NationStates Jolt Archive

Does it work?

Well I don't really understand what you're trying to convey with it. Is the 'who' referring to the Muslims, as in you need to know more about them before you generalise? Or is the who referring to you?

MOD EDIT - split from the thread: Old People Should Give Up And Die (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=583108).

It's actually more like 12711.

only 12 711? That less than a tenth of my town . . . .I mean thats a really low number of assholes in a religion . . . .

only 12 711? That less than a tenth of my town . . . .I mean thats a really low number of assholes in a religion . . . .

Not to mention we still have to check the number of similar cases in Judaism, Christianity, Buddhism, Hinduism, Shintoism and Atheism, to name the main ones.

only 12 711? That less than a tenth of my town . . . .I mean thats a really low number of assholes in a religion . . . .

That's how many times those assholes have succeeded in killing people. Heikoku asked for how many cases of assholism, not how many assholes.

I'll help you out. 1000 "cases of Muslims being asses" /1,000,000,000 people = 0.000001.

I think it's a little over 1,000.

lmfao cause all Islamics do this on a regular basis . . .in fact isn't that what Islam is really all about?

Read a Koran, or a Bible or whatever, they advocate slaughter and genocide every other page.

Read a Koran, or a Bible or whatever, they advocate slaughter and genocide every other page.

But how many followers from each act on that?

Hmmm....

That's how many times those assholes have succeeded in killing people.

Assholes:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stolen_Generations

Assholes:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Phelps

Assholes:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulag

Assholes:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inquisition

Assholes:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zionist_political_violence

Assholes:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napalm

I could go on. I ask again, what exactly is your point? "We're a race of assholes"? Is THAT why you troll so much?

Oh for christ's sake. Has it really descended into this?

But how many followers from each act on that?

Hmmm....

Good point.

But how many followers from each act on that?

Hmmm....

Given that you're still alive? None.

Given that Bush attacked Iraq, Israel kills Palestinian civilians, Soviet Russia has frequently rounded up followers of all faiths and HAMAS kills Israeli civilians? Many, from all faiths.

Please. If you absolutely must spew bullshit, do so without someone around who can deal with it.

Assholes:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napalm

So that was invented and used in the name of a religion?

None.

Bullshit.

Oh for christ's sake. Has it really descended into this?

Face it. Ever since Sauron was sworn in, we're going to be dealing with a combo platter of "Ebil Democrat Mozlem" threads for the next four years.

Read a Koran, or a Bible or whatever, they advocate slaughter and genocide every other page.

The Koran, or Bible, are not posting on NSG.

Bullshit.

You have some nerve calling what I write bullshit after the kind of posts you made.

Face it. Ever since Sauron was sworn in, we're going to be dealing with a combo platter of "Ebil Democrat Mozlem" threads for the next four years.

Hey, at least I'll be around to make irrelevant threads citing news stories about people doing shit that makes no sense. Then, of course, there's the inevitable puns/laughter that follows.

You have some nerve calling what I write bullshit after the kind of posts you made.

Seeing as radical Muslims, Jews and Christians do act on what their holy books tell them to do, you were talking bullshit.

Seeing as radical Muslims, Jews and Christians do act on what their holy books tell them to do, you were talking bullshit.

Seeing as Gulags were inventions by Atheists - and I'm an agnostic, mind you, so I don't have any dog in defending the three main religions, or yours - no, I wasn't.

Seeing as radical Muslims, Jews and Christians do act on what their holy books tell them to do, you were talking bullshit.

You know, as two people who've both been DEATed before for bad behavior, ya'll might want to tone it down just a smidge.

