NationStates Jolt Archive

Well, its the 55th anniversary of North Korean "Victory" in the Korean/Great Glorious Fatherland Liberation War of Victory by Eternal President and Glorious Leader Kim Il Sung and Triumph of Juche War. Which makes for epic lulz.

From the KCNA Website:


Youth and Students' Balls Held
Pyongyang, July 28 (KCNA) -- Dancing parties of youth and students were held in different parts of the country on July 27 to celebrate the 55th anniversary of the victory in the great Fatherland Liberation War.

At dancing parties held at the plazas of the Monument to Victory in the Fatherland Liberation War, the April 25 House of Culture, the Pyongyang Indoor Stadium and other places in Pyongyang, youth and students presented sea of dances with the same jubilee as was witnessed on the war victory day when all the servicepersons and people of the DPRK raised cheers of joy and deep reverence, looking up to President Kim Il Sung, the invincible and iron-willed commander and the legendary hero.

Such songs as "Our Victory-Day July 27" and "We Have Presented Red Flowers" were played at the ball places, carrying the ardor and firm determination of youth and students to glorify the exploits of the President who led the Fatherland Liberation War to victory with his extraordinary military wisdom, distinguished commanding art and matchless pluck, thus demonstrating the dignity and honor of heroic Korea to the whole world.

Amid the playing of songs such as "Our General Is Best" and "General Employs the Art of Compressing Space" the participants in the parties enthusiastically danced with the feelings of gratitude to General Secretary Kim Jong Il, the peerlessly illustrious commander who has wisely led the anti-imperialist, anti-U.S. confrontation struggle with the great Songun politics.

Songs "Pride of Youth", "May the Country and the Youth Shine", "Hullari", "Let's Support Our Supreme Commander with Arms", "Let's Meet With Each Other at the Front" and "Let Us Soldiers Become Heroes" further enlivened the atmosphere of celebration.

Dancing parties of youth and students also took place in different provincial seats, cities and counties, including Phyongsong, Hamhung and Kanggye cities on the same day.

Yay special skills!

For some reason, I don't think Bush could get away with holding students' balls.

That's the real crime in North Korea, the songs are just awful.

Well, its the 55th anniversary of North Korean "Victory" in the Korean/Great Glorious Fatherland Liberation War of Victory by Eternal President and Glorious Leader Kim Il Sung and Triumph of Juche War. Which makes for epic lulz.

From the KCNA Website:



Yay special skills!

Nice to know they still have the strength to dance on so little food.

Amid the playing of songs such as "Our General Is Best" and "General Employs the Art of Compressing Space"

The art of compressing space. Is that what they call stomach shrinkage? :p

That's the real crime in North Korea, the songs are just awful.

You try employing the art of compressing space.

You try employing the art of compressing space.

Wasn't that the cause of the Black Mesa Incident?

You try employing the art of compressing space.

It sounds impressive but it's basically the 'fart song' where you put your hand under your armpit - Kim Jong-Il never fails to be amused by this and he's damn good at it too - his Flight of the Bumblebees is a wonder to behold.

Wasn't that the cause of the Black Mesa Incident?

It sounds impressive but it's basically the 'fart song' where you put your hand under your armpit - Kim Jong-Il never fails to be amused by this and he's damn good at it too - his Flight of the Bumblebees is a wonder to behold.

The Black Mesa Incident was caused by the fart song? :eek:

Wasn't that the cause of the Black Mesa Incident?

Didn't that happen because of an overload which caused the teleporters to link to alien worlds, which made them invade the base?

The Black Mesa Incident was caused by the fart song? :eek:

This caused a catastrophic resonance cascade, leading to widespread and severe structural damage to the room and eventually the entire facility. Communications with the outside world were cut off. These were side-effects caused by the resonance cascade tearing dimensional holes between Earth and Xen, a border-world.

What do you think a 'catastrophic resonance cascade' is exactly?

Doesn't Juche explicitly say that the military, not the working class, are the leading force in society?

Doesn't Juche explicitly say that the military, not the working class, are the leading force in society?

Not initially. It wasn't until the 90's when the economy really suffered a terminal decline that the "military-first" policy was implemented; prior to that, Juche was still pretty similar to Stalinism. After that, it evolved from an interpretation of Marxism to a full-blown state religion.

Not initially. It wasn't until the 90's when the economy really suffered a terminal decline that the "military-first" policy was implemented; prior to that, Juche was still pretty similar to Stalinism. After that, it evolved from an interpretation of Marxism to a full-blown state religion.

