NationStates Jolt Archive

Alright, hear me out here.

So apparently Congress approves of the 700 billion bailout. Now, I see this going two ways:

First, it works. Everybody is happy. The US becomes the land of sunshine and butterflies once again. Unicorns frolic. Bunnies lay easter eggs. All is good.

Second, it fails.

Now, if it fails, I can only HOPE that it'll act as a wakeup call to the voters out there that the government we have in place is completely in the pocket of the companies in question, and are acting soley for the benefit of those with cash.
Now, I'm not saying there will be an outright revolution in the 'people waving AK's in the streets' sense, but my honest and sincere hope is that the majority of Congress will get thrown out and replaced with, hopefully, people who are less tied up with companies and lobbyists.
You know, that whole 'government by the people, for the people' thing.

Of course, there is the third option which springs from the second:
It fails, and people dont care. This is really the worst option. If this happens, I'm moving to Europe or Japan first chance I get.
At least the Japanese government admits its pretty much owned by corporations and is somewhat competent.

*Prays for #2*

*Prays for #2*
you are HOPING that we throw $700billion down a hole and end up with a destroyed economy and long term depression?

im hoping that the $700bn gets mostly returned to us and that we learn a lesson, re-regulate the financial system and only suffer a long term recession.

All things considered, it probably is the best option, since #1 just leaves us back where we started with no way of moving forward.

EDIT:
The problem is, Congress has apparently already approved of it (from what I know). Now its just got to make it through a vote, during which most of the 'good' bits (IE: Executive pay caps) will get cut out, and maybe it'll get jacked up to 750 billion, 150 billion of which will get 'lost'.
Maybe I'm being overly paranoid there. We're at the point where the government doesn't even need to make excuses for losing huge amounts of cash.

you are HOPING that we throw $700billion down a hole and end up with a destroyed economy and long term depression?

im hoping that the $700bn gets mostly returned to us and that we learn a lesson, re-regulate the financial system and only suffer a long term recession.

All things considered, it probably is the best option, since #1 just leaves us back where we started with no way of moving forward.

Exactly.

no thanks

no thanks
So you'd rather keep most of our senators in the pockets of said companies and continuing to take taxpayers money and throw it all said companies whenever they're in trouble for years to come, cursing your children and grandchildren, not mention yourself?

So you'd rather keep most of our senators in the pockets of said companies and continuing to take taxpayers money and throw it all said companies whenever they're in trouble for years to come, cursing your children and grandchildren, not mention yourself?
yes

i would rather have the bailout work and live in happy butterfly land than have it fail and go through a major economic depression

yes

i would rather have the bailout work and live in happy butterfly land than have it fail and go through a major economic depression

...

Point taken.

yes

i would rather have the bailout work and live in happy butterfly land than have it fail and go through a major economic depression

This. But thats because I dont live in a fantasy land were number 2 has even a remote chance of happening, nor do I live in a fantasy land were His Majesty The Market will save us/correct itself.

Thus, number one is the only way the US will survive.

This. But thats because I dont live in a fantasy land were number 2 has even a remote chance of happening, nor do I live in a fantasy land were His Majesty The Market will save us/correct itself.

Thus, number one is the only way the US will survive.*blub blub*
Corporate socialism! Yay!
Contract on America. 'nuff said.

*blub blub*
Corporate socialism! Yay!
Contract on America. 'nuff said.

*is confused*

*is confused*

Corporate socialism is a commonly used term, although perhaps not completely in line with the meaning of socialism, means, essentially, a country that bails out their corporations no matter what idiotic decisions they make.

This. But thats because I dont live in a fantasy land were number 2 has even a remote chance of happening, nor do I live in a fantasy land were His Majesty The Market will save us/correct itself.

Thus, number one is the only way the US will survive.
its annoying since the last thing i want to do is bail out a bunch of rich guys who overreached themselves.

but they have put us into a very bad spot and im not willing to go down with them just so they can be punished.

Corporate socialism is a commonly used term, although perhaps not completely in line with the meaning of socialism, means, essentially, a country that bails out their corporations no matter what idiotic decisions they make.

I know what it means, what Im more confused about is what his comment had to do in relation to mine...


Really, Im not happy we have to bail these fucks out. Im really not. But if it comes down to a new depression or bailing them out, Im not cutting off my nose to spite my face.

