NationStates Jolt Archive

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysoOB9w0tF4&feature=related

At least he's being honest, huh?

New York Times = far-left. :p

A good politician, even one who hates the brown people, should have distanced themselves from the "white Christian male power structure" statement.

New York Times = far-left. :p

A good politician, even one who hates the brown people, should have distanced themselves from the "white Christian male power structure" statement.

Pro White people do not "hate" brown people. We just love our own race. White nationalism is an act of love, I learned all about it on this weather information website I found.

Pro White people do not "hate" brown people. We just love our own race. White nationalism is an act of love, I learned all about it on this weather information website I found.

I think I know that site… it's the one with the "probability of eternal hellfire" forecast, right?

I think I know that site… it's the one with the "probability of eternal hellfire" forecast, right?

No, its mostly about bad weather conditions, storm fronts or something.

But for some reason, they have a freakin' HUGE section on Jews. I read it for 11 hours.

Meteorologists are highly educated, scientific people who develop some of the most sound and mathematically developed predictive models in the world. Why would they lie about Jews?

Meteorologists are highly educated, scientific people who develop some of the most sound and mathematically developed predictive models in the world.

Weather is a highly chaotic system, which is why meteorologists can really only realistically make predictions three days in advance.

Take that any way you want.

Weather is a highly chaotic system, which is why meteorologists can really only realistically make predictions three days in advance.

Take that any way you want.

I'm sick of you mocking my beliefs. You name ONE instance in the history of modern science where white political leaders have failed to anticipate and competently respond to enturbulated weather.

Fucking jew.

I'm sick of you mocking my beliefs. You name ONE instance in the history of modern science where white political leaders have failed to anticipate and competently respond to enturbulated weather.

http://updatecenter.britannica.com/eb/image?binaryId=8427&rendTypeId=4

I'm sick of you mocking my beliefs. You name ONE instance in the history of modern science where white political leaders have failed to anticipate and competently respond to enturbulated weather.

Fucking jew.

Napoleon.

Napoleon.

Napoleon was Corsican, not white. :p

http://updatecenter.britannica.com/eb/image?binaryId=8427&rendTypeId=4

Ben Franklin was a brilliant man, who tried to liberate our banking system from Jews, and for that, they had him killed, shot in the back by his own troops during the Revolutionary War, then had him replaced with a Jew lookalike with a prosthetic foreskin to complete the disguise.

Napoleon.

Oh, yeah?

Well, Wellington to you, schmuck.

Anyway, he only ran out of ammo because he trusted a JEWISH logistics manager. If he'd had a decent white person, and not a spy from the Zionist Elders of Learned Protocols, he'd have had the extra 20,000 rounds he needed to win at Waterloo.

Never trust a Jew to buy your ammo, they'll leave your good white soldiers with muskets that go "click", all to save a few Francs.

Andaras, I don't have Flash installed and I'm not going to install it. I don't like video as a source.

If you could post a link to a transcript of McCain's comments (or whatever the youtube is) I'll try to discuss it seriously before the thread is locked as either (a) a morass of "satirical" spam, or (b) a US election thread.

In before thread lock :p

McCain didn't say that himself. he didn't strike me as being particularly happy with the way the interview was going as a whole. I don't like the guy, but I don't think he's a white supremacist. All fox did was make themselves, as usual, look like a bunch of racist, rabid, rednecks in suits.

What the Italians are doing to the Roma is real and far worse that any wet dream fantasies the White Christian Male Power Structure in the US has about Mexican farm workers, who they need to prop up said power structure.

Transcript coming up!


…

McCain: The second thing, on the left, that they're against is the temporary worker, as you know. We say: "Two years, go back for a year, two years, go back for a year." They don't want that, they don't want them to have to go back. They say: "People can come and work".

O'Reilly: The strategy is… do you understand (and I'm not saying this in a condescending way, you're smarter than I am), but do you understand what the New York Times wants, what the far-left wants? They want to break down the white Christian male power structure *McCain begins nodding*, of which you're a part, and so am I, and they want to bring in millions of foreign nationals to basically break down the structure that we have. In that regard, Pat Buchanan is right. So I say that you've got to cap it with a number.

McCain: In America today we have a very strong economy, low unemployment. So we need additional foreign workers, including, by the way, agriculture, but there may come a time where we have an economic downturn and we don't need so many, so I think it has to vary.

O'Reilly: But in this bill, you guys got to cap it. You're estimating there's twelve million, there may be twenty! You don't know, I don't know, you've got to cap it!

