NationStates Jolt Archive

... be a crack dealer or an abortion doctor, and why?

Ooh. tough choice. Abortion doctors are a legal occupation, but crack dealers are less likely to get killed.

Hmm....

abortion doctor. Abortion has a legit purpose. Crack doesn't.

Abortion, obviously. I'd be getting paid good money for providing a valuable service.

Crack dealers aren't very versatile, their choice of occupation is self-limiting and there's little chance for advancement.

Abortion doctors can change to other forms of medicine with ease, unless they're caught too soon.

On the other hand, the religious right tends to be more tolerant of crack dealers than they are of abortion doctors.

Abortion doctor. I'd rather help people than hurt them

Crack dealer. Happier customers. Less mess. No education required.

Crack dealers aren't very versatile, their choice of occupation is self-limiting and there's little chance for advancement.

Some of them can make $12-1400/night, completely tax-free of course, unlike a doctor's salary. I'd say you could do what you wanted after a few years of that - maybe move up to a distributorship or something, or go legit somehow.

Abortion doctors can change to other forms of medicine with ease, unless they're caught too soon.

Changing to other forms of medicine wouldn't make them abortion doctors, though. The question implied that you had to stay with one or the other, I believe. ;)

Is this a serious question?

I'm against abortion, and yet I'd even rather be an abortion doctor than a crack dealer.

Abortion doctor!
cos they can take home the Fetus! free meat!

Oh, and for the record, of the non-silly options (pudding dealer would be awesome,) I would choose crack dealer. I find fewer problems teleologically with crack dealing over aborting, not to mention that it would be hard to get a record deal singing songs about aborting fetuses.

Abortion doctor. Even if money was the same and both were actually legal, in the end aborting babies has no negative effect on your body. Crack does. And please...show me a dealer that doesn't scoop into his own supply. Doesn't happen.

And please...show me a dealer that doesn't scoop into his own supply.

Ah, but they do it because they want it already and can get it at wholesale prices. It works out to be an employee discount, so to speak.

crack dealer. i don't use the stuff, so my aim will be better than that of my customers. plus, better pay. not to mention that the crack addict voluntarily enters into self-destruction. the unborn doesn't get any say in whether it's aborted.

not to mention that the crack addict voluntarily enters into self-destruction. the unborn doesn't get any say in whether it's aborted.

Hence why I agree on a teleological basis.

Abortion doctor, because abortion doctors are heroes who risk their lives to help women in need where as crack dealers ruin lives and hurt others for their own selfish needs.

Abortion doctor, because abortion doctors are heroes who risk their lives to help women in need where as crack dealers ruin lives and hurt others for their own selfish needs.

Eh. I think "heroes" is a massive overstatement. I can't recall an abortion doctor being killed in my lifetime (I'm sure it's happened, but it's rare), while crack dealers get killed every day in routine gang warfare and in prison. Abortion doctors are anonymous unless someone informs on them. Everyone in the neighborhood knows who the crack dealers are, and that they have a lot of money (and crack) on them at any given time - they're the more likely target by a mile.

I'd probably go for crack dealer, since they make more money and its safer. Also, I'm a bit too squeamish to be performing abortions on girls that I would have trouble not calling whores under my breath. Besides, everyone loves crack! Not even mentioning how much easier it is, and the fact that I wouldn't need to take too many classes on how to sell crack. Plus, if I'm good I could make lots of money without having to get into any surgery! ^_^

Of course, I wouldn't do my own drugs, because drug free is the way to be! Only for me! Everyone else can buy as much crack as they want for all that I care!

Though I suppose pudding dealer is almost as good.

Though I suppose pudding dealer is almost as good.

What about selling pudding made out of crack?

Abortion doctor. What better way to get delicious babies to eat?

What about selling pudding made out of crack?

Then you could market it to children as a delicious snack! BRILLIANT!

why crack dealer, of all the other occupations? crack dealer?
It's pretty obvious the pudding dealers make far more money through the large markets of illegal pudding selling than the crack dealers. I mean come on have you never played GTA? the Crack dealers always leave loads of money to pick up, and they always get into gunfights.
So unless you're tackleberry i suggest pudding dealers.

