NationStates Jolt Archive

...When they said reading of the bible wasn't actively encouraged in the catholic church.

(apologies to all catholics here...but this is due to a conversation I had yesterday with a catholic).

So I'm talking to this woman whose in her mid-thirties. Has shown at the very least a little common sense when it comes to life and the discussion of religion pops up. She knows I'm pagan, but I didn't know what she was. She's Catholic. Born into Catholicism to be exact.

We were talking about what problems that may arise with her current relationship (with a man 15 years her junior who is atheist). During this conversation it came to light one of the reasons I turned away from the Christian faith (other than the hordes of inaccuracies, the lying priests, preachers and evangelists...etc. etc.).

I told her a story that I remember out of the bible, now I can't remember which prophet it was exactly, I believe it was Elijah but the story (from the old testament) goes thus:

Prophet is bald. Children, being as children are, tease and bully said prophet about being bald. Prophet is very upset.

God sends wild bears to slaughter children.

-- Forgive me, but I'm kinda not a big fan there.

When I'd finished the story she said to me, exact quote: "I'm not Biblically inclined or knowledgeable."

I asked why she was in a faith she didn't even research and she asked why should she?

*blink*

A woman, in her mid thirties, actually asked why she should read the bible and research the basis of her faith that she rules her life by.

EXCUSE ME?! WTF?!

Er, get a blog? :)

In my experience, this is not uncommon of Catholics. Official Catholic doctrine is that, if at any time Church teachings and the Bible differ, Church teachings win.

Wild bears :D

Man that's a kick in the teeth for those little bastards :p

Dont forget the catholic church used to have its bible in latin* to make sure the common believers could'nt read it and had to obey the teachings of the church


El-Presidente Boris

*and used to burn people for putting it into english :eek:

Wild bears :D

Man that's a kick in the teeth for those little bastards :p
Yeah, being eaten by bears'll learn 'em.

Yeah, being eaten by bears'll learn 'em.
Seeing as it's fictional, I reckon it's OK to laugh.

Seeing as it's fictional, I reckon it's OK to laugh.
I know, I was trying to join in :p

...When they said reading of the bible wasn't actively encouraged in the catholic church.

(apologies to all catholics here...but this is due to a conversation I had yesterday with a catholic).

So I'm talking to this woman whose in her mid-thirties. Has shown at the very least a little common sense when it comes to life and the discussion of religion pops up. She knows I'm pagan, but I didn't know what she was. She's Catholic. Born into Catholicism to be exact.

We were talking about what problems that may arise with her current relationship (with a man 15 years her junior who is atheist). During this conversation it came to light one of the reasons I turned away from the Christian faith (other than the hordes of inaccuracies, the lying priests, preachers and evangelists...etc. etc.).

I told her a story that I remember out of the bible, now I can't remember which prophet it was exactly, I believe it was Elijah but the story (from the old testament) goes thus:

Prophet is bald. Children, being as children are, tease and bully said prophet about being bald. Prophet is very upset.

God sends wild bears to slaughter children.

-- Forgive me, but I'm kinda not a big fan there.

When I'd finished the story she said to me, exact quote: "I'm not Biblically inclined or knowledgeable."

I asked why she was in a faith she didn't even research and she asked why should she?

*blink*

A woman, in her mid thirties, actually asked why she should read the bible and research the basis of her faith that she rules her life by.

EXCUSE ME?! WTF?!

So you're going to take the words of one person whom you characterize as a dumbass, and apply that experience to every Catholic in the world?

Excuse me?! WTF?!

Dont forget the catholic church used to have its bible in latin* to make sure the common believers could'nt read it and had to obey the teachings of the church


El-Presidente Boris

*and used to burn people for putting it into english :eek:

Yes, and when was Vatican II? 1962?
They haven't burned people for QUITE a while before that, either....

Dont forget the catholic church used to have its bible in latin* to make sure the common believers could'nt read it and had to obey the teachings of the church


The idea was that only learned scholars would interpret the bible.
the result of ever uneducated yokel reading the bible are the southern baptist.