McCain: We do, we do. I agree with you, but I also would remind you again that they have to get behind everybody else who tried to apply legally, they have to pay the fines, they have to go back to the country of origin…

O'Reilly: I got all that.

McCain: … it's a minimum of thirteen years, as you know, so to call that amnesty, in my view, is a stretch.

Transcript coming up!
The unrecognized name is Pat Buchanan.

And when he said 'strong economy' I almost chocked, but then the video is from over a year ago, I guess when they were trying to push through the immigration reform deally.

And this totally belongs in the election thread.

so McCain is against allowing too much migration

Good man. I dont like the growth where i live due to migration. i like the open spaces. Opening the borders will destroy the scenery and environment of your nation.
If they are needed for work keep them for a while (ie agriculture season) then send them back to their own country. The NZ scheme is working very well.
Each country should be for their own people.

New York Times = far-left. :p


Fox news = far-right

Fox news = far-right

*stops the presses*

so McCain is against allowing too much migration

Good man. I dont like the growth where i live due to migration. i like the open spaces. Opening the borders will destroy the scenery and environment of your nation.
If they are needed for work keep them for a while (ie agriculture season) then send them back to their own country. The NZ scheme is working very well.
Each country should be for their own people.

Damn right. Best thing I've seen on nationstates all day.

so McCain is against allowing too much migration

Good man. I dont like the growth where i live due to migration. i like the open spaces. Opening the borders will destroy the scenery and environment of your nation.
If they are needed for work keep them for a while (ie agriculture season) then send them back to their own country. The NZ scheme is working very well.
Each country should be for their own people.

Now I don't know what's "to much immigration" is for you, but a nation with 300 million people who takes LESS Iraq immigrants (who's existence are because of you) then a city in Sweden is, in my opinion, far to few. And immigration is very helpful for a nation, if I for example moved to the USA, your nation would save around 250 000$ for my education.

Now I don't know what's "to much immigration" is for you, but a nation with 300 million people who takes LESS Iraq immigrants (who's existence are because of you) then a city in Sweden is, in my opinion, far to few. And immigration is very helpful for a nation, if I for example moved to the USA, your nation would save around 250 000$ for my education.

Speaking as a white nationalist, hearing this kind of crap from a race traitor just leaves me spasming in annoyance.

Please, $250k in European education is hardly worth what we spend on incarcerating a single drug offender. Keep your "education", America already leads the world in that field.

You Swiss people should get a clue, and remember, the truth is always found in white.

This is satire. The poster you were responding to calls me a Nazi because they are oblivious to the literary method of satire. And yes, I know Swiss people are from Switzerland, and Swedes are from Sweden. I'd really appreciate it if you'd play along.

What a weird conversation. It's like O'reilly was prattling on about something that made McCain feel uncomfortable, and instead of being able to excuse himself, McCain went into autopilot and started spouting random comments from the platform.

Speaking as a white nationalist, hearing this kind of crap from a race traitor just leaves me spasming in annoyance.

Please, $250k in European education is hardly worth what we spend on incarcerating a single drug offender. Keep your "education", America already leads the world in that field.

You Swiss people should get a clue, and remember, the truth is always found in white.

This is satire. The poster you were responding to calls me a Nazi because they are oblivious to the literary method of satire. And yes, I know Swiss people are from Switzerland, and Swedes are from Sweden. I'd really appreciate it if you'd play along.

im not saying you should take in all immigrants, but you can give them a chance, maybe give them a 6 mouth of "temporary" stay and if they don't behave during that time kick them out. (this is of course not true for the people who needs help for example the Iraqis) but for example work immigration.

And education? http://hdrstats.undp.org/indicators/7.html USA aren't leading it, you are number 12..

What a weird conversation. It's like O'reilly was prattling on about something that made McCain feel uncomfortable, and instead of being able to excuse himself, McCain went into autopilot and started spouting random comments from the platform.

It's always possible he was trying to figure out whether or not O'Reilly was making fun of him.

im not saying you should take in all immigrants, but you can give them a chance, maybe give them a 6 mouth of "temporary" stay and if they don't behave during that time kick them out. (this is of course not true for the people who needs help for example the Iraqis) but for example work immigration.

And education? http://hdrstats.undp.org/indicators/7.html USA aren't leading it, you are number 12..

That poll is scientifically flawed in that it counts all Americans, not just whites. If you count just the whites, we're like Finland but with Nascar.

Immigrants never behave, they drive drunk, carry narcotics, and accomplish little else besides the occasional enormous contributions to science, art, culture, engineering, literature, and diversity of sexual technique.

You Swiss people don't have so many foreigners, that's why you only speak one language.

