NationStates Jolt Archive

I have a dual purpose with this thread. One, to point out how absurd Utah's law on liqour already is, and secondly, to point out how more absurd it could become.

Please note the bolded sections:

http://www.heraldextra.com/content/view/294885/182/

A Republican state senator says he wants to keep alcohol out of the view of minors in restaurants -- at least until it reaches a customer's table. Senate President Michael Waddoups, R-Taylorsville, said children shouldn't be allowed to see liquor bottles or drinks being poured.

"Restaurants are turning into bars," Waddoups said. "It's making it look attractive. Kids see it and wonder what they're missing. I think we need to be a little more strict."

Utah already has some of the most strict liquor laws in the country, a distinction that causes heartburn for the state's $6 billion-a-year tourism industry.

Utah is the only state that requires most restaurants to have a glass barrier, dubbed a "Zion Curtain," that separates customers from bartenders in restaurants that serve liquor. Servers must walk around the bar to serve a drink. Waddoups, however, contends that Utah's liquor laws aren't strict enough. He says he'd like to see a physical barrier blocking the view of alcohol at restaurants and the preparation of drinks or have it all moved into a room that customers can't see.

Waddoups' proposal will be discussed during a legislative meeting Wednesday, although Gov. Jon Huntsman has said the Zion Curtain needs to be eliminated, not expanded. Huntsman says that Utah's liquor laws need to be brought in line with the rest of the country's in an effort to boost tourism and attract talented workers to the state.

Huntsman has pledged to eliminate a state law that requires customers to fill out an application and pay a fee for the right to walk into a bar. In Utah, bars are open to the public, but are considered private clubs. It is the only state in the country with such a law.

However, Waddoups also is opposing any effort to eliminate private clubs because he says they reduce drunken driving and underage alcohol consumption.

Huntsman said he still believes progress will be made to "normalize" Utah's liquor laws, but there likely will be trade-offs.

"The good news is that it's even being discussed in the first place, because it represents we're not maintaining the status quo," Huntsman said.

So, apparently, there's a glass shield between you and the bartender. You have to pay a state license fee to get into a bar, and now they want to replace the glass shield with something not clear so that minors won't be corrupted by drinking being mixed in their presence.

Does anyone see anything bizarre here?

It's always been bizarre there.

That's Mormonism for you.

It's Utah, the Mormon Vatican. What were you expecting? Oh that's right I forgot. Only brown-skinned religious people are zealous and intolerant. Everyone else just the victim of religious persecution.

lolwut?

Silly mormons. First liqour, next up, coffee!

It's Utah, the Mormon Vatican. What were you expecting? Oh that's right I forgot. Only brown-skinned religious people are zealous and intolerant. Everyone else just the victim of religious persecution.

Call me when Mormons fly airliners into skyscrapers.

Alright, Gauthier, Hotwife, can you go do that somewhere else? You're ruining my humorous thread regarding ridiculous liquor laws.

Wait... in an attempt to prevent alcohol becoming more 'attractive' they're going to use elaborate means to conceal alcohol from children, including cool glass barriers?

A fool-proof plan.


It's Utah, the Mormon Vatican. What were you expecting? Oh that's right I forgot. Only brown-skinned religious people are zealous and intolerant. Everyone else just the victim of religious persecution.
Ohhh, shut up.

You're as bad as any other troll on these boards.

I'll keep an eye out. Gauthier, Hotwife... knock it off.

Now then... Seriously...? Do they really think that would work? We have something that is actually equally as asinine as that here in Ontario. Instead of applying to liquor, it applies to the wall where tobacco is displayed. There is a law requiring the wall to be covered. It was brought in last year. It's utterly pointless, just like the wall to prevent alcohol from being in the view of the people of Utah.

It achieves nothing, and only serves to irritate the majority to protect the sensitivities of an overreacting minority who thinks it knows best, when it really only wishes to impose its collective will on the general population. Yet another place on the brink of becoming a nanny state.

