NationStates Jolt Archive

So Michael Phelps is a real human being, with flaws, not a swimming automaton. Do you think the punishment was just? I don't.

http://www.fanhouse.com/news/main/usa-swimming-suspends-michael-phelps/331784?icid=200100397x1217742953x1201215464

zOMG!!! :eek:
NO WAI!! Michale Phelps is super-human, he shouldn't get in trouble! :eek2:

Pity. I hope all the millions he's earned already will be enough to console him.

zOMG!!! :eek:
NO WAI!! Michale Phelps is super-human, he shouldn't get in trouble! :eek2:

Of course he's superhuman! Most athletes take drugs to enhance their performance. Michael Phelps took a hit from the bong to give himself a challenge and give the other swimmers a chance at winning!

The only time a victimless crime can have victims.

Yep he's human - which means, dumb, dumb, dumb. When I first heard this story, I thought, "Michael, the point isn't that you were smoking pot--- the point is, you let yourself get CAUGHT smoking pot on camera!!"

The rebuke is fair; he's going to lose big bucks from losing some of those endorsements. And all cuz - let's face it - he was being a typical young adult.

Yes, it's his own fault - but every male swimmer I've ever known tends towards extremism, and off season, they party as hard as they train. Maybe he didn't, off season -- which makes what happened that much more unfair.

Honestly, I feel really sorry for him. He probably worked for years to get that good, and finally felt like he could "loosen up" from the training... and now this.

Do you think the punishment was just? I don't.

Of course not. He should have been flogged on national television for daring to commit such a horrific and disgusting crime. Let's see who doesn't get that I'm joking

I kind of wish he had responded with, "You know what? I won eight goddamn gold medals in one Olympics, breaking other records in the process - I am literally the best fucking swimmer the world has seen. If I want to take a rip of a fucking bong, I'm gonna take a rip off a motherfucking bong, bitches. What the fuck have you done?"

I mean, he's already made more money than most swimmers will ever make anyway.

Is the USA Swimming Team even doing anything for the next three months?

Of course he's superhuman! Most athletes take drugs to enhance their performance. Michael Phelps took a hit from the bong to give himself a challenge and give the other swimmers a chance at winning!Go, Phelps, go! :D

...Wait, why is he swimming in the wrong direction?

I kind of wish he had responded with, "You know what? I won eight goddamn gold medals in one Olympics, breaking other records in the process - I am literally the best fucking swimmer the world has seen. If I want to take a rip of a fucking bong, I'm gonna take a rip off a motherfucking bong, bitches. What the fuck have you done?"

Amen. He's done more at 23, and sacrificed more to do it than any of the critics will ever do.

So Michael Phelps is a real human being, with flaws, not a swimming automaton. Do you think the punishment was just? I don't.

http://www.fanhouse.com/news/main/usa-swimming-suspends-michael-phelps/331784?icid=200100397x1217742953x1201215464

What does 'being human' have to do with it?

You can't blame his unwise decisions on his species...

Go, Phelps, go! :D

...Wait, why is he swimming in the wrong direction?

If you dangle a Twinkie at the end of the pool, he'll set another world record. ;)

What does 'being human' have to do with it?

You can't blame his unwise decisions on his species...

*looks at humans*

Why not? It's a pretty good excuse if you ask me. :p

If you dangle a Twinkie at the end of the pool, he'll set another world record. ;):eek:
I'd like to keep the arm that was attached to whatever device was holding that, thank you very much.

You know now that I think about it, all those reports about what he eats...we really should have seen this coming...

You know now that I think about it, all those reports about what he eats...we really should have seen this coming...

:eek:

:p

"This is not a situation where any anti-doping rule was violated, but we decided to send a strong message to Michael because he disappointed so many people, particularly the hundreds of thousands of USA Swimming member kids who look up to him as a role model and a hero," the Colorado Springs-based federation said in a statement."

--from the article

Thats pretty fucked up...

The man one the Most Gold Medals in the History of The Olympics...


If he wants to smoke weed, he should get to smoke weed...

"This is not a situation where any anti-doping rule was violated, but we decided to send a strong message to Michael because he disappointed so many people, particularly the hundreds of thousands of USA Swimming member kids who look up to him as a role model and a hero," the Colorado Springs-based federation said in a statement."

--from the article

I was just gonna quote that too. Since when did we start punishing folks when they haven't even broken a rule? That's like my University saying "We know you didn't break any rules, but we know you spent too much time on NSG and not studying, so we're going to suspend you."

Come on guys, let's get real. So he took weed. That's like the 1998 snowboarding gold medalist in the olympics having his metal stripped cause he was high while riding. Ummm....it's taking away from his abilities, not adding. He should get a second metal for this one. Weed is weed. He's not sacrificing virgins.

Besides, it's important that kids know that even their heroes make mistakes, and that they must learn to push forward and carry on. One who can do that is a true "hero".

hsee, kids? this man smokes weed. He's a world-champion athlete. Don't do what he did or you'll turn out like him.

Yeah, makes a lot of sense :p

I was just gonna quote that too. Since when did we start punishing folks when they haven't even broken a rule? That's like my University saying "We know you didn't break any rules, but we know you spent too much time on NSG and not studying, so we're going to suspend you."

Come on guys, let's get real. So he took weed. That's like the 1998 snowboarding gold medalist in the olympics having his metal stripped cause he was high while riding. Ummm....it's taking away from his abilities, not adding. He should get a second metal for this one. Weed is weed. He's not sacrificing virgins.

Um...smoking weed is against the law. I'm fairly certain that's the 'rule' that he broke. And he admitted to breaking it. He may very well be lucky to not be charged...I do recall the sheriff saying that he was looking into charges.

I don't see this punishment as being excessive.

Besides, it's important that kids know that even their heroes make mistakes, and that they must learn to push forward and carry on. One who can do that is a true "hero".

I actually agree with that; Michael Phelps 'coming back' from this could send a good message. But is it not also important to 'send a message' that there are consequences to your actions?

****************

Really, all he needs to do to come back from this is to keep his nose clean, and walk the high road. Take a deep breath, exhale - repeat if necessary - and try to not get too paranoid about what everyone else is thinking or doing.

Um...smoking weed is against the law. I'm fairly certain that's the 'rule' that he broke. And he admitted to breaking it. He may very well be lucky to not be charged...I do recall the sheriff saying that he was looking into charges.

Oh, it's against the law alright, by all means, punish him according to the law. But since he hasn't broken a rule of that group, they shouldn't be the ones to punish him since, according to their rulebook, he's done nothing wrong.


Take a deep breath, exhale - repeat if necessary

Isn't that what got him to this point in the first place?