That poll is scientifically flawed in that it counts all Americans, not just whites. If you count just the whites, we're like Finland but with Nascar.

Immigrants never behave, they drive drunk, carry narcotics, and accomplish little else besides the occasional enormous contributions to science, art, culture, engineering, literature, and diversity of sexual technique.

You Swiss people don't have so many foreigners, that's why you only speak one language.

um? remember what I said about the Iraqis? 20% of Sweden's population are first or second generation immigrants. And one language? dude? we have English signs in the subway...

Methinks Hammurab was released back into society a little bit too early.

Helping another country reach democracy is the best approach to stop people wanting migration. The EU is too slack to bother with that. Instead they allow migration to be quite high to say they are nice people and doing something.

The births still occur where the dictators rule and in the end nothing is changes. It can even get worse

If democracy is successfully installed (and it could be in Iraq if the rich Europe and Asia actually contributed significantly) you improve the lives of an entire nation. Meaning millions. This is far better than a few thousand and it can last. It can last meaning that the millions under a caring democratic government can give birth to even more under a caring democratic government

Allowing migration does not treat the cause of the problem at all. But it is much easier to criticize a group for trying to improve the lives of a population then do something yourself.

Methinks Hammurab was released back into society a little bit too early.

I'm with you on that.

Since this is about immagration how is it about White privilege? Should it not be about American privilege? OR is this just the paper and the OP trying to beat up a story to make it seem as if McCain is against all non-whites.

Methinks Hammurab was released back into society a little bit too early.

Oh, please, you sound like that court-appointed psychiatrist who thinks that just because she did her post-doc research at Johns Hopkins, graduated first in her class at Harvard Medical (a Jew run school, by the way), and managed to restore me to functionality after a massive edema that should've rendered me dead, that I'm supposed to give a shit that she thinks I might benefit from 4 kg of rhysperdol administered three times a day and as needed.

Besides, I'm still in the day room, I don't get out until tomorrow.

You Swiss people don't have so many foreigners, that's why you only speak one language.

I am still deciding if you are a Troll, someone who is attempting to use humour or if you are deadset serious in your posts.

I however think that you will not be on this forum in 3 months time.

Did I miss something in that video?

No where did McCain support white supremecy. He admitted to being a part of the white christian male power structure, which is true since he is a white christian male, but nothing more.

Everything he said in that is exactly was in the failed McCain-Kennedy Immigration Reform bill that several moderate Democrats, including Obama, backed out of.

His comment about called a 13 year process toward citizenship for illegal migrant workers being amnesty was a direct defence against the right calling this bill too lenient on illegal immigration. He agreed with Bill O'Rielly that there should be a cap on foreign work visas, but that is something that we have had for years.

Again, where did he say that he hates hispanics, or any race for that matter? Where did he say he would defend white privilege?

Speaking as a white nationalist, hearing this kind of crap from a race traitor just leaves me spasming in annoyance.

Then it was all worth it.

I am still deciding if you are a Troll, someone who is attempting to use humour or if you are deadset serious in your posts.

I think it's fairly obvious that he's just a humorous persona.

I am still deciding if you are a Troll, someone who is attempting to use humour or if you are deadset serious in your posts.

I however think that you will not be on this forum in 3 months time.

As a white nationalist, let me just tell you, the truth is always in white.

And I've been here for years, thanks.

Of course, Kat might be pushing the button on me as I type this....

I think somebody was working on transcripts of the McCain speech, or more plausibly, a link thereto.

Anyway, for those who believe in white privilege (which is reasonable, considering the pervasive, if hopefully declining, racial disparity that is still observable in American culture), they probably aren't inclined to vote for McCain anyway, unless the aggregate of remaining issues provides clear impetus.

And I've been here for years, thanks.

Of course, Kat might be pushing the button on me as I type this....

So you have been, you just crawl from under your rock every now and then to post something and then go right back under I got sidetracked bu your lack of posts rather than by your join date.

I think it's fairly obvious that he's just a humorous persona.

I'll tell you, NW, if I've learned anything on nationstates, its that "obvious" is a comparative standard.

I'll tell you, NW, if I've learned anything on nationstates, its that "obvious" is a comparative standard.

Comparative and competitive. When you've reached the point where nothing is obvious, you've won.

Ralph Nader 08 is all i have to say.

Jews kick ass! And the truth is not in white...that would make it hard to see on paper, which is why it is in BLACK. And Hammurab, you are writing in BLACK text color.


EDIT: Without the Jews, we wouldn't have Jesus...not that I'm a religious freak or anything just saying.

