NationStates Jolt Archive

I think the Smunkling was in the right here.

In my mind, respect for one's elders is a general thing (and not much different from the respect you should give people in general). And, much like with anyone else, you lose respect for your elders when their actions warrant it.

Jeez, Smunkee, you need to move out of where you live! From what I've read of your posts, it sounds like Hell.

You live in Oklahoma, right? Go one state up, your neighbor of the north: Kansas.

Except for our drivers, everyone here is swell!

I was raised to do it, but mostly lately I think it might be a bunch of crap.

today while at the gas station this old ugly fat hag pushed my kid out of the way so she could get a soda, and my kid told her "you could have said excuse me" and the bitch ranted at me for like 5 minutes about how I "need to teach my kids respect"

I explained to her as politely as possible that it's rather rude to push someone and she's lucky I don't call the police since she assaulted my child, and that she needs to learn some manners.

I think if people are rude they don't deserve respect. My kid would have moved if the lady would have said something, but to just push her? how rude is that?!

so, do you think my kid was being rude? should she just have gotten up off the floor and apologized for being in the lady's way?

do you respect your elders just because they are older? do you think that's a good idea?

Respect is earned on a person to person basis, not given because of some arbitrary standard like being old or having been a soldier. This hag was completely out of line and deserves nothing of the sort.

*Yikes! Triple-thread yoink!

I was raised to do it, but mostly lately I think it might be a bunch of crap.

today while at the gas station this old ugly fat hag pushed my kid out of the way so she could get a soda, and my kid told her "you could have said excuse me" and the bitch ranted at me for like 5 minutes about how I "need to teach my kids respect"

I explained to her as politely as possible that it's rather rude to push someone and she's lucky I don't call the police since she assaulted my child, and that she needs to learn some manners.

I think if people are rude they don't deserve respect. My kid would have moved if the lady would have said something, but to just push her? how rude is that?!

so, do you think my kid was being rude? should she just have gotten up off the floor and apologized for being in the lady's way?

do you respect your elders just because they are older? do you think that's a good idea?

I was raised to do it, but mostly lately I think it might be a bunch of crap.

today while at the gas station this old ugly fat hag pushed my kid out of the way so she could get a soda, and my kid told her "you could have said excuse me" and the bitch ranted at me for like 5 minutes about how I "need to teach my kids respect"

I explained to her as politely as possible that it's rather rude to push someone and she's lucky I don't call the police since she assaulted my child, and that she needs to learn some manners.

I think if people are rude they don't deserve respect. My kid would have moved if the lady would have said something, but to just push her? how rude is that?!

so, do you think my kid was being rude? should she just have gotten up off the floor and apologized for being in the lady's way?

do you respect your elders just because they are older? do you think that's a good idea?

No, Your child was not rude, the lady was/is.

I've seeing that alot. Older people being rude and expecting to get away with it just because they are older. it's a shame really. some of these people act as if the world owes them just because they are old.

I only hope I'm not like that when I get to their age.

Oh, and I tend to respect everyone until they give me a reason not to.

I believe it's generally a good idea. It really depends on the person, though. All my grandmothers and aunts are sweet old ladies, and my uncles and grandfathers are kind of gruff but in a good way. Sometimes, though, it's not a good idea to insult old people. Artificial hips can hurt.
Also, I think that you are correct and that women definitly should have apologized for being such a bitch.

Respect is earned. You need to do more than keep breathing for extended periods of time to earn it.

Your kid was in the right. If your kid had been rude and refused to move after being politely asked, there may be a problem, but it seems to me that your kid was in the right. This old woman should have said excuse me and say what her intentions were so it is clear what is happening. That woman is showing your child how NOT to act.

It reminds me of high school where teachers looked at me funny because I told them that they were using the entrance as an exit and had collided right into me. They weren't even mindful of where they were going. Yet I was somehow considered to be in the wrong and later on labelled by the vice principal as being rude because I talked back to teachers... yet I was 19 when it happened.

do you respect your elders just because they are older? do you think that's a good idea?
I respect my elders and always have. Sure some of them are down right miserable, and some of them fail at interpersonal relationships but that is their problem.

While I think what the woman did was rude and wrong, please tell us what does "ugly" and "fat" have to do with it?

today while at the gas station this old ugly fat hag pushed my kid out of the way so she could get a soda, and my kid told her "you could have said excuse me" and the bitch ranted at me for like 5 minutes about how I "need to teach my kids respect"
...
so, do you think my kid was being rude? should she just have gotten up off the floor and apologized for being in the lady's way?
It was an appropriate response, but perhaps the off-hand delivery could have been refined a bit. If it were me, I'd have politely attracted her attention before confronting her directly on it. That's probably a minor detail though.

do you respect your elders just because they are older? do you think that's a good idea?
Hmm. Respect is a weird notion in this context. I certainly treat them with human dignity as I would anyone else, and I have no problem defaulting to the position of offering assistance to people who need it. But I'm not about to let some skewed sense of "deserved privilege" let anyone claim superiority over anyone else. You might be 20 years my junior or 20 years my senior - either way, if you're asserting dominance over another, I will speak up, and will be entirely within the bounds of decency to do so.

