NationStates Jolt Archive

How many of you have experienced a schism in an organization you belong to? This came up because this morning, at my church this morning, our preacher was fired. The elders did this without consulting the rest of us, and, well, that's a recipe for disaster. The end result was that about 3/4 of us walked out of the church, and had our service, with our now-fired preacher, out at the community center. Now we'll be having our services away from the church presumably until our Elders regain their sense, or until we have enough money to start a new building.

How many of you NSGers have had a similar schism in an organization or church that they belong to?

ive never had it happen...im catholic...but it happens all the time.

y'all should probably find a whole nother church to attend. drama doesnt mix well with religion.

How many of you have experienced a schism in an organization you belong to? This came up because this morning, at my church this morning, our preacher was fired. The elders did this without consulting the rest of us, and, well, that's a recipe for disaster. The end result was that about 3/4 of us walked out of the church, and had our service, with our now-fired preacher, out at the community center. Now we'll be having our services away from the church presumably until our Elders regain their sense, or until we have enough money to start a new building.

How many of you NSGers have had a similar schism in an organization or church that they belong to?

If you just didn't go to church you wouldn't be having this problem...
:p

If you just didn't go to church you wouldn't be having this problem...
:p

Oh, har-har. :tongue:

Odd. Did they give a reason for firing him?

I avoid getting involved with organizations enough to be affected by schisms or the far more common infighting and backstabbing. EDIT: My personal experience is that at least as much politicking bullshit goes on as the actual work the organization is supposed to be doing. Getting too involved only leads to me being annoyed by all the stupid soap operas that have nothing to do with why I wanted to join in the first place.

Oh, har-har. :tongue:

Just another example of religion causing problems...

Odd. Did they give a reason for firing him?

I avoid getting involved with organizations enough to be affected by schisms or the far more common infighting and backstabbing.

Actually, it's been building up for the past few months. We've had a new elder who thinks he's king, and the only other two elders always agree with him. We were getting in a new preacher in just a few months, and apparently this elder couldn't wait. So, he fired him. Of course, I only got one side of the story.

lets see Asians American club broke apart on campus.
the old leadership was graduating and the new leadership was trying to take the reigns.
But the old leadership wouldn't give up power so we ended up doing nothing for a semester until no one started showing up for meetings.

In the army a small schism erupted over myself. I received an Article 15 for being late to formation by 10 minutes. this was my first incidence and in 3 years in the unit the first time to receive . the platoon Sergent had made it his duty to get me kicked out of the army 6 months before i got out because i didn't want to reenlist. The commander went along with it. Until the other NCO's in the unit got wind of it.
End result the platoon Sergent got transferred to another unit.

I've had something similar happen but not on such a scale. Just continue what you are doing. The sudden shrinkage of the congregation will probably turn enough of the elders against the power-hungry one to throw him and his supporters out and invite your preacher back. If not...well that's their problem.

How many of you have experienced a schism in an organization you belong to? This came up because this morning, at my church this morning, our preacher was fired. The elders did this without consulting the rest of us, and, well, that's a recipe for disaster. The end result was that about 3/4 of us walked out of the church, and had our service, with our now-fired preacher, out at the community center. Now we'll be having our services away from the church presumably until our Elders regain their sense, or until we have enough money to start a new building.

How many of you NSGers have had a similar schism in an organization or church that they belong to?

The only rational response to this situation is to kill the infidels.

Sorry, I couldn't help myself.

I still say the best solution is to stop attending any services...

Seriously though, you should try and find out both sides of the story, the elders might habve a valid reason for firing him.

I still say the best solution is to stop attending any services...

Seriously though, you should try and find out both sides of the story, the elders might habve a valid reason for firing him.

i went ahead and called them. the priest was molesting the kids.

perils of confusing faith with church? ne?

I've had something similar happen but not on such a scale. Just continue what you are doing. The sudden shrinkage of the congregation will probably turn enough of the elders against the power-hungry one to throw him and his supporters out and invite your preacher back. If not...well that's their problem.
I hope so.
I still say the best solution is to stop attending any services...

Seriously though, you should try and find out both sides of the story, the elders might habve a valid reason for firing him.
I've tried, but I haven't come up with anything. This morning, when someone brought that up (Before we left the church) the elders said he was "Preaching against them". When asked specifically what he had said that was against them, they couldn't come up with an answer.