Actually no, the DPRK (like China) never replaced the 'People's Republic' (the joint dictatorship of many classes, including the peasantry, national-bourgeois and working class) with the 'Socialist Republic' (meaning the dictatorship of the working class and non-propertied in general. Mao and Kim both said their states weren't a dictatorship of any one group, party or class, but a 'state of the whole people'. Both engaged in the anti-Marxist 'national unity' crap which emphasized class collaboration over class struggle.

Want evidence that DPRK is state capitalist (with an emerging private market)? Just look at all the north/korea industrial private enterprises and 'special enterprise zones' in the DPRK.

Actually no, the DPRK (like China) never replaced the 'People's Republic' (the joint dictatorship of many classes, including the peasantry, national-bourgeois and working class) with the 'Socialist Republic' (meaning the dictatorship of the working class and non-propertied in general. Mao and Kim both said their states weren't a dictatorship of any one group, party or class, but a 'state of the whole people'. Both engaged in the anti-Marxist 'national unity' crap which emphasized class collaboration over class struggle.

Want evidence that DPRK is state capitalist (with an emerging private market)? Just look at all the north/korea industrial private enterprises and 'special enterprise zones' in the DPRK.

And nobody gets tortured and starved to death at all.
*nodnod* :p

For some reason, I don't think Bush could get away with holding students' balls.

Are you sure? He has more power than Mark Foley.

And nobody gets tortured and starved to death at all.
*nodnod* :p

The famine claim is mostly just BS concocted by the imperialists to try and discredit the DPRK, and naive and stupid liberals in America lapped it gratefully. The imperialist camp has tried everything it can to try and destabilize the DPRK, economic sabotage, propaganda, you name it.

So yes the DPRK is revisionist in a Marxist-Leninist sense, just as Cuba is also, but I support them because of the possibility of restoration of socialism proper. I also support them in an anti-imperialist sense, seeing as global capital is targeting their people specifically for the next exploitation grab.

I mean honestly, did you see the bourgeois rags after Fidel's death, they were positively salivating at the prospect of a barbaric capitalism taking over and a mass-theft of working class productive capacity to rich foreigners. When Raul didn't really do anything though they instantly become silent.

The famine claim is mostly just BS concocted by the imperialists to try and discredit the DPRK, and naive and stupid liberals in America lapped it gratefully. The imperialist camp has tried everything it can to try and destabilize the DPRK, economic sabotage, propaganda, you name it.

Indeed, in fact, I suspect Kim Jong-Il plays a part in the 100, 000+ refugees who've escaped North Korea due to 'famine' over the past 10 years, nice cover story, I guess they're all spies.

That's why China is deporting them back to NK, who wants spies, and that's why those deported are either executed or imprisoned, they failed at spying, treason.

S'all clear now, thank God you're here to enlighten us.

100, 000+ refugees
Prove it.

Sounds like bourgeois propaganda to me.

Prove it.

Sounds like bourgeois propaganda to me.

Hop on a plane to Northern China and I'll introduce you to some.

Prove it.

Sounds like bourgeois propaganda to me.

New York Times - http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D02E1D71F39F932A35755C0A9639C8B63

Human Rights Watch - http://www.hrw.org/english/docs/2008/02/26/nkorea18147.htm

BBC - http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7306787.stm

Reuters - http://www.reuters.com/article/topNews/idUSSEO21733520080411?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNewsDesperate

Voice of America - http://www.voanews.com/english/archive/2008-04/2008-04-16-voa14.cfm?CFID=18643983&CFTOKEN=41640483

Los Angeles Times - http://articles.latimes.com/2003/jun/17/world/fg-norkor17

The Guardian - http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/apr/17/korea.food

The China Post - http://www.chinapost.com.tw/commentary/the%20china%20post/john%20metzler/2008/04/19/152632/North-Korea.htm

The Washington Post - http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/04/29/AR2008042902713.html?nav=hcmodule

Time - http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1737780,00.html

Amnesty International - http://www.amnesty.org.uk/news_details.asp?NewsID=15110

CNN - http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/asiapcf/04/17/korea.food/

UNICEF - http://www.unicef.org/newsline/97pr33.htm

AFP - http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5gcazCFtmXWl0zwid4_HPTOiMtvcg

The Scotsman - http://news.scotsman.com/world/Spectre-of-famine-stalks-North.3952565.jp

MSNBC - http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10631108/

CBS News - http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2001/05/15/world/main291426.shtml

snip
I think the class character of those sources is pretty obvious.

I think the class character of those sources is pretty obvious.

