NationStates Jolt Archive

Our dear, wearyingly inexhaustible president seems to be attracting a lot of attention... For a variety of reasons.


Sarkozy "get lost" video becomes Internet hit

A video of French President NicolasSarkozy telling a bystander to "get lost" has become a hit onthe Internet.

Sarkozy was filmed by a journalist from the daily LeParisien on a walkabout at the annual farm fair in Paris onSaturday.

Sarkozy offered his hand to a man who said: "Don't touchme, you are soiling me." In reply, Sarkozy said, withoutdropping his smile: "Get lost, dumb ass."

The video was posted on Le Parisien's websitewww.leparisien.fr.on and by midday on Sunday it had been seenby more than 350,000 people, a spokeswoman for the newspapersaid.

"It has created quite a controversy," she said. The videois the first to come up when searching for Sarkozy onDailymotion and YouTube.

Sarkozy's popularity ratings are in freefall and hishands-on style of government is attracting growing criticism.

In November, Sarkozy had a heated exchange with fishermenduring protests against rising fuel costs. The presidentchallenged a fisherman who had insulted him.

"Come down and say that," Sarkozy, elected in May, wasquoted as saying. "Don't think that by insulting me you willsolve fishermen's problems."

After the incident, Sarkozy said he refused to have insultshurled at him and would only accept a dialogue between"civilized people."

Francois Hollande, head of the Socialist party, saidSarkozy was not behaving like a head of state and called on himto improve his behaviour.

"One should not get into a brawl...One does not call down afisherman or a worker to explain what he said, one does not getinto a fight with someone who does not want to shake yourhand," Hollande said on pay-TV channel Canal plus.

Sarkozy's spokesman, David Martinon, declined to comment onthe fair incident.

The number of people satisfied with the president fell 9percentage points in a month to 38 percent, according to anIfop poll in the Sunday paper Le Journal du Dimanche.


(link (http://www.eleconomista.es/telecomunicaciones-tecnologia/noticias/372311/02/08/Sarkozy-get-lost-video-becomes-Internet-hit.html))


Sarkozy outburst at farming fair

French President Nicolas Sarkozy has been caught on camera swearing at a member of the crowd at the annual farming fair in Paris.

The video clip, which has been posted on the internet, shows a man at the Salon International de l'Agriculture refusing to shake the president's hand.

The man draws back and says: "Oh no, don't touch me, you'll dirty me."

Mr Sarkozy snaps: "Get lost then you bloody idiot, just get lost!" to put it in a mild English translation.

The video was taken as Mr Sarkozy greeted visitors to the fair earlier this weekend.

The encounter has now been posted on the website of the French daily newspaper Le Parisien and has already received thousands of hits.

It's rather unfortunate timing for the French leader whose popularity ratings are already at an all time low partly due to the over exposure of his private life which many French people found distasteful.

The opposition Socialist leader, Francois Hollande, claimed this latest episode showed Mr Sarkozy's behaviour was not fitting for a president.


(link (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7261834.stm))


Nicolas Sarkozy loses his cool over French food

The right way to make mayonnaise, cheese soufflé and foie gras will be protected by the UN if President Sarkozy’s latest ploy wins approval (writes Charles Bremner in Paris).

The French leader wants la cuisine française to be listed by Unesco, the UN agency, as part of the world’s cultural heritage.

At the opening of the annual Paris Agriculture Show, Mr Sarkozy said: “We have the best gastronomy in the world — at least from our point of view. We want it to be recognised among world heritage.”

Mr Sarkozy’s gesture in response to a two-year campaign by a group of leading chefs — who fear French cuisine is under threat from modern life and the global food industry — raised eyebrows because it stretches the meaning of a UN project to protect traditions in the developing world.

So far, these have included Indonesian dance and storytellers in Kyrgyzstan. In 2005 the cultural, educational and scientific wing of the UN, based in Paris, rejected a Mexican attempt to register its cuisine.

