NationStates Jolt Archive

Do you guys know of any good map strategy games that are either turn-based or real time pausable? I'm looking for games like the total war series, or paradox games, making history and the like. You know you have a nation or a dynasty or whatever and you wage war, manage economy, establish diplomatic relations etc. Thank you in advance:)

Real men play starfire.

Starfire is a pen and paper turn based 4X strategy game in space. You design your own ships, randomly generate your star systems, and colonize them. You explore into new star systems, meet strange new beings, and kill them.

Try demos of the various Paradox Interactive games.

Real men play starfire.

Starfire is a pen and paper turn based 4X strategy game in space. You design your own ships, randomly generate your star systems, and colonize them. You explore into new star systems, meet strange new beings, and kill them.

Sounds like I'll have to be both the narrator and the player:rolleyes:

Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri rules all.

And for RTS whatever the most recent version of Cossacks is.

Sins of a Solar Empire. Absolutely superb.

If you don't mind having the game in Japanese and... Some other Japanese-related thingy, you could try Sengoku Rance. ;)

The Guild two is pretty good. You control a dynsaty, attack random people,etc,. Diplomacy with other dynasties, buying land, the game is awesome! (If still a little buggy)

If you don't mind having the game in Japanese and... Some other Japanese-related thingy, you could try Sengoku Rance. ;)

I hope there aren't many menus:p
I'm waiting for the latest rise of the 3 kingdoms to be imported to pc this year:)

I hope there aren't many menus:p
I'm waiting for the latest rise of the 3 kingdoms to be imported to pc this year:)

Well, I think Sengoku Rance is simpler than, let's say, The Spirit of Eternity Sword 2, but then again, the latter is much more fun because of its really cool combat system. If they removed the Japanese-thingy elements from the game and had it translated, I think it could sell well outside of Japan.

The Civilization series.

What? Nobody said it yet.

The Civilization series.

What? Nobody said it yet.

Well, it's quite likely that he already played them quite a bit.

Sins of a Solar Empire. Absolutely superb.

Pace is slow enough that you get a feel for the game quick. Excellent game.

Before they Sim-med out on the [Noun] Warriors games (and even then) Koei made the kind of games you have in mind. Of course most of them were about Chinese or Japanese history so the choices are pretty limited.

If we're talking about classics, there's Master of Orion 2. What other game let's you blow up a planet, then take the resulting asteroid belt to create a new planet?

Europa Universalis ftw!!!

The Civilization series.

What? Nobody said it yet.

I left at no III. Never got into it. II ate long sections of my existence though.

Knights of Honor, Victoria, Hearts of Iron, Europa Universalis, all great games.

You mentioned one of the best in your OP...TW.

best RTS ever!!!

WarHammer 40,000 Dawn of War... with its three expansions, Winter Assault, Dark Crusade and Soulstorm.

PERIOD!

Another vote for Sins of a Solar Empire

best RTS ever!!!

WarHammer 40,000 Dawn of War... with its three expansions, Winter Assault, Dark Crusade and Soulstorm.

PERIOD!

those are real time. we want turn based.

You could try Colonization. It was a Civilization-esque game where you played either the English, French, or Spanish, and tried to settle in America. I personally didn't really like it, but I suppose you could give it a shot.

You can design your own spaceships in Galactic Civilizations II. Mine looked 10x more terrifying than their firepower warranted. :cool:

The main gripe I have with this genre is that when you have taken a couple cities/planets from another empire you can just keep the war machine rolling until you have defeated that empire and then your army can move on to the next empire. Several minor wars with periods of uneasy peace with old enemies in between would be more challenging than wiping them out in one big war. Is there any game where it's easy to take 1 city but very difficult to sustain a war effort beyond taking say 3 or 4 cities?

You had a lot of ship customization in Master of Orion 2 as well. Your ship designs would also look a bit different depending on what color you chose for your empire.

