NationStates Jolt Archive

Birth leave sought for girls
Soon-to-be-moms at East High School ask for four weeks of maternity leave.
By Jeremy P. Meyer
The Denver Post

Pregnant students in a Denver high school are asking for at least four weeks of maternity leave so they can heal, bond with their newborns and not be penalized with unexcused absences.

The request is unusual in Colorado's public schools, where districts tend to deal with pregnant students or new moms with specialized programs or individualized education plans.

Denver Public Schools has no districtwide policy, leaving it up to schools to work out plans for students to continue their education.

Two counselors from East High School approached the school board last month, saying the policy at their school is unfair and inconsiderate because it forces new moms to return to school the day after being discharged from the hospital or face being charged with unexcused absences.
http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_7899096

Should they get maternity leave?

Why not? Perhaps they could make it so that the teenage mom feels like she is still welcomed in the school despite her choices. Why encourage more people to drop out? They should make allowances when it is clear it would help curb drop out rates.

At the same time, maybe have someone help that teenage mom by bringing her the assignments and giving her the ability to contact her teachers so she can at least try and keep up with her classmates while she bonds with her child. After all, the infant does sleep a lot so it would be time used wisely.

If an environment is created where the mother is respected, maybe we can see more of it reflected around the country, any country really. There is a lot of talk of "family values". Maybe it's time to start having more options for younger and older women when it comes to children so they don't have to make hard choices.

Why punish the girls further for their choices?

sure, maybe though it would be good if they were doing home study for a while, especially if they had to take off early due to bed rest or something. I missed 9 weeks of school when I was a Junior because of health problems, the school didn't have any issue sending home my assignments and a tutor would visit me once a week or so in case I had a problem. I don't see why pregnant girls can't get the same thing going.

of course there should be maternity leave for highschool students. what possible reason would there be to not have it?

I say for college students but not High School.

http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_7899096

Should they get maternity leave?

To say no is to ignore reality -- sad as it is. The school should probably have someplace for daycare, too, if it really wants them to continue their education.

They made the choices, they should accept the responsibility.

Why not high school? Isn't that where you want to prevent drop outs?
Yeah, I'd think the opposite would be the most desirable. By definition almost, college kids should be able to start and stop as desired, only missing a semester, or so.

I'd sure rather have a new mom think that she can continue high school, rather than drop out and become more of a burden on society. Prevention is usually cheaper than the cure.

I say for college students but not High School.

Why not high school? Isn't that where you want to prevent drop outs?

Yeah, I'd think the opposite would be the most desirable. By definition almost, college kids should be able to start and stop as desired, only missing a semester, or so.

I'd sure rather have a new mom think that she can continue high school, rather than drop out and become more of a burden on society. Prevention is usually cheaper than the cure.

Exactly. Plus isn't already possible to take a semester or two off with no problems in college? I had classmates who would do that in order to make money in order to fund their education.

I feel the same. People have the right and freedom to make a choice on how they conduct themselves through phases in their life. Some times it's not the best (barring all that legal crap) but we shouldn't close the door because of it.

sure, maybe though it would be good if they were doing home study for a while, especially if they had to take off early due to bed rest or something. I missed 9 weeks of school when I was a Junior because of health problems, the school didn't have any issue sending home my assignments and a tutor would visit me once a week or so in case I had a problem. I don't see why pregnant girls can't get the same thing going.
Same here.

They made the choices, they should accept the responsibility.

the same could be said for women who work, no maternity leave for them either?

Of course they should. Whyever not???

Who would pay for it? The school? Thus the taxpayers?

Who would pay for it? The school? Thus the taxpayers?

Pay for what? Them staying at home from school?

the same could be said for women who work, no maternity leave for them either?

Oh they're different.

(Why?)

'Cause we say so!

note: we do not endorse this position. We are merely saving other posters the time and expense of having to spout drivel.

Who would pay for it? The school? Thus the taxpayers?

Exactly what are they paying for?

From the article, it would be for a tutor to spend some time with the student. Most schools already have tutors working for them, so it wouldn't be extra.

The taxpayer is already paying for the kid to be in school, so I don't see what the additional expenses will be.

yes. the point is to try and make things better, not make them worse

Let's face it, having a child in High School is a ridiculous personal mistake. If you can't think to use a condom you should face the consequences. At some point you have got to start expecting people to take responsibility for their own lives and not baby them for their entire lives. This is the same issue as abortion, if you can't think to use protection, you cannot simply be given a do-over. This is the real world people! (Rape= Different Situation). I know, this is an extremely weird view on abortion and such for a center-leftist/socialist/ liberal like me, but this is what I think.

As a school board member (Oklahoma Public Schools), we have alternative school opportunities to accommodate some of these situations. This is a direct branch of the school, that deals directly with issues that cause children to fluctuate from the norm (no, not typically a place for violence/punishment). The curriculum is exactly the same, but the environment is a bit more controlled. Obviously, the attempt is to provide the best environment while providing the best education. This is a special situation, but fits within the normal structure of the school system.

