NationStates Jolt Archive

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2008/02/12/deeson.fl.disabled.man.dumped.wtsp

The long and short of it is a quadriplegic man was arrested for a traffic violation and apparently some one in the jail didn't believe he couldn't walk so dumped him out of his wheelchair. Being arrested for a traffic accident, I can see why they would be skeptical of his condition, but at what point does skepticism allow for "I'm going to be a power abusing jackhole." And what's even better, is the sheriff's office didn't know anything about it until the reporters showed the office their own tape.

Protect and serve? I want to know who is protecting us from the police.

I want to know who is protecting us from the police.
No-one.

There we go.

Yea Police Brutality has been coming up a lot lately. What in the hell is this world coming too?

That's just sick. And sad. It's a sick, sad world.

Isn't their an internal affairs type set up in the US?

(i'm basing this off detective novels I read)

Proof of why police with guns + population without guns = total abuse of power.

Proof of why police with guns + population without guns = total abuse of power.

Yes... this is so blindingly sensible.:rolleyes:

Proof of why police with guns + population without guns = total abuse of power.
I'm British, and we're doing fine, mostly because our police don't carry guns without being part of a firearms team.

Pfft, but when the people are allowed to get guns there is some depressed kid who goes and shoots up a school.

Proof of why police with guns + population without guns = total abuse of power.
You realize we are talking about cops in America right? The place where we have an armed populace? And oh yeah, where even looking like you are going to threaten a cop with an item that looks like a gun is going to get you deader than a chicken in a fox pen.

Unarmed police DO NOT work in America.

I'm British, and we're doing fine, mostly because our police don't carry guns without being part of a firearms team.
And probably because your cops don't have to live in fear of being shot up.

And probably because your cops don't have to live in fear of being shot up.
Exactly. Everyone is much less paranoid about such things - there are odd problems in some of the shittier bits of London, but that's just about it.

I'm British, and we're doing fine, mostly because our police don't carry guns without being part of a firearms team.

I'm British and our police do carry guns

(poor little NI always gets left out :( )

I'm British and our police do carry guns

(poor little NI always gets left out :( )

At least you don't have paratroopers on the streets anymore, or, at least, that's what I've been told.

I'm British and our police do carry guns

(poor little NI always gets left out :( )
OK, in Great Britain, they don't.

At least you don't have paratroopers on the streets anymore, or, at least, that's what I've been told.

Yup

In theory, other cops are protecting us from the cops.

Protect and serve? I want to know who is protecting us from the police.

Here, the Carabinieri protect us from the Police.
In turn, the Police protects us from the Carabinieri.

Here, the Carabinieri protect us from the Police.
In turn, the Police protects us from the Carabinieri.

Sounds balanced XD

The best protection you can get from police brutality is a digital camera. This si why police brutality is coming up so often these days. it's because everyone's got one. Even if it's only on the cell phone.

We watch the watchmen. And upload it to Youtube.

The best protection you can get from police brutality is a digital camera. This si why police brutality is coming up so often these days. it's because everyone's got one. Even if it's only on the cell phone.

We watch the watchmen. And upload it to Youtube.

Their own damn cameras are getting them into more trouble than ours XD.

The best protection you can get from police brutality is a digital camera. This si why police brutality is coming up so often these days. it's because everyone's got one. Even if it's only on the cell phone.

We watch the watchmen. And upload it to Youtube.

Little Brother is watching Big Brother

What the heck was a Quadraplegic doing in traffic in the first place????
If he was driving a car no wonder the cops didn't believe him! (but thats still no excuse for abuse!)

You realize we are talking about cops in America right? The place where we have an armed populace? And oh yeah, where even looking like you are going to threaten a cop with an item that looks like a gun is going to get you deader than a chicken in a fox pen.

It doesn't even have to look like a gun. I remember a case in Denver where an officer entered a residence by climbing through the window. Keep in mind that at this time they KNEW that the person they were looking for was not home. Upon climbing in the bedroom window the officer saw someone laying in bed holding a shiny object so the officer shot and killed him. The man was holding a can of either beer or pop and was IIRC paralyzed (or in some other way bed bound). The officer in question got off without punishment IIRC.

your all so quick to judge...

what if the policeman was some sort of magician and by miracle of the power of faith had made the man walk again?

the story would certainly change then

So your saying if i go throwing quadriplegic men off of their wheel chairs... its ok? As long as it cures them... wow

So your saying if i go throwing quadriplegic men off of their wheel chairs... its ok? As long as it cures them... wow

Erm... Yes?

