NationStates Jolt Archive

Well catching up on people i knew back in high school and me and one of them started having email conversations.
Me and her back in the day used to do lsd and pot a lot.

Anyways she starts telling me she has found god. not in of itself bad.
Then mentions living in a separate community (yellow flag)
That I should come visit to hear the spirit holy spirit in person(another yellow flag). To be honest I know if it is a cult I really no longer have the power to break those connections and wont even try.

So I wonder what has Nations states General heard about Rose creek village
http://www.rosecreekvillage.com/

and their founder Noah (again another yellow flag)

nver heard of it.

does your friend seem excessively attached to noah and his ideas?

i wouldnt go there if i were you. if its not a cult, she can come see you some time.

Definitely looks like a cult from the website.

I would recommend talking to your friend, though--that's the only way to really know what's going on.

nver heard of it.

does your friend seem excessively attached to noah and his ideas?

i wouldnt go there if i were you. if its not a cult, she can come see you some time.

yes on the first.


no on the second. though she has a daughter now so that might travel sleeping arrangements hard.

Hmm, you should ask her what this religion ask of her.

yes on the first.


no on the second. though she has a daughter now so that might travel sleeping arrangements hard.
ask if she goes to see her parents.

cults keep people from their families.

Hmm, you should ask her what this religion ask of her.

well she is a single mom so she doesn't work.
I also think the father of her daughter might be noah. though non concrete proof on that.

look under the child birth thing, do people like changing their names when they join the "village"? some of the names just seemed... unconventional like, "Haviylah" and "Shiphchah", though i suppose that depends on where you're from.

ask if she goes to see her parents.

cults keep people from their families.

her emails have been very anti her mom.


along the lines of my mom partied. and I used to party. and I am happy to break that chain.

well she is a single mom so she doesn't work.
I also think the father of her daughter might be noah. though non concrete proof on that.

Well, does she have a life outside the cult? Or does the cult encompass her whole life? I mean I have a life outside of my religion.

look under the child birth thing, do people like changing their names when they join the "village"? some of the names just seemed... unconventional like, "Haviylah" and "Shiphchah", though i suppose that depends on where you're from.

i dont know anywhere in the US where that is common, for those names.

Rose Creek Village

Selmer is also the home of Rose Creek Village. RCV is a religious community located on approximately 100 acres (0.40 km2) of land. Members of RCV live in a commune style community and most of the money made through internal enterprises and outside jobs is filtered back into the community pool. It is headed by a man named Noah Taylor who goes on frequent mission trips most recently to Myanmar and India. They recently accepted a guest from the Maasai people of Kenya. The group formerly owned and operated a Deli in Selmer called "Another Realm" that closed in mid 2008. There have been many rumors of "cult like" activity that have been, as yet, unverified. RCV also offers child birth services and has at least 3 midwives on the premises. RCV also owns and operates Yachad LLC. a company which licenses several other businesses including Painting, Solar Solutions, Carpentry, Millwork, Construction, and a Distribution Center all operated by members of RCV. RCV also hosts VillageFest every year, generally on the last week in September. VillageFest is an annual culture and arts festival which includes storytelling, dancing, music, and a petting zoo.

The Rose Creek Village website states:

We are people who believe that Jesus Christ (whom we refer to by his Hebrew name, Yahshua) is really the Son of God and can really do the things he said he can do: that he can deliver us from the ways of this world and create a love and unity within us so startling that it would cause the world around us to marvel and believe.[11]


Totally a cult. Get your gun and break her out.

Whatever you decide to do, don't drink the Kool-Aid.

her emails have been very anti her mom.


along the lines of my mom partied. and I used to party. and I am happy to break that chain.
its almost certainly a cult.

maybe itll be good for her for a while?

is there anything you can do about it?

I wouldn't presume to give (or ask) online advice about something so serious. If you're really concerned, I'd suggest talking to someone or reading books by someone who actually knows something about cults. If you think anything illegal is going on, though, talk to the police. Cults have a way of ending in things like mass suicides, murders, or at the very least fraud or abuse.

Well, does she have a life outside the cult? Or does the cult encompass her whole life? I mean I have a life outside of my religion.

read the women only go to town in groups with a male escort from the village. on a forum

Totally a cult. Get your gun and break her out.

Why are cults the only one to have communes? Other religion should have communes! I want a Pagan commune dammit!