Tutors could be made available, but without legislation mandating them for specific instances (funding would be nice also) such as pregnancy, it would open the opportunity for all types of request related to ADD, ADHD, etc. Personally, with the exception of rare cases, such as those where the expectant mother is bed-ridden for extended periods for health reasons, I would prefer an in-school situation, with exceptions made such as alternative school, to keep the student within the extended population as long as possible and safe, for reasons related to morale and social interaction. Obviously, at some point, accommodations related to scheduling are necessary regardless.

I certainly would not have a problem, at the high school or college level, from a standpoint of administration/procedure. I would just want the best situation possible for the student.

Just an opinion.

Who would pay for it? The school? Thus the taxpayers?

yes.

just like every other public school student.

As a school board member (Oklahoma Public Schools), we have alternative school opportunities to accommodate some of these situations. This is a direct branch of the school, that deals directly with issues that cause children to fluctuate from the norm (no, not typically a place for violence/punishment). The curriculum is exactly the same, but the environment is a bit more controlled. Obviously, the attempt is to provide the best environment while providing the best education. This is a special situation, but fits within the normal structure of the school system.

Tutors could be made available, but without legislation mandating them for specific instances (funding would be nice also) such as pregnancy, it would open the opportunity for all types of request related to ADD, ADHD, etc. Personally, with the exception of rare cases, such as those where the expectant mother is bed-ridden for extended periods for health reasons, I would prefer an in-school situation, with exceptions made such as alternative school, to keep the student within the extended population as long as possible and safe, for reasons related to morale and social interaction. Obviously, at some point, accommodations related to scheduling are necessary regardless.

I certainly would not have a problem, at the high school or college level, from a standpoint of administration/procedure. I would just want the best situation possible for the student.

Just an opinion.

do y'all not have any provision for students who have a temporary condition that keeps them at home or in the hospital for a month?

Who would pay for it? The school? Thus the taxpayers?
Absolutely! And it's a bargain at twice the price.

I'd much rather support a girl through high school than have her drop out and have to support her for the rest of her life.

Surely maternity leave should apply to all mothers, no?

do y'all not have any provision for students who have a temporary condition that keeps them at home or in the hospital for a month?

they do, that's why I was out of OKC public schools for 9 weeks with no problem, they will send home your books/assignments and a tutor can come see you.

The alternative schools are...dangerous sometimes, most of the pregnant girls stayed in their own high school, due to the general class of people at the alternative school (mostly kids too violent to be in the regular school system)

Drop out rates in OKC schools are very high though, it has little to do with the school system and more to do with poverty in the area.

they do, that's why I was out of OKC public schools for 9 weeks with no problem, they will send home your books/assignments and a tutor can come see you.

The alternative schools are...dangerous sometimes, most of the pregnant girls stayed in their own high school, due to the general class of people at the alternative school (mostly kids too violent to be in the regular school system)

Drop out rates in OKC schools are very high though, it has little to do with the school system and more to do with poverty in the area.

high dropout rates are a good reason to keep every kid in school who wants to be there. sick kids, teen parents, kids who have to work to support their families, whatever.

any school district that doesnt have a program to help teen parents stay in school isnt doing everything it can do to stop kids from dropping out.

To say no is to ignore reality -- sad as it is. The school should probably have someplace for daycare, too, if it really wants them to continue their education.

Why not tack a preschool to the high school so mommy and baby can go to school together? ^.^

Really, I don't see why they shouldn't, as long as they're willing to still do the school work. If it's going to be "I dropped a baby, pass me" then no. But if they still do the assignments and complete the courses from home, then its fine.

What's the penalty for an unexcused absence?

I missed a lot of classes when I was in high school, but as long as I showed up for and scored well on the tests no one seemed to mind.

The problem here is caused by the school trying to enforce mandatory attendance. Without that, this wouldn't be an issue.

What's the penalty for an unexcused absence?

I missed a lot of classes when I was in high school, but as long as I showed up for and scored well on the tests no one seemed to mind.

The problem here is caused by the school trying to enforce mandatory attendance. Without that, this wouldn't be an issue.

my senior year you couldn't have more than 12 unexcused absences the whole year or you failed. I had like ......... way more than that. Being on my own I had to work, I showed up for tests but it just wasn't enough for some teachers, a few of them would mark me present when I wasn't but one just didn't care "do you want to graduate or work?"

I just wanted food.

They made the choices, they should accept the responsibility.

So did other mothers who are out of high school and college and waited until they were married or at least could support themselves to have children. Should they be punished too by being forced to work right after they get out of the hospital, lest they be fired?

I think this is a brilliant idea. I don;t think it's in any way "promoting" teenage pregnancy or "excusing" it. However being forced to attend school as soon as they get out of the hospital and not having tiem to be with their kid is going to be horrible for the mother, who will wind up dropping out... and already, 12% of schools in the US are dropout factories, why spit out more dropouts? The mother does not need to be "punished" for something she is already payign the consequences for.

I don't see why this can't be a good idea. If it helps them to keep up in school, why not.

I'm of two minds about this.

