NationStates Jolt Archive


Cyber witch-hunts - the internet as lynch mob social enforcement

Daistallia 2104
11-07-2008, 16:38
The internet seems tailor made for cyber lynch mobs.

From flash mob to lynch mob

(CNN) -- A Korean woman receives death threats because she wouldn't clean up her dog's mess on the subway; a Chinese man suspected of philandering is besieged by angry emails and phone calls; an American college student caught plagiarizing online is turned in by incensed bloggers.

Forget Big Brother, it's the Internet mob that's watching you...

It's a long time since the Internet was populated purely by geeks and freaks. Our personas in virtual space are increasingly integrated with our "real life" identities; a growing number of people have Facebook profiles, blogs and Flickr accounts.

And our physical and virtual worlds are meshing, too. "Flash mobbing" is one of the Internet's stranger crazes. Groups of people organized by Web sites, email and text message descend on public spaces to take part in bizarre demonstrations of performance art.

The first Flash mob took place at Macy's in New York City in June 2003 when over a hundred people converged in the rug department.

The phenomenon has spread to flash parties on subway trains and silent flash raves in train stations in Great Britain; flash pillow fights in Toronto; zombie flash mobs in San Francisco; and a flash proposal of marriage to one girl in Beijing.

Flash mobbing is seen at worst as a nuisance that can delay commuters and other travelers who encounter mobs in action. But groups of people have been harnessed via the Internet for purposes other than entertainment -- and one of these phenomena, known as "mobbing," is more sinister.

In 2005, a woman known as "Dog Poop Girl" became the victim of an Internet shame attack when, after refusing to clean up after her dog on a South Korean subway train, another commuter posted her picture on the Internet. She was quickly identified, her personal details were posted online, she was subjected to harassment and she even received death threats.

In a recent article for TIME magazine, web guru Jaron Lanier wrote, "Collectives tend to be mean, to designate official enemies, to be violent, and to discourage creative, rigorous thought... We might be genetically wired to be vulnerable to the lure of the mob."

And Lanier thinks it could go further. "What's to stop an online mass of anonymous but connected people from suddenly turning into a mean mob, just like masses of people have time and time again in the history of every human culture?"

Some say it's already happening.

Internet mobbing is most prevalent in South East Asian countries, where social norms are strict yet perceived as under threat. People are targeted when they are thought to have deviated from those norms. Along with Dog Poop Girl, vigilantes have pursued other targets with menacing enthusiasm.

It took just five days in 2006 for vigilantes to track down the "Stiletto Kitten Killer" -- a Chinese woman who was videoed crushing a kitten's skull with her high-heeled shoe. Both she and the man who filmed her had their personal and contact information posted across the Internet, along with Internet "Wanted" posters. They lost their jobs and had to issue public apologies, a stern punishment in a country where animal protection laws do not exist.

The same year, a manhunt was on to catch the "Shanghai Sex Blogger", a Western expat who detailed his dalliances with numerous Chinese women. Chinese bloggers raged against him. One, a professor of psychology at the Shanghai Academy of Social Sciences, called for an "Internet hunt for the immoral foreigner" and called repeatedly for the man to be "found and kicked out of China!!!"

In another well-known Chinese case, an angry husband who suspected his wife was having an affair with a college student she'd met in an online game asked for help tracking him down. The Associated Press reported that the student, who denied the accusation, was bombarded with harassing and threatening e-mails.

This vigilante action might be prompted by understandable moral outrage, but some are concerned that the headline-grabbing witch-hunts have been vastly out of proportion with the original transgressions.

Vigilantes have not stopped at reprimanding their quarry: They have shamed them publicly in front of thousands of people; their identities and personal details have been posted for all to see, making them vulnerable to fraud and identity theft; they and their families have been harassed.

A director at South Korea's Ministry of Information and Communications, Oh Sang Kyoon told the International Herald Tribune, "Victims cannot live a normal life. They quit jobs and run away from society. They even flee the country. It's like lynching victims in a 'people's court on the Web.'"

