NationStates Jolt Archive

So nowanddays, you don't even need to carry cash on your person. You can put it all in your bank account and make 99.9% of your purchases using your debit card, or credit card. However, I have noticed there is one thing that still demands that we use cash to pay for it's product. No, I'm not talking about Prositutes, I'm talking about drink machines.

http://www.coastalcanteen.com/customers/106021014274006/images/machine_highvisibilitydrink.jpg

How come the companies who make these machines haven't kept up with the pace of technology? Comon, accept my Debit Card!

What do you guys think, should vending machines allow you to use your debit card to buy a drink, or is using hard cold cash good enough?

Sodas from a machine are already a buck and half to two bucks in shisty places. How much more are you willing to pay for them to be hooked up to some sort of connection to enable them to run your card or for them to pay for Visa use?

drinks machines are designed to eat up loose change hence why they are always on the way out of shops

now drinks machines that serve alcohol...

Actually...I've come across a few that do accept cards. I just think it's taking them a long time to introduce them into the system, because the cash-ones are so numerous and in comparatively good condition. Heck, I've even seen some coin-only machines around. There's a lot of work that needs done, if we want to obliterate cash.

Oh, and my mom nags me constantly about the fact I refuse to carry cash.

At my university, we have accounts linked to our student IDs into which we can deposit money. All vending machines on campus (along with most stores/restaurants in the town) accept the student IDs. It's really convenient-- there's a number of deposit locations on campus, or you can make a deposit online using a credit/debit card, plus you can give somebody "guest" access, which will let *them* make online deposits into your account, but not use it to pay for anything.

Wait, you're supposed to put money in drink machines? Next you'll be suggesting that tipping them over, breaking off the front panel with a crowbar and running off into the night with a sackful of cans is somehow wrong.

Cash is good enough. I'd rather pay in cash when I can. Is a debit or credit card really that more convenient? I'll use it when I don't have the cash or it's going to cost a pretty penny. I prefer cash. It reduces the debt you carry. I find debit takes more time than cash. It's not a time saver especially when you have to key in a pin and wait for the machine to authenticate the payment. And credits cards are no more convenient now. For example, my husband's new VISA has required him to use a pin number now.

Cash is good enough. I'd rather pay in cash when I can. Is a debit or credit card really that more convenient? I'll use it when I don't have the cash or it's going to cost a pretty penny. I prefer cash. It reduces the debt you carry. I find debit takes more time than cash. It's not a time saver especially when you have to key in a pin and wait for the machine to authenticate the payment. And credits cards are no more convenient now. For example, my husband's new VISA has required him to use a pin number now.Debit cards save you the time you take to pick up cash from the cashier or ATM. This is coming from someone that only pays cash.

No, not really. What use would that be?
I don't have a credit card (why on earth people are willing to pay money to be able to spend money is utterly and totally beyond me), and I usually pay cash.

You need cash for most things anyway, plus it's much faster. There's very few things that annoy me more than people paying with credit cards in supermarkets... it takes fucking AGES!!!

Really? This is the kind of thing you think about?

Dude, get a hobby.

So nowanddays, you don't even need to carry cash on your person. You can put it all in your bank account and make 99.9% of your purchases using your debit card, or credit card. However, I have noticed there is one thing that still demands that we use cash to pay for it's product. No, I'm not talking about Prositutes, I'm talking about drink machines.

http://www.coastalcanteen.com/customers/106021014274006/images/machine_highvisibilitydrink.jpg

How come the companies who make these machines haven't kept up with the pace of technology? Comon, accept my Debit Card!

What do you guys think, should vending machines allow you to use your debit card to buy a drink, or is using hard cold cash good enough?

Some do, the ones at my old college accepted both credit cards and your school ID (which was simmilar to a debt card you could put money on it)

I think the big slowdown often is getting the darn t things networked, it can be a pain outside where cable runs are a bit more limited (not that it could not be done)

Debit cards save you the time you take to pick up cash from the cashier or ATM. This is coming from someone that only pays cash.

Yes, it saves time in that respect. But at the same time, you pay a small fee for the convenience. You don't pay that fee if you use a credit card or cash.

I don't have a credit card (why on earth people are willing to pay money to be able to spend money is utterly and totally beyond me)
How do you mean? My credit card is free. (I actually make some tiny amount of money on it since they pay some fraction of a percent of your spendings back as a "reward" at the end of the year.)

How do you mean? My credit card is free. (I actually make some tiny amount of money on it since they pay some fraction of a percent of your spendings back as a "reward" at the end of the year.)

Haven't seen a free credit card around here, ever. They charge you an annual fee for having the card, and interest on what you use it for (and we're not talking small interest, either, most of the ads I've seen make 17% sound like it's the best deal ever...)

Plastic is alright, but it's slow and harder to monitor how much you're spending. It's slower because by the time I've got to the cashier I've normally got the total added up in my head and the correct change in hand. It's harder to monitor your cash flow because I have to actually remember what I spent the money on whereas with cash I simply look in my wallet and see how much is left.

I tend only to use a card when it's a large purchase, online or I want credit card insurance on it.

Haven't seen a free credit card around here, ever. They charge you an annual fee for having the card, and interest on what you use it for (and we're not talking small interest, either, most of the ads I've seen make 17% sound like it's the best deal ever...)Ouch...
My credit card has no annual fee and no interest on purchases providing you pay back in full at the end of the month.

Cash advances and balances transfers though... x_x

You need cash for most things anyway, plus it's much faster. There's very few things that annoy me more than people paying with credit cards in supermarkets... it takes fucking AGES!!!Really? I find I'm not done packing by the time it comes to pay, so it gives me time to continue packing whilst the transaction takes place.

