NationStates Jolt Archive

Heres yet another example of heavy handed Police arresting now and asking questions later, instead of the other way around. http://improveverywhere.com/2008/04/15/headphone-dancing-ends-in-arrest-in-dc/

This is proof that iPod turns people into criminals.

What, you thought you had the right to assemble freely, or something? COMMUNIST! :p

COMMUNIST! :p
Or "libruhl", what with interchangeability and all.

Oh, dites-moi, la bannière étoilée flotte-t-elle encore sur la terre de la Liberté et la patrie des braves ?

*snickers*

“If I can’t dance, I don’t want your revolution!”

Really, if you want to listen to music, there are better places to do it than in the Jefferson memorial. I could understand the cops moving the person outside of the monument, but arresting them seems a bit much.

Really, if you want to listen to music, there are better places to do it than in the Jefferson memorial. I could understand the cops moving the person outside of the monument, but arresting them seems a bit much.

They were wearing headphones, what business does the State have in removing people with headphones on?

It was a fascist police action against the law-abiding citizenry.

Less Jefferson statues, moar Lenin ones.

Ah, freedom. :rolleyes:

The usual police apologists aren't here yet, so here's the argument they will probably use as posted by someone who commented on the article.

"Legal View
April 16, 2008 at 4:59 am

Want to know what was illegal about this? Failing to comply with the lawful order of a police officer to leave the premises. If you don’t like the order or feel it’s “illegal,” then what you do is note down his name, file a complaint, or file a lawsuit. If you really feel that’s not enough and you simply must protest through civil disobedience, then bloody well accept the consequences instead of bitching around about it. Yes, you fail to comply with an order you will be arrested. What did you think would happen?"

That's right, if the police violate your civil liberties you have rights. The right to bend over and take it.

Bored rent-a-cops + peaceful crowd of people = trouble.
@Fass, care to do the rest of the anthem? I'm curious if the rest would be prettier than the English version as well. I'd do it myself, but I don't actually speak French yet. I am fortunate enough to have picked up a few words here and there, though.

@Fass, care to do the rest of the anthem? I'm curious if the rest would be prettier than the English version as well.

Just because I'm quite bored and want to procrastinate making breakfast, here's what the first verse would end up like directly translated:

Oh, dites-moi, pouvez-vous voir dans la lueur de l'aube
ce que nous acclamions si fièrement au crépuscule?
Dont nous regardions les larges rayures et les brillantes étoiles,
au dessus de nos remparts, si fièrement flotter?
Et l'éclat rouge des fusées, et les bombes explosant dans les airs,
prouvèrent dans la nuit que notre drapeau y était toujours.
Oh, dites-moi, la bannière étoilée flotte-t-elle encore
sur la terre de la liberté et la patrie des braves?

America: Serious Business.

I have to wonder what the response would have been if they were praying, not dancing.

The mistake was the headphones and (I'm assuming) music.

I find that when I dance in public for no particular reason to the music in my own head, people leave me alone. In fact, many even slowly back away. :D

answer me this all ye who accuse the police of being freedom stealing facists...

why was only ONE person arrested while several people were dancing and arguing about being asked to leave?

In the [first video] you can watch the group as they quietly danced around the memorial (which, to be clear, is open to the public 24 hours a day, according to its web site). A U.S. Park Police officer can then be seen approaching the dancers and telling them to leave.
while they were dancing 'quietly' they were taking alot of room and obstructing other people from the displays. if you watch, you can see several 'quiet dancers' spinning around, taking several steps, and bascially clearing a large area of people who were not dancing but trying to observe the displays. a point the 'valiant dancers' never touched upon, only that they were 'quiet'.

also how loud were their dance steps? if you watch the video the link provides, you can clearly hear the loud steps of the dancers. so what's so quiet about that? I like how you can hear the dancers making a noise at the start of part one, yet when the camera goes up to the kneeling man, the recording volume suddenly gets soft...

The second video, posted below, shows the dancers arguing with Park Police officers about why they’re being asked to leave. They say they were quietly dancing with headphones on to celebrate Jefferson’s birthday, and that they weren’t breaking any laws (which, as far as we can tell, they indeed were not). Toward the end of the video, you can see Oberwetter, 28, being handcuffed and taken into custody.

again, one out of several dancing and arguing. me thinks the answer lies on the editing room floor.

