NationStates Jolt Archive

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090217/ap_on_re_us/california_budget;_ylt=ArKP8.CTuti0Q9Sh7mwgUSTDr7sF

"If we don't pass the budget, the situation is just going to get so much worse," the Los Angeles Democrat told reporters Tuesday. "One more Republican senator needs to do the right thing."

Like other states, California faces plunging tax revenue that has imperiled state services.

The compromise proposal put before lawmakers was negotiated by Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger and the four legislative leaders — two from each party.

The plan includes $15.1 billion in program cuts, $14.4 billion in temporary tax increases and $11.4 billion in borrowing. The package also would send five ballot measures to voters in a special election to be held May 19.

The governor had delayed releasing layoff notices on Friday when it appeared lawmakers would pass the compromise plan.

But after the weekend sessions failed to produce the necessary votes, Schwarzenegger's spokesman said the administration had no choice. "In the absence of a budget, the governor must do everything he can to cut back on state spending," spokesman Aaron McLear said.

Despite the warnings of impending fiscal calamity, most rank-and-file Republicans have refused to agree to higher taxes. Republican lawmakers blamed Democrats for years of overspending.

"You're not going to go back to the people's pocketbooks to fuel that spending," said state Sen. Dennis Hollingsworth, R-Temecula.

Being ideologues the nation over, the GOP are threatening to derail the whole of California by refusing to pass a budget for the state because it includes required tax increases. Apparently Republican legislators are all from the rich sections of town or are their own constituents so they don't have to answer to the thousands of people California is going to lay off which will drive California even further into the ground.

How can the GOP justify running the state into the ground? Where is spending going to be cut? Probably those things that are hated by the GOP like education and public funding so that different people can get fired.

When state services start to stop, the Republicans will capitulate. They can only play partisan politics so long - when people start to actually suffer because of their pigheadedness, then I'm sure they will vote for the budget and find a way to place the blame elsewhere.

That's how it always works in state budget disputes. Its happened in Virginia several times over the last decade.

How can they justify running an entire country in to the ground?

OH wait right, party politics.

I wonder if the CA Republicans will do the same as some of the Congressional Republicans and brag about all the great programs in the budget and what it will do for the state after they vote against it. :rolleyes:

I wonder if the CA Republicans will do the same as some of the Congressional Republicans and brag about all the great programs in the budget and what it will do for the state after they vote against it. :rolleyes:

Almost assuredly.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090217/ap_on_re_us/california_budget;_ylt=ArKP8.CTuti0Q9Sh7mwgUSTDr7sF



Being ideologues the nation over, the GOP are threatening to derail the whole of California by refusing to pass a budget for the state because it includes required tax increases. Apparently Republican legislators are all from the rich sections of town or are their own constituents so they don't have to answer to the thousands of people California is going to lay off which will drive California even further into the ground.

How can the GOP justify running the state into the ground? Where is spending going to be cut? Probably those things that are hated by the GOP like education and public funding so that different people can get fired.

It's politics according to Paul "Muad'dib" Atreides; He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing.

:tongue:

I wonder if the CA Republicans will do the same as some of the Congressional Republicans and brag about all the great programs in the budget and what it will do for the state after they vote against it. :rolleyes:

Well let's see... the same people who passed Proposition 8 to "protect California children?" Yeah I think we can expect further idiocy from them. Same bastards whose collective asses (and expansive ranches) were saved by CA firefighters don't want to raises the taxes necessary to keep them operating. It's all a liberal conspiracy to raise taxes. Therefore we shouldn't raise taxes but instead sit around and do nothing. The collective thumbs-up-our-ass plan. Fucking great, red-county California.

I wonder if the CA Republicans will do the same as some of the Congressional Republicans and brag about all the great programs in the budget and what it will do for the state after they vote against it. :rolleyes:You actually expected better?

The collective thumbs-up-our-ass plan.Joy.

How can the GOP justify running the state into the ground? Where is spending going to be cut? Probably those things that are hated by the GOP like education and public funding so that different people can get fired.

I imagine this is what the voice message on my machine yesterday about an "emergency meeting" for district teachers was all about.

The state has already ordered every district to take an ax to its education budget. My city needs to cut $26 million from next year's budget. So far, they've come close with increased class sizes, no librarians, no prep periods, no science, P.E., computers or other "elective" teachers, pay cuts, and possibly furloughs.

I imagine this is what the voice message on my machine yesterday about an "emergency meeting" for district teachers was all about.

The state has already ordered every district to take an ax to its education budget. My city needs to cut $26 million from next year's budget. So far, they've come close with increased class sizes, no librarians, no prep periods, no science, P.E., computers or other "elective" teachers, pay cuts, and possibly furloughs.

Damn! :eek:

And I thought MS's cuts were bad...

It's politics according to Paul "Muad'dib" Atreides; He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing.

:tongue:

Sounds like the last 8 years.