Haven't seen a free credit card around here, ever. They charge you an annual fee for having the card, and interest on what you use it for (and we're not talking small interest, either, most of the ads I've seen make 17% sound like it's the best deal ever...)

http://generalitemafia.ipbfree.com/uploads/ipbfree.com/generalitemafia/emo-cringe.gif

In that case, I agree with you. Obv.

Really? I find I'm not done packing by the time it comes to pay, so it gives me time to continue packing whilst the transaction takes place.
I think that was pretty much her point - it really annoys the people behind you in line. :tongue:

I think that was pretty much her point - it really annoys the people behind you in line. :tongue:They'd still be waiting as I'd still be hogging up the bag area till I was finished packing if I paid in cash. :tongue:

Yes, it saves time in that respect. But at the same time, you pay a small fee for the convenience. You don't pay that fee if you use a credit card or cash.You do? Far as I know, mine doesn't.

No, not really. What use would that be?
I don't have a credit card (why on earth people are willing to pay money to be able to spend money is utterly and totally beyond me), and I usually pay cash.

You need cash for most things anyway, plus it's much faster. There's very few things that annoy me more than people paying with credit cards in supermarkets... it takes fucking AGES!!!

1) Credit cards are paying money to take what amounts to small loans ... can be handy, more so then having to hunt down a bank or a cash machine that does not charge you just to get some cash. Was not a big deal when I used to get phisical checks but direct deposit makes it a pain to do specially with bank hours. Add to that the ability to electronically auto or manually pay every bill I have and it becomes even more handy to have a credit card

2) The only thing I cant use credit card for (and thats only from time to time) is a few bars that dont do tabs downtown. Other then that I have no need for cash.

3) The "paying" part of credit card only comes into play if you don't pay it back (or you were stupid and got one with a high enough limit to have an annual fee)

4) More annoying then credit cards is stupid people counting out their 1's at the store forgetting how much cash they had in hand, and trying to count out change.

Haven't seen a free credit card around here, ever. They charge you an annual fee for having the card, and interest on what you use it for (and we're not talking small interest, either, most of the ads I've seen make 17% sound like it's the best deal ever...)
Interest does not apply to the first month, simply pay it off then.

Its even easier to do when you can have it deduct from savings/checking if you wish. (big deal for me)

They'd still be waiting as I'd still be hogging up the bag area till I was finished packing if I paid in cash. :tongue:

That's what the tables between the check-out and the exit are for...
You don't pack your things at the check-out, holding everybody up. You put everything back in to trolley, and pack it on those tables.

That's what the tables between the check-out and the exit are for...
You don't pack your things at the check-out, holding everybody up. You put everything back in to trolley, and pack it on those tables.We don't get those at UK supermarkets.

I can see your frustration now.

1) Credit cards are paying money to take what amounts to small loans ... can be handy, more so then having to hunt down a bank or a cash machine that does not charge you just to get some cash. Was not a big deal when I used to get phisical checks but direct deposit makes it a pain to do specially with bank hours. Add to that the ability to electronically auto or manually pay every bill I have and it becomes even more handy to have a credit card

I can't honestly say that there's a shortage of ATMs around here. There's one in every corner shop, every petrol station, at every bank and some randomly situated for good measure.
And the only charge you would pay is if you're with a bank that does charge you for taking out money... I don't think very many still do that.


2) The only thing I cant use credit card for (and thats only from time to time) is a few bars that dont do tabs downtown. Other then that I have no need for cash.

Market, bus, taxis, newagents, dry cleaners, the list is very long.

4) More annoying then credit cards is stupid people counting out their 1's at the store forgetting how much cash they had in hand, and trying to count out change.

They seem to be dying out... I haven't seen anyone do that in years now. Now all you get is people trying to decide which card to use, then frogetting their pin numbers, trying again, waiting for the transaction to go through...

We don't get those at UK supermarkets.

I can see your frustration now.

You don't? :confused:
I thought Tescos was from the UK? Have they put those tables in just for Ireland? Surely Aldi and Lidl have them, they have them in Germany and they have them here...

So nowanddays, you don't even need to carry cash on your person. You can put it all in your bank account and make 99.9% of your purchases using your debit card, or credit card. However, I have noticed there is one thing that still demands that we use cash to pay for it's product. No, I'm not talking about Prositutes, I'm talking about drink machines.

http://www.coastalcanteen.com/customers/106021014274006/images/machine_highvisibilitydrink.jpg

How come the companies who make these machines haven't kept up with the pace of technology? Comon, accept my Debit Card!

What do you guys think, should vending machines allow you to use your debit card to buy a drink, or is using hard cold cash good enough?

Drink machines serve two linked purposes - an impulse purchase product, priced at (usually) way more than it's real cost value, but low enough to seem acceptable.

The price of the product at a drink machine is designed to be invisible - you'll drop the money in the machine because it's just change in your pocket. The only real incentive for a credit card drink machine, is to put it where you get a substantially higher casual spend than usual - so... an airport, for example, might be a good place. Or a tourist venue.

(It works on school campuses, because students spend like idiots.)

You don't? :confused:
I thought Tescos was from the UK? Have they put those tables in just for Ireland? Surely Aldi and Lidl have them, they have them in Germany and they have them here...

I haven't been in the mothercountry for a few years, now... but when I was, I never saw a separate staging area for packing your bags. Even in Aldi.

Actually, thinking about it - the Aldi in Leicester was positively American in it's approach to moving you through as quick as possible - they paid people to pack your bags for you, while it was still on the register.

I haven't been in the mothercountry for a few years, now... but when I was, I never saw a separate staging area for packing your bags. Even in Aldi.

Actually, thinking about it - the Aldi in Leicester was positively American in it's approach to moving you through as quick as possible - they paid people to pack your bags for you, while it was still on the register.