Jews kick ass! And the truth is not in white...that would make it hard to see on paper, which is why it is in BLACK. And Hammurab, you are writing in BLACK text color.

True, Hammurab is writing in black. But the truth of him stays in the white.

Jews kick ass! And the truth is not in white...that would make it hard to see on paper, which is why it is in BLACK. And Hammurab, you are writing in BLACK text color.


EDIT: Without the Jews, we wouldn't have Jesus...not that I'm a religious freak or anything just saying.

Oh, dude, for fuck's sake...its like early man inventing magnetic resonance imaging, but they can't figure out how to plug it in...

What's the name of your country, I wanna take a look.

I'll tell you, NW, if I've learned anything on nationstates, its that "obvious" is a comparative standard.

Truer words have never been spoken. Or written, as the case may be.

What's the name of your country, I wanna take a look.

Just click on my name in the sidebar to the left, and select "Vist [User's] Homepage".
Or just click this (http://www.nationstates.net/new_malachite_square).
/vanity

Let's be allies. I am pretty new and do need a mentor...kind of.

Let's be allies. I am pretty new and do need a mentor...kind of.

I'd be glad to, but I don't do RP. :(

What do you mean?

What do you mean?

On NationStates, you only need allies and so forth if you're going to do in-character roleplaying (RP). Things like going to war are all roleplayed out on the forums, using some kind of arcane rules system which I have no hope of understanding. :)

So how about we just be friends?

So how about we just be friends?

Sure. That I know how to do. :p
Edit: Why did I use a razz smiley when I could have used a fluffle? *fluffles* :fluffle:

:D Yay!

Abdju, you deserve more replies. Decent posters who disagree with you should take you on.

I agree with you too much to tackle what looks like informed comment. (I'm fairly ignorant on your preferred issues, so my agreement would weaken your case.)

Please don't give up. You just haven't hit the right tone yet.

=============

Transcript coming up!

Thanks! You're a prince.

Uh ... princess? I can't quite remember. In any case, thanks.

My analysis (based only on text, mind, I understand I am missing massive amounts of information by that): both O'Reilly and McCain would have difficulty qualifying as "sentient." I could teach a parrot to make more sense than that.

If you watched it through and wrote that down yourself, my sympathies and double the thanks. With a foot-rub, all the cookies in my cupboard and anything else you want (unless it would get me a Mod warning.)

===========

*snip comment*

And this totally belongs in the election thread.

Mmmm. Fresh meat for the lion cage.

Really, the Mods' evil plan is working well. Most of us won't venture into that thread, what with you and Jocabia eating anything that moves.

US politics, marginalized. I call that a good result! Go you Mods!

:D

Mmmm. Fresh meat for the lion cage.

Really, the Mods' evil plan is working well. Most of us won't venture into that thread, what with you and Jocabia eating anything that moves.

US politics, marginalized. I call that a good result! Go you Mods!

:D

Pff, Jocabia hardly posts in there anymore, and I let a lot of shit go because I can barely muster up interest. I'm still holding out for the debates or conventions or something to get this party underway...

Sure. That I know how to do. :p
Edit: Why did I use a razz smiley when I could have used a fluffle? *fluffles* :fluffle:

:fluffle:s for :fluffle:ing.

You're good people, no mistake.

Uh, there was a subject? Ummm ... John McCain said something stupid a year ago?

Why aren't we talking about the actual US President. Surely he has said something stupid in the last week?

Oh, silly me. That would be Bush Bashing. We don't do that any more. It's like picking on the developmentally retarded kid who gets to be Prom Queen. And also, they have some heritable disease which causes their parents to die because they did some naughty thing with a superpower.

(Yes, my brain is damaged by all that spami-trollo-griefic satire, and if Moderation fails me I'm gonna sue that i-less historical figure by the common law of Nonsense.)

:fluffle:s for :fluffle:ing

:fluffle:s for :fluffle:ing my :fluffle:

Pff, Jocabia hardly posts in there anymore, and I let a lot of shit go because I can barely muster up interest. I'm still holding out for the debates or conventions or something to get this party underway...

In all sincerity, it's good to see you rising above the "US election" ghetto.

I have missed your wisdom and wit in the wider forum.

*self-checks for sentimentality"

Logging out now, before I accidentally vomit on someone while trying to hug them. Yes, I'm drunk and it's late.

Thanks! You're a prince.

Uh ... princess? I can't quite remember. In any case, thanks.

My analysis (based only on text, mind, I understand I am missing massive amounts of information by that): both O'Reilly and McCain would have difficulty qualifying as "sentient." I could teach a parrot to make more sense than that.