The Republicans know that the government will bail out California if it's really in trouble, so by opposing tax increases not only are the budget problems "solved" (emphasis on quotation marks) but they can claim that they fought for lower taxes. Even better, if the state declares bankruptcy the restructuring of state government will also let them claim they fought for smaller government.

A curious world is politics.

Of course, people should realize this actually enables the Republicans to claim that they not only fought for lower taxes but also smaller government (through inevitable job and spending cuts as the state government goes through bankruptcy proceedings). Politics is a dangerous game.

How can they justify running an entire country in to the ground?

OH wait right, party politics.

Considering the state your country is in compared to others (including some you've bombed) I don't think you have much comprehension of what "running into the ground" means. The appropriate hyperbole for your country is "going to hell in a hand basket"

But...but... WHY AREN'T THE DEMOCRATS BEING BIPARTISAN?!?!

Waaaaaah!!! Wahhh!!!!!! They aren't being bipartisan enough to totally give in to our obstructionist demands and let us continue with the policies that have been failing for the last 30 years! WAAAAHHH!!! BIPARTISAN!!!

I declare the government of California dissolved. More over I declare California an Anarchist Free state. Wow maybe these are republican plans but anarchist plans. This is California I could defiantly the anarchist pretending to be republicans for a few decades then when the moment is right pull this and collapse the government.

no no no no.

this cannot be the real reason why the republicans are refusing to pass the budget.

no.

surely there is someone here who can explain that it all comes down to ...... oh i dont know what it could possible be but politicians are only this insane on the national level. only crazy people knowingly destroy the state they are living in.

but if they are secretly anarchist they think they are saving the state by destroying it.

Being ideologues the nation over, the GOP are threatening to derail the whole of California by refusing to pass a budget for the state because it includes required tax increases.

"Required" tax increases? No. NO. NO!!!

What is "required" is that the Jackass Party in Sacramento justify to every single California taxpayer why each and every spending item in their proposed budget is absolutely essential to the continued survival of this state and cannot be reduced by any amount lest disaster befall us. Unless they can do so, I refuse to send them one more of my hard-earned tax dollars and I will vote out anyone I can who supports tax increases.

The "ideologues" here are the Donkocrats who have controlled the state legislature for the last ten years and have run this state into the ground.

Apparently Republican legislators are all from the rich sections of town or are their own constituents so they don't have to answer to the thousands of people California is going to lay off which will drive California even further into the ground.

Apparently you don't live here and don't have the faintest idea what you're talking about.

How can the GOP justify running the state into the ground? Where is spending going to be cut? Probably those things that are hated by the GOP like education and public funding so that different people can get fired.

Start by cutting salaries for the prison union and other Democrat special interests who keep buying votes in Sacramento. Then slash the staffs of the state legislature. Then examine every single line item in the budget and cut every dollar that cannot be justified beyond all reasonable doubt as essential to the survival of this state.

But that won't be done because that would undermine the power of Sacramento Donkocrats, and that's the root cause of the entire mess.

Apparently you don't live here and don't have the faintest idea what you're talking about.


That never stopped you from having an opinion on IL politics.

"Start by cutting salaries for the prison union and other Democrat special interests who keep buying votes in Sacramento. Then slash the staffs of the state legislature. Then examine every single line item in the budget and cut every dollar that cannot be justified beyond all reasonable doubt as essential to the survival of this state.


...then gather a counsel in a magically protected safe haven to decide the fate of the One Ring. Give it to Gary Coleman and send him off to take the One Ring to the Dark Lord's stronghold in Washington DC and cast it into the White House furnace where it was created- the only place where it can be destroyed.

Make sure not to put it on, however, or the Dark Lord's influence might corrupt you and force you to vote Democrat. Also watch out for the nazgul- er, Democratic Senators, lead by the Witch Queen Nancy Pelosi.

And when you travel through Moria, I mean Boston, watch out for the big gay Balrog.

And when you travel through Moria, I mean Boston, watch out for the big gay Balrog.

Huge, flaming and uses a whip. Oooooo...

Apparently Republican legislators are all from the rich sections of town or are their own constituents so they don't have to answer to the thousands of people California is going to lay off which will drive California even further into the ground...How can the GOP justify running the state into the ground? Where is spending going to be cut?

I love how the left has owned California for the past forty years, and yet somehow it's the Republican's refusing to pass one piece of legislation that's responsible for it's present troubles.

...then gather a counsel in a magically protected safe haven to decide the fate of the One Ring. Give it to Gary Coleman and send him off to take the One Ring to the Dark Lord's stronghold in Washington DC and cast it into the White House furnace where it was created- the only place where it can be destroyed.

Make sure not to put it on, however, or the Dark Lord's influence might corrupt you and force you to vote Democrat. Also watch out for the nazgul- er, Democratic Senators, lead by the Witch Queen Nancy Pelosi.

And when you travel through Moria, I mean Boston, watch out for the big gay Balrog.

What a great argument. I can't believe how intelligent you are, or how much you refuted what he said.