The government of leader Kim Jong Il surprised the world in the 1990's when it acknowledged a famine was occurring and appealed for international aid. Observers call it a big step for a country that prides itself on self-sufficiency.

The North Korean government, puppets of the bourgeois masters that they are!

I think the class character of those sources is pretty obvious.

Unless you intend to claim that every single one of those sources is biased, I showed you the proof.

Unless you intend to claim that every single one of those sources is biased, I showed you the proof.

Of course they're all biased, you can tell by the lies they tell, North Korea is the breadbasket of the world, any media source that disagrees is therefore clearly biased.

Communist political science is like creationism that way, if the results don't fit, either ignore them, call them incessantly into question or dismiss them as propaganda.

Andaras is what we call a political creationist though, of course, we're biased that way due to wearing our liberal, rose-tinted glasses.

Unless you intend to claim that every single one of those sources is biased, I showed you the proof.

He is using the time honored and most widely used debate method on Earth.

Sticking your fingers in your ears and screaming:

LALALALALALALALALLALALALLALALALALALA!

Of course they're all biased, you can tell by the lies they tell, North Korea is the breadbasket of the world, any media source that disagrees is therefore clearly biased.

Communist political science is like creationism that way, if the results don't fit, either ignore them, call them incessantly into question or dismiss them as propaganda.

Andaras is what we call a political creationist though, of course, we're biased that way due to wearing our liberal, rose-tinted glasses.

I am not denying that the DPRK has economic problems, but they are caused by the economic sabotage of the imperialist camp moreover. The DPRK was actually beating the South economically up until the 90's when it was isolated by the 'West' and subjected to economic war.

The DPRK was actually beating the South economically up until the 90's when it was isolated by the 'West' and subjected to economic war.

Prove it.

Sounds like proletariat propaganda to me.

I am not denying that the DPRK has economic problems, but they are caused by the economic sabotage of the imperialist camp moreover. The DPRK was actually beating the South economically up until the 90's when it was isolated by the 'West' and subjected to economic war.

Isn't that the same time South Korea started to really get its ass in gear and make lots of profits?

Isn't that the same time South Korea started to really get its ass in gear and make lots of profits?

Wait, you're taking Andaras's claims at face value?

By the end of 1979 per capita GNP in North Korea was about one-third of that in the South.

It's a tad worse now.

Isn't that the same time South Korea started to really get its ass in gear and make lots of profits?
It's when the US and imperialist bloc really started to pump it full of nice lucrative investments and funds as part of the broader war to economically attack the DPRK, yes.

No, just exploring a possible tangent that might possiblely connect to reality at 10 minutes to 4 am.

Enough of the petty bickering, if you can read Korean, sing along with us all - No Motherland Without You (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K907lLUzmC0&feature=related)

I'm good.

And Andaras, do you really think that the DPRK is above propoganda and infladting or deflating numbers?

It seems to me that most of this hate against the DPRK is a racist hatred of Korean culture and people demonstrated by Westerners.

It seems to me that most of this hate against the DPRK is a racist hatred of Korean culture and people demonstrated by Westerners.

Certainly where I'm coming from, can't speak for the rest.

Certainly where I'm coming from, can't speak for the rest.

At it's heart that is what the arrogant attitude of the imperialist West is all about:

Why can't you be governed like us.
Why can't you act like us.
Why can't your culture be more like us.
Why can't you look like us.

And lastly, why can't you just become Westerners?

At it's heart that is what the arrogant attitude of the imperialist West is all about:

Why can't you be governed like us.
Why can't you act like us.
Why can't your culture be more like us.
Why can't you look like us.

And lastly, why can't you just become Westerners?

More a case of:

Why can't you allow people to grow food properly?
Why do you spend your time gambling and whoring in Macau while your people starve?
Why is power more important than the welfare of your people?
Why is your haircut quite so silly?

These and others.

It seems to me that most of this hate against the DPRK is a racist hatred of Korean culture and people demonstrated by Westerners.

Or a hatred born from 45+ years of being under the threat(real and imagined) of nulcear war with The USSR, created a hatred of all things commie? And Its not really hatred, its the fact that we're all scared shitless of the mere idea that what amounts to cartoon character leads a nation with nuclear missiles?

And I suggest you read this (http://www.rense.com/general37/nkorr.htm). Go through and check every fact in there. Maybe 1 in 3 claims is true. Its long, but very funny. I liked this little bit.