Totally a cult. Get your gun and break her out.

So you want the poster in question to end up getting killed or jailed?

Really, even as a joke, this is retarded advice.

read the women only go to town in groups with a male escort from the village. on a forum

Hmmm, I'm tempted to say that yea it's a cult. A cult usually try to control every aspect, and every minute of their members life.

Why are cults the only one to have communes? Other religion should have communes! I want a Pagan commune dammit!
hmmmm

were the shakers a cult?

yes on the first.


no on the second. though she has a daughter now so that might travel sleeping arrangements hard.
Ashmoria is right. Child or no child, if your friend really avoids leaving the place for any reason then there is a problem. Do you know your friend's family? Have they heard from her, been visited by her?

From the website, it sounds like a cult. It might turn out to be just some newly emerging hippie-ish new church/commune that, if it lasts, will turn more mainstream over time. Or it could go the other way.

And no, you should not go there unless you (a) learn a lot more about it and (b) set up an escape plan, preferably with other friends to back you up on walking out. I'm serious. Better to have it turn out to be nothing and feel like a paranoid idiot that to be alone in a very uncomfortable situation.

hmmmm

were the shakers a cult?

Don't you mean Quakers?

its almost certainly a cult.

maybe itll be good for her for a while?

is there anything you can do about it?

well it has helped her clean up. though she didn't really have a substance problem. yeah she drank and smoke some pot, but she would be responsible with it (aka work the next day, got to drive, etc. )


To be honest. no. dragging her out is kidnapping. So long as she is there of her own free will and the cult leader isn't molesting her daughter.

So you want the poster in question to end up getting killed or jailed?

Really, even as a joke, this is retarded advice.

And what's your advice? Drink Noah's kool-aid?

hmmmm

were the shakers a cult?
Technically, yes, but not an abusive one.

Well catching up on people i knew back in high school and me and one of them started having email conversations.
Me and her back in the day used to do lsd and pot a lot.

Anyways she starts telling me she has found god. not in of itself bad.
Then mentions living in a separate community (yellow flag)
That I should come visit to hear the spirit holy spirit in person(another yellow flag). To be honest I know if it is a cult I really no longer have the power to break those connections and wont even try.

So I wonder what has Nations states General heard about Rose creek village
http://www.rosecreekvillage.com/

and their founder Noah (again another yellow flag)

When in doubt don't ask NSG, ash a proffessional. Rick Ross is a famous cult expert. (http://www.rickross.com/help.html)

My advice is you read the "warning signs" he listed to determine if it is cultic, if you lack information do research first then read the warning signs. If neccessary you can post on his message board or even request assistance.

Don't you mean Quakers?

Or the candelstick makers?

well it has helped her clean up. though she didn't really have a substance problem. yeah she drank and smoke some pot, but she would be responsible with it (aka work the next day, got to drive, etc. )


To be honest. no. dragging her out is kidnapping. So long as she is there of her own free will and the cult leader isn't molesting her daughter.

Most cult leaders are charismatic people who can manipulate people into thinking that they have joined in their own free will, but really they haven't.

Tell me something, did your friend grow up in a broken or dysfunctional home?

Or the candelstick makers?

I thought that was The Amish.

I thought that was The Amish.

They can appear cultish at times.

Don't you mean Quakers?
No, the Quakers (Society of Friends) are a non-cloistered church that did not in any way withdraw from mainstream society. Quite the opposite, in fact.

The Shakers, on the other hand, are a cloistered church that live apart from mainstream society and whose members devote their entire lives to living within their closed community and by its demanding rules. But, like I said, the Shakers are non-abusive. Though they reject the life of the outside world, they do not demonize it in any way, and they never try to stop any member from leaving to rejoin the secular world. Also they don't recruit much, which is why they are practically extinct (that plus their strict celibacy).

Another way to tell the difference between Shakers and Quakers is that the Shakers made amazing furniture, while the Quakers made huge financial fortunes in the whaling industry.

They can appear cultish at times.

At least they keep to themselves.

At least they keep to themselves.

Except when they get arrested selling weed.

No, the Quakers (Society of Friends) are a non-cloistered church that did not in any way withdraw from mainstream society. Quite the opposite, in fact.

The Shakers, on the other hand, are a cloistered church that live apart from mainstream society and whose members devote their entire lives to living within their closed community and by its demanding rules. But, like I said, the Shakers are non-abusive. Though they reject the life of the outside world, they do not demonize it in any way, and they never try to stop any member from leaving to rejoin the secular world. Also they don't recruit much, which is why they are practically extinct (that plus their strict celibacy).

