NationStates Jolt Archive

During my stay at the Phillipines I noticed that most of the time people seemed to be pissed off at me even though I exercised common western etiquette. I heard words like "saba" and "hiya" alot and knew they were directed at me from my own relatives. After doing research I have learned that "saba" is our equivalent of "Damn you to hell for pissing me off" and "hiya" means shame. After researching things such as tradition a pattern emerged. Every time I unwittingly didn't meet their social norms they said this. This of course pissed me off since I was alien and didn't grow up in their backwards nation and even though they were fully aware of this they acted as though I somehow magically learned all their social norms and tradition. I read that failing to meet social norms there meant not only shame to yourself but your family in it's entirety. I'm thinking this shouldn't count because I'm a F%$&%&^ alien, I don't know their social norms, only that of the USA and though I'd be more than glad to learn them they treated me as though I knew them the second I got off the tarmac even though they know better. My failure of completing the impossible task of instantaneously learning all there is to know about a mysterious and alien land bringing shame to my family seems REALLY unreasonable. Seriously, it shouldn't count since I'm foreign and new so why did they make a big deal out of it?

So in summary my failure should not make my relatives look like arses nor should I get anymosity from them. And since Fillipinos(as) are an exorbitantly social people the neighborhood would know so they shouldn't label my relativeness as shameful and should be understanding.

Thoughts?

Your mistake was not doing any prior research to going, and expecting them to be all nice and courteous when you made big cultural mistakes.

We left days after the school year ended, I barely had time with all the packing, and saying goodbye to friends and all.

Your mistake was not doing any prior research to going, and expecting them to be all nice and courteous when you made big cultural mistakes.

It still counts. Foreigners try to respect American customs when they visit, so Americans should do the same in other countries. It's understandable if you find this difficult, but that doesn't mean your actions don't "count."

Why didn't your relatives help you understand? Seems they wouldn't want to be shamed, it would have been to everyone's advantage.

Why didn't your relatives help you understand? Seems they wouldn't want to be shamed, it would have been to everyone's advantage.

Dunno. The only times they tried was after I flopped at something or unwittingly did something unheard of in their culture that is ok in the US.

'backwards nations...'

This will end well.

Let me put it this way. Let's say you had a visit by a cousin from Hypotheticalstan. Upon seeing you, he spits on your carpet. Turns out that the arid conditions of Hypotheticalstan make the giving of water, even spit, being a mark of respect.

You still have a gob of spit on your carpet though. Are you going to be pleased with that?

Hey man, I wouldnt insalt any one with blue glowing eyes who spits on my floor. Those Fremmen guys can take your head clean off ;) gota love Dune.

We left days after the school year ended, I barely had time with all the packing, and saying goodbye to friends and all.

Let me put it this way. Let's say you had a visit by a cousin from Hypotheticalstan. Upon seeing you, he spits on your carpet. Turns out that the arid conditions of Hypotheticalstan make the giving of water, even spit, being a mark of respect.

You still have a gob of spit on your carpet though. Are you going to be pleased with that?

people have different customs everywhere; in Japan, for example, most people have to be addressed by various titles or else you've been 'rude' to them. It's just the nature of the culture.

Still, they're mighty uppity for a country we used to own.

Still, they're mighty uppity for a country we used to own.

And who says the amricans are imperialist?

I could say the same about you :P

And who says the amricans are imperialist?

I could say the same about you :P

Hey, just stating a fact. I think most of us, including your humble narrator, would stay as far away from Eurasia as possible at this point.

I don't think they were in the right, but a bit of research before hand would have been the right thing to do.

Now, I could understand this coming from random people you offend, but your own relatives? Did they tell you what you did?

Now, I could understand this coming from random people you offend, but your own relatives? Did they tell you what you did?