I would've had even more respect for Phelps if he had held a press conference and told them, "I've got 14 mutha-fukkin gold medals! What have you wieners got? I can do whatever the hell I like! Put that in your pipe and smoke, cause y'all know what I'm putting into mine!"
And then pulled out a bong and lit up.

Oh, it's against the law alright, by all means, punish him according to the law. But since he hasn't broken a rule of that group, they shouldn't be the ones to punish him since, according to their rulebook, he's done nothing wrong.

Well, first off, you seem to have missed this from the posted article:

"Michael has voluntarily accepted this reprimand and has committed to earn back our trust."

And (not in the posted article) he violated USA Swimming's Code of Conduct. (http://www.swimmingworldmagazine.com/lane9/news/20201.asp?q=Michael%20Phelps%20Draws%20First%20Punishment%20From%20USA%20Swimming)

In a statement released tonight, "USA Swimming has reprimanded Michael Phelps under its Code of Conduct by withdrawing financial support and the eligibility to compete for a period of three months effective today, February 5."

You know, this story has me all sorts of pissed off.

Athletes can go out and get wasted on alcohol on a whim, or use illegal steroids to enhance their performance, or even start shooting guns in a strip club...but god forbid they ever even think of taking a hit of weed.

I mean, if a 14-time Olympic gold medalist can't catch a fucking break on this issue, how can anybody?

It'd be nice if we could have a serious debate in this country on marijuana use...but as long as the media keeps treating pot-smokers like puppy-murderers, it'll never happen.

I hear all this crap on the media about his "lapse in judgement"

FUCK THAT.

There are millions of regular pot-smokers in this country, and most of them are perfectly capable of using their drug of choice responsibly and perfoming admirably in whatever profession they choose to enter.

But you'd never know that from the way the media frames the discussion. No. Pot-smokers are all irresponsible drug-addicts who can't be trusted to do anything. Never mind that alcohol is arguably a more harmful and dangerous drug that is heavily abused by millions of people...no, do not think about that at all.

One hit of pot makes you "stupid" and "irresponsible".

Makes me want to puke.

ooh...better thought: Phelps should hold a press conference and start singing, "Legalise it...and I will advertise it...", in a fake Jamacian accent.

Seeing as how he's unemployed for the next 3 months, he could be onto a winner there!

Well guys, you entertained me!
Theocratic, you beat me to the obvious "human but dumb" reply.
OMG! Next the media will be telling us this guy has premarital sex!!!!
What the media creates it can also destroy........

He knew that if he pumped anything into that body (which he onnly leases - The US Olympics Committee own it and major companies have sponsorship rights) the whole world would take notice.
Maybe like Australia's own champ, Ian Thorpe, he just got sick of the publicity and wanted a normal (sort-of) life.
Good luck to him.
Oh and did I say, "OMG! OMG!"

Well, first off, you seem to have missed this from the posted article:



And (not in the posted article) he violated USA Swimming's Code of Conduct. (http://www.swimmingworldmagazine.com/lane9/news/20201.asp?q=Michael%20Phelps%20Draws%20First%20Punishment%20From%20USA%20Swimming)

Ah, alright.

In that case, all I have to say is:

"Carry on"

=============================

I'd also like to add my agreement to Delator. I know three very good winter-athletes (skiers) who are also 3.7 GPA students in a Big Ten college with me. All three smoke weed a couple times a week, at most. I must say, I'm impressed with them in their abilities. Furthermore, they are able to function just fine and take a hit responsibly.

From what I've gathered, Alcohol is probably worse in its impairing effects than marijuana. If alcohol is legal and worse, then shouldn't weed be legal?

particularly the hundreds of thousands of USA Swimming member kids who look up to him as a role model and a hero," the Colorado Springs-based federation said in a statement."Here's a novel idea. Have the kids think for themselves, rather than encouraging them to brainlessly copy and worship someone.

Thats pretty fucked up...

The man one the Most Gold Medals in the History of The Olympics...

If he wants to smoke weed, he should get to smoke weed... Nonesense. It's illegal, and he can't be exempted from the law because of a bunch of gold medals. The actions by the police/ swimming-whatevers/ etc are perfectly justifiable.

OTOH, everyone uninvolved who reacts 'Shocked' and 'Saddened', 'Disappointed' or whatever is a wanker, since the appropriate reaction can only be 'Well, just about everyone does it around that age. Why not he? Stop bothering me with these non-news...'. Everything else is hypocrisy.

Hell. I'm opposed to marihuana legalisation, and I still tried it out a few times. I'm sure as hell not going to judge anyone else who does it.

Athletes can go out and get wasted on alcohol on a whim, or use illegal steroids to enhance their performance, or even start shooting guns in a strip club...but god forbid they ever even think of taking a hit of weed.Yes, but they'll be pissed on if caught (Unless the tests confirming the consumption of such products are only retroactively established as standards. Lance Armstrong, I'm looking at you). It's a bit silly, since more-or-less every professional athlete does it, and IMHO, it'd be best to just be honest and legalise it, but at present, the reaction to being caught doping is (Usually) orders of magnitude worse than the reaction to being caught smoking pot.

I mean, the overreaction of the media aside, I doubt this thread is a statistical outlier in the general 'I don't give a shit, he's not alone in this' attitude.

You know, this story has me all sorts of pissed off.

Athletes can go out and get wasted on alcohol on a whim, or use illegal steroids to enhance their performance, or even start shooting guns in a strip club...but god forbid they ever even think of taking a hit of weed.

I mean, if a 14-time Olympic gold medalist can't catch a fucking break on this issue, how can anybody?

It'd be nice if we could have a serious debate in this country on marijuana use...but as long as the media keeps treating pot-smokers like puppy-murderers, it'll never happen.

I hear all this crap on the media about his "lapse in judgement"

FUCK THAT.

There are millions of regular pot-smokers in this country, and most of them are perfectly capable of using their drug of choice responsibly and perfoming admirably in whatever profession they choose to enter.

But you'd never know that from the way the media frames the discussion. No. Pot-smokers are all irresponsible drug-addicts who can't be trusted to do anything. Never mind that alcohol is arguably a more harmful and dangerous drug that is heavily abused by millions of people...no, do not think about that at all.

One hit of pot makes you "stupid" and "irresponsible".

Makes me want to puke.

Ride on, Delator.

So he's not a robot? :p

Next the media will be telling us this guy has premarital sex!!!!

Sir, if you're going to continue with such vile slurs against an American hero like Mr. Phelps I shall have to ask you to step outside!

Pity. I hope all the millions he's earned already will be enough to console him.