It's hard not to feel sympathy for some targets of mobbing. An American college student known as "Laura K. Krishna" (not her real name) was caught out when she offered a stranger $75 via instant messenger to write a paper for her.

Unfortunately for her, the person she approached, comedy writer and blogger Nate Kushner, accepted her offer and blogged about it, hoping to teach the plagiarist a lesson. But the story was seized by enraged bloggers and quickly span out of control: They flooded her home and college with emails and phone calls, demanding she be kicked out of school.

Laura K. Krishna quickly became the butt of McJob jokes and her long-term employment prospects suffered (ask any employer who Googles a potential recruit before hiring; her real name is still easily obtainable online). There's no doubt that plagiarism is wrong, but was the punishment meted out to her appropriate for her crime?

A commenter posting as "Joanna" thinks not. She wrote on Nate Kushner's blog, "I felt slightly sick when I read that, apparently, a fair number of people on this thread want to see 'Ms. Krishna' expelled, publicly flayed, drawn and quartered, et cetera.

"As a college student working my a** off for an English degree, I have no respect for this girl ... but she is, above all, just a stupid kid who did a stupid thing."

Once they're targeted, there's little that people can do to remove details about them online. Information travels fast and can be replicated with ease. Nate Kushner removed Laura K. Krishna's name and college from his site at the request of her mother, but her details remain on other sites. It would take remarkable concerted effort -- and co-operation from Web site owners -- to expunge her information from the Internet.

This is partly because the Internet is not regulated by any one set of laws. It transcends national boundaries, and makes recourse to legal avenues complicated, expensive and questionably effective, as Brazilian model Daniela Cicarelli found when she tried to use the law to remove YouTube videos of her romping in the sea with her banker boyfriend.

As fast as YouTube took down the videos, they were re-posted, while the press coverage of the lawsuit simply sparked more interest in the footage, plus a whole host of spoof tributes.

The most concerning aspect of mobbing, though, is the way large groups of people can be mobilized to attack a perceived transgressor without their accusers providing any real evidence of their guilt. On the Internet, the mob can be judge and jury.

One American blogger, Jason, has touted the use of mobbing as a tool to hold public officials accountable for their actions. "Isn't the threat of hundreds of people calling you during dinner to tell you what a jerk you are seem like it would make you tone it down a bit?" he wrote. "When I see an infuriating story crop up on Digg, I'm going to dig for personal information about the offenders and post it to the comments," he continued.

But while Jason's intentions might be to protect the public, can mob rule be a viable option for any society? Some argue that virtual lynchings will only turn transgressors into victims. Even online, as the saying goes, two wrongs don't make a right.

In the meantime, those thinking of the Internet as an idyllic place for freedom of expression would be wise to take heed: say what you like, but remember that the mob is watching you...

The most recent example was here in Japan, where a lynch mob of rightwing bloggers and forumers forced a major newspaper to stop a column in it's English edition they thought was impinging the good name of Japan by presenting English versions of Japanese tabloid articles.
http://www.smh.com.au/news/world/japan-rails-at-australians-tabloid-trash/2008/07/04/1214951041660.html?page=fullpage#contentSwap1

Note that this incident was replete with death threats, exageration, and all the other features of the modern lynch mob.
Do you think such behaviour is OK?
How should it be dealt with?
Is it possible to stop it?
Barringtonia
11-07-2008, 16:53
Great article.

As much as any new phenomenon is born of chaos, it will settle down at some point. There'll certainly be victims along the way.

I find the Internet fascinating in terms of human behaviour expressing without constraint, for good or for bad.