On multiple occasions I improperly performed the Malo tradition and also ate of food at the wrong time, refused to eat certain foods due to health concerns, stepped on gopher-hills (they beleive it's an omen to do so, again found that out too late) refused to let them boil my clothes and leave me in bed naked to remove the usog curse (evil eye) and also ate of food designated for a funeral too early which they beleive is bad luck thought I thought it was like here in the US where if the food is already there all set up it's ok to take. I also protested safety hazards but doing such was a taboo since I had no right according to them to instruct elders no matter how much more educated I was.

YOU heard this from someone? Watch me reel in shock...

Usually I hear that for an actual offense, usually intentional here in the states, it was a shock to me because it was coming from relatives and for reasons I did not at the time understand.

Now if you don't mind my asking, what is your purpose for positing here and how come the MODs haven't dealt with your unremmiting insolence towards NSG posters?

During my stay at the Phillipines I noticed that most of the time people seemed to be pissed off at me even though I exercised common western etiquette. I heard words like "saba" and "hiya" alot and knew they were directed at me from my own relatives. After doing research I have learned that "saba" is our equivalent of "Damn you to hell for pissing me off"

YOU heard this from someone? Watch me reel in shock...

During my stay at the Phillipines I noticed that most of the time people seemed to be pissed off at me even though I exercised common western etiquette. I heard words like "saba" and "hiya" alot and knew they were directed at me from my own relatives. After doing research I have learned that "saba" is our equivalent of "Damn you to hell for pissing me off" and "hiya" means shame. After researching things such as tradition a pattern emerged. Every time I unwittingly didn't meet their social norms they said this. This of course pissed me off since I was alien and didn't grow up in their backwards nation and even though they were fully aware of this they acted as though I somehow magically learned all their social norms and tradition. I read that failing to meet social norms there meant not only shame to yourself but your family in it's entirety. I'm thinking this shouldn't count because I'm a F%$&%&^ alien, I don't know their social norms, only that of the USA and though I'd be more than glad to learn them they treated me as though I knew them the second I got off the tarmac even though they know better. My failure of completing the impossible task of instantaneously learning all there is to know about a mysterious and alien land bringing shame to my family seems REALLY unreasonable. Seriously, it shouldn't count since I'm foreign and new so why did they make a big deal out of it?

So in summary my failure should not make my relatives look like arses nor should I get anymosity from them. And since Fillipinos(as) are an exorbitantly social people the neighborhood would know so they shouldn't label my relativeness as shameful and should be understanding.

Thoughts?

Thoughts... maybe you should actually think about where you are going to go, before you go there. A little research, perhaps. Plan accordingly.

Usually I hear that for an actual offense

On multiple occasions I improperly performed the Malo tradition and also ate of food at the wrong time, refused to eat certain foods due to health concerns, stepped on gopher-hills (they beleive it's an omen to do so, again found that out too late) refused to let them boil my clothes and leave me in bed naked to remove the usog curse (evil eye) and also ate of food designated for a funeral too early which they beleive is bad luck thought I thought it was like here in the US where if the food is already there all set up it's ok to take. I also protested safety hazards but doing such was a taboo since I had no right according to them to instruct elders no matter how much more educated I was.

It seems to me you committed several offenses, by your own admission.


Now if you don't mind my asking

You can ask whatever you want, whether I answer depends on my mood. But let me pose a question to you.

Did you ever think to..you know...ASK if it was alright to begin eatting? Did you ever think to wait until other people did, to gauge whether or not it would be acceptable for you to start? Or did you just start eatting before everyone else around you, without even bothering to find out if it was acceptable.

You were a guest in someone else's home, in someone else's culture, in someone else's country, and from what it seems here you didn't even bother to ask the most simple of questions like "is it ok if I eat now"? and instead did whatever you wanted and expected it to be ok.

Why were you treated badly? My guess is because, by every indication you have given us, you made absolutly no effort to ask even the most basic questions about the culture you were in, and just assumed what you were doing was correct.