[...] Mr Sarkozy’s announcement was overshadowed at home yesterday by a video of an incident at the farm show in which he swore at a man in the crowd who refused to shake his hand. By last night a million people had clicked on to the internet clip in which Mr Sarkozy tells the man: “Casse-toi, pauvre con” — which can roughly be translated as “P*** off, stupid sod”, or “Get lost, silly b*****”. The middle-aged man had told Mr Sarkozy that he did not want to dirty his hand.

[...] Mr Sarkozy told the farmers that he would use France’s six-month presidency of the EU, which starts in July, to launch an all-new Common Agriculture Policy that would protect French producers more.

(link (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article3426814.ece))


Sarkozy's communion with God

President's repeated references to faith shock the French who say he should be the guardian of a secular state

More than a century after France officially separated religion and state, President Nicolas Sarkozy is trying to close the gap, talking about faith as the missing compass in private and public life.

By North American standards, or even those of other European countries, Mr. Sarkozy's remarks over the past two months, and the resulting French disapproval, may seem overwrought. He doesn't claim a personal relationship with God and is not a regular churchgoer.

But he has called religious faith a defining element of identity. And even more shocking in anticlerical France, he has invited the Roman Catholic Church and other organized religions to provide moral instruction to "enlighten our choices and build our future."

Mr. Sarkozy's repeated references to God in speeches over the past two months have been denounced as attacks on the citadel of French secularism. Some critics accused him of political pandering, particularly to conservative Catholics dismayed by the attention paid to the twice-divorced President's social life.

Others say he should be the guardian of state neutrality on faith. [...]

"It's an unwritten rule that French presidents don't speak about religion," said Jean-Luc Pouthier, the editor of Bible World magazine. "Since 1905, all our presidents, no matter what their politics, have taken care to never mention it."

[...] Mr. Sarkozy has discomfited many people with recent speeches praising religion as an antidote to "human arrogance and folly."


(link (http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/LAC.20080225.SARKO25/TPStory/TPInternational/Europe/))


Sarkozy plays patriot mind games

Charles de Gaulle, the Resistance, the tricolore, the Marseillaise and even French cuisine are being enlisted in a campaign by President Nicolas Sarkozy to strengthen national sentiment in France.

Sarkozy was elected in May last year on a manifesto that pledged a return to patriotism and traditional values and he has been true to his word.

[...] National symbols are key components of Sarkozy's plans to overhaul primary education, too.

His scheme principally focuses on reinforcing basic skills in literacy and numeracy. But a whole chapter of his proposal is about "strengthening moral and civic education", including respect for the flag, Marianne (the female figure of the French republic) and the national anthem, "for which children should stand when played".

For history, children will also be required to know "the traits that constitute the French nation" - a term that carries many rightwing echoes - and "the rules for acquiring French citizenship".

Sarkozy has also said that as part of their final year in primary school, French children should "adopt" a Jewish child who was killed in the Nazi death camps in order to reinforce the lessons of the Holocaust.


(link (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/2/story.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=10494527))

Lol, that's funny. How come people don't want to shake his hand?
Am I remembering correctly that he's not from a big city and lived a more agrarian life? Is that why?

Lol, that's funny. How come people don't want to shake his hand?
Am I remembering correctly that he's not from a big city and lived a more agrarian life? Is that why?

Sarkozy? Agrarian? Hardly. He was born in Paris, and he loves to hang out with the rich and the famous and the very rich, far from such things as agrarian realities. Chirac was the agrarian one, by background and inclination.

No, Sarkozy is simply becoming very unpopular.

Sarkozy? Agrarian? Hardly. He was born in Paris, and he loves to hang out with the rich and the famous and the very rich, far from such things as agrarian realities. Chirac was the agrarian one, by background and inclination.

No, Sarkozy is simply becoming very unpopular.Ah that's right, it was Chirac I was thinking of.
So is it common for people to not want to shake hands with unpopular politicians? (To the point of insulting them, I mean.)

maybe Sarkozy had a bad cold or was under the impression that nobody saw him playing with his gastronomy's

No, Sarkozy is simply becoming very unpopular.

good to see he is fulfilling his duties accordingly :p

The guy is an embarassment.

