NationStates Jolt Archive

Pres. Obama: "..if Congress passes our plan, this company (Caterpillar, Inc.) will be able to rehire some of the folks who were just laid off."

Jim Owens, the CEO of Caterpillar, Inc. ""I think, realistically, no. The honest reality is we're probably going to have more layoffs before we start hiring again."

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=6866995&page=1

HopeandChange

Pres. Obama: "..if Congress passes our plan, this company (Caterpillar, Inc.) will be able to rehire some of the folks who were just laid off."

Jim Owens, the CEO of Caterpillar, Inc. ""I think, realistically, no. The honest reality is we're probably going to have more layoffs before we start hiring again."

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=6866995&page=1

HopeandChange

Well, to be fair to Obama, it's pretty normal that businessmen would know more about the workings of their company than government officials. It has probably more to do with him not being in business but rather in government than him being a rookie.

Having said that, yeah that didn't look good for the President....

You realize there are like 3 open topics on Obama on the front fucking page, right? Was this all together necessary?

You realize there are like 3 open topics on Obama on the front fucking page, right? Was this all together necessary?

Yes yes it was. We get to endure this whining until at least 2012, and likely 2016. Fasten your seat belt, we're in for a long and repetitive ride.

I mean, seriously? Look at some of the shit that's been posted:

Obama says we all need to knuckle down, and can't keep our homes heated high all year round, but he keeps his office warm!

Obama says in a general sense that the stimulus package will help get the economy rolling, and help companies rehire lost workers. Owner of company states he believes it'll get worse before it gets better, but admits it probably will get better in the end, which does not actually invalidate what Obama said!

Seriously, fucking seriously?

Yes yes it was. We get to endure this whining until at least 2012, and likely 2016. Fasten your seat belt, we're in for a long and repetitive ride.

Good! If they're whining, that means they're suffering, does it not?

I mean, seriously? Look at some of the shit that's been posted:

Obama says we all need to knuckle down, and can't keep our homes heated high all year round, but he keeps his office warm!

Obama says in a general sense that the stimulus package will help get the economy rolling, and help companies rehire lost workers. Owner of company states he believes it'll get worse before it gets better, but admits it probably will get better in the end, which does not actually invalidate what Obama said!

Seriously, fucking seriously?

Remember, people have a very limited attention span, only the first two or three seconds of information sinks in to any degree.

Good! If they're whining, that means they're suffering, does it not?
I'm so glad you're not an American. That couldn't be farther from how things should be here.... We are not some backwards Bannana Republic that trys to make the people out of power suffer under the people in power. And when that does happen, we don't say "Good!". You seem to be awfully similar to the people you claim to oppose.

Yes yes it was. We get to endure this whining until at least 2012, and likely 2016. Fasten your seat belt, we're in for a long and repetitive ride.
Ugh, you know I'm really seeing now how ridiculously partisan some Americans are. Perhaps, try just disagree / defending him instead of just stating your party stance. You Democrats are acting in the EXACT same manner the Republicans you uppose so much were notorious for acting under the Bush years.

Think about that.
I mean, seriously? Look at some of the shit that's been posted:

Obama says in a general sense that the stimulus package will help get the economy rolling, and help companies rehire lost workers. Owner of company states he believes it'll get worse before it gets better, but admits it probably will get better in the end, which does not actually invalidate what Obama said!

Seriously, fucking seriously?
No, see you obviously didn't watch it. He made an example out of Caterpillar, an example the CEO clearly refuted.

These next few years will go by alot better if Democrats can just realize that Obama is making mistakes and if Republicans just give him a chance a realize he is inheriting a mess worse than we could ever imagine.

Both sides are acting like idiots.

Republicans are pouncing on anything that he does wrong as evidence that he is the wrong man for the job.

Democrats are ignoring any mistakes he makes by making fun of people and stating "WHERE IS THE CHANGE!?" while ignoring the topic at hand...

You realize there are like 3 open topics on Obama on the front fucking page, right? Was this all together necessary?

As opposed to the 400 or so "Bush is so stupid" posts any given day the past 8 years.

hy⋅poc⋅ri⋅sy
–noun
1. a pretense of having a virtuous character, moral or religious beliefs or principles, etc., that one does not really possess.
2. a pretense of having some desirable or publicly approved attitude.
3. an act or instance of hypocrisy.