(also, don't tell anyone, but if you picked the right configuration for your ship, you could make a single ship that could obliterate any computer-AI controlled enemy fleet, no matter its size. The only way to beat it would be to make another ship of the same type, and hope you go second. Or maybe first. I don't recall when the phasing stopped working)

I'm telling you, MoO2 is a classic. If you like turn-based strategy, you should at least try it out.

I'd also take a look at Space Empires IV and V. I actually prefer IV, as it has a turn based combat system, while V's is real time, but in most other ways they're fairly similar.

Aww...

I saw the thread title and hoped it would be about Carcassonne. I enjoy video games and all, but there is nothing like facing one's own family and friends over an old-style real game. Carcassonne is definitely map-based-
;-P


If you are looking for an older computer game, Caesar II is nifty. It combines a Sim City-like part with a "Province View" that has battles in which one controls troops rather than does the actual fighting. It was a spiffy change from the usual.

I'd also take a look at Space Empires IV and V. I actually prefer IV, as it has a turn based combat system, while V's is real time, but in most other ways they're fairly similar.
I was just going to say that. The Space Empires games have always been a great example of the mechanics of a strategy game without much flash getting in the way.

Space Empires V is pretty flashy. I don't recommend V, but IV is great (I also liked III, but it will be hard to find now).

those are real time. we want turn based.

oh ok... Masters of Orion...the original one...its old but still one of my faves

I'm sure you're looking for video/computer games, but the best game I've ever played that met the description "turn-based map strategy game" is actually the board game Diplomacy.

Oh, oh! How could I forget? Age of Wonders. That game was pretty nifty. I think that was the game's name, anywho. Also, the classic Stronghold (not the new ones, the original one for the DOS) wasn't exactly turn-based, but it was tick-based. IIRC you could slow down or fasten the ticks, or maybe even pause the game completely, but still be able to build thing and give orders. But the game was a bit broken in regards to combat. :) Still, building the empire was great fun, the combat was just a spectacular way to finish the game once you got tired of your kingdom.

Sins of a Solar Empire. Absolutely superb.

God. Seconded.

Oh, oh! How could I forget? Age of Wonders. That game was pretty nifty. I think that was the game's name, anywho. Also, the classic Stronghold (not the new ones, the original one for the DOS) wasn't exactly turn-based, but it was tick-based. IIRC you could slow down or fasten the ticks, or maybe even pause the game completely, but still be able to build thing and give orders. But the game was a bit broken in regards to combat. :) Still, building the empire was great fun, the combat was just a spectacular way to finish the game once you got tired of your kingdom.
The new Stronghold isn't like that? Thanks for the warning.

I found Age of Wonders quite difficult. I loved it, but I just never got very far.

Dice Wars

http://www.gamedesign.jp/flash/dice/dice.html

The new Stronghold isn't like that?
Not remotely. It's more like a more complex Settlers with quite a decent combat engine.

best RTS ever!!!

Too bad real time games can't have the S component. In PvP or PvComputer....Especially in a 'standard' command your troops against opponent game.


As for TB...
- Master of Orion 1 & 2
- Heroes of Might and Magic IV
- XCOM (UFO ftw!)...


erm...ok, something less well known:
- Silent Storm (http://www.silentstorm-online.de/main.php?lang=en) (just DL some 'no panzerklein mod' while at it)
- Dominions III (http://www.shrapnelgames.com/Illwinter/Dom3/1.htm) (completely turn based game in vein of the arcade Total Wars series)
- Blood Bowl (search google for FUMBBL) :)
- Stars! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stars!)




I also suggest that you AVOID Space Empires games (I've played III & IV) at all cost, they're practically MS EXCELS IN SPACE...except that even spreadsheeting is more engaging. :D

Dice Wars

http://www.gamedesign.jp/flash/dice/dice.html

awesome

Too bad real time games can't have the S component. In PvP or PvComputer....Especially in a 'standard' command your troops against opponent game.


If they are to fast for you to think...well dude...thats YOUR problem.

You can also look for Masters of Magic... from the same company and almost the same time that Masters of Orion.

awesome
Be careful. I've lost weeks in there.

