NationStates Jolt Archive


Here's a thought

South Lizasauria
16-07-2008, 00:21
You know how most superheroes are bent and dedicated to battling crime and protecting the innocent? Why don't they then research what causes criminals and evil masterminds to do what they do as well as fighting them that way they might eventually find a way to minimize crime that they can share with the authorities. If they do that and the authorities listen they'll need to fight less and everyone else will be safer. Thoughts?
Thumbless Pete Crabbe
16-07-2008, 00:22
'Cause then they'd be criminologists, and not superheroes.
Philosopy
16-07-2008, 00:23
Criminologyman isn't very catchy.
Hachihyaku
16-07-2008, 00:26
Cause people want to see/read criminals getting the hell kicked out of them in exciting ways, not seeing/reading how super heroes have taken up social studies...
Pure Metal
16-07-2008, 00:31
*psst* they're not real
JuNii
16-07-2008, 00:32
You know how most superheroes are bent and dedicated to battling crime and protecting the innocent? Why don't they then research what causes criminals and evil masterminds to do what they do as well as fighting them that way they might eventually find a way to minimize crime that they can share with the authorities. If they do that and the authorities listen they'll need to fight less and everyone else will be safer. Thoughts?

and then what...

forced lobotomies for egomaniacs? mind control?

One of Lex Luthor's drives was his hatred for Superman. how would you 'cure' that?

Magneto is driven by the persecution of Mutants. how would you 'cure' that?

Superman tries that in "Kindom Come" with disaterous results. they tried another method in "Dark Knight Returns"
Hachihyaku
16-07-2008, 00:38
*psst* they're not real

Don't say that!!! ;SS
Neesika
16-07-2008, 00:42
....

No thanks, please keep your 'thought'.
Philosopy
16-07-2008, 00:43
*psst* they're not real

You would say that, PM. Or should I say, SUPERPM!

You tried to stop us discovering your secret identity by dismissing the existence of superheroes, but we're smarter than that...
Noisnemid
16-07-2008, 00:44
well, a few reasons...

1 its a simple question of priorities... jobs are important, being a super-hero gets you corprate endorsements, and the love of the people, not to mention lots of other kool stuffs... (i cite venture brothers :P)

however, superhero's can only exist if there is a steady supply of arch-nemesis, or villians, or what-have-you to defeat. if you lose them, you lose the hero's you lose the corprate endorsements... by getting rid of the REASONS people become villians, the super-hero's would put themselves out of a job quite quickly. they don't want that... they protect freedom, that includes the freedom to be a villian that gets their ass handed to them by one of the super-hero's.

2 again, the criminology thing... helping disabled school children, and rehab programs wont get the estimed admiration of a city, and it most certinally wont get you those big juicy corprate endorsements... besides, a 'crimonologist hero' just doesn't have htat nice ring to it, and you don't get to dress up in a rediculase costume and run around with your underware outside your pants! what would the world be if superhero's wore underware under their pants? chaos, thats what!

and finally, i would like to cite teh graphic novel 'Watchmen' it contains answers to EVERY question relivant to this thread, and is one of the best books i've ever read... i'd encourage you guys to go to the library and barrow it, or wherever. just get a copy and read it, it wont let you down, and it explains precicely why super-hero's don't help rehab clinics...

-also, what kind of guy does it take to dress up in a silly outfit, and sneak into peoples houses at night to beat them up? not the kind of guy who goes and helps a charity, i can tell yout hat.-
Grave_n_idle
16-07-2008, 00:47
You know how most superheroes are bent and dedicated to battling crime and protecting the innocent? Why don't they then research what causes criminals and evil masterminds to do what they do as well as fighting them that way they might eventually find a way to minimize crime that they can share with the authorities. If they do that and the authorities listen they'll need to fight less and everyone else will be safer. Thoughts?

The basic premise, I suspect, is that the heroes and the villains are sides of one coin. There's kind of an equilibrium reaction at work.