He is doing well at home with his family and friends.
(Not making this up, this was reported on the news. Like god damnit, he was caught smoking pot, not hit by a car)

So he's not a robot? :p
No, that's silly.
He's a saiyan
http://images.wikia.com/uncyclopedia/images/0/01/Phelps_super_saiyan.gif

This is ridiculous. So he smoked pot. That's not a bad thing; the law is stupid in this area. It's not like he cheated or anything.

No evidence he actually smoked anything illegal; I fail to see how, in the absence of any convincing evidence, the punishment can be applied.

Now see, if drugs were legal, this wouldn't even be an issue.

Two times in 24 hours...

*ducks again*

So he lit up. I fail to see the problem.

He should seek asylum in The Netherlands and offer to swim for their Olympic team.

So he lit up. I fail to see the problem.

He should seek asylum in The Netherlands and offer to swim for their Olympic team.

Yeah, I don't either. Methinks it's a thing with society though. People just can't seem to break this habit of thinking that pot is a harmful drug and really should be illegal.

That's for another thread though.

So he's not a robot? :p
My money is on cyborg, but what part of him is machine, hmm...
His left pinky toe. That's the most important body part for swimmers.

My money is on cyborg, but what part of him is machine, hmm...
His left pinky toe. That's the most important body part for swimmers.

I'm leaning toward mutant myself.

ooh...better thought: Phelps should hold a press conference and start singing, "Legalise it...and I will advertise it...", in a fake Jamacian accent.
Some got gold (medals) and oil and diamonds....all he did was Mary J. :(

No evidence he actually smoked anything illegal; I fail to see how, in the absence of any convincing evidence, the punishment can be applied.
He confessed already.

Is the USA Swimming Team even doing anything for the next three months?
Good point, but more important...didn't he retire? Why does he care if he's suspended?

I love the line about how he the swim team is going to cut his $1200 a month stipend for the next three months, and then not let him, by far their best competator, compete

"oh no, whatever shall I do for the next three months, except look at my shiny 8 gold medals, review my six world record, and count my many many millions of dollars. I do ever so wish I was going with you to...wherever it was you were going again, Montana or whatever, for your little 'competition'. I hope this doesn't affect my chances of making the olympic team for 2012!"

Well, he *could* be a robot that is powered by pot.

I'm leaning toward mutant myself.

Not mutant. Muto. He'll help us find dry land!

I kind of wish he had responded with, "You know what? I won eight goddamn gold medals in one Olympics, breaking other records in the process - I am literally the best fucking swimmer the world has seen. If I want to take a rip of a fucking bong, I'm gonna take a rip off a motherfucking bong, bitches. What the fuck have you done?"

the apology phelps ought give (http://www.theagitator.com/2009/02/01/a-letter-id-like-to-see-but-wont/)

...

You’ll have to pardon my cynicism. But I call bullshit. You don’t give a damn about my health. You just get a voyeuristic thrill from watching an elite athlete fall from grace–all the better if you get to exercise a little moral righteousness in the process. And it’s hypocritical righteousness at that, given that 40 percent of you have tried pot at least once in your lives.

Here’s a crazy thought: If I can smoke a little dope and go on to win 14 Olympic gold medals, maybe pot smokers aren’t doomed to lives of couch surfing and video games, as our moronic government would have us believe. In fact, the list of successful pot smokers includes not just world class athletes like me, Howard, Williams, and others, it includes Nobel Prize winners, Pulitzer Prize winners, the last three U.S. presidents, several Supreme Court justices, and luminaries and success stories from all sectors of business and the arts, sciences, and humanities.

So go ahead. Ban me from the next Olympics. Yank my endorsement deals. Stick your collective noses in the air and get all indignant on me. While you’re at it, keep arresting cancer and AIDS patients who dare to smoke the stuff because it deadens their pain, or enables them to eat. Keep sending in goon squads to kick down doors and shoot little old ladies, maim innocent toddlers, handcuff elderly post-polio patients to their beds at gunpoint, and slaughter the family pet.

Tell you what. I’ll make you a deal. I’ll apologize for smoking pot when every politician who ever did drugs and then voted to uphold or strengthen the drug laws marches his ass off to the nearest federal prison to serve out the sentence he wants to impose on everyone else for committing the same crimes he committed. I’ll apologize when the sons, daughters, and nephews of powerful politicians who get caught possessing or dealing drugs in the frat house or prep school get the same treatment as the no-name, probably black kid caught on the corner or the front stoop doing the same thing.

Until then, I for one will have none of it. I smoked pot. I liked it. I’ll probably do it again. I refuse to apologize for it, because by apologizing I help perpetuate this stupid lie, this idea that what someone puts into his own body on his own time is any of the government’s damned business. Or any of yours. I’m not going to bend over and allow myself to be propaganda for this wasteful, ridiculous, immoral war.

Go ahead and tear me down if you like. But let’s see you rationalize in your next lame ONDCP commercial how the greatest motherfucking swimmer the world has ever seen . . . is also a proud pot smoker.

Yours,

Michael Phelps

Not mutant. Muto. He'll help us find dry land!
So your ceiling is leaking too? I was somewhat concerned about all the standing water building up around my feet, then I discovered that the room below mine also has a leaky ceiling, so I guess things are going to work themselves out.

No that's not really fair. Like LG said hes done and sacrificed a lot, all he did was take a hit of a damn bong for chrissakes. I don't even smoke and I can sympathize.

i dont care that mr phelps was smoking dope. really, who hasnt?

but its good for him to find out that there are consequences and that he does need to be far more careful about who he surrounds himself with who might take pictures of his indiscretions.

what asshole took that pic and sold it? thats the guy im mad at. what a jerk.

the apology phelps ought give (http://www.theagitator.com/2009/02/01/a-letter-id-like-to-see-but-wont/)

The congregation says "Amen"

So Michael Phelps is a real human being, with flaws, not a swimming automaton. Do you think the punishment was just? I don't.

http://www.fanhouse.com/news/main/usa-swimming-suspends-michael-phelps/331784?icid=200100397x1217742953x1201215464

yes.

three month suspension for drug violation? yes.

the fact that he's accepting the punishment and is appearing to be very sorry about his actions speaks more than the photo.

So Michael Phelps is a real human being, with flaws, not a swimming automaton. Do you think the punishment was just? I don't.

http://www.fanhouse.com/news/main/usa-swimming-suspends-michael-phelps/331784?icid=200100397x1217742953x1201215464

1. It's not like he needs to swim anymore.
2. If his sponsor, Kellogg's, wants to drop him, it's their right.
3. I don't begrudge him the privilege of getting stoned, but as you'll notice, most people don't agree with me.

the apology phelps ought give (http://www.theagitator.com/2009/02/01/a-letter-id-like-to-see-but-wont/)
Nice :)

I blame my not winning any gold medals in Olympic sports on my years of pot smoking. Yes. Thats the reason.