What a great argument. I can't believe how intelligent you are, or how much you refuted what he said.

Whats to refute? He basically railed against higher taxes in an extremelly long winded, childish rant.

When there is an actual arguement there, Ill be sure to pay attention.

But...but... WHY AREN'T THE DEMOCRATS BEING BIPARTISAN?!?!

Waaaaaah!!! Wahhh!!!!!! They aren't being bipartisan enough to totally give in to our obstructionist demands and let us continue with the policies that have been failing for the last 30 years! WAAAAHHH!!! BIPARTISAN!!!
http://www.salon.com/comics/tomo/2009/01/06/tomo/

I love how the left has owned California for the past forty years, and yet somehow it's the Republican's refusing to pass one piece of legislation that's responsible for it's present troubles.

Oh, the left has owned California for 40 years? Cool, does that mean I own New Mitanni? I think I want a refund.

You probably also casually throw out stupid claims like "the liberal media" and expect them to fly too, but sadly, they don't. California isn't "owned" by "the left" nor "the right." What, every piece of legislation other than this has been proposed by Democrats? Like that liberal Prop 8, eh? Nonsense.

And all you have left is this silly strawman about blaming Republicans for "present troubles." No. We are blaming Republicans for future troubles. Specifically, the thumbs-up-asses budget they apparently prefer to have. But you could care less - you "love" it, just like New Mitanni "hopes [Obama] fails." Then you could gloat about being 'right.'

As if that would really disprove all the many times you've had your nonsense hammered down in places like, oh, this.

I love how the left has owned California for the past forty years, and yet somehow it's the Republican's refusing to pass one piece of legislation that's responsible for it's present troubles.

Reagan was "the left"?

Um how is not raising taxes during bad economic times "running the state of California into the ground?"

Um how is not raising taxes during bad economic times "running the state of California into the ground?"

I believe it has something to do with state of the state's coffers. You see, how it works is people pay taxes and this money goes into some bank-type-thing to be spent on schools and roads and stuff like that. Now, if the government doesn't have enough money in this bank-type-thing then it will have to either raise taxes or cut expenditure.

The reason these people are saying that the state is being run into the ground is because expenditure is being cut but the state still hasn't got enough money and further expenditure cuts could damage institutions such as schools and other stuff as well as forcing the state to fire quite a lot of it's employees which wouldn't be a nice thing to do given the current economic climate that you may have read about.

Of course one could argue that raising taxes would give people less money to spend which could harm the economy but that's getting a bit too complicated, don't you think?

What a great argument. I can't believe how intelligent you are, or how much you refuted what he said.

The next time this little boy has anything mature, let alone intelligent, to say will be the first time.

As for refuting my argument, he didn't because he can't. There is no refutation to my argument that every last dollar proposed for expenditure in the budget be subject to scrutiny and justified as absolutely essential before the Donkocrats extort even more money from the public.

The next time this little boy has anything mature, let alone intelligent, to say will be the first time.

This seems like flamebating. Id report it if it wasnt cute.

As for refuting my argument, he didn't because he can't. There is no refutation to my argument that every last dollar proposed for expenditure in the budget be subject to scrutiny and justified as absolutely essential before the Donkocrats extort even more money from the public.

What arguement? You made a suggestion and then went into an immature, howling whinefest about the democrats.

The next time this little boy has anything mature, let alone intelligent, to say will be the first time.

As for refuting my argument, he didn't because he can't. There is no refutation to my argument that every last dollar proposed for expenditure in the budget be subject to scrutiny and justified as absolutely essential before the Donkocrats extort even more money from the public.

Do you not think that this statement could possibly be a tiny, tiny bit ironic considering your signature? I mean, complaining that the democrats have driven the state into the ground and yet hoping they do it to the whole country? Did you really not feel any cognitive dissonance at all when you typed that?

Besides, they are right. An argument has premises and inferences and conclusions. What you wrote was an opinion on what you felt should happen. It didn't appear to prove anything because it didn't really set out to prove anything.

The next time this little boy has anything mature, let alone intelligent, to say will be the first time.

Self-criticism, Leeroy? I like it, but why do you call yourself "little boy"?

I know you are but what am I?


Seriously!?

Seriously!?

Why, do you think Leeroy somehow earned a better response than that? He's not even an American until he gives us all his birth certificate ractified by the governor of whatever state he claims to live in.

Why, do you think Leeroy somehow earned a better response than that?

I think it's less a question of what he deserves and more of your self-respect. You don't have to let him drag you down.

I think it's less a question of what he deserves and more of your self-respect. You don't have to let him drag you down.

Meh. :D

Meh. :D

I know.. It's like banging your head against a brick wall only a lot less painful and without the risk of disfiguring scars and death. Although the possiblility of brain damage still remains, as does the possibility of people walking up to you and asking "What are you doing?" or "Why are you doing that?" and "Are you a bit mental?".

But anyway, I've forgotten my point so.. er.. chin up! Don't let the bastards grind you down and all..