I do not think we can consider any society truly free until someone can do both.

I do not think we can consider any society truly free until someone can do both.

An abortion doctor who deals crack to the pudding merchants?

I do not think we can consider any society truly free until someone can do both.

You are implying being able to do both at the same time, right?

Then you could market it to children as a delicious snack! BRILLIANT!

Maybe we can get Bill Cosby to advertise for us?

teleologically

teleological

You keep using that word. It doesn't mean what you seem to think it means, since its nonsensical within the context.

You keep using that word. It doesn't mean what you seem to think it means, since its nonsensical within the context.

It means dealing with the final end, and I find more problems with abortion relating to the final end (since it prevents life) than crack (since one has to be an adult to consent to using it.)

It means dealing with the final end, and I find more problems with abortion relating to the final end (since it prevents life) than crack (since one has to be an adult to consent to using it.)

No. The word means "exhibiting or relating to design or purpose especially in nature", unsurprisingly as teleology is the philosophical study of design, purpose, directive principle, or finality in nature or human creations, or the use of design or purpose as an explanation of natural phenomena. It does not mean "dealing with the final end", and even if it did, that still makes no sense as a usage.

It means dealing with the final end, and I find more problems with abortion relating to the final end (since it prevents life) than crack (since one has to be an adult to consent to using it.)

As a broad ethical category, that works. Sort of. As a synonym for "consequences," it doesn't.

... be a crack dealer or an abortion doctor, and why?

Unlike abortion crack ruins lives.

As a broad ethical category, that works. As a synonym for "consequences," it doesn't.

Precisely.

a little bit of both

I was going to put some serious thought into the abortion/crack dilemma, but Pudding Dealer is just such a perfect alternative, I had to vote for it (Although I do not think it would actually be that great of a job).

Now I have this thought of wandering around downtown in a butterscotch-smeared trenchcoat, asking folks if they need a custard fix.

Abortion Doctor just like a few people have said its an actually profession and i would rather kill myself than turn to selling drugs. Not that i have anything against dealers or drug takers its just not something i like.

No. The word means "exhibiting or relating to design or purpose especially in nature", unsurprisingly as teleology is the philosophical study of design, purpose, directive principle, or finality in nature or human creations, or the use of design or purpose as an explanation of natural phenomena. It does not mean "dealing with the final end", and even if it did, that still makes no sense as a usage.

Well, dictionary.com's first definition is "the doctrine that final causes exist", and their fourth is "the belief that purpose and design are a part of or are apparent in nature." Seeing as how I find a problem with the situation due to my belief in a final end and that situation's relationship to it, I don't see how I'm misusing the word.

Unlike abortion crack ruins lives.

One chooses to smoke crack, whereas one cannot choose to be aborted.

Well, dictionary.com's first definition is "the doctrine that final causes exist", and their fourth is "the belief that purpose and design are a part of or are apparent in nature." Seeing as how I find a problem with the situation due to my belief in a final end and that situation's relationship to it, I don't see how I'm misusing the word.

The idea takes on different meanings in different contexts. Dictionary.com isn't going to be very helpful, there. The first definition relates to metaphysics, while you were using it in relation to ethics, even if you're equivocating a bit now... :p

No. The word means "exhibiting or relating to design or purpose especially in nature", unsurprisingly as teleology is the philosophical study of design, purpose, directive principle, or finality in nature or human creations, or the use of design or purpose as an explanation of natural phenomena. It does not mean "dealing with the final end", and even if it did, that still makes no sense as a usage.

Really? I thought they were just mispelling theological.

Either way, you're as nitpicky as ever, Fass.

And what makes you think crack dealers can't be abortion doctors? You can have the best of two worlds!

One chooses to smoke crack, whereas one cannot choose to be aborted.

One chooses to "take" abortion, though. And crack doesn't choose tu be smoked (or eaten?). Until the baby is a few weeks old, studies show the baby is pretty much the equivalent of a rock.