Yes yes it was. We get to endure this whining until at least 2012, and likely 2016. Fasten your seat belt, we're in for a long and repetitive ride.
Heck look at the OP's name. It has Reagan in it.

And only 16 posts?

Hmm... I call the "T" word.

No, see you obviously didn't watch it. He made an example out of Caterpillar, an example the CEO clearly refuted.

These next few years will go by alot better if Democrats can just realize that Obama is making mistakes and if Republicans just give him a chance a realize he is inheriting a mess worse than we could ever imagine.

Both sides are acting like idiots.

Republicans are pouncing on anything that he does wrong as evidence that he is the wrong man for the job.

Democrats are ignoring any mistakes he makes by making fun of people and stating "WHERE IS THE CHANGE!?" while ignoring the topic at hand...

No, I saw it, more to the point, we can't say what was said between them. Maybe he did get it wrong, it doesn't matter.

I'm willing to admit he makes mistakes, the thing is, the mistakes i've seen the right wing harping on have been so utterly trivial as to be inconsequential.

I'm so glad you're not an American. That couldn't be farther from how things should be here.... We are not some backwards Bannana Republic that trys to make the people out of power suffer under the people in power. And when that does happen, we don't say "Good!". You seem to be awfully similar to the people you claim to oppose.

1- You support dictatorships. You don't get to make claims on "how things should be".

2- Learn to spell "Banana" and "tries". Furthermore, Bush DID do that, so did Cheney.

3- Yeah, after EIGHT FUCKING YEARS of being the one at whom this kind of thing was aimed, I'm pretty sure I earned the right to dish SOME out, too. The Right surely can dish it out, so it should be able to TAKE IT.

As opposed to the 400 or so "Bush is so stupid" posts any given day the past 8 years.

hy⋅poc⋅ri⋅sy
–noun
1. a pretense of having a virtuous character, moral or religious beliefs or principles, etc., that one does not really possess.
2. a pretense of having some desirable or publicly approved attitude.
3. an act or instance of hypocrisy.

I'm sorry, was it in the first THREE WEEKS of his administration, or only after TWO FAILED WARS, AN ECONOMY IN SHAMBLES, FREEDOMS ERODING AND THE US LOSING ALL CONFIDENCE IT HAD IN THE WORLD?

Furthermore, Bush DID do that, so did Cheney.
Exactly. You are much closer to the people you oppose than you seem to realize.

Maybe you don't realize it, but it's due to your overly-hostile personality that you clearly are not in control of.

How sad for you :wink:

(1) Exactly. You are much closer to the people you oppose than you seem to realize.

(2) Maybe you don't realize it, but it's due to your overly-hostile personality that you clearly are not in control of.

How sad for you :wink:

(1) Oh, TAI, how wrong you are.

I DO realize it.

I simply don't CARE.

(2) Again, the "overly-hostile" thing was from eight years of taking the crap from Bush's regime. And I, at least, don't support the TORTURE of my political opponents. So, I suppose you are still above me on the "hostile personality".

i'm sorry, was it in the first three weeks of his administration, or only after two failed wars, an economy in shambles, freedoms eroding and the us losing all confidence it had in the world?

do you always have to needlessly put things in caps.

Pres. Obama: "..if Congress passes our plan, this company (Caterpillar, Inc.) will be able to rehire some of the folks who were just laid off."

Jim Owens, the CEO of Caterpillar, Inc. ""I think, realistically, no. The honest reality is we're probably going to have more layoffs before we start hiring again."

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=6866995&page=1

HopeandChange
minor gaff. whats the big deal?

do you always have to needlessly put things in caps.

I'm too lazy to use the bold command.

minor gaff. whats the big deal?

I don't think anyone is making a big deal out of it, just making fun of Obama for it. It's really quite funny, to get contradicted like that. Although you can take it further and say that the bill isn't going to result in any rehires, if their best example fails.

I DO realize it.

I simply don't CARE.