And of course option #2 is assuming the impossibility that any new set of politicians won't sell us out for cash the second they set foot in the cess-pool that is Washington D.C.

I'm just working on getting my degree so I can be a skilled worker somewhere else.

I know what it means, what Im more confused about is what his comment had to do in relation to mine...
Sorry, i should've left only the bottom line there, it mighta made more sense.
Corporate socialism is a commonly used term, although perhaps not completely in line with the meaning of socialism, means, essentially, a country that bails out their corporations no matter what idiotic decisions they make.That.

And of course option #2 is assuming the impossibility that any new set of politicians won't sell us out for cash the second they set foot in the cess-pool that is Washington D.C.

I'm just working on getting my degree so I can be a skilled worker somewhere else.
like where?

like where?

Canada preferably, maybe New Zealand or Australia. My lack of alternate language skills would keep me from going anywhere else, as the only other thing I can speak is bare-minimum Spanish.

Canada preferably, maybe New Zealand or Australia. My lack of alternate language skills would keep me from going anywhere else, as the only other thing I can speak is bare-minimum Spanish.
canada is great but its COLD. horribly cold. cold enough to kill you cold.

the other 2 are good but you should check their immigration policies.

canada is great but its COLD. horribly cold. cold enough to kill you cold.
Mmmmmumbles*Alaska*mumblemumble

canada is great but its COLD. horribly cold. cold enough to kill you cold.

the other 2 are good but you should check their immigration policies.

I've still got 2 years until I'll have my bachelors...going back to school at 27 was certainly an interesting choice, but it's something that had to be done. I know Canada is cold, but...yeah it's just cold, but it's closest to home culturally.

New Zealand is crazy to get into immigration wise, unless you're in a job that they really desire. Luckily, they seem to want engineers of all stripes so my Manufacturing Eng/Robotics degree should do quite well. don't really know enough about Australia yet, but they should be better than N/Z, just because they have a bigger economy, and enough mineral deposits where that should have a good manufacturing base.

he shouldnt go to alaska either. its crazy cold up there!

he shouldnt go to alaska either. its crazy cold up there!
And obviously teeming with crazy people! The crazy cold seeps in and makes the already crazy peoples extra-helping crazy!
...but not bad in bathing suits, bafflingly enough.

canada is great but its COLD. horribly cold. cold enough to kill you cold.

I have actually heard from other Canadians that Tim Horton's coffee will change your DNA to allow one to tolerate their winters.

I have actually heard from other Canadians that Tim Horton's coffee will change your DNA to allow one to tolerate their winters.
is THAT how they do it!

And obviously teeming with crazy people! The crazy cold seeps in and makes the already crazy peoples extra-helping crazy!
...but not bad in bathing suits, bafflingly enough.
they have a tanning bed in every home so they can go to the lower 48 any time and not look dead-white (except for those who arent dead white to begin with of course)

If you don't pay them, they are going to turn off your paychecks and ATM cards. I shit you not. So you will have to pay.

Think of the $700 billion as a downpayment. It's going to cost several trillion to actually recapitalize the system. The good news is that since this bill has no provisions on regulating OTC derivatives, hedge funds will still be able to make good coin.

Is several trillion a lot? Well no, not really, the government can easily afford it by cutting social security, healthcare and education spending. Raising income taxes is also certain.

And those cuts will have to be made, because the government relies on billions of dollars from foreigners to fund the government, and they are not going to tolerate too much deficit spending. So cut it is.

The whole thing is hilarious. I agree that recapitalization is needed, but this is just a stick up.

they have a tanning bed in every home so they can go to the lower 48 any time and not look dead-white (except for those who arent dead white to begin with of course)Sorta. It's more like the post-Cold War nuclear testing shine we have since so much of our territory had been dedicated to experiments and such.

Sorta. It's more like the post-Cold War nuclear testing shine we have since so much of our territory had been dedicated to experiments and such.
hey i live in new mexico (on the upper edge of white sands missile range) i know how that is.

This proposed bailout is ludicrous. We want to continue to bailout the financial market!! This bailout will cost us well over a trillion dollars!!! Does anyone care that this set of bailouts, starting with Bear Strens, the Freddie/Fannie conservatorship, and now this proposed $700 Billion buyout has the potential to cost us TRILLIONS of dollars.