Be careful. I've lost weeks in there.

It's so addictive, must...win....must...win

- Master of Orion 1 & 2
- Heroes of Might and Magic IV
- XCOM (UFO ftw!)...

I can't believe I missed XCOM.

Also, the Heroes of Might & Magic games are good, though I prefer the earlier ones.

The Warlords games used to be turn-based, but Warlords 3 was RTS, so I highly recommend Warlords and Warlords 2 only (at least one of them has a great random map generator, too).
I also suggest that you AVOID Space Empires games (I've played III & IV) at all cost, they're practically MS EXCELS IN SPACE...except that even spreadsheeting is more engaging. :D
The reason I excluded Space Empires 5 from my reommendation is because it's less like a spreadsheet.

If they are to fast for you to think...well dude...thats YOUR problem.
The problem is that they don't require you to THINK but ACT.

They have, from my pov, average RT"S" has about as much to do with strategy games as an average beat'em up.
You can also look for Masters of Magic... from the same company and almost the same time that Masters of Orion.

That's an awesome game too.

Too bad real time games can't have the S component. In PvP or PvComputer....Especially in a 'standard' command your troops against opponent game.
Simply untrue, every Relic game has been excellent in combining RT speed with strategy pretty nicely.
As for TB...
- Master of Orion 1 & 2
- Heroes of Might and Magic IV
- XCOM (UFO ftw!)...
Damn right, shame about every game after UFO : Enemy Unknown, really.

If they are to fast for you to think...well dude...thats YOUR problem.
The problem is that they don't require you to THINK but ACT.

They have in average, from my pov, about as much to do with strategy as an average beat'em up.
You can also look for Masters of Magic... from the same company and almost the same time that Masters of Orion.

That's an awesome game too.

I tried to play Master of Orion 2 recently and the game is so old it doesnt play on my new mac for some reason.

I tried to play Master of Orion 2 recently and the game is so old it doesnt play on my new mac for some reason.
Get DOSBox and D-Fend ;)

Get DOSBox and D-Fend ;)

Visit this site

www.abandonia.com

Visit this site

www.abandonia.com
Aye, an excellent site. And with LucasArts, Activision and Vivendi leaving the ESA, the best adventure games of the 1990s will soon be back up. Good times.

I can't believe I missed XCOM.

Also, the Heroes of Might & Magic games are good, though I prefer the earlier ones.
I think the series peaked on IV with heroes really taking part in combat.

The V is just lame rehash of III with 3D graphics IMO.

The problem is that they don't require you to THINK but ACT.

They have in average, from my pov, about as much to do with strategy as an average beat'em up.



Real life battles were fought in real time... real life strategy needs to be though in real time. Let me do this more phooney...


Napoleon: Ok...so my cavalry advances thirty meters... and my infantry support. The artillery reloads and my dragoons...not yet...to early to move them yet... thats it... WELLINGTONG... ITS YOUR TURN!!!


Wellingtong: OK NAPY... now now..my oh my what to do what to do?

Aye, an excellent site. And with LucasArts, Activision and Vivendi leaving the ESA, the best adventure games of the 1990s will soon be back up. Good times.

:eek:

WHEN IS LUCAS ARTS GOING TO LEAVE ESA!?!?!?

BEST NEWS IN LONG LONG TIME!!!!

:confused:

it can be true...you are playing with me :(

:eek:

WHEN IS LUCAS ARTS GOING TO LEAVE ESA!?!?!?

BEST NEWS IN LONG LONG TIME!!!!

:confused:

it can be true...you are playing with me :(
It's on the front page. News that ID is leaving is on the forums.

On the other hand, they're all joining some new "PC Gaming Alliance", which sounds a lot like "ESA 2 : This time, we're going to shut your arses down straight away".

Real life battles were fought in real time... real life strategy needs to be though in real time. Let me do this more phooney...
It's not tough it's brainless... edit: Well, not brainless, just requiring something different from deep thinking - Something more akin to beat'em up and using the right combo.

