NationStates Jolt Archive

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20090116/wl_afp/zimbabweeconomycurrency

HARARE (AFP) – The European Union on Friday threatened new sanctions against Robert Mugabe's government in Zimbabwe, blamed for political deadlock, a surging cholera epidemic and runaway inflation.

With no sign of an end to the crisis, Czech Foreign Minister Karel Schwarzenberg, whose country holds the EU presidency, said that European nations were considering new sanctions against Mugabe and his inner circle.

In Geneva a UN agency said cholera has claimed 2,201 lives since August, warning that prevention efforts have failed to stop it while the nation's economic collapse has left public hospitals empty.

Zimbabwe's stunning economic decline came into even sharper focus as the central bank unveiled a 100-trillion-dollar note -- just a week after introducing a series of billion-dollar denominations that have already lost most of their value.

"The European Union is contemplating the implementation of further restrictive measures," Schwarzenberg told reporters after meeting his South African counterpart outside Cape Town.

"The sanctions, we have not yet decided about them. They would be what we call tailor-made -- not hitting the broad population but hitting those who are responsible and in power," Schwarzenberg said.

.........

The political stalemate has only fuelled the economic crisis that has impoverished the country, leaving nearly half the population dependent on food aid.

The UN's humanitarian coordination office (OCHA) said that most of the working trucks left in the country were being snapped up for a massive food aid operation targeting six million people this month alone, but leaving essential medical supplies by the wayside.

........

The new 100,000,000,000,000 Zim-dollar bill would have been worth about 300 US dollars (225 euros) at Thursday's exchange rate on the informal market, where most currency trading now takes place, but the value of the local currency erodes dramatically every day.

Inflation was last reported at 231 million percent in July, but the Washington think-tank Cato Institute has estimated it now at 89.7 sextillion percent -- a figure expressed with 21 zeroes.

So, we have a $100,000,000,000,000 bill depreciating at 89,700,000,000,000,000,000,000%.

For reference, that's 2,842,480,924,956,602% per second.

I can't even think that fast.

Even if you assume the Cato institute is way off, and that 231,000,000% is accurate, that's still 439% per minute, or 7% per second (yes, I am rounding, mostly down).

EDIT: Forgot a slash.

SUPEREDIT: Math is not my thing. Vault 10 has corrected me as follows:

A correction: that's not a correct calculation.
Inflation per second is rather calculated (inflation per year)^(1/31500000). That is 1.0000015, or 0.00015% per second in this case.

A more interesting figure is inflation per day. That is 1.14, or 14%. It's not exactly record-breaking, IIRC Zimbabwe reached a 50% per day inflation once.

lol.

Teehee.

I want one.

You could buy them, shred them and sell the paper to a recycler for a profit. :D

they should sell these in novelty shops

God Mugabe, if you werent the direct cause of thousands of deaths due to your incompetence, Id hope you never leave. You are, hands down, the funniest man alive.

God Mugabe, if you werent the direct result of thousands of deaths due to your incompetence, Id hope you never leave. You are, hands down, the funniest man alive.

You mean direct cause, right? :confused:

God Mugabe, if you werent the direct result of thousands of deaths due to your incompetence, Id hope you never leave. You are, hands down, the funniest man alive.

you can't say he hasn't brought money to Zimbabwe :p

You mean direct cause, right? :confused:

yes.

They should unveil a £100,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 bill!

Aye I'm sure sanctions are going to help against a nation where the inner circle are wealthy and the general public is impoverished. Yes.

The zeros hurt my eyes. What is that, septrillions? Do we start making up words at this point?!

The zeros hurt my eyes. What is that, septrillions? Do we start making up words at this point?!
"Zimbabwillions" - YAS!

Robert Mugabe. Making the result of the world's leaders look competent since 1980.

Aye I'm sure sanctions are going to help against a nation where the inner circle are wealthy and the general public is impoverished. Yes.

It'll help them more than aid would.

Aid would just go straight to the "inner circle's" pockets. We've seen it happen before.

At least with sanctions, the inner circle suffers too, which can, you know, actually bring them to the table.

And shit.

There must be more billionaires in Zimbabwe than any other country on earth. Clear proof of Mugabe's excellent financial policies.

Teehee!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So, we have a $100,000,000,000,000 bill depreciating at 89,700,000,000,000,000,000,000%.
For reference, that's 2,842,480,924,956,602% per second.
A correction: that's not a correct calculation.
Inflation per second is rather calculated (inflation per year)^(1/31500000). That is 1.0000015, or 0.00015% per second in this case.

A more interesting figure is inflation per day. That is 1.14, or 14%. It's not exactly record-breaking, IIRC Zimbabwe reached a 50% per day inflation once.