A moments indignity for the ability to walk again is a pretty simple decision (not that the guy had much choice.)

your all so quick to judge...

what if the policeman was some sort of magician and by miracle of the power of faith had made the man walk again?

the story would certainly change then

While thats all well and good the idea of that ever happening is ridiculous.

So your saying if i go throwing quadriplegic men off of their wheel chairs... its ok? As long as it cures them... wow

of course, how else do you expect to cure them?

At least you don't have paratroopers on the streets anymore, or, at least, that's what I've been told.

The guys who jump out of airplanes? Aren't they a little pointless when they're already at street level?

What the heck was a Quadraplegic doing in traffic in the first place????
If he was driving a car no wonder the cops didn't believe him! (but thats still no excuse for abuse!)
He is able to use his arms fairly well and I think only technically qualifies for quadriplegia.

Yea Police Brutality has been coming up a lot lately. What in the hell is this world coming too?Americans are tired of seeing news on Iraq. Gives the networks incentive to focus on other stories.

The guys who jump out of airplanes? Aren't they a little pointless when they're already at street level?

British paras are pretty tough even when they're not falling out of planes. Horribly arrogant though.

Fuck the police. They never get punished unless they attack some guy in a wheelchair. What happened to the whole checks and balances thing?

Look at this guy. http://www.collegehumor.com/video:1801757 There's no law against saying "dude," no matter how annoying it may be.

Reason number 83978773464 I hate cops.

Unarmed police DO NOT work in America.

Unarmed police rarely works anywhere.

Unarmed police rarely works anywhere.



The crime rates in most western Europian countries beg to differ.

He is able to use his arms fairly well and I think only technically qualifies for quadriplegia.

If you look carefully at the video, you will see that he does not use his left arm at all. Not even to break his 'fall' from the wheelchair. One could conclude from that that he has no use of the arm. It may well be that he only has use of his right arm, and that may also be limited as we have not seen him use it for anything other than large movements.

The crime rates in most western Europian countries beg to differ.How many Western European countries can you name that have unarmed police? I can think of only one...

How many Western European countries can you name that have unarmed police? I can think of only one...



I thought it was most...only been to France and England though, and where I was neither had any po po with guns.

I thought it was most...only been to France and England though, and where I was neither had any po po with guns.France? You're kidding, right? France has armed police.

Who cares if the police are armed? They're jerks in england too. They yell at you from video cameras. Although that did happen to me in America once actually.

France? You're kidding, right? France has armed police.

Not where I was...


Then again there are places in the states where cops arent armed so it might have been regional.

Well here In Pittsfield, Mass they had "To Protect and Serve" removed from all the police cars. That just says it all right there. :headbang:

Not where I was...


Then again there are places in the states where cops arent armed so it might have been regional.Maybe they weren't real cops, but some other uniformed service.

Then again there are places in the states where cops arent armed so it might have been regional.

They might be/have been peace officers, not police

Maybe they weren't real cops, but some other uniformed service.

Thats possible too. Im not familier with any other form of uniformed law keeper, as in the US there really is only...cops.

Proof of why police with guns + population without guns = total abuse of power.

The man was in custody. Are you suggesting that people in custody should be armed? Or that the man should have resisted his arrest for a traffic accident by shooting his way out?




I have seen first hand what police do. I saw a man in a holding cell have his arm broken because he fell asleep. I've seen the loop in the floor with the chains and the football helmet. I've had my own head slammed against the wall. Once in custody checks on power and abuse are far less. I honestly believe that part of our problem with people committing crime after being jailed (I apparently can't even get close to spelling the word for that right) is because that once you are in the system no matter what the reason you are de-humanized and 'othered' to such an extent that you leave not feeling you are truly a member of society. We treat our criminals, no matter how minor the crime, like dogs until they become dogs. It's sickening.

fucking pigs. that is all.

The man was in custody. Are you suggesting that people in custody should be armed? Or that the man should have resisted his arrest for a traffic accident by shooting his way out?




I have seen first hand what police do. I saw a man in a holding cell have his arm broken because he fell asleep. I've seen the loop in the floor with the chains and the football helmet. I've had my own head slammed against the wall. Once in custody checks on power and abuse are far less. I honestly believe that part of our problem with people committing crime after being jailed (I apparently can't even get close to spelling the word for that right) is because that once you are in the system no matter what the reason you are de-humanized and 'othered' to such an extent that you leave not feeling you are truly a member of society. We treat our criminals, no matter how minor the crime, like dogs until they become dogs. It's sickening.That depends on the prison. I knew someone who actually enjoyed being in a minimum security prison and he came out in perfect shape and wanting be be a personal trainer.

fucking pigs. that is all.
*russian accent*
i hate pigs :sniper:

We treat our criminals, no matter how minor the crime, like dogs until they become dogs. It's sickening.

also, intentional

Who protects us from the cops?