One hit of pot makes you "stupid" and "irresponsible".

Makes me want to puke.

No - he was 'stupid' because he got caught, which forced the hand of the various sponsors/bodies.

i dont care that mr phelps was smoking dope. really, who hasnt?


Me?


but its good for him to find out that there are consequences and that he does need to be far more careful about who he surrounds himself with who might take pictures of his indiscretions.


Absolutely.

As I said before - he kind of forced hands here. The various interested parties have to crack down even on something as trivial as this, because of precedence. If everyone just kinda coughs and looks the other way, it creates a bad precedent for the NEXT guy who gets caught doing something stupid.


what asshole took that pic and sold it? thats the guy im mad at. what a jerk.

I'm not really mad at that guy. I wouldn't have taken that picture... or tried to sell it, but it's not like he busted into Phelps' bedroom or anything.

wtf!? This isn't fair. Have him arrested and punished just like the rest of us average Joes.

the apology phelps ought give (http://www.theagitator.com/2009/02/01/a-letter-id-like-to-see-but-wont/)

Just got that on Stumble. Love it. Just once I'd like to see someone have the balls to actually say something like that. Wonder what would happen.

<snip>
As I said before - he kind of forced hands here. The various interested parties have to crack down even on something as trivial as this, because of precedence. If everyone just kinda coughs and looks the other way, it creates a bad precedent for the NEXT guy who gets caught doing something stupid.

Well, getting caught was certainly stupid, but what he got caught doing wasn't stupid per se..


I'm not really mad at that guy. I wouldn't have taken that picture... or tried to sell it, but it's not like he busted into Phelps' bedroom or anything.
Yeah, taking the picture was a pretty unwise move, as was allowing it to be taken.

wtf!? This isn't fair. Have him arrested and punished just like the rest of us average Joes.

How 'bout don't arrest people who do it in the first place? It's an incredibly stupid law and should be repealed. There is no sensible reason to keep it in place, only knee-jerk reactions.

How 'bout don't arrest people who do it in the first place? It's an incredibly stupid law and should be repealed. There is no sensible reason to keep it in place, only knee-jerk reactions.

It's there for the same reason there's still an embargo on Cuba. An outdated notion that "3bil must b pwnish3d". And of course both approaches have proven to be rather ineffective at best.

Well, getting caught was certainly stupid, but what he got caught doing wasn't stupid per se..


I agree... and I disagree.

I agree that, fundamentally, it shouldn't BE illegal.

But - it is. So doing it, (nominally) in a career where you WILL get tested, frequently... not to bright. And doing it in 'uncontrolled' circumstances, even dumber.

So - 'ideally', I agree. 'Realisitically', I have to disagree.


Yeah, taking the picture was a pretty unwise move, as was allowing it to be taken.


True, this. At least he regained some ground by not acting like a prick about it, when he DID end up embarassed.

Well, he *could* be a robot that is powered by pot.

I would like to see this robot.:p

I would like to see this robot.:p

http://thevoidcomedy.files.wordpress.com/2008/04/bender.jpg

http://thevoidcomedy.files.wordpress.com/2008/04/bender.jpg

Epic, but Bender is fueled by alcohol. Perhaps his alter-ego (insert witty pun)der?

Epic, but Bender is fueled by alcohol. Perhaps his alter-ego (insert witty pun)der?

Blunter?

No - he was 'stupid' because he got caught, which forced the hand of the various sponsors/bodies.

You and I both know that...but the media won't cover it that way because then there's no way to milk the story.

We'll hear about every sponsor that drops him, but almost nothing about who keeps him.

Blunter?

Good enough for me!;)

You and I both know that...but the media won't cover it that way because then there's no way to milk the story.

We'll hear about every sponsor that drops him, but almost nothing about who keeps him.

Kellogg 'took the hit' (how ironic), probably because they are most intimately linked, and have the brand that could be most easily damaged. Phelps is probably counting his blessings right now, because that 'big' rift probably enabled him to retain (at least an option on) a lot of other connections, that will keep heads down until he's back out of the dog house.

So Michael Phelps is a real human being, with flaws, not a swimming automaton. Do you think the punishment was just? I don't.

http://www.fanhouse.com/news/main/usa-swimming-suspends-michael-phelps/331784?icid=200100397x1217742953x1201215464

WTF? WTF is wrong with smoking pot? Its less unhealthy than smoking cigs.

So it wasn't just gillyweed that he took?

Kellogg 'took the hit' (how ironic), probably because they are most intimately linked, and have the brand that could be most easily damaged. Phelps is probably counting his blessings right now, because that 'big' rift probably enabled him to retain (at least an option on) a lot of other connections, that will keep heads down until he's back out of the dog house.

Maybe Kelloggs will take another hit (http://www.petitiononline.com/Kellogg/petition.html)...alright, probably not but it was pretty funny.

Of course he's superhuman! Most athletes take drugs to enhance their performance. Michael Phelps took a hit from the bong to give himself a challenge and give the other swimmers a chance at winning!
This is the argument i made. It gives a better sense of hope, instead of despair, to some people that even someone who has puffed the magic dragon might actually earn the appreciation and respect of people worldwide for dedication, hard work and accomplishment.
A better argument is often made to me though that there isn't a single regular pot smoker that the other person in the argument knows who has enough wherewithal to bother walking anywhere, to say nothing of being an Olympic champion.

I am starting to think that pot After a work out helps you improve faster.

is "human" supposed to be a point in this mysterious person's favor?

This is such a non-issue. If the man can beat the rest of the world while lit, more power to him. Was he selling it? No. Was he driving? No. I fail to see the need for uproar.

WTF? WTF is wrong with smoking pot? Its less unhealthy than smoking cigs.

Well that's bullshit, but I agree that there's nothing that needs the overreaction we're seeing.

Seth Meyers just pinned Kelloggs on dropping Phelps in his "Really? With Seth" bit responding to them saying it 'wasn't consistent with their image,' among them "Every one of your products sound like a wish a genie granted at a Phish concert..."

If you missed it, find it. It was awesome.

Here.

http://www.hulu.com/watch/56216/late-night-with-conan-obrien-new-michael-phelps-ads

I think that Seth Myers from SNL nails this one (especially in the last twenty seconds of that clip). (http://www.nbc.com/Saturday_Night_Live/video/clips/really-michael-phelps/999101/)

EDIT: Dammit CToaN! You mentioned this before me! I guess great minds think alike. :tongue:

How about people criticize the laws which make him a criminal instead of him for taking a rip off a bong? How about Michael Phelps made no mistake, how about the government made a mistake by criminalizing the weed?