A correction: that's not a correct calculation.
Inflation per second is rather calculated (inflation per year)^(1/31500000). That is 1.0000015, or 0.00015% per second in this case.

A more interesting figure is inflation per day. That is 1.14, or 14%. It's not exactly record-breaking, IIRC Zimbabwe reached a 50% per day inflation once.

Why is it raised to 1/31,500,000? I just divided it by 31,556,926 (the number of seconds in a year)?

Dear Mr. Mugabe,
I would like you to print me a $1 googol($10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00000000000000000000000) bill. In exchange for this I will give you €50. I think this trade is more than fair.
Yours,
Ifreann

Even a £100,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 ,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 Bill!! Hahaha!

Why is it raised to 1/31,500,000? I just divided it by 31,556,926 (the number of seconds in a year)?

I thought that was the number of minutes per year. :confused:

I thought that was the number of minutes per year. :confused:

No, there are 525,948 minutes in a year.

Why is it raised to 1/31,500,000? I just divided it by 31,556,926 (the number of seconds in a year)?
That's math for everyone who works with loans or any other banking instruments. You shouldn't divide it. Rather, you should first convert it to a coefficient, e.g. 10% = 1.1, then take that to the power of 1/n, where n is the number of fractions, here seconds in a year.

And to think, 50 years ago Zim dollars were worth more than US dollars.

That's math for everyone who works with loans or any other banking instruments. You shouldn't divide it. Rather, you should first convert it to a coefficient, e.g. 10% = 1.1, then take that to the power of 1/n, where n is the number of fractions, here seconds in a year.

I'll have to take your word for it. Math is not my thing.

Edited the OP.

Gideon Gono is a genius. Central bankers around the world have a lot to learn from him, he's pulled off what they wish they could do.

Robert Mugabe. Making the result of the world's leaders look competent since 1980.

he was considered premier statesman until 1990 that's when he started doing the forced land removals.
1980-1990 he was under a agreement with the UK they would pay for land purchases from white farmers, and he would only take white farmers off their land who were willing to leave(for UK money). then he would sell the land to the farm workers who used to farm the land for the whites.
problem was 1990 not very many whites a had sold their land (maybe a dozen every year )
Mugabe wanted involuntary land sales the UK refused to fund it. No funding Mugabe had to use militia men to chase off the whites, but then the militia wants the land and they really don't know how to farm.

Dear Mr. Mugabe,
I would like you to print me a $1 googol($10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 00000000000000000000000) bill. In exchange for this I will give you €50. I think this trade is more than fair.
Yours,
Ifreann

I dunno... by the time it gets printed and shipped out, it might be them getting the better value.

I dunno... by the time it gets printed and shipped out, it might be them getting the better value.

More than likely, but the novelty value of such a note is tremendous.

How is that even possible? You cant do it even if u try.

A correction: that's not a correct calculation.
Inflation per second is rather calculated (inflation per year)^(1/31500000). That is 1.0000015, or 0.00015% per second in this case.

A more interesting figure is inflation per day. That is 1.14, or 14%. It's not exactly record-breaking, IIRC Zimbabwe reached a 50% per day inflation once.

Could you just quickly explain exactly why one uses the root here?

They should unveil a £100,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 bill!

Well, this (http://aes.iupui.edu/rwise/banknotes/hungary/HungaryP137-1milliardBpengo-1946_f-donated.jpg) is the closest anyone ever got to that, 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 pengö.

Um, scary thought: the last time I can remember this kind of inflation was 1920s Germany.

Could someone just as extreme as He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named use this opportunity to take power?

Mugabe is pretty extreme. And they already elected his ass, so they're getting exactly what they deserve.

Um, scary thought: the last time I can remember this kind of inflation was 1920s Germany.

Could someone just as extreme as He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named use this opportunity to take power?

Is it Hitler? I'm not him, but the 'He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named' bit is a clue.

And they already elected his ass

No they didn't.

Um, scary thought: the last time I can remember this kind of inflation was 1920s Germany.

How old are you?

No they didn't.

Mugabe insists that the elections were free and fair, and that he won.

Mugabe insists that the elections were free and fair, and that he won.

Yes, but everyone else knows they weren't.

How old are you?

20, but I'm a student of history.

Mugabe insists that the elections were free and fair, and that he won.

So did Bush in 2000. Though I wouldn't compare Mugabe to Bush. Mugabe would be rightly outraged :p

20, but I'm a student of history.

So that makes you able to remember things from 60 odd years before you were born?

Could someone just as extreme as He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named use this opportunity to take power?

That doesn't work when he's already in power.