So is it common for people to not want to shake hands with unpopular politicians? (To the point of insulting them, I mean.)

Nope.

This is, by the way, at least the fourth time Sarkozy has embarassed himself in a video that's quickly found its way onto the Internet. Here are the four put together:
http://www.lemonde.fr/web/video/0,47-0@2-823448,54-1015659@51-991293,0.html

Lol, that's funny. How come people don't want to shake his hand?

Because they don't like him ? I would never shake his hand. He's the opposite of all the values for which I stand for. He is responsible of criminal policies.

Am I remembering correctly that he's not from a big city and lived a more agrarian life? Is that why?

Hum, no, he's born in Paris and lived most of his life in Neuilly, one of the richest city of suburbs of Paris (you know, one with less than 1% of social housing, while the law says that big cities must at least 20% of them).

Because they don't like him ? I would never shake his hand. He's the opposite of all the values for which I stand for. He is responsible of criminal policies.



Hum, no, he's born in Paris and lived most of his life in Neuilly, one of the richest city of suburbs of Paris (you know, one with less than 1% of social housing, while the law says that big cities must at least 20% of them).

It is quite rude to not shake someone's hand when meeting them. I'd be irked as well if someone refused to shake my hand. Also, how are his policies criminal?

No, Sarkozy is simply becoming very unpopular.Yeah, well, you can't marry a super model and expect other men not to become jealous.

What a surprise.

A man tired out by his marital affairs and the attention they've got him for all of the wrong reasons, as well as the stress of running the country because he thinks that François Fillon is stupid and incapable of running France properly gets kind of irritated by morons that he meets, and people not recognising the acheivements of France around the world.

probably everyone here knows that I think Sarkozy is a turd.
But I cant really criticize him for the 3 first videos because that how I would have reacted (yes I am not a president so maybe he should behave better than me.. but I wont throw the proverbial stone at him)

The fourth video .. well , what can I say? The president of France is an embarrassment to France. Its was the G8 all the world cameras were on him.. check this clip with some Spanish/German TV coverage..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l-5ExlcO7z8

If you drive while drunk you lose your License.. If you are caught doing your Job while drunk, you lose your job.. unless your Job is President.

I think I like the guy....

having no French whatsoever, what exactly did he say?
What's a better translation than the one given?
no "mild English translations" please!

I love Sarko.

The best is when he was a bit drunk after having met with Putin..maybe he drank some vodka with Putin or something....

having no French whatsoever, what exactly did he say?
What's a better translation than the one given?
no "mild English translations" please!
Something like "go fuck yourself".

So Sarkozy's unpopular for being what - too French?

So Sarkozy's unpopular for being what - too French?

I lol'ed. :)

Something like "go fuck yourself".
Hey, I said no mild translations! ;)

In French he answered:

" Alors casse toi, casse toi pauvre con "

French having far more badass words than English, an exact translation is impossible.
But " Get lost, get lost dumbass " would be very close.

Sarkozy is absolutly not " too French ".
He use of his personnal life in the American way, helped by his rich friends who all holds some medias now... but most of the country still has no interest in this.
He could be homosexual, SM, polygam...we would still don't care.

Worst, he doesn't stand alcohool, and that's a fucking shame :D
Chirac, in the time, was not a very good president but he had the decence to beat Helmut Köhl and Gerard Shröder in drinking contests, and never insulted someone in public...

Sarkozy as no dignity at all, he respect only wealth and fame, and this is the true reason why we couldn't see him at all, now, he used his friends to be show on TV every hour, every day, much like Berlusconi in Italy...

About the catastrophic measure of his presidency, we could already say that he govern only for the richest part of the country and absolutly doesn't care about the other, that he wants to tear down the French laïcité of 1905, and that he wants to be Bush lapdog, and that he wants the French to think that economic sucess is everything, that being one of the ten richest country in the world is not enough already.
He also deeply wants to destroy every public service, a very stupid move when you think that we are the country in Europe getting the most international investments BECAUSE we have a fucking good public service. Fucking costly, also, but you have to choose your priorities...

He is something like an US Republican disguised in French, but doesn't even understand that we don't want to be " a country like any other ".