I hope so.

I've tried, but I haven't come up with anything. This morning, when someone brought that up (Before we left the church) the elders said he was "Preaching against them". When asked specifically what he had said that was against them, they couldn't come up with an answer.

OK, sounds like they didn't have a valid reason...

Find a different church.

OK, sounds like they didn't have a valid reason...

Find a different church.

Well, I pretty much already have. It's essentially two different churches now. We're meeting at some local community center instead.

Can the preacher still make a living?

Sounds worrying for the poor guy...

Can the preacher still make a living?

Sounds worrying for the poor guy...

You read the part where 3/4 of the congregation went with him right?

You read the part where 3/4 of the congregation went with him right?

Yes, but he is paid by the congregation or by the elders?

(This is a Catholic here... we find it pretty much impossible to imagine not having a huge elder structure...)

Just another example of religion causing problems...
Nah. Ban people. No more problems, then.

Can the preacher still make a living?

Sounds worrying for the poor guy...
Well, we've been putting up a collection for him. I hope that gets him through.
You read the part where 3/4 of the congregation went with him right?
The problem is that we were barely able to pay everything when we had Everybody with us.
Yes, but he is paid by the congregation or by the elders?

(This is a Catholic here... we find it pretty much impossible to imagine not having a huge elder structure...)
Congregation. We only have three elders.

I'm assuming that now you have 3 less elders to support and you only need to support the preacher and renting the community center for congregations. It should be easier yes?

Kill the elders.


No man, no problem.

I'm assuming that now you have 3 less elders to support and you only need to support the preacher and renting the community center for congregations. It should be easier yes?
I really don't know yet. They always posted the budget for each week on the bulletin, and seeing as this all happened this morning, we haven't exactly had time to get one out.:tongue:

Kill the elders.


No man, no problem.

Problem: Two of them are war vets.:p

Problem: Two of them are war vets.:p

But theyd be old. You telling me you cant kill old people?

But theyd be old. You telling me you cant kill old people?

Not legally.

Not legally.

Whoa, who here is talking about legality?

Whoa, who here is talking about legality?

Maybe we should get some of your silly string.

But theyd be old. You telling me you cant kill old people?

One's forty-eight or so, the other's 35. I'd be crushed.

One's forty-eight or so, the other's 35. I'd be crushed.

Firearms are the great equalizer.

Maybe we should get some of your silly string.
Or call in LG. I'm sure he'd do horrible things to them with a can of silly string. *Sagely nod*

Firearms are the great equalizer.

Am I the only one becoming uncomfortable with this conversation? I realize it's in jest but, uh, it's still rather uncomfortable.

Am I the only one becoming uncomfortable with this conversation? I realize it's in jest but, uh, it's still rather uncomfortable.

My work here is done.

My work here is done.

You like making me uncomfortable.:(

You sick bastard.:p

You like making me uncomfortable.:(

You sick bastard.:p

No, no: He GETS PAID to make you uncomfortable. Didn't you see him say his WORK there was done? ;)

After reading This thread (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=13862714&postcount=1), my firm belief is that the correct course of action here is to politely ask Katganistan to give the elders a solid kick in the testicles...

No, no: He GETS PAID to make you uncomfortable. Didn't you see him say his WORK there was done? ;)

Who says you can't like your job?:p

How many of you have experienced a schism in an organization you belong to? This came up because this morning, at my church this morning, our preacher was fired. The elders did this without consulting the rest of us, and, well, that's a recipe for disaster. The end result was that about 3/4 of us walked out of the church, and had our service, with our now-fired preacher, out at the community center. Now we'll be having our services away from the church presumably until our Elders regain their sense, or until we have enough money to start a new building.

How many of you NSGers have had a similar schism in an organization or church that they belong to?


I suggest finding a good Church of Christ to attend. ;)

I suggest finding a good Church of Christ to attend. ;)

Y'know what's really ironic about that post?

I'll let you guess. Go ahead, guess.

After reading This thread (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=13862714&postcount=1), my firm belief is that the correct course of action here is to politely ask Katganistan to give the elders a solid kick in the testicles...
But they aren't police horses... ;)

But they aren't police horses... ;)

And I can't afford the beer.:p

Y'know what's really ironic about that post?

I'll let you guess. Go ahead, guess.

Really? that was your church? Hmm, I guess there is the occasional bad apple. But seriously, I've not seen too many problems with CoC, like i've experienced with all other denominations.