If heroes get too strong, villains get more desparate, or more violent, or more ruthless. If villains get too strong, heroes get more edgier, the dividing line gets thinner. Heroes get less accountable as the villains do more damage.

There's a comment about it in the new Batman movie - something about dying a hero, or living long enough to see yourself become the villain?

Crime is a function of humanity. Super-crime would be a function of super-humanity.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 02:05
did we seriously get a thread questioning the behavior of superheroes? SERIOUSLY?
Neesika
16-07-2008, 02:07
did we seriously get a thread questioning the behavior of superheroes? SERIOUSLY?

I'm not surprised, considering the poster, that it got made.

I'm just amazed it's actually turned into a discussion.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 02:08
I'm not surprised, considering the poster, that it got made.

I'm just amazed it's actually turned into a discussion.

Yeah, I'm not sure which is more disturbing. That someone thought it necessary to actually organize this particular thought sufficient to publish, or that others saw fit to actually try and answer the question.

Neesika....why does the man in the moon cry so much?
Neesika
16-07-2008, 02:10
Yeah, I'm not sure which is more disturbing. That someone thought it necessary to actually organize this particular thought sufficient to publish, or that others saw fit to actually try and answer the question.

Neesika....why does the man in the moon cry so much?

Don't be ridiculous. It's because Jesus had sex with baby cats.
Muravyets
16-07-2008, 02:11
Yeah, I'm not sure which is more disturbing. That someone thought it necessary to actually organize this particular thought sufficient to publish, or that others saw fit to actually try and answer the question.

Neesika....why does the man in the moon cry so much?
Because he can see this thread from space.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 02:11
Don't be ridiculous. It's because Jesus had sex with baby cats.

Oh....that makes sense.

Because he can see this thread from space.

winner
Neesika
16-07-2008, 02:23
Because he can see this thread from space.

Curse you for your wittier rejoinder!

I say we battle it out for supremacy. In a bathtub full of green jello.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 02:23
I say we battle it out for supremacy. In a bathtub full of green jello.

No. NOW winner
Neesika
16-07-2008, 02:25
No. NOW winner

You're an easily manipulable judge.
Katganistan
16-07-2008, 02:25
'Cause then they'd be criminologists, and not superheroes.

See: Batman.
South Lizasauria
16-07-2008, 02:44
'Cause then they'd be criminologists, and not superheroes.

Can't they be both?
South Lizasauria
16-07-2008, 02:45
Cause people want to see/read criminals getting the hell kicked out of them in exciting ways, not seeing/reading how super heroes have taken up social studies...

If superheroes studiedit'd be easier for them to know what the villain is going to do thus putting out heroes one step ahead.
South Lizasauria
16-07-2008, 02:47
and then what...

forced lobotomies for egomaniacs? mind control?

One of Lex Luthor's drives was his hatred for Superman. how would you 'cure' that?

Magneto is driven by the persecution of Mutants. how would you 'cure' that?

Superman tries that in "Kindom Come" with disaterous results. they tried another method in "Dark Knight Returns"

In Smallville Lex and Kent were friends, maybe they could patch things up lol :D

A halt to the persecution would be in order for Magneto to stop.
South Lizasauria
16-07-2008, 03:00
did we seriously get a thread questioning the behavior of superheroes? SERIOUSLY?

wtf is your problem? Oh wait I already know the answer to that. Your a neurotic temperamental troll along with those other two.
Neesika
16-07-2008, 03:02
wtf is your problem? Oh wait I already know the answer to that. Your a neurotic temperamental troll along with those other two.

It madeth me giggle.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 03:02
If superheroes studiedit'd be easier for them to know what the villain is going to do thus putting out heroes one step ahead.

you realize that they're fictional, yes? They don't need to be "one step ahead". There's no actual crime. There's no actual villain. The results are determined by whatever the writer wants to happen
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 03:03
It madeth me giggle.

but wouldn't it be better if the superheroes studied psychology so they could understand why you giggled?