They don't do that here...
Only in Supervalue, and sometimes there's kids in Tescos collecting for charity. I don't mind giving to charity, but can't I please do that without having all the eggs cracked and the bread squeezed to buggery cause those stupid kids don't think about putting the big bottle of coke on top of them? :(

I can't honestly say that there's a shortage of ATMs around here. There's one in every corner shop, every petrol station, at every bank and some randomly situated for good measure.
And the only charge you would pay is if you're with a bank that does charge you for taking out money... I don't think very many still do that.



Market, bus, taxis, newagents, dry cleaners, the list is very long.



They seem to be dying out... I haven't seen anyone do that in years now. Now all you get is people trying to decide which card to use, then frogetting their pin numbers, trying again, waiting for the transaction to go through...

Maybe it is a culture difference here cash machines are not as plentiful, and ones not owned by your bank charge you 2+ dollars per transaction.

Well I dont use any of the first of the list but here dry cleaners take credit as well ... I can honestly say while I keep it on hand it is a minority of the time.

And i have not noticed the money counters dying out. personally and most people around here dont force a PIN for authentication

Either way meh

I gave up using credit cards years ago. Filthy, lying, thieving usurers, all of them. Those crooks can bite me.

I use physical cash or my debit card (distant cash) for everything. I use the debit card so much that my signature wore off it, but I don't replace it. Instead I force any inquisitive retailers to look at my ID to confirm I'm the proper cardholder. It's more secure that way. Only a few ever ask.

Physical cash is definitely preferable to plastic because it is a 1-step transaction with no hidden surprises. You pay the price, get the goods, and you're done. No statements to check up on later.

I avoid using a lot of services and conveniences that come with the debit card because of hidden fees. For instance, if you pay with debit/ATM at a grocery store and opt to get cash back, the fee for the cash part of that transaction can be twice what you'd be charged at an ATM machine. Same with those stand-alone ATMs at bars, convenience stores, etc. You should only use a bank's ATM, preferably at an actual bank location. People fail to keep track of such nickel-and-dime fees, and they add up to budget-busting amounts pretty quickly. Other kinds of transactions can also have fees attached that you are not told about up front but which show up on your bank statements later, sometimes as much as $5+.

Remember, kids, money is money. Pieces of plastic are not money.

And the only charge you would pay is if you're with a bank that does charge you for taking out money... I don't think very many still do that.

Did banks used to charge you for taking money out of their own ATMs? Banks here in Australia charge you for taking money out of other ATMs but not their own.

In fact that is the only fee associated with my card and all my bank accounts.

OK, I have to add that I still, on rare occasions, see a type of financial dinosaur that I would dearly love to have be finally extinct: The person who pays with a personal check.

WTF!!! They are standing at the register, filling out fucking miniature forms!! Ye gods!! Don't they realize the planet is revolving? Tempus is fugiting and these idiots are farting around with checks!! Gah!!

OK, I have to add that I still, on rare occasions, see a type of financial dinosaur that I would dearly love to have be finally extinct: The person who pays with a personal check.

WTF!!! They are standing at the register, filling out fucking miniature forms!! Ye gods!! Don't they realize the planet is revolving? Tempus is fugiting and these idiots are farting around with checks!! Gah!!

I would agree, there is 1 and only 1 thing I am currently forced to pay with checks

Rent

I would never ever take my damn checkbook to an actual store unless in dire emergency

Did banks used to charge you for taking money out of their own ATMs? Banks here in Australia charge you for taking money out of other ATMs but not thier own.

It depends on the bank in the US. Whenever I move to a new city, I go bank shopping, and I reject any bank that charges too many fees, especially a fee to use their own ATMs.

At my university, we have accounts linked to our student IDs into which we can deposit money. All vending machines on campus (along with most stores/restaurants in the town) accept the student IDs. It's really convenient-- there's a number of deposit locations on campus, or you can make a deposit online using a credit/debit card, plus you can give somebody "guest" access, which will let *them* make online deposits into your account, but not use it to pay for anything.

This is a great idea, I should bring it up with my student union board, but since all they really care about is that the majority demographic is well looked after, and bitching about how little money they have despite the amount they waste on themselves they wouldn't care about implementing something good into the uni, thank god for VSU.

Back to the OP, I think the reason why vending machines don't have access to this is really due to security and privacy reasons.

They'd still be waiting as I'd still be hogging up the bag area till I was finished packing if I paid in cash. :tongue:

Packing your bags? Stupid European system.

You don't? :confused:
I thought Tescos was from the UK? Have they put those tables in just for Ireland? Surely Aldi and Lidl have them, they have them in Germany and they have them here...I think our local Aldi has what could be construed as a staging area. It looks somewhat like an anorexic breakfast bar.

It depends on the bank in the US. Whenever I move to a new city, I go bank shopping, and I reject any bank that charges too many fees, especially a fee to use their own ATMs.

Too right, and so you should. As for personal checks I do have a check book but I mainly only use t nowadays when sending off a check to a charity.

I would agree, there is 1 and only 1 thing I am currently forced to pay with checks

Rent

I would never ever take my damn checkbook to an actual store unless in dire emergency
Same here. I am forced to write and mail checks for my rent and my health insurance, and both piss me off because as far as I'm concerned landlady and insurer both are being just stubborn in refusing to let me switch them over to automatic electronic payments. I think I've had to reorder checks only twice in 7 years.

Same here. I am forced to write and mail checks for my rent and my health insurance, and both piss me off because as far as I'm concerned landlady and insurer both are being just stubborn in refusing to let me switch them over to automatic electronic payments. I think I've had to reorder checks only twice in 7 years.

My new place does electronic ... don't move in quite yet

Before I paid rent by check I had my old truck and my new car on the same set of check blanks (paid for the whole truck down payment for the car) I bought them 5 years apart ...