North Korea's main battle tanks - T-62s - have 155 mm guns and can travel as fast as 60 km per hour. The US main tanks - M1A - have 120 mm guns and cannot travel faster than 55 km per hour. North Korean tanks have skins 700 mm thick and TOW-II is the only anti-tank missile in the US arsenal that can penetrate this armored skin.

It seems to me that most of this hate against the DPRK is a racist hatred of Korean culture and people demonstrated by Westerners.

Yet, we get along well with South Koreans. Their government may be more like ours, but they certainly have their own cultural and political ways of dong things - and we really don't seem to have a problem with that.

snip

Oh yes, HOW DARE the Korean peoples have a culture and nation which the arrogant West doesn't approve of. How dare the DPRK be independent.

Why do the Korean people have the audacity not be White?
Why do the Korean people have the audacity not be capitalist?
Why do the Korean people have the audacity to be independent?

I think these are the questions you mean.

I bet you'd just love if the whole world were Americans.

*snip*

Is this what you're reduced to? Come now comrade, surely a slightly more dialectic dissection of my commentary?

It's when the US and imperialist bloc really started to pump it full of nice lucrative investments and funds as part of the broader war to economically attack the DPRK, yes.

I'm still looking for something that resembles supporting evidence for this claim.

I think the class character of those sources is pretty obvious.

This is hilarious. Do tell, what exactly is the class character of UNICEF?

It seems to me that most of this hate against the DPRK is a racist hatred of Korean culture and people demonstrated by Westerners.

It seems to me that most of this hate against the ROK is a racist hatred of Korean culture and people demonstrated by Communists.

This is hilarious. Do tell, what exactly is the class character of UNICEF?

Usurping
Nations
Incredible
Capitalist
Excessive
Force

or sumfn along those lines?
Of course, always directed against the Workers' Paradises of the world, that is.

It seems to me that most of this hate against the ROK is a racist hatred of Korean culture and people demonstrated by Communists.

South Korea doesn't have a unique culture, everyone knows that, what they have is a bastardized American Anglophilia, or as I like to call it: Americans with darker skin.

ROK has no independent culture, economy or politics, it's all just products of Yankee imperialism.

South Korea doesn't have a unique culture, everyone knows that, what they have is a bastardized American Anglophilia, or as I like to call it: Americans with darker skin.

ROK has no independent culture, economy or politics, it's all just products of Yankee imperialism.

Andaras, I am a reasonably tolerant person, and I've generally been willing to talk to you on the grounds of political theory and concept, pointing out where you have gotten things wrong, and where you have it more or less right.

But seriously, if you're going to talk about a place, people or culture, actually knowing something about that item will make you look a lot less like an ignorant moron.

But seriously, if you're going to talk about a place, people or culture, actually knowing something about that item will make you look a lot less like an ignorant moron.

I'm afraid no amount of information can do that, because, if it isn't in Andaras's frame of reference, it's imperialist propaganda, so he already knows everything that is True, hence rendering the acquisition of new information useless.

South Korea doesn't have a unique culture, everyone knows that, what they have is a bastardized American Anglophilia, or as I like to call it: Americans with darker skin.

ROK has no independent culture, economy or politics, it's all just products of Yankee imperialism.

Your knowledge of South Korean culture is startlingly ignorant. The main element to your ignorance is the idea that if a culture is heavily influenced by another it stops being its own culture - a position that, if accurate, would indicate that Korea lost its cultural identity centuries ago due to heavy influence from China and in the early part of last century due to Japanese influence. Despite these influences both Koreas retain a uniquely Korean culture.

One of the greatest influences on Korean culture is Confucianism. Confucius came from Qufu, which is not in Korea - he is as much an outside influence on the culture as capitalism from the US and communism from Europe and Russia. Communism is after all no more Korean than capitalism, so don't try and claim that capitalism has changed their culture any more than communism has.

One of the greatest influences on Korean culture is Confucianism. Confucius came from Qufu, which is not in Korea - he is as much an outside influence on the culture as capitalism from the US and communism from Europe and Russia. Communism is after all no more Korean than capitalism, so don't try and claim that capitalism has changed their culture any more than communism has.

Well, more than 70% of South Koreans are Christian, it certainly has felt the influence of continued American presence.

On the other hand, in a nod to Andaras's claims of racist behaviour, Koreans can be among the most 'racist' of any nation - the expectation is that you marry another Korean rather than an outsider, possibly a view of the older generation but it certainly remains a pressure. This could be said to be true of any nation I suppose but it seems more of an issue in Korea than any place I know.

So you're right in that any culture is a mixture of influences while retaining its own unique characteristics

Well, more than 70% of South Koreans are Christian, it certainly has felt the influence of continued American presence.