Because it's important for a fictional character to know what motivated the criminal, otherwise he might not catch them!
Neesika
16-07-2008, 03:04
you realize

This is where you should have stopped and said to yourself...

"Oh wait. Obviously not."
Neesika
16-07-2008, 03:05
but wouldn't it be better if the superheroes studied psychology so they could understand why you giggled?

Because it's important for a fictional character to know what motivated the criminal, otherwise he might not catch them!

Stop being a neurotic, temperamental troll. Only fictional characters should have neurosis.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 03:05
You're an easily manipulable judge.

is true.

This is where you should have stopped and said to yourself...

"Oh wait. Obviously not."

This, also, is true.
South Lizasauria
16-07-2008, 03:05
you realize that they're fictional, yes? They don't need to be "one step ahead". There's no actual crime. There's no actual villain. The results are determined by whatever the writer wants to happen

Being one step ahead will make them look cooler when they deal with the fictional crimes in their fictional land. You were implying that I didn't know they were fictional, yes?
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 03:06
You were implying that I didn't know they were fictional, yes?

Implying? No. At this point I'm outright questioning.

Being one step ahead will make them look cooler when they deal with the fictional crimes in their fictional land.

Because nothing is cooler than a superhero, at the library
Grave_n_idle
16-07-2008, 03:07
Yeah, I'm not sure which is more disturbing. That someone thought it necessary to actually organize this particular thought sufficient to publish, or that others saw fit to actually try and answer the question.

Neesika....why does the man in the moon cry so much?

I would recommend that you watch Labyrinth, The Last Unicorn and... Stranger Than Fiction. And Pan's Labyrinth, actually. Just off the top of my head.
Galloism
16-07-2008, 03:08
Because nothing is cooler than a superhero, at the library

The BatComputer(tm) has all the world's libraries in it.
Neesika
16-07-2008, 03:10
I would recommend that you watch Labyrinth

David Bowie's junk!

My kids love that movie. Actually I love that movie and I've converted my children.

Yet we're all clear that David Bowie isn't actually the Goblin King.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 03:10
The BatComputer(tm) has all the world's libraries in it.

yes, and batman is an exception to "It's not cool when superheroes research". Of course batman manages to pull it off for two reasons:

1) he has no superpowers, so his status as "world's greatest detective" is part and parcel of his actual superhero persona

2) when he researches he does so in a cave surrounded by fucking bats. That's hardcore.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 03:10
I would recommend that you watch Labyrinth, The Last Unicorn and... Stranger Than Fiction. And Pan's Labyrinth, actually. Just off the top of my head.

seen every one of em actually, but I'm not sure I'm getting the reference...
South Lizasauria
16-07-2008, 03:16
yes, and batman is an exception to "It's not cool when superheroes research". Of course batman manages to pull it off for two reasons:

1) he has no superpowers, so his status as "world's greatest detective" is part and parcel of his actual superhero persona

2) when he researches he does so in a cave surrounded by fucking bats. That's hardcore.

Whose to say that the other heroes can't research in some cool way? Besides they have to occasionally research and improvise when the villain is resistant to their powers.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 03:17
Whose to say that the other heroes can't research in some cool way?

....the writers?
South Lizasauria
16-07-2008, 03:17
Because nothing is cooler than a superhero, at his hideout learning about his foe and formulating a kickass plan

corrected
South Lizasauria
16-07-2008, 03:19
....the writers?

They can have the heroes research in their hideout if they wanted to. In fact many superhero cartoon series already do/did that.
Muravyets
16-07-2008, 03:20
Curse you for your wittier rejoinder!

I say we battle it out for supremacy. In a bathtub full of green jello.

Mmmm.... lime-y....
Neesika
16-07-2008, 03:20
*bangs head against fictional wall while stroking fictional penis, cuz no one can tell me it's not possible!*
Neesika
16-07-2008, 03:20
Mmmm.... lime-y....

Can't keep it out of your bikini.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 03:21
They can have the heroes research in their hideout if they wanted to.