On multiple occasions I improperly performed the Malo tradition and also ate of food at the wrong time, refused to eat certain foods due to health concerns, stepped on gopher-hills (they beleive it's an omen to do so, again found that out too late) refused to let them boil my clothes and leave me in bed naked to remove the usog curse (evil eye) and also ate of food designated for a funeral too early which they beleive is bad luck thought I thought it was like here in the US where if the food is already there all set up it's ok to take. I also protested safety hazards but doing such was a taboo since I had no right according to them to instruct elders no matter how much more educated I was.

Maybe you should have asked before you did things, instead of assuming & acting incorrectly. People appreciate it more if you make an effort, even if you still get it wrong sometimes.

It seems to me you committed several offenses, by your own admission. Let me pose a question to you.

Did you ever think to..you know...ASK if it was alright to begin eatting? Did you ever think to wait until other people did, to gauge whether or not it would be acceptable for you to start? Or did you just start eatting before everyone else around you, without even bothering to find out if it was acceptable.

You were a guest in someone else's home, in someone else's culture, in someone else's country, and from what it seems here you didn't even bother to ask the most simple of questions like "is it ok if I eat now"? and instead did whatever you wanted and expected it to be ok.



You can ask whatever you want, whether I answer depends on my mood.

A few people already did start eating, they admitted it was against tradition after my Aunt reprimanded us. How was I to know they were being bad Fillipinos?

On multiple occasions I improperly performed the Malo tradition and also ate of food at the wrong time, refused to eat certain foods due to health concerns, stepped on gopher-hills (they beleive it's an omen to do so, again found that out too late) refused to let them boil my clothes and leave me in bed naked to remove the usog curse (evil eye) and also ate of food designated for a funeral too early which they beleive is bad luck thought I thought it was like here in the US where if the food is already there all set up it's ok to take. I also protested safety hazards but doing such was a taboo since I had no right according to them to instruct elders no matter how much more educated I was.
So let's see here, you insulted their religion/beliefs, disrupted their funeral rites, and came off like a typical American who has descended from on high to bring Truth to the natives...

Nope, can't see at all why they might be pissed off at you for THAT! /sarcasm

There's cutting the new-comer some slack for missing the details and then there is dealing with someone who obviously isn't bothering to try and learn.

On multiple occasions I improperly performed the Malo tradition and also ate of food at the wrong time, refused to eat certain foods due to health concerns, stepped on gopher-hills (they beleive it's an omen to do so, again found that out too late) refused to let them boil my clothes and leave me in bed naked to remove the usog curse (evil eye) and also ate of food designated for a funeral too early which they beleive is bad luck thought I thought it was like here in the US where if the food is already there all set up it's ok to take. I also protested safety hazards but doing such was a taboo since I had no right according to them to instruct elders no matter how much more educated I was.

Typical tourist Yank, with the typical "I'm an American! Worship my superiority! Your customs and traditions are worthless before me! Ahahahahaha!" tourist attitude.

Given that you were with family, you probably assumed your upbringing would have given you a fair bit of instruction on Filippino culture and manners, I can see why you wouldn't think you'd have to go to great lengths to adapt to a culture that was already kinda "yours". In fact, it would have probably felt a little ridiculous for you to study up on how to relate to your own kin and ethnic group. (It's even more ridiculous for these Europeans to lecture you on how you should have done it) But I guess that boatride across the ocean changes people more than they think.

