NationStates Jolt Archive

Joe the plumber is back and it appears he is appalled by McCain.

BUT!

President Obama is still scary!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/16385;_ylt=Ar4l_n.53et_WWMmlIrlZILZn414

Yes, it is.

Goodbye.

So he wants to be Joe Da president ???

maybe we should listen to him and make Palin president?

yes I am listening to sweet home Alabama hush

John McCain's opinion on the bailout appalled him, so he prefers Sarah Palin? Yeah, her opinions on the bailout (http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=txfqWzGMgmY) really inspire confidence, don't they?

His opinions and thoughts seem very close to the GOP aprés-election line. Strange coincidence, huh?

The "Media" in essence, created Joe The Plumber from various references during the elections as we all know. As long as they find him useful to their cause(s) he will continue his 15+ minutes.

The funny thing is that Joe the Plumber and Sarah Palin have both been in the news more frequently than John McCain, since the election.

As long as the public is willing to indulge in this asinine crap, the media will continue to supply the slop for the trough.

I'm sure he can get a job as an "everyman" pundit now.

Really Joe? McCains stance on the bailout made you feel sick, but McCain and St. Palin inciting race riots was just fine for you?

Thats not suprising.

What a complete and total partisan tool.

If the banks didn't get their bailout, just who the hell was going to loan him the money to start his plumbing business? Vinny the Mouth down by the docks?

Asked why he didn’t leave McCain’s campaign if he was “appalled” by the candidate, Wurzelbacher said, “honestly, because the thought of Barack Obama as president scares me even more.”
Then couldn't he have instead backed Barr/Baldwin/Nader/etc.?

Granted, they're not likely to win at this point in time, but that's only going to continue until more people start supporting and/or voting for candidates outside the two main parties. So long as you keep contributing to the notion of the "lesser of two evils" you're part of the problem.

I'm sure he can get a job as an "everyman" pundit now.
What do you mean by "everyman"?

But yeah, given the nature of celebrity culture in our society, I wouldn't be too surprised if it was easy for him to cash on his fame.

Then couldn't he have instead backed Barr/Baldwin/Nader/etc.?

Granted, they're not likely to win at this point in time, but that's only going to continue until more people start supporting and/or voting for candidates outside the two main parties. So long as you keep contributing to the notion of the "lesser of two evils" you're part of the problem.

People may start supporting third party candidates when one that isnt an authoritarian or a total loon comes along.

What do you mean by "everyman"?

"And now, to see how this development will affect the man on the street, we turn to regular pundit Joe the Plumber for analysis and opinion."

People may start supporting third party candidates when one that isnt an authoritarian or a total loon comes along.
I don't think all third party candidates are necessarily authoritarian and/or total loons, I don't know much about Ralph Nader but from what I've heard he sounds somewhat reasonable; and IIRC, Ron Paul endorsed Chuck Baldwin yet that still didn't seem to transfer the former's popularity to the latter...

I don't think all third party candidates are necessarily authoritarian and/or total loons, I don't know much about Ralph Nader but from what I've heard he sounds somewhat reasonable; and IIRC, Ron Paul endorsed Chuck Baldwin yet that still didn't seem to transfer the former's popularity to the latter...

Because Ron Paul wasnt really popular with anyone but politically uninformed trolls on the internet.

Because Ron Paul wasnt really popular with anyone but politically uninformed trolls on the internet.
I doubt they're even mostly uninformed OR trolls; though I'd be more inclined to believe the former than the latter.

But the relevant point is, surely if he was that popular online, why wasn't that momentum transferred to Chuck Baldwin after the endorsement?

I doubt they're even mostly uninformed OR trolls; though I'd be more inclined to believe the former than the latter.

But the relevant point is, surely if he was that popular online, why wasn't that momentum transferred to Chuck Baldwin after the endorsement?

Because he wasnt actually that popular, and if he was it would have been?

Because he wasnt actually that popular, and if he was it would have been?
He seemed rather popular. I've certainly heard a lot more about Ron Paul than about Chuck Baldwin, and I'm wondering if Ron Paul belonging to one of the main two parties would have something to do with that.