... be a crack dealer or an abortion doctor, and why?

Abortion doctor by a long, long way.

Not even a real question. The 'abortion' doctor is occupied with the emancipation of women... the crack dealer peddles self-perpetuating addiction.

pudding dealer. pudding! pudding! $0.99 per cup!

Why not be both? You can pass out the crack and then the crackwhores turn to you for abortions. Corner the market!

One chooses to smoke crack, whereas one cannot choose to be aborted.

I could!? They told me it was too damn late.

No. The word means "exhibiting or relating to design or purpose especially in nature", unsurprisingly as teleology is the philosophical study of design, purpose, directive principle, or finality in nature or human creations, or the use of design or purpose as an explanation of natural phenomena.

Dictionaries don't tell you everything.

Since Venndee is, I believe, some sort of Aristotelian (somewhat weirdly combined with the libertarian discourse ethics of Hans Hermann-Hoppe?) his usage of "teleology" has an ethical sense... and makes sense, more or less, in context.

Abortion doctor by a mile.

Perhaps we should allow people the freedom to pursue self-destruction. But we should not help them along the path.

Crack dealer.

Crack dealer. I can just see myself surrounded by hired goons & crack hos. Ah, the good life. I'm not that keen on gold jewellery & diamonds though. I suppose we have to make compromises in whatever jobs we do.

Pudding Dealer, y´all. I don´t like doctors, so I couldn´t be an Abortion doctor and, crack is whack!, according to Whitney Houston.:D

Pudding Dealer, y´all.
zOMG! I now has competition!

(Psst, do you want to enter into a business partnership?)

Pudding! Pudding! $0.75 per cup! Available in many flavors! Pudding!
I don´t like doctors...
:(

One chooses to smoke crack, whereas one cannot choose to be aborted.

That would be because there isn't one to choose, except for the mother.

zOMG! I now has competition!

(Psst, do you want to enter into a business partnership?)

Pudding! Pudding! $0.75 per cup! Available in many flavors! Pudding!

Lets do it, Brutland. We could also sell pudding on eBay, to the highest bidder (starting at $0.50 per cup and going up in range according to flavor) and become rich.:eek:

abortion doctor. Abortion has a legit purpose. Crack doesn't.

Agreed.

Lets do it, Brutland. We could also sell pudding on eBay, to the highest bidder (starting at $0.50 per cup and going up in range according to flavor) and become rich.:eek:
Sure! We can carve our niche with odd-flavored puddings. We can have balut puddings, and, in view of this thread's topic, crack-flavored fetus pudding. How 'bout you? What can our former colonial master offer for pudding? :D

Sure! We can carve our niche with odd-flavored puddings. We can have balut puddings, and, in view of this thread's topic, crack-flavored fetus pudding. How 'bout you? What can our former colonial master offer for pudding? :D

*rubs hands together*
I like where this is going.
WTF is balut?
Anyway, I was thinking and I just came up with the best pudding recipe ever. Our marketing strategy is as follows:
I want to formally introduce you to our fetus flavor of the week, Mexican crack garbage baby. With artificial flavors and 100% trans-fat free. And for those who are into healthy eating: African fetus flavored scones. We gotta diversify.:D

abortion doctor. Abortion has a legit purpose. Crack doesn't.

Getting high isn't a legit purpose? Damn it, college LIED to me! :P

Oh, and for the record, of the non-silly options (pudding dealer would be awesome,) I would choose crack dealer. I find fewer problems teleologically with crack dealing over aborting, not to mention that it would be hard to get a record deal singing songs about aborting fetuses.

Actually, that's quite the unexplored niche. I mean, there are a billion MCs rapping about drugs. They need a new angle.

*ponders* What rhymes with "curettage"?

I can't recall an abortion doctor being killed in my lifetime (I'm sure it's happened, but it's rare)

Abortion doctors have been killed in my lifetime. A quick check of the internet shows that 5 doctors were killed in 1994-1995, during the height of the anti-choice violence.