Probably deserves a longer answer.
Call to power
11-07-2008, 16:53
its one of the reasons why I don't have any personal pages and avoid any forum where the posters have the ability/intelligence to track me down and kill me...

it can't really be stopped until institutions are put in place to control the internet which I guess will be pretty soon seeing as how its really starting to push its luck
Dinaverg
11-07-2008, 16:59
its one of the reasons why I don't have any personal pages and avoid any forum where the posters have the ability/intelligence to track me down and kill me...

it can't really be stopped until institutions are put in place to control the internet which I guess will be pretty soon seeing as how its really starting to push its luck

What sort of institutions, precisely?
Call to power
11-07-2008, 17:04
What sort of institutions, precisely?

I got no idea probabaly some sort of internet cops who have international jurisdiction or maybe just the riddance of net neutrality
Dinaverg
11-07-2008, 17:21
I got no idea probabaly some sort of internet cops who have international jurisdiction or maybe just the riddance of net neutrality

Internet cops?
Nanatsu no Tsuki
11-07-2008, 17:32
It's like the SS Internet Gestapo. It's kinda scary to think that even on the net you can get attacked by your peers. Wait... wait... I'm posting this on NSG. Silly me, I already know what cyber-witch hunts are. You see them here every day. (Of course, not to the extent of the OP.:p)
Philosopy
11-07-2008, 17:39
It's not surprising that this has happened. Those of us who use forums such as this one have been observing for years the 'internet-anonymity-makes-nice-people-arseholes' phenomenon, so it was bound to spill over into real life at some point.

It's going to get worse as the people who are currently teenagers grow up. It's as if they have no sense of privacy, and seem to put absolutely everything about themselves online; information that will then be used by the people who would abuse it.
Dinaverg
11-07-2008, 17:49
It's not surprising that this has happened. Those of us who use forums such as this one have been observing for years the 'internet-anonymity-makes-nice-people-arseholes' phenomenon, so it was bound to spill over into real life at some point.

It's going to get worse as the people who are currently teenagers grow up. It's as if they have no sense of privacy, and seem to put absolutely everything about themselves online; information that will then be used by the people who would abuse it.

hehe, you're talking about this like it's current events.
JuNii
11-07-2008, 17:56
hehe, you're talking about this like it's current events.

isn't it? you have cyber bullying going on right now.

add to that all the 'post your information here' threads in forums all over the place.

as for enforcement on the webs? you already have PJ hunting down child molesters, is a branch of police or Feds setting up a 'Net Force' type division that far off?
Conserative Morality
11-07-2008, 18:45
It's like the SS Internet Gestapo. It's kinda scary to think that even on the net you can get attacked by your peers. Wait... wait... I'm posting this on NSG. Silly me, I already know what cyber-witch hunts are. You see them here every day. (Of course, not to the extent of the OP.:p)

She's a witch burn her!

How do you know she's a witch?

Just look how she's dressed!

They dressed me up like this!

...:D
Nanatsu no Tsuki
11-07-2008, 19:26
She's a witch burn her!

How do you know she's a witch?

Just look how she's dressed!

They dressed me up like this!

...:D

Oh, but I'm a witch. And I will put a spell on you:
Allahoooo allahayyy, CM will now be gayyyyyyy!!!

:D
Dinaverg
11-07-2008, 19:29
isn't it? you have cyber bullying going on right now.

add to that all the 'post your information here' threads in forums all over the place.

as for enforcement on the webs? you already have PJ hunting down child molesters, is a branch of police or Feds setting up a 'Net Force' type division that far off?

I mean, he's talking about it as though it began recently.
Dinaverg
11-07-2008, 19:30
Oh, but I'm a witch. And I will put a spell on you:
Allahoooo allahayyy, CM will now be gayyyyyyy!!!

:D

Bit of a waste of magic, innit?
Call to power
11-07-2008, 19:31
Internet cops?

super mods with crazy real life deat powers!
Dinaverg
11-07-2008, 19:31
super mods with crazy real life deat powers!

I can't stop thinking Robocop.
Nanatsu no Tsuki
11-07-2008, 19:32
Bit of a waste of magic, innit?