In bad RTS: He or she who has the fastest mousehand - most commands per minute - wins!

Napoleon: Ok...so my cavalry advances thirty meters... and my infantry support. The artillery reloads and my dragoons...not yet...to early to move them yet... thats it... WELLINGTONG... ITS YOUR TURN!!!


Wellingtong: OK NAPY... now now..my oh my what to do what to do?

Napoleon: I select 100x100 square, and call them group 1.

Napoleon: Group 1 attack.

Napoleon: I select 100x100 square and call them group 2.

Napoleon: Group 2 attack..

<while later>

Napoleon: Why in the heck did half of group 1 suddenly change direction?
Aide: Sir, you appointed them to group 2!

Meanwhile on the other side...

Wellington: WTF? Why aren't my toops striking back?
Aide: Sir, you used the MOVE command not ATTACK command while moving them into position.
Wellington: Attack?!? Empty ground? WTF?
Aide: Sir, you see, that's how reality works! You have to issue an attack command otherwise they won't respond to attacks!


The problem with *most* RTS games is that you're not commanding an army, but moving a bunch of brainless toons around.

There are exceptions, like Close Combat series where the troops do have their own minds and can take their own actions or Settlers (I&II) where you don't actually command your troops.

Why is Lucas so full fo greed!?

WHy he wants us to pay for games 20 years old!?

Thats just plain mean.:(

If one is interested in WW2 combat then I suggest Combat Mission (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combat_Mission) series.

It's a turn based game but the moves are handled in real time.

If one is interested in WW2 combat then I suggest Combat Mission (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combat_Mission) series.

It's a turn based game but the moves are handled in real time.
I like CMBB a hell of a lot more than the others, but then that's because CMBO had some really irritating problems regarding FOs and hiding, and then CMAK had dust, and the desert setting was mainly very pish. Italy was quite good, but that's about it.

Grand Theft Auto.

It's not tough it's brainless... edit: Well, not brainless, just requiring something different from deep thinking - Something more akin to beat'em up and using the right combo.

In bad RTS: He or she who has the fastest mousehand - most commands per minute - wins!



Napoleon: I select 100x100 square, and call them group 1.

Napoleon: Group 1 attack.

Napoleon: I select 100x100 square and call them group 2.

Napoleon: Group 2 attack..

<while later>

Napoleon: Why in the heck did half of group 1 suddenly change direction?
Aide: Sir, you appointed them to group 2!

Meanwhile on the other side...

Wellington: WTF? Why aren't my toops striking back?
Aide: Sir, you used the MOVE command not ATTACK command while moving them into position.
Wellington: Attack?!? Empty ground? WTF?
Aide: Sir, you see, that's how reality works! You have to issue an attack command otherwise they won't respond to attacks!


The problem with *most* RTS games is that you're not commanding an army, but moving a bunch of brainless toons around.

There are exceptions, like Close Combat series where the troops do have their own minds and can take their own actions or Settlers (I&II) where you don't actually command your troops.

Try medieval 2 Total War. Its turnbased for the high level strategy and real time for the battles. A ture jewel.

New game coming out in september. Spore. Sounds like it is going to be awesome. You start off as a we germ and you have develop sentience then build cities then colonize planets and then invade other players universes and stuff.

- Master of Orion 1 & 2

Hey, III was awesome. Screw you and your inflated expectations. :p

I tried to play Master of Orion 2 recently and the game is so old it doesnt play on my new mac for some reason.

Intel Macs and OS X Leopard can't run Mac OS Classic.

Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri rules all.

This.

Real life battles were fought in real time... real life strategy needs to be though in real time.
I wouldn't call things that take several days in real life "real time", it's closer to turn based where each day is one turn. So real life battles are real time but real life research, resource gathering, building construction, troop training, troop movements, supply lines and reinforcements are closer to turn based.

Napoleon: Gather wood and food. Build stables and breed horses, we'll need cavalry here. Research a rifle upgrade for the infantry support. Gather more iron to produce artillery.