In reality however the learned scholars would selectively choose portions of the bible to pass on based on what they wanted the commoners to hear.

And now look what's happened -- uppity women questioning what they read...
and hey, the church tolerating it -- in bible studies and such.

What a horror!

So you're going to take the words of one person whom you characterize as a dumbass, and apply that experience to every Catholic in the world?

Excuse me?! WTF?!

The problem is...she's not a dumbass. What's confused me is how she can blindly take what her priests are telling her without even trying to see if it's backed up.

Putting aside the whole of the Catholic church (I'm not applying this experience to every catholic in the world - although my opening sentence can seem like I was implying that. My apologies I was just quoting a common saying. I don't know every catholic, nor do I think it possible to).

What I am asking, is why it is that this woman can support something she doesn't even research.

It's about one woman, and one woman alone. Not about all the catholics out there (Although I have met several other catholics like this... most that were at the catholic middle school I went to).

It's like asking how someone can justify Lot offering up his two virgin daughters to a crowd of rapists in exchange for two men he believed were angels. The said daughters went ahead afterwards to sleep with their father while he was asleep in hopes he'd give them kids. To only then have them turn around to say they didn't even know that it was in the Bible.

How exactly can this woman support and defend her faith if she actually says she doesn't want to learn about it? Beyond what is said at mass?

This is probably the stupidest thread I have ever read...

*walks away with head shaking*

Prophet is bald. Children, being as children are, tease and bully said prophet about being bald. Prophet is very upset.

God sends wild bears to slaughter children.


God sends wild bears to slaughter children.

wild bears to slaughter children.

Awesome.
I'm so converting to Christianity.

This is probably the stupidest thread I have ever read...

*walks away with head shaking*

Nah; personally I've seen this as a trend among Catholics. And I grew up in a Catholic family. An Irish Catholic family, moreover. Wherein everyone who's not female basically has the disposition "no, i don't really agree with the Pope... in fact I'm not even sure I believe in God. But I'm still Catholic. Yeah."

I don't think I've ever met someone of my age who was still Catholic at the end of school...

Obviously I'm not tarring everyone with the same brush, this is just my personal observation.

This is probably the stupidest thread I have ever read...

*walks away with head shaking*

New to NSG are you? ;)

Only Catholics...

Don't remember that story. Anyone got a reference? Also Bears? In Judea?

Why do Catholics listen to the Popes? They told everyone to pray for those in purgatory then decided it didn't exist! How can they justify that level of Blind Faith?

The problem is...she's not a dumbass. What's confused me is how she can blindly take what her priests are telling her without even trying to see if it's backed up.

Putting aside the whole of the Catholic church (I'm not applying this experience to every catholic in the world - although my opening sentence can seem like I was implying that. My apologies I was just quoting a common saying. I don't know every catholic, nor do I think it possible to).

What I am asking, is why it is that this woman can support something she doesn't even research.

It's about one woman, and one woman alone. Not about all the catholics out there (Although I have met several other catholics like this... most that were at the catholic middle school I went to).

It's like asking how someone can justify Lot offering up his two virgin daughters to a crowd of rapists in exchange for two men he believed were angels. The said daughters went ahead afterwards to sleep with their father while he was asleep in hopes he'd give them kids. To only then have them turn around to say they didn't even know that it was in the Bible.

How exactly can this woman support and defend her faith if she actually says she doesn't want to learn about it? Beyond what is said at mass?

sooooo because this catholic woman isnt obsessed with obscure stories of the bible like you are you think there is something wrong with her faith?

yes there is a difference in emphasis between the roman catholic church and the fundamentalist protestant churches. few catholic memorize huge passages of the bible.

but then the catholic church doesnt insist on a literal word by word reading of the bible for the purposes of running your life or that there is one translation of the bible that is a perfect rendering of the will of god, literal human history and a blueprint of the future.

its all a matter of focus and emphasis.

in the meantime if you want to know the catholic justification of the children being killed by bears ask a priest or a catholic theologian. there is an answer even if your casual friends cant provide it.

Only Catholics...

