NationStates Jolt Archive

What's the secret to good satire? What makes it good?

What are good examples of good satires? - name movies, TV shows, books, etc.

Do you have any examples of satirists who try and fail?

Educate me!

A repressive system that ruthlessly fights freedom of expression often breeds good satire.

Educate me!
The most successful satire is a charicature of truth framed by what are essentially really stupid puns. Basically, you blow everything out of proportion, from the quirks in a person's personality and mannerisms to the situations your characters find themselves in. For instance, Dead Ringers:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzlOBn029b8&feature=related

Read Terry Pratchett... any of his books.

Care and attention. Being over the top and crude doesn't work well, it's cleverly mocking your opponents by taking their position just into absurdity.

Observe many of Jhahannam's posts, or the TV show "Yes, Minister".

See Mel Brooks' movies, or the Zucker Brothers' movies.

Nowadays, satirizing the wrong group can get you into trouble.

If you're the Wayans' Brothers or Dave Chappelle, you can get away with satirizing black people, but if you're white, you might as well suck-start a shotgun.

South Park can satirize Muslims, or homosexuals, or just about anything - but they have a faithful following who could give a rat's ass about what people like Barbara Streisand and Tom Cruise thing.

I believe that groups that can't satirize themselves have serious issues.

What's the secret to good satire? What makes it good?

What are good examples of good satires? - name movies, TV shows, books, etc.

Do you have any examples of satirists who try and fail?

Educate me!

Doctor Strangelove *nods*

What are good examples of good satires?

Jonathan Swift.

Jonathan Swift.

Ah, the textbook answer.

Ah, the textbook answer.

A little 4th grade education goes a long way.

Pratchett, Swift, "Yes, Minister"/"Yes, Prime Minister," and Jhahannam are all excellent, if very varied, examples of satire done well. I'd also add many of Tom Lehrer's songs to the list. :)

Jonathan Swift.No! He eats babies! :mad:
I'd also add many of Tom Lehrer's songs to the list. :)No! He poisons pidgeons! :mad:

See Mel Brooks' movies, or the Zucker Brothers' movies.

<snip>
Not all comedy is satire. Mel Brooks and the Zucker Brothers -- all of them geniuses -- don't do satire. They do farce.

Doctor Strangelove *nods*

Jonathan Swift.
^^Two outstanding examples of satire. I also found Robocop to be a brilliant satire of US culture/attitudes in the 1980s.

Satire is generally a form of comedy that makes indirect social commentary by presenting a slightly twisted caricature of reality, often carrying current social trends, policies or conditions to their (absurd) logical conclusions -- such as Swift's "Modest Proposal" to solve the problem of starvation in Ireland by having the Irish eat their own children. Presented as if it was a serious social policy suggestion, it was really satirizing the hypocritical, racist, oppressive attitude of the English government towards its Irish subjects and the English policies that had created the extreme poverty in Ireland in the first place.

Satire generally delivers its jokes with a totally straight face, as if it is serious drama, which makes it a lot harder to do well and to find an audience for.

No! He poisons pidgeons! :mad:

Hey, it's not against any religion to want to dispose of a pigeon. ;)

No! He eats babies! :mad:

You say that like it weren't laudable.

Life of Brian contains a lot of great satire, but also some nice slapstick as well. It's one huge orgasmic mix.

More satirical movies:

Brazil
Wag the Dog
Thank You For Smoking
Network
Bulworth
Team America: World Police*

*Sometimes, satire disguises itself with more obvious jokes about other things, which can mislead the audience as to what the main joke really is. Usually, that means the audience is the joke.

Read Terry Pratchett... any of his books.

Indeed. Or Private Eye.

What's the secret to good satire? What makes it good?

What are good examples of good satires? - name movies, TV shows, books, etc.

Do you have any examples of satirists who try and fail?

Educate me!
Good satire:
Aussies are descended from convicts banished from the British ilse's for cutting purses and throats on the streets of London town. These days most aussies are inbred racist drunks who long ago destroyed most of their continent country by parading invasive species throughout the land. The people of Australia take pride in their cultural diversity and celebrate it every chance they get through such gatherings as the Sydney Race Riots which they reenact every year. In fact, Australia recently changed their national motto to "1, 2, 3, 4, I declare a race war" in honor of this event.

Australian cuisine, consisting entirely of Vegemite, a delicious salty black yeast extract, is stored and served in koala and kangaroo assholes and spread on curly yellow toe nail clippings which also happen to be Australia's main export as a cheap subsitute for Fritos.

Think of Australia as the Brits' deep, deep south.

As a side note, Australia has an almost unique distinction of being one of a very select few nations to have its own mini-clone. Australia Jr. is like its larger counterpart in every way except it's about 1/8 the size and so are all the mens' dicks.

Good satire is mildly offensive while being difficult to misinterpret except by the especially sensative, those who can't take a joke or lack a sense of humor, or those predispoed to stupidity. Implying the subject of the pseudo-hatred likes it rough from men with hairy asses will make the burn doubly funny. Satire can also have a message of some kind but it has to be carefully masked enough so that your audience doesn't think you're being preachy.

Good satire is a healthy mix of truth, fiction, hyperbole, and pizza because those greasy Italians are always fun to mock.

Pratchett, Swift, "Yes, Minister"/"Yes, Prime Minister," and Jhahannam are all excellent, if very varied, examples of satire done well. I'd also add many of Tom Lehrer's songs to the list. :)

I agree with this - except that I don't know the postings of Jhahannam that well. :p

I would also like to mention Dr. Strangelove again, as that's some of the finest satire I've ever seen!

And both the Daily Show and the Colbert Report is worth a mention - especially since I agree with Russell Peterson1 who claims that the hosts of the big American talkshows like Jay Leno, David Letterman and Conan O’Brian only manage to produce pseudosatire and not real satire: They attack the man and not the message.

M*A*S*H could also be worth a mention, as it is a classic - and keep an eye out for the comming movies "Green Zone" and "War, Inc". They seem to have potential.


1: Strange Bedfellows: How Late-Night Comedy Turns Democracy into a Joke

TV show "Yes, Minister".

That was a documentary, Thatcher said so ;)

Jonathan Swift.

A classic.

Swift and Twain.

I've always thought of satire, and humor in general, as being the most objective form of writing/movie/etc. If something is truly worthy of being satirized, the satirist doesn't need to do much more than show it as it really is.

For example, "A Modest Proposal" is great because it presents an opinion that is no less unreasonable than mainstream ideas about Ireland. It's funny because Swift doesn't try to cover up his idea with any euphemisms or excuses, he says in a completely straightforward manner that the Irish are subhuman and we should eat their babies.

What's the secret to good satire? What makes it good?

What are good examples of good satires? - name movies, TV shows, books, etc.

Do you have any examples of satirists who try and fail?

Educate me!

One word for you: Jhahannam!

And both the Daily Show and the Colbert Report is worth a mention - especially since I agree with Russell Peterson1 who claims that the hosts of the big American talkshows like Jay Leno, David Letterman and Conan O’Brian only manage to produce pseudosatire and not real satire: They attack the man and not the message.


I think, moreover, that they play into pre-existing media narratives. I'd give the same critisism to HIGNIFY and nearly every show that features impersonations.