NationStates Jolt Archive

I went to the pub today with a friend of mine and at the end of the night we ended up in a fast food joint, as you do. There was a girl in there we recognised, her being a bar maid in the local and all, but when we left we got started on by a couple of guys for "chatting her up". Nothing happened as we took the passive stance of apologising and awalking away, the question is do you believe their behaviour was justified or would you have taken a different approach?

I went to the pub today with a friend of mine and at the end of the night we ended up in a fast food joint, as you do. There was a girl in there we recognised, her being a bar maid in the local and all, but when we left we got started on by a couple of guys for "chatting her up". Nothing happened as we took the passive stance of apologising and awalking away, the question is do you believe their behaviour was justified or would you have taken a different approach?

Those guys were probably just drunk jerks. I think you two did the correct thing of walking away. Late night brawls can end in tragedy, you know.:p Of course, one can always go for ¨maybe the guys were trying to protect the girl from you¨ argument. Either way, you and your buddy did the right thing.

you should have kicked their ass this is a free country you talk to anyone you want.

you should have kicked their ass this is a free country you talk to anyone you want.

Location: Essex, UK

Not exactly a free country. You can be held for 28 days without being charged with anything.

Err aye, apologise and wonder off is the best course of action. No need to get in a fight for no reason.

Location: Essex, UK

Not exactly a free country.
Lol wut. Yer not free to beat people up, so it's a police state?
You can be held for 28 days without being charged with anything.
Only if you're wearing a turban.

Those guys were probably just drunk jerks. I think you two did the correct thing of walking away. Late night brawls can end in tragedy, you know.:p Of course, one can always go for ¨maybe the guys were trying to protect the girl from you¨ argument. Either way, you and your buddy did the right thing.

I could understand the 'protection' intent if it hadn't been for the fact that they didn't try and come after us until we had left the shop.

Apologies for not making that clear in the original post.

42 days (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/7449268.stm)! Pay attention!

Thanks for the update. Maybe you can find the answer to life, the universe, and everything while in prison! :D

Location: Essex, UK

Not exactly a free country. You can be held for 28 days without being charged with anything.

42 days (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/7449268.stm)! Pay attention!

I went to the pub today with a friend of mine and at the end of the night we ended up in a fast food joint, as you do. There was a girl in there we recognised, her being a bar maid in the local and all, but when we left we got started on by a couple of guys for "chatting her up". Nothing happened as we took the passive stance of apologising and awalking away, the question is do you believe their behaviour was justified or would you have taken a different approach?

if they were customers... then they were jelouse that you talked to the prettiest barmaid there.

if they were workers... then they were jelouse that you talked to the prettiest barmaid there.

either way, kudos for you in avoiding a fight. :)

I could understand the 'protection' intent if it hadn't been for the fact that they didn't try and come after us until we had left the shop.

Apologies for not making that clear in the original post.

Mate, no need to apologize. And as I stated before, these guys were probably drunk jerks in search of a fight. I think you and your friend did the correct thing in walking away.

how big where these guys?

I would of had a fight and so would allot of people but its always best to just walk away so there is nothing to feel bad about

Order of action:

1. Avoid hostile confrontations when reasonably possible
2. Attempt peaceful resolution if the situation allows
3. Escape where possible.
4. Fight only if necessary and the previous 3 options either didn't work or cannot be attempted.

You did right. Most things just aren't worth fighting about, and since you mention no threats against you or the girl, there doesn't appear to be any cause for violence.

2. Attempt peaceful resolution if the situation allows

I'm rather cautious on this rule myself

how big where these guys?

I would of had a fight and so would allot of people but its always best to just walk away so there is nothing to feel bad about

I don't feel bad about it at all, I'm entirely sure I did the right thing. I'm just not entirely sure how that situation came about.

Also, why would you have gotten into a fight?

I don't feel bad about it at all, I'm entirely sure I did the right thing. I'm just not entirely sure how that situation came about.