Unless you are telling me that Mugabe is really quite a nice chap, if a bit misunderstood, but it's all very democratic and shit and these things are just an unfortunate run of bad luck.

And technically, Hitler came to power during a deflationary collapse.

So that makes you able to remember things from 60 odd years before you were born?

Pssst...he's lying. He's a Time Lord!

Mugabe insists that the elections were free and fair, and that he won.

That's Dr Mugabe to you!

Yes, but everyone else knows they weren't.

Shhh. You're making communism look bad.

Are you a student of history at all, can you tell me, por favor?

That's Dr Mugabe to you!

Oh, you're a doctor, eh?

Um, scary thought: the last time I can remember this kind of inflation was 1920s Germany.

So the real record holders, Hungary 1946 and Yugoslavia 1989-1994, don't count?

(Although I believe Zimbabwe has by now overtaken Yugoslavia)

Shhh. You're making communism look bad.

Oh sorry. Next thing I'll be saying collective farming doesn't work.

Oh sorry. Next thing I'll be saying collective farming doesn't work.

Shhh, dammit!

Oh for yuck's sake...http://generalitemafia.ipbfree.com/uploads/ipbfree.com/generalitemafia/emo-_facepalm__by_Chimpantalones.gif

Oh sorry. Next thing I'll be saying collective farming doesn't work.

In fact...its not just communism that doesn't work, but communists themselves. They just sit in their parents basements all day writing angry blogs in an effort to delegitimise the 'system', while growing a massive beard (its a commie tradition)

In fact...its not just communism that doesn't work, but communists themselves. They just sit in their parents basements all day writing angry blogs in an effort to deligitimise the 'system', while growing a massive beard (its a commie tradition)

Quiet, I throw bombs into the house of bourgeois scum like you!

Does anyone else miss him?

Quiet, I throw bombs into the house of bourgeois scum like you!

Does anyone else miss him?

Indeed I do.
He was so much fun.
He colored everyone's day.
and such a nice shade of red too. ,)

Of course if things go bad in the US and EU, this is exactly what is planned for the last stages of bailout. Just be aware of that. People in glass houses should undress in the dark and all that.

Of course if things go bad in the US and EU, this is exactly what is planned for the last stages of bailout. Just be aware of that. People in glass houses should undress in the dark and all that.

That's why I'm stockpiling tar and feathers.

That's why I'm stockpiling tar and feathers.

I'm verrry long lead. Gold, not so much.

I'm verrry long lead. Gold, not so much.

I have food, supplies, arms and ammunition. I might enslave my nearest unarmed liberal neighbors (I'll tell them I'm instituting Communism - that should make them cooperative). The rest I'll light up with tracer.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20090116/wl_afp/zimbabweeconomycurrency



So, we have a $100,000,000,000,000 bill depreciating at 89,700,000,000,000,000,000,000%.

For reference, that's 2,842,480,924,956,602% per second.

I can't even think that fast.

Even if you assume the Cato institute is way off, and that 231,000,000% is accurate, that's still 439% per minute, or 7% per second (yes, I am rounding, mostly down).

EDIT: Forgot a slash.

SUPEREDIT: Math is not my thing. Vault 10 has corrected me as follows:
It's comforting that the Europeans are establishing new sanctions. I hope these new ones work better than the old ones.

I have food, supplies, arms and ammunition. I might enslave my nearest unarmed liberal neighbors (I'll tell them I'm instituting Communism - that should make them cooperative). The rest I'll light up with tracer.

I'm just going to drive around the desert in a ford falcon and get into fights over cans of dog food.

I'm not one to cling to the past.

Robert Mugabe. Making the result of the world's leaders look competent since 1980.
Not really. More like 1997, when he got involved with the Congo. Terrible, terrible mistake.

Um, scary thought: the last time I can remember this kind of inflation was 1920s Germany.

Could someone just as extreme as He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named use this opportunity to take power?
No, because the Weimar Republic was run by spineless pussies, whereas Zimbabwe is basically someone's own country already. Hopefully he dies of old age soon, thus killing the ZANU-PF vote from people who still look to the Rhodesian civil war and note that what were possibly the right guys won, and vote for them for that reason.

OOoooooooooo... Zimbabwe must be the richest country ever in the history of Man!

OOoooooooooo... Zimbabwe must be the richest country ever in the history of Man!

Hmmm, except that it once had (somewhat different) ties to the UK too, how does Zimbabwe fit in the history of Man (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isle_of_Man)?

And no, most Hungarians were once a whole lot richer.

Hmmm, except that it once had (somewhat different) ties to the UK too, how does Zimbabwe fit in the history of Man (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isle_of_Man)?