Also, I'm a bit too squeamish to be performing abortions on girls that I would have trouble not calling whores under my breath.

I'm really glad the doctor that performed an illegal abortion for my mother and saved her life (and allowed me to be born) didn't have the same attitude. Because more judgement on top of a situation no teenager should have to go through was probably not what she needed, especially from a person who has taken an oath to do all s/he can for his/her patients.

One chooses to smoke crack, whereas one cannot choose to be aborted.

One chooses to have an abortion. One also chooses to smoke crack during pregnancy and give birth to a crack-addicted baby who will spend the rest of its life fighting addiction, stigma, poverty, etc.

*rubs hands together*
I like where this is going.
WTF is balut?
Anyway, I was thinking and I just came up with the best pudding recipe ever. Our marketing strategy is as follows:
I want to formally introduce you to our fetus flavor of the week, Mexican crack garbage baby. With artificial flavors and 100% trans-fat free. And for those who are into healthy eating: African fetus flavored scones. We gotta diversify.:D
This is balut (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balut). Yummy for pudding. (BTW, it's also a fetus. Yum.)

Flavor of the week sounds good. I'm thinking of vegetarian pudding...

Speaking of diversification, how 'bout them European feti (fetuses)? AHA! Why don't we make something like "feti cheese" pudding??

Also, black pudding (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_pudding) made from reject and expired blood from blood banks. So that nothing goes to waste!

Abortion doctors have been killed in my lifetime. A quick check of the internet shows that 5 doctors were killed in 1994-1995, during the height of the anti-choice violence.

Care to guess how many crack dealers bought it during that same period? ;)

Care to guess how many crack dealers bought it during that same period? ;)

4?

Care to guess how many crack dealers bought it during that same period? ;)

2 and a half!

4?

Dunno. However, the crack epidemic was just a couple years past its peak in '94, so I'm guessing a nice chunk of gang killings were of crack dealers.

Oh, oobee doo, I wanna be like you! (http://youtube.com/watch?v=c9cWkUhZ8n4)

now all I need is mans red fire

The idea takes on different meanings in different contexts. Dictionary.com isn't going to be very helpful, there. The first definition relates to metaphysics, while you were using it in relation to ethics, even if you're equivocating a bit now... :p

Well, that's probably the source of the confusion. I haven't really looked into metaphysics, and thus wouldn't have considered it from that standpoint. And, just curious, how am I equivocating?

One chooses to "take" abortion, though. And crack doesn't choose tu be smoked (or eaten?). Until the baby is a few weeks old, studies show the baby is pretty much the equivalent of a rock.

If someone got pregnant and smoked crack while the baby is a 'rock' and it is born, would that be alright?

If someone got pregnant and smoked crack while the baby is a 'rock' and it is born, would that be alright?

It will never be born if it's aborted... What's your point here?

Oh, oobee doo, I wanna be like you! (http://youtube.com/watch?v=c9cWkUhZ8n4)

now all I need is mans red fire

WTF? :confused:

Well, that's probably the source of the confusion. I haven't really looked into metaphysics, and thus wouldn't have considered it from that standpoint. And, just curious, how am I equivocating?

Great topics - very frustrating, but exciting. :p All I meant by equivocation was that you went from one definiton to the other to make your point.

I've always found the occupation of drug dealer intriguing. However, the risks of injury from vigilantes forces me to choose Pudding Dealer.

Care to guess how many crack dealers bought it during that same period? ;)

None. It was like the Salem witch trials. Innocent people got gunned down, while the crack dealers just cast teleport without error and escaped unharmed.

Abortion doctor. What better way to get delicious babies to eat?

FFS, Hillary, give Ifreann her account back. :mad:

One chooses to have an abortion. One also chooses to smoke crack during pregnancy and give birth to a crack-addicted baby who will spend the rest of its life fighting addiction, stigma, poverty, etc.

Incorrect and proven so. Once they get the drug out of their system a crack baby is no different than a normal baby.