1) I would like to see those girls be given every chance to succeed. and providing tutors and even daycare for older children will also provide job opportunities as well as learning opportunities all around.

2) I don't want this to be a signal to people to not take the responsibility in their leasure time activities.

this will be an issue in which I would quietly sit back and watch develop.

Yeah, I'd think the opposite would be the most desirable. By definition almost, college kids should be able to start and stop as desired, only missing a semester, or so.

I'd sure rather have a new mom think that she can continue high school, rather than drop out and become more of a burden on society. Prevention is usually cheaper than the cure.

Prevention would've been her not getting pregnant in the first place.

Of course not. I'll be damned if my taxes pay for the stupidity of teens throughout the UK; I have no objection to teenages being promiscuous and generally enjoying themselves, I simply see no reason to accomodate their failure to use protection.

Prevention would've been her not getting pregnant in the first place.

thats a different kind of prevention

Of course not. I'll be damned if my taxes pay for the stupidity of teens throughout the UK; I have no objection to teenages being promiscuous and generally enjoying themselves, I simply see no reason to accomodate their failure to use protection.

so instead of paying for her to stay in school--a price not significantly higher than if she hadnt given birth--you would put her on the dole for the next 10 years or so?

so instead of paying for her to stay in school--a price not significantly higher than if she hadnt given birth--you would put her on the dole for the next 10 years or so?

Nope, I'd follow the new welfare plans outlined by the conservative party, which I daresay you could look up yourself if you fancy.

In any case, there is a high likelihood a teenage mother will be on the dole for the majority of her life, irrespective of whether or not the state pays for her to forego an education and look after her baby. It is not as simple as you put, as you well know.

Nope, I'd follow the new welfare plans outlined by the conservative party, which I daresay you could look up yourself if you fancy.

In any case, there is a high likelihood a teenage mother will be on the dole for the majority of her life, irrespective of whether or not the state pays for her to forego an education and look after her baby. It is not as simple as you put, as you well know.

so its OK with you that you ensure that she is on the dole? penny wise and pound foolish, eh?

and what about the father of the baby? if he is still in school should HE be kicked out for his irresponsible behavior?

so its OK with you that you ensure that she is on the dole? penny wise and pound foolish, eh?

and what about the father of the baby? if he is still in school should HE be kicked out for his irresponsible behavior?

Of course. Personal responsibility is imperative, and in the case of pregnancy, I see no reason why a school age father should not "pay his way" as it were; it is, after his, his own fault as much is it is the mothers.

Where the dole is concerned, I am genuinely troubled that single mothers, and young mothers, tend to be so poorly employed. However, politics should be nothing if not realistic, and decades of statistics only suggest that teen mothers will remain socially draining for the remainder of their lives. In the light of this, I would rather jettison them from society's care than pay their way for the next 50 years.

Of course. Personal responsibility is imperative, and in the case of pregnancy, I see no reason why a school age father should not "pay his way" as it were; it is, after his, his own fault as much is it is the mothers.

Where the dole is concerned, I am genuinely troubled that single mothers, and young mothers, tend to be so poorly employed. However, politics should be nothing if not realistic, and decades of statistics only suggest that teen mothers will remain socially draining for the remainder of their lives. In the light of this, I would rather jettison them from society's care than pay their way for the next 50 years.

soooooo you want to make sure that neither parent can support their child AND you want to make sure that the government doesnt support them either.

so what becomes of the baby? sold on the black market?

Of course. Personal responsibility is imperative, and in the case of pregnancy, I see no reason why a school age father should not "pay his way" as it were; it is, after his, his own fault as much is it is the mothers.

Where the dole is concerned, I am genuinely troubled that single mothers, and young mothers, tend to be so poorly employed. However, politics should be nothing if not realistic, and decades of statistics only suggest that teen mothers will remain socially draining for the remainder of their lives. In the light of this, I would rather jettison them from society's care than pay their way for the next 50 years.

You propose to do this how? Shoot her the kid and the father in the head?

soooooo you want to make sure that neither parent can support their child AND you want to make sure that the government doesnt support them either.

so what becomes of the baby? sold on the black market?

No. I would have them give their child either up for adoption, or to their parents, until such a time as they have the financial position to support a child.

How about we just kick out the entire school system for irresponsible behavior in favoring "abstinence only" programs over actual sex ed?

If there were a clear link between such an offer and long-term economic success, sure. I think the cost of providing such an option would be outweighed by the reduction in social problems and increased tax revenue; generally, the fewer undereducated and poor unwed mothers, the better for all involved.

my senior year you couldn't have more than 12 unexcused absences the whole year or you failed.
That's idiotic. If some kids are clever enough not to need to attend the classes, why make them?

In grade 10 alone I missed 27 math classes. Just math (there were only 60 classes the entire semester). I got hauled into the principle's office with a lecture about how truancy affected performance, and how studies showed that I, on average, would score 1% higher for each class I'd missed had I attended it.

To which I replied, "Wow, I didn't think it was possible to get 124%."