I use physical cash or my debit card (distant cash) for everything. I use the debit card so much that my signature wore off it, but I don't replace it. Instead I force any inquisitive retailers to look at my ID to confirm I'm the proper cardholder. It's more secure that way. Only a few ever ask.I had a similar problem yesterday. Only it's because I never signed my card in the first place. What with the advent of chip and pin in the UK I didn't need to. I had to scrabble around in my wallet for some id or something with my signature so I could go see the Dark Knight in an Imax Cinema. It was truly awesome. They should definitely make far more films on 70mm.

Remember, kids, money is money. Pieces of plastic are not money.But then money only has value insofar as we let it have value anyway. It's not like that piece of paper as any real value.

OK, I have to add that I still, on rare occasions, see a type of financial dinosaur that I would dearly love to have be finally extinct: The person who pays with a personal check.

WTF!!! They are standing at the register, filling out fucking miniature forms!! Ye gods!! Don't they realize the planet is revolving? Tempus is fugiting and these idiots are farting around with checks!! Gah!!

I pay with checks. Deliberately, and with maliciouness aforethought.

I always have done - if I didn't have cash to hand, or whatever - but now I absolutely go out of my way to do it.

And, here is why: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKSxp6_dIhQ

I had a similar problem yesterday. Only it's because I never signed my card in the first place. What with the advent of chip and pin in the UK I didn't need to. I had to scrabble around in my wallet for some id or something with my signature so I could go see the Dark Knight in an Imax Cinema. It was truly awesome. They should definitely make far more films on 70mm.
I know someone who, instead of signing her ATM and credit cards, writes "Ask to see ID" on them. She always carries her ID.

But then money only has value insofar as we let it have value anyway. It's not like that piece of paper as any real value.
True, but I meant it more in the sense of how transactions are completed. When the seller gets the money, THEN the transaction is complete. Cards are similar to the dreaded checks in that they are merely instructions to a bank to transfer funds. Between the time you give the instruction and the time the money is delivered, various things can happen for which you may be charged fees you were not expecting. Pay with money, and none of that happens.

And, here is why: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKSxp6_dIhQThat's more of a reason to pay cash than anything else...

I pay with checks. Deliberately, and with maliciouness aforethought.

I always have done - if I didn't have cash to hand, or whatever - but now I absolutely go out of my way to do it.

And, here is why: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKSxp6_dIhQ
You are an evil bastard, but VISA are more evil bastards. :D

That's more of a reason to pay cash than anything else...

I pay cash as well, but checks are slower even than cash... and being slower at the register is the goal.

You are an evil bastard, but VISA are more evil bastards. :D

Right on both counts. :)

See... told you I'm not an Angry Liberal.

I don't get mad. I get evil. :D

And i have not noticed the money counters dying out. personally and most people around here dont force a PIN for authentication

Either way meh

How else do they identify that the person shopping really owns the card?

Did banks used to charge you for taking money out of their own ATMs? Banks here in Australia charge you for taking money out of other ATMs but not their own.

In fact that is the only fee associated with my card and all my bank accounts.

I think they did, years and years ago.
No banks that I know of charge you for taking money out of an ATM, here or abroad. If you take out differnet currency they might apply a change fee.

OK, I have to add that I still, on rare occasions, see a type of financial dinosaur that I would dearly love to have be finally extinct: The person who pays with a personal check.

WTF!!! They are standing at the register, filling out fucking miniature forms!! Ye gods!! Don't they realize the planet is revolving? Tempus is fugiting and these idiots are farting around with checks!! Gah!!

You know, the first time I ever even heard of checks was when I was in Canada... never saw anyone use them anywhere else, though.
What's the point of them?

How else do they identify that the person shopping really owns the card?
In the US, I'm noticing a new trend towards not taking either PINs or signatures if the transaction is small enough. I have absolutely no idea whether that is an idiotic notion borne of economic desperation to keep people spending, or what.

I would agree, there is 1 and only 1 thing I am currently forced to pay with checks

Rent

I would never ever take my damn checkbook to an actual store unless in dire emergency

Why would you need to do that? My BF uses bank transfer, but I've got a standing order set up for the rent.

Wait, you're supposed to put money in drink machines? Next you'll be suggesting that tipping them over, breaking off the front panel with a crowbar and running off into the night with a sackful of cans is somehow wrong.

Well, it's not like the police keeps arresting you just for fun.

In the US, I'm noticing a new trend towards not taking either PINs or signatures if the transaction is small enough. I have absolutely no idea whether that is an idiotic notion borne of economic desperation to keep people spending, or what.

I remember that some shops used to accept signature as proof of ID. But if I'm not much mistaken, that has been outlawed. If you don't have the PIN, you can't use the card.

I think they did, years and years ago.
No banks that I know of charge you for taking money out of an ATM, here or abroad. If you take out differnet currency they might apply a change fee.
Here in New England there is a bank called, ironically, Citizens Bank. Those maniacs are so fee-happy, I swear, if they could charge you half a dollar for touching their front door, they would. They charge fees for some kinds of their debit cards to be used in some ways at some of their ATMs some of the time. They have several different configurations of such fees. I think they're on crack, I really do.

When I moved to Boston, I went to Citizens and announced that I was shopping for a bank, and two of their reps settled down to sell me on all their services. All I heard was a litany of fees. When they got to the "Free Checking" account for which I would only be charged $11 every month, I laughed in their faces and walked out.

You know, the first time I ever even heard of checks was when I was in Canada... never saw anyone use them anywhere else, though.
What's the point of them?
They are what existed before credit cards and debit cards. They are the "old school." A check is a note to your bank telling them to take the designated amount of money out of the designated account and give it to the designated person. Then you give the person the check, and it is up to them to take it to a bank (either theirs or the bank it was drawn on whose name and logo are on it) and "present it for encashment" -- hand it over and get the money.

In addition to taking too much time to write, checks are also a pain if the payee is not quick about getting their money. Having outstanding checks that have not been cashed can make it hard to keep financial records balanced. For instance, it especially annoys me that my landlady will sometimes take upwards of two weeks to cash my rent check. You know, if she doesn't need the money....