Also, how are his policies criminal?

His hunt for "illegal immigrants" already caused many death (people so scared that they jumped from windows to avoid getting catch by the police, people who committed suicide after their asylum demand was rejected because they knew that in their country they would be tortured and killed, people who were taken back to their country and killed there, ...).

And his economical policies are no better, the constant lowering of the amount of healthcare which is paid by the state is preventing some people from accessing to healthcare - and is forcing other people to wait before seeing a doctor, and you know that for disease like cancers (one of the most frequent cause of death in France) the sooner they are detected, the higher survival rate you have. So he's killing people there too.

So Sarkozy's unpopular for being what - too French?

Well, no, Sarkozy is not "too French" at all. His heart in more in USA than in France.

His hunt for "illegal immigrants" already caused many death (people so scared that they jumped from windows to avoid getting catch by the police, people who committed suicide after their asylum demand was rejected because they knew that in their country they would be tortured and killed, people who were taken back to their country and killed there, ...).

And his economical policies are no better, the constant lowering of the amount of healthcare which is paid by the state is preventing some people from accessing to healthcare - and is forcing other people to wait before seeing a doctor, and you know that for disease like cancers (one of the most frequent cause of death in France) the sooner they are detected, the higher survival rate you have. So he's killing people there too.

Well, someone the plight of illegals doesn't pull my heart. They knew the risk when entering the country illegally, they should face the consequences.

Also, I don't approve of Universal health care, so I don't see Sarkozy is killing people by scaling back services they shouldn't be receiving in the first place. People have no right to health care. If they can pay for it, great, if not, sucks for them.

I can, however, see how some would think that if they were raised in an environment where universal health care was around.

Well, someone the plight of illegals doesn't pull my heart. They knew the risk when entering the country illegally, they should face the consequences.

They were fleeing from death. « There is no such thing as an illegal human being », Rafael Correa, Presidente de la Republica del Ecuador. You may not like them - but sending them back to death is a nothing else than a murder.

But then, you should remember that Sarkozy is not Emperor of France. He's president, within the bounds of the Constitution which says...

« At the dawn of the victory of the free people against the regimes who tried to enslave and degrade human beings, the french people proclaims once again that every human being, without distinction of race, religion or faith, possesses unalienable and sacred rights. [...] In addition, it proclaims the following rights, made especially necessary by our time : [...]

4. Every human being persecuted because of his actions in favor of freedom is entitled to receive asylum on the land of the Republic.

[...]

10. The Nation provides to individuals and families conditions necessary to their development.

11. It guarantees to everyone, and especially to children, mothers and elderly, protection of health[...] »

Also, I don't approve of Universal health care, so I don't see Sarkozy is killing people by scaling back services they shouldn't be receiving in the first place. People have no right to health care. If they can pay for it, great, if not, sucks for them.

You may agree or not with it, it doesn't change the fact that by changing the law, he's killing people. You may argue in favor of killing them, but then at least admit it !

And anyway, what you say contradicts both the Constitution of France, and the Universal Declaration of Human Rights :

«
Article 25.

(1) Everyone has the right to a standard of living adequate for the health and well-being of himself and of his family, including food, clothing, housing and medical care and necessary social services, and the right to security in the event of unemployment, sickness, disability, widowhood, old age or other lack of livelihood in circumstances beyond his control.
»

Something like "go fuck yourself".

In a video making the rounds tout l'Internet, Sarkozy reaches out to shake a man's hand at a farm fair in Paris, when the man replies (in French), "Don't touch me, you are soiling me." To which Sarkozy, ever-feisty, snarls, "Casse-toi, pauvre con," which, depending on how literal you want to be, means, "Piss off, poor idiot."

*nods*

They were fleeing from death. « There is no such thing as an illegal human being », Rafael Correa, Presidente de la Republica del Ecuador. You may not like them - but sending them back to death is a nothing else than a murder.

But then, you should remember that Sarkozy is not Emperor of France. He's president, within the bounds of the Constitution which says...

