highly doubt it's about money, unless the US gov is incredibly stupid.

I believe it is not a question of whether or not the US government is stupid, but how stupid, as it is undeniable that they have an IQ below average.

Nope.

Early in the twentieth century in the United States, there was this weird puritanical movement that did their damndest to get everything fun banned. They succeeded, for a time, with alcohol, but because of the mainstream proliferation of booze, the ban was impossible to maintain. Everyone used it, everyone hated prohibition, and that was that. Cannabis fell victim to a similar group, but due to the fact that its regular use had not, and has not penetrated into society in the way that booze has, it was impossible to develop a constituency for legalization. The issue evolved from the initial moral concern. As time wore on with dope criminalized, it became associated in the popular consciousness with criminality. So, by the middle of the latter half of the century, it wound up that it was no longer a morality issue, but a law and order issue. Further changes occurred, the counter-culture, before burning itself out, managed to associate marijuana with stupid hippies who sailed the failboat with their social movement. Many of those hippies who went "respectable" began to associate marijuana with the incompetence, stupidity and foolishness of that time period, and as a result, wanted their own kids to have nothing to do with it.

Over time the issue has changed, it's a policy that has taken on a life of its own, and I severely doubt that change on the matter is even remotely possible. Marijuana and drug policy has taken on a life of its own, out of the control of any of the relevant stakeholders. Not that I don't support legalization, I wholeheartedly do. MJ should be completely and totally legal, but, it isn't, and it won't be, because of issue and group politics.

And, no, it has nothing to do with idiotic conspiracy theories about money.


actually marijuana was first suposibly banned cause of mexicans , not hippies. Same way cocaine was banned cause of slaves and opium cause of orientals. racism. fear.

buit im not talking about opium nor cocaine .. tho both have their place, and use .. but different..

I'm talkiing about pot.

Are you high right now?

actually marijuana was first suposibly banned cause of mexicans , not hippies. Same way cocaine was banned cause of slaves and opium cause of orientals. racism. fear.

buit im not talking about opium nor cocaine .. tho both have their place, and use .. but different..

I'm talkiing about pot.

Are you high, or did you just not read what I wrote?

Marijuana was banned during the social crusades of the early half of the twentieth century, just like alcohol. Unlike alcohol, it was never sufficiently mainstream to get the ban removed. Further, support for the ban has changed over time to different groups for different reasons.

Because the stinking hippies are in bed with the fascist ruling parties to deny the rest of us some fun.

Because it lacked the good fortune of either having a powerful corporate lobby like tobacco or an ingrained cultural relevance like alcohol. One of the best allies for personal freedom out there is the raw economic influence of corporations...I have no doubt most or all of the major tobacco manufacturers are highly interested in marijuana as a complement to their current product offerings. However, due to the bizarre stigma regarding marijuana (one reinforced more by bad memories of hippies than anything) they can't risk endorsing it without raising a government shitstorm.

Sort of odd that those evil corporate fascists are the best bet for preserving individual freedom in consumer goods, but that's what you get when their motivations lie first and foremost with the bottom line and not with some half-assed, half-cocked "morality".

Because the stinking hippies are in bed with the fascist ruling parties to deny the rest of us some fun.

Damn their hides!

all i know about pot is from government videos
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ne9UF-pFhJY

Are you high right now?

haven't smoke in about 8 years actually. I love me some pot tho! When I stopped drinking and smoking cigs in 01 I smoked a bowl or two a day.. those were the days. I had a good job then, before the lay off. Since then I['ve been not smoking cause I never know when I might have to take a drug test. So basically I been drinking. uuuugh.

haven't smoke in about 8 years actually. I love me some pot tho! When I stopped drinking and smoking cigs in 01 I smoked a bowl or two a day.. those were the days. I had a good job then, before the lay off. Since then I['ve been not smoking cause I never know when I might have to take a drug test. So basically I been drinking. uuuugh.

So you're drunk, then.

all i know about pot is from government videos
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ne9UF-pFhJY


I'm sure you'd narc if they promised to lift your taxes.

So you're drunk, then.

I'm not drunk, I'm buzzed.. what does this matter? I'm not hollering bad shit like I usually do.. I'm talking about a legitimate topic.