Also, why would you have gotten into a fight?

Because CTP is badarse like that.:D

Because CTP is badarse like that.:D

He has a bad arse? As a man with a fantastic arse I can only offer my condolences ;)

This is all I have to say. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YPBHhlwd3-o&feature=related)

This is all I have to say. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YPBHhlwd3-o&feature=related)

Ha ha! I was almost offended when I saw the title, but I listened to the song and I reckon that covers my stance fairly well.

Edit: Well, apart from the final verse.

Well, this is something pretty different, but it reminds me of a story my friend told me about his dojo master and his master in England. His dojo master was at a bar and some English bloke decided to try and pick a fight with the American, not realizing that he was picking on a black-belt. But unfortunately, the young black belt made one crucial mistake: he decided to trash talk back to the Englishman with the line "F___ you, and f___ your f___ing Queen!", at which point the rest of the bar decided to pick a fight with the Americans as well. When my friend asked his dojo master how the fight went, the reply was: "Well, we were doing pretty well until we went through the window."

Lol wut. Yer not free to beat people up, so it's a police state?

Only if you're wearing a turban.

It shouldn't matter if you get the hell out of there after decking those jerks. just be sure that your car isn't out front where a security camera might get the plate number.

42 days (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/7449268.stm)! Pay attention!

Are you kidding me? You can only be held for 48 hours here. And a good thing, as I imagine you'd have a hard time getting people to tune into an episode of "42 Days".

Violence is the oldest and most effective form of conflict resolution. When diplomacy fails violence must be applied without apology. Never hesitate to do what you must. Remember, victory is life.

Are you kidding me? You can only be held for 48 hours here. And a good thing, as I imagine you'd have a hard time getting people to tune into an episode of "42 Days".

Just do it as reality TV.

Day 17 and the evil terrorist is still refusing to admit culpability for general plotting and murmuring vaguely seditiously whilst wearing a turban - police are now administering hourly beatings and are feeding him heavy doses of laxatives having removed the toilet seat yesterday.

It'd be the most popular show ever made!

you should have kicked their ass this is a free country you talk to anyone you want.

It shouldn't matter if you get the hell out of there after decking those jerks. just be sure that your car isn't out front where a security camera might get the plate number.

Hmmm - I tend to think you are being just as much a jerk as the people the OP is talking about. There was no need for violence in this situation at all - as the OP showed it could be resolved by them acting sensibly.

Violence is the oldest and most effective form of conflict resolution. When diplomacy fails violence must be applied without apology. Never hesitate to do what you must. Remember, victory is life.

How do you decide when diplomacy has failed? And why must you not apologise? There is nothing good about violence and I do not believe that you can ever justify it.

I object to violence because when it appears to do good, the good is only temporary; the evil it does is permanent.

Only if you're wearing a turban.

Oi pack that in.

Order of action:

1. Avoid hostile confrontations when reasonably possible
2. Attempt peaceful resolution if the situation allows
3. Escape where possible.
4. Fight only if necessary and the previous 3 options either didn't work or cannot be attempted.

You did right. Most things just aren't worth fighting about, and since you mention no threats against you or the girl, there doesn't appear to be any cause for violence.

Yep yep.

How do you decide when diplomacy has failed? And why must you not apologise? There is nothing good about violence and I do not believe that you can ever justify it.

Well the are some redeaming features of violence. It has and I suspect always will, sort things out.

Sometimes you have to get violent, that I'm afraid is just life.

Well the are some redeaming features of violence. It has and I suspect always will, sort things out.

Sometimes you have to get violent, that I'm afraid is just life.

It doesn't really solve anything though does it. Violence only begets more violence. Whilst the world is currently a violent place, there is no reason that this can't be changed.

It doesn't really solve anything though does it. Violence only begets more violence. Whilst the world is currently a violent place, there is no reason that this can't be changed.

Well yes and no. Violence can certianly beget violence, but it is untrue to say that it does not solve problems.