« At the dawn of the victory of the free people against the regimes who tried to enslave and degrade human beings, the french people proclaims once again that every human being, without distinction of race, religion or faith, possesses unalienable and sacred rights. [...] In addition, it proclaims the following rights, made especially necessary by our time : [...]

4. Every human being persecuted because of his actions in favor of freedom is entitled to receive asylum on the land of the Republic.

[...]

10. The Nation provides to individuals and families conditions necessary to their development.

11. It guarantees to everyone, and especially to children, mothers and elderly, protection of health[...] »



You may agree or not with it, it doesn't change the fact that by changing the law, he's killing people. You may argue in favor of killing them, but then at least admit it !

And anyway, what you say contradicts both the Constitution of France, and the Universal Declaration of Human Rights :

«
Article 25.

(1) Everyone has the right to a standard of living adequate for the health and well-being of himself and of his family, including food, clothing, housing and medical care and necessary social services, and the right to security in the event of unemployment, sickness, disability, widowhood, old age or other lack of livelihood in circumstances beyond his control.
»

Can you give an example of someone deported from France since Sarkozy was elected who was executed in their native country? (more than 1 would be nice).

If universal health care is in the French constitution, then yes, it should be provided, as it is part of the constitution. Sarkozy could try to change that, but I doubt he'd be able to do it.

Also, the declaration of human rights is from the UN, isn't it? If so, its not worth the paper its written on.

Can you give an example of someone deported from France since Sarkozy was elected who was executed in their native country? (more than 1 would be nice).

I don't have them with me right know, but I saw around 10 such cases fully documented a few months ago. They were from before Sarkozy was president, but when he was "Ministre de l'Intérieur", that is head of the police.

Also, the declaration of human rights is from the UN, isn't it? If so, its not worth the paper its written on.

From a political point of view, you may oppose Human Rights, but then say it very clearly, and show your true color.

Then, it may be a UN document, but since it was ratified by France, it has the full weight of any international treaty - that is below Constitution but above any law.

I don't have them with me right know, but I saw around 10 such cases fully documented a few months ago. They were from before Sarkozy was president, but when he was "Ministre de l'Intérieur", that is head of the police.



From a political point of view, you may oppose Human Rights, but then say it very clearly, and show your true color.

Then, it may be a UN document, but since it was ratified by France, it has the full weight of any international treaty - that is below Constitution but above any law.

Oh don't get me wrong, I support human rights- I simply don't think the right to 'free' health care is one of them. Nor do I think too highly of the UN.

Oh don't get me wrong, I support human rights- I simply don't think the right to 'free' health care is one of them.

So you support the human rights you carefully selected ? Well, then you don't supper "human rights". But some of them. Health care is as fundamental as any other one.

It's in the " Déclaration Universelle des Droits de l'Homme et du Citoyen " , writen during the First Republic.
The document who was the main base for the UN declaration of human rights, if I remember correctly.

So it's deeply into our constitution and Nation itself.

I am for universal health care...what is the logic in being an extremely rich country if you can't even assume a good standard of living for everyone, from the richest to the poorest ?
For me it's just as important as giving everyone the same political weight in the elections.

About the illegal immigrants, I'm undecided, one country cannot rescue every people on Earth, and the majority of them are not political refugees.
But there was indeed great mistakes, when you force an Irakian or an Afghan to go back into his country, you're doing wrong.

Thus, it's not the debat here...

The problem with Sarkozy as a man, it's that he's not on the line a French President must take.
He has no self control, no dignity, he doesn't show any interest for culture, he doesn't protect the things a French president swore to defend, like the laïcité, the Constitution, and, worst of all, make a politic who openly create a new aristocracy in the country:

_ suppression of most of the heritage fees is going to accelerate the concentration of wealth and lands in the hands of the richest, just like it occured in America, where you could see now billionaries only because their great-grand-father was a succesfull businessman ( like the Mars family ), and who have done nothing and never worked of their life.
_ the perpetual attempt to be the sole ruler of the country, in appearance at least
_ the law now autorise a citizen to plead guilty and, in this case, the judge could decide of a new sentence. We have seen the whole pernicity of this law two years ago, when a rich journalist, friend of Sarkozy political party, assaulted a steward on a plane of Air France.
According to the law, such offense lead you to prison, for two to five years.
But because he's very rich, he plead guilty and he just had to pay a very huge sum.
The standard citizen could'nt afford this, this is a blatant violation of the principe of an equitable law, the same for all citizens.