I'm sure you'd narc if they promised to lift your taxes.

I'd narc for a diet coke. Who cares?

Get while the gettin's good.

I'm not drunk, I'm buzzed.. what does this matter? I'm not hollering bad shit like I usually do.. I'm talking about a legitimate topic.

You're typing and comprehension seem slightly less than...coherent.

I'm siding with LG on this one.

100% with yea

Because it lacked the good fortune of either having a powerful corporate lobby like tobacco or an ingrained cultural relevance like alcohol. One of the best allies for personal freedom out there is the raw economic influence of corporations...I have no doubt most or all of the major tobacco manufacturers are highly interested in marijuana as a complement to their current product offerings. However, due to the bizarre stigma regarding marijuana (one reinforced more by bad memories of hippies than anything) they can't risk endorsing it without raising a government shitstorm.

Sort of odd that those evil corporate fascists are the best bet for preserving individual freedom in consumer goods, but that's what you get when their motivations lie first and foremost with the bottom line and not with some half-assed, half-cocked "morality".


...Look at pot.. you don't have to do anything to it. It just grows. How is the gov gonna make real money if they legalise it. Taxes won't even go..

i'd narc for a diet coke. Who cares?

Get while the gettin's good.

ha!

I'd actually think we'd mostly agree here on this forum. Maybe a few who don't. But their reasoning is meh.

Most people on this forum want everything legalised. Heroin, cocaine, ice.

I'm not drunk, I'm buzzed

Buzz off

...Look at pot.. you don't have to do anything to it. It just grows. How is the gov gonna make real money if they legalise it. Taxes won't even go..

If it grows and people smoke it, you can bet your sweet ass the government would put a tax on it given the chance. It's what the government does.

...Look at pot.. you don't have to do anything to it. It just grows. How is the gov gonna make real money if they legalise it. Taxes won't even go..

So does the tobacco plant, but there's still a massive industry around growing it, and massive taxation centered on selling it.

Most people on this forum want everything legalised. Heroin, cocaine, ice.

Especially baby burgers... mmmmmmmmm.

Is there any truth to the belief that one reason, however minor or major, for continuing the strict penalties for marijuana use in the US has something to do with support for privatised prisons? It's a theory I saw crop up on another forum I visit a couple of days ago, but I've not been able to find any evidence worth considering in my brief searches.

Is there any truth to the belief that one reason, however minor or major, for continuing the strict penalties for marijuana use in the US has something to do with support for privatised prisons? It's a theory I saw crop up on another forum I visit a couple of days ago, but I've not been able to find any evidence worth considering in my brief searches.

No. That's a stupid theory.

Most people on this forum want everything legalised. Heroin, cocaine, ice.


pots not even on tho realm of those

So does the tobacco plant, but there's still a massive industry around growing it, and massive taxation centered on selling it.

Tobacco isn't just grow and burn .. you gotta do stuff to it. You do not have to do anything to pot. It grows and that's that.

Is there any truth to the belief that one reason, however minor or major, for continuing the strict penalties for marijuana use in the US has something to do with support for privatised prisons? It's a theory I saw crop up on another forum I visit a couple of days ago, but I've not been able to find any evidence worth considering in my brief searches.

Dunno. could be an offset . but it's not the main reason.

Tobacco isn't just grow and burn .. you gotta do stuff to it. You do not have to do anything to pot. It grows and that's that.

Bzzt, wrong, there is no difference.

You have to dry it out--just like tobacco. Good luck lighting it aflame if you've just cut it off. Marijuana is one of the most water-dense plants around. You have to dry it out.

In fact, it was a very common practice until urbanization in the United States for individual farmers to grow their own little patches of tobacco.

Tobacco isn't just grow and burn .. you gotta do stuff to it. You do not have to do anything to pot. It grows and that's that.

No, you don't "gotta" do stuff to it. You can smoke tobacco leaves right off the plant just the same as you can smoke marijuana buds right off the plant. Just because people don't doesn't mean people can't. If marijuana was legalized, there would assuredly be a market for processed marijuana cigarettes.

Bzzt, wrong, there is no difference.