Don't remember that story. Anyone got a reference? Also Bears? In Judea?

Why do Catholics listen to the Popes? They told everyone to pray for those in purgatory then decided it didn't exist! How can they justify that level of Blind Faith?

only catholics???

ALL religions run on blind faith.

They told everyone to pray for those in purgatory then decided it didn't exist!
They still have purgatory. It was "limbo" they decided didn't really exist (and they never had a firm position on limbo in the first place).

Oh: and the prophet who sicced the bears on the kids was Elisha, not Elijah (easy mistake: not only do they have similar names, but Elisha was Elijah's disciple; I'm just being nit-picky)

The problem is...she's not a dumbass. What's confused me is how she can blindly take what her priests are telling her without even trying to see if it's backed up.

What do you expect people to do ? Research their faith and the claims it makes ? Be critical ?

Sorry, most people refuse that. That is why there things like the ID movement exist.

A bit of misinterpretation. This is what God actually sent:



http://www.bruddabear.com/photo/BearCavalry.jpg

The idea was that only learned scholars would interpret the bible.
the result of ever uneducated yokel reading the bible are the southern baptist.

In reality however the learned scholars would selectively choose portions of the bible to pass on based on what they wanted the commoners to hear.

So basically, "it was a good idea because they tried to prevent idiots from making fundie sects. Only thing is, it turned out that being smart doesn't make people any less retarded."


Or even more simply, "Great in theory. But it made Practice it's bitch and then started kicking puppies before going off to have lunch at an orphanage."

A bit of misinterpretation. This is what God actually sent:



http://www.bruddabear.com/photo/BearCavalry.jpg

Armageddon is going to be so kickass.

If I recall, there was a period of history not too long ago when all bibles were written in latin, all masses were done in latin and only the rich and the clergy knew latin. :p

Encouraging the ignorant masses to accept the clergy's word as to what God wants from them has been the norm for quite some time now.

So basically, "it was a good idea because they tried to prevent idiots from making fundie sects. Only thing is, it turned out that being smart doesn't make people any less retarded."


Or even more simply, "Great in theory. But it made Practice it's bitch and then started kicking puppies before going off to have lunch at an orphanage."



Armageddon is going to be so kickass.

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51PWKE2Q8SL._AA280_.jpg

Beware of the worms *nod*

Don't remember that story. Anyone got a reference? Also Bears? In Judea?
Have I got a reference for you! Just follow the link to learn about the awesome power of being able to curse little brats in the name of the Lord: Afflict Ye Not The Bald (http://www.angryflower.com/bibbal.html). Being a bald man myself, I can actually sympathize with Elisha.

"Sticks and Stones may break my bones but names will get you eaten by bears, you little shits!"

:D

Don't remember that story. Anyone got a reference? Also Bears? In Judea?


go figure eh?

yes there were bears in the middle east in ancient times. and lions. and elephants in northern africa that were tameable enough for hannibal to use them in his wars against rome. (african elephants today are not tameable)

only catholics???

ALL religions run on blind faith.
That includes atheism. Atheism runs on the blind faith that there is no God. See? Deep down we're all the same :p.

I'll be here until the apocalypse passes...

http://mars.sgi.com/ops/81093_full.jpg

Under a rock. Go on... just try and find me!

That includes atheism. Atheism runs on the blind faith that there is no God. See? Deep down we're all the same :p.

yeah

if atheism were a religion.

and if not believing is a form of believing.

but we even take the ATOM on blind faith that scientists arent goofing on us. i certainly have never seen one.

Have I got a reference for you! Just follow the link to learn about the awesome power of being able to curse little brats in the name of the Lord: Afflict Ye Not The Bald (http://www.angryflower.com/bibbal.html). Being a bald man myself, I can actually sympathize with Elisha.
And you would curse me to be eaten by a bear.

Not if you would show remorse.

yeah

if atheism were a religion.

and if not believing is a form of believing.

but we even take the ATOM on blind faith that scientists arent goofing on us. i certainly have never seen one.