To put this in comparison, our current national debt is almost $10 trillion dollars, eight years ago we had almost 5 trillion in debt. So in the last 8 years we have doubled our debt while drastically cutting taxes and now we want to add another TRILLION, which is a tenth of our current debt, dollars or more to our debt to bailout a market that has preyed on the American Consumer to line their pockets while causing irreparable damage to the mortgage industry and the financial market as a whole.

The only reason why this bailout is being considered is the foreign investors who finance out national debt. They stand to lose tens of billions in the collapse in this market, and on top of that this failure will lessen the value of the dollar drastically. These two disaters combined will cause our government to lose it's ability to endlessly borrow money from the rest of the world.

This bailout, which will be payed using borrowed money, will ultimately protect the government's ability to continue spending our nation to death. I pray that this bailout does not work and our foreign investors stop funding the wasteful spending of our corrupt and bloated federal government. This may finally send a wake up call our government by telling them that they cannot buy their way out of problems, and that they need to spend our tax dollars wisely and efficiently.

I ultimately hope, thought very greatly doubt, that at the least this will awaken Americans to the irresponsibility of the majority of the people we have elected to our federal government. We pay them with our tax dollars while they cut deals for their rich friends, both democrats and republicans are funded by special interests which mean they will never do anything for the American People.

Fortunately there is a choice, while both Sen. Obama and Sen. McCain talk about how they would change America, their is a candidate that represents true change.

Former Senator Bob Barr is the Libertarian Candidate for President. If you, like myself, are sick and tired of a government that continues to generate debt while providing less and less quality public services. If you are tired of the government telling you how to live your life and what to do with your body. If you are tired of seeing our government bureaucracy spend and spend while doing nothing, then I ask you to check out the platform of Bob Barr.

If not, if you believe that our nation is fine and that 10 Trillion of debt combined with no end of deficit spending in sight is fine. That the government's removal of our civil rights and liberties is necessary or the right thing to do. Then go ahead and vote for either of the major party candidates, I say either because overall both are going to do the same thing, they will just do it with a different political spin.

Canada preferably, maybe New Zealand or Australia. My lack of alternate language skills would keep me from going anywhere else, as the only other thing I can speak is bare-minimum Spanish.

If your white (or form a mostly white country). speak good English and have a degree, Australia will in general welcome you with open arms.

yes

i would rather have the bailout work and live in happy butterfly land than have it fail and go through a major economic depression



I am with you. I pray it works perfectly. I also pray I get to keep that $2,000 check I got and still be able to finish school..But we can't always get what we want.

hey i live in new mexico (on the upper edge of white sands missile range) i know how that is.
Yeah, but your state stays warm because of sunlight, not radioactivity. ;)

Yeah, but your state stays warm because of sunlight, not radioactivity. ;)
sure does! its been in the low 80's for the past 2 weeks, perfect fall weather. cool in the morning warm in the afternoon!

i always lived in the north before. i dont think i could ever live in the land of cold and gloom again.

I am with you. I pray it works perfectly. I also pray I get to keep that $2,000 check I got and still be able to finish school..But we can't always get what we want.
ill be happy if it staves off another great depression.

not that im not expecting at least one more major disaster before bush gets out of office. i wonder what else he can fuck up before we are rid of him.

This proposed bailout is ludicrous. We want to continue to bailout the financial market!! This bailout will cost us well over a trillion dollars!!! Does anyone care that this set of bailouts, starting with Bear Strens, the Freddie/Fannie conservatorship, and now this proposed $700 Billion buyout has the potential to cost us TRILLIONS of dollars.

To put this in comparison, our current national debt is almost $10 trillion dollars, eight years ago we had almost 5 trillion in debt. So in the last 8 years we have doubled our debt while drastically cutting taxes and now we want to add another TRILLION, which is a tenth of our current debt, dollars or more to our debt to bailout a market that has preyed on the American Consumer to line their pockets while causing irreparable damage to the mortgage industry and the financial market as a whole.

The only reason why this bailout is being considered is the foreign investors who finance out national debt. They stand to lose tens of billions in the collapse in this market, and on top of that this failure will lessen the value of the dollar drastically. These two disaters combined will cause our government to lose it's ability to endlessly borrow money from the rest of the world.