"no, no, we were quiet, we had iPhones" yeah right. I could hear them dancing when the camera was a distance away from them in the first video... that's not quiet.

"Whoa, whoa, don't touch my property..." yet I can do whatever the s*#t I want on government/public property... riiiiight...

"Wow, you're angry..." no sh#*t! he's asking people to leave and they're arguing with him. all your tone shows me is that you were not there to "celebrate Jefferson's birthday" but were there to cause a scene.

"You're saying that the state is going to reject us..." a security guard =|= the state. :rolleyes:

"we are celebrating Jefferson's birthday..." and preventing others from celebrating Jefferson's birthday in their own way... but their right to dance supersedes anyone elses right to have a quiet and solomn area. "there is something wrong with America..." yes, it won't cater to you at other's expense. a harsh lession that alot of people learn.

his tape show they were not 'silent' nor 'quiet'

the security guards are there to keep order. thus even tho they were 'quiet' the dancers were posing a threat to that order and thus asked to leave. perfectly within the rights of the guards and frankly, arguing with those who's job it is to keep that order is really asking for it. right or wrong.

So Redwulf. you are right. you decide to test the limits of what you can or cannot do in places you take the consequences. just like those guards have to take the consequences of their actions. too bad those people can be caught lying by their own tape. and for what purpose? for their 15 minutes of fame.

and notice the cameraman did the one thing they should've done in the first place if they truely wanted to celebrate Jefferson's birthday.

he ASKED "will it be ok to dance down there?" had they asked beforehand, then they would've gotten their answer and NO ONE would've been arrested by this childish display.

if people find this something worth rallying to... then I agree. there is something wrong with America.

-snip-

Exactly right. Once again we see some people trying to bash the police (government?) for infringing on their rights when in reality they broke the law.

"we are celebrating Jefferson's birthday..."

people actually do that?

I propose a hit and run music festival outside the whitehouse in protest!
I also propose that there be lots of food there, and lots of red paint.

Arrested for dancing? how ugly are we talking here? i mean you'd have to be pretty offensive on the eyes to allow that sort of thing. Even then, that's just silly.
I wonder if for one day in a year, all police forces went off duty, then for another day of the same year you have a military curfew for 24 hours (ie no ones allowed outside). Then compare crime rates after each event. hmmm.

I dunno, on the one hand I've had experience of officious officials in America, on asking what the boundaries were when a policeman asked me to move inside the drinking zone, the policeman put his hand to his gun and said - don't make me ask again son.

WTF?

On the other hand, I've heard enough whiny 'Don't tase me bro' idiots who feel their personal right to do what they want trump the rights of everyone who'd rather just drop it.

I guess one has the right to dance in a public place, if no one was really bothered I can't see why there's a problem but I can also see that there's ways to handle a discussion and ways not to.

Sgt. Robert......Lachance notes that federal regulations designate certain areas that are "meant to be tranquil and quiet," including the inner chamber of the Jefferson Memorial. That precludes making too much noise -- signs at the Memorial enjoin quiet -- or any behavior that "has a propensity to draw a crowd of onlookers."

They were there specifically to cause this reaction [EDIT: Except seems they weren't] another example of libertarians who fight for personal right as long as it's their personal right.

Does anyone else think that this is ironic that they did this at the JEFFERSON memorial?

Does anyone else think that this is ironic that they did this at the JEFFERSON memorial?

I'm sure they chose it specifically, they were celebrating his birthday because they were libertarians - I don't think they went with the intention to get arrested but they weren't there by coincidence.

Oh, dites-moi, la bannière étoilée flotte-t-elle encore sur la terre de la Liberté et la patrie des braves ?

*snickers*
You really have to wonder sometimes, don't you.

also how loud were their dance steps? if you watch the video the link provides, you can clearly hear the loud steps of the dancers. so what's so quiet about that? I like how you can hear the dancers making a noise at the start of part one, yet when the camera goes up to the kneeling man, the recording volume suddenly gets soft...