Exactly! Everything in life is a leap of faith, usually blind faith. How do you know there's other countries? It could all be a media conspiracy to hide the Alien invasion!

Okay, maybe I went a little far with that one...:p

Exactly! Everything in life is a leap of faith, usually blind faith. How do you know there's other countries? It could all be a media conspiracy to hide the Alien invasion!

Okay, maybe I went a little far with that one...:p

lol

*sings*

"there is no arizona, no painted desert, no sedona"

lol

*sings*

"there is no arizona, no painted desert, no sedona"

And don't forget kiddies, this is all an illusion! One of you is actually in a long coma, waiting to wake up! The rest of us are in your imaaagination! So go and do whatever you want! It won't affect you in the real world! :p

And don't forget kiddies, this is all an illusion! One of you is actually in a long coma, waiting to wake up! The rest of us are in your imaaagination! So go and do whatever you want! It won't affect you in the real world! :p

I disbelieve! I disbelieve!!! :eek:

I disbelieve! I disbelieve!!! :eek:

*Two unicrons walk in* Shun the non-believer! Shun! Shuuuun!

Dont forget the catholic church used to have its bible in latin* to make sure the common believers could'nt read it and had to obey the teachings of the church


El-Presidente Boris

*and used to burn people for putting it into english :eek:

No. That's because going to Chruch provides a stable community that is easy to become a part of. In most countries in the world you can seek out the nearest Catholic Church and instantly stop being the weird stranger and become the newest member of the community.

The price to pay for that is you have to spend half your Sunday hearing about how much you suck and are going to hell. And if that's what you have to put up with, then it's nicer to hear it from a guy who is speaking a language that no one in the room can understand.

"Sticks and Stones may break my bones but names will get you eaten by bears, you little shits!"

:D

So the moral of the story is not to make fun of prophets with words and names, but break their bones with sticks and stones?

If I recall, there was a period of history not too long ago when all bibles were written in latin, all masses were done in latin and only the rich and the clergy knew latin. :p

Well all that was stopped in 1972 when the Church saw that it wrong, but as for only the rich and the clergy knowing Latin, I seem to recall many education systems children were taught Latin, of course that has now been dropped leading to people not knowing that the plural of Stadium is Stadia not Stadiums but whatever.

The price to pay for that is you have to spend half your Sunday hearing about how much you suck and are going to hell. And if that's what you have to put up with, then it's nicer to hear it from a guy who is speaking a language that no one in the room can understand.

Half your Sunday? What does your Sunday only last for 90 minutes? MAybe two hours.

You know of all the Catholic services I have been to and there have been plenty I have never once been told about hopw much I suck and that I am going to hell not once.

How exactly can this woman support and defend her faith if she actually says she doesn't want to learn about it? Beyond what is said at mass?

Who says the Bible is the foundation of her faith? Not the woman, clearly, and I'm not really sure the Church says so, either. So, neither the individual nor the religious authority she claims to follow say she has a duty to know about this story in the Bible.

yeah

if atheism were a religion.

Then we'd have one hell of an apocalypse! (http://www.viruscomix.com/page433.html)

and if not believing is a form of believing.
One could argue that not believing is agnosticism and that atheism is believing G/god(s) do not exist.

Then we'd have one hell of an apocalypse! (http://www.viruscomix.com/page433.html)

I can't tell whether that is satire or propaganda. :)

Then we'd have one hell of an apocalypse! (http://www.viruscomix.com/page433.html)


One could argue that not believing is agnosticism and that atheism is believing G/god(s) do not exist.

you can but you wouldnt be right. agnosticism is an attitude--that one cannot possibly know whether or not god(s) exist and what form such a god would have if it did exist.

atheism is lacking an active belief in any god(s) no matter whether you have never thought of it, dont care, or have an active disdain for the idea.

you can but you wouldnt be right. agnosticism is an attitude--that one cannot possibly know whether or not god(s) exist and what form such a god would have if it did exist.

atheism is lacking an active belief in any god(s) no matter whether you have never thought of it, dont care, or have an active disdain for the idea.