If you watched it through and wrote that down yourself, my sympathies and double the thanks. With a foot-rub, all the cookies in my cupboard and anything else you want (unless it would get me a Mod warning.)

:D


you do get a bit mislead by the transcript.

mccain is clearly uncomfortable with what oreilly is saying but doesnt have the balls to call him an idiot. when he says he agrees, he is agreeing with the milder "we have to have a cap on how many illegal aliens we let stay and how many guest workers we let in" not the "we have to save white male privilege" part.

its not a great performance by mccain who was forced to back off his much more rational plan to deal with undocumented aliens in this coutry because of people like oreilly working the republican base into a xenophobic lather. but he really wasnt agreeing with most of the crap that oreilly was saying. he very obviously didnt want to argue about it.

Helping another country reach democracy is the best approach to stop people wanting migration.

And invading another country is the best way to CAUSE migration.

The Iraq War is not a "cause", it's a horrible, idiotic, gargantuan mistake that caused death and destruction, and the EU does not have the obligation to be a part in that genocide Bush started.

mccain is clearly uncomfortable with what oreilly is saying but doesnt have the balls to call him an idiot. when he says he agrees, he is agreeing with the milder "we have to have a cap on how many illegal aliens we let stay and how many guest workers we let in" not the "we have to save white male privilege" part.

Yeah. He's nodding in agreement while he squirms in his chair. :p

Yeah. He's nodding in agreement while he squirms in his chair. :p

yeah the poor thing (and id feel sorry for him if he werent a knowledgeable adult who should have kicked oreilly's ass for his idiocy) just wanted some free air time to explain his immigration policy. he didnt want to participate in some kind of race/ethinic class war.

it must suck to be a republican some days.

yeah the poor thing (and id feel sorry for him if he werent a knowledgeable adult who should have kicked oreilly's ass for his idiocy) just wanted some free air time to explain his immigration policy. he didnt want to participate in some kind of race/ethinic class war.

it must suck to be a republican some days.

Well, when it's one of those days you don't go for an interview with O'Reilly.

The Iraq War is not a "cause", it's a horrible, idiotic, gargantuan mistake that caused death and destruction....

I agree 100% it was a mistake

and the EU does not have the obligation to be a part in that genocide Bush started.

So it is better to leave the idiot in control of the situation and hope he can get his act together and clean up the mess? Or would you rather abandon the Iraqi people to fend for themselves, and continue the suffering? Or would you prefer to leave Iraq so that an anti-west group can rise up and take power of the country, and start causing trouble like Iran?

Guess Andaras should listen to some of this to hit the roof:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6M76YyAWuE

yeah the poor thing (and id feel sorry for him if he werent a knowledgeable adult who should have kicked oreilly's ass for his idiocy) just wanted some free air time to explain his immigration policy. he didnt want to participate in some kind of race/ethinic class war.
He'd have more luck getting a chance to "explain" "his"* immigration policy on Sesame Street than the douchebag hour that is the O'Reilly Factor/Hannity & the other idiot who knows better/anything else on FOX.

*I put 'his' in quotes because McCain completely 180s his public opinions whenever the one he holds is less likely to get him elected.

He'd have more luck getting a chance to "explain" "his"* immigration policy on Sesame Street than the douchebag hour that is the O'Reilly Factor/Hannity & the other idiot who knows better/anything else on FOX.

*I put 'his' in quotes because McCain completely 180s his public opinions whenever the one he holds is less likely to get him elected.

what can he do? it turns out that SANITY is deadly when it comes to immigration policy in the republican party. its not like mccains plan was liberal (or particularly workable) but no reason need apply on this issue.

what can he do? it turns out that SANITY is deadly when it comes to immigration policy in the republican party. its not like mccains plan was liberal (or particularly workable) but no reason need apply on this issue.

McCain's whole shtick is he is a maverick - not a diehard neocon. At least that is supposed to be his shtick, but the last time the USS Maverick sailed the Straight Talk Express lane was in 2000. People need to stop giving him a pass on it and point it out - his penchance for bending to the neocons would kill his appeal to the middle-of-the-roaders who thinks he is still McCain 2000 and would kill his appeal for all those who thinks he is strong on the issues because people arn't pointing out he blows like a leaf in the wind on all issues.