Wait... in an attempt to prevent alcohol becoming more 'attractive' they're going to use elaborate means to conceal alcohol from children, including cool glass barriers?

A fool-proof plan.

Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.

Wait... in an attempt to prevent alcohol becoming more 'attractive' they're going to use elaborate means to conceal alcohol from children, including cool glass barriers?

A fool-proof plan.



You can almost hear Homer Simpson or Captain Zapp Branigan saying "Its so stupid, it just might work!"

I'll keep an eye out. Just place nice, guys.

Now then... Seriously...? Do they really think that would work? We have something that is actually equally as asinine as that here in Ontario. Instead of applying to liquor, it applies to the wall where tobacco is displayed. There is a law requiring the wall to be covered. It was brought in last year. It's utterly pointless, just like the wall to prevent alcohol from being in the view of the people of Utah.

It achieves nothing, and only serves to irritate the majority to protect the sensitivities of an overreacting minority who thinks it knows best, when it really only wishes to impose its collective will on the general population. Yet another place on the brink of becoming a nanny state.

Given how the lessons of Prohibition and how miserably it failed seems to be lost on Utah, it's hard to completely dismiss that religious influence might be a significant factor in this rather puritannical law.

I'll keep an eye out. Gauthier, Hotwife... knock it off.

Thanks.

Wow. That's the EXACT OPPOSITE of what they should actually do. Children tend to have a healthier attitude towards alcohol if they are given a proper education about it and are introduced to it gradually by their parents.

out of VIEW? See no evil? Maybe we could get burkas for those liquors who indecently show themselves to eager young eyes.

out of VIEW? See no evil? Maybe we could get burkas for those liquors who indecently show themselves to eager young eyes.

I lol'd

out of VIEW? See no evil? Maybe we could get burkas for those liquors who indecently show themselves to eager young eyes.

Crown Royal had the whole Booze Burka thing going for years.

http://image.linotype.com/fontlounge/fontsinuse/crownroyal.jpg

Now then... Seriously...? Do they really think that would work? We have something that is actually equally as asinine as that here in Ontario. Instead of applying to liquor, it applies to the wall where tobacco is displayed. There is a law requiring the wall to be covered. It was brought in last year. It's utterly pointless, just like the wall to prevent alcohol from being in the view of the people of Utah.

It achieves nothing, and only serves to irritate the majority to protect the sensitivities of an overreacting minority who thinks it knows best, when it really only wishes to impose its collective will on the general population. Yet another place on the brink of becoming a nanny state.

We've got the same idea here in Alberta when it comes to tobacco. At least we've moved away from provincially owned and operated liquor stores, brown bags and the like. Kids aren't that thick, just because something is hidden behind a wall or glass it does not mean it no longer exists.

We've got the same idea here in Alberta when it comes to tobacco. At least we've moved away from provincially owned and operated liquor stores, brown bags and the like. Kids aren't that thick, just because something is hidden behind a wall or glass it does not mean it no longer exists.

Evidence from things like Prohibition, Abstinence-Only Education and The Satanic Verses prove that the more you try to hide and bar some things from people, the more they'll do anything to get their hands on it.

Hahaaaaaoh God, America, what is going on?

Hahaaaaaoh God, America, what is going on?
A brief reading up on the history of Utah might be in order.

A brief reading up on the history of Utah might be in order.

I know they're Mormons, but still, religion has so much power within the politics of the United States.

Crown Royal had the whole Booze Burka thing going for years.

http://image.linotype.com/fontlounge/fontsinuse/crownroyal.jpg

Well yeah there's that... but you can see transparent glass at the top and I'll bet that, when moving around, you can totally see the liquor itself as it splashes lasciviously about. I'm sorry, but that's just totally unacceptable to the parents of Utah.

I thought Oklahoma had stupid liquor laws......but that's just....wow.

Boy you people will complain about anything won't you?