During my stay at the Phillipines I noticed that most of the time people seemed to be pissed off at me even though I exercised common western etiquette. I heard words like "saba" and "hiya" alot and knew they were directed at me from my own relatives. After doing research I have learned that "saba" is our equivalent of "Damn you to hell for pissing me off" and "hiya" means shame. After researching things such as tradition a pattern emerged. Every time I unwittingly didn't meet their social norms they said this. This of course pissed me off since I was alien and didn't grow up in their backwards nation and even though they were fully aware of this they acted as though I somehow magically learned all their social norms and tradition. I read that failing to meet social norms there meant not only shame to yourself but your family in it's entirety. I'm thinking this shouldn't count because I'm a F%$&%&^ alien, I don't know their social norms, only that of the USA and though I'd be more than glad to learn them they treated me as though I knew them the second I got off the tarmac even though they know better. My failure of completing the impossible task of instantaneously learning all there is to know about a mysterious and alien land bringing shame to my family seems REALLY unreasonable. Seriously, it shouldn't count since I'm foreign and new so why did they make a big deal out of it?

So in summary my failure should not make my relatives look like arses nor should I get anymosity from them. And since Fillipinos(as) are an exorbitantly social people the neighborhood would know so they shouldn't label my relativeness as shameful and should be understanding.

Thoughts?

I think that before you visit a country, you should try to learn their customs. Most societies differ from that of the USA, and I think it's a travellers responsibility to at least try to be respectful of tradition.

To be honest, I've come across a few American travellers in Australia, and I haven't been happy with their behaviour. Three very materialistic, loud and obnoxious girls took up 6 seats on a crowded bus, placing their bags beside them. Every single seat was taken, except the spares beside them, and a very old man came on to the bus, and he stood right next to them, trying to sit down, and they refused to move. Instead, they pulled out books and began "reading" and ignored him. I don't know about your "backwards" country, but if you ever visit Australia, I'd reccomend you don't do that.

Wait a tick.

You've made a whole series of cultural fuckups, called their culture 'backwards', seemingly not apologised for a lot of this stuff, and still expect to be respected?

Nice job, squire. Please stay in the US, or at least research the culture of where you're going, before you inflict this on anywhere else in the world.

During my stay at the Phillipines I noticed that most of the time people seemed to be pissed off at me even though I exercised common western etiquette.When going somewhere, you really should get to know the local customs and not assume that standard western etiquette is standard. You'd be surprised how different "Western etiquette" can be on its very own, actually.

On multiple occasions I improperly performed the Malo tradition and also ate of food at the wrong time, refused to eat certain foods due to health concerns, stepped on gopher-hills (they beleive it's an omen to do so, again found that out too late) refused to let them boil my clothes and leave me in bed naked to remove the usog curse (evil eye) and also ate of food designated for a funeral too early which they beleive is bad luck thought I thought it was like here in the US where if the food is already there all set up it's ok to take. I also protested safety hazards but doing such was a taboo since I had no right according to them to instruct elders no matter how much more educated I was.

Remind me never to go to the Phillipines, I have a strong sense of taste and I'm lactose intolerant, so I can't and/or won't eat most foods. I also hate having to abide by superstitions and the rule of people who are wrong, but think that being who they are makes them right.

On multiple occasions I improperly performed the Malo tradition and also ate of food at the wrong time, refused to eat certain foods due to health concerns, stepped on gopher-hills (they beleive it's an omen to do so, again found that out too late) refused to let them boil my clothes and leave me in bed naked to remove the usog curse (evil eye) and also ate of food designated for a funeral too early which they beleive is bad luck thought I thought it was like here in the US where if the food is already there all set up it's ok to take. I also protested safety hazards but doing such was a taboo since I had no right according to them to instruct elders no matter how much more educated I was.

They're your relatives. And who cares? If eating something makes you sick. don't eat it. If you are uncomfortable having your clothes boiled (which would ruin half of my stuff), don't do it. I do concede that you should have asked about the food at the funerak and what the proper way to do the Malo ritual, but it seems the rest of the forum is bagging on you for being an American that hasn't memorized every culture in the world's customs and declared them to be the same as their own.

but it seems the rest of the forum is bagging on you for being an American that hasn't memorized every culture in the world's customs and declared them to be the same as their own.

Hope you like spit on your carpet when your cousin from Hypotheticalstan visits.