He seemed rather popular. I've certainly heard a lot more about Ron Paul than about Chuck Baldwin, and I'm wondering if Ron Paul belonging to one of the main two parties would have something to do with that.

I think Ron Paul being on the Colbert Report had something to do with it.

I'm sure he can get a job as an "everyman" pundit now.

And he can do a Sunday Show with Jim "Jeff Gannon" Guckert too.

On FOXNews.

I think Ron Paul being on the Colbert Report had something to do with it.
... what?

... what?

Ron Paul's popularity probably had more to do with being on the Colbert Report than being a Republican.

Nadar is more popular than many Republican and Democratic candidates. It takes more than the D or R next to your name.

Ron Paul's popularity probably had more to do with being on the Colbert Report than being a Republican.

Nadar is more popular than many Republican and Democratic candidates. It takes more than the D or R next to your name.
But if Nader is more popular, then why aren't people voting for him? And doesn't that kinda defeat the point about people not supporting third-party candidates because they're waiting for someone who isn't "authoritarian or a total loon"?

And are you implying that most Ron Paul supporters only supported him because they saw him on the Colbert report? I'm thinking if they found enough clips of him in various contexts to rearrange them into youtube videos, they'd probably find out more about him than they would from just watching the Colbert report...

But if Nader is more popular, then why aren't people voting for him? And doesn't that kinda defeat the point about people not supporting third-party candidates because they're waiting for someone who isn't "authoritarian or a total loon"?

Because people dont like what Nader has to offer. Almost every voter knows who Nader is. Doesnt mean they agree with him. Ross Perot also was very popular, but he was batshit insane.

Knowing who someone is =/= Agreeing with them. Nader has tremendous name recognition (maybe I should use that word instead of popularity), but unfortunitally only a small minority agrees with him.


And are you implying that most Ron Paul supporters only supported him because they saw him on the Colbert report? I'm thinking if they found enough clips of him in various contexts to rearrange them into youtube videos, they'd probably find out more about him than they would from just watching the Colbert report...

No, but the Colbert Report gave him huge exposure to an audience that would normally be hostile to Republican candidates, and he used the whole thing to bash the Iraq war. This made him popular with the college know it all hippies. Since then, Ron Paul has been on Colbert several time.

Sure, after they saw him on that, they looked him up. But the only reason, Id wadger, anyone payed any attention to him was because he was on the Colbert Report early on in the primary.

It should have been up ages ago.

I know most people are sick of the guy, but he says and does such entertaining things. He's like the Britney Spears of politics. No one takes him seriously, but damn if it isn't funny when he shows up at a party without his panties on.

Keep it comin', Joe.

I know most people are sick of the guy, but he says and does such entertaining things. He's like the Britney Spears of politics. No one takes him seriously, but damn if it isn't funny when he shows up at a party without his panties on.

Keep it comin', Joe.

If you were suddenly famous, you would probably hire an agent and work it like he's doing.

I know most people are sick of the guy, but he says and does such entertaining things. He's like the Britney Spears of politics. No one takes him seriously, but damn if it isn't funny when he shows up at a party without his panties on.

Keep it comin', Joe.

I see him more as a Bushevik Cindy Sheehan. Except he didn't lose anyone dear to Obama's presidency.

I don't think all third party candidates are necessarily authoritarian and/or total loons, I don't know much about Ralph Nader but from what I've heard he sounds somewhat reasonable; and IIRC, Ron Paul endorsed Chuck Baldwin yet that still didn't seem to transfer the former's popularity to the latter...

Ralph Nader probably qualifies as a loon. Ron Paul qualifies as both authoritairan AND a loon.

But if Nader is more popular, then why aren't people voting for him?

Because he's an obnoxious asshole.

Ralph Nader probably qualifies as a loon. Ron Paul qualifies as both authoritairan AND a loon.
Authoritarian in what sense? He's unusually libertarian for a republican.

Granted though, some views of his I've heard of sound kinda legality-centric, but the same can be said of most mainstream candidates of both parties.