So, basically, you want every comic book to be batman? Lame. And the fact is, they obviously don't want to. But by all means, show us how cool it is, go ahead, make up your own book, I'm sure people would love to read about the incredible amazing adventures of the powerful and brave superhero. Look, it's...criminal psychologist man! He understands their motives! He understands their desires! He knows that sometimes a cigar is just a cigar!
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 03:22
Can't keep it out of your bikini.

there are bikinis? I'm seriously disappointed.
Muravyets
16-07-2008, 03:22
Being one step ahead will make them look cooler when they deal with the fictional crimes in their fictional land. You were implying that I didn't know they were fictional, yes?
No, it won't. It will make komix be only 1 page long. Them not being one step ahead is why we can have stories about them. With drama. And suspense. And all that other story-type stuff.
Neesika
16-07-2008, 03:22
there are bikinis? I'm seriously disappointed.

You have no idea how awesome a jelloed up g-string can feel.
Muravyets
16-07-2008, 03:24
David Bowie's junk!

My kids love that movie. Actually I love that movie and I've converted my children.

Yet we're all clear that David Bowie isn't actually the Goblin King.

Well, if he isn't, then the goblins are missing a bet, because how cool would it be to have Bowie as your king? And Iman as your queen? I'd vote for that.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 03:24
You have no idea how awesome a jelloed up g-string can feel.

on whom? You? Who said I was in this for your feelings?
Muravyets
16-07-2008, 03:25
yes, and batman is an exception to "It's not cool when superheroes research". Of course batman manages to pull it off for two reasons:

1) he has no superpowers, so his status as "world's greatest detective" is part and parcel of his actual superhero persona

2) when he researches he does so in a cave surrounded by fucking bats. That's hardcore.
It also works because he's the only one who does it, for the most part. If everybody did it, komix would be just pictures of people reading computer screens. Oh, yay!
Non Aligned States
16-07-2008, 03:26
Whose to say that the other heroes can't research in some cool way? Besides they have to occasionally research and improvise when the villain is resistant to their powers.

Because Sherlock Holmes doesn't appeal to the same market as those that likes people in spandex causing general mayhem and destruction.
Heikoku 2
16-07-2008, 03:26
See: Batman.

And Kat has a point.

Moreover, it's not a sociological thing. Comics simplify, and sociological issues in comics tend to be boring. Elaborating on JuNii's points:

Brainiac is an evil, megalomaniacal computer.

Jonathan "Scarecrow" Crane is a nerd yearning for revenge with a fear gas.

Gervis "Mad Hatter" Tetch is a nerd with a broken heart and some mind-control.

Apocalypse wants to destroy the world.

Joker is a psychopath, Twoface has multiple personality disorder, Riddler has an OCD.

Of course, there are many villains whose only or main motivation is money, but those aren't looking to get out of poverty, those are looking to get filthy rich, and they tend to have enough money to get by as non-villains. Some of them even "retire", as is the case of the Penguin.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 03:26
It also works because he's the only one who does it, for the most part. If everybody did it, komix would be just pictures of people reading computer screens. Oh, yay!

are we seriously still talking about this? Can't we go back to you in Neesika naked in a tub of jello?
Muravyets
16-07-2008, 03:26
Can't keep it out of your bikini.

So true. So true. I did tons of research about it. In my cave. ;)
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 03:27
So true. So true. I did tons of research about it. In my cave. ;)

thus proof that seeing someone do something is infinity more fun than seeing someone researching it.
Muravyets
16-07-2008, 03:29
are we seriously still talking about this? Can't we go back to you in Neesika naked in a tub of jello?
We're not naked. We have bikinis on. And you're apparently too lazy to do anything about that.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 03:31
We're not naked. We have bikinis on. And you're apparently too lazy to do anything about that.

I could...but it's more fun to wait for one of you to rip it off the other.
Muravyets
16-07-2008, 03:31
thus proof that seeing someone do something is infinity more fun than seeing someone researching it.
So true. So true. I can assure you that watching me and Neesika fighting for supremacy in a vat of green jello is going to be a lot more fun than watching us sit in said jello vat reading books about how to wash jello out of a bikini.