Why would you need to do that? My BF uses bank transfer, but I've got a standing order set up for the rent.
In my case, I only have to do it because the payees in question are asses.

My insurer claims not to be equipped to accept electronic transfers, which is the biggest load of horseshit they could shovel out because they are one of the biggest insurance companies in North America. Lying, lazy scum.

My landlady flat-out refuses to accept anything but a paper check, and I suspect this is because she doesn't understand how electronic payments work. But I have to put up with it because (a) she's also my neighbor and (b) she's only raised my rent once in 8 years.

I remember that some shops used to accept signature as proof of ID. But if I'm not much mistaken, that has been outlawed. If you don't have the PIN, you can't use the card.
Credit cards don't use PINs. You have to sign the receipt. It's either PIN or signature, depending on whether it's a debit or credit transaction.

Credit cards don't use PINs. You have to sign the receipt. It's either PIN or signature, depending on whether it's a debit or credit transaction.

Actually I saw recently a bank here in Australia recently announced (within the past month) they had a credit card or that all of their credit cards you could either sign for it or use the PIN, I may not be remembering it properly but if I find it I will post it up here.

I pay cash as well, but checks are slower even than cash... and being slower at the register is the goal.But unlike that comercial, cash is usually faster than cards.

In my case, I only have to do it because the payees in question are asses.

My insurer claims not to be equipped to accept electronic transfers, which is the biggest load of horseshit they could shovel out because they are one of the biggest insurance companies in North America. Lying, lazy scum.

My landlady flat-out refuses to accept anything but a paper check, and I suspect this is because she doesn't understand how electronic payments work. But I have to put up with it because (a) she's also my neighbor and (b) she's only raised my rent once in 8 years.

"Not equipped to accept electronic transfers"? As in, they've got no bank account????


Credit cards don't use PINs. You have to sign the receipt. It's either PIN or signature, depending on whether it's a debit or credit transaction.

:confused:
Ok, that must be a different system over here, then. Cause I know my BF has a credit card, and he does have a PIN and has to use it whenever paying with the card...

So nowanddays, you don't even need to carry cash on your person. You can put it all in your bank account and make 99.9% of your purchases using your debit card, or credit card. However, I have noticed there is one thing that still demands that we use cash to pay for it's product. No, I'm not talking about Prositutes, I'm talking about drink machines.

http://www.coastalcanteen.com/customers/106021014274006/images/machine_highvisibilitydrink.jpg

How come the companies who make these machines haven't kept up with the pace of technology? Comon, accept my Debit Card!

What do you guys think, should vending machines allow you to use your debit card to buy a drink, or is using hard cold cash good enough?

No credit, nor debit card for me, so cold hard cash is all I do. Some of us like the slower pace, heh for some things in life.

Is the cashless society really such a good idea?

I know someone who, instead of signing her ATM and credit cards, writes "Ask to see ID" on them. She always carries her ID.


True, but I meant it more in the sense of how transactions are completed. When the seller gets the money, THEN the transaction is complete. Cards are similar to the dreaded checks in that they are merely instructions to a bank to transfer funds. Between the time you give the instruction and the time the money is delivered, various things can happen for which you may be charged fees you were not expecting. Pay with money, and none of that happens.Ah, that makes much more sense. I think I made that point also - easier to keep track of money and everything.

You know, the first time I ever even heard of checks was when I was in Canada... never saw anyone use them anywhere else, though.
What's the point of them?They don't have a point anymore. Well I suppose I pay my driving instructor by cheque. It's easier than cash and it's not like he carries a little card reader around with him. And it also means I don't have to worry about canceling a standing order.

I seem to remember though that cheques played a heavy part in the advent of paper money. They were formal IOUs that would be honoured by banks. Then people got around to not bothering to cash them, but using cheques given to them to pay for things they wanted as they were much lighter than a bag of coins. At least I think that's right.

Actually I saw recently a bank here in Australia recently announced (within the past month) they had a credit card or that all of their credit cards you could either sign for it or use the PIN, I may not be remembering it properly but if I find it I will post it up here.
I suppose PINs are more secure because cashiers seldom check signatures to make sure receipt matches card, but a false PIN will be rejected automatically. I wouldn't know about credit cards anymore. I'm strictly a debit-user and that's PINs only.

:confused:
Ok, that must be a different system over here, then. Cause I know my BF has a credit card, and he does have a PIN and has to use it whenever paying with the card...Chip and PIN is a UK/Ireland scheme. I don't think the idea of using pins to authorise transactions is anywhere near as prevalent in other places.

I suppose PINs are more secure because cashiers seldom check signatures to make sure receipt matches card, but a false PIN will be rejected automatically. I wouldn't know about credit cards anymore. I'm strictly a debit-user and that's PINs only.Aye. My Mum and Dad have let me use their cards to buy things for them before. I can't even forge my Dad's signature properly...

But unlike that comercial, cash is usually faster than cards.
Heh, true, provided the cashier knows what money is. I once handed over a $10.00 dollar bill to pay a grocery charge of $8.97, and for some reason the register failed to display the amount of change due, and the cashier got so confused he had to call a manager to figure out how much change he should give me. That took a while.

I suppose PINs are more secure because cashiers seldom check signatures to make sure receipt matches card, but a false PIN will be rejected automatically. I wouldn't know about credit cards anymore. I'm strictly a debit-user and that's PINs only.

Yeah I use a debit card, but I usually just place it under credit rather than savings account as I don't have to worry about the PIN. You are right about cashiers not checking the signiture the amount of things I could have done if I was a bit more dishonest really it doesn't make you feel secure if your card is stolen.