And no, most Hungarians were once a whole lot richer.

Damned Attila...

Actually, they think it recently beat Hungary's "prices double every 15.5 hours" inflation.

Actually, they think it recently beat Hungary's "prices double every 15.5 hours" inflation.

I bet the sign industry is booming, if you have to change prices that often.

OOoooooooooo... Zimbabwe must be the richest country ever in the history of Man!

they used to be pretty well off. They sit on perhaps one of the most fertile lands in the world.

they used to be pretty well off. They sit on perhaps one of the most fertile lands in the world.

With the least competent farmers.

Um, scary thought: the last time I can remember this kind of inflation was 1920s Germany.

Could someone just as extreme as He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named use this opportunity to take power?

You dont mean!!!?

http://www.collider.com/uploads/imageGallery/Harry_Potter_NECA_Figures/voldemort_neca_harry_potter_action_figures_series_one.jpg


:eek:

With the least competent farmers.

it was going until unpaid removal.
then he had to give the lands to which ever militia man ran the farmers off. and who would have known shooting things is not a required skill to farm.

Shhh. You're making communism look bad.

Shh, you're mixing up authoritarianism with communism.

No, because the Weimar Republic was run by spineless pussies, whereas Zimbabwe is basically someone's own country already. Hopefully he dies of old age soon, thus killing the ZANU-PF vote from people who still look to the Rhodesian civil war and note that what were possibly the right guys won, and vote for them for that reason.

I wouldn't call a war hero general with a face like this (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/1b/Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-C06886%2C_Paul_v._Hindenburg.jpg/225px-Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-C06886%2C_Paul_v._Hindenburg.jpg) a pussy. Hitler rather succesfully manipulated the Reichstag into giving him power, along with the threat of the SA surrounding the parliment as the Enabling Act was passed. Streisman was quite an effective Chancellor until he died in '29, the same year as the Stockmarket crash which I'm sure you're well aware of. Hindenburgs death was really the nail in the coffin for Germany, as he was the last man with enough power and a hatred of Hitler to really stop him.

I wouldn't call a war hero general with a face like this (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/1b/Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-C06886%2C_Paul_v._Hindenburg.jpg/225px-Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-C06886%2C_Paul_v._Hindenburg.jpg) a pussy. Hitler rather succesfully manipulated the Reichstag into giving him power, along with the threat of the SA surrounding the parliment as the Enabling Act was passed. Streisman was quite an effective Chancellor until he died in '29, the same year as the Stockmarket crash which I'm sure you're well aware of. Hindenburgs death was really the nail in the coffin for Germany, as he was the last man with enough power and a hatred of Hitler to really stop him.

I'd call him senile.

Oh, you're a doctor, eh?

Dr. who?

See folks, whenever you feel bad about the economic situation you can always take a look at good ol' Zimbabwe and think happy thoughts.


More sanctions are not going to work, as much as I hate to say it the George Bush Solution might just be the best one this time, AKA precision guided bombs.

I wouldn't call a war hero general with a face like this (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/1b/Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-C06886%2C_Paul_v._Hindenburg.jpg/225px-Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-C06886%2C_Paul_v._Hindenburg.jpg) a pussy. Hitler rather succesfully manipulated the Reichstag into giving him power, along with the threat of the SA surrounding the parliment as the Enabling Act was passed. Streisman was quite an effective Chancellor until he died in '29, the same year as the Stockmarket crash which I'm sure you're well aware of. Hindenburgs death was really the nail in the coffin for Germany, as he was the last man with enough power and a hatred of Hitler to really stop him.

That's not the Weimar republic. Weimar was from 1918 - 1920.

More sanctions are not going to work, as much as I hate to say it the George Bush Solution might just be the best one this time, AKA precision guided bombs.
That would only end in disaster, I think.

Any intervention really ought to be primarily African in nature, especially since it could only engender yet more ill-feeling towards certain western nations if they went in to another country without much cause and indulged in yet more regime-change. That nation has hardly made any noises towards threatening other nations, nor has it been harbouring international terrorists or stockpiling imaginery weapons of mass destruction. Oppressing their own citizens isn't the best reason to start attacking other nations.

Any change in Zimbabwe, ideally, ought to come from within, although I think there is little chance of that happening whilst good old Mugabe's still in power. As soon as that old sod kicks the bucket, then hopefully there can be some moves towards making Zimbabwe into a functioning country, rather than the international embarressment that it currently is.

As soon as that old sod kicks the bucket, then hopefully there can be some moves towards making Zimbabwe into a functioning country

Or someother nutcase gaining power.

Or someother nutcase gaining power.
True.