Tough drinking laws, yeah real human rights abuse.


Good to know with all the widespread human rights abuse going on in the world, you still can find time to whine about something so arbitrary.

They don't want their children to see porn. They don't want their children to see alcohol. Violence is okay as long as it's real. If it's video game violence, that's no good either.

Wouldn't it be easier just to keep the children out of sight instead?

They don't want their children to see porn. They don't want their children to see alcohol. Violence is okay as long as it's real. If it's video game violence, that's no good either.

Wouldn't it be easier just to keep the children out of sight instead?

Yeah, but they have laws against locking them up in the basement where they'll be safe.

Yeah, but they have laws against locking them up in the basement where they'll be safe.

Yes, there needs to be at least 7 fire exits... and no beer fridge or they may go blind.

Spray paint the glass barriers. Done.

Boy you people will complain about anything won't you?

Tough drinking laws, yeah real human rights abuse.


Good to know with all the widespread human rights abuse going on in the world, you still can find time to whine about something so arbitrary.

It must be even better for you to know that you, at least, possess the ability to whine about something even more arbitrary: whether other people are "whining" about "something so arbitrary!"

Boy you people will complain about anything won't you?

Tough drinking laws, yeah real human rights abuse.


Good to know with all the widespread human rights abuse going on in the world, you still can find time to whine about something so arbitrary.

Even small violations of freedoms are an insult and a mistake.

Boy you people will complain about anything won't you?

Tough drinking laws, yeah real human rights abuse.


Good to know with all the widespread human rights abuse going on in the world, you still can find time to whine about something so arbitrary.

Have you noticed, nobody's whining, they're just saying it's ludicrous. You're the only one whining.

Well seriously, this doesn't concern most of you, what are you worried about what another state does with their liquor laws?

Boy you people will complain about anything won't you?

Tough drinking laws, yeah real human rights abuse.


Good to know with all the widespread human rights abuse going on in the world, you still can find time to whine about something so arbitrary.

It's not complaining we're doing, we're pointing out the rather large amount of stupid building up in Utah at the moment.

Well seriously, this doesn't concern most of you, what are you worried about what another state does with their liquor laws?

Well shit, one might as well say that the human rights abuses all around the world that you just mentioned don't "concern" most of us either. Should we just not comment on those either (in their relevant discussions)?

Yeah, but they have laws against locking them up in the basement where they'll be safe.

Yes, there needs to be at least 7 fire exits... and no beer fridge or they may go blind.

Maybe optical chastity belts. They're basically lockable blindfolds that protects a child's innocence. There can be little lcd displays on the inside that can provide the child with approved imagery/bible tracts instead of that dirty ol' reality. *nod*

Well shit, one might as well say that the human rights abuses all around the world that you just mentioned don't "concern" most of us anyway. Should we just not comment on those either (in their relevant discussions)?

That's not exactly the same thing. We're talking about a simple privilege here, the privilege to consume something, it's not something as important as say freedom of speech, which is a right.

Well seriously, this doesn't concern most of you, what are you worried about what another state does with their liquor laws?

Why do you care about human rights abuse around the world? It doesn't concern you.

Maybe optical chastity belts. They're basically lockable blindfolds that protects a child's innocence. There can be little lcd displays on the inside that can provide the child with approved imagery/bible tracts instead of that dirty ol' reality. *nod*

That explains it...

http://www.rahafharfoush.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/georgi-laforge.jpg

Well seriously, this doesn't concern most of you, what are you worried about what another state does with their liquor laws?

"First, they came for the cognac, and I did nothing, because I didn't drink cognac.

Then, they came for the wine, and I did nothing, because I didn't drink wine.

And then they came for the whiskey. By then, it was too late to stop them."

:D

That's not exactly the same thing. We're talking about a simple privilege here, the privilege to consume something, it's not something as important as say freedom of speech, which is a right.

Privilege my ass, it's a right.

Why do you care about human rights abuse around the world? It doesn't concern you.