If the man can beat the rest of the world while lit, more power to him. Was he selling it? No. Was he driving? No. I fail to see the need for uproar.
Exactly.

If the man can win 14 gold medals (or whatever silly number it was) in one Games and get chonged, good on him. There's gotta be a High Times cover in this somewhere...

I am starting to think that pot After a work out helps you improve faster.
it can help the muscles relax which aids recovery, as well as preventing tears while exercising.
I knew a lot of powerlifters when I was at Uni and some of them were getting through an ounce a week. Didn't stop them from competing nationally and, for some of them, internationally. One of them set several world records. Of course the huge amount of 'roids she was shoving inside her prob helped.

I think he's been crucified, a massive overreaction. He's a young bloke, he's living his life, let him do it without hounding him.

So Michael Phelps is a real human being, with flaws, not a swimming automaton. Do you think the punishment was just? I don't.

http://www.fanhouse.com/news/main/usa-swimming-suspends-michael-phelps/331784?icid=200100397x1217742953x1201215464

I think the kid was just being a kid. He obviously has spent ost of his youth training to be what he is today, and now in the off season wanted to relax and party. So he smoked some weed, so what, he didn't hurt anyone but himself.

The parties that yanked sponsorship deals with him have that right. In this economy who know if they aren't praying for more of these to yank more deals and save some money.

As for the sheriff who wants to charge him. Dude, go prosecute some domestic violence and other crimes that have victims, and don't waste the county and state money that would be required to prosecute Phelps.

I think he did the drugs because he's still upset that he didn't get presented the medals by Hitler in the 1972 Olympics in Muhich.

:D (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jZEItFOKlHc)

I find it funny that those arguing that the penalties are too much are the only ones carrying on the subject. He accepted the 3 month penalty with no fuss. Looking to regain any loss of image and trust and looking forward to resuming his competitions 3 months from now.

for me, that speaks more about his character than anything else.

I find it funny that those arguing that the penalties are too much are the only ones carrying on the subject. He accepted the 3 month penalty with no fuss. Looking to regain any loss of image and trust and looking forward to resuming his competitions 3 months from now.

for me, that speaks more about his character than anything else.

Here, in our local rag, the editor says that Phelps has no character - all because of one bong hit (that we know of). So, one bong hit is an indicator of lack of character but a three martini lunch isn't.

Here, in our local rag, the editor says that Phelps has no character - all because of one bong hit (that we know of). So, one bong hit is an indicator of lack of character but a three martini lunch isn't.

some may say that's true, but for me, the opinion of the editor is shadowed by the person's action. Phelps took responsiblity for what he did. He accepted his 3 month ban. and he's looking forward to a time after the ban. he's pushing on and striving to put his past behind him. Again, that's more telling than another person's opinon of him.

some may say that's true, but for me, the opinion of the editor is shadowed by the person's action. Phelps took responsiblity for what he did. He accepted his 3 month ban. and he's looking forward to a time after the ban. he's pushing on and striving to put his past behind him. Again, that's more telling than another person's opinon of him.

You know I agree with you, just pointing out the idiocy, and hypocrisy, of a particular mindset.

You know I agree with you, just pointing out the idiocy, and hypocrisy, of a particular mindset.
true dat. :D

To be honest, I think it would take a lot more strength of character to stand up and say "yes, I smoke marijuana. And you know what? I'm still the greatest damn swimmer ever. So maybe you need to re-evaluate your beliefs on the ability of recreational marijuana users to accomplish something in life. Maybe you should re-evaluate your laws and see if they are good laws. Ban me if you want, I'll just console myself with all these gold medals."

To be honest, I think it would take a lot more strength of character to stand up and say "yes, I smoke marijuana. And you know what? I'm still the greatest damn swimmer ever. So maybe you need to re-evaluate your beliefs on the ability of recreational marijuana users to accomplish something in life. Maybe you should re-evaluate your laws and see if they are good laws. Ban me if you want, I'll just console myself with all these gold medals."

1) comes off as Arrogant. he'd lose any sympathetic supports who are not MJ supporters.

2) he was banned becuase he broke Rules, not Laws.

3) if he pushed it, the IOC could make a case of him being stripped of those gold medals for breaking the Drug RULES.

1) comes off as Arrogant. he'd lose any sympathetic supports who are not MJ supporters.

Perhaps, perhaps not. But he'd still be right.


2) he was banned becuase he broke Rules, not Laws.

Then he could apply the same idea to the rules of the organization. If it's against the rules to take drugs that give you no advantage whatsoever, then those rules are incredibly stupid and need to be changed.

3) if he pushed it, the IOC could make a case of him being stripped of those gold medals for breaking the Drug RULES.

If that happened, I think a lot of the people supposedly alienated by point 1 would be more sympathetic again. Getting stripped of his medals for a reason other than cheating would not sit well with most people, I think.

Perhaps, perhaps not. But he'd still be right. it's not about being "right" or "wrong". it's about breaking rules.

Then he could apply the same idea to the rules of the organization. If it's against the rules to take drugs that give you no advantage whatsoever, then those rules are incredibly stupid and need to be changed. and you don't change those rules by breaking them.

If that happened, I think a lot of the people supposedly alienated by point 1 would be more sympathetic again. Getting stripped of his medals for a reason other than cheating would not sit well with most people, I think. yet how many people got their medals stripped for taking drugs.

i'm badly hooked on drungs right now. lol@ Junii

i'm badly hooked on drungs right now. lol@ Junii

LOL! Drungs are bad Mmmm'kay :D

it's not about being "right" or "wrong". it's about breaking rules.

When it comes to character, it is about right and wrong.


and you don't change those rules by breaking them.

No, but that doesn't mean if you're a high profile rule-breaker, you don't use the situation to call attention to the silliness of the rules/laws.


yet how many people got their medals stripped for taking drugs.

Performance enhancing drugs. You know, cheating.

i'm badly hooked on drungs right now. lol@ Junii

Quick! Look at some fractals!

3) if he pushed it, the IOC could make a case of him being stripped of those gold medals for breaking the Drug RULES.


The IOC has no authority to strip anyone of medals for drugs they take months after the event. He was tested repeatedly during the Olympics and was clean.

When it comes to character, it is about right and wrong. not always.

No, but that doesn't mean if you're a high profile rule-breaker, you don't use the situation to call attention to the silliness of the rules/laws. yet is he? no indication that he's trying to call any attention to any international rules/laws. So far, it's only the spectators that are crying foul.

Performance enhancing drugs. You know, cheating.