I know.. It's like banging your head against a brick wall only a lot less painful and without the risk of disfiguring scars and death. Although the possiblility of brain damage still remains, as does the possibility of people walking up to you and asking "What are you doing?" or "Why are you doing that?" and "Are you a bit mental?".

But anyway, I've forgotten my point so.. er.. chin up! Don't let the bastards grind you down and all..

You're pretty cool for a newbie, y'know that? :p

Wow! Flaming much?

The Dems blame the Reps. The Reps blame the Dems. Maybe the real problem is a State full of people who all want something but don't think they should have to pay for it. So they keep electing pols that promise them everything and, in a desperate attempt to keep the idiots voting for them, actually try to deliver. There's a saying that people get the government they deserve. I'm not sure how much overall truth there is in this statement, but it's sure true of Cali. The rich don't want to be taxed, the poor want free or low-cost food, housing, health care, transportation and the middle income just want out - because they're the ones bearing the brunt of the tax burden. Then there are the cloud-cuckoo land environmentalists and new age ditzes with airy-fairy ideas that sound good but someone has to pay for them. Is the problem with the Republicans who have their heads stuck so far up their butts that they can't see or the Democrats who are sniffing each others butts rather than paying attention to the realities of life in the state? Each one bears a share of the blame. But the real blame rests squarely on the shoulders of the California electorate who think that if they can get everything they want, someone else will pay for it.

One of the most heavily taxed states - spending 20 times more per capita than some states.

Maybe they need to do both - cut the hell out of their budget, and then raise taxes slightly.

Then go back next year and cut some more.

One of the most heavily taxed states - spending 20 times more per capita than some states.
California's total tax burden, at 10.9%, is tied with Utah for 8th/9th. Above average, but not extremely so: leaving out the anomalous cases of Alaska and District of Columbia (which receive special injections of cash), the lowest is New Hampshire at 6.6%
I have no idea where you get "20 times more per capita" (posterior extraction?)

What arguement? You made a suggestion and then went into an immature, howling whinefest about the democrats.

Is he talking about me? I don't know because I have had him ignored for months for being an ass.

One of the most heavily taxed states - spending 20 times more per capita than some states.

Maybe they need to do both - cut the hell out of their budget, and then raise taxes slightly.

Then go back next year and cut some more.

Except, being Republicans, "cutting spending" = "cutting the fuck out of taxes and cutting funding for schools, public works projects, and social programs but damn sure not cutting their own pay, reducing their staff, or ceasing the funneling of money to their rich districts for gated playgrounds or some shit"

A google search for the definition of "terrorist" revealed the following from Wordnet Search:

(n) terrorist (a radical who employs terror as a political weapon; usually organizes with other terrorists in small cells; often uses religion as a cover for terrorist activities)

I would add the following: also known as a "republican"

I love how the left has owned California for the past forty years, and yet somehow it's the Republican's refusing to pass one piece of legislation that's responsible for it's present troubles.

Yes, it isn't as if California is a state in a larger nation which is in an economic tailspin. That couldn't have any impact.

I believe it has something to do with state of the state's coffers. You see, how it works is people pay taxes and this money goes into some bank-type-thing to be spent on schools and roads and stuff like that. Now, if the government doesn't have enough money in this bank-type-thing then it will have to either raise taxes or cut expenditure.

The reason these people are saying that the state is being run into the ground is because expenditure is being cut but the state still hasn't got enough money and further expenditure cuts could damage institutions such as schools and other stuff as well as forcing the state to fire quite a lot of it's employees which wouldn't be a nice thing to do given the current economic climate that you may have read about.

Of course one could argue that raising taxes would give people less money to spend which could harm the economy but that's getting a bit too complicated, don't you think?

Nice post. Perhaps all of the Republicans should just leave California and it can impose a 100% income tax and let the commies gather there and sing kumbayah until the big earthquake comes that destroys it like Sodom and Gommorrah.

Nice post. Perhaps all of the Republicans should just leave California and it can impose a 100% income tax and let the commies gather there and sing kumbayah until the big earthquake comes that destroys it like Sodom and Gommorrah.

sigh... I guess we can dream, right?

Nice post. Perhaps all of the Republicans should just leave California and it can impose a 100% income tax and let the commies gather there and sing kumbayah until the big earthquake comes that destroys it like Sodom and Gommorrah.

So, you're admitting that you have absolutely nothing of value to add to this discussion?

So, you're admitting that you have absolutely nothing of value to add to this discussion?

I am confused. What makes you think that? My point is that taxes should, if at all, be raised during good times, not bad times. Only a liberal (I have a huge bias) would believe that higher taxes are the cure for an ailing economy.

I am confused. What makes you think that? My point is that taxes should, if at all, be raised during good times, not bad times. Only a liberal (I have a huge bias) would believe that higher taxes are the cure for an ailing economy.

And only a conservative (I have a huge bias too) would believe that cutting taxes, especially in light of the fact that 8 years of exactly that sort of economic policy getting us into the present economic climate, is the cure for an ailing economy.