Again, not the same thing, your talking rights vs. privileges

That's not exactly the same thing. We're talking about a simple privilege here, the privilege to consume something, it's not something as important as say freedom of speech, which is a right.

This isn't about consuming alcohol. If you read so much as the first paragraph you'd know they want to make it unlawful for children to see alcohol in restaraunts. It's completely ludicrous and worthy of mockery. And since when did something need to be about "rights" for me to mock the stupidity of?

Oh boohoo you can't go get drunk now and act like a complete moron

Oh boohoo you can't go get drunk now and act like a complete moron

...

Well don't worry, no one will oppress YOUR right to act like a complete moron.

Oh boohoo you can't go get drunk now and act like a complete moron

You can get drunk as much as you want as long as the kids don't see the bottle you're drinking from.

Of note: they can see the drink itself, just not the bottle it was poured from.

Of note: they can see the drink itself, just not the bottle it was poured from.

That's completely retarded. How is that meant to make alcohol less tempting? Now it'll look like it's being brought to you by a magic man from behind the black curtain.

Oh boohoo you can't go get drunk now and act like a complete moron

It is as if you didn't read even a single word of the original post. People can get as hammered as they'd like, just as long as no one other than the bartender gets to see the drink poured.

That's completely retarded. How is that meant to make alcohol less tempting? Now it'll look like it's being brought to you by a magic man from behind the black curtain.

Or out of top hat... actually that'd be pretty cool. :p

Utah isn't exactly known for being sensible...

good lord what proper parent TAKES their children to a place that serves the demon rum?

shouldnt that be grounds for removing them from the parents custody?

Man is there any state that's normal?

Boy you people will complain about anything won't you?

Tough drinking laws, yeah real human rights abuse.


Good to know with all the widespread human rights abuse going on in the world, you still can find time to whine about something so arbitrary.
Good to know with all the widespread human rights abuse going on in the world you can still find time to whine about something so arbitrary as a discussion thread on the internet.
Spray paint the glass barriers. Done.
Legalise vandalism, the kids will do it for you for free.
Well seriously, this doesn't concern most of you, what are you worried about what another state does with their liquor laws?
What we're concerned about doesn't concern you. If this is such a non-issue you can post in a different thread. It'd be a better use of your time.
"First, they came for the cognac, and I did nothing, because I didn't drink cognac.

Then, they came for the wine, and I did nothing, because I didn't drink wine.

And then they came for the whiskey. By then, it was too late........

I drank all the whiskey"

:D
Fixed.
Oh boohoo you can't go get drunk now and act like a complete moron
I think you'll find people in Utah can.
Man is there any state that's normal?

The ones people outside America haven't heard of.

Oh boohoo you can't go get drunk now and act like a complete moron

Youre not paying attention to whats going on, are you?

Man is there any state that's normal?

I'd say Maryland is the most normal state you'll find.:D

I'd say Maryland is the most normal state you'll find.:D

You have Baltimore. That makes you unnormal.

You have Baltimore. That makes you unnormal.
Well-

I-

Erm...

It-

>.>
<.<
*Begins to write up a petition to make Baltimore it's own state* :p

*facepalm*[/thread]

I know they're Mormons, but still, religion has so much power within the politics of the United States.

Utah more than anywhere. I highly doubt this would fly in any other state.

I'd say Maryland is the most normal state you'll find.:D

Your official state sport is jousting. You're weird.

Utah more than anywhere. I highly doubt this would fly in any other state.


I could see it happening here in IL. But thats because roughly 50% of the North of half my state are idiots, and 90% of the Southern half are idiots.

Your official state sport is jousting. You're weird.

Admit it. You're jealous.:wink:

Admit it. You're jealous.:wink:

I kinda am. Jousting is awesome.

Every man needs his vice.

Admit it. You're jealous.:wink:

I am. And not only is jousting your state sport, you could have your state flag all over a jousting match and it'd look right.