Read a Koran, or a Bible or whatever, they advocate slaughter and genocide every other page.

now thats bullshit. I have read both a bible and a Koran (translated) from cover to cover and neither of them do anything of the sort. Even if you want to construe them that way, the best anyone could come up with would be a few passages in both the could be taken to mean that killing of certain people is okay. (mostly old testament for the bible). Even then, those are interpretations not followed by most Muslims or christians. . . (also I'm a pure bred Atheist with a tendency to dislike religion but your comment their is just ridiculous)

now thats bullshit. I have read both a bible and a Koran (translated) from cover to cover and neither of them do anything of the sort. Even if you want to construe them that way, the best anyone could come up with would be a few passages in both the could be taken to mean that killing of certain people is okay. (mostly old testament for the bible). Even then, those are interpretations not followed by most Muslims . . . (also I'm a pure bred Atheist with a tendency to dislike religion but your comment their is just ridiculous)

Thank you.

now thats bullshit. I have read both a bible and a Koran (translated) from cover to cover and neither of them do anything of the sort.

That's shit and you know it. I'll find some quotes, and what about Jericho, Canaan and all that?

You know, as two people who've both been DEATed before for bad behavior, ya'll might want to tone it down just a smidge.

I haven't broken any rules in this current discussion.

Seeing as Gulags were inventions by Atheists

Not in the name of Atheism though, and that still doesn't change the fact that Radical Abrahamists kill for their religion.

Not in the name of Atheism though, and that still doesn't change the fact that Radical Abrahamists kill for their religion.

Radicals of all spades tend to kill people, it has more to do with being fucking crazy as opposed to religious.

Radicals of all spades tend to kill people, it has more to do with being fucking crazy as opposed to religious.

But if we take away religion, so many people wouldn't have an excuse to kill/opress/otherwise abuse people.

Not in the name of Atheism though, and that still doesn't change the fact that Radical Abrahamists kill for their religion.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atheism#Early_Modern_Period

"The French Revolution took atheism outside the salons and into the public sphere. Attempts to enforce the Civil Constitution of the Clergy led to anti-clerical violence and the expulsion of many clergy from France. The chaotic political events in revolutionary Paris eventually enabled the more radical Jacobins to seize power in 1793, ushering in the Reign of Terror. At its climax, the more militant atheists attempted to forcibly de-Christianize France, replacing religion with a Cult of Reason. These persecutions ended with the Thermidorian Reaction, but some of the secularizing measures of this period remained a permanent legacy of French politics."

This search took me about TWO MINUTES.

Your move, sir?

But if we take away religion, so many people wouldn't have an excuse to kill/opress/otherwise abuse people.

Optimism is cute.

Optimism is cute.

Oh, I know there will always be mass opression, slaughter in the name of anything, but think how many people have, are and will be killed or otherwise damaged in the name of religion, particularly Islam.

That's shit and you know it. I'll find some quotes, and what about Jericho, Canaan and all that?

read the rest of the quote and rather than threatening to come up with some sort of backing for your post just do it.

Oh, I know there will always be mass opression, slaughter in the name of anything, but think how many people have, are and will be killed or otherwise damaged in the name of religion, particularly Islam.

Islam has killed fewer people than has Christianity.

Read a Koran, or a Bible or whatever, they advocate slaughter and genocide every other page.

on the other hand, Genesis 18:17-33 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%2018:17-33;&version=9;) is an argument against genocide in principle, so it all really depends on what you emphasize.

Oh, I know there will always be mass opression, slaughter in the name of anything, but think how many people have, are and will be killed or otherwise damaged in the name of religion, particularly Islam.

:rolleyes:

So, about 10 wikipedia articles later, and you have yet to get ONE POINT.

on the other hand, Genesis 18:17-33 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis%2018:17-33;&version=9;) is an argument against genocide in principle, so it all really depends on what you emphasize.

Thank you :)

(see he backs up what he says!)

Oh, I know there will always be mass opression, slaughter in the name of anything, but think how many people have, are and will be killed or otherwise damaged in the name of religion, particularly Islam.

I can't be arsed to find the numbers, but I think Christianity still has a leg up on Islam as far as slaughter goes. Still take away their invisible sky faeries and they'll just find some other justification to kill. Humans are bastards.