And only a conservative (I have a huge bias too) would believe that cutting taxes, especially in light of the fact that 8 years of exactly that sort of economic policy getting us into the present economic climate, is the cure for an ailing economy.

Oh you are a Bush blamer. I see. Sorry, I am a Keynesian.

Nice post. Perhaps all of the Republicans should just leave California and it can impose a 100% income tax and let the commies gather there and sing kumbayah until the big earthquake comes that destroys it like Sodom and Gommorrah.

I AM YOUR GOD, AND YOU ARE TO BOW BEFORE ME!

What kind of person wishes death on people for disagreeing with him? That's shameful. Not to mention your lack of anything remotely resembling knowledge of economical and political systems. Let alone basic theology. Since you decided to throw some "I hope God smites them just to please my sadistic urges" in this thread, I dare you to prove that I'm not God.

Oh you are a Bush blamer. I see. Sorry, I am a Keynesian.

No, you're not. You're a person who wishes for the deaths of millions of your countrymen for disagreeing with you. I don't know that there is a name for that. Or, rather, I do, but we can't flame in the forums, even though you are a person who wishes for the deaths of millions of your countrymen for disagreeing with you.

Again: You are a person who wishes for the deaths of millions of your countrymen for disagreeing with you.

Oh you are a Bush blamer. I see. Sorry, I am a Keynesian.

You're a Keynesian, yet you believe that the government should cut taxes and, through logical extension, reduce government infrastructure investment? Are you sure you understand Keynes?

I am confused. What makes you think that?

Your post in which you say nothing but wishing for the deaths of millions of your countrymen for disagreeing with you.

Wow. The budget passed, with some changes to get one Republican to vote for it.

California is #6 in the nation in terms of taxes per capita.

http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/287.html

Wow. The budget passed, with some changes to get one Republican to vote for it.

Thus preventing other Republicans from grandstanding CA into the ground.

Thus preventing other Republicans from grandstanding CA into the ground.

I don't think either party got what they wanted.

You're a Keynesian, yet you believe that the government should cut taxes and, through logical extension, reduce government infrastructure investment? Are you sure you understand Keynes?

I think his point was that cutting taxes would do well for the ailing economy.

Which is true.

We would like to apologise for the way in which politicians are represented in this thread. It was never our intention to imply that politicians are weak-kneed political time-servers who are concerned more with their personal vendettas and private power struggles than the problems of government, nor to suggest at any point that they sacrifice their credibility by denying free debate on vital matters in the mistaken impression that party unity comes before the well-being of the people they supposedly represent, nor to imply at any stage that they are squabbling little toadies without an ounce of concern for the vital social problems of today. Nor indeed do we intend that readers should consider them as crabby ulcerous little self-seeking vermin with furry legs and an excessive addiction to alcohol and certain explicit sexual practices which some people might find offensive.

We are sorry if this impression has come across.

I AM YOUR GOD, AND YOU ARE TO BOW BEFORE ME!

What kind of person wishes death on people for disagreeing with him? That's shameful. Not to mention your lack of anything remotely resembling knowledge of economical and political systems. Let alone basic theology. Since you decided to throw some "I hope God smites them just to please my sadistic urges" in this thread, I dare you to prove that I'm not God.

The death of the commies by an angry god would wipe the stain of their sinful wicked ways from the fabric of my great country.

Yeah like you would know anything about economics seeing as you are a liberal.

I would not know anything about political systems since I graduated with honors as a political science major in college.

I guess a guy claiming to be god (who also thinks that it is an american value to not oust dictators) is the person I should listen to on the subject of theology.

I cannot prove that you are not god. However, I would be much more inclined to believe that you are some manner of devil and I do not even believe in the existence devils very much.

You're a Keynesian, yet you believe that the government should cut taxes and, through logical extension, reduce government infrastructure investment? Are you sure you understand Keynes?

Yes you messed up on the logical extension bit. This is where budget deficits come in. The problem with Cali though is that they did not build up surplusses during the good years. They were always having deficits because they are a bunch of pinkos.

The death of the commies by an angry god would wipe the stain of their sinful wicked ways from the fabric of my great country.

Yeah like you would know anything about economics seeing as you are a liberal.

I would not know anything about political systems since I graduated with honors as a political science major in college.

I guess a guy claiming to be god (who also thinks that it is an american value to not oust dictators) is the person I should listen to on the subject of theology.

I cannot prove that you are not god. However, I would be much more inclined to believe that you are some manner of devil and I do not even believe in the existence devils very much.

1- You don't know what "commies" are. The fact remains that you, that claim to be so democratic, are wishing death on people that disagree with you.

2- More than you, I patently do know. About anything.

3- No, you did not.

4- More than to yourself, that wish death on people who disagree with you.

5- I'm pretty sure I exist. And I'm also pretty sure YOU are the one wishing death on people who disagree with you. Want to discuss which of us seems more like a devil? Be my guest.