Because he's an obnoxious asshole.

After two terms of Bush, and almost half of the vote still going to McCain, I'm not convinced that's a check AGAINST anyone.

Authoritarian in what sense? He's unusually libertarian for a republican.


And unusually republican for a libertarian?

Because he's an obnoxious asshole.
Then why isn't he less popular? O.o

And in what ways is he obnoxious that wouldn't apply to most politicians?

Then why isn't he less popular? O.o

And in what ways is he obnoxious that wouldn't apply to most politicians?

Nader is like George Lucas. Long, long ago in a galaxy far, far away both men came up with an idea that everyone loved. With Lucas, it was a script for a science fiction movie that became a cultural phenomenon. Nader, pushed for automotive safety such as seat belts.

Both men got drunk with fame and are now doddering about with inane crap as of late.

And unusually republican for a libertarian?
I don't think ideology labels are very meaningful anyway, actually, but he's certainly economically libertarian, and has some beliefs considered socially libertarian that wouldn't even apply to Obama... (I've heard Obama's more in favour of the death penalty than Ron Paul...)

Anyway though, I'm typing this from a library computer (my laptop's broken) and I really should get going now...

Then couldn't he have instead backed Barr/Baldwin/Nader/etc.?

Granted, they're not likely to win at this point in time, but that's only going to continue until more people start supporting and/or voting for candidates outside the two main parties. So long as you keep contributing to the notion of the "lesser of two evils" you're part of the problem.
because john mccain was taking him for the ride.

now that the ride is over, he can say whatever stupid thing enters his head.

Nader has tremendous name recognition (maybe I should use that word instead of popularity), but unfortunitally only a small minority agrees with him.
Well, there are also a lot of people who agree with his positions, but do not think he has the skill-set to start running the country. The Presidency isn't an entry-level job; if Nader had even put in some time in Congress he might get taken more seriously.

I see him more as a Bushevik Cindy Sheehan. Except he didn't lose anyone dear to Obama's presidency.

Well at least he isn't using the death of a person to push his own agenda like Sheehan and Bush did.

Well at least he isn't using the death of a person to push his own agenda like Sheehan and Bush did.

yeah, how DARE that bitch use her son's senseless death to point out that people are dying senselessly?

Well at least he isn't using the death of a person to push his own agenda like Sheehan and Bush did.

I assume you don't have children.

If and when you do, see how you feel about one or more of them dying to serve a lie.

So he wants to be Joe Da president ???

Palin/Plumber '12....*shudders*

Joe (not called Joe) the Plumber (apparently not actually licensed as a plumber(?))?

Yeah, his 15 minutes is more than up. Definitely.

I assume you don't have children.

If and when you do, see how you feel about one or more of them dying to serve a lie.

True and I do have a kid.

One thing that I always thought interesting was the fact Cindy's kid didn't even talk to her about joining up......

Palin/Plumber '12....*shudders*

Well that would lock the trailer vote.

Palin/Plumber '12....*shudders*

'12 congress had proposed requiring a license to be president. so maybe he wont be able to get it.

Authoritarian in what sense? He's unusually libertarian for a republican.

Granted though, some views of his I've heard of sound kinda legality-centric, but the same can be said of most mainstream candidates of both parties.

"Libertarian" in the sense that hes all about the state governments oppressing you and stripping you of your rights as opposed to the federal government.

"Libertarian" in the sense that hes all about the state governments oppressing you and stripping you of your rights as opposed to the federal government.

Lol - so stripping the federal government of powers it has no authority to wield will create oppressive states? saying, "I want less power" is authoritarian?

Lol - so stripping the federal government of powers it has no authority to wield will create oppressive states?

In the sense Ron Paul seeks to achieve.

Besides, "it has no power to wield" is debatable. I know you libertarians live in a world were you are the only ones who understand the Constitution, but trust me, that is not reality.

Lol - so stripping the federal government of powers it has no authority to wield will create oppressive states? saying, "I want less power" is authoritarian?