On the other hand, in a nod to Andaras's claims of racist behaviour, Koreans can be among the most 'racist' of any nation - the expectation is that you marry another Korean rather than an outsider, possibly a view of the older generation but it certainly remains a pressure. This could be said to be true of any nation I suppose but it seems more of an issue in Korea than any place I know.

So you're right in that any culture is a mixture of influences while retaining its own unique characteristics

You need to check your sources - almost half of South Koreans are not religious. Only 30% are Christian and a quarter are Buddhist (of course neither of these religions are Korean). Furthermore, a sixth of Koreans were Christian before an American presence was established.

You need to check your sources - almost half of South Koreans are not religious. Only 30% are Christian and a quarter are Buddhist (of course neither of these religions are Korean). Furthermore, a sixth of Koreans were Christian before an American presence was established.

Gosh, you're correct - totally unsubstantiated figure but one that's been in my head for a long time.

I stand corrected, I remember being told this figure and there's certainly plenty of evangelists on the streets of Seoul so I guess I never questioned the figure too much.

Gosh, you're correct - totally unsubstantiated figure but one that's been in my head for a long time.

I stand corrected, I remember being told this figure and there's certainly plenty of evangelists on the streets of Seoul so I guess I never questioned the figure too much.

I think it was probably a bad turn of phrase - it may have come from a statistic that 70% of religious Koreans are Christian. But, it doesn't really matter whether 70% of Koreans are Christians or 70 Koreans are Christian - I think we can both agree that Korea has its own culture and that claims of racism in this thread are merely an attempt to avoid having to make an argument with substance in favour of ad hominem ranting.

I must admit that this thread was an amusing read for all the wrong reasons. Call me a decadent imperialist swine if you like, but does Andaras actually mean all those statements he makes? He may believe in other things than the usual bunch of Jesus fanboys and religious fundamentalists that try to make the majority of this forum see the error of their ways, but he certainly enjoys the benefits of the same kind of tunnel vision.

It saddens me that we have moved from awkwardly titled patriotic songs and funny hats to politics.

More a case of:

Why can't you allow people to grow food properly?
Why do you spend your time gambling and whoring in Macau while your people starve?
Why is power more important than the welfare of your people?
Why is your haircut quite so silly?

These and others.

Why is Kim Jong-Il the only fat North Korean?

Why are you the only fat North Korean?

He's not fat, he's actually 7 feet tall and built like an adonis.

It's these bourgeois, capitalist widescreen TVs stretching and distorting his perfect communist physique.

It saddens me that we have moved from awkwardly titled patriotic songs and funny hats to politics.

That's what you get when you try to poke fun at one of Andaras' favorite nations. You should have known better!

:p

Did anyone else find the headline halarious?

Did anyone else find the headline halarious?

You're a bad man and you're going straight to hell.

Or a North Korean labour camp for political prisoners, whatever is worse.

Andaras: I'll be damned if you call me a Yankee. Yankee's are from New York, you useless hobo.

Oh, it's so fun watching Andaras dance around, move the goal posts and in general make the stupidest possible arguments anyone could ever make.

First:
The famine claim is mostly just BS concocted by the imperialists to try and discredit the DPRK, and naive and stupid liberals in America lapped it gratefully.

"There was no famine!"

Of course, Sdaeriji then gave 17 sources showing that it wasn't "concocted." Andaras responds that those sources are all biased and thus wrong:

I think the class character of those sources is pretty obvious.

When confronted with the stupidity of this accusation, he then backs up and changes his story:

I am not denying that the DPRK has economic problems, but they are caused by the economic sabotage of the imperialist camp moreover.

"Okay, so there was a famine... but it's the capitalist's fault!"

A few posts later and he's whipping out something even more stupid:

It seems to me that most of this hate against the DPRK is a racist hatred of Korean culture and people demonstrated by Westerners.

"I don't even care about whether there was a famine... you're all racists, that's what it is!"

Then, in case any of this wasn't laughably absurd at it is, he fills the conspicuous gap (there was a conspicuous lack of anything that could even be misconstrued as racism) himself:

South Korea doesn't have a unique culture, everyone knows that, what they have is a bastardized American Anglophilia, or as I like to call it: Americans with darker skin.

What a piece of work a man is.

It saddens me that we have moved from awkwardly titled patriotic songs and funny hats to politics.

http://www.7gadgets.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/11/il_fullxfull_12639192.jpg

The description was "Sexy Turkey Hat."

Turkey hat yes...

Sexy? You be the judge.