Sorry Junni im not buying it. The decible lvls that came from those people were a tiny fraction of the decible levels on a busy Saturday afternoon of normal every day visitors. Certainly it was many many times quieter then even a single crying baby. Are we going to throw toddlers who want a cookie in jail for disturbing the peace as well? I mean good lord, this is a place where Uncle Ben yells at Aunt Mabel from Kansas from across the room to oh come look over here and bring the camera. Then repeat that about 20,000x a day. The room was soo quiet, that even the slight sound of thier squeaking sneakers were echoing around the room. This may have created an illusion of excessive noise in a tomblike quiet at midnight kinda thing, but in terms of objective decible measurement there was no violation of the law due to excessive sound generation in any way shape or form.

Oh, dites-moi, la bannière étoilée flotte-t-elle encore sur la terre de la Liberté et la patrie des braves ?

*snickers*

LOL, good one Fass...

*sigh*

Petty authority doing what it does best. Acting petty.

Oh, dites-moi, la bannière étoilée flotte-t-elle encore sur la terre de la Liberté et la patrie des braves ?

*snickers*

I figured out what you'd posted, Fass, but I ran it through a translator program just to see what it would generate:

"Oh, say to me, the spangled banner still floats it on the ground of Freedom and the fatherland of the brave men"

Thank you for the accurate sardonic display. Spot on.

It wouldn't have necessarily been such a big deal if they had just done what the police asked them to do and moved their party outside the memorial building.

Seriously you guys it's a fucking memorial. People don't go there for the dance music.

Oh, dites-moi, la bannière étoilée flotte-t-elle encore sur la terre de la Liberté et la patrie des braves ?

*snickers*

Oh, say to me, the spangled banner still float does on the ground of Freedom and the fatherland of the brave men?

ah, so you agree that the decible levels of them at MIDNIGHT were slightly higher than a BUSY SATURDAY AFTERNOON with ALOT MORE PEOPLE.

so they were NOT QUIET!

That's not what he said at all. He didn't say it was "slightly higher", he said it was a "tiny fraction". That's not more, that's less.

“If I can’t dance, I don’t want your revolution!”

Dance Dance Counterevolucion!

"I admire your revolutionary spirit."

*bang*

That's not what he said at all. He didn't say it was "slightly higher", he said it was a "tiny fraction". That's not more, that's less.
Gah! lack of sleep... damn. will correct. :p

It is a well know fact that Jefferson hated dancing and hippies so wouldn't want those hippies dancing near his memorial.

I figured out what you'd posted, Fass, but I ran it through a translator program just to see what it would generate:

"Oh, say to me, the spangled banner still floats it on the ground of Freedom and the fatherland of the brave men"

Thank you for the accurate sardonic display. Spot on.

You had to run that through a translator? Jesus.

Police fell for IRL trolling.

They came in there wanting to start SOMETHING.

Police fell for IRL trolling.

They came in there wanting to start SOMETHING.

You win the thread for using "IRL trolling."

People should try a right-wing protest and see if they can get arrested...

Now the internet has picked up on this don't be surprised a huge Silent Disco will take place within the next week.

Dance Dance Counterevolucion!

"I admire your revolutionary spirit."

*bang*
http://www.snorgtees.com/images/DanceDance_Thumbnail.gif

We can dance if want to
We can leave your friends behind . . .

People should try a right-wing protest and see if they can get arrested...

I can just see them now, marching on Washington, waving placards that read, "Personal Responsibility Rocks Our Socks!" Or perhaps, "Don't spend our money quite so frivolously!"

People should try a right-wing protest and see if they can get arrested...

The problem is that most people that aren't left-wing, also aren't into doing group things like protesting. I'm surprised that the FairTax rallies get the kind of attendance that they do because it isn't really a liberal cause.

Sorry Junni im not buying it. The decible lvls that came from those people were a tiny fraction of the decible levels on a busy Saturday afternoon of normal every day visitors. Certainly it was many many times quieter then even a single crying baby. Are we going to throw toddlers who want a cookie in jail for disturbing the peace as well? I mean good lord, this is a place where Uncle Ben yells at Aunt Mabel from Kansas from across the room to oh come look over here and bring the camera. Then repeat that about 20,000x a day. The room was soo quiet, that even the slight sound of thier squeaking sneakers were echoing around the room. This may have created an illusion of excessive noise in a tomblike quiet at midnight kinda thing, but in terms of objective decible measurement there was no violation of the law due to excessive sound generation in any way shape or form.

ok, much better after my nap. :p

can you show the decible levels during their 'silent dance?'

also, I never said that the arrest was due to the dance. others alluded to it.