WADA does NOT make that distinction (http://www.faqs.org/sports-science/Pl-Sa/Prohibited-Substances-Competition-Bans.html). WADA expresses in its Code the underlying philosophy to the prohibition as "The use of any drug should be limited to medically justified indications."


and here is the list (http://www.wada-ama.org/rtecontent/document/2008_List_En.pdf).

S8. CANNABINOIDS
Cannabinoids (e.g. hashish, marijuana) are prohibited.

The IOC has no authority to strip anyone of medals for drugs they take months after the event. He was tested repeatedly during the Olympics and was clean.

when was that picture taken?

when was that picture taken?

From the article cited in the OP

"Phelps has acknowledged "regrettable" behavior and "bad judgment." He didn't dispute the authenticity of the photo, reportedly taken at a house party while Phelps was visiting Columbia, S.C., in November during an extended break from training."

From the article cited in the OP

"Phelps has acknowledged "regrettable" behavior and "bad judgment." He didn't dispute the authenticity of the photo, reportedly taken at a house party while Phelps was visiting Columbia, S.C., in November during an extended break from training."

now take a look at the WADA list that the IOC and other countries use.

* “The Prohibited List may identify specified substances which are particularly susceptible to unintentional anti-doping rule violations because of their general availability in medicinal products or which are less likely to be successfully abused as doping agents.” A doping violation involving such substances may result in a reduced sanction provided that the “…Athlete can establish that the Use of such a specified substance was not intended to enhance sport performance…”

which is probably one reason why the IOC is NOT getting involved and is letting the nation's own committee (in this case, the US Swim Team) handle it. but the cry to remove Cannabinoids from the prohibitied list may cause them to step in.

not always.

What else, exactly, is relevant to good character?


yet is he? no indication that he's trying to call any attention to any international rules/laws. So far, it's only the spectators that are crying foul.

Utterly irrelevant. The fact that he's not does not mean that it would not be good for him to do so.


WADA does NOT make that distinction (http://www.faqs.org/sports-science/Pl-Sa/Prohibited-Substances-Competition-Bans.html).

and here is the list (http://www.wada-ama.org/rtecontent/document/2008_List_En.pdf).

Then they are clearly in the wrong. As far as I can see, no valid argument can be made in support of that position, and I don't think most people would be happy with a successful athlete being stripped of his medals for something other than cheating.

Character has little to do with rules. The early Christians broke the rules constantly, because the rules ran counter to what they thought was right.

If you read Thoreau on Civil Disobedience - he advocated breaking rules that you thought were wrong and then taking the responsibility and the consequences for your actions.

Ghandi broke rules right and left, no once can say he had no character.

How much character did it take Nazis to follow their rules? How much character did it take the maqui to break the Nazi rules?

I'm not saying what Phelps did is on a par with Ghandi, but he did take responsibility and the consequences for what he did.

Character is about standing up for your beliefs and standards, not about following rules. I doubt that a great many of us, including myself, have that much character.

now take a look at the WADA list that the IOC and other countries use.


Im not clear how that is at all relevant. If he didnt take drugs until after the Olympics were over, the IOC has no jurisdiction over him. Thats like saying if he gets arrested for cocaine possession in 2050 then they can also take away his medals.

Im not clear how that is at all relevant. If he didnt take drugs until after the Olympics were over, the IOC has no jurisdiction over him. Thats like saying if he gets arrested for cocaine possession in 2050 then they can also take away his medals.

I believe the IOC also oversees the qualifiers. like those World and Nationals competition.

Anything that deals with the athletes and their qualifying for the olympics.

What else, exactly, is relevant to good character?
This \/ (Nicely put ASD)

Character has little to do with rules. The early Christians broke the rules constantly, because the rules ran counter to what they thought was right.

If you read Thoreau on Civil Disobedience - he advocated breaking rules that you thought were wrong and then taking the responsibility and the consequences for your actions.

Ghandi broke rules right and left, no once can say he had no character.

How much character did it take Nazis to follow their rules? How much character did it take the maqui to break the Nazi rules?

I'm not saying what Phelps did is on a par with Ghandi, but he did take responsibility and the consequences for what he did.

Character is about standing up for your beliefs and standards, not about following rules. I doubt that a great many of us, including myself, have that much character.

This \/ (Nicely put ASD)

That doesn't contradict what I'm saying at all. Nothing about standing up and calling stupid people out for being stupid precludes accepting that there will be negative consequences for your actions.

That doesn't contradict what I'm saying at all. Nothing about standing up and calling stupid people out for being stupid precludes accepting that there will be negative consequences for your actions.well, following the conversation...

Perhaps, perhaps not. But he'd still be right. it's not about being "right" or "wrong". it's about breaking rules.
When it comes to character, it is about right and wrong. not always.What else, exactly, is relevant to good character?
so ASD is saying what is relevant to good character outside of being 'right' or 'wrong'.

Does Phelps consider what he did right? the US Swim team and the drug rules stupid?

well, following the conversation...


so ASD is saying what is relevant to good character outside of being 'right' or 'wrong'.

Does Phelps consider what he did right? the US Swim team and the drug rules stupid?

ASD's examples were people who did what was right despite what the law said. This actually reinforces my point.

And yes, the drug rules are stupid, as the only drugs that are relevant to athletic competition are those used to gain an unfair advantage. There is no rational reason to ban anything else.

ASD's examples were people who did what was right despite what the law said. This actually reinforces my point.

And yes, the drug rules are stupid, as the only drugs that are relevant to athletic competition are those used to gain an unfair advantage. There is no rational reason to ban anything else.

and the part I highlighted. he took responsiblitiy for his actions. as long as he did that, then I wouldn't mind if he is fighting for a change in the WADA list.

and my question was NOT do YOU think those laws are silly, but does Phelps?

and the part I highlighted. he took responsiblitiy for his actions. as long as he did that, then I wouldn't mind if he is fighting for a change in the WADA list.

and my question was NOT do YOU think those laws are silly, but does Phelps?

I would assume so, or he'd not likely be one to smoke marijuana, no?

He looked like he knew what he was doing with that thing, too...

I would assume so, or he'd not likely be one to smoke marijuana, no?

He looked like he knew what he was doing with that thing, too...

but we don't know. However, by accepting the actions, that does add to his credibility should he actively fight to have MJ removed from the list.

which would've been damaged had he whined or made biting remarks about the ruling.

Marijuanna isnt even on the drugs to test for list in the NBA,(and if they are its a very recent thing). Since many NBA players smoke pot in the off season, should all of the USA basketball medals be returned?

I still want Phelps to do the "I'm the best fucking swimmer ever" speech. :D

but we don't know. However, by accepting the actions, that does add to his credibility should he actively fight to have MJ removed from the list.