Nah. Ban people. No more problems, then.

There we go, Kat's found the solution...

I suggest finding a good Church of Christ to attend. ;)Y'know what's really ironic about that post?

I'll let you guess. Go ahead, guess.

The good part combined with the church part?

It is in the nature of religious and political groups to have schisms because it is a fact that people want to choose their own path. Don't stress about it CM - America was founded by Puritans who broke away from the Church of England that broke away from the Catholic Church.
It happens to friendships too. There comes a point where two people can no longer travel together.
Yes and it nearly always involves painful separation and acrimony.

In the army a small schism erupted over myself. I received an Article 15 for being late to formation by 10 minutes. this was my first incidence and in 3 years in the unit the first time to receive . the platoon Sergent had made it his duty to get me kicked out of the army 6 months before i got out because i didn't want to reenlist. The commander went along with it. Until the other NCO's in the unit got wind of it.
End result the platoon Sergent got transferred to another unit.

I hate douchebag PSGs like that. I've never understood why you'd fuck with someone like that just because they don't want to reenlist. It sure as hell won't change their mind and make them want to.

How many of you NSGers have had a similar schism in an organization or church that they belong to?

I actually caused one.
The NVA, the Dutch Association for Autism, is an organization of parents of autistic children.
PAS, which stands for "Persons in the Autism Spectrum", is the association for adult autistics with a normal or higher intelligence (would be "Aspergers" in US/UK).
We tried to work together, by PAS becoming a part (a "members group") within the NVA.
They, however, did not really take us seriously. We got no assistance to speak of, and, more importantly, were systematically kept out of the decision-making process, requests for having a liaison or member in the [i dunno the correct term in English, is it board, management, well, whatever is the head of an association, I'll call it "board"] were completely ignored, mainly due to the then active "board" members being afraid of having to deal with fresh ideas.
Also, the NVA did nothing for adult autistics, kept on focusing completely on the kids, expecting the about 20 active PAS volunteers to do all the work within an association with 12,000 members and even more than 20 paid employees on theyr part.

So, after two years, I kinda put up an ultimatum: give us a place in the management, or there is no reason for us to stay.
We got a response that boiled down to "we'll let you know in an indefinite amount of time, or maybe a bit longer", so we left, and established PAS as an official, independent, association.
Never regretted that decision, because immediately after we left, the NVA began noticing the adult autistics too, some regional "boards" even got autistic members, and more things like that. Also, we got a number of subsidies that amounted to a multiple of the few bucks we got to work with from the NVA, we can independently make our decisions, and yes, recently the NVA has started approaching us again about cooperation.

Needless to say, this time we are doing the stalling. ;)
Well, actually we're stalling because we've got so much work to do that we can hardly keep up anyway. :(
Speaking of which... lemme start doing some work!

How many of you have experienced a schism in an organization you belong to?

Well, not strictly a schism (this is more strictly a religious thing), but my political party (Comunisti Italiani) was born from a split within Rifondazione Comunista in '98, as my side wanted to vote confidence to the centre-left cabinet led by Prodi, and the majority of the party wanted to vote against. After ten years and a major debacle of the italian left wing (no left-wingers in parliament, for the first time since the end of WW2), there are talks for the reunification of the two parties. Maybe it will happen before the elections for the european parliament.

ive never had it happen...im catholic...but it happens all the time.

y'all should probably find a whole nother church to attend. drama doesnt mix well with religion.

I thought religion and drama were synonymous.

We have three different "socialist" societies on campus, who disagreed on what issues were to be emphasised, how Marxist to be etc. Amusingly, their names are all very similar so it has an unfortunate ring of People's Front of Judea vs. Judean People's Front

I hate douchebag PSGs like that. I've never understood why you'd fuck with someone like that just because they don't want to reenlist. It sure as hell won't change their mind and make them want to.

I had to eat a 14/14... but the knowledge it got him sent away was good enough. it was funny I got called in the middle of extra duty so the commander could tell me that if i want to go ROTC or OCS later he would write me a latter of recommendation.

ive never had it happen...im catholic...but it happens all the time.

y'all should probably find a whole nother church to attend. drama doesnt mix well with religion.

Heh on the contrary drama and reigion are linked from the start. Mummers, ritual, singing, myths and tales, man it's everywhere in religoin.