Keep in mind that without Federal authority, racial integration would have been as hobbled as the United Nations General Assembly.

Keep in mind that without Federal authority, racial integration would have been as hobbled as the United Nations General Assembly.

Most Libertarians would be ok with that.

Keep in mind that without Federal authority, racial integration would have been as hobbled as the United Nations General Assembly.

Riiiight. Racial integration has stagnated terribly ever since the federal gov't started meddling. remember that much of the segregation was due to legislation from the government at all levels.

Riiiight. Racial integration has stagnated terribly ever since the federal gov't started meddling. remember that much of the segregation was due to legislation from the government at all levels.

Yes. The Civl Rights Act and the Federal Supreme Court didnt do anything. States like Alabama would have had racial integration sooner if the Feds had stayed out of it.

God. What "history" do you libertarians read?

Riiiight. Racial integration has stagnated terribly ever since the federal gov't started meddling. remember that much of the segregation was due to legislation from the government at all levels.

Three Words:

Little Rock, Arkansas.

You have taken history lessons, riiight?

I assume you don't have children.
You're not giving people who don't have children enough credit, to associate not having children with that perspective...

You're not giving people who don't have children enough credit, to associate not having children with that perspective...

If I'd have said something like 'you are SO typical of people without children..."

But, I didn't. Because I don't assume that all people without children would think that way - but I do find it a little hard to assume someone WITH children would talk that kind of talk.

At least, someone with children that still talk to them.

People may start supporting third party candidates when one that isnt an authoritarian or a total loon comes along.
Then explain why Ross Perot had to drop out of the race twice to spike his electability. He had everyone looking at a 33 1/3% margin, and was both authoritarian and a total loon.

If I'd have said something like 'you are SO typical of people without children..."

But, I didn't. Because I don't assume that all people without children would think that way - but I do find it a little hard to assume someone WITH children would talk that kind of talk.

At least, someone with children that still talk to them.
Ah ok, fair enough.

Riiiight. Racial integration has stagnated terribly ever since the federal gov't started meddling. remember that much of the segregation was due to legislation from the government at all levels.

This is so ridiculously and outrageously wrong and backwards that I don't know whether to laugh or cry. :eek:

This is so ridiculously and outrageously wrong and backwards that I don't know whether to laugh or cry. :eek:

Laugh. Lets be honost, if you cried over every ridiculously and outragiously wrong thing that was said on NSG, youd be suicidal by now.

Laugh. Lets be honost, if you cried over every ridiculously and outragiously wrong thing that was said on NSG, youd be suicidal by now.
BOOM! HEAD SHOT! XD

Aside from the typos that comment was almost perfect...

yeah, how DARE that bitch use her son's senseless death to point out that people are dying senselessly?

Ah but isn't it interesting that her son didn't talk to her about joining the army? Most kids usually talk to their parents well if they have a good relationship....

Lol - so stripping the federal government of powers it has no authority to wield will create oppressive states? saying, "I want less power" is authoritarian?

Power doesn't lesson. It changes hands. Instead of the "oppressive" government which in theory you can change, you get somebody with his private army telling you what to do.

Europe abandoned feudalism for a reason.

Ah but isn't it interesting that her son didn't talk to her about joining the army? Most kids usually talk to their parents well if they have a good relationship....
you dont know enough about the situation to make a judgement about it.

you dont know enough about the situation to make a judgement about it.

This is the general so we can judge all we want.

Even so I thought it was interesting when I read about that fact.

This is the general so we can judge all we want.

Even so I thought it was interesting when I read about that fact.
it has the potential to be interesting but only because we imagine what the reason might be.

we have no way of knowing what the situation really was.

it has the potential to be interesting but only because we imagine what the reason might be.

we have no way of knowing what the situation really was.

Considering we only have her side of the story sure.

I once hear was NPR talking to her. They chatted with her and eventually they raised the question with her. She stumbled a response and I heard somebody in the background saying "hang up hang up!" Then Cindy started saying "Hello? Hello? I can't hear you!" and then she hung up..

It kind of soured me on her.