How about we just kick out the entire school system for irresponsible behavior in favoring "abstinence only" programs over actual sex ed?

Because "abstinence only' works just fine.
Simply because students are too stupid to learn the materiel they are being taught does not mean the system is wrong.
I mean.. I fail at all mathematics, but I haven't gotten pregnant yet. Explain that if you will..:rolleyes:

I'm of two minds about this.

1) I would like to see those girls be given every chance to succeed. and providing tutors and even daycare for older children will also provide job opportunities as well as learning opportunities all around.

2) I don't want this to be a signal to people to not take the responsibility in their leasure time activities.

this will be an issue in which I would quietly sit back and watch develop.
I don't see how this would be a signal to not take responsibility.
Nope, I'd follow the new welfare plans outlined by the conservative party, which I daresay you could look up yourself if you fancy.

In any case, there is a high likelihood a teenage mother will be on the dole for the majority of her life, irrespective of whether or not the state pays for her to forego an education and look after her baby. It is not as simple as you put, as you well know.
It's not as simple as 'pregnant as a teen == drain on society forever' either.

Because "abstinence only' works just fine.

Which it doesn't, go again.

Which it doesn't, go again.

I would like you to find one person who is currently practicing abstinence who has also concieved a child since starting to abstain.

I would like you to find one person who is currently practicing abstinence who has also concieved a child since starting to abstain.

I would like you to find numbers that actually prove abstinence only programs actually reduce the number of teenage pregnancies.

I would like you to find numbers that actually prove abstinence only programs actually reduce the number of teenage pregnancies.

What does that have to do with anything really?
It would not prove that the concept and education is or isn't sound, just that students will or will not follow said practice.

The laziness and moral depravity of individuals does not invalidate anything.

Which isn't to say I support abstinence only education. :p
However, it works fine for me.

I would like you to find one person who is currently practicing abstinence who has also concieved a child since starting to abstain.

I'd like you to show how abstinence only education guarantees that one will remain abstinent.

Oh, and for the sake of lulz: The Virgin Mary.

I'd like you to show how abstinence only education guarantees that one will remain abstinent.

Oh, and for the sake of lulz: The Virgin Mary.

I will like you to show how contraceptive/safe-sex education guarantees that one will use a condom..?
That was a weak point, no offense.

And lulz.

Which it doesn't, go again.

Indeed. I went to abstinence classes in 7th and 8th grade, all they consisted of was scare tactics and "facts" they obtained from "reputable sources". In my 9th grade health textbook there were subtle religious ovetones about sex, yet in the next chapter there was everything you'd ever want/need to know about marijuana and crystal meth. I think that if we had decent sex ed teen pregnancy would decrease.

That, and if society stopped punishing teen mothers for actions they're paying the consequences for, then we'd have fewer teen mothers dropping out and being forced to raise their kids in poverty and on welfare, which the taxpayers have to pay for. Wouldn't you rather pay for a teenage girl to be able to support herself and be a productive member of society (you're already payign for millions of teenage girls to be productive members of society anyway)?

I say yes. Allow them to stay home and get a tutor (assuming there is a tutor available already). It would do wonders for the dropout rate, and help her support her baby in the future without help from the state (since there is a direct correlation between level of education and income).

I don't see how this would be a signal to not take responsibility.

many teens don't realize how big the responsiblity of raising a child is. the ideal of dropping out of school or giving up their dreams and fun can be a great deterant.

However some can see a program of maternity leave, tutors and daycare as the perfect solution to the problem of Pregnancy and child raising... basically, some might try to abuse the system which wouldn't be good for the child in the long run.

a far fetched fear, but I've seen what the effects of heavy dependancy on babysitters on children can have on a child/parent relationship. it's not that pretty. :(

What about the fathers? (For those children where the father is known) They are (or will be) required to pay support, perhaps they should get paternity leave, it may even give mothers some opportunity maybe a couple of times a week to attend school.

We do have home instructors that teach kids who are out for long term medical reasons.

sorry kat, but I just got a mental image of this note being sent to a school:
"Please excuse [daughter] from school and please arrange for home tutoring. She's currently suffereing from a long term effect of some protein injection she recieved in a 'tender' location several months ago and would be out for about 9 months."

:D

We do have home instructors that teach kids who are out for long term medical reasons.

Two counselors from East High School approached the school board last month, saying the policy at their school is unfair and inconsiderate because it forces new moms to return to school the day after being discharged from the hospital or face being charged with unexcused absences.

Ridiculous. Surely their doctors can write them a note, if their parents can't.

many teens don't realize how big the responsiblity of raising a child is. the ideal of dropping out of school or giving up their dreams and fun can be a great deterant.

However some can see a program of maternity leave, tutors and daycare as the perfect solution to the problem of Pregnancy and child raising... basically, some might try to abuse the system which wouldn't be good for the child in the long run.

a far fetched fear, but I've seen what the effects of heavy dependancy on babysitters on children can have on a child/parent relationship. it's not that pretty. :(

I see what you mean.

if you can't think to use protection, you cannot simply be given a do-over.

