NationStates Jolt Archive

It's seems that Heath Care in the US has hit an all time low.

http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/07/01/waiting.room.death/index.html

It's seems that Heath Care in the Kings County Hospital Center has hit an all time low.

I've taken the liberty of fixing the mistake in your post. Please don't take the actions of a single hospital in the United States and say that they encompass United States healthcare. :rolleyes:

It's seems that Heath Care in the US has hit an all time low.

What an absurd statement...

...and it seems I'm not the only one who thinks so.

Even in the aftermath of 9-11, the lack of compassion and empathy that some New Yorkers can display is still disturbing. Anyone remember Kitty Genovese?

And it'll be a miracle if this thread makes it without a "At least we're still better than those damned leftist countries and their socialized medicine" post.

That's pretty horrifying, and I'm sad to say that I guessed even before following the link that the waiting room in question might likely be in a psychiatric hospital. There are huge, huge problems with the treatment of the mentally ill in this country, of which this is an obviously very extreme example. Too often, staff are not trained worth a damn in how to deal with mentally ill patients, and will treat genuinely sick people like this woman as if they're "faking" or something similarly stupid.

The hospital service is over run. In Australia every year more money gets spent from the budget on health. Whilst these are horrible scenarios people should start to take up health insurance to avoid this.

You cant just keep on hoping that more money will be spent by others. Invest in your health.

At least we're better than those damned Leftist countries and their socialized medicine. :P

Seriously though, thats messed up. We need Universal Health Care. NOW.

There are huge, huge problems with the treatment of the mentally ill anywhere, of which this is an obviously very extreme example.

Fixed.

these people are doctors and they didn't realize that upon forging events they would have to also dispose of the tapes:p

I've taken the liberty of fixing the mistake in your post. Please don't take the actions of a single hospital in the United States and say that they encompass United States healthcare. :rolleyes:

but it does considering this hospital passes inspections and whatever other safeguards are in place even though it is currently being sued for horrific patient conditions :confused:

It's seems that Heath Care in the US has hit an all time low
What about the days of the Wild West, eh?

Far better now than it was then.

It was only a month ago that we all saw the footage of the man being run over in the middle of a busy street where noone stopped to help. hit and runs are always in the news and it seems now even a hospital, the place where above all we should be cared for, has succumb to the trend of the 21st century where noone gives a shit. You could give hospitals massive funding boosts but it still wont change the attitudes of people where we only look out for ourselves.

say "hi" to your neighbours.

I've taken the liberty of fixing the mistake in your post. Please don't take the actions of a single hospital in the United States and say that they encompass United States healthcare. :rolleyes:

Nah, sorry, the US health care system stinks. You go in with a cold and you die.

What about the days of the Wild West, eh?

pfft they had Indian wizards and shit back then

SNIP

this magical world where everybody cares has never existed past hamlet level get over it

Nah, sorry, the US health care system stinks. You go in with a cold and you die.

MRSA is a bitch like that

How about watching this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9Tf8nHlEVY

or this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xlwc0mE0lCU

People are more likely not to stand up for complete strangers (except for the second video but only one guy out of a packed subway helped out) and this problem is apparent in everywhere.

I don't really have any point to make other then using the mistakes of every other country's health care programs in regards to the mentally ill as a justification for why we're allowed to let people die on the floors of hospitals.

Fixed

I've never understood why people sit around and think that, because everyone is doing it wrong, that it's okay for them to do it wrong also. Yes, the state of health care for the mentally ill worldwide is extremely poor in general compared to the health care we provide to people with physical ailments, but that is not an excuse for letting someone die on the floor of a hospital.

What an absurd statement...

...and it seems I'm not the only one who thinks so.

Though those who argue in favour of private medical care often do the very same thing when it comes to debating problems that show up at individual hospitals in universal health care systems.

You cant just keep on hoping that more money will be spent by others. Invest in your health.