Heh, true, provided the cashier knows what money is. I once handed over a $10.00 dollar bill to pay a grocery charge of $8.97, and for some reason the register failed to display the amount of change due, and the cashier got so confused he had to call a manager to figure out how much change he should give me. That took a while.

lol, well that is the school system nowadays for you. They just don't teach kids to do basic arithmetic in their heads nowadays, it is all calculators and software programs so you don't have to know that 10-8.97=1.03 all you have to know is how to program into the calculator or type it up on an Excel sheet. *continues grumbling about today's school system*

How come the companies who make these machines haven't kept up with the pace of technology? Comon, accept my Debit Card!

What do you guys think, should vending machines allow you to use your debit card to buy a drink, or is using hard cold cash good enough?

Back here there are vending machines that operate by cell phone, ie. the payment goes into your phone bill.

lol, well that is the school system nowadays for you. They just don't teach kids to do basic arithmetic in their heads nowadays, it is all calculators and software programs so you don't have to know that 10-8.97=1.03 all you have to know is how to program into the calculator or type it up on an Excel sheet. *continues grumbling about today's school system*

Meh I don't know, but I do know that at my childrens school part of their maths lesson is dedicated to 'mental maths'.

Meh I don't know, but I do know that at my childrens school part of their maths lesson is dedicated to 'mental maths'.

Well that is good, and I did go a bit over the top. But I recently did a statistics course at university as part of my degree and before I did a lot of the calculations I knew what a ball park figure would be and knew that it should land close to that number, others who really didn't have the skills to do mental maths would accidentally press a wrong button or something but then not realise that they were wrong even when the number was no where near what you would even expect.

Well that is good, and I did go a bit over the top. But I recently did a statistics course at university as part of my degree and before I did a lot of the calculations I knew what a ball park figure would be and knew that it should land close to that number, others who really didn't have the skills to do mental maths would accidentally press a wrong button or something but then not realise that they were wrong even when the number was no where near what you would even expect.

Heh yeah you have to have some head for maths really.

Heh yeah you have to have some head for maths really.

True but I think that the vast majority of people should be able to work out that 10-8.95=1.05 but then that's just my opinion.

Credit cards don't use PINs. You have to sign the receipt. It's either PIN or signature, depending on whether it's a debit or credit transaction.

In the UK (and probably in the Republic, too), you have to use a PIN with both types of card.

lol, well that is the school system nowadays for you. They just don't teach kids to do basic arithmetic in their heads nowadays, it is all calculators and software programs so you don't have to know that 10-8.97=1.03 all you have to know is how to program into the calculator or type it up on an Excel sheet. *continues grumbling about today's school system*It's different in the States now. They try to teach kids what the coins mean a year early so they can claim they did something for No Child Left Behind, even though the kids clearly struggle with it.

True but I think that the vast majority of people should be able to work out that 10-8.95=1.05 but then that's just my opinion.
Or a person could "count back." I worked in retail for a long time. The way I was taught is that if the charge is $8.97, and the customer hands you $10, you place the change into their hand counting it up from $8.97 to $10, thusly:

"Your total is $8.97." (they give you $10) "Out of 10" (give them the pennies) "That's 9" (give them the dollar and the receipt) "And 10. Thank you very much, have a nice day. Can I help who's next, please?"

It's called "counting back change" from what they owe you to what they gave you. (EDIT: And if you remember to put what they gave on top of the cash drawer rather than in it until you have counted back the change, it kills all attempts to scam money by claiming "I gave you a 20.")

In the UK (and probably in the Republic, too), you have to use a PIN with both types of card.
Yeah, I'm coming to realize that.

Or a person could "count back." I worked in retail for a long time. The way I was taught is that if the charge is $8.97, and the customer hands you $10, you place the change into their hand counting it up from $8.97 to $10, thusly:

"Your total is $8.97." (they give you $10) "Out of 10" (give them the pennies) "That's 9" (give them the dollar and the receipt) "And 10. Thank you very much, have a nice day. Can I help who's next, please?"

It's called "counting back change" from what they owe you to what they gave you. (EDIT: And if you remember to put what they gave on top of the cash drawer rather than in it until you have counted back the change, it kills all attempts to scam money by claiming "I gave you a 20.")

Many, many years ago I was a butcher by trade, and doing that done wonders for my maths.

Many, many years ago I was a butcher by trade, and doing that done wonders for my maths.But it left your English lacking? :eek: :hail:

But it left your English lacking? :eek: :hail:

Naaa my Enlgish is fine, my dyslexcia just sorta gets in the way:D

I make all my purchases with cash.

I don't want to have to have a debit card to buy a freaking soda at the emergency room.

The only time I use my debit is to get cash out on payday and to pay for things online.

credit and debit cards are soo convienent that people end up spending more than they should. that is bad.

I use cash when I can and tend to lock up my credit cards.

FYI: Debit cards do nothing for your credit score. so if you think that you're improving your Credit rating by using a debit card... guess again.

even those Visa Debit cards, where you load them up like a gift card are for shit. they got so many fees and hidden costs that you end up with less on the card than what you put on it.

I got one of those as a 'bonus' from my company. a $15 visa debit card. I could buy $10 worth of stuff due to the usage fees tacked on. add to that a call to check your balance also has a fee... each time you check your balance. Totally worthless.

and nowdays, you have it so that the clerk doesn't need to check your signature. I have "Check ID" on my card and less than 10% of the stores I go to read that.

<snip>

FYI: Debit cards do nothing for your credit score. so if you think that you're improving your Credit rating by using a debit card... guess again.

<snip>
Same can be said of cash. I still prefer both of them to playing the debt management game.

Btw, I agree with the rest of your post. Good points.

I use cash about 70% of the time or so. All other transactions are with my debit card. I don't use credit.

I never carry cash, so I always use my credit cards or debit card. It's more convenient.

Same can be said of cash. I still prefer both of them to playing the debt management game.

Btw, I agree with the rest of your post. Good points.

except that for most people, they don't know that using debit cards does nothing for their credit score.

they think that Debit Cards also affects one's credit score.