This bailout, which will be payed using borrowed money, will ultimately protect the government's ability to continue spending our nation to death. I pray that this bailout does not work and our foreign investors stop funding the wasteful spending of our corrupt and bloated federal government. This may finally send a wake up call our government by telling them that they cannot buy their way out of problems, and that they need to spend our tax dollars wisely and efficiently.

I ultimately hope, thought very greatly doubt, that at the least this will awaken Americans to the irresponsibility of the majority of the people we have elected to our federal government. We pay them with our tax dollars while they cut deals for their rich friends, both democrats and republicans are funded by special interests which mean they will never do anything for the American People.

Fortunately there is a choice, while both Sen. Obama and Sen. McCain talk about how they would change America, their is a candidate that represents true change.

Former Senator Bob Barr is the Libertarian Candidate for President. If you, like myself, are sick and tired of a government that continues to generate debt while providing less and less quality public services. If you are tired of the government telling you how to live your life and what to do with your body. If you are tired of seeing our government bureaucracy spend and spend while doing nothing, then I ask you to check out the platform of Bob Barr.

If not, if you believe that our nation is fine and that 10 Trillion of debt combined with no end of deficit spending in sight is fine. That the government's removal of our civil rights and liberties is necessary or the right thing to do. Then go ahead and vote for either of the major party candidates, I say either because overall both are going to do the same thing, they will just do it with a different political spin.


You scare me.

ill be happy if it staves off another great depression.


It doesn't work that way. The choice is between a depression and Zimbabwe. The bailout doesn't 'fix' anything in the wider economy. All it does is keep the banking system intact while the US goes through probably the worst recession since the 1930s.

Banking crises that require government intervention usually result in a 20% contraction of GDP over the next 2-4 yrs. Unemployment usually increases fourfold.

A depression is inevitable. People should at least understand what they are supporting.

oh i know we are going to go through a nasty recession. but im hoping that it doesnt get so bad that the government cant avoid calling it a depression.

oh i know we are going to go through a nasty recession. but im hoping that it doesnt get so bad that the government cant avoid calling it a depression.



I am hoping for neither. Seriously, why would you wish economic death on the country? Why wish that on 300 million people who did nothing wrong? Not to mention the other nations that would get hit over it. Canada.......

With all this, I think it's about time someone removed the current government from power and overturned the political and economic system to start afresh.

I volunteer to be that person.

NSG, help me raise an army to crush all in its path, overthrow the United States Government and all of the major corporations influencing it, and return ultimate power to where it belongs -- in the hands of the people. And by the people, I mean me. After NSG's generous assistance puts me in power (and the members are rewarded by being granted positions of authority), I plan to restore the economy to the human standard, disband all banks and redistribute their wealth into my mattress, invade Canada for its oil, and build a planet destroying superlaser so I can negotiate with creditors.

Alternately, you could just sit around and keep complaining without actually doing anything. It'll probably work just as well.

I am hoping for neither. Seriously, why would you wish economic death on the country? Why wish that on 300 million people who did nothing wrong? Not to mention the other nations that would get hit over it. Canada.......
just trying to be realistic

I am hoping for neither. Seriously, why would you wish economic death on the country? Why wish that on 300 million people who did nothing wrong? Not to mention the other nations that would get hit over it. Canada.......If i may, i don't think she means that so much as how the republican bloviation machine has been extreme in its efforts to paint this circumstance as anything but. For some time now.

im also hoping that the voter backlash against the bailout isnt so strong as to elect a bunch of the asshole republicans who wanted to fix this by repealing the capital gains taxes and insuring securities.

You scare me.

I am sorry that common sense scares you. LOL

I also invite you to explain why my comments scare you.

With all this, I think it's about time someone removed the current government from power and overturned the political and economic system to start afresh.

I volunteer to be that person.

NSG, help me raise an army to crush all in its path, overthrow the United States Government and all of the major corporations influencing it, and return ultimate power to where it belongs -- in the hands of the people. And by the people, I mean me. After NSG's generous assistance puts me in power (and the members are rewarded by being granted positions of authority), I plan to restore the economy to the human standard, disband all banks and redistribute their wealth into my mattress, invade Canada for its oil, and build a planet destroying superlaser so I can negotiate with creditors.