And our security budgets keep getting larger and larger. We can't keep on hoping that more money will be spent by others. We must invest in our own protection, a cache of AKs.

Our road building budget keeps growing and growing. We cant' keep on hoping that more money will be spent by others. We must invest in our own personal fleet of ATVs to cross the tundra ourselves.

Our air traffic control budget keeps growing and growing. We can't keep on hoping that more money will be spent by others. We must talk planes down ourselves.

etc.

We aren't pioneers out in the wild. We claim to have proper, civilised societies, where we all have rights and responsibilities. And we all seek to enjoy the benefits of living in a civilised society. A big part of this is putting in place a responsible government that provides the infrastructure and services that a civilised society needs. Healthcare that doesn't involve leaving unattended dead bodies lying around would be one of them.

Please don't take the actions of a single hospital in the United States and say that they encompass United States healthcare.

This isn't an isolated event. There have been numerous reports of people in clear medical need being left abandoned in the States. I don't think this is just an issue of private healthcare (which is a part of, but not the entirety of, the problem). It's a cultural issue as well. Until there is a cultural development that emphasises responsibility to society and to others, even the finest healthcare system would just be left to rot.

Nah, sorry, the US health care system stinks. You go in with a cold and you die.

:rolleyes:

Proof? Because I can tell you that I've gone to the emergency room a few times in my life, and I'm still breathing. I've even had bronchitis (which is worse than a cold), gone to the emergency room, and lived to tell the tale.

I've even had bronchitis (which is worse than a cold), gone to the emergency room, and lived to tell the tale.
You got bronchitis and got into the emergency room?

Bloody hell, I get it just about every year and just take some antibiotics to sort it out. Works fine.

We must invest in our own protection, a cache of AKs.

Way ahead of you...

*shifty eyes*

That's pretty horrifying, and I'm sad to say that I guessed even before following the link that the waiting room in question might likely be in a psychiatric hospital. There are huge, huge problems with the treatment of the mentally ill in this country, of which this is an obviously very extreme example. Too often, staff are not trained worth a damn in how to deal with mentally ill patients, and will treat genuinely sick people like this woman as if they're "faking" or something similarly stupid.

Yea, although this isnt in any way an excuse, this was a psychiatric hospital. Its not unusual for patients to sleep on the floor, or go into catatonic states where they dont move for long periods of time etc. I mean these people ARE crazy. They piss and shit all over the place, kick, hit, bite and scream and when they arnt doing that they are sleeping on the floors. Like i said it doesnt excuse the negligence but i can understand in some way why people around the patient did act the way they did. I mean the author of the article sounded shocked that the other crazy patients didnt ask for help. Really? You have the expectation that a crazy patient can tell difference between catatonia and death nessesarily?

Fixed.

Erm, that was rather a strange fix, seeing as I've specifically studied and observed the treatment of the mentally ill in the United States, but have never seen so much as a single article addressing how the mentally ill are treated in, say, Botswana or Lithuania. Seeing as I know nothing about the Botswanan and Lithuanian health-care systems, why would I make blanket assertions about them?

Yea, although this isnt in any way an excuse, this was a psychiatric hospital. Its not unusual for patients to sleep on the floor, or go into catatonic states where they dont move for long periods of time etc. I mean these people ARE crazy. They piss and shit all over the place, kick, hit, bite and scream and when they arnt doing that they are sleeping on the floors. Like i said it doesnt excuse the negligence but i can understand in some way why people around the patient did act the way they did. I mean the author of the article sounded shocked that the other crazy patients didnt ask for help. Really? You have the expectation that a crazy patient can tell difference between catatonia and death nessesarily?