That's why the label bugs me. It is much more useful to say someone is a secular humanist, or a materialist, or any of the other atheistic philosophies.
Besides, the way it is normally used, to be atheist just means to not be part of the biggest local religion (regardless of whether one believes in a supernatural Being).

lol

*sings*

"there is no arizona, no painted desert, no sedona"

Next you're going to tell me there is no ocean front property (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZVVWGfhlAk)in Arizona...

Next you're going to tell me there is no ocean front property (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZVVWGfhlAk)in Arizona...

I GOT SOME!

from the front porch you can see the sea!

Then we'd have one hell of an apocalypse! (http://www.viruscomix.com/page433.html)
I can't tell whether that is satire or propaganda. :)

Maybe this (http://www.viruscomix.com/carmageddon.html) helps (note the title of your browser tab/window). ;)

edit: You should also look at the little details that have changed after the apocalypse

you can but you wouldnt be right. agnosticism is an attitude--that one cannot possibly know whether or not god(s) exist and what form such a god would have if it did exist.
Depends on who gets to define the term and in regards of my point, wouldn't even your definition of agnosticism translate into non-belief? :D

atheism is lacking an active belief in any god(s) no matter whether you have never thought of it, dont care, or have an active disdain for the idea.
Strong atheism actively denies the existence of gods.

A wiki quote:
Strong atheism is a term generally used to describe atheists who accept as true the proposition, "gods do not exist". Weak atheism refers to any type of non-theism which falls short of this standard

Therefore an atheist can hold a belief that gods do not exist.


I personally hold my stance more akin to agnosticism rather than atheism because I haven't formulated a position on the existence of god(s) because such an exercise, in my opinion, is completely futile and irrelevant. According to wikipedia my view would be close to Apathetic agnosticism or, in short, apatheism.

...When they said reading of the bible wasn't actively encouraged in the catholic church.

(apologies to all catholics here...but this is due to a conversation I had yesterday with a catholic).

So I'm talking to this woman whose in her mid-thirties. Has shown at the very least a little common sense when it comes to life and the discussion of religion pops up. She knows I'm pagan, but I didn't know what she was. She's Catholic. Born into Catholicism to be exact.

We were talking about what problems that may arise with her current relationship (with a man 15 years her junior who is atheist). During this conversation it came to light one of the reasons I turned away from the Christian faith (other than the hordes of inaccuracies, the lying priests, preachers and evangelists...etc. etc.).

I told her a story that I remember out of the bible, now I can't remember which prophet it was exactly, I believe it was Elijah but the story (from the old testament) goes thus:

Prophet is bald. Children, being as children are, tease and bully said prophet about being bald. Prophet is very upset.

God sends wild bears to slaughter children.

-- Forgive me, but I'm kinda not a big fan there.

When I'd finished the story she said to me, exact quote: "I'm not Biblically inclined or knowledgeable."

I asked why she was in a faith she didn't even research and she asked why should she?

*blink*

A woman, in her mid thirties, actually asked why she should read the bible and research the basis of her faith that she rules her life by.

EXCUSE ME?! WTF?!


This is the story you must be talking about, I had to read it to make sure.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elisha

After Elijah's departure, Elisha returned to Jericho, and there healed the spring of water by casting salt into it (2 Kings 2:21). We next find him at Bethel (2:23), where, with the sternness of his master, he curses the youths who have come out and ridiculed him as a prophet of God: "Go up, thou bald head." The youths mockingly tell Elisha to follow his master in a chariot to heaven, and make fun of his appearance. Elisha then pronounces a curse upon them, pleading God for retribution. The judgment is said to have at once taken effect: two she-bears come out of the woods and kill 42 of the youths.

Depends on who gets to define the term and in regards of my point, wouldn't even your definition of agnosticism translate into non-belief? :D

well yes it might. you can be an atheist agnostic if you have no belief in god(s) but believe that you cant ever really know anyway. you can be a theistic agnostic if you have a belief that some sort of "supreme being" exists but believe that you cant know anything about that being.


Strong atheism actively denies the existence of gods.