I got bullied at at school for many years untill I started to fight back, problem solved.

The Germans tried to take Poland in the second world war, much violence later, problem solved.

Teb Bundy killed many women, then the state kiled him, problem solved.

All of nature is violent, all of humaity has the capacity to be violent, it is something that I do not ever see going away.

Hmmm - I tend to think you are being just as much a jerk as the people the OP is talking about. There was no need for violence in this situation at all - as the OP showed it could be resolved by them acting sensibly.

By backing down.

Kick their ass once and they will learn you can chat up any bar maid you want.
Problem some three less drunks bother you for having a conversation with a pretty girl. now weeks or months later they might do this again when he is trying to chat up another girl.

By backing down.

Kick their ass once and they will learn you can chat up any bar maid you want.
Problem some three less drunks bother you for having a conversation with a pretty girl. now weeks or months later they might do this again when he is trying to chat up another girl.

May, might, could do, might be........

Sounds like to much of a risk to take to me. Violence should never be the first action, but the last.

It is in fact attitudes like the one you show, that are responisble for the spate of knife crimes, etc... are you 15?

May, might, could do, might be........

Sounds like to much of a risk to take to me. Violence should never be the first action, but the last.

It is in fact attitudes like the one you show, that are responisble for the spate of knife crimes, etc... are you 15?

when it comes to a bunch of punks getting between me and Maybe Ms. right violence is called for.
No wonder it is so easy for Americans to get laid in Europe, Europeans guys back down.

you should escalate it step by step first. they come talking shit then you talk shit back.
Try it sometime most of the time, most of the time it doesn't result in a fight but the bully backing down. It is very important you make it understood your not scared of escalating a conflict. nine out of ten times these sorts of punks move on to a softer target.

By backing down.

Kick their ass once and they will learn you can chat up any bar maid you want.
Problem some three less drunks bother you for having a conversation with a pretty girl. now weeks or months later they might do this again when he is trying to chat up another girl.

when it comes to a bunch of punks getting between me and Maybe Ms. right violence is called for.
No wonder it is so easy for Americans to get laid in Europe, Europeans guys back down.

you should escalate it step by step first. they come talking shit then you talk shit back.
Try it sometime most of the time, most of the time it doesn't result in a fight but the bully backing down. It is very important you make it understood your not scared of escalating a conflict. nine out of ten times these sorts of punks move on to a softer target.

The phrase "all mouth and no trousers" springs to mind.

No wonder English people find it so easy to get laid in the US.

why would you have gotten into a fight?

because I live in Northampton :p

Because CTP is badarse like that.:D

homework massive :)

He has a bad arse? As a man with a fantastic arse I can only offer my condolences ;)

some women like my fat arse actually it makes a change from the rest of the pipe cleaner

No wonder English people find it so easy to get laid in the US.

because they would of never seen a foreigner before what with the dead tourist industry?

I've not actually been to Northampton, I wasn't aware it was such a dangerous place :)


Not so much dangerous as hideously depressing. Think of it as the red-haired stepchild of the east midlands.

because I live in Northampton :p

I've not actually been to Northampton, I wasn't aware it was such a dangerous place :)

because they would of never seen a foreigner before what with the dead tourist industry?

Because Englishmen wear snazzy trousers ;)

My first post modded for inciting racial hatred but I say if man on your land, you fight him, or he learns that he gets away with being on your land.
Likewise, if man attack you for talking to woman, you must fight. What if he takes woman while you are gone? Then woman is still violate but you have no joy.
Where I live, we know this. In your "civilized" land, you forget.

Not so much dangerous as hideously depressing. Think of it as the red-haired stepchild of the east midlands.