...have you ever actually been in a psychiatric hospital? Because I've visited quite a few, as a visitor, as a patient, and as a volunteer, and I've never seen this epidemic of public peeing and biting that you seem to believe exists. I have, in fact, never seen a single patient do any of the things you mentioned except screaming. I have, however, consistently seen staff members who are badly trained, resentful of the patients, and prone to ignoring real health issues and making completely unqualified "diagnoses." ("Oh, her stomach doesn't really hurt; she just wants attention. Don't bother doing even a basic examination.") The problem isn't the patients, I assure you, but the way we as a society seem to feel it's acceptable to treat the mentally ill as if they're, well, a bunch of "crazy" people who don't need proper medical care.

Yea, although this isnt in any way an excuse, this was a psychiatric hospital. Its not unusual for patients to sleep on the floor, or go into catatonic states where they dont move for long periods of time etc. I mean these people ARE crazy. They piss and shit all over the place, kick, hit, bite and scream and when they arnt doing that they are sleeping on the floors. Like i said it doesnt excuse the negligence but i can understand in some way why people around the patient did act the way they did. I mean the author of the article sounded shocked that the other crazy patients didnt ask for help. Really? You have the expectation that a crazy patient can tell difference between catatonia and death nessesarily?

I've been a visitor, patient and volunteer at a psychiatric hospital, and not in the nice "I have depression" side only either, in the scary "we think you are dangerous so we're locking you up for a few days" side. I haven't seen any of this happen. There was this one lady once who threw up her meds, but mostly people didn't do any of what you are talking about. These people are sick, like medically sick and need medical help. They aren't like "crazy" like in the movies......ranting and raving and peeing everywhere, at least not immediately after intake where they are medicated.

I've seen mistreatment in psych hospitals more often than I've seen "raving loonies".

I've been a visitor, patient and volunteer at a psychiatric hospital, and not in the nice "I have depression" side only either, in the scary "we think you are dangerous so we're locking you up for a few days" side. I haven't seen any of this happen. There was this one lady once who threw up her meds, but mostly people didn't do any of what you are talking about. These people are sick, like medically sick and need medical help. They aren't like "crazy" like in the movies......ranting and raving and peeing everywhere, at least not immediately after intake where they are medicated.

I've seen mistreatment in psych hospitals more often than I've seen "raving loonies".

I dont know what mental institution you were a part of but my GF is an ER nurse at a normal ER and you get kicking screaming biting and hitting as a normal event of the day on any given Fri or Sat night. And this is from non crazy people. The reports of squalid conditions in the hospital were in some parts made that way from patients making the conditions that way. Bathrooms and floors dont become squalid all by themselves, They become that way from patients shitting or pissing on them or otherwise abusing the facilities. Maybe its just a matter of hiring more janatorial staff or something but dont be under any impression that these patients are angels.

We need Universal Health Care. NOW.

Uh, right. The people who can't deliver our mail properly but still raise the cost of postage regularly; can't educate our kids even though they always get more money when they demand it; and can't give us consistent information regarding how to pay our taxes but hold us responsible if we don't pay them when and how we are supposed to - THOSE PEOPLE should be in charge of our health? Sounds like a, um, really great situation. Yeah. As long as nobody ever gets sick.

I dont know what mental institution you were a part of but my GF is an ER nurse at a normal ER and you get kicking screaming biting and hitting as a normal event of the day on any given Fri or Sat night. And this is from non crazy people. The reports of squalid conditions in the hospital were in some parts made that way from patients making the conditions that way. Bathrooms and floors dont become squalid all by themselves, They become that way from patients shitting or pissing on them or otherwise abusing the facilities. Maybe its just a matter of hiring more janatorial staff or something but dont be under any impression that these patients are angels.

ER is not a psych hospital. In the ER you deal with people in crisis situations, after they are seen and MEDICATED only then are they taken to the actual psych ward.

The people who can't deliver our mail properly but still raise the cost of postage regularly
The US Post Office is one of the best deals in the country.