A wiki quote:
Strong atheism is a term generally used to describe atheists who accept as true the proposition, "gods do not exist". Weak atheism refers to any type of non-theism which falls short of this standard

Therefore an atheist can hold a belief that gods do not exist.


hence the STRONG in the term, eh?

all that is required is no active belief, the rest is a further definition of one's position on the possibility of god(s) existing.


I personally hold my stance more akin to agnosticism rather than atheism because I haven't formulated a position on the existence of god(s) because such an exercise, in my opinion, is completely futile and irrelevant. According to wikipedia my view would be close to Apathetic agnosticism or, in short, apatheism.

or an apathetic atheist agnostic, perhaps.

i just call myself an atheist. i dont see the point in splitting hairs once you get to the "no i just dont believe it" stage.

Here is the relevant passage:

23 And he went from thence to Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, little boys came out of the city and mocked him, saying: Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head. 24 And looking back, he saw them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord: and there came forth two bears out of the forest, and tore of them two and forty boys. 25 And from thence he went to mount Carmel, and from thence he returned to Samaria.

Link (http://www.drbo.org/chapter/12002.htm)

The wikipedia description quoted above is erroneous in a number of ways. Specifically, he did not want personal retribution because they insulted his appearance, but because they were mocking God through him. The people of Bethel were notorious idolaters and blaspheming God through Elisha, whom they knew Elisha to be a prophet of. This is the reading of the passage most supported by the Church Fathers. St. Augustine (http://www.newadvent.org/fathers/1801047.htm) is pretty representative.

As to the OP's point, as many people have stated in the thread, the bible is huge and lack of knowledge of some obscure passage is not a sign of blind faith.

<snip>
in the meantime if you want to know the catholic justification of the children being killed by bears ask a priest or a catholic theologian. there is an answer even if your casual friends cant provide it.

I wanted to emphasize this. The casual Bible reader, regardless of religion, isn't going to have an answer to these things in most cases. If you want answers you go to someone who has spent a significant amount of time studying them. If you're Catholic, that means going to a Priest, in most cases. If you're an Evangelical/Protestant, you would probably go to your Pastor. If you're a Mormon, you'd probably go to your Sunday School teacher or your Bishop.

You don't go to the average person expecting deep scriptural insight, especially when most people don't spend any time at all in independent scripture study, only going by what they hear on Sunday morning.

Having said that, I do remember back when I was a Catholic that in school we never read Biblical passages. It was something I wasn't comfortable with even then, but I don't hold that against members of the Catholic Faith. Some religions emphasize their Scripture heavily, some don't. It is what it is.

Way I've always seen it, love for Jesus is more important than love for the rulebook.

Here is the relevant passage:



The wikipedia description quoted above is erroneous in a number of ways. Specifically, he did not want personal retribution because they insulted his appearance, but because they were mocking God through him. The people of Bethel were notorious idolaters and blaspheming God through Elisha, whom they knew Elisha to be a prophet of.


And theres nothing better for sorting out idiolaters and blasphemers than killing their "little boys" with She-bears. Yep - Baby Jesus wasn't in a good mood that day.....

I can't help but find those old vengeful god stories hilarious.
God's prophet gets taunted for being bald by children and he runs home and cries to God and God, being god and stuff, sends wild bears to eat them. That's comedy.

Half your Sunday? What does your Sunday only last for 90 minutes? MAybe two hours.

You know of all the Catholic services I have been to and there have been plenty I have never once been told about hopw much I suck and that I am going to hell not once.I've never seen such a sermon either.

Half your Sunday? What does your Sunday only last for 90 minutes? MAybe two hours.

You know of all the Catholic services I have been to and there have been plenty I have never once been told about hopw much I suck and that I am going to hell not once.
I would like to say that having been to Catholic and Baptist masses, the difference is Catholic masses are actually half as long but seem like they are 10 times longer.

I would say that just because a person has a religion it doesn't mean they let it rule their life.

i just call myself an atheist. i dont see the point in splitting hairs once you get to the "no i just dont believe it" stage.

If there's one thing we believe in it's categorization.