Why yes, yes you can. That was the point of Roe v. Wade.

What about the fathers? (For those children where the father is known) They are (or will be) required to pay support, perhaps they should get paternity leave, it may even give mothers some opportunity maybe a couple of times a week to attend school.

in theory the mother needs time to recover from delivery. then there is the adjustment of hormones coupled with having to care for a new baby--amazingly stressful in the best of circumstances

but, yeah, the father would need adjustment time too. if he is closely involved in his child's life he would need some time to bond with his new baby.

Ridiculous. Surely their doctors can write them a note, if their parents can't.

This is the first thing I thought. It is not an unexcused absence if a doctor/parent note is brought in. With enough warning as you say work can be arranged at home.

http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_7899096

Should they get maternity leave?

I don't think they should... The school seems to already have programs in place to ensure that these children-mothers can continue their education while new mothers... To excuse them from school for weeks on end without penalty is absurd... They need their education...

What about the fathers? (For those children where the father is known) They are (or will be) required to pay support, perhaps they should get paternity leave, it may even give mothers some opportunity maybe a couple of times a week to attend school.

Why not? Sounds logical that the father should help out.

Exactly. Plus isn't already possible to take a semester or two off with no problems in college? I had classmates who would do that in order to make money in order to fund their education.

I feel the same. People have the right and freedom to make a choice on how they conduct themselves through phases in their life. Some times it's not the best (barring all that legal crap) but we shouldn't close the door because of it.

High School and college are two separate systems... It's fairly easy to take a semester off of college, and continue the class at a later time, the class will be there again next semester... High school is different... Most classes run year long... 11th Grade English is 11th grade english, you have to complete the year to get the credit... And if you miss the second semester, you have to wait till the second semester of the next school year to get what you missed... Or take the class in a summer school program (assuming you're not in a all-year school).

The simple issue is, by missed a month or more of school, you're not completing the class... And you should have to retake the class...

Prevention would've been her not getting pregnant in the first place.

I suppose you've never made a mistake in your life?

The leave should be given and time or possibility to prove a knowledge of the same level as the rest of the students.

As long as they still complete their work and are held to the same grade requirements as the rest of the class, I see no reason not to allow it. As others have said, it would be essentially along the same lines as a prolonged absence for any other medical issue.

As long as they still complete their work and are held to the same grade requirements as the rest of the class, I see no reason not to allow it. As others have said, it would be essentially along the same lines as a prolonged absence for any other medical issue.

Yeah thats where I was going at with mine ... There should be no relaxation of the requirements at all but some time/resources given for them to show/acquire that knowledge and be tested for it

I could have sworn they were allowed to have it already..

Here I think you can, at least.

4 weeks out of school is a lot different then 4 weeks out of a job. if you miss 4 weeks out of a class chances are you missed a lot of material that you most likely need in order to understand the material you are learning when you get back.

i can see maybe giving them a chance to come back the next semester if they wish to leave for a semester, but getting attending only bits of a class is not the way to learn

and i don't care if its considered punishment for not giving it to them. if they think they are grown up enough to have sex then they should be grown up enough to accept consequences of the actions.

There is no reason why schools shouldn't allow teen mothers leave. I mean come on! This is something everybody should have no problem getting behind.


Seeing as people have already brought up the "A" word here....

If you really do care about mothers and their children, or profess to holding dear the idea of real choice. Then it would be quite hypocritical to oppose simple and cheap little things like this.

Wouldn't it be so much easier to turn the babies born to students into the free lunches that the financially disadvantaged students recieve?

Pros:
Free-er food source
Former-mother stays in school
More dead baby jokes at lunch

Cons:
Not enough dead baby jokes

This is the first thing I thought. It is not an unexcused absence if a doctor/parent note is brought in. With enough warning as you say work can be arranged at home.

I've actually arranged that for a number of students with a number of very good reasons for not coming in. With a little warning, a teacher can actually put together a packet that covers the same material that would be covered in class.

I've done this for absences of a month and a half before -- if the child has the proper medical notes and completes the work/passes the tests, no worries.

I've actually arranged that for a number of students with a number of very good reasons for not coming in. With a little warning, a teacher can actually put together a packet that covers the same material that would be covered in class.

I've done this for absences of a month and a half before -- if the child has the proper medical notes and completes the work/passes the tests, no worries.

I got mono bad ... real bad once... the only thing I had to re-take is phis-ed which a month was the max excuse with a passing grade

The rest I could make up

Wouldn't it be so much easier to turn the babies born to students into the free lunches that the financially disadvantaged students recieve?

Pros:
Free-er food source
Former-mother stays in school
More dead baby jokes at lunch

Cons:
Not enough dead baby jokes

Mr Swift would approve your modest proposal.

4 weeks out of school is a lot different then 4 weeks out of a job. if you miss 4 weeks out of a class chances are you missed a lot of material that you most likely need in order to understand the material you are learning when you get back.

Hence the reason that you would still be required to complete classwork and homework....