You have to dry it out--just like tobacco. In fact, it was a very common practice until urbanization in the United States for individual farmers to grow their own little patches of tobacco.

dude i got tobacco in back of me on teh side of me (in season).. tobacco is different from pot. I haven't grown my own pot (cry) but I know you do not have to do all the shit you have to do to tobacco to pot. After tobacco leaves the farm and goes to say RJ Reynolds .. it goes through a whole bunch of other shit before it becomes chew or a cig.



I dunno how the ameri indians did it.. but I'd bet money they have some type of process.

I duno about pot tho, dunno if they even smoked pot. know they did some halucinagins.

Drunk Naturality is my new favourite poster.

dude i got tobacco in back of me on teh side of me (in season).. tobacco is different from pot. I haven't grown my own pot (cry) but I know you do not have to do all the shit you have to do to tobacco to pot. After tobacco leaves the farm and goes to say RJ Reynolds .. it goes through a whole bunch of other shit before it becomes chew or a cig.

Yes, it gets ground up, wrapped up, packed up and shipped out in little boxes, cartons and cases.

Also, see Sdaeriji.

Drunk Naturality is my new favourite poster.

Same. This guy is pro.

I heard that it was banned because the person that invented paper, heard that cannabis was stronger, better, cheaper, took up less of the environment than trees. That person also ran a newspaper that began to try to influence the people that cannabis was bad, and eventually they made it illegal....

just what I heard...

Same. This guy is pro.

I feel like I do when I point the laser pointer at my cat... :)

I'm so sick.

No, you don't "gotta" do stuff to it. You can smoke tobacco leaves right off the plant just the same as you can smoke marijuana buds right off the plant. Just because people don't doesn't mean people can't. If marijuana was legalized, there would assuredly be a market for processed marijuana cigarettes.

argh .. go out to a tobacco field.. grab one of those green ass leaves.. be careful.. don't get a worm on ya .. and try to smoke it. Sdj I love ya, but you don't know wtf you talking about.


and I'm not doubting there wouldnt be a money maker if marajuna was legalized. of course there would be, the only place we'd be able to get it from was from thne gov. .. that wasn't my question.

argh .. go out to a tobacco field.. grab one of those green ass leaves.. be careful.. don't get a worm on ya .. and try to smoke it. Sdj I love ya, but you don't know wtf you talking about.

Try to smoke a marijuana bud right off the plant. Bet it won't burn.

Try to smoke a marijuana bud right off the plant. Bet it won't burn.

Ever heard the story of the Canadians in Afghanistan and their encounter with a large field of marijuana? They attempted to burn it down with napalm, whilst standing downwind. ;)

I feel like I do when I point the laser pointer at my cat... :)

I'm so sick.

haha no you aren't

Try to smoke a marijuana bud right off the plant. Bet it won't burn.

are you seriously comparing pot to tobacco?

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15239501/

Found it.

hey! but anyway !! my topic was why is it illegal! dangit lol

haha no you aren't

This is so incredibly cathartic after a night of writing grad school finals papers. :p

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15239501/

Found it.

That has to be the job people want: Stand near the burning marijuana, with the smoke in the air.

hey! but anyway !! my topic was why is it illegal! dangit lol

We're talking about Canadians, white phosphorous and "marijuana forests" now. Resistance is futile.

and Sdj.. you prob right about a bud right off the plant, but still.. it is not like tobacco.

We're talking about Canadians, white phosphorous and "marijuana forests" now. Resistance is futile.


heheh

heheh

You know you want to go.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15239501/

Found it.

this proves that marijuana = terrorism commence plan to introduce disease that eliminate all pot in the world.

Have any of you watched 'Hooked: Illegal Drugs and How they got that way? '


I'm sure it has some propoganda in it. but in general I believe it's true.

When we made alcohol illegal it was one of the stupidest things the government has done. A proper tax would boost the economy, keep people out of prison, and cut the prices for law enforcement.

When we made alcohol illegal it was one of the stupidest things the government has done. A proper tax would boost the economy, keep people out of prison, and cut the prices for law enforcement.

why do you want our police out of a job? do you hate the police and law and order ?

When we made alcohol illegal it was one of the stupidest things the government has done. A proper tax would boost the economy, keep people out of prison, and cut the prices for law enforcement.