To prove this, I suggest we make you watch the second scenario before the first.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 03:32
To prove this, I suggest we make you watch the second scenario before the first.

Tease.....

I kinda like that in a woman...
Muravyets
16-07-2008, 03:32
I could...but it's more fun to wait for one of you to rip it off the other.
Pfft. As if she could rip anything off me... HA!
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 03:37
Pfft. As if she could rip anything off me... HA!

the only way to find out is to try.
Muravyets
16-07-2008, 03:44
the only way to find out is to try.

Maybe tomorrow...
Poliwanacraca
16-07-2008, 03:54
Hey, guys, I just had a thought! How come the characters in horror movies always go walking around dark scary places alone? I mean, the killer totally wouldn't catch them if they all stayed together in a brightly lit place and waited for the police to show up! How come they never do that?

Oh, man, and I just had another thought! You know that Captain Ahab dude? Why didn't he just give up chasing the whale and go home? That would have been pretty smart!
Neesika
16-07-2008, 03:56
on whom? You? Who said I was in this for your feelings?

You? Who said I was in this for you at all?

My intention is to get Mur'v naked, wet, and limey tasting. It's more fun when there are clothes to peel off with my teeth.
Neesika
16-07-2008, 03:58
So true. So true. I can assure you that watching me and Neesika fighting for supremacy in a vat of green jello is going to be a lot more fun than watching us sit in said jello vat reading books about how to wash jello out of a bikini.

To prove this, I suggest we make you watch the second scenario before the first.

That made me guffaw.

I can read REALLY sexily though...:D
Neesika
16-07-2008, 03:58
Pfft. As if she could rip anything off me... HA!

Oh sister, it's ON!
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 03:59
That made me guffaw.

I can read REALLY sexily though...:D

it's the hot teacher phenomenon
Neesika
16-07-2008, 03:59
Hey, guys, I just had a thought! How come the characters in horror movies always go walking around dark scary places alone? I mean, the killer totally wouldn't catch them if they all stayed together in a brightly lit place and waited for the police to show up! How come they never do that?

Oh, man, and I just had another thought! You know that Captain Ahab dude? Why didn't he just give up chasing the whale and go home? That would have been pretty smart!
I adore you.

Do you like green jello?
Neesika
16-07-2008, 04:00
it's the hot teacher phenomenon

Somehow I can't picture you in the horny student role.
Heikoku 2
16-07-2008, 04:01
Okay, in the OP's defense, Literature Theory tends to discuss this kind of thing, albeit in a deeper way and with better-formulated question, but nonetheless.
Poliwanacraca
16-07-2008, 04:03
I adore you.

Do you like green jello?

Mmm, green jello. ;)

I dunno though...three of us in the jello might make poor NA's head explode.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 04:05
Somehow I can't picture you in the horny student role.

you never knew me in highschool. But it is true, I tend to be the one holding the ruler...
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 04:07
Hey guys? I am writing a new comic book, I just finished the first edition, tell me what you think?

http://www.waterford.lib.mi.us/adult/watehist/scholarblue.gif
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 04:08
I dunno though...three of us in the jello might make poor NA's head explode.

Yeah, but, what a way to go.
Neesika
16-07-2008, 04:10
Mmm, green jello. ;)

I dunno though...three of us in the jello might make poor NA's head explode.

You say that like it's a bad thing.

Besides, I'd be getting my thrills, his possible demise is certainly worth THAT.
Muravyets
16-07-2008, 04:10
Oh sister, it's ON!
Bring your pliers. All my bathing suits are from Land's End.

Somehow I can't picture you in the horny student role.
Heh, I can picture him that way, easily.