I respecy my elders and always have. Sure some of them are down right miserable, and some of them fail at interpersonal relationships but that is their problem.

While I think what the woman did was rude and wrong, but what does "ugly" and "fat" have to do with it?

not much, I just think if you are already ugly and fat and smell like cigarettes and moldy cheese, you should try to be nice.....

not much, I just think if you are already ugly and fat and smell like cigarettes and moldy cheese, you should try to be nice.....
Perhaps that may be part of her problem? Perhaps people have not been "nice" with her because she is "ugly and fat"?

Perhaps that may be part of her problem? Perhaps people have not been "nice" with her because she is "ugly and fat"?

No excuse to take it out on another, especially a small child.

Perhaps that may be part of her problem? Perhaps people have not been "nice" with her because she is "ugly and fat"?

So? That is no excuse to turn around and be mean to others who have done nothing.

I was raised to do it, but mostly lately I think it might be a bunch of crap.

today while at the gas station this old ugly fat hag pushed my kid out of the way so she could get a soda, and my kid told her "you could have said excuse me" and the bitch ranted at me for like 5 minutes about how I "need to teach my kids respect"

I explained to her as politely as possible that it's rather rude to push someone and she's lucky I don't call the police since she assaulted my child, and that she needs to learn some manners.

I think if people are rude they don't deserve respect. My kid would have moved if the lady would have said something, but to just push her? how rude is that?!

so, do you think my kid was being rude? should she just have gotten up off the floor and apologized for being in the lady's way?

do you respect your elders just because they are older? do you think that's a good idea?

Seems to me like someone has raised her kid to be awesome.

As it was said before, respect is something that needs to be earned, or at the very least, if you extend it with the benefit of the doubt, people have to work to keep that respect.

All in all, you reacted very wisely in letting the old hag know her behaviour was unacceptable.

I was raised to do it, but mostly lately I think it might be a bunch of crap.

today while at the gas station this old ugly fat hag pushed my kid out of the way so she could get a soda, and my kid told her "you could have said excuse me" and the bitch ranted at me for like 5 minutes about how I "need to teach my kids respect"

I explained to her as politely as possible that it's rather rude to push someone and she's lucky I don't call the police since she assaulted my child, and that she needs to learn some manners.

I think if people are rude they don't deserve respect. My kid would have moved if the lady would have said something, but to just push her? how rude is that?!

so, do you think my kid was being rude? should she just have gotten up off the floor and apologized for being in the lady's way?

do you respect your elders just because they are older? do you think that's a good idea?

It's a gray area honestly. It has to be dealt with case-by-case.

Well i found when working at a shop which served loads of old folks.
That the ones who were aware they were old tended to be nicer.
The ones who let themselves get rushed tended to be more snappy e.g. "i'm late for my coach hurry up and serve me!". But that's just an observation on my part, the ones that worry me are the quiet ones who just go along with other people.
anyway apart from that i pray i don't ever end up in an old folks home, ever.
yeah, but that's not age specific. I've seen younger middle aged and teens doing the "hurry up and serve me" type attitude.

But I do take into account that their day may not be the best... but it's when it's repeatedly done... :rolleyes:

No, Your child was not rude, the lady was/is.

I've seeing that alot. Older people being rude and expecting to get away with it just because they are older. it's a shame really. some of these people act as if the world owes them just because they are old.

I only hope I'm not like that when I get to their age.

Oh, and I tend to respect everyone until they give me a reason not to.

Well i found when working at a shop which served loads of old folks.
That the ones who were aware they were old tended to be nicer.
The ones who let themselves get rushed tended to be more snappy e.g. "i'm late for my coach hurry up and serve me!". But that's just an observation on my part, the ones that worry me are the quiet ones who just go along with other people.
anyway apart from that i pray i don't ever end up in an old folks home, ever.

Jeez, Smunkee, you need to move out of where you live! From what I've read of your posts, it sounds like Hell.

You live in Oklahoma, right? Go one state up, your neighbor of the north: Kansas.

Except for our drivers, everyone here is swell!

Kansas is worse from what I've heard. At least they don't teach Creationism here.

I was raised to do it, but mostly lately I think it might be a bunch of crap.

today while at the gas station this old ugly fat hag pushed my kid out of the way so she could get a soda, and my kid told her "you could have said excuse me" and the bitch ranted at me for like 5 minutes about how I "need to teach my kids respect"

I explained to her as politely as possible that it's rather rude to push someone and she's lucky I don't call the police since she assaulted my child, and that she needs to learn some manners.