Which usually retires wealthy first?

you see, I'd rather be the pudding dealer. However, I'm not sure exactly how much money there is in pudding dealing. Possibly not that much. :(

Seemed to work for Cosby though.

While abortion provider is a good, morally upright job...

Crack dealer. Less likely to get shot, less training required. All the hos I want and a big shinny Caddy. Mind you being eco-minded I'd have to trade the Caddy for some sort of VW diesel Jetta (with 20 inch rims of course...).

Actually, that's quite the unexplored niche. I mean, there are a billion MCs rapping about drugs. They need a new angle.

*ponders* What rhymes with "curettage"?

Ask Carcass.

I think goregrind has a million bands singing about surgery and autopsies. I'm pretty sure medical themed lyrics are old and tired nowadays. :p

None. It was like the Salem witch trials. Innocent people got gunned down, while the crack dealers just cast teleport without error and escaped unharmed.

If I could cast seventh-level spells, you could bet I wouldn't be wasting my life selling crack.

Would you rather...
... be a crack dealer or an abortion doctor, and why?

Abortion doctor.

This is balut (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Balut). Yummy for pudding. (BTW, it's also a fetus. Yum.)

Flavor of the week sounds good. I'm thinking of vegetarian pudding...

Speaking of diversification, how 'bout them European feti (fetuses)? AHA! Why don't we make something like "feti cheese" pudding??

Also, black pudding (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_pudding) made from reject and expired blood from blood banks. So that nothing goes to waste!

Lets do it!! Lets do it!!

You keep using that word. It doesn't mean what you seem to think it means, since its nonsensical within the context.

You should see this guy mangle legal terms and absolutely refuse to recognise that he doesn't get to reinvent the language, or centuries of legal precedent. It's positively blood-curdling.

Dictionaries don't tell you everything.

Since Venndee is, I believe, some sort of Aristotelian (somewhat weirdly combined with the libertarian discourse ethics of Hans Hermann-Hoppe?) his usage of "teleology" has an ethical sense... and makes sense, more or less, in context.
Oddly enough, whenever questioned or challenged on his mangling of terms, this poster runs to dictionary.com for backup. So while you are indeed correct, that dictionaries do not tell you everything, it appears that Vendee didn't get the memo, for that is the mistaken presumption he is working under.

It will never be born if it's aborted... What's your point here?

I didn't say it would be aborted or miscarried, just wondering what your response would be if the mother smoked crack until the fetus gained viability/stopped being a rock/other delineation point and then stopped.

An abortion dr provides something important to a woman in need. Crack can be considered a luxury item, like smokes.

I didn't say it would be aborted or miscarried, just wondering what your response would be if the mother smoked crack until the fetus gained viability/stopped being a rock/other delineation point and then stopped.

I'm not a doctor (and my medical knowledge is not so vast), so I don't know. I still don't understand how it's related to what we were discussing though.

Okay, here we go... what do you think?

I think you pushed it a bit too far...

Okay, here we go... what do you think?

*rolls around the floor, laughing hysterically*

I absolutely love it. It´s hilarious. My fiancé just saw it and can´t stop laughing. Brilliant!!

I think you pushed it a bit too far...
mmmm... okay....

*deletes*

i'll just give you free chocolate pudding. ;)

I'm not a doctor (and my medical knowledge is not so vast), so I don't know. I still don't understand how it's related to what we were discussing though.

Oh, I'm not asking what your medical opinion would be. I'm asking what you would think, morally, of engaging in crack-smoking at a very early age of pregnancy.

mmmm... okay....

*deletes*

i'll just give you free chocolate pudding. ;)

Yo, dude, I didn't like, mean to restrict your freedom or anythin' dude, so just like, whoa, take it easy, man, like, ok? It was still funny.

Oh, I'm not asking what your medical opinion would be. I'm asking what you would think, morally, of engaging in crack-smoking at a very early age of pregnancy.

I think it would be pretty stupid, not knowing what the actual effects on the baby might be. If you want a baby, it's much better not to have a fucked up one.