One of the other high-ups in Zanu-PF could well come out of the wood-work and seize power after Mugabe's death. Shit, it might well even degrade in to civil war over who suceeds the old bastard, but that could play in to the hands of those who wish to see a better-functioning Zimbabwe, as it would be a good reason to intervene in that nation and attempt to make it better for the ordinary people of that country.

That would only end in disaster, I think.

Any intervention really ought to be primarily African in nature, especially since it could only engender yet more ill-feeling towards certain western nations if they went in to another country without much cause and indulged in yet more regime-change. That nation has hardly made any noises towards threatening other nations, nor has it been harbouring international terrorists or stockpiling imaginery weapons of mass destruction. Oppressing their own citizens isn't the best reason to start attacking other nations.

Plus, why would we get involved? They don't have any oil.

I can't even find an online currency converter. Looks like if you had even a weak American dollar there, you'd be flush.

Plus, why would we get involved? They don't have any oil.
Altruism may kick in for once, as well as an urge to re-gain the USA's good name in the eyes of the rest of the world. I know it's a long shot, but it could happen.

Altruism may kick in for once, as well as an urge to re-gain the USA's good name in the eyes of the rest of the world. I know it's a long shot, but it could happen.

Unlikely. We're just not the sort.

Why in the name of Pete does everyone always say the US has to do something militarily? Everytime the US does something, people hate us for it. Let Europe do something, let other African nations do something, let the US sit home and mind their own troubles!

Why in the name of Pete does everyone always say the US has to do something? Everytime the US does something, people hate us for it. Let Europe do something, let other African nations do something, let the US sit home and mind their own troubles!

I personally think we should leave this to Bhutan.

True.

One of the other high-ups in Zanu-PF could well come out of the wood-work and seize power after Mugabe's death. Shit, it might well even degrade in to civil war over who suceeds the old bastard, but that could play in to the hands of those who wish to see a better-functioning Zimbabwe, as it would be a good reason to intervene in that nation and attempt to make it better for the ordinary people of that country.

You are right, a PGB is a bad idea.

A covert hit squad might not be though since it would get rid of Mugabee with little suspicion and leave the people of Zimbabwe and the rest of Africa to figure it out for themselves? This mess will continue until he is ousted from power, or dies, and will only get worse until it happens. At the current rate waiting for him to croak on his own is a bigger atrocity than interfearing with the natural disorder of things.

Or maybe I'm just tired.

I can't even find an online currency converter. Looks like if you had even a weak American dollar there, you'd be flush.

Yeah.. They're so poor they escape into South Africa.

Why in the name of Pete does everyone always say the US has to do something militarily? Everytime the US does something, people hate us for it. Let Europe do something, let other African nations do something, let the US sit home and mind their own troubles!
Well, it is usually you lot who take it into your heads to make the world a better place for yourselves by going in to countries in order to make them change.

I agree that it probably ought to be Africa who ought to do something about the mess that is Zimbabwe. Anyone else could well be targeted with the claims of neo-colonialism, especially European countries who used to have colonies in Africa, and especially the UK.

That's not the Weimar republic. Weimar was from 1918 - 1920.

You fail history forever!


The term Weimar Republic (De-WeimarRepublic.ogg Weimarer Republik (help·info), IPA: [ˈvaɪmarɐ repuˈbliːk]) is used by historians to signify the democratic and republican period of Germany from 1919 to 1933.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weimar_Republic

I can't even find an online currency converter. Looks like if you had even a weak American dollar there, you'd be flush.

i have half a mind to go live over there like a king, with my many, many tens of pounds.

(ok, have to consider PPP of course, but i still like the idea :P)

I can't even find an online currency converter. Looks like if you had even a weak American dollar there, you'd be flush.
oanda.com offers conversions into Zimbabwe dollars though I have no clue how fast the exchange rate is updated...


1 US Dollar = 17,191,062 Zimbabwe Dollar
1 Zimbabwe Dollar (ZWD) = 0.00000006 US Dollar (USD)

i have half a mind to go live over there like a king, with my many, many tens of pounds.

(ok, have to consider PPP of course, but i still like the idea :P)

You also need things to actually be made for you to buy...

You also need things to actually be made for you to buy...

yeah, that too. helps if the place isn't a shithole.

maybe i should rethink this plan ;)

oanda.com offers conversions into Zimbabwe dollars though I have no clue how fast the exchange rate is updated...

That's the official rate. There is no reliable black market rate anymore.
http://www.swradioafrica.com tries to keep up a bit, but struggles to make any sense of it. So, effectively, banknotes in ZWD have no value, other than what anyone accepting it in payment thinks it represents.