Alternately, you could just sit around and keep complaining without actually doing anything. It'll probably work just as well.
Lunatic Golfballs is first in line by a WIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIDE margin.
Didn't you get the memo?

This proposed bailout is ludicrous. We want to continue to bailout the financial market!! This bailout will cost us well over a trillion dollars!!! Does anyone care that this set of bailouts, starting with Bear Strens, the Freddie/Fannie conservatorship, and now this proposed $700 Billion buyout has the potential to cost us TRILLIONS of dollars.

To put this in comparison, our current national debt is almost $10 trillion dollars, eight years ago we had almost 5 trillion in debt. So in the last 8 years we have doubled our debt while drastically cutting taxes and now we want to add another TRILLION, which is a tenth of our current debt, dollars or more to our debt to bailout a market that has preyed on the American Consumer to line their pockets while causing irreparable damage to the mortgage industry and the financial market as a whole.

The only reason why this bailout is being considered is the foreign investors who finance out national debt. They stand to lose tens of billions in the collapse in this market, and on top of that this failure will lessen the value of the dollar drastically. These two disaters combined will cause our government to lose it's ability to endlessly borrow money from the rest of the world.

This bailout, which will be payed using borrowed money, will ultimately protect the government's ability to continue spending our nation to death. I pray that this bailout does not work and our foreign investors stop funding the wasteful spending of our corrupt and bloated federal government. This may finally send a wake up call our government by telling them that they cannot buy their way out of problems, and that they need to spend our tax dollars wisely and efficiently.

I ultimately hope, thought very greatly doubt, that at the least this will awaken Americans to the irresponsibility of the majority of the people we have elected to our federal government. We pay them with our tax dollars while they cut deals for their rich friends, both democrats and republicans are funded by special interests which mean they will never do anything for the American People.

Fortunately there is a choice, while both Sen. Obama and Sen. McCain talk about how they would change America, their is a candidate that represents true change.

Former Senator Bob Barr is the Libertarian Candidate for President. If you, like myself, are sick and tired of a government that continues to generate debt while providing less and less quality public services. If you are tired of the government telling you how to live your life and what to do with your body. If you are tired of seeing our government bureaucracy spend and spend while doing nothing, then I ask you to check out the platform of Bob Barr.

If not, if you believe that our nation is fine and that 10 Trillion of debt combined with no end of deficit spending in sight is fine. That the government's removal of our civil rights and liberties is necessary or the right thing to do. Then go ahead and vote for either of the major party candidates, I say either because overall both are going to do the same thing, they will just do it with a different political spin.



Would you care to join us in reality?

just trying to be realistic



So am I, I don't believe it will get as bad as some people are fearing.

canada is great but its COLD. horribly cold. cold enough to kill you cold.

the other 2 are good but you should check their immigration policies.

its not that cold dude . .. unless youre in the NWT or nunavut . .. or the yukon. . . or in the north of any province . .. ya. . . ok

Would you care to join us in reality?
If reality hurts as much as it seems to these days (with such obvious help from a party so completely engulfed in falsehood), then perhaps we'll pass?
:(

Lunatic Golfballs is first in line by a WIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIDE margin.
Didn't you get the memo?

Nonsense! LG is totally unqualified to build a planet-destroying superlaser. He'd probably have it launch crotch seeking attack weasels! .... wait ..... *returns to plans and starts drawing*

So am I, I don't believe it will get as bad as some people are fearing.
i do hope not. but so much of the economy under bush (not that its all his fault) has been built "on paper" with mortgage securities and derivatives (that i only have a slight understanding of). with the paper going bad, the housing market tankging as it MUST, i dont see how we cant be in for a world of hurt. the bailout should help to stabilize the financial system long enough for the chickens to come to roost rather than drown immediately.

I am hoping for neither. Seriously, why would you wish economic death on the country? Why wish that on 300 million people who did nothing wrong? Not to mention the other nations that would get hit over it. Canada.......

canada would get hurt . . .bad. . . or economies tied pretty close to the Us of A's we MIGHT not go in to full on depression but it'd still suck

its not that cold dude . .. unless youre in the NWT or nunavut . .. or the yukon. . . or in the north of any province . .. ya. . . ok
ive BEEN to canada. its even kinda cool in the middle of summer.

did i mention that i live in the desert southwest and it was 80 degrees today?