Yes you messed up on the logical extension bit. This is where budget deficits come in. The problem with Cali though is that they did not build up surplusses during the good years. They were always having deficits because they are a bunch of pinkos.

And you wish death on them.

Without even knowing what a "pinko" is.

And you wish death on them.

Without even knowing what a "pinko" is.

North Korean Commies killed my father's brothers, two sisters, and parents, for the crime of working for missionaries.

They tied them up with barbed wire, and then shot them into a ditch.

So forgive me if I have no compassion for anyone who thinks that Communism is a good idea.

North Korean Commies killed my father's brothers, two sisters, and parents, for the crime of working for missionaries.

They tied them up with barbed wire, and then shot them into a ditch.

So forgive me if I have no compassion for anyone who thinks that Communism is a good idea.

Do I look like I give a fuck about your father's family?

Read the thread before answering me if you, besides wishing for the genocide of Muslims, also wish for the genocide of Californians. Socialism isn't being discussed here, and neither is Communism.

Do I look like I give a fuck about your father's family?

Read the thread before answering me if you, besides wishing for the genocide of Muslims, also wish for the genocide of Californians. Socialism isn't being discussed here, and neither is Communism.

I would be happy to have killed any number of Communists when I was in the Army (in fact, I joined at the end of the Cold War).

I did, on occasion, severely and legally beat Communist protesters in Germany, which was satisfying in the extreme.

I would be happy to have killed any number of Communists when I was in the Army (in fact, I joined at the end of the Cold War).

I did, on occasion, severely and legally beat Communist protesters in Germany, which was satisfying in the extreme.

1- I was discussing with GF the fact that he doesn't seem to know what Communists ARE.

2- Your sadistic pleasures of beating up on people because they are there are ALSO not being discussed here. Go beat up the North Koreans that did your father's family in, they are not my problem.

1- I was discussing with GF the fact that he doesn't seem to know what Communists ARE.


I know what they are.

Nancy Pelosi's parents, for starters.

I know what they are.

Nancy Pelosi's parents, for starters.

Based on this post you just made, no, you do not. But feel free to describe your sadistic pleasures in beating her parents up. Maybe raping her? I mean, your father's family did croak in the hands of North Korea, or so you claim, so I'm pretty sure you somehow feel completely justified in thinking wistfully about the rape of a world-standard-centrist, capitalist woman.

Based on this post you just made, no, you do not. But feel free to describe your sadistic pleasures in beating her parents up. Maybe raping her? I mean, your father's family did croak in the hands of North Korea, or so you claim, so I'm pretty sure you somehow feel completely justified in thinking wistfully about the rape of a world-standard-centrist, capitalist woman.

Her parents were registered members of the Communist Party.

Pretty obvious that they were Communists. She was registered as a teenager.

Her parents were registered members of the Communist Party.

Pretty obvious that they were Communists. She was registered as a teenager.

Prove it. Then go take it to THEM. Let's see the response you get in feeling justified in beating THEM up - or her - because your father's relatives bit the dust in North Korean soil. That's NOT the subject I'm discussing with GF.

Her parents were registered members of the Communist Party.

Pretty obvious that they were Communists. She was registered as a teenager.

how could one be "registered" as a communist, officially, as a teenager, when voting registration wasn't lowered to the age of 18 until 1970, when Pelosi was 30?

More to point, her father was an elected Democrat Congressman and mayor.

Here's his biography on Congress' website:

http://bioguide.congress.gov/scripts/biodisplay.pl?index=D000007

Doesn't say shit about being a communist, now does it?

how could one be "registered" as a communist, officially, as a teenager, when voting registration wasn't lowered to the age of 18 until 1970, when Pelosi was 30?

You beat me.

I guess I will have to settle for didn't you get the memo? She is the Manchurian candidate!

Do I look like I give a fuck about your father's family?

Read the thread before answering me if you, besides wishing for the genocide of Muslims, also wish for the genocide of Californians. Socialism isn't being discussed here, and neither is Communism.

Damn H2 you are an even meaner than I thought. You know there is a saying tha the devil flourishes when men of good conscience do nothing in times of moral crisis. You did advocate not overthrowing Saddam. You have no sympathy for those murdered by commie dictators. You are a liberal. You claim to be God. Maybe you are a devil.

Doesn't say shit about being a communist, now does it?

You don't get it, Neo Art. It wouldn't say she was a communist if she was, right? Right?

She is the Manchurian candidate!

Manchuria?

That's near North Korea!

QUICK, Hotwife! Beat her up! She might have had some passing contact with people of the same nationality of the people that you claim to have done in your father's relatives!

I would be happy to have killed any number of Communists when I was in the Army (in fact, I joined at the end of the Cold War).

I did, on occasion, severely and legally beat Communist protesters in Germany, which was satisfying in the extreme.

Good for you! That is awesome. I am soooo jealous. I wish I could have killed or beaten up commies too without any legal problems.