4 weeks out of school is a lot different then 4 weeks out of a job. if you miss 4 weeks out of a class chances are you missed a lot of material that you most likely need in order to understand the material you are learning when you get back.

i can see maybe giving them a chance to come back the next semester if they wish to leave for a semester, but getting attending only bits of a class is not the way to learn

and i don't care if its considered punishment for not giving it to them. if they think they are grown up enough to have sex then they should be grown up enough to accept consequences of the actions.

Says you, I could have easily swung all the material in anything at a high school level as long as BS busywork was cut out

That being said as long as they can take home the necessary work and show they learned the material what does it matter?

http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_7899096

Should they get maternity leave?

LOL. The US is getting a bad reputation when it comes to teen pregnancy. :p

http://ninpuchan.dreamhost.com/myart1/img/schoolgirl.jpg

They made the choices, they should accept the responsibility.

Yep, nothing like four weeks off of school to alleviate a teen from all the responsibility of a pregnancy...

"Man, having a baby when I was 16 was going to be hard, but now that I have four weeks off high school, I'm footloose and fancy free!!!"

And to all the bean counters, in what way is it cheaper to keep the kid in school another year than let them miss a month and graduate on time?

They made the choices, they should accept the responsibility.

I agree with you.

If they are that stupid to get pregnant, and that stupid to not have an abortion. then they are obviously not smart enough for school.

and where the HELL are the parents in these cases?!?!? :sniper:

is the US/Age we live in that messed up where parents dont give a damn about their own offspring?

not to go off topic but:
Take off the phrase "In God We Trust", its unconstitutional anyway.
Replace with "Help Me Because I Will Not Help Myself"

As if I'm some gods-blessed trillionare, who does't have tax to pay.

im 26, working a minimum-wage job, and still living at home with parents, fools like this make it damn hard to move out with all the tax taken out. :( :headbang:

You dont give a damn about the actions of "breeders", fine, YOU pay for it! How much money you think it takes to raise a kid for 18 years? not including medical bills, toys/books, car when they are of age, musical insterment(sp?), music tutoring and college?

you really think the new grandparents are ready for the additional burden? or do you think a 15 year old can move out, get a nice job, and support lover and kid/s with the money they earn?

more kids for adoption, great, thanks for thinking about them too!

CPS comes in, and 2 days later they are looking to be adopted.

really, you free love people forget you show a bit of fang when you smile.
-Rafe

http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_7899096

Should they get maternity leave?

Maternity/paternity leave is for workers. Students aren't workers.

I know some girls who had a child while they were studying at the university. They still followed the lectures, gave the exams, and graduated - although it took them more time than usual.

Should they get maternity leave?

Of course they should.

High School and college are two separate systems... It's fairly easy to take a semester off of college, and continue the class at a later time, the class will be there again next semester... High school is different... Most classes run year long... 11th Grade English is 11th grade english, you have to complete the year to get the credit... And if you miss the second semester, you have to wait till the second semester of the next school year to get what you missed... Or take the class in a summer school program (assuming you're not in a all-year school).

The simple issue is, by missed a month or more of school, you're not completing the class... And you should have to retake the class...

Not all high schools are termed. Mine, like many Ontario schools, divided into two semesters, with an optional third one in the summer. With this, I was able to finish grade 12 English. So, not all are confined to a separate system. After all, if high school is to prepare you for college, perhaps a similar system is needed to enhance the experience.

It would then help out students who have home troubles so they aren't forced to remain at home. They can move out, support themselves and study.

Why should one have to retake the class if they are able to study, do the assignment and pass the tests and exams? After all, class attendance in college is optional to pass. If your assignments, tests and exam all have the minimum required grade, you get passed.

They made the choices, they should accept the responsibility.

Yeah. Teenagers who get pregnant should be punished for their irresponsibility. I say not only should they be kicked out of school, their kids should not be allowed to go to school. But shouldn't be told ahead of time. When little Billy shows up for school he should be told, "sorry little Billy, you can't come here because your mommy is a whore. Stay here so that we can call her and have her come pick you up and we'll explain to her that whores and their bastards are not welcome here."

It's really the only way they'll learn. It must be because, who would know better how people will learn than a high-school.

<snip>

So, rather than allowing the to take time off school, but still finish, get a degree and a chance of a decently paid job, you're in favour of booting them out when they get pregnant and making sure they'll live of welfare for the rest of their lifes, did I understand that correctly?

Maternity/paternity leave is for workers. Students aren't workers.

I know some girls who had a child while they were studying at the university. They still followed the lectures, gave the exams, and graduated - although it took them more time than usual.

Is that while they were pregnant, or did they show up to class two days after giving birth?

Also, college students have a lot more free time than high school students. In highschool you keep almost full-time worker hours. In college three or four hours of class a day is a lot.

I agree with you.

If they are that stupid to get pregnant, and that stupid to not have an abortion. then they are obviously not smart enough for school.

and where the HELL are the parents in these cases?!?!? :sniper:

is the US/Age we live in that messed up where parents dont give a damn about their own offspring?

im 26, working a minimum-wage job, and still living at home with parents, fools like this make it damn hard to move out with all the tax taken out. :( :headbang:

really, you free love people forget you show a bit of fang when you smile.
-Rafe

Maybe if you paid a bit more attention to your education you wouldn't write sentences like the first two, and you'd have a job good enough to get you out of your parents' house.