Wellington: What are they doing... I can't believe it, they are building a bloody village and I was expecting a jolly good battle today.

Also in real life battles everyone on your side has hopefully been briefed on their mission before the battle even begins. It's too late to improvise an organized strategy in the middle of a battle. Rainbow Six comes close to the real life model of time here. Before a battle begins you draw up a plan on a map and choose troops and equipment so the strategy phase is over before the battle begins. Some battles the plan might work as expected so everyone just follows the orders they where given in the briefing. In other battles a supprice may force you to deviate from your mission and improvise but then you must keep it simple, there is no time to draw up something as complicated as the original strategy.

New game coming out in september. Spore. Sounds like it is going to be awesome. You start off as a we germ and you have develop sentience then build cities then colonize planets and then invade other players universes and stuff.
Looks utter, utter pish in my opinion. Will be a mishmash of underdeveloped game elements that the PC gaming world will absolutely fawn over for a few months before realising that it was actually pretty poor, see also Black & White.
I wouldn't call things that take several days in real life "real time", it's closer to turn based where each day is one turn. So real life battles are real time but real life research, resource gathering, building construction, troop training, troop movements, supply lines and reinforcements are closer to turn based.
Hence why proper RTS games are those more like Ground Control (the original, not the very pish second one) where you get a set amount of units and you fight with them against foe x on a designated mission.
Also in real life battles everyone on your side has hopefully been briefed on their mission before the battle even begins. It's too late to improvise an organized strategy in the middle of a battle. Rainbow Six comes close to the real life model of time here. Before a battle begins you draw up a plan on a map and choose troops and equipment so the strategy phase is over before the battle begins. Some battles the plan might work as expected so everyone just follows the orders they where given in the briefing. In other battles a supprice may force you to deviate from your mission and improvise but then you must keep it simple, there is no time to draw up something as complicated as the original strategy.
Up to Lockdown, where they've become increasingly rubbish, much to my chagrin.

Try medieval 2 Total War. Its turnbased for the high level strategy and real time for the battles. A ture jewel.

If it is anyway like Rome TW then you can pause the combat in order to give orders - This way you can dedicate time for each unit that is remotely comparable to actually being the unit commander in person. The units themselves are still relatively brainless if left alone.

However, if it is in anyway like R:TW (or Shogun or Medieval:TWs) then the combat phase gets horrendously repetitive after a short while, maybe after 10-15 battles, and the lack of true multiplayer - strategy & battle phase - eats out the rest of the appeal.

I suggest you try, for example, Close Combat 5 for an experience of - in my opinion - well done purely real time combat. The AI is bit lacking, especially on offense, but that fault can be compensated by playing against a friend.

Eh if we're talking simply battle based stuff, then I can definitely recommend the WinSP- series, especially WinSPMBT. Good times, for free. Bit of a pain in the arse in that you have to download 4 or 5 patches for it (more of a minor inconvenience than anything else, mind), but once that's done, it's Good Times O'Clock.

If you own it, drop me a TG and we can play a few PBEMs whenever (excellently, you can just post the things over MSN).

Eh if we're talking simply battle based stuff..
Well most, real time combat games are mainly battle based stuff. :D

...then I can definitely recommend the WinSP- series, especially WinSPMBT. Good times, for free. Bit of a pain in the arse in that you have to download 4 or 5 patches for it (more of a minor inconvenience than anything else, mind), but once that's done, it's Good Times O'Clock.
Hmm, released by Shrapnel Games - That's a good sign...I suggest you check out their Dominions series, they're pretty damn good games (I've played II & III with a friend who bought 'em) if you can look past the - to put it kindly - archaic graphics.

edit:
In general I'm not into hex warfare though a la Steel Panthers.

Fantasy General is the exception.

Gotta add a vote for Medieval II:Total War.

For sheer variety of options, factions and flexibility, accept no substitute.

