NationStates Jolt Archive

Hearing recent stories about a "Jedi Church", and comparing this harmless pop-culture faith to equally ficticious and silly, but far more harmful belief systems which are recognized by Federal authorities(such as Scientology), I propose the following question: should the Jedi church be recognized as an official religion, with tax-exempt status?

probably not

If they can develop lightsabers that didn't use a power source the size of a large room, I'd be ok with granting them tax exempt status.

I voted, perhaps a little hastily, that no church should be tax-free. On the one hand I don't like the state giving a religion extra privileges, but then is it really fair to tax people for their right to worship as they see fit? I do, however, believe in a level playing field, so if they can meet the official criteria, they should qualify for something even a scan/joke like scientology can get.:rolleyes:

I spent a week with the Raelian religion.

They seem nice enough, the Jedi don't seem any worse.

If they are sincere and really buy it, why not?

I spent a week with the Raelian religion.

They seem nice enough, the Jedi don't seem any worse.

If they are sincere and really buy it, why not?

Uh.. six words: The Dark Side.

Well jedi aren't allowed to get married, so this end the reproduction of star wars nerds once and for all. Also they would walk around blindfolded trying to use the force to guide them. This church is awesome.

Actually now that I think about it the original star wars had a lot of references to transcendental meditation, which is not a religion.

Not necessarily -- after all, the pope is not supposed to have sex, yet no less than six popes already had children before they became priests:

Saint Peter, whose mother-in-law is mentioned in the bible as having been miraculously healed (Mat 8:15). Peter (Cephas) was also shown to be married (leading about a wife) during his apostleship in Paul's first letter to the Corinthians (9:5).
Pope St. Hormisdas (514–523) was married and widowed before ordination. He was the father of Pope Silverius.[1]
Pope Adrian II (867–872) was married, before taking orders, and had a daughter.[citation needed]
Pope John XVII (1003) was married before his election to the papacy and had three sons, who all became priests.[citation needed]
Pope Clement IV (1265–1268) was married, before taking holy orders, and had two daughters.[2]
Pope Honorius IV (1285–1287) was married before he took the Holy Orders and had at least two sons: one of them became podesta of Urbino and died before 1279, and the other one became Roman senator and died in 1306[3]

is it really fair to tax people for their right to worship as they see fit?
Is that what would happen if the tax exemption for the religious organization was lifted? I don't think so.
If any church makes money, it should be taxed, unless it applies for the status of non profit organization and has it granted.
If it has real estate, it should be taxed as anyone elses.
And so on.
I don't see the point of making an exception for the regious organizations.

How come so many voted to abolish tax exemption for churches- any good church that takes in money gives far more away then they keep for the prists- have you seen the pay slip of the average catholic prist, they have to rely on charaty to go on holiday-many find it easyer to take a vow of poverty and give all their money away to charity.

the christian churches are always doing these endless charity collections in church just to help the peolpe who live in 3rd wold countries like any ware in africa,much of asia and the middle east, we even had som nuns come round asking for help to feed the ruissins. u see in countries where the govermant cudnt care less about the peolpe , church funded charities like CAFOD.

its not just christian churches look at the budists, in countries like Burma and china there almost the only system of benifits in the country, they live in bare conditions(llike catholic nuns/monks and slitly less bare for prists) and the donations they get go to helping them arange work with the poor.

now i know they carnt be called a non-profit organisation, beuse religions need to build churches,fair enoghth beuse how can you teach peolpe to give to the poor without som ware to teach. som of the money goes to feeding the prists-but they dont live in lcxury. som of the money to monks/nuns who are the only source of eduncation in poor areas, if u carnt aford to pay for school in afica then u are doomed to unemployment and starvation.

unlike the big organisasions you can tax like mac-donalds , the churches dont seek to get money for the sake of being rich, they dont targe for servaces unless you buy a candel, they ask for donations wich are tax-deductable by UK law.

on the other hand their are churches who only seek to gain money like scientology and other devil worshorpers, but their just cults, the pope may be coverd in gold but thats using a small amount to get peolpes attentions so thay will give far more most of which goes to charity.
in conclusion the church is not makeing large amounts of profit for its self, is a charity,provides free servaces and should not be taxed unless you want to tax all charitys.

Yes. Mostly because there shouldn't be any taxes. But hey, thats just my opinon. Which isn't worth any less than yours. In fact it's worth MORE! BUHAHAHAHAHA! FEAR MY WORTHWHILE OPINON!
*wakes up*
I did it again, didn't I? I need some caffiene.