I think if people are rude they don't deserve respect. My kid would have moved if the lady would have said something, but to just push her? how rude is that?!

so, do you think my kid was being rude? should she just have gotten up off the floor and apologized for being in the lady's way?

do you respect your elders just because they are older? do you think that's a good idea?

I don't think your kid was being rude..

I generally respect people until they prove themselves unworthy of it (of course they gain regain it though). This is regardless of whether they are elders or not.

No excuse to take it out on another, especially a small child.
I already made my comment regarding such rudeness. Perhaps if the "ugly, fat" woman was here to defend herself, we could ask her why she did what she did?

I think you should respect your elders. You should give people who have more experience than you the nod, especially if you're a child. However, respect for elders doesn't include allowing them to abuse you.

My brother was in the grocery store in Florida with his very pregnant wife shopping. An elderly woman runs into his wife so hard that his wife literally had to be brought a chair because her ankle was so sore. "Snow birds!", the elderly woman spits and she rams her with the cart because she's moving too slowly (because she's incredibly pregnant).

My brother has quite the temper and, understandably, was barely able to stop from just tearing the place up. He felt so helpless because he couldn't even restrain her until the cops arrived, since it would have been difficult to do so without injuring her. Plus, what's the likelihood she'd actually get into any trouble for what she'd done.

Most elderly people I know deserve a little bit of deference for their contribution, but there is a few that make you wish we did the ice flow thing.

I already made my comment regarding such rudeness. Perhaps if the "ugly, fat" woman was here to defend herself, we could ask her why she did what she did?

Perhaps, though I doubt we'd get any kind of satisfactory answer.

Perhaps that may be part of her problem? Perhaps people have not been "nice" with her because she is "ugly and fat"?

I'm ugly and fat and I don't go around pushing 4 year olds. I thought I was being rather nice explaining to her that it was unacceptable instead of what I really wanted to say and I think it was rather responsible of me to be so very nice to her instead of doing what my first instinct was and punching her in the face.

I'm a very nice person, ugly and fat or not.

I already made my comment regarding such rudeness. Perhaps if the "ugly, fat" woman was here to defend herself, we could ask her why she did what she did?

during her rant she said something about it being polite to move when an older person needs something.

apparently even if it's not their turn, if you didn't see them or if they didn't announce themselves.

I would get up if I saw someone older than me that needed to sit, but them pushing me out of my seat makes me just a bit less likely to want to give it up.

people have to earn respect. if they don't courtesy is all they get, and if they do anything negative they might as well not exist.

Kansas is worse from what I've heard. At least they don't teach Creationism here.
Exactly. From what you've heard.

As a resident Kansan, most strangers are polite and helpful. And besides, you're judging Kansas from our Board of Education. Our Senators and board of education are a bunch of dumbasses.

The media's representation of Kansas is "some unknown state where there's some crazy fundie Christians in control." Which is true, but incomplete, since we have an awesome governor, and my city's mayor is really cool.

You need to look at the people! People are nice here, and I have never met a rude old lady pushing me around. In fact, most people are very nice to the elderly, and the elderly are very nice to us young'uns.

during her rant she said something about it being polite to move when an older person needs something.

apparently even if it's not their turn, if you didn't see them or if they didn't announce themselves.

I would get up if I saw someone older than me that needed to sit, but them pushing me out of my seat makes me just a bit less likely to want to give it up.

You should have kicked her in the shin and then said that her leg was impolitely in the way of your foot.

Exactly. From what you've heard.

As a resident Kansan, most strangers are polite and helpful. And besides, you're judging Kansas from our Board of Education. Our Senators and board of education are a bunch of dumbasses.

The media's representation of Kansas is "some unknown state where there's some crazy fundie Christians in control." Which is true, but incomplete, since we have an awesome governor, and my city's mayor is really cool.

You need to look at the people! People are nice here, and I have never met a rude old lady pushing me around. In fact, most people are very nice to the elderly, and the elderly are very nice to us young'uns.

I'm working under the delusion that every jackass I encounter is here from Texas, I am actually right 9 times out of 10

We went to Kansas for the weekend once, the Wichita zoo is nice. I have family in Kansas City (both sides) it's nice too.

Exactly. From what you've heard.

As a resident Kansan, most strangers are polite and helpful. And besides, you're judging Kansas from our Board of Education. Our Senators and board of education are a bunch of dumbasses.

The media's representation of Kansas is "some unknown state where there's some crazy fundie Christians in control." Which is true, but incomplete, since we have an awesome governor, and my city's mayor is really cool.

You need to look at the people! People are nice here, and I have never met a rude old lady pushing me around. In fact, most people are very nice to the elderly, and the elderly are very nice to us young'uns.

I haven't met any rude old ladies in Oklahoma either.

People here are nice enough, although the older they get, the more bigoted they appear to become.