McCain's whole shtick is he is a maverick - not a diehard neocon. At least that is supposed to be his shtick, but the last time the USS Maverick sailed the Straight Talk Express lane was in 2000. People need to stop giving him a pass on it and point it out - his penchance for bending to the neocons would kill his appeal to the middle-of-the-roaders who thinks he is still McCain 2000 and would kill his appeal for all those who thinks he is strong on the issues because people arn't pointing out he blows like a leaf in the wind on all issues.

yeah. the faux maverick thing has served him well but anyone paying attention knows he has caved in to the republican machine. he has become a lowest common denominator candidate. the only thing that surprises me is that he hasnt yet started to swing back toward the middle.

yeah. the faux maverick thing has served him well but anyone paying attention knows he has caved in to the republican machine. he has become a lowest common denominator candidate. the only thing that surprises me is that he hasnt yet started to swing back toward the middle.

The problem is no one is paying attention and no one is calling him on it.

The problem is no one is paying attention and no one is calling him on it.

there is a long time to go yet. most people will not even think about it until mid october. a hefty percentage will make their minds up IN NOVEMBER.

The problem is no one is paying attention and no one is calling him on it.

Both of them are bullshit artists who flip-flop, spin, and twirl on their "positions". You can't really get either of them to say the same fucking thing twice.

They both deserve to be called on it, because they're both accusing each other of it, even while they're doing it.

Both of them are bullshit artists who flip-flop, spin, and twirl on their "positions". You can't really get either of them to say the same fucking thing twice.

They both deserve to be called on it, because they're both accusing each other of it, even while they're doing it.
No one is calling McCain on it, that was my point :rolleyes:
Even if some one pointed out he blows in the political breeze, they would say that is an attack on his character then point out how Obama was never shot down in a plane and thus isn't qualified to be president. And then the DNC will disown anyone who points out that is a stupid argument - like Clark did.

No one is calling McCain on it, that was my point :rolleyes:
Even if some one pointed out he blows in the political breeze, they would say that is an attack on his character then point out how Obama was never shot down in a plane and thus isn't qualified to be president. And then the DNC will disown anyone who points out that is a stupid argument - like Clark did.

It's getting to the point now that since they both can't be pinned down on anything, we might as well say they stand for the same things - whatever will sound good today, and appeal to the voters I happen to be speaking to, otherwise I'll "revisit" what I said and "examine" my stance on this "important" issue on which I've never had a different position.

It's getting to the point now that since they both can't be pinned down on anything, we might as well say they stand for the same things - whatever will sound good today, and appeal to the voters I happen to be speaking to, otherwise I'll "revisit" what I said and "examine" my stance on this "important" issue on which I've never had a different position.
Obama leans with the wind, McCain 180s when stuff doesn't go his way.
Turning on the McCain-Feingold thing, turning on the immigration reform with Kennedy, embracing Jerry Falwell and the religious right after denouncing them, etc.

Obama leans with the wind, McCain 180s when stuff doesn't go his way.
Turning on the McCain-Feingold thing, turning on the immigration reform with Kennedy, embracing Jerry Falwell and the religious right after denouncing them, etc.

It's still something I can't stand. I thought that a President was supposed to be a "leader" who "stood for something".

Well, neither stand for anything as far as I'm concerned. Of course, we don't elect "leaders" who "stand for something" here in the US anymore.

It's still something I can't stand. I thought that a President was supposed to be a "leader" who "stood for something".

Well, neither stand for anything as far as I'm concerned. Of course, we don't elect "leaders" who "stand for something" here in the US anymore.

That's a stupid idea of what a leader should be. Any idiot can lock off the rudder and yell, "Westward, that's what I said and that's the way we go!!!"

A leader is someone who reads the situation and (at least most of the time) makes the best reasoned judgment based on the available information. He or she may have started off heading west, but cuts south because to the west are icebergs, and to the south is a warm water current that will get them westward faster in the long run. Or have been heading to Greenland but changes course when he finds out later on that the names 'Greenland' and 'Iceland' were switched.

A moron heads off a cliff because that's the direction he said he was going before he knew there was a cliff there, and lemmings follow him off. I guess in that respect you can call that person a 'leader,' but why you'd want to follow him is beyond me.

That's a stupid idea of what a leader should be. Any idiot can lock off the rudder and yell, "Westward, that's what I said and that's the way we go!!!"

A leader is someone who reads the situation and (at least most of the time) makes the best reasoned judgment based on the available information. He or she may have started off heading west, but cuts south because to the west are icebergs, and to the south is a warm water current that will get them westward faster in the long run. Or have been heading to Greenland but changes course when he finds out later on that the names 'Greenland' and 'Iceland' were switched.

A moron heads off a cliff because that's the direction he said he was going before he knew there was a cliff there, and lemmings follow him off. I guess in that respect you can call that person a 'leader,' but why you'd want to follow him is beyond me.
He doesn't have to lock off the rudder.