Would you care to join us in reality?

I am in reality, it may not be your reality. I definitely find my self in a very real and very ass backwards United States of America.

I am in reality, it may not be your reality. I definitely find my self in a very real and very ass backwards United States of America.

Like I said, this bailout is required to save the US. Unfortunitally.

Ill keep dealing with the reality, you can keep praying to Our Great Lord, The All Mighty Market to save us.

i do hope not. but so much of the economy under bush (not that its all his fault) has been built "on paper" with mortgage securities and derivatives (that i only have a slight understanding of). with the paper going bad, the housing market tankging as it MUST, i dont see how we cant be in for a world of hurt. the bailout should help to stabilize the financial system long enough for the chickens to come to roost rather than drown immediately.

It's everybodies fault even the democrats. I am just hoping this bailout takes that bad paper off the hands of the banks and keeps their heads above water and we fix what caused this, in hopes of a not so bad recession as our economy rebounds. If it fails I am off to another country. With all the work put into the bill from all sides pray they got this right because we are fucked forever if they didn't.

ive BEEN to canada. its even kinda cool in the middle of summer.

did i mention that i live in the desert southwest and it was 80 degrees today?

oooo hot! hot hot hot . . .I'm goin back to my Igloo!!!

Nonsense! LG is totally unqualified to build a planet-destroying superlaser. He'd probably have it launch crotch seeking attack weasels! .... wait ..... *returns to plans and starts drawing*See, *this* is where the elusive "healthy debate" should be, inspiring creativity and new ideas.

oooo hot! hot hot hot . . .
Randy Marsh?

canada would get hurt . . .bad. . . or economies tied pretty close to the Us of A's we MIGHT not go in to full on depression but it'd still suck


Trade with us makes up about 30% your GDP....Canada would get hammered pretty bad. Last time I checked USA made up 79% of your exports and 55% of your imports. China has a huge stake in our economy as well, hell Japan exports more to us than anybody....A lot of nations would get hammered.

Trade with us makes up about 30% your GDP....Canada would get hammered pretty bad. Last time I checked USA made up 79% of your exports and 55% of your imports. China has a huge stake in our economy as well, hell Japan exports more to us than anybody....A lot of nations would get hammered.

like I said maybe not a full on recession but OW

like I said maybe not a full on recession but OW



Oh it will be a depression, unless Canada starts decreasing that fast. I would set a goal of 35% within 10 years...Won't stage off a huge hit, but will help.

It's everybodies fault even the democrats. I am just hoping this bailout takes that bad paper off the hands of the banks and keeps their heads above water and we fix what caused this, in hopes of a not so bad recession as our economy rebounds. If it fails I am off to another country. With all the work put into the bill from all sides pray they got this right because we are fucked forever if they didn't.
oh hun if we go they go too.

oh hun if we go they go too.

Canada? Yeah, their fucked. The EU may do alright....We are the UK's #1 exporter.....If the EU was a nation we'd be their #1 exporter I think...They get hammered to.

If your white (or form a mostly white country). speak good English and have a degree, Australia will in general welcome you with open arms.

American, but black. I don't consider myself to be of any african descent because I've never been to Africa and my family's been here atleast 6-7 generations now. 2.5/3 ain't bad.

ive BEEN to canada. its even kinda cool in the middle of summer.

did i mention that i live in the desert southwest and it was 80 degrees today?

High of 88 tomorrow in East Alabama, beautiful fall day. Between 75-82 for the next week...fantastic. Actually, Canada's that place with all the white stuff...snow, right? Forgot what snow was, haven't seen it since 2000.

Comination weather and finance report.......
Hey Americans! Why not check out Australia and New Zealand? You's feel remarkably at home over here - except that we drive on the left. It's spring here and the sun is starting to bite a little (depends where you are). Melbourne where I am is rally nice (in the70's - that's fahrenheit).
Oh and by the way the Benelus countries just intervened to prop up one of their ailing bank chains - Fortis I think. But , significantly they partly nationalised the chain.
Throwing money at corporate cowboys is sheer stupidity. Nationalising the banks when they are about to crash makes sens. But governments need to remember - their primary responsibility is to their citizens - not to their shareholders.