Well, no, we don't know for sure. We can't know for sure what anybody believes (they might be deceiving us, after all!), but we can make educated guesses based on actions. People who think that drugs are immoral aren't typically the ones to do drugs.

which would've been damaged had he whined or made biting remarks about the ruling.

His credibility would not at all be lessened if he made biting remarks about the ruling. Sure, had he whined and said something like "it's not fair! don't apply the rules to me!" that'd be one thing, but saying "Go ahead and suspend me. That's fine. It may be stupid, but those are your rules. I guess I'll just have to console myself with my millions of dollars and my gold medals and all still numerable fans. How horrible this punishment is. Alas." that'd be another.

And if some people lose respect for him not just falling into line and saying "yeah drugs are bad, I'm so sorry that I put something into my own body," then tough shit. I wouldn't want the respect of such sheep anyway.

The owner of the bong tried to sell it on Ebay (http://www.wmbfnews.com/Global/story.asp?S=9818304) for $100,000. The only result, of course, was that he and all his friends were arrested.

The owner of the bong tried to sell it on Ebay (http://www.wmbfnews.com/Global/story.asp?S=9818304) for $100,000. The only result, of course, was that he and all his friends were arrested.

Wow. What a dumbass. WTF did he think would happen?

Quick! Look at some fractals!
:fluffle: Always make time for the important things.
http://www.8bucksproductions.com/CageFriendship.jpg

Michael Phelps is not human, did you see that bong? That kind of lung capacity only comes from being jettisoned from planet Krypton, or an unholy pact with the Devil.

Lol I'd love to use a bong, I've smoked pot(hash and weed) a fair bit but never used a bong.....

A three month suspension sounds fair to me. It could've been far worse.

A three month suspension sounds fair to me. It could've been far worse.

Fair in what way?
Care to provide a rational reason why marijuana should be against the rules/the law in the first place?

Fair in what way?
Care to provide a rational reason why marijuana should be against the rules/the law in the first place?

Duh! coz it is an illeagl substance?:D

Duh! coz it is an illeagl substance?:D

I believe the question was, is there a logical reason for it to be illegal in the first place?"

Duh! coz it is an illeagl substance?:D

So it should be against the law because it's against the law?

Amusingly, this really is the reasoning that people often use to keep it illegal. Probably because there aren't any arguments that are actually good.

I believe the question was, is there a logical reason for it to be illegal in the first place?"

I belive that the question was, why should it be against the rules. Then /law was added.

So it should be against the law because it's against the law?

Amusingly, this really is the reasoning that people often use to keep it illegal. Probably because there aren't any arguments that are actually good.

Fuck me can people not read all of a sudden?

I belive that the question was, why should it be against the rules. Then /law was added.

Um, /the law was there the entire time, I never edited it in...

Um, /the law was there the entire time, I never edited it in...

Jesus people, do I have to explain every little thing?

Was it not clear that I was answering the question up to the / and ignoring what was after it, does it make any sort of sense to answer the /law, bit the way I did?:rolleyes:

Further, it being illegal does not imply that it should also be against the rules-- they could very well let the punishment be purely a legal one. I mean, for drugs used to get an unfair advantage, the integrity of the sport is violated, so it makes sense to introduce their own punishments in addition to the legal ones.

Fair in what way?
Care to provide a rational reason why marijuana should be against the rules/the law in the first place?

Fuck me can people not read all of a sudden?

I read rather well, do you?

The question is cited above, he clearly asked for a rational reason for it being against the rules/law.

You responded that it was an illegal (I corrected your spelling - unless of course it was intentional) substance.

This led us to believe that you were using circular reasoning.

When caught in a fallacy, use something other than our alleged lack of ability to read to argue your point.

I read rather well, do you?

The question is cited above, he clearly asked for a rational reason for it being against the rules/law.

You responded that it was an illegal (I corrected your spelling - unless of course it was intentional) substance.

This led us to believe that you were using circular reasoning.

When caught in a fallacy, use something other than our alleged lack of ability to read to argue your point.

Meh!:p Just read my last post huh!

Meh!:p Just read my last post huh!

So you just pick and choose, is that it? Well forgive me if I can't read your mind.

So, that being, more or less, settled. Give a rational reason for it being illegal.

So you just pick and choose, is that it? Well forgive me if I can't read your mind.

So, that being, more or less, settled. Give a rational reason for it being illegal.

There is none that I can see. Let people use whatever substancs they want is what I say.

Lol I'd love to use a bong, I've smoked pot(hash and weed) a fair bit but never used a bong.....

I prefer a joint, myself, but why don't you just make one?

Fair in what way?
Care to provide a rational reason why marijuana should be against the rules/the law in the first place?

I never said it should be against the law.

Whether it should be against the law or not is irrelevant; the fact remains it is against the law right now. As someone who is expected to be a role model for younger athletes, he can't be running around breaking the law and expect the commission to look the other way.

Whether it should or should not be against the law is another debate entirely.

I never said it should be against the law.

Whether it should be against the law or not is irrelevant; the fact remains it is against the law right now. As someone who is expected to be a role model for younger athletes, he can't be running around breaking the law and expect the commission to look the other way.

Whether it should or should not be against the law is another debate entirely.

It's entirely relevant. If it should be legal, then the law is unjust. If the law is unjust, then the punishment that it demands is, by definition, wrong. (Because if the punishment that it described was a fair punishment for the crime, that would make the law just).

Your claim only makes any sort of sense if breaking the law is immoral in and of itself, but that's just ridiculous.

It's entirely relevant. If it should be legal, then the law is unjust. If the law is unjust, then the punishment that it demands is, by definition, wrong. (Because if the punishment that it described was a fair punishment for the crime, that would make the law just).

Your claim only makes any sort of sense if breaking the law is immoral in and of itself, but that's just ridiculous.

It is the law and people are expected to follow both the laws they agree with and those they do not.

It is the law and people are expected to follow both the laws they agree with and those they do not.

Yes, people are expected to, or they risk punishment, but that does not make acting in such a way the law prohibits inherently immoral.

After all, it was once illegal to help slaves escape, was it not? But I would think that that case goes farther than not being a moral wrong-- it was an extreme moral good. In fact, I would say it was even more a moral good because it was illegal-- it meant that the people who did it put their own interests at risk in order to achieve a noble goal. Now, certainly, smoking marijuana isn't a moral good. But it's not inherently wrong just because it's against the law.