IF SL had written about heading down to stay with relatives in Kansas - and I apologise to any sane people in Kansas for the reputation your state has but there you go - where his ultra-religious and deeply traditional family called him an immoral atheist for his refusal to say grace, his unwillingness to go to church on Sundays and more...

Well most people would be saying very different things.

If we won't accept backward traditions and superstitions in our own countries, why would another country suddenly deserve 'respect' for 'cultural traditions'.

I can understand if they're complete strangers and he's a guest - and even then, they're showing a bigotry that's not particular acceptable - but this is his family, he has a right to be pissed at the comments made at him.

There's complete double-standards with the majority of 'compassionate pseudo-intellectuals' who deride religion in their home country yet hold 'traditional culture' in such mysterious respect and regard.

IF SL had written about heading down to stay with relatives in Kansas - and I apologise to any sane people in Kansas for the reputation your state has but there you go - where his ultra-religious and deeply traditional family called him an immoral atheist for his refusal to say grace, his unwillingness to go to church on Sundays and more...

Well most people would be saying very different things.


Let's reverse things. What if some fundamentalist came from Kansas to say, California and went around calling their guests atheists and are doomed to go to hell, etc, etc?

The basic idea is to learn at least what constitutes courtesy at a place before you go there. If you don't particularly like it, avoid it. SL has clearly stepped a few lines too far here. And his attitude, if anything, is simply arrogant.

I can only imagine what would happen if he were to visit Dubai (I believe it is Dubai with this custom) where sheep's eyes are considered a delicacy and are used as welcoming gifts.

Hope you like spit on your carpet when your cousin from Hypotheticalstan visits.

I wouldn't like it, but I wouldn't get angry at him if I knew it was a custom back there. I'd just, y'know, tell him that it's not really a popular practice out here as I cleaned it up.

Anyway, there's one thing that concerned me as I read this thread. Non Aligned States...oh, I guess I'm still addressing the same person here. Didn't see that one coming.

Er...anyway. Earlier you bolded parts of the statement that displayed typical Yankee behavior (I dislike the notion that this is 'typical', mind you. Nobody I know acts like that). Most of these I agree with, but 'refused to eat certain foods due to health concerns'. Now, I don't know the specifics but if you're concerned about your health, shouldn't that take precedence over the culture you're visiting?

Let's reverse things. What if some fundamentalist came from Kansas to say, California and went around calling their guests atheists and are doomed to go to hell, etc, etc?

The basic idea is to learn at least what constitutes courtesy at a place before you go there. If you don't particularly like it, avoid it. SL has clearly stepped a few lines too far here. And his attitude, if anything, is simply arrogant.

There's a fine line between respecting a host's customs and doing things that are plain stupid - perhaps SL is indulging in a little truthiness but if they're looking to boil my clothes and have me lie on a bed to dispel some curse, I'll tell them I'm not doing it.

I can only imagine what would happen if he were to visit Dubai (I believe it is Dubai with this custom) where sheep's eyes are considered a delicacy and are used as welcoming gifts.

I would politely decline.

I wouldn't like it, but I wouldn't get angry at him if I knew it was a custom back there. I'd just, y'know, tell him that it's not really a popular practice out here as I cleaned it up.

The thing is, you wouldn't know it is a custom back there, and you'd certainly have no reason to expect that sort of behavior.


Er...anyway. Earlier you bolded parts of the statement that displayed typical Yankee behavior (I dislike the notion that this is 'typical', mind you. Nobody I know acts like that).


I've run into a more than a few tourists before. And while there are a fair distribution of "holier than thou" tourists from most places, it seems America generates a greater amount of that.

But keeping that in mind, perhaps you will be better satisfied with a label of "typical arrogant tourist" behavior?


Most of these I agree with, but 'refused to eat certain foods due to health concerns'. Now, I don't know the specifics but if you're concerned about your health, shouldn't that take precedence over the culture you're visiting?