And of course I know Kansas isn't just a pack of crazies, but unless the Board of Education has some changes, Kansas is still going to be at the end of a lot of jokes.

We went to Kansas for the weekend once, the Wichita zoo is nice. I have family in Kansas City (both sides) it's nice too.
I've never visited Wichita, but I've heard it's nice, too.

We would have no problems if they entire world were like Kansas!

what a great learning opportunity.

yes your kids need to respect their elders. but, as the one obviously knows, that doesnt mean that they have to put up with being treated badly just because the person is older than they are.

its important especially for girls to learn to be polite but stand up for themselves at the same time. youve got a very good start on that.

So, do you think my kid was being rude? should she just have gotten up off the floor and apologized for being in the lady's way?

do you respect your elders just because they are older? do you think that's a good idea?

To answer your questions in order. No, your kid was just "there". No she should not have apologized, she should have been apologized to.

As for elders, it's a bit more complicated. On one hand, a child should be taught that adults, having been around longer, [I]generally[I] know better, and should heed their words. This "respect" however should only extend to adults they know: parents, teachers, trusted neighbors, etc.

For respect of the elderly, sure, they should be respected...insofar that they are treated politely and with kindness, as ANY individual should.*

TRUE respect needs to be earned; through experience, actions and character, NOT through some arbitrary ideology of "I'm older, so you should listen to me."

SO!

The lady in question can correctly be considered a fat, whiney old hag and your daughter is not at all in the wrong, and neither are you. She is just stuck in a irrelevant, incorrect way of thinking. And if she really looked to traditional thinking as a guide, the she would have followed the Golden Rule: "Do unto others, as you would have others do unto you."

Fin.

*Unless there is some reason why an individual shouldn't go out of his way to be "polite". Like in dealing with criminals...or fat old hags...

I respect or disrespect people based on themselves, not postition or age. I respect my grandfather, as he is compassionate, wise, and amazing in pretty much every measurable way. I respect my parents, as they are logical, fair, and great people. I respect some of my teachers for being amazing, I don't respect others for being stupid, vindictive, ect. I don't respect old fundamentalists in Iran.

What a jerk!!! You have a lot more self-control than I do, I probably would have told her off! I think that you should respect your elders untill they do something stupid or mean or just plain uncaring. Then you treat them like every other jerk.;)

I was raised to do it, but mostly lately I think it might be a bunch of crap.

today while at the gas station this old ugly fat hag pushed my kid out of the way so she could get a soda, and my kid told her "you could have said excuse me" and the bitch ranted at me for like 5 minutes about how I "need to teach my kids respect"

I explained to her as politely as possible that it's rather rude to push someone and she's lucky I don't call the police since she assaulted my child, and that she needs to learn some manners.

I think if people are rude they don't deserve respect. My kid would have moved if the lady would have said something, but to just push her? how rude is that?!

so, do you think my kid was being rude? should she just have gotten up off the floor and apologized for being in the lady's way?

do you respect your elders just because they are older? do you think that's a good idea?

Of course your kid wasnt rude, I think she gave the perfect reaction. You, on the other hand, should not have listened a 5 minute rant. Your kid fell to the floor and you listened to this person for 5 minutes?

Of course your kid wasnt rude, I think she gave the perfect reaction. You, on the other hand, should not have listened a 5 minute rant. Your kid fell to the floor and you listened to this person for 5 minutes?

I picked up the kid and while I was comforting her the rant was ongoing.

I tried my best to react in an appropriate way, modeling proper behavior and such, which is why I didn't actually do or say what I wanted.

Your kid needs to be sent to a Turkish prison.

I picked up the kid and while I was comforting her the rant was ongoing.

I tried my best to react in an appropriate way, modeling proper behavior and such, which is why I didn't actually do or say what I wanted.

I dont think you reacted in an appropriate way. Pushing children and making them fall intentionally is unacceptable. You said you were polite when you explained her that she was wrong. I think you should not have "rewarded" the old women's wrong behaviour. I dont mean you should have pushed her back or anything but you should have cut off her rant and explained her (matter of factly, maybe a lil rude or angry?) that she was wrong and leave.

Bring the old bitch to court!

I was raised to do it, but mostly lately I think it might be a bunch of crap.

today while at the gas station this old ugly fat hag pushed my kid out of the way so she could get a soda, and my kid told her "you could have said excuse me" and the bitch ranted at me for like 5 minutes about how I "need to teach my kids respect"

I explained to her as politely as possible that it's rather rude to push someone and she's lucky I don't call the police since she assaulted my child, and that she needs to learn some manners.

I think if people are rude they don't deserve respect. My kid would have moved if the lady would have said something, but to just push her? how rude is that?!

so, do you think my kid was being rude? should she just have gotten up off the floor and apologized for being in the lady's way?

do you respect your elders just because they are older? do you think that's a good idea?