High of 88 tomorrow in East Alabama, beautiful fall day. Between 75-82 for the next week...fantastic. Actually, Canada's that place with all the white stuff...snow, right? Forgot what snow was, haven't seen it since 2000.


theres the problem eh?

WE Have great weather this time of year.... and most of the year... but THEY have SNOW and cold and gloom.

screw that. go for australia.

theres the problem eh?

WE Have great weather this time of year.... and most of the year... but THEY have SNOW and cold and gloom.

screw that. go for australia.

Here is the song that we in Australia are thinking of substituting for "Advance Australia Fair" ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKaUL2mtAqA

But seriously guys, take the time to travel. Believe it or not - the world needs more American tourists (if only to poke fun at!):p

Here is the song that we in Australia are thinking of substituting for "Advance Australia Fair" ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKaUL2mtAqA

But seriously guys, take the time to travel. Believe it or not - the world needs more American tourists (if only to poke fun at!):p
its so freaking expensive.

and the plane ride to australia! *shudder*

Well stop over in Hawaii first and go surfing, then go to New Zealand and eat all their superb fish (pronounced "fush" in New Zealand) and then come to Australia.
Hey! We all know you Yanks are loaded - don't come the raw prawn with "expensive", cobber!
But seriously now guys, check out your qualifications and see if they are accepted here and come over for a working visa.
Try Seek online!

i always lived in the north before. i dont think i could ever live in the land of cold and gloom again.

After a year in Kuwait I'm begging to go back to the cold and gloom. When I get home I'm going to roll around in the snow.

its not that cold dude . .. unless youre in the NWT or nunavut . .. or the yukon. . . or in the north of any province . .. ya. . . ok

I lived about 2km from Northern Ontario (in Sault Sainte Marie) and it wasn't all that bad.

did i mention that i live in the desert southwest and it was 80 degrees today?

Places like that fuck with my internal calendar. For example, it was about 110F today and I just really can't internalize that it's September. My body has been convinced that it's the middle of August since I got here last April.

Hopefully you'll be stateside soon New W. In the meantime stay cool (and safe!)

but THEY have SNOW and cold and gloom.

and who says that's bad?

you just try having a sandball fight.... or wearing a greatcoat in all seasons without dying of dehydration.... or skiing on grass! what can possibly compare with the phenomenon of the noises of a million-plus city being slowly silenced and muffled by a coating of snow? And you don't know how hard it is to write dark, depressing poetry in the middle of a sunny day with eighty degree weather.

Alright, hear me out here.

So apparently Congress approves of the 700 billion bailout. Now, I see this going two ways:

First, it works. Everybody is happy. The US becomes the land of sunshine and butterflies once again. Unicorns frolic. Bunnies lay easter eggs. All is good.

Second, it fails.

Now, if it fails, I can only HOPE that it'll act as a wakeup call to the voters out there that the government we have in place is completely in the pocket of the companies in question, and are acting soley for the benefit of those with cash.
Now, I'm not saying there will be an outright revolution in the 'people waving AK's in the streets' sense, but my honest and sincere hope is that the majority of Congress will get thrown out and replaced with, hopefully, people who are less tied up with companies and lobbyists.
You know, that whole 'government by the people, for the people' thing.

Of course, there is the third option which springs from the second:
It fails, and people dont care. This is really the worst option. If this happens, I'm moving to Europe or Japan first chance I get.
At least the Japanese government admits its pretty much owned by corporations and is somewhat competent.

You know, Pakistan tried the same thing last year. It failed miserably and now they're in a depression. :rolleyes:

You know, Pakistan tried the same thing last year. It failed miserably and now they're in a depression. :rolleyes:



Since when does the USA = Pakistan?

Since when does the USA = Pakistan?
Since we started pointing nuclear weapons at India. US Statehood for Kashmir by 2015!!

Since when does the USA = Pakistan?

That's true. Pakistan has considerably less debt.

*snip of OP*

Of course, there is the third option which springs from the second:
It fails, and people dont care. This is really the worst option. If this happens, I'm moving to Europe or Japan first chance I get.
At least the Japanese government admits its pretty much owned by corporations and is somewhat competent.

"Screw you guys, I'm going home."

Except it's more like, "screw you daddy, I'm leaving home."