I can't be arsed to find the numbers, but I think Christianity still has a leg up on Islam as far as slaughter goes. Still take away their invisible sky faeries and they'll just find some other justification to kill. Humans are bastards.

Thank you.

read the rest of the quote and rather than threatening to come up with some sort of backing for your post just do it.

Alrighty then:
"When the Lord your God brings you into the land you are entering to possess and drives out before you may nations...then you must destroy them totally. Make no treaty with them and show them no mercy." Deuteronomy 7:1-2

"...do not leave alive anything that breaths. Completely destroy them...as the Lord your God has commanded you..." Deuteronomy 20:16

From the Koran: "Slay them wherever you find them...Idolatry is worse than carnage...Fight against them until idolatry is no more and God's religion reigns supreme." (Surah 2:190-)

"...make war on the leaders of unbelief...Make war on them: God will chastise them at your hands and humble them. He will grant you victory over them..."(Surah 9:12-)

And actually telling you that you have to fight: "If you do not fight, He will punish you sternly, and replace you by other men." (Surah 9:37-)

I can't be arsed to find the numbers, but I think Christianity still has a leg up on Islam as far as slaughter goes. Still take away their invisible sky faeries and they'll just find some other justification to kill. Humans are bastards.

If you add in Christianity, Judaism, Hinduism and the rest, religion has almost definatly killed more people but at the same time we woulda been killing each other with or without it and claiming that the Bible condones genocide on every other page only proves that you've never read the bible.

Alrighty then:
"When the Lord your God brings you into the land you are entering to possess and drives out before you may nations...then you must destroy them totally. Make no treaty with them and show them no mercy." Deuteronomy 7:1-2

"...do not leave alive anything that breaths. Completely destroy them...as the Lord your God has commanded you..." Deuteronomy 20:16

From the Koran: "Slay them wherever you find them...Idolatry is worse than carnage...Fight against them until idolatry is no more and God's religion reigns supreme." (Surah 2:190-)

"...make war on the leaders of unbelief...Make war on them: God will chastise them at your hands and humble them. He will grant you victory over them..."(Surah 9:12-)

And actually telling you that you have to fight: "If you do not fight, He will punish you sternly, and replace you by other men." (Surah 9:37-)

deuteronomy is old testament and the others don't condone genocide they condone war. More to the point you claimed that it was every other page (there are 5 posts there from two more than thousand + page books) . . .If you'll read my post again you'll see that what you just posted only backs up what I said . . .

Alrighty then:
"When the Lord your God brings you into the land you are entering to possess and drives out before you may nations...then you must destroy them totally. Make no treaty with them and show them no mercy." Deuteronomy 7:1-2

"...do not leave alive anything that breaths. Completely destroy them...as the Lord your God has commanded you..." Deuteronomy 20:16

From the Koran: "Slay them wherever you find them...Idolatry is worse than carnage...Fight against them until idolatry is no more and God's religion reigns supreme." (Surah 2:190-)

"...make war on the leaders of unbelief...Make war on them: God will chastise them at your hands and humble them. He will grant you victory over them..."(Surah 9:12-)

And actually telling you that you have to fight: "If you do not fight, He will punish you sternly, and replace you by other men." (Surah 9:37-)

http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/

That'll give you a laundry list of god's commands to murder and slaughter, for all three Abrahamic faiths.

deuteronomy is old testament Still the Bible.

and the others don't condone genocide they condone war.

Sure:"Slay them wherever you find them...Idolatry is worse than carnage...Fight against them until idolatry is no more and God's religion reigns supreme." (Surah 2:190-)

More to the point you claimed that it was every other page (there are 5 posts there from two more than thousand + page books) . . .If you'll read my post again you'll see that what you just posted only backs up what I said . . .

I was clearly exaggerating, but there is a lot of slaughter etc in the Old Testament.

I was clearly exaggerating, but there is a lot of slaughter etc in the Old Testament.
Now with that (both parts) I agree completely. The old testament is a nasty piece of work but you have to want to read it as an excuse to commit genocide before it can be used that way. Same with the Qur'an there are a whole bunch of Surah's (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sura) so you kind of have to pick and choose which you wanna believe in terms of how you wanna use the Qur'an.