Respect is earned. It isn't automatic. However, out of courteousness, I will start with default respect for for elders despite the fact they haven't earned it yet. However, that doen't mean they can't lose it. And quickly. Especially if they lay hands on my child. It wouldn't be the first old lady I tackled. :p

do you respect your elders just because they are older? do you think that's a good idea?

Nope, respect needs to be earned.

Respecting your elders because they're your elders?
Utter rubbish.

Respecting your elders if they've earned it?
Yes.

Respect is earned. It isn't automatic. However, out of courteousness, I will start with default respect for for elders despite the fact they haven't earned it yet. However, that doen't mean they can't lose it. And quickly. Especially if they lay hands on my child. It wouldn't be the first old lady I tackled. :p

It's generally a good idea to have a default level of respect for strangers. Only about "I'm not going to be intentionally rude". If only so you don't end up getting tackled by some other LG-esque person.

It's generally a good idea to have a default level of respect for strangers. Only about "I'm not going to be intentionally rude". If only so you don't end up getting tackled by some other LG-esque person.

Very wise. I don't tackle total strangers on a whim anymore. In this age of lawsuits, my days of doing so are behind me. *nod*

Respect should always be given to everyone regardless of their age (I really don't see what age has to do with anything) unless/until they do something stupid like pushing someone much smaller than them to the ground without provocation.

This bitch that pushed your kid even went further and started bitching at you for getting a negative reaction from the child she pushed. WTF?!?!?! Fuck her. She deserves nothing but contempt.

I was raised to do it, but mostly lately I think it might be a bunch of crap.

today while at the gas station this old ugly fat hag pushed my kid out of the way so she could get a soda, and my kid told her "you could have said excuse me" and the bitch ranted at me for like 5 minutes about how I "need to teach my kids respect"

I explained to her as politely as possible that it's rather rude to push someone and she's lucky I don't call the police since she assaulted my child, and that she needs to learn some manners.

I think if people are rude they don't deserve respect. My kid would have moved if the lady would have said something, but to just push her? how rude is that?!

so, do you think my kid was being rude? should she just have gotten up off the floor and apologized for being in the lady's way?

do you respect your elders just because they are older? do you think that's a good idea?

An elder is a member of a community who deserves respect because of a lifetime of accumulated wisdom. It's a relationship, not a sinecure. This woman was not a member of your community, therefore she was not your elder. Just older.

Also, being an elder necessitates maturity. Maturing doesn't just happen. Just like some fruit goes straight from bitter and green to rotten and brown without ever having been juicy and red, some people go from young and headstrong to old and bitter without ever having been learned and wise. And old woman who pushes kids around rather than asking them to get out of her way has gone straight to old and bitter. If she wanted the respect due an elder she would have displayed the grace of one and asked your child politely to get out of the way.

While I think what the woman did was rude and wrong, please tell us what does "ugly" and "fat" have to do with it?

At fifty everyone has the face he deserves. – George Orwell

Your kid needs to be sent to a Turkish prison.

Been watching a little Midnight Express (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midnight_Express_%28film%29) have we? :p

I dont think you reacted in an appropriate way. Pushing children and making them fall intentionally is unacceptable. You said you were polite when you explained her that she was wrong. I think you should not have "rewarded" the old women's wrong behaviour. I dont mean you should have pushed her back or anything but you should have cut off her rant and explained her (matter of factly, maybe a lil rude or angry?) that she was wrong and leave.

I was quite clear on how unacceptable it was. I am however in a position where my kids are watching so I am trying to model for them the behavior I wish everyone had which is, just because other people suck ass doesn't mean you have to stoop to their level. I could have totally punched her in the face, and actually a few years ago I would have done that without thinking, I could have also verbally ripped her a new one, and even a few months ago would have done thustly, but I am trying to model the grown up behavior for the smunklings, which means I can't always do what I wanna do.

I was quite clear on how unacceptable it was. I am however in a position where my kids are watching so I am trying to model for them the behavior I wish everyone had which is, just because other people suck ass doesn't mean you have to stoop to their level. I could have totally punched her in the face, and actually a few years ago I would have done that without thinking, I could have also verbally ripped her a new one, and even a few months ago would have done thustly, but I am trying to model the grown up behavior for the smunklings, which means I can't always do what I wanna do.

A new father friend of mine commented on the fact that he never cared for people pushing or jumping the line, crossing the road where lights weren't green and etc., - indeed he was probably the one transgressing himself.

Yet now it makes him angry and he puts it down to having a new child and wanting to provide a good example, and expecting others to be good examples as well.

So when he sees bad examples he fumes and is often driven to point it out verbally - he's become the kind of guy he used to laugh at and call 'old man'.

Interesting how perspectives change.