So you support the human rights you carefully selected ? Well, then you don't supper "human rights". But some of them. Health care is as fundamental as any other one.

I believe in human rights-I just don't believe that health care is a right. It is not an all or noting deal.

It's in the " Déclaration Universelle des Droits de l'Homme et du Citoyen " , writen during the First Republic.
The document who was the main base for the UN declaration of human rights, if I remember correctly.

It's not exactly that, but quite close. The "Déclaration des Droits de l'Homme et du Citoyen" of 1789 (and there was a second one in 1793) is the main base of the "Déclaration Universelle des Droits de l'Homme" of UN in 1948. The "Déclaration Universelle" from 1948 is more complete than the one of 1789. The one of 1789 is part of our Constitution, within the preamble of 1946 (which I partially quoted above), the one of 1948 is legally binding as a treaty, not as part of the Constitution.

Someone mentioned Berlusconi...I think it's sadly becoming more and more clear that Sarkozy is France's version of the guy.

What is it with this lack of good politicians these days?

Someone mentioned Berlusconi...I think it's sadly becoming more and more clear that Sarkozy is France's version of the guy.

What is it with this lack of good politicians these days?

The problem is not in the lack of good politicians, it is in the more and more complete control of corporations on mass media, and the increasing power of those media on people's opinion. They chose Ségolène Royale as the candidate of the PS, and they chose Nicolas Sarkozy as the candidate of the UMP, and then they chosed to promote Sarkozy over Royale.

Last two presidential elections in France were decided by the media, most of them controlled by big corporations... and here is the result. Freedom of the press is becoming history here, mostly because of corporate control on it.

Can't say better than Kilobugya...it's our Berlusconi, but he's more dangerous, I can say from experience that there is still lot of people counting on France, at the UN, and who are afraid of a French president becoming Bush lapdog like Blair was.

Recently, a Moroccan friend was telling me that the only reason he's not becoming a terrorist is the fact that France was opposed to the Irak War in 2003. It let him keep some hope about the Western Democratic system.

Don't know how much share such ideas, of course.

Just that I can't stop being afraid of our government.

With Sarkozy, it's the return of the ultra-right wing, Catholic and ultra-liberal, who was silenced for decades in France because of their support to Vichy.

With Sarkozy, it's the return of the ultra-right wing, Catholic and ultra-liberal, who was silenced for decades in France because of their support to Vichy.

Well I know right-wing/left-wing and authoritarian/liberal are on different axis, but generally highly Catholic is somewhat counter to ultra-liberal, and I had thought Sarkozy was socially conservative. Do you mean economical liberal (or is the term nowadays neo-liberal)? :confused:

I have to say, despite the problems the previous French governments might have caused, the changes Sarkozy is bringing definitely seems to be the wrong way to sort it out. I am especially disappointed to hear about his dismantling of the health care system, since I had previously read that France has one of the best universal healthcare systems going.

His hunt for "illegal immigrants" already caused many death (people so scared that they jumped from windows to avoid getting catch by the police, people who committed suicide after their asylum demand was rejected because they knew that in their country they would be tortured and killed, people who were taken back to their country and killed there, ...).
Oh give me a break.....not every immigrant in France comes from a country where they would be killed if they return...:rolleyes: Stop blowing it out of proportion....
And his economical policies are no better, the constant lowering of the amount of healthcare which is paid by the state is preventing some people from accessing to healthcare - and is forcing other people to wait before seeing a doctor, and you know that for disease like cancers (one of the most frequent cause of death in France) the sooner they are detected, the higher survival rate you have. So he's killing people there too.
It's not the governments job to be a nanny. The more the government does, the more dependent humanity becomes on it, the more freedom humans lose.