How come the morality police always seem to be people pissed off about their own life choices looking to make others suffer worse than themselves?

Is that while they were pregnant, or did they show up to class two days after giving birth?
While.

Also, college students have a lot more free time than high school students. In highschool you keep almost full-time worker hours. In college three or four hours of class a day is a lot.
Clearly, the high school and the university you know are quite different from the ones I know.
As a high school student, I had never more than 35 hours/week and needed to study at home about 4 hours a day. University was just 20 hours/week the first year (24 hours sometimes the second year), but the need for studying at home increased a lot.

Because "abstinence only' works just fine.
Simply because students are too stupid to learn the materiel they are being taught does not mean the system is wrong.
I mean.. I fail at all mathematics, but I haven't gotten pregnant yet. Explain that if you will..:rolleyes:

If "Abstinence Only" means what I would think it does, it should not even be a policy or course. Not only is it mired in subjective, anachronistic religious twaddle, but it is also delusional; few teenagers actually abstain from sex, nor should they. Not only should it be celebrated for its own pleasures, but there is no evidence that abstinence creates anything more than generations of sexually inept, sexually embarressed and sexually frustrated adults.

http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_7899096

Should they get maternity leave?
In a sane world, this wouldn't even be up for debate. Of course they should.

I agree with you.

If they are that stupid to get pregnant, and that stupid to not have an abortion. then they are obviously not smart enough for school.

So they're stupid and they have a baby, and you think the best option is to make sure they have even LESS chance of getting educated?

Precisely whom do you think this will help?


and where the HELL are the parents in these cases?!?!? :sniper:

I don't know about you, but my parents were nowhere nearby when I was getting laid in high school.

I also know that if I'd gotten pregnant and wanted to keep the baby, my parents would have been right there next to me fighting to make sure that I could still get my education.


is the US/Age we live in that messed up where parents dont give a damn about their own offspring?

You mean like parents who decide that their daughter was a stupid slut who got herself knocked up, and therefore she doesn't deserve to go to school any more?

Or parents who pay so little attention to their own kids that they think it's reasonable to have her sitting in class two days after childbirth?


As if I'm some gods-blessed trillionare, who does't have tax to pay.

im 26, working a minimum-wage job, and still living at home with parents, fools like this make it damn hard to move out with all the tax taken out. :( :headbang:

You dont give a damn about the actions of "breeders", fine, YOU pay for it! How much money you think it takes to raise a kid for 18 years? not including medical bills, toys/books, car when they are of age, musical insterment(sp?), music tutoring and college?

As a taxpayer, do you really think you're going to spend LESS tax money if teen mothers are denied educational opportunities? Do you really think you're going to save money by making it more likely that they will be dependent on welfare or social services?


you really think the new grandparents are ready for the additional burden? or do you think a 15 year old can move out, get a nice job, and support lover and kid/s with the money they earn?

more kids for adoption, great, thanks for thinking about them too!

CPS comes in, and 2 days later they are looking to be adopted.

really, you free love people forget you show a bit of fang when you smile.
-Rafe
Yeah, we get it, you're one angry sumbitch. So angry, in fact, that you're prepared to penalize young women purely out of spite, even though it will cost YOU more in the long run and will actually increase the very problems that you are ranting about.

As long as they still complete their work and are held to the same grade requirements as the rest of the class, I see no reason not to allow it. As others have said, it would be essentially along the same lines as a prolonged absence for any other medical issue.

The big difference is that in a pregnancy, the mother can plan ahead and has a good idea of when she will be absent. That gives the school, mother, and parents plenty of time to plan for the absence. If anything, this should be easier to handle than an unexpected medical issue.

Prevention would've been her not getting pregnant in the first place.
Like I said earlier, objection only ignores reality. Let's be practical and not throw up barriers where we don't need to.

If you want to be stubborn, make it over something that matters more. Like illegal immigration or the pointless prosecution of drug users.

The big difference is that in a pregnancy, the mother can plan ahead and has a good idea of when she will be absent. That gives the school, mother, and parents plenty of time to plan for the absence. If anything, this should be easier to handle than an unexpected medical issue.
Indeed.

While I was in high school there was a minor outbreak of mono, and the school didn't have any problem working out ways for those kids to keep up with their classes. With a pregnancy, the teachers and staff could have worked with the student to set things up ahead of time; with mono, the kids were suddenly out of school for extended periods of time with little to no warning beforehand.

Indeed.

While I was in high school there was a minor outbreak of mono, and the school didn't have any problem working out ways for those kids to keep up with their classes. With a pregnancy, the teachers and staff could have worked with the student to set things up ahead of time; with mono, the kids were suddenly out of school for extended periods of time with little to no warning beforehand.

Mono? This umm was in the 70's before stereo caught on then?