But, he does have to have the balls to go against the polls, against his core constituents, and against public opinion when necessary.

Neither Obama nor McCain have any testicular fortitude to do that much.

If all you want is someone who follows the polls, we don't need a President - we need a "Poll of the Day" website...

So it is better to leave the idiot in control of the situation and hope he can get his act together and clean up the mess? Or would you rather abandon the Iraqi people to fend for themselves, and continue the suffering? Or would you prefer to leave Iraq so that an anti-west group can rise up and take power of the country, and start causing trouble like Iran?

My proposition is the US gives a LOT of money, as well as control of the American troops in Iraq, to the UN so that the UN takes care of it, having already proven itself much more competent than Bush. How the US gets that money being a little something I like to call "their problem".

My proposition is the US gives a LOT of money, as well as control of the American troops in Iraq, to the UN so that the UN takes care of it, having already proven itself much more competent than Bush. How the US gets that money being a little something I like to call "their problem".

Ok...ok...saying that the U.N. is more competent than Bush is like saying the sun is hotter than the moon.

But that is not the same thing as saying the U.N. is competent. Time and again, the U.N. has failed to prevent violence/genocide/civil war wherever they have jurisdiction.
And don't ask me to come up with a better option, cus I don't have one...I just know that idea would result in lots of U.S. deaths.

I just know that idea would result in lots of U.S. deaths.

Shoulda thought of that before invading, because the dead US soldiers are ALSO exclusively the US's problem. I SAID the war was a mistake, but did anyone listen? Nope. The status quo is resulting in the same anyways. Another option is funding the UN majorly so it gets its own manpower.

Shoulda thought of that before invading, because the dead US soldiers are ALSO exclusively the US's problem. I SAID the war was a mistake, but did anyone listen? Nope. The status quo is resulting in the same anyways. Another option is funding the UN majorly so it gets its own manpower.

I'm so glad the deaths of more soldiers means so much to you. As a U.S. soldier, it fills my heart with joy. :rolleyes:

I'm not arguing that the war was a good idea. I'm saying that giving any command to the U.N. would be a complete failure. And again, when has the U.N. ever done a good job in holding a country together? There is no point funding them if they are just going to screw up.

On a completely different note...we have really gotten off topic. heh.

I'm so glad the deaths of more soldiers means so much to you. As a U.S. soldier, it fills my heart with joy. :rolleyes:

I'm not arguing that the war was a good idea. I'm saying that giving any command to the U.N. would be a complete failure. And again, when has the U.N. ever done a good job in holding a country together? There is no point funding them if they are just going to screw up.

On a completely different note...we have really gotten off topic. heh.

1- I'm Brazilian. And I did always say the war was a mistake. No one listened, so it's not my fault now. Brazilian = not my problem and Told You So = not my fault. I got royally screwed over, banned in a chatroom and called anti-American and so on in the run-up to this war. I'm STILL furious at that and I long for the day when I'll be able to tell them I told them so. So, I'm under no obligation to care. Your President stopped playing golf when Sérgio Vieira de Mello, a Brazilian, was killed. He called it a sacrifice. And you come to me asking about my caring? I'm sorry, but I'll offer you this: I'll stop playing parcheesi for the dead soldiers.

2- The US should still get the hell out. They can even keep the manpower there, but under someone else's command. Be it NATO, the UN, whatever, just not the US.

3- True. Wanna make a separate thread?

1- I'm Brazilian. And I did always say the war was a mistake. No one listened, so it's not my fault now. Brazilian = not my problem and Told You So = not my fault. I got royally screwed over, banned in a chatroom and called anti-American and so on in the run-up to this war. I'm STILL furious at that and I long for the day when I'll be able to tell them I told them so. So, I'm under no obligation to care. Your President stopped playing golf when Sérgio Vieira de Mello, a Brazilian, was killed. He called it a sacrifice. And you come to me asking about my caring? I'm sorry, but I'll offer you this: I'll stop playing parcheesi for the dead soldiers.

2- The US should still get the hell out. They can even keep the manpower there, but under someone else's command. Be it NATO, the UN, whatever, just not the US.

3- True. Wanna make a separate thread?

Meh. Not really a point...We both agree going in was stupid, we both agree that staying is pretty stupid, and as a brazillian, you really arent gonna care about U.S. soldiers being sacrificed no matter what I say, just like I wouldn't care about Brazillian troops being blown away. It'll turn into a cluster fuck of epic proportions with thinly vieled flames.
And going by some of your posts I've seen, you seem like too brutal a poster to piss off:p

On topic though, O'Rielly is a prick. He forced McCain into a corner, and because McCain is a career politician, he just started spouting typical politician crap that would appeal to the hard core conservatives who actually watch that show.