Well I know right-wing/left-wing and authoritarian/liberal are on different axis, but generally highly Catholic is somewhat counter to ultra-liberal, and I had thought Sarkozy was socially conservative. Do you mean economical liberal (or is the term nowadays neo-liberal)?

Yes, "libéral" in french is liberal in the economical sense. Sarkozy is authoritian and economically liberal.

I am especially disappointed to hear about his dismantling of the health care system, since I had previously read that France has one of the best universal healthcare systems going.

It used to be true. It's doing down since the return in power of the right in 1993. They tried a strong attack on the healthcare system in 1995, and were forced to partially back down after one month of strike and 2 millions of protesters. Then the "left" came back from 1997 to 2002 and didn't do much. And since 2002... they are destroying it as fast as they can :( And this time unions are too weak to resist.

Can't say better than Kilobugya...it's our Berlusconi, but he's more dangerous, I can say from experience that there is still lot of people counting on France, at the UN, and who are afraid of a French president becoming Bush lapdog like Blair was.
Except that Bush is almost out of power, where as Sarkozy has JUST assumed power. Just because he's pro-American doesn't mean he's a lapdog for a President on the way out...

Recently, a Moroccan friend was telling me that the only reason he's not becoming a terrorist is the fact that France was opposed to the Irak War in 2003. It let him keep some hope about the Western Democratic system.
So hopefully Sarko's government deports that piece of shit.

Just that I can't stop being afraid of our government.
Blowing things waaaaaaay out of proportion...."afraid"....???:rolleyes:
With Sarkozy, it's the return of the ultra-right wing, Catholic and ultra-liberal, who was silenced for decades in France because of their support to Vichy.
Oh yeah...first of all nice try to connect Sarko to Nazism/Fascism....second of all France hasn't been exactly doing wonders under the years of leftist rule, and that is a major reason why a conservative was elected...because people were ready for someone to get the country to work and fix problems with immigration....not because they decided "hey, let's give the guys who have connections to vichy france a try".:rolleyes:

Oh give me a break.....not every immigrant in France comes from a country where they would be killed if they return...:rolleyes: Stop blowing it out of proportion....

Maybe not every one, but among the 25 000 that Sarkozy wants to kick every year, many are. And even for those who wouldn't be killed, it's still a very catastrophic situation from a human point of view.

It's not the governments job to be a nanny. The more the government does, the more dependent humanity becomes on it, the more freedom humans lose.

Yep, sure, people are more free when they are blind, dying or illiterate. That's obvious.

Blowing things waaaaaaay out of proportion...."afraid"....???:rolleyes:

Since Sarkozy was "Ministre de l'Intérieur" in 2002, the rate of illegal abuse of power from the police was up 20% each year, according to human rights organizations. People get arrested for protesting (like in 2006), the sovereign will of people expressed in a referendum is discarded, more and more censorship in the media are documented, the President dares to challenge the Constitutional Council, ... So yes, we can be quite afraid of his government.

Just last week, the police attacked and sent to hospital an elected representative (member of Communist Party) who dared to interpose himself between strikers and the police, trying to cool down both sides and avoid violence.

Oh yeah...first of all nice try to connect Sarko to Nazism/Fascism....

Well, Sarkozy is doing (or at least trying to do) a lot of things which weren't done in France since Pétain. Like arresting children in schools or at school doors, like wanting to pass retroactive laws, like having a ministry of "national identity", like messing up religion and politics, ...

And he is dismantling what was done by the "National Council of Resistance", from the communists to right-wing (gaulist). So... the accusation of ideological proximity between Sarkozy and Pétain is not far-fetched. They share some common ideology. Sarkozy is not (yet, at least) pushing them as far as Pétain, but the core ideology is close.

second of all France hasn't been exactly doing wonders under the years of leftist rule,

Well, under Jospin (1997-2002), unemployment was lowered, and France was doing better than the eurozone. Since 2002, it's the opposite. Jospin was doing a very centrist policy, not a real leftist one, but it was undeniably much better than now.

and that is a major reason why a conservative was elected...