Now with that (both parts) I agree completely. The old testament is a nasty piece of work but you have to want to read it as an excuse to commit genocide before it can be used that way. Same with the Qur'an there are a whole bunch of Surah's (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sura) so you kind of have to pick and choose which you wanna believe in terms of how you wanna use the Qur'an.

The Qur'an is the infallible word of god. One does not pick and choose.

The Qur'an is the infallible word of god. One does not pick and choose.

lol you wha??? but its self-contradictory??

lol you wha??? but its self-contradictory??

Doublethink my friend. Doublethink.

lol you wha??? but its self-contradictory??

It's one of the central points of their faith I believe.

Doublethink my friend. Doublethink.

*Attempts*
*Fails*
*brain Overheats*
*SNAP*

Face it. Ever since Sauron was sworn in, we're going to be dealing with a combo platter of "Ebil Democrat Mozlem" threads for the next four years.

And this is different from all the Bush-bashing how? Oh yeah, Obamas a democrat.

I don't remember making this thread.

I don't remember making this thread.

It was split off from the original because it veered off topic. There's a thread in moderation about it. As for the title... I couldn't think of anything better.

It was split off from the original because it veered off topic. There's a thread in moderation about it. As for the title... I couldn't think of anything better.

Yeah I know lol, but it was pretty creepy seeing that thread title in the index with my name under it, having no recollection of making it, for a second I thought I was suffering from amnesia or something. :p

And this is different from all the Bush-bashing how? Oh yeah, Obamas a democrat.

Oh right, Obama screwed up in his first two months in office even more than Bush did in 8 years. Forgot about that.

:rolleyes:

Ok, let's be honest, my god(s) can kick all of your gods' butts.

And this is different from all the Bush-bashing how? Oh yeah, Obamas a democrat.

I'll repost something I posted a bit ago:

Here's the thing. I've noticed some noise on the right wing about things like this, the idea of "well liberals counted the days, and blamed things on Bush, now it's OUR TURN".

Yes, we did. Yes, we blamed things on Bush. Yes, we counted the days until he was out on his ass. Yes, all of that is true. But we had our reasons.

September 11th demonstrated a complete failure of the intelligence community to do its job. In the months and years afterwards, it's become patently obvious that during the first months of the Bush presidency, there was a total failure of the intelligence communities to speak with each other. And while there is evidence that this circumstance extended back before Bush took office, as the saying goes, the buck stopped with him. The fact that problems might have existed when he got there does not excuse his failure to rectify them.

Moreover, the whole nonsense regarding the Nigerian Yellow Cake, the "mobile WMD factories", and the outting of Valerie Plame demonstrate that Bush did absolutely nothing to correct these faults. Rather than treat our intelligence agencies as organizations of unbiased intel, he used them in order to filter out information that did not serve to accomplish his goals, and used biased, subjective, and utterly unreliable information, information it now appears was known by the White House to be unreliable, to justify a war. Information that has now been demonstrably proven to have been false.

His "mission accomplished" speech demonstrated a profound ignorance as to the actual conditions on the ground, and a total unwillingness to recognize that this war would involve more than simply ousting Sadam Hussein, and watch Iraq magically spring into a stable democracy. It demonstrated that we were, as a nation, as a military, utterly unprepared for what was to come. Likewise, it has been revealed, that every single voice that attempted to tell the administration what was actually going to occur, was either discredited, insulted, or removed from their office. Every single attempt that was made to either derail the efforts for war, or demonstrate that the situation would be harder than we as a people were told, was specifically, forcibly, silenced.

His efforts to cut funding for legitimate areas of research, as well as his monstrously disastrous "no child left behind" has done manifest harm to America's position as an educated and technologically advanced nation, while his support of demonstrably worthless abstience only programs (literally worthless, studies have shown that, at best they accomplish nothing and, at worst, actually increase rates of teen pregnancy and STD infection) demonstrate that he has been less concerned with actually fixing legitimate problems, and more concerned with pushing his own moralistic agenda.