That's the thing! I believe this is all about money. Everyone knows that if we really didn't want all this cocaine or heroine or pot in here it wouldn't be so flamboyant. Our own DEA or wtf ever is in on this shit.

Money Money Money

money money money
...money!

...money!

yeah it's the truth. make fun all you want...hell you prob across the sea. you got irish to worry about

ok that was low blow, i apologise. I dunno wtf is going on over there

ok that was low blow, i apologise. I dunno wtf is going on over there

I love this guy.

any who . pot being illegal. what are your reasons for it to be.

I'll end it ..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3FnQMSD4Zg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FL0cK4gaEuM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oobDQ0vdm8M
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4s0nzsU1Wg

Banned by racism?

My reason is money.

Quite right. Look under William Randolph Hearst, by the way.

wiki:William Randolph Hearst
Hearst sympathized with Harry J. Anslinger in his war against marijuana. Jack Herer and others argue that Hearst's paper empire (he owned hundreds of acres of timber forests and a vast number of paper mills designed to manufacture paper from wood pulp) in the early 1930s was threatened by hemp, which: 1) like wood pulp, could also be used to manufacture paper[9] and 2) also had an advantage over wood pulp, because it could be regrown yearly as well.[9] Between 1936 and 1937, Hearst associated marijuana with hemp in his newspapers[10] and published many of the stories that Anslinger fabricated.[10] Hearst would indeed play a major part in aiding the anti-marijuana movement, which eventually led to its prohibition in the Marihuana Tax Act of 1937,[11] a law which also effectively outlawed hemp.

Nope.

Early in the twentieth century in the United States, there was this weird puritanical movement that did their damndest to get everything fun banned. They succeeded, for a time, with alcohol, but because of the mainstream proliferation of booze, the ban was impossible to maintain. Everyone used it, everyone hated prohibition, and that was that. Cannabis fell victim to a similar group, but due to the fact that its regular use had not, and has not penetrated into society in the way that booze has, it was impossible to develop a constituency for legalization. The issue evolved from the initial moral concern. As time wore on with dope criminalized, it became associated in the popular consciousness with criminality. So, by the middle of the latter half of the century, it wound up that it was no longer a morality issue, but a law and order issue. Further changes occurred, the counter-culture, before burning itself out, managed to associate marijuana with stupid hippies who sailed the failboat with their social movement. Many of those hippies who went "respectable" began to associate marijuana with the incompetence, stupidity and foolishness of that time period, and as a result, wanted their own kids to have nothing to do with it.

Over time the issue has changed, it's a policy that has taken on a life of its own, and I severely doubt that change on the matter is even remotely possible. Marijuana and drug policy has taken on a life of its own, out of the control of any of the relevant stakeholders. Not that I don't support legalization, I wholeheartedly do. MJ should be completely and totally legal, but, it isn't, and it won't be, because of issue and group politics.

And, no, it has nothing to do with idiotic conspiracy theories about money.

While I agree with you about your assessment of the period, and the reason for the substance not becoming legal once more, I have to disagree with the cause for the prohibition.

During that time, Mexican migrant workers were willing to work for less than American workers at the time. They would come to America seeking work. When they were done for the day, they would smoke Cannabis as part of their happy hour; the hour right after work was over. In order words, Mexicans were being employed for cheaper than Americans were, kind of like today.

Cannabis was targeted because it was thought that by removing something the Mexicans enjoyed, it would send them back to Mexico.

This was the same policy behind opium. Chinese workers were viewed as very hard working and unlike Americans, willing to work for less. Opium was their alcohol. By trying to remove it, the American government sought to get rid of these workers.

It was partly because of the moralistic crusades - what better thing to add to a prohibition than more drugs? It was mainly influenced by xenophobic beliefs and that by denying these folks something they enjoyed in their home countries that it would drive them away and prevent them from "taking job from Americans".

Seems like that mentality still exists today and perhaps the tactic failed.

How and why was hemp made illegal? (http://abovetheignorance.org/faq.html#16)

The above site does a good job of explaining. I just paraphrase the information I got from it and videos I've watched over the years.

My reason is money. It might have been banned by racism (I'm still not sure of that.. I actually think it was a scape goat), but I think it's kept banned by money.