Besides, being labeled an atheist is not only booring it's also dangerous when faced with a militant fundie christianislamofascisthindunazitheist ninjapirate who's out to batter people who answer wrongly to questions like Are you an atheist? or Do you deny god(s)? :D

I would say that just because a person has a religion it doesn't mean they let it rule their life.

Yep, I'll go with that. Also, As Elisha only "cursed them in the name of the LORD." And the whole: "And two she-bears came out of the woods and tore forty-two of the boys." bit is not Elisha's fault, should he be held responsible?

But what kind of suckish insult is that? They deserved it for sucking at insulting so badly!

Also, that's the sort of thing God did in the Old Testament (see also Sodom and Gomorrah, Elijah and the priests of Baal etc)

Because through a conversation with one member of a 1billion+ religious congregation, you obviously know all you need to know. I'm sure you went into depth with the slightly differing rites, cultural traditions and theological views of the following Catholic denominations into account when you made your sweeping generalization:



* Roman Catholic Church
* Armenian Catholic Church
* Belarusian Catholic Church
* Bulgarian Catholic Church
* Chaldean Catholic Church
* Coptic Catholic Church
* Croatian Greek Catholic Church
* Ethiopian Catholic Church
* Georgian Catholic Church
* Greek Catholic Church
* Hungarian Greek Catholic Church
* Italo-Albanian Catholic Church
* Macedonian Catholic Church
* Maronite Catholic Church
* Melkite Catholic Church
* Romanian Catholic Church
* Russian Catholic Church
* Ruthenian Catholic Church
* Slovak Greek Catholic Church
* Syrian Catholic Church
* Syro-Malabar Church
* Syro-Malankara Catholic Church
* Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church

As well as:

* Latin Rite
* Febroniast
* Gallicanist



And after studying all these individual Catholic Churches dogmas you no doubt realized your above thesis and decided to enlighten us all.

it gets worse. i was talking to a former Catholic priest. he told me that for the 8 years he spent in training he spent 7 hours reading the Bible. thats les than an hour a year!!:eek::confused::eek: then he was supposed to get up every Sunday morning and teach from it!!

not only that but he spent the rest of his time studying man made canon law.

and he was supposed to give his congregation the impression that they weren't good enough to read the Bible.

This is probably the stupidest thread I have ever read...

*walks away with head shaking*

Now Wilgrove, we both know that just ain't true.

it gets worse. i was talking to a former Catholic priest. he told me that for the 8 years he spent in training he spent 7 hours reading the Bible. thats les than an hour a year!!:eek::confused::eek: then he was supposed to get up every Sunday morning and teach from it!!

not only that but he spent the rest of his time studying man made canon law.

and he was supposed to give his congregation the impression that they weren't good enough to read the Bible.

He probably meant 7 hours a day or week.

That includes atheism. Atheism runs on the blind faith that there is no God. See? Deep down we're all the same :p.

You don't need "blind faith" to not believe in fairy tales. Just like you don't need "blind faith" to tell someone stabbing themselves with a knife isn't such a good idea.

it gets worse. i was talking to a former Catholic priest. he told me that for the 8 years he spent in training he spent 7 hours reading the Bible. thats les than an hour a year!!:eek::confused::eek: then he was supposed to get up every Sunday morning and teach from it!!

not only that but he spent the rest of his time studying man made canon law.

and he was supposed to give his congregation the impression that they weren't good enough to read the Bible.

Well, the best way to get someone convert away from christianity is to have them actually read the damn bible. I wish I had the time & interest to read it throughoutly enough myself to be able to do something along the lines of this:

http://suicideforhire.comicgenesis.com/d/20060705.html

...And read the following 5-7 pages. Best laughs I had in ages when I first read that one. Some people might find the comic... Offensive so be warned.

So the moral of the story is not to make fun of prophets with words and names, but break their bones with sticks and stones?

If you can concuss them, they may be unable to pray and have you smited(smoted? smitten?).

and he was supposed to give his congregation the impression that they weren't good enough to read the Bible.