Damn H2 you are an even meaner than I thought. You know there is a saying tha the devil flourishes when men of good conscience do nothing in times of moral crisis. You did advocate not overthrowing Saddam. You have no sympathy for those murdered by commie dictators. You are a liberal. You claim to be God. Maybe you are a devil.

You wish for the death of people who disagree with you.

Good for you! That is awesome. I am soooo jealous. I wish I could have killed or beaten up commies too without any legal problems.

You wish for the death of people who disagree with you.

More to point, her father was an elected Democrat Congressman and mayor.

Here's his biography on Congress' website:

http://bioguide.congress.gov/scripts/biodisplay.pl?index=D000007

Doesn't say shit about being a communist, now does it?

Democrat = Commie Lite

Democrat = Commie Lite

Glorious Freedonia = Person who doesn't know what communism is and wishes for the death of people who disagree with him while claiming to be pro-democracy.

Democrat = Commie Lite


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_Party_(United_States)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communism


Please, for your own sake, educate yourself. It can only make you grow as a person. You're doing such a disservice to yourself by spouting such ignorant nonsense and showing such a lack of political awareness.

Glorious Freedonia = Person who doesn't know what communism is and wishes for the death of people who disagree with him while claiming to be pro-democracy.

I know what communism is. The rest is true. Heikoku2= Saddam and Uday Hussein lover who claims that he or she is God.

I know what communism the rest is true. Heikoku2= Saddam and Uday Hussein lover who claims that he or she is God.

Oh yes, Heikoku has often claimed to be God, whilst waving pictures of the Husseins around.

Oh yes, Heikoku has often claimed to be God, whilst waving pictures of the Husseins around.

Quite frankly, is there anyone here who hasn't done that? Its life-affirming and good exercise.

I know what communism the rest is true. Heikoku2= Saddam and Uday Hussein lover who claims that he or she is God.

You see, where this fails, apart from the obvious grammatical errors that render the first sentence meaningless, is that Heikoku2 stated a fact. You do not understand the principles of communism and you have wished for the death of those who disagree with you whilst claiming to support democracy. Whilst it is possible Heikoku2 may be a god, he or she, I'm sorry I've not yet confirmed the existance of external genetalia, is speaking to you through a magic box the rest is just pure fiction.

Smarten up, boy, and have some pride, will ya? You're letting the side down..

Could I humbly suggest that everyone cuts back on the flaming and death threats? You've murdered a perfectly reasonable topic.

back on topic...

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29229462/

Senate leaders secured the final vote needed from moderate Republican Abel Maldonado in late-night negotiations by agreeing to his demands for election changes, government reform and removal of a gas tax increase, giving them the two-thirds vote needed to pass the package.

To win Maldonado's support, legislators also agreed to ask voters to revise the state's constitution to allow open primaries for legislative, congressional and gubernatorial elections.

Leaders also met Maldonado's demands to freeze legislators' salaries in deficit budget years and to eliminate new office furniture budgeted for the state controller.

hmmm... those demands don't sound unreasonable...

Could I humbly suggest that everyone cuts back on the flaming and death threats? You've murdered a perfectly reasonable topic.

Aye, you could do that but it would be like pissing into a volcano if you were in some way inclinded to do so..

back on topic...

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29229462/



hmmm... those demands don't sound unreasonable...

I can understand the opposition to tax increases but what exactly were the other options?

California takes in more taxes than most other states...but what the hell, we are entering one of the worst economic periods in decades, why not tax some more! and borrow too!

I can understand the opposition to tax increases but what exactly were the other options?

That's the problem. Even without other options, a minority political party gains enough political capital by opposing such measures to make their holding up of a necessary bill worthwhile. The Republicans who voted for the bill are probably in strongly red, uncontested districts, so that when the Republicans who actually face challenges in the next election go to make their campaign ads, their slogan can be "Voted Against Raising YOUR Taxes!" unlike their Democratic counterparts.

Start by cutting salaries for the prison union and other Democrat special interests who keep buying votes in Sacramento.

Setting aside all the other nonsense and flaming, I love that prison guards are merely a "Democrat special interest[]" in NM's universe.

I love how the left has owned California for the past forty years, and yet somehow it's the Republican's refusing to pass one piece of legislation that's responsible for it's present troubles.

Let's see in the past 40 years, who has been Governor of California:


Ronald Reagan (1967-1975) - Republican


Edmund G. "Jerry" Brown (1975-1983) - Democrat


George Deukmejian (1983-1991) - Republican


Pete Wilson (1991-1999) - Republican


Gray Davis (1999-2003) - Democrat


Arnold Schwarzenegger (2003-present) - Republican


Yep, all a bunch of leftists. :rolleyes:

Let's see in the past 40 years, who has been Governor of California:


Ronald Reagan (1967-1975) - Republican


Edmund G. "Jerry" Brown (1975-1983) - Democrat


George Deukmejian (1983-1991) - Republican


Pete Wilson (1991-1999) - Republican


Gray Davis (1999-2003) - Democrat


Arnold Schwarzenegger (2003-present) - Republican


Yep, all a bunch of leftists. :rolleyes:

Not exactly relevant but still..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4n-UGQcG3Jw

I can understand the opposition to tax increases but what exactly were the other options?