The Ultimatum of Apathy. "I don't care, and that's your fault! What am I going to do about it? Well, WHAT DO YOU THINK???"
Hmm, I see the last page of posts has pretty much mined this out. Meh, I post anyway.

For those interested in a bit of light reading:

Draft Emergency Economic Stabilization Act of 2008 (http://www.businessspectator.com.au/bs.nsf/Article/Draft-Emergency-Economic-Stabilization-Act-of-2008-JX52Z?OpenDocument&src=is)
The following is a full text, unedited draft of the Economic Stablization Act bill that is before US Congress...

For those interested in a bit of light reading:

Draft Emergency Economic Stabilization Act of 2008 (http://www.businessspectator.com.au/bs.nsf/Article/Draft-Emergency-Economic-Stabilization-Act-of-2008-JX52Z?OpenDocument&src=is)

Yeah, just a bit of light reading. No worries Leon I will polish it off before dinner:p

Since when does the USA = Pakistan?

The USA seems to have some difficulty distinguishing bits of Pakistan from their own territory. Or indeed, from that of a belligerent nation.

well there's a good bit to think about here, and it appears our so called leaders aren't really thinking about it any better then the majority of the rest of us, even if they've come to a conclusion i think most of us wouldn't or haven't, and for once i think most of us have come to the better conclusion, reguardless of wnom, has the deeper understanding.

this is really just another one of those bum's rush power grabs like happened after those 20 guys ripped off four airplanes and knocked down two and a half buildings with them, killing approximately 3000 civilians.

and the vast majority, at least at first, either remained silent of objection to this kind of reaction, or, well, quite a few did enthusiastically go along with the idea of this making a great excuse to destroy the infrasteructure of two and a half countries and somewhere in the neighborhood of a million of THIER civilian population, along with throwing away the lives of FOUR thousand of our own military in the proccess. (that's us as in those of us in the u.s. and the few other countries who'se leadership got suckered into going along with it)

well that one's a done deal as they say, we cannot bring back the senselessly killed (although we COULD stop continuing to kill them).

well now, the thing is, the big deal excuse, is that without throwing away this 700 billion there won't be credit around to create and run 'small' bussinessess. (i wonder if this deffinician of 'small' bussinessess is anything like the one they use for 'small' 'family' farms?)

the point is, lets think about what credit is for a moment. credit = indenture. indenture = slavery.

realestate prices are inflated 400%. have been getting there progressively for several decades, accellerated of course in the last one.

folks it's called a CORRECTION for a rason, several reasons.

the only thing that 700 billion is going to accomplish is making the rest of us that much poorer, but more importantly, making the position of the tyranny of the corporate economy that has usurped government of the people all the more unassailable by conventional means.

if it were really about solving problems wtih the economy, well we've got some people out of work and an infrastructure that needs fixing. a combination that begs for three little letters from about 70 - 80 years ago is it. W.P.A.

that and a temporary suspension of forclosures. no 700 billion bailout required.

so we'll just have to see what we will see, but my message to the little pin headed neo nazi's who want the executive branch of the american government to assume dictatorial control of the entire planet is simply that america IS NOT 'gods kingdom on earth': get over it.

and who says that's bad?

you just try having a sandball fight.... or wearing a greatcoat in all seasons without dying of dehydration.... or skiing on grass! what can possibly compare with the phenomenon of the noises of a million-plus city being slowly silenced and muffled by a coating of snow? And you don't know how hard it is to write dark, depressing poetry in the middle of a sunny day with eighty degree weather.
we get snow. just not here in the valley.

you can go to albuquerque in january with a friend and one of you can play golf while the other goes skiing.

but yeah, no month long gloom to inspire poe-esque poetry.

You know, Pakistan tried the same thing last year. It failed miserably and now they're in a depression. :rolleyes:


Their economy grew over 6% last year and there doesn't seem to be any info on Pakistan even being in a depression at all.

Of course, there is the third option which springs from the second:
It fails, and people dont care. This is really the worst option. If this happens, I'm moving to Europe or Japan first chance I get.
At least the Japanese government admits its pretty much owned by corporations and is somewhat competent.

You do know that the last PM of Japan just resigned not long ago over a complete lack of getting ANYthing done while he was in office.... right?