You realize but don't care that you are awfully similar to the people you oppose? How unstable. :p Do you have ridiculously high blood pressure, by any chance?
No, I saw it, more to the point, we can't say what was said between them. Maybe he did get it wrong, it doesn't matter.
He did get it wrong, but like I stated in my original post in this thread, it isn't like that big of a deal. I find, like I said, that this and things like this become big deals when Democrats ignore them (which you are not, right now...I give you credit for) and when Republicans blow them out of proportion (which I'm not, so give me credit for that).

I'm willing to admit he makes mistakes, the thing is, the mistakes i've seen the right wing harping on have been so utterly trivial as to be inconsequential.
Some have been, some have not. Keeping the Oval Office air conditoned = non-issue. Appointing multiple people who have had 'problems' paying their taxes = issue, notably for Obama who is trying to model his Presidency as open, honest and lead-by-example.

You realize but don't care that you are awfully similar to the people you oppose? How unstable. :p Do you have ridiculously high blood pressure, by any chance?

1- You aren't the best person to be giving me this kind of lecture.

2- I'm similar to them in ONE aspect. I also breathe oxygen, like they do.

3- Actually, my blood pressure is great, and so is my cholesterol. I do have relatively-high blood sugar and I am somewhat fat. Now that my medical history is out of the way, let's wonder how unstable one would have to be to support the TORTURE of political opponents, shall we?

2- I'm similar to them in ONE aspect.
You already admitted it to me. Sorry. :p

I DO realize it.

I simply don't CARE.

I do have relatively-high blood sugar and I am somewhat fat.
lol

lol

Okay, I'll bite. What's so funny about the blood sugar? o_O It IS within standards. :p

Okay, I'll bite. What's so funny about the blood sugar? o_O It IS within standards. :p

I am somewhat fat.
That. Came out. Funny.

Is this you?

http://www.maskworld.com/pix/costumes/large/95441-stammeshaeuptling-fat-suit-tribal-chieftain-fat-suit.jpg

That. Came out. Funny.

Is this you?

So... Simple humor for simple minds?

So... Simple humor for simple minds?

http://www.mysmiley.net/imgs/smile/animated/anim_59.gif

I mean, seriously? Look at some of the shit that's been posted:

Obama says we all need to knuckle down, and can't keep our homes heated high all year round, but he keeps his office warm!

Obama says in a general sense that the stimulus package will help get the economy rolling, and help companies rehire lost workers. Owner of company states he believes it'll get worse before it gets better, but admits it probably will get better in the end, which does not actually invalidate what Obama said!

Seriously, fucking seriously?

Seriously,

Obama said that the CEO of Caterpillar told him that he would rehire some workers immediately if the stimulus bill passed.

Then the CEO of Caterpillar says, "No, I'm going to lay off some more people first..."

Seriously.

I'm sorry, was it in the first THREE WEEKS of his administration, or only after TWO FAILED WARS, AN ECONOMY IN SHAMBLES, FREEDOMS ERODING AND THE US LOSING ALL CONFIDENCE IT HAD IN THE WORLD?

I see Bush Derangement Syndrome is alive and well. The Caps lock thing is a dead giveaway. Or are you just troubled to see The Emperor Has No Clothes?

...We are not some backwards Bannana Republic that trys to make the people out of power suffer under the people in power... You seem to be awfully similar to the people you claim to oppose.


You do realise that that means you are saying 8 years under Bush was exactly like that, right?

Seriously,

Obama said that the CEO of Caterpillar told him that he would rehire some workers immediately if the stimulus bill passed.

Then the CEO of Caterpillar says, "No, I'm going to lay off some more people first..."

Seriously.

So... what we should take from this is that the CEO of caterpillar is a liar?

Seriously,

Obama said that the CEO of Caterpillar told him that he would rehire some workers immediately if the stimulus bill passed.

Then the CEO of Caterpillar says, "No, I'm going to lay off some more people first..."

Seriously.

So Obama says he was told one thing, the person who told it denied it. Who the fuck knows? Maybe Obama misheard, maybe he misunderstood. Maybe the CEO was a little too enthusiastic when sitting in the room with the president, and is now backtracking on his previous statements, so that if he decides to fire people he won't look like he's going back on what he said.

I think the third is just as believable as the other two, because I have no problem with someone leaning over to the CEO and going "you know, you really shouldn't have said we weren't going to fire anymore people..."

minor gaff. whats the big deal?

Please apply the opposite standard. If Pres. Bush (or any Republican) did the same thing, would you be so dismissive?