Ahh, well this thread has given me the idea to start a Pagan commune!

Most cult leaders are charismatic people who can manipulate people into thinking that they have joined in their own free will, but really they haven't.

Tell me something, did your friend grow up in a broken or dysfunctional home?

yes never knew her dad, mom had drinking issues.

Ahh, well this thread has given me the idea to start a Pagan commune!

I will join!

When in doubt don't ask NSG, ash a proffessional. Rick Ross is a famous cult expert. (http://www.rickross.com/help.html)

My advice is you read the "warning signs" he listed to determine if it is cultic, if you lack information do research first then read the warning signs. If neccessary you can post on his message board or even request assistance.

This. Don't listen to half-baked ideas online (and I'm including myself in that). If you are worried their is a real problem (and you seem to be), do some research and talk to proffesionals. If you have any concerns about your friend or anyone else being abused/in danger, go to the police. That's what they're their for.

Don't you mean Quakers?
no the shakers

"tis a gift to be simple, tis a gift to be free"

simple durable wooden furniture.

yes never knew her dad, mom had drinking issues.

Yea, cult leaders like to prey on people who come from broken or dysfunctional homes, mainly because they're easier to manipulate, they have some hole in their lives that they need to fill.

This isn't true for ALL people that come from broken/dysfunctional home, but for most of them it does.

This. Don't listen to half-baked ideas online (and I'm including myself in that). If you are worried their is a real problem (and you seem to be), do some research and talk to proffesionals. If you have any concerns about your friend or anyone else being abused/in danger, go to the police. That's what they're their for.
I don't know if there's much point in going to the police unless he can uncover information on which to allege abuse. "She joined a creepy church that I don't like" is not a police matter. Unless members are willing to talk about abuses, I don't see how he could find out about that at all.

I don't know if there's much point in going to the police unless he can uncover information on which to allege abuse. "She joined a creepy church that I don't like" is not a police matter.

Agreed. You will definitely need some evidence for the police to give the matter the time of day.

I don't know if there's much point in going to the police unless he can uncover information on which to allege abuse. "She joined a creepy church that I don't like" is not a police matter.

Well if he communicates with her further and happens to hear anything beyond "creepy church I don't like", this is the appropriate course of action. I mean, anything illegal.

Ahh, well this thread has given me the idea to start a Pagan commune!

I've got a pagan commune that worships Bacchus through debauched drunkeneness.

This. Don't listen to half-baked ideas online (and I'm including myself in that). If you are worried their is a real problem (and you seem to be), do some research and talk to professionals. If you have any concerns about your friend or anyone else being abused/in danger, go to the police. That's what they're their for.



I agree that a professional must be consulted however the police can't do jack if the cultists have good legal footing.

Well if he communicates with her further and happens to hear anything beyond "creepy church I don't like", this is the appropriate course of action. I mean, anything illegal.
Sorry, but I don't see any police force investigating a church on what amounts to nothing but gossip, really.

I seriously think that personal intervention is better at this stage. If it were me, I would be making a concerted effort NOT to lose touch with her, encouraging her to come out of the "village" for visits and see what happens, and make sure she knows that she has someplace to come to -- whether its just for a visit, or if she ever needs to "escape." I'd be trying to keep as much of an eye as possible on her child.

Sometimes, people join cults because they are in trouble, and sometimes it works out badly, and sometimes it doesn't. I know one woman who has been through a lot of hard times, and who has gone in and out of creepy churches and "communities" with her kids, but the point is she comes out of them again, when she doesn't need them anymore. She never gets brainwashed.

I know another person who got cultified enough that he even changed his name to something "Bible-y" and cut off all contact with his family, gave up his work as a photographer, and runs a bizarre blog today. But he's also holding down a steady job in a public library and is in a long-term relationship. Considering that for years beforehand, he suffered from depression so severe he was at risk of suicide and could form no deep intimacies with others, I think his cult experiences have done him good, inasmuch as they saved his life, apparently. Normally, with his kind of trip, I'd be thinking, "Get that guy deprogrammed, stat!", but in his particular case, when I compare where his head was at before, I can't say that.