What 'legit' doc you know is gonna guide you to smoke some dope in stead of taking these pills here for nausea?
What doc is going to tell you this plant , that hasn't got a mass producer that they can make millions off of can give you the same or better effect?

"It grows on the vine ..doesn't take any cultivation .. The gov can't control it's sell ... ie there is no cultivation to control .. ie they can't control money on it"


What think ye?
i think its because dope smokers and former dope smokers dont have the balls to stand up and admit it. they wont advocate the legalization of marijuana even though they know its mostly harmless.

so they let a few old men and women decide to keep illegal something that they think of as satan's evil weed that will turn our children into heroin addicts.

It's illegal because the government doesn't like it when its citizens make money and mind their own business.

i think pot is illegal because pot smokers are too busy spinning paranoid conspiracy theories about why pot is illegal and coming up with laughable claims backed by effectively no evidence that pot is a miracle plant that will prevent baldness and make cloth to rival silk and that the man just doesn't want that to happen, thus not effectively organizing to legalize it and confirming the old conservatives' fears about hippies.

because whenever somebody does do some proper organizing around the issue, shit gets more-or-less decriminalized and/or legalized for medicinal use.

I believe it is not a question of whether or not the US government is stupid, but how stupid, as it is undeniable that they have an IQ below average.
Yeah or maybe they're actually funnelling "War on Drugs" money into other shit ;)

It was partly because of the moralistic crusades - what better thing to add to a prohibition than more drugs? It was mainly influenced by xenophobic beliefs and that by denying these folks something they enjoyed in their home countries that it would drive them away and prevent them from "taking job from Americans".

Then why, exactly, was the alcohol of the white people, alcohol, made illegal first? These moralistic crusades were independent of xenophobia--they were a combination of progressive social movements and christian moralism.


How and why was hemp made illegal? (http://abovetheignorance.org/faq.html#16)

The claims made are so extreme that it's tough to take that site seriously. Hemp is a magical food product, cloth, medicine and energy source that will solve all of the world's problems? It seems like the traditional stoner "whoa, dude, imagine what you can do with weed!" conversation I've witnessed people who are, for whatever reason, deeply invested in pot.

Marijuana was next. It was well known that the Mexican soldiers who fought America during the war with Spain smoked marijuana. Poncho Villa, A Mexican general, was considered a nemesis for the behavior of his troops, who were known to be especially rowdy.

I'm sorry, but, what the hell? Mexican troops did not fight with the Spanish during the Spanish-American War, and Pancho Villa definitely did not.

i think pot is illegal because pot smokers are too busy spinning paranoid conspiracy theories about why pot is illegal and coming up with laughable claims backed by effectively no evidence that pot is a miracle plant that will prevent baldness and make cloth to rival silk and that the man just doesn't want that to happen, thus not effectively organizing to legalize it and confirming the old conservatives' fears about hippies.

because whenever somebody does do some proper organizing around the issue, shit gets more-or-less decriminalized and/or legalized for medicinal use.

This.

i think pot is illegal because pot smokers are too busy spinning paranoid conspiracy theories about why pot is illegal and coming up with laughable claims backed by effectively no evidence that pot is a miracle plant that will prevent baldness and make cloth to rival silk and that the man just doesn't want that to happen, thus not effectively organizing to legalize it and confirming the old conservatives' fears about hippies.

because whenever somebody does do some proper organizing around the issue, shit gets more-or-less decriminalized and/or legalized for medicinal use.

So you're saying the reason why marijuana is illegal is because the people who want marijuana legal usually smoke marijuana.

That would explain it. :p

The US loses huge amounts of money on its 'war against drugs', and they would make a nice little revenue from taxation if they did legalise. I highly doubt it's about money, unless the US gov is incredibly stupid.

You sir, have answered your own question.

...Look at pot.. you don't have to do anything to it. It just grows. How is the gov gonna make real money if they legalise it. Taxes won't even go..

Simply not true! Unless you are talking ditch weed crud. To get best quality bud, it takes knowledgeable and skilled people to nurture it to perfection. In California, there is real money in this industry. It needs to be legalized to protect citizens in areas like Mendocino county, were many criminal-element growers set up operations.