I'm just trying to call out the hypocrisy.

.... We are not some backwards Bannana Republic that trys to make the people out of power suffer under the people in power. And when that does happen, we don't say "Good!"....

Actually, considering your support of Pinochet, I would describe you as someone who says "Good!" when a banana republic dictator makes the people under him suffer.

As for the OP, it's a non-issue.

So... what we should take from this is that the CEO of caterpillar is a liar?

Could Pres. Obama be the liar?

Just Maybe?

Please apply the opposite standard. If Pres. Bush (or any Republican) did the same thing, would you be so dismissive?

I'm just trying to call out the hypocrisy.

If President Bush did what exactly?

This is a nothing story. Obama said he'd been told one thing, the other guy hasn't directly contradicted saying that - just said that he has another plan.

So - he says one thing to the President, another to the media... and this is a story about Obama (or Bush) how?

I'm just trying to call out the hypocrisy.

Hypocrisy is treating to like circumstances differently. Since Bush was 8 years of incompetence and disaster, and Obama has been...3 weeks, it's not much different.

I swear it's remarkably telling of the right wing that they continue to scream "why don't you treat Obama like you treated Bush?" It's because Bush was a near decade long unmitigated fucking disaster.

If Obama fucks up as royally as Bush did, you better believe I'm giving him every bit of flak. But you can't even compare like points in the administration. Bush inherited a relatively stable economy in peacetime. I don't recall much about the first few months of his administration, probably because they were so fucking uneventful.

If anything I'm willing to believe Obama is receiving considerably more hostility in his first few weeks than Bush did, and most of the hostility directed at Bush was largely due to what many people felt (and some still feel) was an illegitimate ascention to power

Could Pres. Obama be the liar?

Just Maybe?

Don't be the hypocrite you were just complaining about.

Your thread starts with an assertion, and when challenged on it, the best you have is to question whether the exact opposite of your original point might have the possibility of being incorrect.

Could Pres. Obama be the liar?

Just Maybe?

Could he be? Of course he could. Or nobody could be a liar and they just remember the conversation differently.

What's your fucking point?

Please apply the opposite standard. If Pres. Bush (or any Republican) did the same thing, would you be so dismissive?

I'm just trying to call out the hypocrisy.

What hypocrisy? Bush opponents had, by the end, 8 years of track record with which to criticize the man. Obama opponents, yourself included, have 25 days.

I swear it's remarkably telling of the right wing that they continue to scream "why don't you treat Obama like you treated Bush?" It's because Bush was a near decade long unmitigated fucking disaster.


And you notice it's whenever they claim Obama is in some kind of scandal.

The idea that there's a parallel between an illegal war and a warm office... between a disagreement over what was said and the sanction of torture... is laughable... but every time someone fails to suck up the anti-Obama rhetoric, they're accused of a double-standard.

Which is interesting, because it means even those who are hating Obama... are backhandedly admitting that the Bush regime was an unprecedented clusterfuck.

So Obama says he was told one thing, the person who told it denied it. Who the fuck knows? Maybe Obama misheard, maybe he misunderstood. Maybe the CEO was a little too enthusiastic when sitting in the room with the president, and is now backtracking on his previous statements, so that if he decides to fire people he won't look like he's going back on what he said.

I think the third is just as believable as the other two, because I have no problem with someone leaning over to the CEO and going "you know, you really shouldn't have said we weren't going to fire anymore people..."

If Bush had made the exact same mistake, you would be all over him about it.

If Bush had made the exact same mistake, you would be all over him about it.

No one has yet shown that Obama made a mistake.

A little intellectual honesty, please.

No one has yet shown that Obama made a mistake.

A little intellectual honesty, please.

You would have claimed that Bush made a mistake if these events had happened to him.

A little intellectual honesty, please.

I see Bush Derangement Syndrome is alive and well. The Caps lock thing is a dead giveaway. Or are you just troubled to see The Emperor Has No Clothes?

:rolleyes:

And "Bush derangement syndrome" joins "There's no place like home" in the roster of "comfort words used to try and cheat reality".

Pres. Obama: "..if Congress passes our plan, this company (Caterpillar, Inc.) will be able to rehire some of the folks who were just laid off."