Did he tell them why? Or did he refuse outright? Was his refusal "it looks yucky" or was it "I'm allergic"? A lot of unknowns, I'll give that much, but his attitude does make it a bit suspect.


There's a fine line between respecting a host's customs and doing things that are plain stupid - perhaps SL is indulging in a little truthiness but if they're looking to boil my clothes and have me lie on a bed to dispel some curse, I'll tell them I'm not doing it.

I have to wonder though, how SL gave them an indication that he has a curse on him. If it is a culmination based on his prior actions, I can only speculate at how bad they were.


I would politely decline.

Perhaps. But your attitude strikes me at least as more agreeable than SL's when confronted with foreign customs.

I can understand if they're complete strangers and he's a guest - and even then, they're showing a bigotry that's not particular acceptable - but this is his family, he has a right to be pissed at the comments made at him.

There's complete double-standards with the majority of 'compassionate pseudo-intellectuals' who deride religion in their home country yet hold 'traditional culture' in such mysterious respect and regard.

Very true. Many of the Europeans here are pretty eager to assign a malevolent attribution to social faux pas when Americans are involved, which under different circumstances could be explained away as part of a typical learning curve. There's all sorts of stereotypes in play, but it's fun anyway.

I think I was lucky enough to have survived spending a summer in the Philippines without bringing down too many curses (though there were a couple). Family is extremely important there, and I learned quickly never to speak unless spoken to (which is my usual manner anyway). All things being equal, I found Filipinos to be far more accomodating and friendly than Europeans, for example, and without standing three inches from your face when speaking, like some of the Euros do (French, Italians, etc.).

They're your relatives. And who cares? If eating something makes you sick. don't eat it. If you are uncomfortable having your clothes boiled (which would ruin half of my stuff), don't do it. I do concede that you should have asked about the food at the funerak and what the proper way to do the Malo ritual, but it seems the rest of the forum is bagging on you for being an American that hasn't memorized every culture in the world's customs and declared them to be the same as their own.

Seconded. I won't give my clothes to anyone. I refuse to eat food that I know will make me sick (I'd try a little bit). I try to be as polite as possible but if the request is ridiculous (like boiling your clothes) I won't do it.

Very true. Many of the Europeans here are pretty eager to assign a malevolent attribution to social faux pas when Americans are involved, which under different circumstances could be explained away as part of a typical learning curve. There's all sorts of stereotypes in play, but it's fun anyway.

I think I was lucky enough to have survived spending a summer in the Philippines without bringing down too many curses (though there were a couple). Family is extremely important there, and I learned quickly never to speak unless spoken to (which is my usual manner anyway). All things being equal, I found Filipinos to be far more accomodating and friendly than Europeans, for example, and without standing three inches from your face when speaking, like some of the Euros do (French, Italians, etc.).

I was meant to fly to the Philippines last night but a project has held me back from my due holiday - this is totally irrelevant, I'm just whining.

I've never had any problem in the Philippines - it doesn't seem to have too many of the sort of traditions that cause offense if broken. For the point of comparison, I've been shouted at in Thailand for facing the soles of my feet at people, most often when stepping over them on a busy street - I try not to do it but certainly shrug it off when I do, especially if it's inadvertent.

For me, it's a two-way street, hosts should be as understanding as guests and, where it goes too far, overt disrespect should not be tolerated either way.

but it seems the rest of the forum is bagging on you for being an American that hasn't memorized every culture in the world's customs and declared them to be the same as their own.
No, I'm speaking as an American who does live abroad and has committed a number of social blunders over the years of my stay here in Japan. The difference is that I know enough that when I'm involved in a social situation to ASK what the expected behavior is and not just assume, as SL did, that my American behavior is good enough.

I personally think that the Japanese custom of changing slippers from one room to the next is very stupid and makes no sense, I also knew enough to ask my wife about that BEFORE I visited my in-laws for the first time and didn't just assume that walking in would be ok.