And the potential tax revenue is immense! Legitimate dispensaries contribute financially to the community in sales tax, even without a dedicated marijuana tax as it is.

Marijuana is California’s number one cash crop, according to federal estimates, worth double the state’s vegetable and grape crops combined – or about $14 billion a year.

...

“Marijuana already plays a huge role in the California economy. It’s a revenue opportunity we literally can’t afford to ignore any longer,” said Stephen Gutwillig, California state director for the Drug Policy Alliance.

i think pot is illegal because pot smokers are too busy spinning paranoid conspiracy theories about why pot is illegal<snip>.

because whenever somebody does do some proper organizing around the issue, shit gets more-or-less decriminalized and/or legalized for medicinal use.

I think there is also a justifiable element of fear around organizing. Most respectable people, who would lend much-needed credibility to the movement, have a lot to lose in going to jail.

the reason why Pot is illegal is that no one has been able to put together a solid series of arguments to our lawmakers to make it legal.

I think there is also a justifiable element of fear around organizing. Most respectable people, who would lend much-needed credibility to the movement, have a lot to lose in going to jail.

there isn't really any threat of jail in organizing as long as you don't organize around the "i smoke all the time" platform. Hell, you don't even need to be particularly apologetic about having done it to get elected president.

but yes, there is a problem of getting the active support of both former and current smokers in places of respect and authority, who seem all too happy with the status quo.

the reason why Pot is illegal is that no one has been able to put together a solid series of arguments to our lawmakers to make it legal.

well, there's solid arguments and then there is what it takes to convince lawmakers to do things. they are not frequently the same thing.

there are no good arguments for our current policies - they are objectively pro-mexican drug cartel, for fuck's sake. on a purely pragmatic level, legalizing (or even fully decriminalizing everything below some commercial-scale of production and distribution) removes a number of significant problems while creating no real new ones.

there isn't really any threat of jail in organizing as long as you don't organize around the "i smoke all the time" platform. Hell, you don't even need to be particularly apologetic about having done it to get elected president.

I guess this depends on your idea of organizing?

In the Netherlands, people simply operated establishments that were thinly veiled dispensaries in numbers that were simply not controllable, the law basically had to call a truce. Some people got in legal trouble for doing so, but because of that activism, their country has the most progressive drug laws in a Western society.

Likewise, in California, growers, growing co-ops and dispensaries have been raided, shut down and some people sent to jail for a very long time. These are key parts of organization. Where the rubber meets the road, the threats and gains become tangible.

It isn't enough that 70%+ of Americans, poll after poll, are for the legalization of marijuana, at least for medicinal purposes. It isn't enough that legislation has been drafted and even passed in several states. It takes respectable members of society to come out and be visible about their usage and/or support. And maybe as Marc Emery thinks, and as was demonstrated in the Netherlands, it takes people actually doing what they think is right until the law comes around to sanity.

My reason is money. It might have been banned by racism (I'm still not sure of that.. I actually think it was a scape goat), but I think it's kept banned by money...


..."It grows on the vine ..doesn't take any cultivation .. The gov can't control it's sell ... ie there is no cultivation to control .. ie they can't control money on it"


What think ye?

"Money" is a very vague explanation. Depending on where you live, marijuana is most definitely cultivated. I live on Canada's West coast, and marijuana production and sale is a billion dollar industry. Although covert, indoor grow-ops provide much of the marijuana for sale, a substantial amount is grown outdoors in the mountains, in farmer’s fields and in logging cut blocks.

There are many physicians nationwide who will prescribe medicial marijuana (http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/marijuana/medical_marijuana.html) for a variety of ailments; from cancer and AIDS to glaucoma, and arthritis. As our medical system prefers the more Western allopathic approach to medicine, generally doctors are more willing to prescribe drugs that have been manufactured and marketed but as I said, there are many who will consider marijuana if there is evidence that a person may benefit from consuming marijuana. The problem with the medicinal marijuana in Canada is that in the past, the marijuana that patients recieved was a lower grade than they were able to get on the street...