Jim Owens, the CEO of Caterpillar, Inc. ""I think, realistically, no. The honest reality is we're probably going to have more layoffs before we start hiring again."

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=6866995&page=1

HopeandChange

So, let's get this straight...

Obama has said twice in the past two days that Caterpillar CEO James Owens indicated his company would be able to rehire some of the 20,000 recently laid-off employees.

"Yesterday, Jim, the head of Caterpillar, said that if Congress passes our plan, this company will be able to rehire some of the folks who were just laid off," Obama said today in Peoria.

Fair enough, right?

But when asked today if the stimulus could do that, Owens said, "I think, realistically, no. The honest reality is we're probably going to have more layoffs before we start hiring again."

From what I can see, Owens is being a two-faced little git, much like the British bankers who took the bailout on the premise of restoring credit to businesses and sitting on it. Still, it's all Obama's fault, right?

You would have claimed that Bush made a mistake if these events had happened to him.


Forget who you're talking to? I called Bush on big shit, not every stupid little annoyance. When Bush admitted sanctioning torture - I called him on it. When Bush did pre-election speeches from Ground Zero, I called him on it.

Go dig up me attacking Bush for anything even remotely similar to this total non-story.


A little intellectual honesty, please.

As above.

Some have been, some have not. Keeping the Oval Office air conditoned = non-issue. Appointing multiple people who have had 'problems' paying their taxes = issue, notably for Obama who is trying to model his Presidency as open, honest and lead-by-example.

You'll note he didn't try to cover up that fact right? I wonder how many government officials in the Bush presidency (including bush) we're "avoiding taxes".

You'll note he didn't try to cover up that fact right? I wonder how many government officials in the Bush presidency (including bush) we're "avoiding taxes".

Bush had bigger issues, like the number of his cronies that avoided military service.

Pres. Obama: "..if Congress passes our plan, this company (Caterpillar, Inc.) will be able to rehire some of the folks who were just laid off."

Jim Owens, the CEO of Caterpillar, Inc. ""I think, realistically, no. The honest reality is we're probably going to have more layoffs before we start hiring again."

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=6866995&page=1

HopeandChange
I recall some other promises, too... Things like not signing a major bill for five days, putting the text of bills on the internet... I guess this is just too important and critical for any of us non-politicians to understand, no matter how much time and access we're given.

I recall some other promises, too... Things like not signing a major bill for five days, putting the text of bills on the internet... I guess this is just too important and critical for any of us non-politicians to understand, no matter how much time and access we're given.

Apparently, they're backing out on the promise to put the bill online for 48 hours before the final vote.

Also, Lautenberg stated that it's likely that most of the people who vote on this bill will have never read any of it.

Apparently, they're backing out on the promise to put the bill online for 48 hours before the final vote.

Also, Lautenberg stated that it's likely that most of the people who vote on this bill will have never read any of it.
But it is certainly good legislation and it will have no unforeseen consequences. All legislation that is quickly and quietly passed is like that.


I've heard in a couple places -- the WSJ for one -- that a recovery would be noticeable by June or July. My biggest hope is that this bill doesn't cause a steeper and more vicious recession and that the Democrats can take credit for the summer recovery.

But it is certainly good legislation and it will have no unforeseen consequences. All legislation that is quickly and quietly passed is like that.

And if we criticize the Democrats and their plan, we're traitors.

And if we criticize the Democrats and their plan, we're traitors.
Well, the Republicans did confuse the Democrats with similar talk. Although it would have been justified if it had been directed at Ali-John Murtha and Harry-Asad Reid.

And if we criticize the Democrats and their plan, we're traitors.Well, the Republicans did confuse the Democrats with similar talk. Although it would have been justified if it had been directed at Ali-John Murtha and Harry-Asad Reid.

My god, you actually parodied yourselves...

If Bush had made the exact same mistake, you would be all over him about it.

You would have claimed that Bush made a mistake if these events had happened to him.

A little intellectual honesty, please.

Yeah, Neo Art and Grave n Idle, you need to answer for your actions in these hypothetical situations you had no part in!

Yeah, Neo Art and Grave n Idle, you need to answer for your actions in these hypothetical situations you had no part in!

Hypothetically they'd be hypocrites, if they were acting just like Hotwife!