A new father friend of mine commented on the fact that he never cared for people pushing or jumping the line, crossing the road where lights weren't green and etc., - indeed he was probably the one transgressing himself.

Yet now it makes him angry and he puts it down to having a new child and wanting to provide a good example, and expecting others to be good examples as well.

So when he sees bad examples he fumes and is often driven to point it out verbally - he's become the kind of guy he used to laugh at and call 'old man'.

Interesting how perspectives change.

If I can model behavior and attitudes that keep my children from making some of the really big ugly mistakes I made in my youth, it's worth being an old fart.

You should respect your elders because they fought the war for your type!

You should respect your elders because they fought the war for your type!

:confused:

You should respect everyone for what they are unless they are totally disrepectful back, then you can drop the pretence.

As lots of other people have pointed out, respect must be earned.

I am default polite to elders because they are physically weaker and frailer than me. For that reason, I will give them my seat, hold doors for them, offer help with packages, and let them cut in front of me in lines.

But that doesn't mean I respect them. Hell, I don't even know them. They might be assholes. I've known quite a few elders who turned out not to be worth the effort to spit on their graves, let alone worthy of respect.

Smunkee, you modeled perfect behavior for the little one -- politely telling a disrespectful old hag to mind her manners and keep her hands to herself, showing your child that the rules of polite behavior apply to everyone, not just powerless children.

Plus, your politeness contrasted nicely with her rudeness, making her look even worse and putting you one up on the old bitch. Also a good lesson for the kiddies to learn.

Been watching a little Midnight Express (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midnight_Express_%28film%29) have we? :p

No, Airplane! :p

I've seeing that alot. Older people being rude and expecting to get away with it just because they are older. it's a shame really. some of these people act as if the world owes them just because they are old.

An extremely common attitude amongst older folks in my area. I long ago stopped giving the elderly the benefit of the doubt. I won't be purposely disrespectful, but I'll be damned if I'm going to cater to the fancies of a bunch of bitter, resentful people.

You should respect your elders because they fought the war for your type!

So because some elderly people fought in "the war", all elderly people must be respected?

Fine...plenty of people my age are in Iraq and Afghanistan right now. I demand to be shown the same amount of respect as those soldiers.




See how stupid that sounds?



Maybe my sarcasm detector is broken, but that post sure pissed me off.

So because some elderly people fought in "the war", all elderly people must be respected?

Fine...plenty of people my age are in Iraq and Afghanistan right now. I demand to be shown the same amount of respect as those soldiers.

See how stupid that sounds?

Yes they should be respected. However, if they show they are not worthy of it, you don't have to anymore......

So because some elderly people fought in "the war", all elderly people must be respected?

Fine...plenty of people my age are in Iraq and Afghanistan right now. I demand to be shown the same amount of respect as those soldiers.




See how stupid that sounds?



Maybe my sarcasm detector is broken, but that post sure pissed me off.Good point. I'm actually older than the current crew, and i'm PRETTY FUCKING SURE they're NOT fighting "for my type".
It did sound somewhat like a quote from Bart Simpson, actually.

I respect everybody equally unless they do something to alter the amount I accord them. Age doesn't mean anything to me; what matters is how that person acts, and no number of years or experiences is sufficient to justify them acting in a rude and inconsiderate manner. You don't get that right. Basically, I don't act like an ass to you, and I expect the same in return. The closer you are to me, the more I'm willing to do for you, and the more I expect to be able to count on you in return.

There's no test to "earn" my respect, I give everyone some unless they do something to lose it.

Respect is earned. You need to do more than keep breathing for extended periods of time to earn it.

People might have already responded to this so sorry if it's rehashing, but I've always thought this self defeating at best and bullshit at worst.

What it essentially says is that you give no one any respect until they pass some mysterious trial to 'earn' your respect.

But in what way are you then earning anyone's respect if you treat them like dicks until they 'prove themselves' to you. You're not drill Sargents. And I don't know that your fraternity is all that cool...It seems to me that you have to give people at least a base line of respect (like not plowing through a kid to get a soda) in order to expect any. Making people prove it might work for sports movies, but I don't see it as functional in the real world.

i believe in 'respecting' everyone, until they EARN my contempt, and even then pretending to, at least to their face.

by that i mean consideration, reasonable civilized consideration, as universally and unbiasedly as possible. not a matter of according rank and age special consideration though, just certainly no less then anyone else.

the only special consideration is to make allowances for infermities, be they of age or misfortune.

although, in cultures that DO accord age special consideration, there does seem to be a higher level of universal consideration generally as well. and that IS a plus.

=^^=
.../\...

Respect and etiquette are the basic tenants of any civilised society. Respect for elders is in many ways a cultural inheritance from when an elder and someone in authority were one and the same. The modern continuation of the idea could perhaps be better understood as "Respect for those in authority". The rationale is that people will only take someone seriously and follow their instructions effectively if they respect them.