I use my credit card for any purchase that I can.

So nowanddays, you don't even need to carry cash on your person. You can put it all in your bank account and make 99.9% of your purchases using your debit card, or credit card. However, I have noticed there is one thing that still demands that we use cash to pay for it's product. No, I'm not talking about Prositutes, I'm talking about drink machines.

http://www.coastalcanteen.com/customers/106021014274006/images/machine_highvisibilitydrink.jpg

How come the companies who make these machines haven't kept up with the pace of technology? Comon, accept my Debit Card!

What do you guys think, should vending machines allow you to use your debit card to buy a drink, or is using hard cold cash good enough?

I'm sorry, but why would you want to buy a 12-16 ounce coke from a vending machine for $1 when you get get a 2 liter bottle for $.89 and similarly low prices for a 6 pack (where I live anyways) Bottled water is a bit more understandable because that's more expensive, but that's why there's water coolers and fountains.

http://www.coastalcanteen.com/customers/106021014274006/images/machine_highvisibilitydrink.jpg

Is it just me, or do those machines remind you of stoned smily faces?

When I passed through Hong Kong recently I noticed that softdrink vending machines accept a type of card:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octopus_card#Card_usage

Aren't they making vending machines that you can txt to, with the money coming off your mobile phone a/c? If not, why not?

My credit card is for emergencies only! I use my debit card for most purchases, but I like to have some cash on me at all times, just because. Besides, for me, carrying cash is an effective way to save - at the end of a week, I take all my loose change and dollar bills (and, sometimes, the occasional $5) and put them in a container - the money is not removed from that container until I take it to the bank to put it in my savings account. This is usually done when it reaches the magic number of $50+.

AFAIK, most drink vending machines are connected by telephone to the distributors so that they can be replenished as efficiently as possible.

I suspect the main reason is that the sale value is too low to make it worth while for the card providers.

I use my credit card for any purchase that I can.
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a205/ulteriormotives/Youre-a-MONSTER.jpg

except that for most people, they don't know that using debit cards does nothing for their credit score.

they think that Debit Cards also affects one's credit score.

You know I have never even thought that having a debit card would hurt or improve my credit rating, I suppose some people just don't really seem to realise that it is just paying with the cash you have now but you don't need to have it on you.

I take all my loose change and dollar bills (and, sometimes, the occasional $5) and put them in a container - the money is not removed from that container until I take it to the bank to put it in my savings account. This is usually done when it reaches the magic number of $50+.

I do something similar all my sharpnel goes into a container and then when it is full put it in those little plastic bags and deposit it at the bank, the value can range from $30-%50.

I've thought about it, but they'd have to raise the price to allow for the costs of a connection etc.

I like the machines that take notes though.

You know I have never even thought that having a debit card would hurt or improve my credit rating, I suppose some people just don't really seem to realise that it is just paying with the cash you have now but you don't need to have it on you.

You're Australian, aren't you? Credit rating works differently here.

You know I have never even thought that having a debit card would hurt or improve my credit rating, I suppose some people just don't really seem to realise that it is just paying with the cash you have now but you don't need to have it on you.

I've also never expected to affect my credit rating by using my debit card. I think a lot of people get so caught up in the current market of financial systems/services that they don't really think about exactly what they are or what they do or don't affect. A lot of people seem unaware that when you use a credit card, you are borrowing money from someone else and entering into a debtor/creditor agreement. They also seem unaware that when they use a debit card, they are removing cash from their bank account. Both of those lacks of awareness can be financially dangerous.

In re what affects credit ratings: I admit I don't understand much about how credit ratings work, but I was under the impression that several things can affect them, not just credit card usage.

You're Australian, aren't you? Credit rating works differently here.
Where's "here"?

I've also never expected to affect my credit rating by using my debit card. I think a lot of people get so caught up in the current market of financial systems/services that they don't really think about exactly what they are or what they do or don't affect. A lot of people seem unaware that when you use a credit card, you are borrowing money from someone else and entering into a debtor/creditor agreement. They also seem unaware that when they use a debit card, they are removing cash from their bank account. Both of those lacks of awareness can be financially dangerous.

In re what affects credit ratings: I admit I don't understand much about how credit ratings work, but I was under the impression that several things can affect them, not just credit card usage.


Where's "here"?

Australia, obviously. I wasn't speaking to you anyway. I was speaking to Blouman Empire, who is Australian. In Australia, credit rating works differently to the USA, for example. My fiance was a consumer lending specialist.

Australia, obviously. I wasn't speaking to you anyway. I was speaking to Blouman Empire, who is Australian. In Australia, credit rating works differently to the USA, for example. My fiance was a consumer lending specialist.
I wasn't challenging you. I was asking you. It was not obvious where you were speaking from. This conversation has covered Australia, the UK, and the US, and it's not always easy to keep track of who is where. I actually would like to learn more about how these things work in various places.

EDIT: Besides, if he is is Australian, and you say to him "credit rating works differently here", I think it's not unreasonable for me to think you were talking about somewhere other than Australia.

I wasn't challenging you. I was asking you. It was not obvious where you were speaking from. This conversation has covered Australia, the UK, and the US, and it's not always easy to keep track of who is where. I actually would like to learn more about how these things work in various places.

EDIT: Besides, if he is is Australian, and you say to him "credit rating works differently here", I think it's not unreasonable for me to think you were talking about somewhere other than Australia.

I just realised the way I worded my sentence was kind of ambiguous. Anyway, I wish I could explain it better, but I know that in the US you basically have to borrow money to get a good credit rating. In Australia it's not like that. Your credit rating gets affected by defaults - so if you don't pay a bill or your rent or a loan back, that usually gets listed as a default. Your credit history also shows when you've applied for loans. If you've been declined, that looks bad. Also, if you overdraw your bank account (or credit card or the account your debit card is linked to), that looks bad as well. Umm, my fiance knows more about it though because that was his job.