Please apply the opposite standard. If Pres. Bush (or any Republican) did the same thing, would you be so dismissive?

I'm just trying to call out the hypocrisy.
i have laughed at mr bush's malaprops but i dont see any reason to think of them as huge mistakes of national import.

*sigh*

to all Bushiveks. Glorious Leader is GONE, he's now retired. He Left the Building. He Rode of into the sunset. come to terms with this and get over it.

To all Bushbashers. The Evil is gone, he has been replaced by the Ray of Hope. now is NOT the time to live in the past. Look to the Future and let's work to make that future a brighter reality.

To All Obama Bashers. GIVE the man a chance. watch him... Sure, but give him at least his first 100 days, heck, give him at least 2 years! then dogpile on his 'mistakes' and 'flaws'.

To all Obamaniacs. the man is NOT God. He is NOT infallable. those who oppose him are not the 'spawn of satan'.

To everyone else who does NOT fit in the first four catagories.

BUSH is gone. let him go. let's give Obama the time he needs to get this country back on track.

To all Obamaniacs. the man is NOT God. He is NOT infallable. those who oppose him are not the 'spawn of satan'.

Who the hell are these people? I keep hearing a lot about them, but they never seem to speak up. Never once heard anyone (except Obama haters) describing Obama as the messiah or saying he's infallible.

To everyone else who does NOT fit in the first four catagories.

BUSH is gone. let him go.

Please pretend the last 8 years never happened.

let's give Obama the time he needs to get this country back on track.

How is this relevant to your last comment?

And if we criticize the Democrats and their plan, we're traitors.

But...dissent is patriotic!.. or was until 1/20/09 when all the good little Obamatons were out in force scraping the stickers that said so off their Priuses

But...dissent is patriotic!.. or was until 1/20/09 when all the good little Obamatons were out in force scraping the stickers that said so off their Priuses

I think you're confusing "dissent" with "whining". Common error.

If you have to balls to claim whining is patriotic, more power to you, but I'm still going to disagree.

I think you're confusing "dissent" with "whining". Common error.

If you have to balls to claim whining is patriotic, more power to you, but I'm still going to disagree.

One wonders, exactly, what "dissent" they think they're demonstrating here. And I wonder, exactly, who is trying to silence them.

Contrary to popular opinion "grow the fuck up and stop being so fucking petty" is not censorship. It's criticism, yes, but not censorship.

One wonders, exactly, what "dissent" they think they're demonstrating here. And I wonder, exactly, who is trying to silence them.

Contrary to popular opinion "grow the fuck up and stop being so fucking petty" is not censorship. It's criticism, yes, but not censorship.

Bullshit.

The liberal media has been censoring the Republicans for years. Ever hear about Bushs evenings volunteering at DCs homeless shelters while leading the free world or Hussein Obamas baby eating antics during his election campaign?

Exactly.

Bullshit.

The liberal media has been censoring the Republicans for years. Ever hear about Bushs evenings volunteering at DCs homeless shelters while leading the free world or Hussein Obamas baby eating antics during his election campaign?

Exactly.

It's true, Dingo ate my baby! Err, I mean Obama ate my baby.

Don't you see? These are not silly arguments based on hypocrisy and fallacy, but Dissent. And you evil liberals are not rebutting against them and finding much amusement in doing so... you're Censoring and trying to stifle Dissent, which is unpatriotic! Why do you hate freedom, libs?

And if we criticize the Democrats and their plan, we're traitors.

Indeed, it's your turn.

Don't you see? These are not silly arguments based on hypocrisy and fallacy, but Dissent. And you evil liberals are not rebutting against them and finding much amusement in doing so... you're Censoring and trying to stifle Dissent, which is unpatriotic! Why do you hate freedom, libs?

...

I hate you SO much right now... :p

(JK... :fluffle:)

I've heard in a couple places -- the WSJ for one -- that a recovery would be noticeable by June or July. My biggest hope is that this bill doesn't cause a steeper and more vicious recession and that the Democrats can take credit for the summer recovery.

I hope you're right. The fact that you cite the WSJ as a source makes me worry you're not, though, considering how earnestly they fucked-up on all the indicators leading up to the economic crisis.

And if we criticize the Democrats and their plan, we're traitors.

Wrong decade, darlin'.