I think G&D's friend has joined a cult. But right now he needs to be observing and questioning before he panics about it. I think he just needs to be careful not to get dragged into her scene. It's one thing to let her go her way. It's another to seem to endorse it with her.

Maybe it will turn out all right. But if it doesn't, I personally think he will do more good for her by being a connection to the outside for her, for when she needs one, than by going around making a big drama out of her life choice.

Sorry, but I don't see any police force investigating a church on what amounts to nothing but gossip, really.

I seriously think that personal intervention is better at this stage. If it were me, I would be making a concerted effort NOT to lose touch with her, encouraging her to come out of the "village" for visits and see what happens, and make sure she knows that she has someplace to come to -- whether its just for a visit, or if she ever needs to "escape." I'd be trying to keep as much of an eye as possible on her child.

But what if he says something that causes her to break off contact, or drives her deeper into the cult? Isn't their a risk of that if he "questions her beliefs?"

To be honest, I don't know. That is why I try not to give advice about things like this, other than to say go to a professional instead of looking for help online. This is a delicate subject. Of course, weather you talk to the police depends on weather the situation warrants it, and I can't offer an opinion on that without knowing much more than I do about the situation.

Sometimes, people join cults because they are in trouble, and sometimes it works out badly, and sometimes it doesn't. I know one woman who has been through a lot of hard times, and who has gone in and out of creepy churches and "communities" with her kids, but the point is she comes out of them again, when she doesn't need them anymore. She never gets brainwashed.

Good for her. Doesn't mean I'd be happy about a friend of mine doing the same.

I think G&D's friend has joined a cult. But right now he needs to be observing and questioning before he panics about it. I think he just needs to be careful not to get dragged into her scene. It's one thing to let her go her way. It's another to seem to endorse it with her.

I'm inclined to agree. But as I said, this kind of thing can be a tricky and delicate issue. I'm not saying he should panic. I'm saying he probably shouldn't be going to a forum as his only source of advice.

Maybe it will turn out all right. But if it doesn't, I personally think he will do more good for her by being a connection to the outside for her, for when she needs one, than by going around making a big drama out of her life choice.

I agree. I never said he should make a big drama. But I can see how it can be interperated that way, which just goes to prove my point about why I'm hesitant to give advice about situations like this. I hope I've clarified my position.

But what if he says something that causes her to break off contact, or drives her deeper into the cult? Isn't their a risk of that if he "questions her beliefs?"

<snip>
He doesn't have to "question her beliefs." Just find out about her lifestyle, and her kid's lifestyle, and about what her beliefs are. If she won't tell him or keeps pressuring him to visit her but refuses to visit him outside the "village," then he has reason to start hinting around that he's "there for her", etc.


I hope I've clarified my position.
Sure, totally understood. I'm only meaning to give "if I were in that situation, this is what I would think about doing" kind of advice.

Totally a cult. Get your gun and break her out.

Meh. If you ask me, they look more like simple fundies than a proper "cult" (meaning something more brainwashy than the usual). The part about the suspects the social services about the way their kids are treated had is a bit worrying.

Wouldn't go near that shit. Try get your friend outta there.

Well catching up on people i knew back in high school and me and one of them started having email conversations.
Me and her back in the day used to do lsd and pot a lot.

Anyways she starts telling me she has found god. not in of itself bad.
Then mentions living in a separate community (yellow flag)
That I should come visit to hear the spirit holy spirit in person(another yellow flag). To be honest I know if it is a cult I really no longer have the power to break those connections and wont even try.

So I wonder what has Nations states General heard about Rose creek village
http://www.rosecreekvillage.com/

and their founder Noah (again another yellow flag)

I don't want to, right out, say this is a cult. But it looks like one. Keep talking to your friend, but let her be. If she's a part of this commune, *sigh* there's nothing you can do. It's her life anyway.

Its a cult, if you care for your freind try to help her out of it, sure there are some positive aspects but the whole thing in the long run will be a completely bad thing for her, and her baby who's father might be the cult leader.

look under the child birth thing, do people like changing their names when they join the "village"? some of the names just seemed... unconventional like, "Haviylah" and "Shiphchah", though i suppose that depends on where you're from.

I'd be a bit worried about this, since in Hebrew the word refers to female slaves. 'Haviylah' kind of sounds like the Hebrew word for 'Package', but it's not as clear cut as with the other.

go in with a gun, playing jail break by thin lizzy, and rescue her from these happy christian dudes.