Okay, in the OP's defense, Literature Theory tends to discuss this kind of thing, albeit in a deeper way and with better-formulated question, but nonetheless.
OK, then I refer you to my earlier post in which I pointed out that if the writers did as SL suggests, komix would be 1 page long. And their publishers would be working at Denny's. Why? Because:

A) A hero who is ahead of the villain right from the start doesn't make for a very dramatic or suspenseful story. It doesn't make for much story at all.

B) We are talking about a visual medium. They have to look amazing. One splash panel of a guy in a unitard reading a text on criminal psychology could look amazing, but a whole book of such panels? Even if they are broken up with the whizz-bang taking-a-break-for-coffee-and-a-leak sequences? I'm thinking not so much. Not much audience. Not much challenge for writers and artists. Not much of a business to profit from.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 04:11
Besides, I'd be getting my thrills, his possible demise is certainly worth THAT.

bite me bitch.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 04:12
Heh, I can picture him that way, easily.

Stop undressing me with your mind.

...wait, what the fuck am I saying?

Carry on.
Neesika
16-07-2008, 04:12
bite me bitch.

I'm busy wearing my molars out on Mur'v's Land's End freaking bikini bottoms.

But if you insist, I could make you bleed a little.
Poliwanacraca
16-07-2008, 04:12
Hey guys? I am writing a new comic book, I just finished the first edition, tell me what you think?

http://www.waterford.lib.mi.us/adult/watehist/scholarblue.gif

I can't wait for the movie version. I'm thinking maybe Brad Pitt as the scholar and "Current Perspectives in Forensic Psychology" as the book?
Muravyets
16-07-2008, 04:12
hey Guys? I Am Writing A New Comic Book, I Just Finished The First Edition, Tell Me What You Think?

http://www.waterford.lib.mi.us/adult/watehist/scholarblue.gif

Ka-zaaam!!!!
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 04:14
But if you insist, I could make you bleed a little.

hmm...that's kinda hot....
Muravyets
16-07-2008, 04:17
OK, you bunch of perverts, I gotta go. Now I expect you all to do some really ridiculous stuff to me while I'm not watching, so I'll have something to work with when I come back tomorrow. Get busy.
Poliwanacraca
16-07-2008, 04:17
You say that like it's a bad thing.

Besides, I'd be getting my thrills, his possible demise is certainly worth THAT.

Well, sure, but someone would have to clean up the mess, and scrubbing exploded brain off the bathroom tiles is bound to be a bit of a buzzkill.
Heikoku 2
16-07-2008, 04:17
OK, then I refer you to my earlier post in which I pointed out that if the writers did as SL suggests, komix would be 1 page long. And their publishers would be working at Denny's. Why? Because:

A) A hero who is ahead of the villain right from the start doesn't make for a very dramatic or suspenseful story. It doesn't make for much story at all.

B) We are talking about a visual medium. They have to look amazing. One splash panel of a guy in a unitard reading a text on criminal psychology could look amazing, but a whole book of such panels? Even if they are broken up with the whizz-bang taking-a-break-for-coffee-and-a-leak sequences? I'm thinking not so much. Not much audience. Not much challenge for writers and artists. Not much of a business to profit from.

I never said I disagreed, just saying that it's not SUCH a stupid Op. ;)
Neesika
16-07-2008, 04:17
hmm...that's kinda hot....

You'll have to tell me about these changes in you.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 04:20
You'll have to tell me about these changes in you.

no changes, just occasional boredom :p
Neesika
16-07-2008, 04:25
no changes, just occasional boredom :p

Bored enough to let me flog you?
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 04:27
Bored enough to let me flog you?

no, never that bored. More like "bored enough to let it pass if you do something you weren't supposed to and not drag you across the room by your hair"
Neesika
16-07-2008, 04:30
I have no hair.

And too bad.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 04:32
I have no hair.

Alternative arrangements can be made

And too bad.

It's cute how you are pretending to be all dommy these days.
Neesika
16-07-2008, 04:35
Not at all. Just bitchy. Although I think I could work out my aggression on someone.

I doubt GoG'd let me work him over though :D

I should ask...
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 04:39
Not at all. Just bitchy. Although I think I could work out my aggression on someone.