Like I said, there's a world of difference between simple ignorance of culture and a willingness to learn, and arrogance of culture and assuming that your way is the best or good enough.

For me, it's a two-way street, hosts should be as understanding as guests and, where it goes too far, overt disrespect should not be tolerated either way.

That's a good rule of thumb. It's good to do the research before travelling, and it's good to do the research before receiving guests. In a country like the Philippines, where they absorb every scrap of pop culture that comes out of the U.S., it's a bit surprising that one would have so many problems, but it still pays to do the homework. For practical purposes, if a Filipino is under 40 years old, they're probably just being jerks if they pretend not to know how most of us interact here, but there's no accounting for local variations, especially with the older crowd.

I bet in hindsight the guitar was a bad idea SL :p (http://youtube.com/watch?v=Vb3IMTJjzfo)

also I'd say its karma for all the tourists the world has to deal with

IF SL had written about heading down to stay with relatives in Kansas - and I apologise to any sane people in Kansas for the reputation your state has but there you go - where his ultra-religious and deeply traditional family called him an immoral atheist for his refusal to say grace, his unwillingness to go to church on Sundays and more...

in case I haven't noticed Kansas is in the US no?

There's a fine line between respecting a host's customs and doing things that are plain stupid - perhaps SL is indulging in a little truthiness but if they're looking to boil my clothes and have me lie on a bed to dispel some curse, I'll tell them I'm not doing it.

well he could of stayed in a hotel if he didn't want to play

I would politely decline.

I bet the sheep won't see it that way :D

in case I haven't noticed Kansas is in the US no?



Some parts of the country can be very strange to outsiders, even if you're only from a couple hundred miles away. It's hard to explain, but there's some crazies out there (from my perspective, of course).

Well he could of stayed in a hotel if he didn't want to play

How old is SL? At the risk of being patronising, he comes across as a hyped up 14 year old, unable to tootle over to check himself in at the local resort.

I bet the sheep won't see it that way :D

A case of the eyes being too big for the stomach methinks :)

They're your relatives. And who cares? If eating something makes you sick. don't eat it. If you are uncomfortable having your clothes boiled (which would ruin half of my stuff), don't do it. I do concede that you should have asked about the food at the funerak and what the proper way to do the Malo ritual, but it seems the rest of the forum is bagging on you for being an American that hasn't memorized every culture in the world's customs and declared them to be the same as their own.What an inane take on the issue at hand.

Some parts of the country can be very strange to outsiders, even if you're only from a couple hundred miles away. It's hard to explain, but there's some crazies out there (from my perspective, of course).

I'd like to point out I'm from the UK, even a trip to the shops is strange and freighting for me;)

but the fact is Kansas is in the United States and as such you are less of a guest and allowed to go poking about with the states customs unlike if say I went to Kansas and did the rest of the world traditional custom of burning the American flag only to be stopped before I could trample on it :)

During my stay at the Phillipines I noticed that most of the time people seemed to be pissed off at me even though I exercised common western etiquette. I heard words like "saba" and "hiya" alot and knew they were directed at me from my own relatives. After doing research I have learned that "saba" is our equivalent of "Damn you to hell for pissing me off" and "hiya" means shame. After researching things such as tradition a pattern emerged. Every time I unwittingly didn't meet their social norms they said this. This of course pissed me off since I was alien and didn't grow up in their backwards nation and even though they were fully aware of this they acted as though I somehow magically learned all their social norms and tradition. I read that failing to meet social norms there meant not only shame to yourself but your family in it's entirety. I'm thinking this shouldn't count because I'm a F%$&%&^ alien, I don't know their social norms, only that of the USA and though I'd be more than glad to learn them they treated me as though I knew them the second I got off the tarmac even though they know better. My failure of completing the impossible task of instantaneously learning all there is to know about a mysterious and alien land bringing shame to my family seems REALLY unreasonable. Seriously, it shouldn't count since I'm foreign and new so why did they make a big deal out of it?