Is that right? Well yes... Respect also has to work the other way, generally politeness and good etiquette form a part of society that allows it to function smoothly. Loud, obnoxious behaviour and a lack of awareness for others be in in public or in private conversation always strikes me as disrespectful of others of those around you, as well as showing up that person as being uncivilised, uncultured and having no self respect or sense of self as others see him, regardless of who it is who acts in that manner.

Can, or should, people loose respect? If their actions are in themselves disrespectful, then yes, for they have shown themselves to be unable to conduct themselves in a civilised manner, and so are not a part of that society, and that should be made clear to them. If they cannot act in a respectful manner and a way conducive to a calm and pleasing society, then why should they be regarded as worthy of the respect of that society?

Speak courteously to those above you, considerately to those below you, and know that everything you do will have effects on those around you.

I was raised to do it, but mostly lately I think it might be a bunch of crap.

today while at the gas station this old ugly fat hag pushed my kid out of the way so she could get a soda, and my kid told her "you could have said excuse me" and the bitch ranted at me for like 5 minutes about how I "need to teach my kids respect"

I explained to her as politely as possible that it's rather rude to push someone and she's lucky I don't call the police since she assaulted my child, and that she needs to learn some manners.

I think if people are rude they don't deserve respect. My kid would have moved if the lady would have said something, but to just push her? how rude is that?!

so, do you think my kid was being rude? should she just have gotten up off the floor and apologized for being in the lady's way?

do you respect your elders just because they are older? do you think that's a good idea?

I think that resepct for old age just for the sake of it is a very, VERY dated concept.
I imagine that throughout much of human history, when life expectancy was around 30 years for the average person, growing "old" was in fact an achievement. You had to survive illnesses that we can cure easily today, you had to be clever enough not to get killed in accidents, wars, etc., and you had to be clever enough to ensure a good food supply so you wouldn't starve.
Growing old was might well have been an indicator of intelligence and a bright mind. These days, it might be a pain in the arse growing old, but it's certainly no longer an achievement. So I think unconditional respect for old people should be a thing of the past. They deserve the same amount of respect as everyone else these days.

People might have already responded to this so sorry if it's rehashing, but I've always thought this self defeating at best and bullshit at worst.

What it essentially says is that you give no one any respect until they pass some mysterious trial to 'earn' your respect.

As already was said in other posts:
Courtesy != respect

You EARN respect in my eyes, your actions are disrespectful? Don't expect any respect from me.

On a related note...
You know what really pisses me off? Veterans who act like assholes and expect to get away with it because they 'served'.

You EARN respect in my eyes, your actions are disrespectful? Don't expect any respect from me.Depends on the situation. I usually try not to lower myself down to the level of someone disrespecting me. If you keep pissing pissed people off, the world won't get any better. How do you think feuds start up? It's a little thing one party does to another. Then that gets reciprocated, and in the end things get out of hand.

Depends on the situation. I usually try not to lower myself down to the level of someone disrespecting me.
Most of the situations where my sort of situation happens are severe.

If you keep pissing pissed people off, the world won't get any better. How do you think feuds start up? It's a little thing one party does to another. Then that gets reciprocated, and in the end things get out of hand. That's more along the line of revenge isn't it?
No I'm not saying I'm going to 'get back at them'. I'm just not going to respect them.

They will simply go down on my mental list of importance.

I was raised to do it, but mostly lately I think it might be a bunch of crap.

today while at the gas station this old ugly fat hag pushed my kid out of the way so she could get a soda, and my kid told her "you could have said excuse me" and the bitch ranted at me for like 5 minutes about how I "need to teach my kids respect"

I explained to her as politely as possible that it's rather rude to push someone and she's lucky I don't call the police since she assaulted my child, and that she needs to learn some manners.

I think if people are rude they don't deserve respect. My kid would have moved if the lady would have said something, but to just push her? how rude is that?!

so, do you think my kid was being rude? should she just have gotten up off the floor and apologized for being in the lady's way?

do you respect your elders just because they are older? do you think that's a good idea?

Naaa you have it spot on. I am always open to the idea of respecting my elders just because of their knowledge and life's experiance, but they are not automatically immune from being rude or other wise crappy people.

Indeed, in my experiance if somebody is a racist piece of shit, then when they get old, they become an old racist piece of shit.

I think if people are rude they don't deserve respect. My kid would have moved if the lady would have said something, but to just push her? how rude is that?!

Very.

so, do you think my kid was being rude? should she just have gotten up off the floor and apologized for being in the lady's way?

No. Your child did nothing wrong, in fact she was reinforcing social customs both on herself and on the woman (which is a good thing for a socially reliant species).

Btw, how old is your kid?