Funny, i always thought that when you got bitchy you preferred someone to work it out on you...

I doubt GoG'd let me work him over though :D

I should ask...

Quite, better him than me.
Straughn
16-07-2008, 04:45
did we seriously get a thread questioning the behavior of superheroes? SERIOUSLY?
The religion threads were slow.
Close enough.
Neesika
16-07-2008, 04:46
Funny, i always thought that when you got bitchy you preferred someone to work it out on you...
I have biyay for that, but come on now, I'm multifaceted :P



Quite, better him than me.
I'll refrain from comment:D
Straughn
16-07-2008, 04:49
I'm busy wearing my molars out on Mur'v's Land's End freaking bikini bottoms.
Again with the sigworthiness.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 04:52
I'll refrain from comment:D

Hey if he lets you beat him, more power to ya. Just saying, it won't ever be me :p
Grave_n_idle
16-07-2008, 05:30
David Bowie's junk!

My kids love that movie. Actually I love that movie and I've converted my children.

Yet we're all clear that David Bowie isn't actually the Goblin King.

It is an awesome movie.

The connection here was - Labyrinth is one of those stories that is about stories. It's not unforgivable to discuss literature within the frame of scenario. It doesn't mean you think it's 'real', and it's not necessarily a bad thing. There is still value to be obtained from even fictional experiences.

(Galaxy Quest would be another one that could be on that list, too....)
Straughn
16-07-2008, 05:31
I have no hair.EVERYwhere?
Straughn
16-07-2008, 05:31
Hey if he lets you beat him, more power to ya. Just saying, it won't ever be me :pNot with your fists, feet, elbows, knees, or forehead, to be sure.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 05:33
It is an awesome movie.

The connection here was - Labyrinth is one of those stories that is about stories. It's not unforgivable to discuss literature within the frame of scenario. It doesn't mean you think it's 'real', and it's not necessarily a bad thing. There is still value to be obtained from even fictional experiences.

(Galaxy Quest would be another one that could be on that list, too....)

Well, there are a couple of ways to frame it. First if we look at fictional character types as archtypes, we can begin to imagine why we have those archtypes, what do they represent about society, is there a reason they are the way they are? We can talk about HOW we design characters, and why.

But to phrase it as "why do superheroes not just research the bad guys?" is nonsensical.
Grave_n_idle
16-07-2008, 05:39
Well, there are a couple of ways to frame it. First if we look at fictional character types as archtypes, we can begin to imagine why we have those archtypes, what do they represent about society, is there a reason they are the way they are? We can talk about HOW we design characters, and why.

But to phrase it as "why do superheroes not just research the bad guys?" is nonsensical.

Not nonsensical - just simplistic. And that's not necessarily a bad premise for an opening question.

Unless the OP is somehow suggesting that the superheroes are 'real' (which isn't the indication I picked up), in which case a better question would be "why don't the superheroes just read the comics in which the villains get served, so they can jump straight to kicking their ass next time they meet them"?

Or, "If there are superheroes... why the hell are we wasting all that money in Iraq".

etc.
Neo Art
16-07-2008, 05:41
Not nonsensical - just simplistic. And that's not necessarily a bad premise for an opening question.

If you have the intellectual wherewithal to actually understand what it is you're talking about.
Grave_n_idle
16-07-2008, 05:44
If you have the intellectual wherewithal to actually understand what it is you're talking about.

Maybe I'm erring on the side of charitable.

It's not an unworthwhile chain-of-thought, anyway - so I don't feel like I'm wasting efforts on it. That kind of diversion has been known to spawn some worthy moments. "Watchmen", maybe. "The Others", perhaps.
Straughn
16-07-2008, 05:49
Unless the OP is somehow suggesting that the superheroes are 'real'
http://weblogs.newsday.com/entertainment/tv/blog/superherocrop.jpg
http://l.yimg.com/img.tv.yahoo.com/tv/us/img/site/07/15/0000040715_20070626145306.jpg
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/08/03/arts/television/03heff.html?_r=1&oref=slogin
A few there in the third one ... *salivates*
Hachihyaku
16-07-2008, 10:36
If superheroes studiedit'd be easier for them to know what the villain is going to do thus putting out heroes one step ahead.