Perhaps a decrease in spending? We already spend mountains of money in comparison to other states.

Perhaps a decrease in spending? We already spend mountains of money in comparison to other states.

They are cutting spending. Rather significantly.

What exactly would you (and others claiming that spending cuts would solve the problem) cut? It's very easy to talk about spending cuts as preferrable to taxes in the abstract, but not so easy when it comes to specifics.

California takes in more taxes than most other states...but what the hell, we are entering one of the worst economic periods in decades, why not tax some more! and borrow too!
It had to come from somewhere... (http://www.metroforum.org/articles/item.php?id=16)
EDIT: Fucking used the wrong cliche.

They are cutting spending. Rather significantly.

Which would be great, if it were not supplemented with so much borrowing.

What exactly would you (and others claiming that spending cuts would solve the problem) cut? It's very easy to talk about spending cuts as preferrable to taxes in the abstract, but not so easy when it comes to specifics.

I recommend enormous cuts in welfare and government jobs. I am sure many would suffer, since we would only be spending as much as our neighbor states. Still, the damage done would be less than the damage a tax-increase in this economy will cause. If the taxes were merely on the rich, that would be one thing, but the taxes will harm the middle-class at its most critical time. You could say that depriving so many of jobs and welfare will destroy the economy, and I reply that the many should not have to put-up with a great loss of funds to support the few at this time.

hmmm... those demands don't sound unreasonable...

i can't speak to the state controller's furniture, but california's primaries are already open enough. any more open and they become undemocratic.

California takes in more taxes than most other states

California has a larger population than any other US states. Of course it will take in more taxes.

...but what the hell, we are entering one of the worst economic periods in decades, why not tax some more! and borrow too!

The alternative plan the Republicans seem to have been advocating is sitting around with our thumbs up our asses. What the hell, we don't need no state budget!

I recommend enormous cuts in welfare and government jobs. I am sure many would suffer, since we would only be spending as much as our neighbor states. Still, the damage done would be less than the damage a tax-increase in this economy will cause. If the taxes were merely on the rich, that would be one thing, but the taxes will harm the middle-class at its most critical time. You could say that depriving so many of jobs and welfare will destroy the economy, and I reply that the many should not have to put-up with a great loss of funds to support the few at this time.

California's state spending per capita is not that high. http://www.statehealthfacts.org/comparemaptable.jsp?ind=32&cat=1

But it makes perfect sense in hard economic times to reduce the government safety net. :rolleyes: The disabled, elderly, and poor children can always work harder, right?

Cutting "government jobs" is a nice easy catch-all with no substance. What government functions would you eliminate?

BTW, raising taxes isn't always a bad thing during an economic downturn. See, for example, Ronald Reagan's decision to raise taxes in California in 1972.

I can understand the opposition to tax increases but what exactly were the other options?

cut spending.

here is my take on it. If the first compromise bill is only able to get the support of two republicans It is not really a compromise bill.

A compromise should you know be able to attract more republicans then that.

This thread seems to be a hotbed for bringing out the worse in some. I'm locking it for now, while I review some rather questionable posts.

The thread will remained locked. In order to control the fire, we're barricading off this area, and ordering everyone else to go elsewhere.

The next time this little boy has anything mature, let alone intelligent, to say will be the first time.

As for refuting my argument, he didn't because he can't. There is no refutation to my argument that every last dollar proposed for expenditure in the budget be subject to scrutiny and justified as absolutely essential before the Donkocrats extort even more money from the public.

Attack the post, not the poster. You can complain about the government all you want, just don't attack the poster you have an issue with. Warned.

The death of the commies by an angry god would wipe the stain of their sinful wicked ways from the fabric of my great country.

Yeah like you would know anything about economics seeing as you are a liberal.

I would not know anything about political systems since I graduated with honors as a political science major in college.

I guess a guy claiming to be god (who also thinks that it is an american value to not oust dictators) is the person I should listen to on the subject of theology.

I cannot prove that you are not god. However, I would be much more inclined to believe that you are some manner of devil and I do not even believe in the existence devils very much.

I know what communism is. The rest is true. Heikoku2= Saddam and Uday Hussein lover who claims that he or she is God.

Once again, the problem here is we have someone attacking the poster and not the content of the post itself. Warned.

1- You don't know what "commies" are. The fact remains that you, that claim to be so democratic, are wishing death on people that disagree with you.

2- More than you, I patently do know. About anything.

3- No, you did not.

4- More than to yourself, that wish death on people who disagree with you.

5- I'm pretty sure I exist. And I'm also pretty sure YOU are the one wishing death on people who disagree with you. Want to discuss which of us seems more like a devil? Be my guest.

People!

I don't like repeating myself! ATTACK THE CONTENT of the post, not the poster! Warned.