I don't know that for certain so... let it be known you brought it up.:p
Intangelon
11-07-2008, 19:39
One more way for those "without sin" to cast any number of stones and feel oh, so much better about themselves for having cast them.

Transgressions need to be addressed, and public shaming for public crimes is an idea with some merit. But what's good about public shaming is that after the violator has been punished, he or she is supposed to be welcomed back into greater society with no lingering aftereffects beyond remembering her shame and using it to avoid future transgressions.

This internet mob thing leaves the shame out there, unresolved, for an unknown amount of time. On top of that, it leaves the violator vulnerable to retaliations from people who were never offended in the first place, and to retaliations that far outweigh the original infraction.

This strikes me as one more way for people to get their nosy fix and get an air of superiority all at the same time. Bad combination, if you ask me.
JuNii
11-07-2008, 19:46
I mean, he's talking about it as though it began recently.

ah, my mistake. :p
Conserative Morality
11-07-2008, 19:51
Oh, but I'm a witch. And I will put a spell on you:
Allahoooo allahayyy, CM will now be gayyyyyyy!!!

:D
Huh? Oh dear...

Hey, Zach? Remember all those jokes you made that you made when I came in with that colorful tye-die shirt? Well...:p
Intangelon
11-07-2008, 19:55
Huh? Oh dear...

Hey, Zach? Remember all those jokes you made that you made when I came in with that colorful tye-die shirt? Well...:p

CM gay? What's next, locusts?
Conserative Morality
11-07-2008, 20:02
CM gay? What's next, locusts?

No, that's AFTER Yahtzee says he likes "Lord British" :D
Nanatsu no Tsuki
11-07-2008, 20:18
CM gay? What's next, locusts?

Well, then I may have to ask: CM, no offense, but, are you gay?:p

You guys are confusing me so.:(
Conserative Morality
11-07-2008, 20:27
Well, then I may have to ask: CM, no offense, but, are you gay?:p

You guys are confusing me so.:(

Nah.
Intangelon
11-07-2008, 20:37
No, that's AFTER Yahtzee says he likes "Lord British" :D

YOU LAY OFF LORD BRITISH AND CHUCKLES!

They produced the only passable Car Wars game, and that was way back in the mid-80s. True, dozens of car warfare games have come and gone on platforms and PCs, but none with the detail of Autoduel. They included Steve Jackson's original rules and weapon-set, and instead of just getting a car, you had to design it from the ground up and pay for it from proceeds won in the dueling arena or on missions through lawless territory in low-end unmodifiable cars. That game, top-down, 2D, black-and-white Mac classic that it was, has yet to be approached in modern gaming. At least not by any game I've ever seen.

While I'm ranting old-school, let me say that no modern naval combat game has ever been as fun as Intellivision's Sea Battle or Sub Hunt. Sometimes I miss the 80s.
Neo Bretonnia
11-07-2008, 21:08
One more way for those "without sin" to cast any number of stones and feel oh, so much better about themselves for having cast them.

Transgressions need to be addressed, and public shaming for public crimes is an idea with some merit. But what's good about public shaming is that after the violator has been punished, he or she is supposed to be welcomed back into greater society with no lingering aftereffects beyond remembering her shame and using it to avoid future transgressions.

This internet mob thing leaves the shame out there, unresolved, for an unknown amount of time. On top of that, it leaves the violator vulnerable to retaliations from people who were never offended in the first place, and to retaliations that far outweigh the original infraction.

This strikes me as one more way for people to get their nosy fix and get an air of superiority all at the same time. Bad combination, if you ask me.

Not unlike sex offender registries, a form of Government sponsored cyber witch hunting.
Intangelon
11-07-2008, 21:13
Not unlike sex offender registries, a form of Government sponsored cyber witch hunting.