Considering we only have her side of the story sure.

I once hear was NPR talking to her. They chatted with her and eventually they raised the question with her. She stumbled a response and I heard somebody in the background saying "hang up hang up!" Then Cindy started saying "Hello? Hello? I can't hear you!" and then she hung up..

It kind of soured me on her.
*shrug*

she should have been more upfront about not wanting to answer such a personal and painful question but she did not owe us an answer.

Considering we only have her side of the story sure.

I once hear was NPR talking to her. They chatted with her and eventually they raised the question with her. She stumbled a response and I heard somebody in the background saying "hang up hang up!" Then Cindy started saying "Hello? Hello? I can't hear you!" and then she hung up..

It kind of soured me on her.

You, uh, got a source for that...? And don't say, "NPR, duh!" I mean a link where we can hear it or a transcript or something better than a sentence fragment, "I once hear was NPR talking to her."

This is so ridiculously and outrageously wrong and backwards that I don't know whether to laugh or cry. :eek:

I mentioned Little Rock, Arkansas and he hasn't posted in this thread since, heh.

*shrug*

she should have been more upfront about not wanting to answer such a personal and painful question but she did not owe us an answer.

Indeed. If the person in back ground kept her mouth shut, I would have left it simply as a bad connection.....

You, uh, got a source for that...? And don't say, "NPR, duh!" I mean a link where we can hear it or a transcript or something better than a sentence fragment, "I once hear was NPR talking to her."

I heard what I heard.

If you don't want to believe it, that's your problem.

Sheehan and her son obviously had different views on the war. While I give my condolences to her for losing her son in the war, I dunno, it just doesn't seem right to use his death for your own political agenda. Something is just dirty about that.

Sheehan and her son obviously had different views on the war. While I give my condolences to her for losing her son in the war, I dunno, it just doesn't seem right to use his death for your own political agenda. Something is just dirty about that.

What's the difference between her and the shrub yabbering on about the sacrifice of heros?

What's the difference between her and the shrub yabbering on about the sacrifice of heros?

There is none, I don't like it when he does it either.

Sheehan and her son obviously had different views on the war. While I give my condolences to her for losing her son in the war, I dunno, it just doesn't seem right to use his death for your own political agenda. Something is just dirty about that.
there are many things about mrs sheehan that annoy me. using her grief over the loss of her son to highlight the wrongheadedness of the iraq war isnt one of them.

its not just a difference of opinion between a mom and her boy, her son died for his support of the war.

as did thousands of other men and women who supported the war. and many more thousands who were wounded. and hundreds of thousands of iraqi men women and children dead, maimed, displaced, running for their lives.

anything that helped mr bush (and the rest of us) remember that is a good thing.

I heard what I heard.

If you don't want to believe it, that's your problem.

It really is your problem since its your argument you want to convey, but whatever.

Ah but isn't it interesting that her son didn't talk to her about joining the army? Most kids usually talk to their parents well if they have a good relationship....

Bullshit on both counts.

It's not interesting, and it's not reflective on the relationship.

When my wife went and did her testing, etc for the Army, she didn't even discuss it with her mom. Why? Pretty obvious - her mom would have freaked the fuck out, and there'd have been extra heartache and stress to deal with.

If Cindy Sheehan was open with her family about how she felt it's not a smoking-gun, nor a revalation, nor even a point worthy of interest, that her son didn't talk to her about joining up.

What's the difference between her and the shrub yabbering on about the sacrifice of heros?

Bush didn't lose anybody he cares about.

Sacrifice of heroes, what a crock of shit. It's an example of the cheap Toby Keith patriotism that grips this nation like a plague. Warfare is ugly, random, and bloody in the extreme, no matter who is fighting it. We'd all be done a favor if our political leaders (of all ideological persuasions) and mass media stopped patronizing the members of our armed forces.

Bullshit on both counts.

It's not interesting, and it's not reflective on the relationship.

When my wife went and did her testing, etc for the Army, she didn't even discuss it with her mom. Why? Pretty obvious - her mom would have freaked the fuck out, and there'd have been extra heartache and stress to deal with.