If they can develop lightsabers that didn't use a power source the size of a large room, I'd be ok with granting them tax exempt status.But how will they find enough money to develop that technology without tax exemption, eh?

Not necessarily -- after all, the pope is not supposed to have sex, yet no less than six popes already had children before they became priests:'Not supposed to have sex', and 'not supposed to have had sex' are two different things. And I think a pope needn't even necessarily be a priest.
If you want to take issue with popes, it makes more sense to look at the debauchery some of them indulged in after becoming pope.

Well jedi aren't allowed to get married, so this end the reproduction of star wars nerds once and for all. Also they would walk around blindfolded trying to use the force to guide them. This church is awesome.

Actually now that I think about it the original star wars had a lot of references to transcendental meditation, which is not a religion.

Thank goodness the true nerds (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B5ecfuj2LFw) worship at the shrine of Roddenberry ;)

If they can develop lightsabers that didn't use a power source the size of a large room, I'd be ok with granting them tax exempt status.

Hell, if they can do this I'd want them to get tax funding. Fuck separation of church and state, I want a lightsaber!

Is that what would happen if the tax exemption for the religious organization was lifted? I don't think so.
If any church makes money, it should be taxed, unless it applies for the status of non profit organization and has it granted.
If it has real estate, it should be taxed as anyone else.
And so on.
I don't see the point of making an exception for the religious organizations.

QFT

'Not supposed to have sex', and 'not supposed to have had sex' are two different things. And I think a pope needn't even necessarily be a priest.
If you want to take issue with popes, it makes more sense to look at the debauchery some of them indulged in after becoming pope.


Also keep in mind that the catholic church has changed its doctrine since then atleast once following the Protestant Reformation. Anyway to the main issue. If Bhuddism is recognized as a religion and not strictly a philosophy, I don't see why Jedi should not. Like most standard religions (Judaism, Islam, Christianity, pantheism, paganism) it has a diety: the Force. sure the force is not worshiped in the same way that Muslims worship Allah or the Christians with the Trinity but more like the Native Americans worshiped the Great Spirit. no set services, no sacrifices, just praying and letting the Great Spirit guide you. Of course, being jedi doesn't just stop you from marrying, a Jedi cannot even love.

Come to think of it, the original Jedi were more Agnostic than anything.

Come to think of it, the original Jedi were more make-believe than anything.

fixed

Hearing recent stories about a "Jedi Church", and comparing this harmless pop-culture faith to equally ficticious and silly, but far more harmful belief systems which are recognized by Federal authorities(such as Scientology), I propose the following question: should the Jedi church be recognized as an official religion, with tax-exempt status?

The world is about to end.:eek: A Jedi Church!? WTF!!! What, recognize this fictitious, George Lucas creation and promote Nerd-dom? Please, doesn't the State has anything better to do? Like, build roads and take care of the tax-payers to even consider things like this? Give me a break.:rolleyes:

The world is about to end.:eek: A Jedi Church!? WTF!!! What, recognize this fictitious, George Lucas creation and promote Nerd-dom? Please, doesn't the State has anything better to do? Like, build roads and take care of the tax-payers to even consider things like this? Give me a break.:rolleyes:

Well, scientology got recognized... :(

Well, scientology got recognized... :(

Be that as it may, Dy, doesn't the State has anything better to do than think about recognizing Jedi? Really...;)

Be that as it may, Dy, doesn't the State has anything better to do than think about recognizing Jedi? Really...;)

Apparently not :p

No, the state shouldn't hand out approval stamps to religions. Letting the state have an opinion on what is or isn't a religion violates the separation of church and state. Giving the state approved churches favorable treatment is discrimination against the other churches, a violation of the freedom of religion.

What a load of sith

Seeing as how the US government only looks at the number of members for determining whether a "church" should be recognized, I would say yes. Seriously, other than the anti-religion militants, who thinks this is a bad idea?

any good church that takes in money gives far more away then they keep for the prists

True, all zero good churches should stay tax-exempt. The others get thew same treatment as Hoinest Al's Used Hubcaps.

'Not supposed to have sex', and 'not supposed to have had sex' are two different things.

The point is that even if a religious position is not supposed to have children, it's entirely possible that they had children before joining that religion, becoming a priest, and/or reaching that position.

Hell, if they can do this I'd want them to get tax funding. Fuck separation of church and state, I want a lightsaber!

Oh hell yeah! Two blood red lightsabers (and a cool sith outfit) and I'd kiss the Church of Satan goodbye in a heartbeat.