As for the government being unable to control its sale.. there is definitely room for the government to control and tax the sale of marijuana. By purchasing high-grade marijuana from experienced growers and packaging it for retail in licensed businesses -much the same way that liquor is controlled in Canada (sans Quebec)-, the government could ensure a quality and standardized product (organically grown, strain makeup, THC and cannabinoid content...), while pulling in large revenues from its sale and taxation.

The main problem that Canada faces in the fight to decriminalize/legalize takes the form of our close proximity to the United States, and their Draconian Federal drug laws

The main problem that Canada faces in the fight to decriminalize/legalize takes the form of our close proximity to the United States, and their Draconian Federal drug laws

well, having a legal place to grow and a very close place where it is illegal to sell means ridiculous profits for the distributors willing to risk it. though this would apply even more so within a country. no border guards to pay off...

Then why, exactly, was the alcohol of the white people, alcohol, made illegal first? These moralistic crusades were independent of xenophobia--they were a combination of progressive social movements and christian moralism.

It starts off with a single source. Once people can do it for one group, it's easier to apply it to others. The real question is, why does one remain illegal while one was made legal?

The moralistic crusade had to start somewhere. It starts in its own backyard then moves out once the perceived threat is there. Without exposure, there is no perceived threat. Alcohol was apparent. The others were not. With a community that was at the time all white, those crusaders would have not been exposed.

The claims made are so extreme that it's tough to take that site seriously. Hemp is a magical food product, cloth, medicine and energy source that will solve all of the world's problems? It seems like the traditional stoner "whoa, dude, imagine what you can do with weed!" conversation I've witnessed people who are, for whatever reason, deeply invested in pot.

The plant that produces hemp is not smokable. That is one thing you should remember. The Cannabis plant used for hemp lacks THC, the component that produces that high. The female Cannabis plant, unfertilised, is the only Cannabis plant that will cause a high. A fertilised female plant, and its male counterpart lack the active THC component, and are only usable for hemp products.

Hemp unlike cotton, can withstand harsher conditions, and doesn't have to be subject to crop rotation, like cotton does. Where cotton erodes soil, hemp doesn't.

Yes, the site isn't the best, but to disregard something because it's been hyped by someone who may not be in the soundest of mind sets is simply silly. The plant has potential to do a lot. As a material, I find it's quite durable. I have a help bag; used it almost two years now. The only sign of wear and tear it shows is the ink stain from when I left a pen uncapped in it. It's the only bag I've ever had that's lasted me so long, and has been able to withstand daily use. I've pushed it to the limits and it, unlike my sister-in-law's brand name, high end bag, it didn't fall apart within a month of purchase. Her bag had to be replaced, and she paid over $500 for it; mine was under $100, with exchange.

I've seen what can be produced. For clothing, it would make a world of difference. Yes the plant isn't as soft as cotton, but it's stronger and more durable.

I'd be curious to see its use as a fuel. If we can use vegetable crops, why can't we try and use Cannabis? It would return food back to the tables and offer humanity another source of energy. It may work; it may not, but there is no reason not to try and convert its use to energy.

As for the medicinal use; that's been covered before on the forum, and the results are apparent.

As an intoxicant, why not? People are allowed to pollute their bodies with a plethora of synthetic and natural chemicals, or nearly anything else. We are exposed to pollutants. We are able to eat whatever forsaken crap McDonalds calls "food"; people can consume alcohol. Or anything else deemed unhealthy. But the government seems to think that it ought to protect us from something with no attributable deaths to date.

If we legalise Marijuana then whats next cocaine? Ecstasy? Heroin? All this would lead to is far more people being on drugs and therefore less productive. The economy would crash and we would gain a reputation as junkies.

If we legalise Marijuana then whats next cocaine? Ecstasy? Heroin? All this would lead to is far more people being on drugs and therefore less productive. The economy would crash and we would gain a reputation as junkies.

All this would lead to is far more people being on drugs and therefore less productive. The economy would crash and we would gain a reputation as junkies.

The economy would crash and we would gain a reputation as junkies.

The economy would crash

The economy would crash

Have you been on a really long vacation?

http://blogs.salon.com/0002762/stories/2003/12/22/whyIsMarijuanaIllegal.html

Dunno if anyone linked this.

Have you been on a really long vacation?

Tivo user perhaps. :wink: