NationStates Jolt Archive

Michael Phelps (USA) has recently strengthened his place in the history books by winning more Olympic gold medals than any person ever before. He currently has twelve (spread out over the Athens and Beijing Games), and will almost certainly have 14 by the end of the Beijing Olympics. That will be an impressive five more than the athlete with the second number of Olympic golds in history - gymnast Larissa Latynina of the USSR (18 medals, of which 9 gold).

Phelps has quite understandably created a media buzz. His achievement is unique, his skill incredible, and he is rightly recognised as an outstanding Olympian.

However... Who has ever heard of Béatrice Hess (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B%C3%A9atrice_Hess)?

Hess is a French swimmer who has won a whopping twenty gold medals at the Paralympic Games. You would think that this would make her internationally famous. But she's not. In fact, I'm sure even most French people have never heard of her. Granted, there's less competition at the Paralympics than at the Olympics. But still, twenty gold is a truly stunning achievement. One would expect her to be a household name. The fact that she is not reflects people's unfortunate lack of interest in the incredible achievements of Paralympians.

For the record, in case anyone's interested, Hess has cerebral palsy, and swims without using her legs.

Japanese swimmer Mayumi Narita (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mayumi_Narita) is also someone who should logically be famous. She has won an impressive fifteen gold medals at the Paralympics. (She is quadriplegic.) Brazil's Clodoaldo Silva (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clodoaldo_Silva) won six gold medals in swimming at the Athens Paralympics - exactly matching Phelps' six gold medals in swimming at the Athens Olympics. Again, Phelps had to face off more competition, but surely Silva's great achievement deserves some recognition. (He has cerebral palsy.) For her part, Australia's Siobhan Paton (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siobhan_Paton) also won six gold medals in swimming, at the Sydney Paralympics. (She is mentally disabled.)

I'm looking forward to the Beijing Paralympics. I'm sure there'll be spectacular performances by athletes who have achieved fantastic results many times before... and who are still, nonetheless, completely unknown to the general public.

agreed. sadly, the Paralympic Games are not as widely hyped as the Olympics... but they should be.

Are the Paralympics even broadcast on television? I'd love to watch it, being a cripple myself!

However... Who has ever heard of Béatrice Hess (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B%C3%A9atrice_Hess)?
Hess is a French swimmer who has won a whopping twenty gold medals at the Paralympic Games. You would think that this would make her internationally famous. But she's not. In fact, I'm sure even most French people have never heard of her.

Well, we all have heard of Michael Schumacher, Ralf Schumacher and Kimi Raikkonen, at the very least.

But how many of you can name three major drivers of the Paris-Dakar rally?

That's despite rally being much closer to the people - you can't buy and drive a F1 car, but you can buy any rally car, and it will be cheap, practical, durable, drivable on any road or off the road.

Are the Paralympics even broadcast on television? I'd love to watch it, being a cripple myself!

Here (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/other_sports/disability_sport/6412941.stm) is what the BBC says about its coverage of the Beijing Paralympics.

Trying to watch from France four years ago was not easy. To see the Games on TV, you had to switch on France 3 at night for a three minute summary squeezed in between other programmes. And that was all. The channel had more extensive coverage on its website, however, so I watched on my computer.

Well, we all have heard of Michael Schumacher, Ralf Schumacher and Kimi Raikkonen, at the very least.

But how many of you can name three major drivers of the Paris-Dakar rally?

That's despite rally being much closer to the people - you can't buy and drive a F1 car, but you can buy any rally car, and it will be cheap, practical, durable, drivable on any road or off the road.

BTW i call Räikkönen,''räkä'' finnish for booger

Paralympics? Strange, that sounds unfamilliar...

I think there's several reasons why:
Part of comes down to the aversion (if not outright repulsion) able-bodied ppl have to seeing the disabled. We don't like to be reminded that we could be disabled. Out of sight, out of mind etc;

Some of it is due to the general public as a whole still don't take the paralympics that seriously yet. It's still seen in a rather patronising manner. "Ohh, isn't it wonderful how they can compete! They must be so brave!";

Not shown on TV is prob more just a profit decision than anything else. If it rated, they'd show it. Especially as they've got all the gear already there;

Winning in the paralympics is a damn sight easier than the olympics for one major reason: less competition. Less competition due to 3 main reasons: less cripples; it's relatively new so standards aren't high (making a determined and fit athlete more likely to be successful) and more categories. There's 6 separate categories an athlete can be placed into and then several sub-categories under that (eg amputee swimming has classifications based on type and severity of limb-loss).
These aren't reasons why we should ignore them but they do explain why a person can win so many medals;

Not knowing who they are is no indication of how good they are. For example how many of you have ever heard of Birgit Fischer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birgit_Fischer), who won gold in Kayaking in every Olympics she competed in? 6 Olympics in total, from 1980 - 2004 (missed the 1984 Olympics due to the Eastern Bloc boycott); 8 Golds, 4 silvers, her worst finish was 4th. Considering she was World Champion in K1, K2 and K4 500m for the entire 1980s it's a fair argument to claim she could easily have won 3 more golds had she competed in 1984. Anyone think Phelps will compete (and win) until he's 42?!
So why isn't she a household name? Similar reasons why Hess isn't: No media interest in her.

It looks as if live coverage will be available on the Internet at least, here:
http://player26.narrowstep.tv/assets/players/3206/html/player.html

It appears to be an IPC-backed website, and it's linked to from the official website of the Beijing Paralympics. But it's hazy on details. I don't know how much live coverage exactly it will be providing.

I hope it'll be full coverage, since French TV will only be providing brief summaries...

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Blind football?

Blind football?

Yes. The Paralympics have blind football (5 a side) and football for athletes with cerebral palsy (7 a side).

I think there's several reasons why:
Part of comes down to the aversion (if not outright repulsion) able-bodied ppl have to seeing the disabled. We don't like to be reminded that we could be disabled. Out of sight, out of mind etc;

Some of it is due to the general public as a whole still don't take the paralympics that seriously yet. It's still seen in a rather patronising manner. "Ohh, isn't it wonderful how they can compete! They must be so brave!";

Not shown on TV is prob more just a profit decision than anything else. If it rated, they'd show it. Especially as they've got all the gear already there;

Winning in the paralympics is a damn sight easier than the olympics for one major reason: less competition. Less competition due to 3 main reasons: less cripples; it's relatively new so standards aren't high (making a determined and fit athlete more likely to be successful) and more categories. There's 6 separate categories an athlete can be placed into and then several sub-categories under that (eg amputee swimming has classifications based on type and severity of limb-loss).
These aren't reasons why we shouldn't ignore them but they do explain why a person can win so many medals;

Not knowing who they are is no indication of how good they are. For example how many of you have ever heard of Birgit Fischer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birgit_Fischer), who won gold in Kayaking in every Olympics she competed in? 6 Olympics in total, from 1980 - 2004 (missed the 1984 Olympics due to the Eastern Bloc boycott); 8 Golds, 4 silvers, her worst finish was 4th. Considering she was World Champion in K1, K2 and K4 500m for the entire 1980s it's a fair argument to claim she could easily have won 3 more golds had she competed in 1984. Anyone think Phelps will compete (and win) until he's 42?!
So why isn't she a household name? Similar reasons why Hess isn't: No media interest in her.

You're right on all counts, of course.

The lack of media interest is a vicious circle. More people would watch if it were actually on TV. It wouldn't be as successful as the Olympics (because, indeed, many people are repulsed by disability and/or find it difficult to view these top athletes as athletes), but still...

Blind football?
They have well-trained guide dogs. 2nd half is hell to play, due to all the dog poop everywhere, but it's all fun and games. Especially if one of the dogs takes a shine to an opposing player's leg.

They use a big ball with bells inside it so the players can hear it

They use a big ball with bells inside it so the players can hear it

The one thing that mystifies me is blind bowls.

You're right on all counts, of course.

The lack of media interest is a vicious circle. More people would watch if it were actually on TV. It wouldn't be as successful as the Olympics (because, indeed, many people are repulsed by disability and/or find it difficult to view these top athletes as athletes), but still...
Very true. They don't show cause there's no interest and there's no interest cause they don't show it.
It is changing though, albeit very slowly. Give it another 10-15 years and I feel it'll be accepted as pretty mainstream.


Another reason we could add is that us able-bodied people don't like to see a disabled person compete and do better than us, as it shows us up for the lazy slob we are! Like that SA amputee who came 16th in the 10km swim last week: I doubt I could even swim 500m, let alone 10km and I have full comportment of extremities. So what's my excuse for being so goddamn useless now?

More people would watch if it were actually on TV.

It is on TV here.

I'm looking forward to the Beijing Paralympics. I'm sure there'll be spectacular performances by athletes who have achieved fantastic results many times before... and who are still, nonetheless, completely unknown to the general public.

The Chineese participants are whats left of the families of the regular Olympics athletes that didnt win medals.

I want to watch blind football so bad now.

The Chineese participants are whats left of the families of the regular Olympics athletes that didnt win medals.
Iraq must surely have a large contingent to send this time round. Especially in the amputee events.

I want to watch blind football so bad now.

I've seen it, once the initial novelty wares off it does get quite dull.

Another reason we could add is that us able-bodied people don't like to see a disabled person compete and do better than us, as it shows us up for the lazy slob we are! Like that SA amputee who came 16th in the 10km swim last week: I doubt I could even swim 500m, let alone 10km and I have full comportment of extremities.

I hadn't even thought of that. Indeed, Natalie du Toit is a better swimmer than virtually anyone on this planet, despite having only one leg. You may be on to something. I imagine some people may feel frustrated or inadequate, and hence annoyed, by seeing -for example- a guy with no arms ski far better than they do. Or a woman with one leg jump further than they can in the long jump.

It is on TV here.

You're in the UK, right? I thought the Beeb was only showing it on red button programmes.

I want to watch blind football so bad now.

Try the live coverage on the website I linked to. Hopefully they'll be showing it.

Iraq must surely have a large contingent to send this time round. Especially in the amputee events.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iraq_at_the_2008_Summer_Paralympics

You're in the UK, right? I thought the Beeb was only showing it on red button programmes.


Well I remember being able to watch it without the red button last year. Not sure about this year actually, and I'm too lazy to switch on my tv and find out. :)

They were just parading a soldier from Iraq on NBC as a hero and I was all "Wow, go him." until they mentioned that he injured himself. Sure, he's pretty good to get this far in his sport, but he's not a hero just because he paralyzed himself from the waist down..

CBC will be showing them here in Canada

Very true. They don't show cause there's no interest and there's no interest cause they don't show it.
It is changing though, albeit very slowly. Give it another 10-15 years and I feel it'll be accepted as pretty mainstream.

Another reason we could add is that us able-bodied people don't like to see a disabled person compete and do better than us, as it shows us up for the lazy slob we are! Like that SA amputee who came 16th in the 10km swim last week: I doubt I could even swim 500m, let alone 10km and I have full comportment of extremities. So what's my excuse for being so goddamn useless now?

I think it's more to do with the fact that many people watch the Olympics for inspiration: an amateur runner would watch the atheletics to see what they should (theoretically) be aspiring to. Presumably many disabled people feel the same way when watching the Paralympics, but no able-bodied person aspires to be disabled.

Sure, the games deserve more coverage than they get at the moment, but I can't see it ever being even half as popular as the main event.

I've just discovered that Trischa Zorn (swimmer, USA, blind) is the most successful Paralympian of all times, with 55 medals, of which 41 gold. That's way, way more than any other Paralympic athlete I've ever heard of.

So of course I created a Wikipedia article about her (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trischa_Zorn). :p (The fact that there wasn't one yet is very revealing.)

I'm building up a list of multiple Paralympic gold medallists (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Aridd/Through_the_hidden_door/Main/List_of_multiple_Paralympic_gold_medalists). If you know any to add to it, feel free.

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Trischa Zorn

So of course I created a Wikipedia article about her (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trischa_Zorn). :p (The fact that there wasn't one yet is very revealing.)
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Its because frankly noone really cares. Its about on par to showing up at your kids school to watch them do a spelling bee.

Its about on par to showing up at your kids school to watch them do a spelling bee.

Congratulations; that's one of the most stupid things I've heard in quite a while. (I keep forgetting how inanely moronic comments can be on NSG.)

See if you can figure out for yourself why being one of the world's top athletes, swimming better than almost anyone on the planet, isn't quite the same as being a random kid who can spell pretty well.

See if you can figure out for yourself why being one of the world's top athletes, swimming better than almost anyone on the planet, isn't quite the same as being a random kid who can spell pretty well.

Apparently i share the same apathy about the Paraolympics as clearly the rest of the World even by your own admission does. Sorry. /shrug

Apparently i share the same apathy about the Paraolympics as clearly the rest of the World even by your own admission does. Sorry. /shrug

Oh, I'm not disputing that. And you have a perfect right to feel apathetic about anything. I may deplore it, but it's up to every individual to like whatever they want. To me, the Paralympics are essentially the same as the Olympics: incredibly skilled athletes putting on an amazing display of talent. Except that the Paralympics are more impressive.

What I'm saying, and what a lot of people don't seem to get, is that Paralympians are athletes first and foremost. They're not random disabled people who've been sent of to compete. They're among the world's best athletes in their fields. Their disability is secondary.

A Paralympic medallist is someone who could easily beat almost any non-disabled person in the world. Try swimming against Zorn and you would be hopelessly outclassed. A lot of people seem not to realise that.

Oh, I'm not disputing that. And you have a perfect right to feel apathetic about anything. I may deplore it, but it's up to every individual to like whatever they want. To me, the Paralympics are essentially the same as the Olympics: incredibly skilled athletes putting on an amazing display of talent. Except that the Paralympics are more impressive.

What I'm saying, and what a lot of people don't seem to get, is that Paralympians are athletes first and foremost. They're not random disabled people who've been sent of to compete. They're among the world's best athletes in their fields. Their disability is secondary.

A Paralympic medallist is someone who could easily beat almost any non-disabled person in the world. Try swimming against Zorn and you would be hopelessly outclassed. A lot of people seem not to realise that.

Seems about equivalent to me. It's basically the human body being pushed to it's limits, however much of the body is functional at the time. Hours of training, preparation, pressure, hard work, all that stuff gym teachers are on about.

Seems about equivalent to me. It's basically the human body being pushed to it's limits, however much of the body is functional at the time. Hours of training, preparation, pressure, hard work, all that stuff gym teachers are on about.

My thoughts exactly.

By the way, for those who don't know, the Opening Ceremony is tomorrow, and will be broadcast on the Beeb. You can probably also watch it live on ParalympicSport.tv.

Best of luck to all the athletes... especially the British and French, of course. :p I know you'll dazzle us.

Did anyone else here watch the Opening Ceremony?

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And... how many of these are handicapped?

I'm cheering for the quadriplegic hurdlers.

And... how many of these are handicapped?

During the opening ceremony? They had a blind singer, a blind piano player, a one-legged child ballet dancer... All the women dancers in that last picture were deaf. Not all the performers had disabilities, but people with disabilities were included in most parts of the ceremony.

For the lighting of the torch, a wheelchair athlete hauled himself all the way up a rope (in his wheelchair) to the top of the stadium.

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During the opening ceremony? They had a blind singer, a blind piano player, a one-legged child ballet dancer... Not all the performers had disabilities, but people with disabilities were included in most parts of the ceremony.

For the lighting of the torch, a wheelchair athlete hauled himself all the way up a rope (in his wheelchair) to the top of the stadium.

http://img377.imageshack.us/img377/686/0013729e45180a2d6dc506mq3.jpg

wow.that must have been tough.doubt i could do it.

wow.that must have been tough.doubt i could do it.

You could see it was a strain for him. Hauling himself up by sheer strength. It was very impressive. And a good idea, too.

Oh, I'm not disputing that. And you have a perfect right to feel apathetic about anything. I may deplore it, but it's up to every individual to like whatever they want. To me, the Paralympics are essentially the same as the Olympics: incredibly skilled athletes putting on an amazing display of talent. Except that the Paralympics are more impressive.

What I'm saying, and what a lot of people don't seem to get, is that Paralympians are athletes first and foremost. They're not random disabled people who've been sent of to compete. They're among the world's best athletes in their fields. Their disability is secondary.

A Paralympic medallist is someone who could easily beat almost any non-disabled person in the world. Try swimming against Zorn and you would be hopelessly outclassed. A lot of people seem not to realise that.

The reason I struggle to be interested in the paralympics (other than that I've had my fill of athletics at the Olympics prior to them) is that who wins is often fairly arbitrary. Levels of disability are obviously a continuous spectrum but for the paralympics they have to divide them into classes to compete in.

So the winners are (generally speaking) those who are at the lower end of the spectrum in a particular class (hence why you get athletes getting re-classified and going from also-rans to champions). You can argue that a similar thing goes on re: men and women being separated for the Olympics (and that the Olympics is a search for the most un-disabled person if you see what I mean)

But I just don't find a race to determine the fastest man (with a disability of this type estimated by experts to be between this level and that level of hindrance) in the world over 100m, as compelling as a race to find the fastest man in the world over 100m.

Congrats to Team GB! 33 gold medals so far, including a whopping 15 in cycling.

And the GB rugby team beat the Wheel Blacks, 39-38. :D

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Darren Kenny on his way to win one of the UK's many gold medals in cycling.

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Juan Reyes of Mexico competes in the freestyle, S4 category. S4 is for athletes with fairly severe disabilities (S1 being the most severe, and S10 the least.)

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Algeria's Sidali Lamri beats Japan's Satoshi Fujimoto to take gold in blind judo.

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One of the most famous Paralympians in the world, Natalie du Toit of South Africa, is raking in the gold medals in Beijing.

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Eleanor Simmonds of the UK sets the record for the youngest ever winner of an individual Paralympic gold medal. Simmonds is 13. She's a dwarf swimmer.

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Chaos on the track in the women's 5000 metres.

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"Blade Runner", "the fastest man on no legs", winning another race.

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Great Britain's Nathan Stephens in the shotput.

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In the 100m, defending champion Marlon Shirley of the USA suffers a fall, while Oscar Pistorius of South Africa takes gold.

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Oh, yeah. Another cycling gold for Britain.

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We can never get enough of those, really. :D

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Natalia Partyka of Poland, one of the only two people to have competed at both the Olympics and the Paralympics in Beijing.

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Egypt's Sherif Othman Othman breaks the world record three times in a row to win gold.

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Gold for Thailand's Prawat Wahoram. 148 countries are competing at the Beijing Paralympics.

In case anyone is wondering, China is currently top of the medal table, with 37 golds. Then come the UK, with 33, and the US, with 23.