If Cindy Sheehan was open with her family about how she felt it's not a smoking-gun, nor a revalation, nor even a point worthy of interest, that her son didn't talk to her about joining up.

Meh. Your wife is hardly damning evidence.

You may not find it interesting. I do so again Meh.

It really is your problem since its your argument you want to convey, but whatever.

A comment is not an argument; but whatever.

Sarah Palin for President and Joe the plumber for vice President.

I Miami Shores endorse this message.

Meh. Your wife is hardly damning evidence.

You may not find it interesting. I do so again Meh.

A comment is not an argument; but whatever.

There is a certain amount of contradiction in these posts: "that doesn't refute my argument" vs "I'm not making an argument."

Regardless, I am no fan of Cindy Sheehan, but I refuse to judge her relationship with her son and no matter how strained it may have been (or not as the case may be) she has every right to feel aggrieved at his loss in Bush's little war.

Sarah Palin for President and Joe the plumber for vice President.

I Miami Shores endorse this message.

I think that would make an excellent Republican ticket in 2012!

Virtually guarantees another Obama win. :eek::wink:

I think that would make an excellent Republican ticket in 2012!

Virtually guarantees another Obama win. :eek::wink:

And Obama will make sure Elian stays in Cuba too!

:D

There is a certain amount of contradiction in these posts: "that doesn't refute my argument" vs "I'm not making an argument."

Regardless, I am no fan of Cindy Sheehan, but I refuse to judge her relationship with her son and no matter how strained it may have been (or not as the case may be) she has every right to feel aggrieved at his loss in Bush's little war.

Officially. I am not offering it as an argument to damn her. It was something I heard or read somewhere. Don't remember and well don't really care. She is another whose 15 minutes are gone.

And Obama will make sure Elian stays in Cuba too!

:D

Of this I have no doubt Gauthier.

Of this I have no doubt Gauthier.

Considering Elian wants to stay there.

Considering Elian wants to stay there.

He's not Elian, he's a commie clone. The real one wanted to stay in the USA after he breathed our fresh, freedom air, and after he was returned to Cuba, he set out to sail back to the USA. He drowned...

Meh. Your wife is hardly damning evidence.

You may not find it interesting. I do so again Meh.

My wife is hardly damning evidence?

Of what?

You're the one presenting an anecdote (the son didn't talk to the mom) and drawing some kind of weird mysticism crap out of it... this whole 'don't you find that a bit odd' hokum...

It's not odd. It's not interesting... it just... is. You seem to WANT it to mean something.

I showed a reason why it might not be conjuring spooks, and you find my suggestion of an explanation to not be damning evidence? Why am I presenting 'evidence'? You made the assertion.

Don't you think it's interesting... no! There are like a million possible reasons.

Of this I have no doubt Gauthier.

It's called 'respecting people's wishes'. I'm surprised to see someone consider that a bad thing.

You'd rather he was torn away from his home, to please you?

It's called 'respecting people's wishes'. I'm surprised to see someone consider that a bad thing.

You'd rather he was torn away from his home, to please you?

lol, I would have liked Elian Gonzalez to have grown up in the United States of America where at least I know he is free just like you all are free in the nations your are posting from unlike Cuba under real dictators like Fidel Castro And Raul Castro that is the difference. End of post.

I agree with him that McCain is a monster, and Obama is probably worse. Don't know about Sarah but I don't think she should be anywhere near the white house.

lol, I would have liked Elian Gonzalez to have grown up in the United States of America where at least I know he is free just like you all are free in the nations your are posting from unlike Cuba under real dictators like Fidel Castro And Raul Castro that is the difference. End of post.

Yes, because a nation that's all about freedom wouldn't need to have a detention facility on Cuban soil.

Obama's 15 minutes were up awhile ago.

Obama's 15 minutes were up awhile ago.

http://www.ravenswood.ws/hero/magic/images/Thread_Necromancy.jpg

Obama's 15 minutes were up awhile ago.

gravedig much?