Agreed.
Intangelon
11-07-2008, 21:15
Well, then I may have to ask: CM, no offense, but, are you gay?:p

You guys are confusing me so.:(

It's ironic for CM to hit on a male poster. He was kidding. The kidding flows fast and loose around here. You'll get used to it, especially when you get to know posters' usual proclivities and see them deliberately contradict them, as CM did.

No worries, sweetness.
Fidget Lovers
11-07-2008, 21:18
The Internet mob is watching as I write this message, ready to pounce. :|:eek:
Vault 10
11-07-2008, 21:22
It took just five days in 2006 for vigilantes to track down the "Stiletto Kitten Killer" -- a Chinese woman who was videoed crushing a kitten's skull with her high-heeled shoe. Both she and the man who filmed her had their personal and contact information posted across the Internet, along with Internet "Wanted" posters. They lost their jobs and had to issue public apologies, a stern punishment in a country where animal protection laws do not exist.
Fair. Even soft.


In 2005, a woman known as "Dog Poop Girl" became the victim of an Internet shame attack when, after refusing to clean up after her dog on a South Korean subway train, another commuter posted her picture on the Internet.
So what, you shit in a train, and you object to such a small consequence as having your photo posted on the net?


As fast as YouTube took down the videos, they were re-posted, while the press coverage of the lawsuit simply sparked more interest in the footage, plus a whole host of spoof tributes.
Official TV does the same thing, it takes specific people and makes them famous. And now we see how it participates in the mobbing, too.

How many stories have you seen covered on TV? So what now, ban TV? What does make the actions of TV more just than those of the Anonymous, that TV has a 'casting license? That TV is run by the "elites" and Internet by the working class man?


Is it possible to stop it?
Yes (ban internet), but there's no need to.
Neo Bretonnia
11-07-2008, 21:26
Well, then I may have to ask: CM, no offense, but, are you gay?:p

You guys are confusing me so.:(

I don't know about CM but I am...

I'm a lesbian trapped in a man's body. :D
Intangelon
11-07-2008, 21:31
So what, you shit in a train, and you object to such a small consequence as having your photo posted on the net?

Uh...her picture and personal information. I would object vehemently. If I were fined, that's my punishment. It isn't up to Internet vigilantes to dispense "justice" that could easily spiral out of control.

And what of those falsely accused? If someone saw you doing something that was innocent/legal but easily misinterpreted and accused you of being a criminal publicly online, how would that sit with you?
Intangelon
11-07-2008, 21:32
I don't know about CM but I am...

I'm a lesbian trapped in a man's body. :D

You and Eddie Izzard.

Own any dresses, makeup or heels?
Philosopy
11-07-2008, 21:36
I mean, he's talking about it as though it began recently.

You're really showing your youth if you don't consider within the last 10 years to be recently.
Neo Bretonnia
11-07-2008, 21:38
You and Eddie Izzard.

Own any dresses, makeup or heels?

Nah. I wouldn't want to scare anybody.
Intangelon
11-07-2008, 21:41
Nah. I wouldn't want to scare anybody.

Or attract anybody? ;)
Dinaverg
11-07-2008, 22:41
You're really showing your youth if you don't consider within the last 10 years to be recently.

...Considering that, you know, the Internet as we know it is a teenager, It doesn't really have much meaning outside 'the last ten years'. You remember ten years ago? Bill Clinton, 2nd Millennium, VHS?
The Plutonian Empire
11-07-2008, 22:56
Ya know, my tarot cards said I'd be spied upon. I'm fairly certain that the cyber lynch mob is the culprit.
Neo Bretonnia
12-07-2008, 00:44
Or attract anybody? ;)

ew.
Nanatsu no Tsuki
12-07-2008, 16:18
I don't know about CM but I am...

I'm a lesbian trapped in a man's body. :D

Oh, no worries there Neo B, I already noticed your lesbian ways. And it´s the same with me, I´m a homosexual man trapped inside a woman´s body.