I just realised the way I worded my sentence was kind of ambiguous. Anyway, I wish I could explain it better, but I know that in the US you basically have to borrow money to get a good credit rating. In Australia it's not like that. Your credit rating gets affected by defaults - so if you don't pay a bill or your rent or a loan back, that usually gets listed as a default. Your credit history also shows when you've applied for loans. If you've been declined, that looks bad. Also, if you overdraw your bank account (or credit card or the account your debit card is linked to), that looks bad as well. Umm, my fiance knows more about it though because that was his job.
Oh, so you were telling BE that, here in Australia, credit ratings work differently than they do elsewhere. I get it.

I hope someone who understands the credit rating system in the US will respond to this because my "understanding" of it as a non-user of the system (meaning I'm in the system but I don't try to manage it much) is probably wrong, at least partially. But the way I understand it, in the US, using the system a lot -- i.e. borrowing money/using credit cards -- will build a credit rating more quickly than not using it. However, other things also affect it, positively or negatively. Defaulting on loans and bills will hurt your credit rating. Being turned down for a credit card or a loan will hurt your credit rating. Having a lien put on your property or finances of any kind -- creditor, tax, mechanic's liens, etc -- will hurt it. Having a perfect bill paying record -- always paying on time -- should help your credit rating. Making sure that the credit lines you carry are less than your annual income may help your credit rating (so, for instance, don't accept every credit line increase your credit card offers or gives you automatically). Having a history of credit companies closing accounts on you is bad for your rating, but having a history of you closing accounts at your own request may be good.

Non-credit-related bill payment history and property ownership history can also affect your credit rating, as far as I understand it.

Is it just me, or do those machines remind you of stoned smily faces?
http://www.coastalcanteen.com/customers/106021014274006/images/machine_highvisibilitydrink.jpg
http://cache.eb.com/eb/image?id=99586&rendTypeId=4

Hmmm.... I dunno... maybe if you squint juuuuust right... :p

Oh, so you were telling BE that, here in Australia, credit ratings work differently than they do elsewhere. I get it.

I hope someone who understands the credit rating system in the US will respond to this because my "understanding" of it as a non-user of the system (meaning I'm in the system but I don't try to manage it much) is probably wrong, at least partially. But the way I understand it, in the US, using the system a lot -- i.e. borrowing money/using credit cards -- will build a credit rating more quickly than not using it. However, other things also affect it, positively or negatively. Defaulting on loans and bills will hurt your credit rating. Being turned down for a credit card or a loan will hurt your credit rating. Having a lien put on your property or finances of any kind -- creditor, tax, mechanic's liens, etc -- will hurt it. Having a perfect bill paying record -- always paying on time -- should help your credit rating. Making sure that the credit lines you carry are less than your annual income may help your credit rating (so, for instance, don't accept every credit line increase your credit card offers or gives you automatically). Having a history of credit companies closing accounts on you is bad for your rating, but having a history of you closing accounts at your own request may be good.

Non-credit-related bill payment history and property ownership history can also affect your credit rating, as far as I understand it.

I'll be around this evening. I can answer more questions then.

Your credit score is reflected from a formula (each credit reporting agency is a bit different) that includes, how much debt you have, how much is available to you, and how often you are late. If you pay on time nothing goes on your credit score, only when you are late/deliquent. If you have credit cards under the limit it looks good, unless you have too many or too many too far under the limit. The ratio is too hard for most people to fathom much less keep perfect.

There are places that don't report to your credit, like probably your apartment complex (general "you" here) but they WILL report if you leave in the middle of a lease or damage the building. Any judgements against you go on there, if you have a lien on your car, if you foreclose on your house, if you get something repossessed, if your wages are garnished.

The most popular credit score you hear about is your FICO and it currently has the following breakdown

35% — punctuality of payment in the past (only includes payments later than 30 days past due)
30% — the amount of debt, expressed as the ratio of current revolving debt (credit card balances, etc.) to total available revolving credit (credit limits)
15% — length of credit history
10% — types of credit used (installment, revolving, consumer finance)
10% — recent search for credit and/or amount of credit obtained recently

You'll see that only 10% is affected by credit card use directly, and if all of your types of credit are credit cards, that will actually hurt your score. Most people have various types of "credit", from mortgages to car loans to cell phone contracts etc. Most of your credit score is based on you paying on time. The second highest is whether or not you have borrowed most of what you've been approved to.

It's why I get so annoyed when people suggest to college students that they should get a credit card to "build" their credit......what they really mean is "build your debt".....which is why I call the FICO score the "debt score" when I am teaching financial literacy, because if you consistently pay on time, the only real way to get a good score is to keep debt. You can't charge and pay off every month, you have to keep debt and you have to keep it in a perfect ratio, or you aren't helping yourself at all.

I will cop to being pretty biased since most of my clients and most of the people who I teach are living about 20% or less above the national poverty level and all of them are in debt. Most of them will never see a way out of it unless they severely limit spending for a LONG TIME. Most (90%) of my clients are having trouble meeting daily needs due to the amount of debt they have aquired and are on the edge of bankruptcy.

I'll be around this evening. I can answer more questions then.
<snip for length>
Thanks! This is great. :) I look forward to more about it as well.

I agree completely with you about the issue of people being encouraged to get credit cards as a way of building a rating. To my mind, that is nothing but a misleading marketing ploy by the credit card companies to get people to buy and use their products. From what you write here, it seems that paying bills on time -- even just utility bills -- is far more important.

Am I right in thinking that the credit rating properly is the measure of how much lenders would want to have you as debtor (your credit-worthiness), not a measure of how well you carry the debt you already have, which is how some of the credit card marketing makes it sound? So the most important measure is how you manage your money and transactions, not how many debts you rack up, pay off, etc, over time. Thus, you can build a good credit rating without ever using credit at all. Is that right?