He has shown that he was willing to treat such fundamentally important institutions as the Supreme Court of the United States and the Federal Emergency Management Agency as bastions of political cronyism. The pardoning of Libby, the firing of the US attorneys, and the attempts to place Michael Brown and Harriet Miers into positions of extreme power and importance, positions that they were vastly unqualified for, demonstrate a complete disrespect for the fundamental importance of our justice system and, worst of all, total and utter disregard for the health, safety and lives of American citizens, and a willingness to promote favoritism and party politics over people's lives, and the fundamentals of our justice system.

Moreover, his recent press conference, in which he deflected criticisms about his handling of Katrina, suggests that he believes that America is mad because he personally didn't visit the disaster area earlier. Not only has he refused to apologize for his own failures, failures that directly manifested in the preventable death of hundreds of people, he refuses to even recognize them as failures.

His willingness to engage and authorize activities that we as a people had already legally defined as crimes against humanity, and the attempts to circumvent, and force out, individuals in his administration that he appointed who spoke out against it, shows a profound disregard for the sanctity of basic human liberties. Rights that he, as president, swore to uphold.

Many presidents have good areas and bad. Sometimes they make mistakes. Sometimes events happen beyond their control. But rare it is that we have a president where we can conclusively say that we, as a people, as a nation, are demonstrably worse off as a direct consequence of his presidency. Bush was one of those presidents. Yes, we counted the days. Yes, we said he would be a bad president.

And he turned out to be one of the worst in our history.

So yeah, us liberals did that. And if you wish, sure, feel free to do the same with Obama. And when we point out that you're full of it, you can point out how you said the same thing when we did it to Bush. But the unmistakable, inescapable fact should not elude you.

We were right.

{snip}

I think you might have missed my point (or I failed to express it clearly enough): During the Bush years, some supported him and others didn't. Now that Obama is president, we will have the same thing. Nothing has changed ( nor in any real sense will change) other than the name of the man in office.

Didn't know the closing of Gitmo was nothing.

Didn't know the closing of Gitmo was nothing.

or the equal pay amendment being passed. The one Bush threatened to veto..

Didn't know the closing of Gitmo was nothing.

or the equal pay amendment being passed. The one Bush threatened to veto..

And exactly how will either affect my day to day life? Or the day to day life of most people?

And exactly how will either affect my day to day life? Or the day to day life of most people?

This is the standard? If it doesn't affect your day to day life, it's "nothing?"

Who invented this rule, and, do they know how patently absurd it is?

This is the standard? If it doesn't affect your day to day life, it's "nothing?"

Who invented this rule, and, do they know how patently absurd it is?

No one invented this rule, it evolved along with the human species. Some of us are just a bit more self-centered than others.

No one invented this rule, it evolved along with the human species.

Oh, right. It evolved with humanity. It just looks like an unreasonable assertion pulled right out of your ass.

It's very deceitful, that evolved trait.

Oh, right. It evolved with humanity. It just looks like an unreasonable assertion pulled right out of your ass.

It's very deceitful, that evolved trait.

it goes hand in hand with the "but what have you done for me lately?" principle.

Rape is nothing, because I've never been raped. Thank you for opening my eyes to the light.

Rape is nothing, because I've never been raped. Thank you for opening my eyes to the light.

Evolution agrees with me!

Rape is nothing, because I've never been raped. Thank you for opening my eyes to the light.

Only a few people get murdered as well, so we should scrap those laws.

it goes hand in hand with the "but what have you done for me lately?" principle.

Clearly you need to familiarize yourself with the writings of Eminent 20th Century Russian-American Philosopher Ayn Rand.

Islam has killed fewer people than has Christianity.Well, it hasn't been around as long, has it. And Islam has fewer followers.
A few numbers would be nice though. How many people have each killed? Is there even a reliable count? What is their score per capita?