My my you know nothing about the Catholic Church do you?

it gets worse. i was talking to a former Catholic priest. he told me that for the 8 years he spent in training he spent 7 hours reading the Bible. thats les than an hour a year!!:eek::confused::eek: then he was supposed to get up every Sunday morning and teach from it!!

not only that but he spent the rest of his time studying man made canon law.

and he was supposed to give his congregation the impression that they weren't good enough to read the Bible.

I will assume that this is at least a part of the reason why your friend is an 'ex' priest...

The Vatican DOES admit that the Catholic church has failed to adequately teach Biblical familiarity to it's members. It has not been a goal to be that way though and it just so happens that the Vatican just recently released their plans for a Synod to address this very issue...

SYNOD OF BISHOPS
XII ORDINARY GENERAL ASSEMBLY

THE WORD OF GOD
IN THE LIFE AND MISSION
OF THE CHURCH

*snip*

3. The submissions from the Pastors communally share the following expectations for the synod:

— the Word of God needs to be given greater priority in the life and mission of the Church; this will require courage and creativity in a pedagogy of communicating, adapted to the times (culture, real-life situations, communication);

— the faithful need to know that the Word of God is Jesus Christ, an awareness which lends a sense of mystery to the reading of every word in the Bible, particularly during liturgical celebrations, first and foremost at the Sunday Eucharist;

— the Word of God can only be fully understood through the action of the Holy Spirit, who gives it meaning and inspires the reading of the Bible in the Church, within the context of her living Tradition of proclamation and charity. In this way, hearing the Word of God and reading the Bible are seen to require participation in the community of the Church in a spirit of communion and service;

— the Bible needs to be seen as the Word of God who continues to reveal, despite the many difficulties in understanding certain passages, especially those in Old Testament;

— Christ’s faithful exhibit a great desire to hear the Word of God, which has resulted in many noteworthy pastoral initiatives. In this regard, however, urgent attention needs to be given to a sense of indifference, lack of knowledge and confusion about the truths of the faith concerning the Word of God, as well as to due preparation and necessary biblical supports;

— pastoral programs on the Bible need to be developed. Indeed, all pastoral activity, including the teaching of the truths of the faith, should be based on the Word of God and continually inspired by it;

— communion in the faith necessarily requires putting the Word of God into practice; each particular Church must commit itself to receiving the Word and applying it to every local situation;

— the different approaches to the Bible in the Latin and Eastern Traditions need to be known and their richness appreciated;

— the competency and responsibility of Pastors to proclaim the Word of God demands continual updating in the formation process;

— the laity urgently need to be aware that they are not passive subjects in relation to the Word of God; rather they are to become both hearers of the Word of God and, after due preparation and support from the community, proclaimers of it; and

— the faithful need to be convinced that God addresses his Word of salvation to every person without exception; consequently, he wants his Word to be a part of the Church’s mission, in what people come to know as the Good News of liberation, consolation and salvation. The Word seeks a dialogue within the Church, with Christian communities, with other religions, and even with culture, always mindful of the many seeds of the truth which God’s providence has placed in them.http://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/synod/documents/rc_synod_doc_20080511_instrlabor-xii-assembly_en.html

The verse's given here
http://www.cracked.com/article_15699_9-most-badass-bible-verses.html

The word for those mocking Elisha can mean youths or young children. One passage-explanation I read claimed the city 'round that time had roving gangs of teenagers so those encountering Elisha were probably threatening bullies instead of playful scamps. Consider the numbers. More than 40 mauled. How many were there around Elisha? 40+thugs gathering around a guy as he travels seems more likely to me than 40+ children coming 'round him.
Context=Elisha is God's last prophet. He is God's representative on Earth. To mock him is to mock God. A mauling is merciful considering God killed other people for talking shit. Elisha's coming back to a community whose Queen wants him dead, has killed all the other prophets, and has sent men looking for him. W/40+ witnesses word will get around. Folks might have ideas about killing him as a favor to the queen, capturing him to deliver, or reporting his presence. Following up "I saw Elisha!" w/ "...and that's why I'm horribly disfigured" would dissuade folks from acting against him.