I also mentioned other problems outside of 'noise' that would prompt the guards to ask the dancers to leave. I mentioned noise because the person shooting the video only claimed "we were quiet" when they were not.

I can just see them now, marching on Washington, waving placards that read, "Personal Responsibility Rocks Our Socks!" Or perhaps, "Don't spend our money quite so frivolously!"

"More Personal Responsibilty!"

"Individual Accountability NOW!" :p

Sounds more like a classic case of "Don't tase me bro-ism."

Here's some actual info on the incident:
WASHINGTON -- Organizers said it is was just a lark, but their gathering at the Jefferson Memorial Saturday night sparked a YouTube sensation after a woman was arrested.

Organizers invited people online for a 10-minute, midnight dance without music in honor of Jefferson's birthday. Twenty people showed up.

"There's a lot of different ways we could celebrate the idea of Thomas Jefferson. We thought we would dance quietly for 10 minutes," said Jason Talley, who brought on the dance.

Irritated memorial guards -- pointing to signs asking for quiet and respect for other visitors -- told the dancers to leave. They arrested one woman when they said she would not stop dancing and became resistant.

The woman arrested, Mary Oberwetter, was charged with a misdemeanor for disturbing the peace. She told News4 Wednesday she is seeking legal advice and declined comment.

A spokesman for the D.C. attorney general said the city had not yet received legal papers about the case and declined comment.

The Jefferson Memorial, a testament to America's freedoms, was once freely open to visitors, but is now shrouded in part by barriers.

"The Jefferson Memorial can be a really noisy place. With school groups, it gets noisy," Talley said. "I just hope they don't start arresting those kids."
Linky (http://www.nbc4.com/news/15902071/detail.html)
And Some more...
The Park Police, for their part, say the group was violating a federal law that prohibits disturbances in the sanctuaries of hallowed memorials.

"They were dancing and just generally making a distraction, and the chamber is posted that you are to remain quiet so you don't disturb other visitors," said Sgt. Robert Lachance, a Park Police spokesman. "The chamber of the Jefferson Memorial is a restricted area for demonstrations or causing any kind of activity that could distract other visitors . . . [in order] to preserve a spirit of tranquility and reverence."
Linkage (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/04/15/AR2008041503414.html)

people actually do that?

I suppose when they want an excuse to act weird in public....

Just because I'm quite bored and want to procrastinate making breakfast, here's what the first verse would end up like directly translated:

Oh, dites-moi, pouvez-vous voir dans la lueur de l'aube
ce que nous acclamions si fièrement au crépuscule?
Dont nous regardions les larges rayures et les brillantes étoiles,
au dessus de nos remparts, si fièrement flotter?
Et l'éclat rouge des fusées, et les bombes explosant dans les airs,
prouvèrent dans la nuit que notre drapeau y était toujours.
Oh, dites-moi, la bannière étoilée flotte-t-elle encore
sur la terre de la liberté et la patrie des braves?

Much obliged! It is as I suspected: this version's more pleasing to my ears. Doesn't quite fit the tune anymore, though. Oh well.:)

Originally Posted by Fassitude
Just because I'm quite bored and want to procrastinate making breakfast, here's what the first verse would end up like directly translated:

Oh, dites-moi, pouvez-vous voir dans la lueur de l'aube
ce que nous acclamions si fièrement au crépuscule?
Dont nous regardions les larges rayures et les brillantes étoiles,
au dessus de nos remparts, si fièrement flotter?
Et l'éclat rouge des fusées, et les bombes explosant dans les airs,
prouvèrent dans la nuit que notre drapeau y était toujours.
Oh, dites-moi, la bannière étoilée flotte-t-elle encore
sur la terre de la liberté et la patrie des braves?


not quite translated right but awesome none the less