Weather is a highly chaotic system, which is why meteorologists can really only realistically make predictions three days in advance.

Take that any way you want.

Actually the three-day prediction has more to do with the availability of data than anything else. If we had more instruments, say, out in the Pacific Ocean, we'd have a better handle on activity out there and consequently more data to throw into meteorological models.

And going by some of your posts I've seen, you seem like too brutal a poster to piss off:p

On topic though, O'Rielly is a prick. He forced McCain into a corner, and because McCain is a career politician, he just started spouting typical politician crap that would appeal to the hard core conservatives who actually watch that show.

1- I'll take that as a compliment. ;)

2- All the better to keep Lt. Senile's paws away from the White House. Let he move towards his ever-shrinking base and away from the Center, where the votes are.

1- I'll take that as a compliment. ;)

2- All the better to keep Lt. Senile's paws away from the White House. Let he move towards his ever-shrinking base and away from the Center, where the votes are.

Ha. It was meant as one.
And as for McCain, I am totally ripped by this election. I can't stand either candidate...I think I'll vote for Nader.

Ha. It was meant as one.
And as for McCain, I am totally ripped by this election. I can't stand either candidate...I think I'll vote for Nader.

oh come on. a vote for nader is a waste of the time and effort to go to the polling place.

find a 3rd party that you want to help build its popularity and vote for whomever they have nominated. at least then you have cast more than an unnoticed protest vote.

oh come on. a vote for nader is a waste of the time and effort to go to the polling place.

find a 3rd party that you want to help build its popularity and vote for whomever they have nominated. at least then you have cast more than an unnoticed protest vote.


Sigh* I know...I wasn't actually going to vote for Nader. I'll just wait till November and see who has flipped and flopped less. :(

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysoOB9w0tF4&feature=related

At least he's being honest, huh?

Okay, I'm not a McCain fan, but c'mon here. The fact that O'Reilly uses an idiotic phrase to describe Buchanan's crude racial approximation of Tocqueville, and McCain doesn't openly jump up and down on it, does not mean that McCain is a closet supporter of white male privilege any more than Michelle Obama's statement that she's proud of her country for the first time in her adult life means she's really a closet Black Panther.

To put it plainly, O'Reilly is an idiot. We know this. We've established this. So when he reads Buchanan's borderline racism (his argument isn't technically racism, since he's arguing that immigrants's cultural beliefs are incompatible with the beliefs that must be held by the polis for a democracy to exist and they aren't assimilating, but it's de facto racism when you consider that somehow Irish Catholics can become Americans but Mexican Catholics cannot given that, historically, Mexican Catholics are assimilating at the same rate the Irish did), I do not expect him to even nearly approximate the ability to synopsize and critique Buchanan's views that I just demonstrated. I expect him to parrot the argument in blunter terms. That's what he did. McCain tried to get to the meat of the argument which was on the immigration bill rather than a pointless digression about Buchanan's (mis)understanding of generational difference in cultural assimilation.

We don't need an ulterior motive, and I really wish people would stop looking for one, especially when the P.T. Barnum corrolary to Occam's Razor (the least difficult explanation required to explain most human mistakes is that said person wasn't being very bright) explains the situation so very well.

Ha. It was meant as one.
And as for McCain, I am totally ripped by this election. I can't stand either candidate...I think I'll vote for Nader.
Yeah, you are wasting your time, and more importantly, gas.

(a) a morass of "satirical" spam, or (b) a US election thread.

Remind me what the difference is? :p

How dare the far-left infringe on my rights to preserve a structure that directly benefits me!

Look at me I am the very defination of Northern Europe; tall, fair, strong, and smart.

All else who want to preserve our 'rights', better termed as us being superior to all others in rights and wealth, vote McCain in 2012.

I hope everyone get the various jokes, to note look up December 2012 to grasp the joke of me bringing up 2012.;)

His comment about called a 13 year process toward citizenship for illegal migrant workers being amnesty was a direct defence against the right calling this bill too lenient on illegal immigration. He agreed with Bill O'Rielly that there should be a cap on foreign work visas, but that is something that we have had for years.

I think the cap they were discussing was actually on how many illegals could start a path to citizenship.

I regret that I did not see* this thread until it had grown to such an extent. Feel free to raise your argument(s) in the stickied thread.

Andaras, there is a sticky for US election comment. USE IT!

EDIT: *Or possibly saw and forgot about. Ah, the seductive embrace of senility.