Well most, real time combat games are mainly battle based stuff. :D
Aye aye smartarse :p
Hmm, released by Shrapnel Games - That's a good sign...I suggest you check out their Dominions series, they're pretty damn good games (I've played II & III with a friend who bought 'em) if you can look past the - to put it kindly - archaic graphics.
Dominions games are pretty good, although they look like a downgraded version of Shogun : Total War :p
In general I'm not into hex warfare though a la Steel Panthers.

Fantasy General is the exception.
Nor am I, but WinSPWW2 is very good if you're into yer WW2 stuff (personally I'm not such a fan of WinSPWW2, but then that's because I'm a tad impatient), and WinSPMBT is an excellent game.

I wouldn't call things that take several days in real life "real time", it's closer to turn based where each day is one turn. So real life battles are real time but real life research, resource gathering, building construction, troop training, troop movements, supply lines and reinforcements are closer to turn based.

Napoleon: Gather wood and food. Build stables and breed horses, we'll need cavalry here. Research a rifle upgrade for the infantry support. Gather more iron to produce artillery.

Wellington: What are they doing... I can't believe it, they are building a bloody village and I was expecting a jolly good battle today.

Also in real life battles everyone on your side has hopefully been briefed on their mission before the battle even begins. It's too late to improvise an organized strategy in the middle of a battle. Rainbow Six comes close to the real life model of time here. Before a battle begins you draw up a plan on a map and choose troops and equipment so the strategy phase is over before the battle begins. Some battles the plan might work as expected so everyone just follows the orders they where given in the briefing. In other battles a supprice may force you to deviate from your mission and improvise but then you must keep it simple, there is no time to draw up something as complicated as the original strategy.

Have you played Warhammer 40,000 Dawn of War and Medieval II Total War?

It addresses many of the issues you talk about.

If it is anyway like Rome TW then you can pause the combat in order to give orders - This way you can dedicate time for each unit that is remotely comparable to actually being the unit commander in person. The units themselves are still relatively brainless if left alone.

However, if it is in anyway like R:TW (or Shogun or Medieval:TWs) then the combat phase gets horrendously repetitive after a short while, maybe after 10-15 battles, and the lack of true multiplayer - strategy & battle phase - eats out the rest of the appeal.

I suggest you try, for example, Close Combat 5 for an experience of - in my opinion - well done purely real time combat. The AI is bit lacking, especially on offense, but that fault can be compensated by playing against a friend.

The lack of true multi player is a down, but then again playing turn based games in multiplayer can be a real pain. So is the lack of naval battles. If you find the battles too repetitive, maybe you should play it in a higher difficulty mode.

The lack of true multi player is a down, but then again playing turn based games in multiplayer can be a real pain. So is the lack of naval battles. If you find the battles too repetitive, maybe you should play it in a higher difficulty mode.
Eh, the difficulty mode doesn't change that the AI is considerably worse in RTW than it was in MTW. The MTW AI used to kick my arse at the highest setting. Not so in RTW.

- Dominions III (http://www.shrapnelgames.com/Illwinter/Dom3/1.htm) (completely turn based game in vein of the arcade Total Wars series)
I tried three out once, but didn't really get into it (the map artwork just annoyed me, for some reason). Dominions II is still my favorite turn-based strategy games, even if my play record is something like 4 wins against at least 50 crushing defeats.

I tried three out once, but didn't really get into it (the map artwork just annoyed me, for some reason). Dominions II is still my favorite turn-based strategy games, even if my play record is something like 4 wins against at least 50 crushing defeats.
Well, in Dom III you can use your Dom II maps, they're directly compatible...well, except of special tasks etc...

My fav map for either Dom is the large Faerun map.

DLable there: http://www.strife.com/dominions-2/files.htm

And true that, it's very easy to lose...especially when you have nations like (middle age) Ermor or R'lyeh against you :)

I love Super Mario World, you should try it!

Have you played Warhammer 40,000 Dawn of War and Medieval II Total War?

It addresses many of the issues you talk about.
No but Medieval II Total War is on my to do list. I've been hestitant to get it because I think my integrated Intel 3100 graphics card is only slightly better than the minimum requirements.