*cue to the lynching mob*

I´m also sure I was a witch burnt at the stake for hexing hairy men into going bald. The popularity of Rogaine is my fault.
Free Soviets
12-07-2008, 16:45
How should it be dealt with?
Is it possible to stop it?

well, we could turn it around - make a cyber-bullies list where we track down the personal information of anyone who acts out of all proportion in fake outrage and put that on the tubes too. though, of course, this just means that stuff like that will eventually just be done from behind 7 proxies. but that may be too much hassle, and therefore the total volume would decrease.
Conserative Morality
12-07-2008, 16:55
Oh, no worries there Neo B, I already noticed your lesbian ways. And it´s the same with me, I´m a homosexual man trapped inside a woman´s body.


*cue to the lynching mob*

I´m also sure I was a witch burnt at the stake for hexing hairy men into going bald. The popularity of Rogaine is my fault.
I kept telling you ya shoulda invested in hair growth products, but noooo, you said

Merlin, it'll never work. Now quiet before the angry mob comes. I still have to complete this potion of eternal life.
Nanatsu no Tsuki
12-07-2008, 21:16
I kept telling you ya shoulda invested in hair growth products, but noooo, you said

Did I ever wrote that?
*shifty eyes*
Conserative Morality
12-07-2008, 23:42
Did I ever wrote that?
*shifty eyes*
Well, to be fair, you weren't finished with the potion of eternal youth at the time and had been taking a little too much Ale from the Inquisition...:p
NERVUN
13-07-2008, 00:07
As Terry Pratchett wrote, a mob is only as smart as the IQ of its dumbest member divided by the number of members.

Given the mass of people online and how dumb some of them are...

The real problem is that the members of the Internet mobs feel that they have protection from the same harassment they're dishing out because of the anonymous nature of the Internet. In RL, they wouldn't act this way out of fear.
Trans Fatty Acids
13-07-2008, 00:58
How many stories have you seen covered on TV? So what now, ban TV? What does make the actions of TV more just than those of the Anonymous, that TV has a 'casting license? That TV is run by the "elites" and Internet by the working class man?

Just to state the obvious: TV content is generated by a small number of identifiable individuals & entities who are subject to sanction if they cross a line; Internet content is generated by an exponentially larger number of mostly anonymous individuals who are much harder to identify, let alone sanction. (Though given the cost of technology that's usually involved in finding out someone's personal details and ruining their life, I'd hardly call them the huddled masses.)
Philosopy
13-07-2008, 08:23
...Considering that, you know, the Internet as we know it is a teenager, It doesn't really have much meaning outside 'the last ten years'. You remember ten years ago? Bill Clinton, 2nd Millennium, VHS?

Yes, quite clearly. And I'm not that old.

The internet is a baby, and so anything to do with it, whether email or video streaming, is still in its infancy.
Nanatsu no Tsuki
13-07-2008, 22:59
Well, to be fair, you weren't finished with the potion of eternal youth at the time and had been taking a little too much Ale from the Inquisition...:p

Ahhhh, you´re referring to that time. Yes, well, I was having fun and you were spoiling it by talking about the risks of achieving eternal youth. All I could hear was blah blah blah. Oh, and I´m sure it wasn´t ale what I was taking, it was most surely wine. I could tell by how much you were hiccuping after we left the pub.
Skyland Mt
13-07-2008, 23:03
The advantages of an unregulated medium of communication probably outweigh the negatives in maintaining a free society.

That said, if someone actually breaks a law through on-line activity, as in the case of death threats, by all means treat them as you would in any other case.

But I find it a bit odd that the quoted article puts turning in a plagerist up there with death threats and harassment. One is upholding the law, the others violating it.
Self-sacrifice
14-07-2008, 09:17
Word of mouth has become words on the internet. its still just as unreliable. Its just quicker and more effective at identifying the target

The people in the article all did something wrong. That dosnt excuse the actions but they arnt complete innocents mistakenly harassed by the internet.

When a mob forms by any method they will apply mob justice. This is just a difference from mob effectivness