If the 'petrol woman' had some pressing business I could see the reason why she might need to cut in line, though considering that she not only had the time to haurang you about your daughter's 'lack of respect' but if was in a hurry she would not have bothered with a drink anyway I would say that your daughter was clearly in the right.

do you respect your elders just because they are older? do you think that's a good idea?

I think it is a good idea to respect experience, not age, though respecting your elders seems to be based on the 'they have more experience' reason, which is a valid one though I wouldn't consider them infallible but I would recognise that they know more than I would about some situations.

In essence I'm saying that the petrol woman had no basis (nor need) to be launching a tirade upon you and/or your daughter.

You should respect your elders because they fought the war for your type!

Which war? What if I had elders on both sides? Should I respect both?

No, Airplane! :p

Pfff, you need a Robin Hood: Men in Tights Turkish (well, Ottoman Turk) prison...

Which war?


The war on christmas, of course.
Silly question.

Same latter questions then: What if I had elders on both sides? Should I respect both?

Pfff, you need a Robin Hood: Men in Tights Turkish (well, Ottoman Turk) prison...

I can't believe no one actually understood the reference despite the link. Ruffy had said something about a "Turkish prison" and if anyone here has actually watched Midnight Express, you'd know that I was referring to... yet my reference is ruined by people who haven't watched older movies! :(

I can't believe no one actually understood the reference despite the link. Ruffy had said something about a "Turkish prison" and if anyone here has actually watched Midnight Express, you'd know that I was referring to... yet my reference is ruined by people who haven't watched older movies! :(

Perhaps I knew the reference but didn't care, or perhaps I haven't seen that movie yet and wanted to make a reference of my own.

Choices, choices, choices.

At least my name isn't Kurtz...

I think it's that difference between "elder" and "older". It is like when you think of someone older like George Bush, versus and elder statesman like Nelson Mandela.

You should respect your elders because they fought the war for your type!

I don't think there are any Irish people still alive who fought in a war. Am I allowed be disrespectful to old Irish people?

A baseline of neutral respect and consideration is something I try to exude in my day-to-day dealings with everyday people. Past that, any respect is something to be earned, not assumed just because of age or station. As a professor, I expect a basic level of respect off the bat, but I don't expect to be given any that's undue. I should earn that.

I respect my elders right up until they prove themselves unworthy of it through arrogance, assumption or inexcusable irrationality. Even then, I'll simply avoid them, change the topic or otherwise extract myself rather than get involved in any kind of harangue about who's due what level of respect. I'm not going to convince someone who feels entitled to be knelt to, and they won't convince me to kneel. I'd rather not waste the time and effort.

Unless I'm given a reason not to, I show some respect. It's not that hard and it does no harm.

Unless I'm given a reason not to, I show some respect. It's not that hard and it does no harm.

There y'go. :)

I can't believe no one actually understood the reference despite the link. Ruffy had said something about a "Turkish prison" and if anyone here has actually watched Midnight Express, you'd know that I was referring to... yet my reference is ruined by people who haven't watched older movies! :(
Funny, i kept thinking "Midnight COWBOY", not "Midnight Express" :p
*nods to CToaN*

I was raised to do it, but mostly lately I think it might be a bunch of crap.

today while at the gas station this old ugly fat hag pushed my kid out of the way so she could get a soda, and my kid told her "you could have said excuse me" and the bitch ranted at me for like 5 minutes about how I "need to teach my kids respect"

I explained to her as politely as possible that it's rather rude to push someone and she's lucky I don't call the police since she assaulted my child, and that she needs to learn some manners.

I think if people are rude they don't deserve respect. My kid would have moved if the lady would have said something, but to just push her? how rude is that?!

so, do you think my kid was being rude? should she just have gotten up off the floor and apologized for being in the lady's way?

do you respect your elders just because they are older? do you think that's a good idea?

They deserve a certain amount of respect (oooh and that was coming from somene raised in a culture that holds elders on the freaking pedestal), but think of it as a debit card, respect levels can drop or raise from their words and action.

If that was me in Smunkee's situation you could see my respect for that elderly person drop down like a fat bear that got electrocuted while climbing a power line pole.

"If someone tells you they know more than you do because they're older, tell them you're closer to the sun than they are because you're taller." - Millor Fernandes, an author here in Brazil. And an OLD one. That knows, and it SHOWS, that age means nothing. He has my respect.

*rant about rude old woman*

do you respect your elders just because they are older? do you think that's a good idea?
Word of advice Smunky - don't ever travel to Hong Kong. You'll be up for assault within 5 minutes of being here.

As for 'respect your elders' - naw, I don't. Respect my betters, definitely. By I fail to see why I should respect someone simply because they were born prior to my own birth. How is that an accomplishment exactly?

It's 8 in the morning, and I just stumbled in assuming this thread was about respecting your cider. Bonus.

It's 8 in the morning, and I just stumbled in assuming this thread was about respecting your cider. Bonus.

You shouldn't be having cider before 10am *nods*