"the rose of the shires" :p

I've not actually been to Northampton, I wasn't aware it was such a dangerous place :)

its not but the pensioners grandchildren usually take a dislike ;)

Because Englishmen wear snazzy trousers ;)

we all wear trackies because we are fitness fanatics

My first post modded for inciting racial hatred but I say if man on your land, you fight him, or he learns that he gets away with being on your land.

well you had better get off my land then you filthy colonial type :)

My first post modded for inciting racial hatred

To be honest I am surprised the name of your nation has been allowed by the Mods given the whole Rwanda genocide.

when it comes to a bunch of punks getting between me and Maybe Ms. right violence is called for.
No wonder it is so easy for Americans to get laid in Europe, Europeans guys back down.

you should escalate it step by step first. they come talking shit then you talk shit back.
Try it sometime most of the time, most of the time it doesn't result in a fight but the bully backing down. It is very important you make it understood your not scared of escalating a conflict. nine out of ten times these sorts of punks move on to a softer target.

Frankly, what a load of rubbish. I see this all over the place, this stance, this, showing front rubbish, is just that, rubbish.

Being brave in front of leary drunks, is not really 'not backing down'. Choosing when to fight, and seeing when you don't have to IS the better way.

And fighting because of a woman, shit man how backwards can you get.

It would be really stupid to fight over something this stupid.

If someone wants to fight you, it's ok to back down.

If they attack you, it's definitely ok to fight back.

But you need to keep your mouth shut, and know when to back down and leave the pub. Here in the US, the aggressor can argue incitement because you used "fighting words".

There's the fight, which is always ugly, and the law, which is always a bitch.

Unless it's a life or death sort of thing, most fights should be avoided.

Tutsi do this to me I machete he, land is free, you should take woman, all land belong to Hutu.

http://img486.imageshack.us/img486/9695/owltrouble1rq.jpg

Homework Massive :)

:d

42 days (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/7449268.stm)! Pay attention!

Not yet...

Well yes and no. Violence can certianly beget violence, but it is untrue to say that it does not solve problems.

I got bullied at at school for many years untill I started to fight back, problem solved.

The Germans tried to take Poland in the second world war, much violence later, problem solved.

Teb Bundy killed many women, then the state kiled him, problem solved.

All of nature is violent, all of humaity has the capacity to be violent, it is something that I do not ever see going away.

I can see where you're coming from, but for all of those examples there were other options available which could have been successful and would probably have done more good in the long term. I'm very much against the death penalty so I don't think that the Ted Bundy thing can be called problem solved. Two wrongs don't make a right and all that.

we all wear trackies because we are fitness fanatics

Maybe up there you do, but down here in Essex we...er... *damn* :p

As I said before, violence is the last resort after avoidance, diplomacy, and evasion have failed. Violence is still a necessary option, though, because while two parties are required for peace, it only takes one party to initiate conflict. Violence, and sometimes deadly force, may be required.

There was another thread about a crazy guy who beat a toddler to death. The situation was resolved with a police officer shooting the crazy guy. Diplomacy and peaceful resolutions were not possible. Agresive restraining methods probably wouldn;t have worked, unless the restrainer was proficient in unarmed combat.

I submit that violence must always be an option for those occasions where it is the only way to prevent one person from killing another in cold blood. The only occasion where I view deadly force justifiable is in defense of myself or another person from someone who initiated deadly force. Since this event in the OP did not involve any threat of harm, there was no cause for violence.

For the record, I'm a Gun-Totin' Yankee Redneck. Most of us in the US hold the philosophy I've outlined above. It's the noisy minority that give us a bad name.

By backing down.

Kick their ass once and they will learn you can chat up any bar maid you want.
Problem some three less drunks bother you for having a conversation with a pretty girl. now weeks or months later they might do this again when he is trying to chat up another girl.

Or they'll kick your ass, and maybe the police will get involved. But I'm sure that the barmaid will be impressed by a bunch of drunks getting into a fight.

Location: Essex, UK

Not exactly a free country. You can be held for 28 days without being charged with anything.

There's your answer. Unfortunately, the OP lives in Essex, where unjustified violence, deliquency and chavtastic life is endemic.