Definitely not. Chirac's victory in 2002 was due to the raise of Front National, to the focus given by media to the "insecurity" topic, and to the manipulation done a few days before the election (all the media showing a poor old guy assaulted in his house, and pointed the (maghreban) youth of the nearby poor area as the guilty ones... while in reality this old guy was convicted of sex crimes, and assaulted by one of his former victims, who had nothing to do with the poor area nor with maghreban).

Except that Bush is almost out of power, where as Sarkozy has JUST assumed power. Just because he's pro-American doesn't mean he's a lapdog for a President on the way out...

We are speaking of Bush, who is on his way out, but no one think here in France that Mac Cain would be a better US president, about foreign policy.


So hopefully Sarko's government deports that piece of shit.

He never lived in France.

Not even wondering WHY this king of well educated, moraly strong, guy became messed up islamists ?
Or haven't you ever thought one second how a muslim and Arab could feel when he see that the " country of freedom " is going to throw an entire Arab country to stone age just because they need a scape-goat ?
And that the entire world knew that they are doing this for money with false proofs BUT support them anyway ?
This guy is fighting for a democratic Morocco, but what is the use to fight for democracy if it ends up like this ?

I'm not an advocate of this bloody murderer that was S.Hussein, but perhaps you need better undestanding of this part of the world.

Well I know right-wing/left-wing and authoritarian/liberal are on different axis, but generally highly Catholic is somewhat counter to ultra-liberal, and I had thought Sarkozy was socially conservative. Do you mean economical liberal (or is the term nowadays neo-liberal)? :confused:

Sorry, something to clarify, Kilobyuga as done great job for this, I will just make a little explain:
In France, at the beginning of the 20th century, an unusual alliance occured between the most conservative Catholics and the richest "economically ultra-liberals", something like a pact for power, against the anti-clerical Radical party, who was center-left.

Mainly, they lose the fight, this is why they supported so strongly Petain, who pose himself as their champion. ( even if he was absolutly not religious... )

Oh yeah...first of all nice try to connect Sarko to Nazism/Fascism....second of all France hasn't been exactly doing wonders under the years of leftist rule, and that is a major reason why a conservative was elected...because people were ready for someone to get the country to work and fix problems with immigration....not because they decided "hey, let's give the guys who have connections to vichy france a try".:rolleyes:

Get France to work...so you don't know that France's workers have the highest productivity in all Europe, well better than Japan, second only to USA ?
That they have this rate since the 90's ?
That even in England, people works REALLY per week two less hours than in France, despite the 35 hours law ? ( I tend to say: "because" of the 35 hours law... )

Our main economic problem is that 40% of enterprise capitals are in the hand of foreigners ( twice more than in Germany and England) and then, near half of the profits gets out of the country and aren't used for it's benefits.

Kilobyuga already said that during the last leftist government, France economy was in a far better shape and the public debt was resorbing.

When you see that UMP, the party of Sarkozy, is solding public enterprises to their friends, for a symbolic fee, you could really be afraid, yes.

A little exemple: the public company of transport in Mediterranée, " Corsica Ferries " was sold for a price so ridiculous that it didn't even match the cost of ONE ship scrapped.
Prime Minister Dominique de Villepin has sold the French highways to the very enterprise who were payed to built them, and the price they pay is something like a third of what they get for building them...

But I'm certainly a paranoïd, leftist guy who cry for nothing...

Sorry, something to clarify, Kilobyuga as done great job for this, I will just make a little explain:
In France, at the beginning of the 20th century, an unusual alliance occured between the most conservative Catholics and the richest "economically ultra-liberals", something like a pact for power, against the anti-clerical Radical party, who was center-left.

Mainly, they lose the fight, this is why they supported so strongly Petain, who pose himself as their champion. ( even if he was absolutly not religious... )

Thank you for clearing that up (and Kilobyuga). I had figured it was something like that, but I just wanted to make sure, since in english liberal is most often used to refer to social liberals (and is often combined with left wing or centrist economic policies, although technically the two don't necessarily go together), for example the socially liberal, left of centre party in the UK is the Liberal Democrats.

I just don't believe that health care is a right..where are you from Trollgaard?