So in summary my failure should not make my relatives look like arses nor should I get anymosity from them. And since Fillipinos(as) are an exorbitantly social people the neighborhood would know so they shouldn't label my relativeness as shameful and should be understanding.

Thoughts?

On multiple occasions I improperly performed the Malo tradition and also ate of food at the wrong time, refused to eat certain foods due to health concerns, stepped on gopher-hills (they beleive it's an omen to do so, again found that out too late) refused to let them boil my clothes and leave me in bed naked to remove the usog curse (evil eye) and also ate of food designated for a funeral too early which they beleive is bad luck thought I thought it was like here in the US where if the food is already there all set up it's ok to take. I also protested safety hazards but doing such was a taboo since I had no right according to them to instruct elders no matter how much more educated I was.

Not really enough details there. What sort of health and safety concerns did you "protest" and how, for example, are important in determining what went on.

However, given your record here, your age (IIRC 14?) and apparent maturity, level, and the attitude expressed in both posts, it sounds like you came off like a smug superior little kid. Listen to the things you seem to have said as I suspect they hear them.

"You are backwards."
"Your food is dirty and unsafe."
"I know more than you do because I'm from a better country."
"I think I'm smarter than a bunch of older people, so I don't have to respect them."

Wouldn't you be embarassed if little kid from the Phillipines came to visit you, told your mother her cooking was nasty, and mouthed off to your father about being smarter than him?

I'd say apologise and work at keep your comments to yourself.

How old is SL? At the risk of being patronising, he comes across as a hyped up 14 year old, unable to tootle over to check himself in at the local resort.

if he is 14 he is under his parents care (and roof no less)

in which case he can get a job and move out whilst he still knows everything (I can't find the poster dammit)

A case of the eyes being too big for the stomach methinks :)

you shouldn't feel sheepish when you are someone's guest :p

*snip*

A case of the eyes being too big for the stomach methinks :)

Ooh, a pune (http://everything2.com/index.pl?node=Pune), or play on words. :D

...also ate of food designated for a funeral too early which they beleive is bad luck thought I thought it was like here in the US where if the food is already there all set up it's ok to take...

I have never noticed this tradition in the US. Maybe if you are in a buffet-style-restaurant or something....

Ooh, a pune, or play on words. :D

I can't resist puns :)

Originally posted by Daistallia 2104
Not really enough details there.

This is very true.

However, given your record here, your age (IIRC 14?) and apparent maturity, level, and the attitude expressed in both posts, it sounds like you came off like a smug superior little kid.

Wouldn't you be embarrassed if little kid from the Philippines came to visit you, told your mother her cooking was nasty, and mouthed off to your father about being smarter than him?

I'd say apologise and work at keep your comments to yourself.

There is grounds for an interesting discussion on how much we should accept other customs when either visiting, living in or working in, other countries.

In Asia - I've a vague memory you're in Japan? - there's the whole issue of 'face', one for which the accepted opinion is that one should tread carefully. At some point, I have to ask for respect in return though, that 'face' should not be a cover for incompetence, which it sometimes is. I've been here long enough to know when I can dismiss the 'face' issue.

There's a certain subtlety to cultural differences and it sometimes takes time to work them out. I have sympathy for someone sent to an alien environment who's expected to 'know' all these subtleties and then derided by relatives for missing the mark - we can pick on SL or we can discuss these boundaries.

I fixed your spelling of the Philippines as well - I found it disrespectful :)

Well i suppose you won't be going there again eh?
You could have bribed them with Whisky, then kicked them in the groin and ran away. That's what i would do,:D.

Or you could have made a tearfull account of your visit then say you were kidnapped, (thus provoking the mighty Bush to smite your enemies by killing the "raegheads") then you run across the border to mexico, no wait, run across the border to Australia