Uh, right. The people who can't deliver our mail properly but still raise the cost of postage regularly; can't educate our kids even though they always get more money when they demand it; and can't give us consistent information regarding how to pay our taxes but hold us responsible if we don't pay them when and how we are supposed to - THOSE PEOPLE should be in charge of our health? Sounds like a, um, really great situation. Yeah. As long as nobody ever gets sick.

Heh heh heh. :)

...have you ever actually been in a psychiatric hospital? Because I've visited quite a few, as a visitor, as a patient, and as a volunteer, and I've never seen this epidemic of public peeing and biting that you seem to believe exists. I have, in fact, never seen a single patient do any of the things you mentioned except screaming. I have, however, consistently seen staff members who are badly trained, resentful of the patients, and prone to ignoring real health issues and making completely unqualified "diagnoses." ("Oh, her stomach doesn't really hurt; she just wants attention. Don't bother doing even a basic examination.") The problem isn't the patients, I assure you, but the way we as a society seem to feel it's acceptable to treat the mentally ill as if they're, well, a bunch of "crazy" people who don't need proper medical care.

I've been a visitor, patient and volunteer at a psychiatric hospital, and not in the nice "I have depression" side only either, in the scary "we think you are dangerous so we're locking you up for a few days" side. I haven't seen any of this happen. There was this one lady once who threw up her meds, but mostly people didn't do any of what you are talking about. These people are sick, like medically sick and need medical help. They aren't like "crazy" like in the movies......ranting and raving and peeing everywhere, at least not immediately after intake where they are medicated.

I've seen mistreatment in psych hospitals more often than I've seen "raving loonies".

I love how we basically wrote the exact same post. Great minds thinking alike? :p

The other day on YouTube there was a video about the same thing happening to a 49-year old man in a hospital: On the floor, dying, ignored by doctors, nurses and security.

Of course it later turned out that all the people who ignored him were actually on suspension if that makes any difference (it explains why the Doctors and Nurses couldn't directly help him. But it's hardly an excuse for not getting someone who could).

:rolleyes:

Proof? Because I can tell you that I've gone to the emergency room a few times in my life, and I'm still breathing. I've even had bronchitis (which is worse than a cold), gone to the emergency room, and lived to tell the tale.

Same. I once went to the Emergency Room because I had major abdominal pain. Couldn't even really walk without feeling it. I went in, it took a few hours but they deduced pretty quickly that I had basically just injured my rectus abdominus muscle. This took maybe twenty minutes. The rest of the time they ran some other tests just to make sure that everything else was OK. There wasn't a whole lot they could do for me, just that I try not to strain the muscle--which, considering its location, not an easy task.

Of course on learning about this, my jackass friends take every opportunity to make me laugh, but I digress.

I know this should be shocking, but sadly, it isn't. I don't know about this specific hospital, but if it's like John George, the local psych facility for those without insurance and the homeless, these kinds of things are damn near routine. At John George there are periodically stories about doctors being stabbed by patients, patients attacking each other, patients dying while "under care"... No one wants to put money into the system, but the laws demand that a person who poses an imminent threat to him/herself or others be hospitalized, so much of the time they locked them up in a hospital room and wait for them to detox or get used to the meds and then send them off... waiting for the next time they see them.

Uh, right. The people who can't deliver our mail properly but still raise the cost of postage regularly; can't educate our kids even though they always get more money when they demand it; and can't give us consistent information regarding how to pay our taxes but hold us responsible if we don't pay them when and how we are supposed to - THOSE PEOPLE should be in charge of our health? Sounds like a, um, really great situation. Yeah. As long as nobody ever gets sick.

Dude, don't even start on public education with me. Please don't. If "more money when they demand" means budget cuts year after year...

I'm taking deep, calming breaths.

Dude, don't even start on public education with me. Please don't. If "more money when they demand" means budget cuts year after year...


Wow, budget cuts? Can i move to your town? In my town they talk about budget cuts like a broken record and property school taxes have gone up 25-7% every year since before i was a fetus. If we vote the school budget down , it usually keeps the tax increase under double digits.