The lawyers.

God help us all.

You'd think that dumping someone out of a wheelchair is universally fucked up.

Who protects us from the cops?

The lawyers.

God help us all.
But who defends us from the lawyers? They've forbidden compiteition in their field!
The "unauthorized practice of law" (UPL) is prohibited in every state by statute, regulation, or court rules

I want to know who is protecting us from the police.

The ACLU?

I thought it was most...only been to France and England though, and where I was neither had any po po with guns.

French police do carry guns. Even the English police carried guns. I lived in Leeds for a bit and remember armed police.

The short answer is public opinion and the federal government. Beyond that nothing that's really legal.

I'm British, and we're doing fine, mostly because our police don't carry guns without being part of a firearms team.

Your violent crime has gone way up in recent years IIRC.

I lived in Leeds for a bit and remember armed police.
But they don't carry guns as standard.

There's special Armed Response Units, much the same as an American police SWAT team, and all officers go through extra training before they can carry weapons.

That said, there's obviously other police and security units of the UK that carry weapons, they're just more covert.

In theory, other cops are protecting us from the cops.

In theory I could pass my hand through your head, harming neither of us.

Theories, whether social contract or quantum mechanics, always have their shortcomings.

But they don't carry guns as standard.

There's special Armed Response Units, much the same as an American police SWAT team, and all officers go through extra training before they can carry weapons.

That said, there's obviously other police and security units of the UK that carry weapons, they're just more covert.

Of course the problem that occurs with this discussion is how much you trust the discretion of the officer in the field. If you trust that you have trained your officers to the point where they can make life and death decisions with an acceptable amount of certainty, then arm them. The people who you want the cops to be using the guns against will have weapons which will harm your populace or the police themselves whether you arm your cops or not. If you don't trust your cops enough to arm them than you should be prepared to see some situations where crime is committed that could have been averted had the treat of force by the police been present.

Having the special response teams are great, but they can't be everywhere, and they face some of the same problems that regular cops do about when to use their firearms. The only real advantages that they have is the extra training and the knowledge that the situations that they are going to enter are dangerous to merit their involvement.

It's a judgment call for any nation, and in the end whether or not the cops have firearms, it doesn't really affect their position of authority within a well ordered state, or their ability to abuse the powers which have been granted to them.

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2008/02/12/deeson.fl.disabled.man.dumped.wtsp

The long and short of it is a quadriplegic man was arrested for a traffic violation and apparently some one in the jail didn't believe he couldn't walk so dumped him out of his wheelchair. Being arrested for a traffic accident, I can see why they would be skeptical of his condition, but at what point does skepticism allow for "I'm going to be a power abusing jackhole." And what's even better, is the sheriff's office didn't know anything about it until the reporters showed the office their own tape.

Protect and serve? I want to know who is protecting us from the police.

The people indirectly are, if we voted for the right people they'd actually keep the police and other public services in line and such behavior within said services would be unheard of

The Japanese police carry guns nowadays.

If you look carefully at the video, you will see that he does not use his left arm at all. Not even to break his 'fall' from the wheelchair. One could conclude from that that he has no use of the arm. It may well be that he only has use of his right arm, and that may also be limited as we have not seen him use it for anything other than large movements.

It's probably limited, but he has use of both of his arms. He was on the Today show this morning, and he made at least one huge sweeping motion with both arms.

The guy suffered two broken ribs?

This person should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law, her actions were not justifiable to any reasonable person ever and are at best assault

In fact being someone with authority and who's society trust is place I would support a heavier then normal sentencing

Again, I have to ask this-why is this a gun debate?

The person was in custody, surely we're not arguing that someone in custody should be armed. Or that someone who is being arrest for, what was it again? A traffic violation, or something? That person should have shot their way out of a traffic arrest? And the officer dumped the person out of the chair, no gun involved. I don't know how this makes and argument either way.

When you get old enough you can get a pistol and protect yourself from the cops.

The proper way to test a quadriplegic:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RaEuri_cQ2Y

:D

When you get old enough you can get a pistol and protect yourself from the cops.

True...but I'd like to have something with longer range in addition to the pistol-which is a last ditch weapon, imo.