Because super heroes can't be arsed with it. and they don't need to, theuy've got big fists to stop crime when it happens. That and who wants to watch/read about some ones progress in a social studies class...
Muravyets
17-07-2008, 03:57
Alternative arrangements can be made



It's cute how you are pretending to be all dommy these days.
It's cute when you do it, too. I mean, really, this?
no, never that bored. More like "bored enough to let it pass if you do something you weren't supposed to and not drag you across the room by your hair"
As if. :D
Neo Art
17-07-2008, 04:04
As if. :D

You don't know me too well do you? :p
Muravyets
17-07-2008, 04:05
Not nonsensical - just simplistic. And that's not necessarily a bad premise for an opening question.

<snip>
Actually, I think it's a very poorly framed opening question, because it is easily answered in a way that limit discussion. The reason why things are not done as the OP suggests is because it would create a plot structure that simply does not support the kind of story that superheroes are made for.

I believe there actually have been superhero stories that have been detailed procedural dramas and others that have been character-driven emotional dramas. But these have all been short-run, stand-alone stories, not series, such as most superhero venues. This is because they (deliberately) go against the grain of the superhero concept, which requires plot-driven action. That's what people go to superhero stories for -- plot-driven action, not intellectual challenge or emotional immersion.

There might be a couple of hours of discussion possible on why superhero stories are so dependent on action, but once you establish the technical WHY of it, there is nothing more to say really. As soon as you know that there is a reason why it is done the way it is, there is little argument to be made that it would be "cooler" if it was done some other way. Superheroes would not be cooler superheroes if they were criminal psychologists because, if they did, they might be cool, but they wouldn't be superheroes.
Hotwife
17-07-2008, 04:05
I am the evil supervillain, The Shameless Propagandist.
Muravyets
17-07-2008, 04:07
You don't know me too well do you? :p
Let's put it this way: I can imagine you trying.
Neo Art
17-07-2008, 04:08
Let's put it this way: I can imagine you trying.

I see this and read it one way. You think about me "that way"
Muravyets
17-07-2008, 04:16
I see this and read it one way. You think about me "that way"
Always on the make -- that's all there is to you. :p

Bah! These new smilies suck! That's not the face I was trying to make.
Skalvia
17-07-2008, 04:19
Criminology? Sounds like a fancy word for Pussy to me! Look, Superman doesnt psychoanalyze Doomsday, he kicks his arse...seriously...
Neo Art
17-07-2008, 04:21
Criminology? Sounds like a fancy word for Pussy to me! Look, Superman doesnt psychoanalyze Doomsday, he kicks his arse...seriously...

doomsday killed superman....
Neo Art
17-07-2008, 04:21
Always on the make -- that's all there is to you. :p

Never claimed otherwise

Bah! These new smilies suck! That's not the face I was trying to make.

Oh? what were you trying to do with your tongue?
Skalvia
17-07-2008, 04:22
doomsday killed superman....

Thats the joke friend, lol...Skalvia wasnt being serious...
Muravyets
17-07-2008, 04:25
Never claimed otherwise



Oh? what were you trying to do with your tongue?
Something cuter.
The Goddess Ayanami
17-07-2008, 05:45
There's already a lot of research in terms of what makes criminals, and really with some of the many super villains the reasons are also fairly obvious. The problem is that people either fck with the really smart people...or they ignore the dangerous eco terrorists wannabes (Think Batman & Robin with Poison Ivy in her civilin life talking about letting people freeze to death to save the Earth). It's more like the government and society thinks it knows best and just ignores it. Like the way our government thinks harsher prison time will deter criminals, when crime is DIRECTLY RELATED to EDUCATION, or rather LACK THEREOF.