*rolls around the floor, laughing hysterically*

I absolutely love it. It´s hilarious. My fiancé just saw it and can´t stop laughing. Brilliant!!
Thank you. But it seemed that I acted way too fast in deleting it, but I'll be on the safe side. I have been taking the heat for imagining turning yummy people into yummy foods recently. :(

(Don't worry, I have the CODE! :D)

Our business will still continue! Go for guerrilla advertising!

Thank you. But it seemed that I acted way too fast in deleting it, but I'll be on the safe side. I have been taking the heat for imagining turning yummy people into yummy foods recently. :(

(Don't worry, I have the CODE! :D)

Our business will still continue! Go for guerrilla advertising!

W00T!!

FFS, Hillary, give Ifreann her account back. :mad:

That's a her? But it's even bigger than Bill's!

... be a crack dealer or an abortion doctor, and why?

Abortion doctor. Being a doctor is a legitimite, relatively safe proffession. To me, an abortion doctor is like any other doctor. So, if I had to choose between living a life that could endanger myself and my family and caused people to have deathly addictions or a legitimite proffession that helps women, I'd choose the latter.

Crack Dealer.

Danger's my middle name.

Or at least it would be if it wasn't Michael.

I'm such a badass.

Crack Dealer.

Danger's my middle name.

Or at least it would be if it wasn't Michael.

I'm such a badass.

But then you would need to be X Crack Dealer Danger Y. That is, if you want to be honest with yourself.

mmmm... okay....

*deletes*

i'll just give you free chocolate pudding. ;)

Wants to see the deleted funny thing :(

Crack Dealer.

Danger's my middle name.

Or at least it would be if it wasn't Michael.

I'm such a badass.

Pssst. Forget crack. Crack is whack. Join the Pudding Dealers´ Alliance!!

Pssst. Forget crack. Crack is whack. Join the Pudding Dealers´ Alliance!!

...Your reasoning is sound, but I'm too much of a badass to listen.

'Cuz I don't play by the rules. Not even my own.

Abortion doctors are legal work, and I have no problems with them. So thats an easy one.

...Your reasoning is sound, but I'm too much of a badass to listen.

'Cuz I don't play by the rules. Not even my own.

Suit yourself, but you´re missing on great profit.

...Your reasoning is sound, but I'm too much of a badass to listen.

'Cuz I don't play by the rules. Not even my own.

Lol. "I don't follow the rules, I make them...and then break them."

Lol. "I don't follow the rules, I make them...and then break them."

Sometimes I follow the rules just because they expect me to break them.


You know who you are.

crack dealer, that's easy.

I think it would be pretty stupid, not knowing what the actual effects on the baby might be. If you want a baby, it's much better not to have a fucked up one.

The effects probably would not be good. What about smoking crack past your particular delineation of viability?

Abortion doctor. Abortion saves lives, crack ruins them.

The effects probably would not be good. What about smoking crack past your particular delineation of viability?

As I think I said earlier, if you're planning on having a baby at all, you should try and let it be healthy.

I said nothing about viability. What I meant earlier is, as long as the child has no interests, such as to avoid pain, then you shouldn't consider it as having any. Past that point, say, when he grows a nervous system, you have to take its interests into account.

The baby will most likely be hurt from your addiction to crack, unless it is killed before any bad effects (such as pain) could occur. Whether the baby is viable or not is irrelevant, what matters IMHO is "Will it hurt its interests in any avoidable way?". Smoking crack hurts everyone more than it helps anyone, so its always bad anyways, again IMHO. To stay on topic, taking crack is always bad, whereas aborting is not always bad. Your selling of crack has a much higher chance of having devastating effects than your killing of foetuses.

Can you see where I'm getting at? BTW, I don't really understand why you would ask such questions, apart from curiosity.

Crack, because it doesn't involve someone making a choice for two beings.

Crack, because it doesn't involve someone making a choice for two beings.

But what if you're selling the crack to a pregnant mother? XD

Though I'd still go for Crack, because its a much more romantic career option.