The sheriff's department has begun making arrests tied to the case:

http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/swimming/news/story?id=3901721

Fair in what way?
Care to provide a rational reason why marijuana should be against the rules/the law in the first place?

you should ask the INTERNATIONAL committees why it's against the rules. as for the LAW, ask your local politicians.
:rolleyes:

I think he should have been suspended even if the pictures were of him drinking from a beer bong and not a weed bong. The job of a professional athlete is to be an entertainer/role model. That's how they make their money, by selling their image for the public to hold up as role models. Thus, promoting drunken debauchery, thereby ruining their role model image is something that should be punished in that industry. The fact that marijuana is illegal pretty much seals the deal; not only did he (accidentally) promote debauchery, but he also promoted the breaking of the law.

you should ask the INTERNATIONAL committees why it's against the rules. as for the LAW, ask your local politicians.
:rolleyes:

Yeah. The only people I should discuss the matter with is people responsible for it. When somebody posts something saying that those people are correct, I shouldn't discuss it with them. That's why we never have political debates on NSG: none of us are lawmakers.

Oh, wait. Never mind. We do that all the time.


I think he should have been suspended even if the pictures were of him drinking from a beer bong and not a weed bong. The job of a professional athlete is to be an entertainer/role model. That's how they make their money, by selling their image for the public to hold up as role models. Thus, promoting drunken debauchery, thereby ruining their role model image is something that should be punished in that industry. The fact that marijuana is illegal pretty much seals the deal; not only did he (accidentally) promote debauchery, but he also promoted the breaking of the law.

No, an athlete's job is to compete. If they're a role model as well, great, but if not, whatever. He's old enough to drink and take responsibility for what he may do under the influence. The idea that drunkenness is inherently immoral is some inane societal prudishness that people should get over. And the idea that breaking the law is inherently wrong is to say that the law is sacred; this sort of state worship is exactly what we need to not teach kids. We need to teach them to think for themselves.

Yeah. The only people I should discuss the matter with is people responsible for it. When somebody posts something saying that those people are correct, I shouldn't discuss it with them. That's why we never have political debates on NSG: none of us are lawmakers.

Oh, wait. Never mind. We do that all the time.

you asked for a "rational reason why marijuana should be against the rules/the law in the first place?"

we can only speculate. as for WHY, it's best to inquire the people who made it against the rules/law.

as for speculating why it's against the rules...

a while ago, Steroids were NOT considered a performing enhancing drug untill years of study later. considering what is on that list, it appears WASA and the IOC are taking a blanket approach to keep the games as 'untainted' as possible. there are execptions for medical treatment. but those need to be filed.

as for the Law? it boils down to the elected officals put in office by the people. keep electing those people and MJ will remain an illegal drug.

you asked for a "rational reason why marijuana should be against the rules/the law in the first place?"

we can only speculate. as for WHY, it's best to inquire the people who made it against the rules/law.

That's ridiculous. If somebody voices an opinion (for example "the punishment was fair") it's perfectly sensible to challenge them directly, rather than go and ask the people who made that opinion enforceable (though if you have the connections to get them to listen to you, that's a perfectly good idea as well). If we all agreed with you, nobody would ever debate politics, because, after all, we're not the ones who draft policy.


as for speculating why it's against the rules...

a while ago, Steroids were NOT considered a performing enhancing drug untill years of study later. considering what is on that list, it appears WASA and the IOC are taking a blanket approach to keep the games as 'untainted' as possible. there are execptions for medical treatment. but those need to be filed.

as for the Law? it boils down to the elected officals put in office by the people. keep electing those people and MJ will remain an illegal drug.

First of all, I'm not asking for the mechanics of how things are banned. I do happen to have a basic idea how governments and such work.

But look at each of those--
Blanket bans are irrational and stupid. It's quite clear that marijuana does not grow muscle mass or, really, enhance performance in any way. The rational way to have go about it would have been to look at each drug in question and see if it interfered with the integrity of the sport. Yes, it would have required more effort on the part of those drafting the rules, but it would have been the correct course of action.

As for the law? Again, I'm not asking for the mechanics of how it was banned and how it remains banned. It's pretty obvious how it happened. I'm talking about the reasons that the law should be one way or another. And there is no rational thinking behind anti-marijuana laws, just knee-jerk reactions.

That's ridiculous. If somebody voices an opinion (for example "the punishment was fair") it's perfectly sensible to challenge them directly, rather than go and ask the people who made that opinion enforceable (though if you have the connections to get them to listen to you, that's a perfectly good idea as well). If we all agreed with you, nobody would ever debate politics, because, after all, we're not the ones who draft policy. true, but that's their OPINION on the punishment. you asked for why it was illegal/against the rules.

Blanket bans are irrational and stupid. It's quite clear that marijuana does not grow muscle mass or, really, enhance performance in any way. The rational way to have go about it would have been to look at each drug in question and see if it interfered with the integrity of the sport. Yes, it would have required more effort on the part of those drafting the rules, but it would have been the correct course of action. never said a blanket ban was rational or smart. only that it's 'against the rules'.

As for the law? Again, I'm not asking for the mechanics of how it was banned and how it remains banned. It's pretty obvious how it happened. I'm talking about the reasons that the law should be one way or another. And there is no rational thinking behind anti-marijuana laws, just knee-jerk reactions.
again, for the reasons why MJ is against the law, you need to ask those that drafted the law.

for all you know perhaps they had bad MJ experiences.

The sheriff's department has begun making arrests tied to the case:

http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/swimming/news/story?id=3901721

They're just going to make him a Marijuana Martyr. Do they really want potheads to actually have something to get organized about besides free food?

true, but that's their OPINION on the punishment. you asked for why it was illegal/against the rules.

No. I didn't ask for why it is, I asked why it should be. I know why it is, but a knee-jerk reaction (and, in the case of the law, racism and assorted other ridiculous factors) is not a good reason.


never said a blanket ban was rational or smart. only that it's 'against the rules'.

Yes. And I asked for rational reasons why it should be. How can you possibly not see the distinction?


again, for the reasons why MJ is against the law, you need to ask those that drafted the law.

for all you know perhaps they had bad MJ experiences.

If you look at history, you find that it's against the law for a number of reasons, none of them good. But even if we didn't know, that's not what I was asking. I was asking why it should be.

No, an athlete's job is to compete. If they're a role model as well, great, but if not, whatever.

That's not true at all. An athlete is paid because there are people who are willing to pay to watch them perform and companies are willing to pay to sponsor those people and events. They are entertainers and role models; that is what they sell.

That's not true at all. An athlete is paid because there are people who are willing to pay to watch them perform and companies are willing to pay to sponsor those people and events. They are entertainers and role models; that is what they sell.

Yes, people are willing to pay to watch them play. They don't get paid extra to be a good person. Hell, a "bad" person might have a certain draw as far as ticket sales: people love controversy.

And, again, there's nothing immoral about drinking or smoking, so it's not like somebody who does so is a bad role model.