Mono? This umm was in the 70's before stereo caught on then?

Yeah, the kids all started listening out of one ear.

http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_7899096

Should they get maternity leave?Yes..?
Are you saying they can't take a leave of absence on account of pregnancy?

Mono? This umm was in the 70's before stereo caught on then?

I was thinking monotheism... imagine an outbreak of that in high school. Would be funny to watch ;)

Mono? This umm was in the 70's before stereo caught on then?

... (http://www.ilovewavs.com/Effects/Music/RimShot.wav)

I was thinking monotheism... imagine an outbreak of that in high school. Would be funny to watch ;)

Heheh yeah it would have made my own school days a lot different!

... (http://www.ilovewavs.com/Effects/Music/RimShot.wav)

I thankya, I'm here all week, please, try the fish!

I thankya, I'm here all week, please, try the fish!

Does it come in a roll?

Does it come in a roll?

Brother! It comes any way you want it to!:D

Brother! It comes any way you want it to!:D

Raw... delicious maki! :)

Why not tack a preschool to the high school so mommy and baby can go to school together? ^.^

Really, I don't see why they shouldn't, as long as they're willing to still do the school work. If it's going to be "I dropped a baby, pass me" then no. But if they still do the assignments and complete the courses from home, then its fine.

The high school that I graduated from had an Advanced Health and Family Wellness class that pretty much was a daycare/preschool for the children of students. It helped to teach students that didn't have kids how to care for children and it allowed the mothers of these children to still attend school with their original classmates.

If "Abstinence Only" means what I would think it does, it should not even be a policy or course. Not only is it mired in subjective, anachronistic religious twaddle, but it is also delusional; few teenagers actually abstain from sex, nor should they. Not only should it be celebrated for its own pleasures, but there is no evidence that abstinence creates anything more than generations of sexually inept, sexually embarressed and sexually frustrated adults.

Agreed. Abstinence Only rarely seems to work simply because you're talking about sex to teenagers with raging hormones. Whether you're telling them to do it safely or not do it at all, they're still thinking about it.

I thankya, I'm here all week, please, try the fish!

I don't like fish. How's the chicken?

If "Abstinence Only" means what I would think it does...
It does.


...it should not even be a policy or course. Not only is it mired in subjective, anachronistic religious twaddle, but it is also delusional; few teenagers actually abstain from sex, nor should they.

Yep, it is twaddle.


Not only should it be celebrated for its own pleasures, but there is no evidence that abstinence creates anything more than generations of sexually inept, sexually embarressed and sexually frustrated adults.

More importantly, there is overwhelming evidence that "abstinence only" is a message that has NEVER worked. Ever. In the history of the human species.

It takes a special kind of moron to take a plan that has never worked, to force it upon people who don't want to embrace it, and then blame those same people when the plan fails.

If "Abstinence Only" means what I would think it does, it should not even be a policy or course. Not only is it mired in subjective, anachronistic religious twaddle, but it is also delusional; few teenagers actually abstain from sex, nor should they. Not only should it be celebrated for its own pleasures, but there is no evidence that abstinence creates anything more than generations of sexually inept, sexually embarressed and sexually frustrated adults.

"Abstinence only" as a lifestyle works just fine to prevent pregnancy.
Perhaps as a subject being taught and expecting teenagers to listen..not so much.

Let's face it, having a child in High School is a ridiculous personal mistake. If you can't think to use a condom you should face the consequences. At some point you have got to start expecting people to take responsibility for their own lives and not baby them for their entire lives. This is the same issue as abortion, if you can't think to use protection, you cannot simply be given a do-over. This is the real world people! (Rape= Different Situation). I know, this is an extremely weird view on abortion and such for a center-leftist/socialist/ liberal like me, but this is what I think.

Dear Lefty, The real world is overpopulated. Why is it that abortion should not be encouraged?

Dear Lefty, The real world is overpopulated. Why is it that abortion should not be encouraged?
Well maybe because it isn't...?

Well maybe because it isn't...?

An overpopulation denier are you, eh? I think that man is causing the endangering and extinction of species. If we were underpopulated or perfectly populated we would not be doing that. If any animal was messing up the ecosystem like we are we would have a year round open hunting season on them. Do you disagree with any of those statements? If you do not disagree, I think you would half to admit that we are overpopulated.

:upyours:

No they should not be allowed Maternity leave. This sort of liberal behaviour is what increases maybe encourages this sort of thing to happen all the more. These girls were obviously out of school on the day of their sex education class. Look where that left them!!

What is needed is a stern position on behalf of the schools in Denver. School is for school. Childeren have enough holidays as it is without using getting pregnant as an excuse! This is just ridiculous. What is needed is a better educational system in the first place to stop the children getting pregnant in the first place.

Caspovul

:upyours:

No they should not be allowed Maternity leave. This sort of liberal behaviour is what increases maybe encourages this sort of thing to happen all the more. These girls were obviously out of school on the day of their sex education class. Look where that left them!!

Hmm, a bit of a rocky start. You have your Family Values Talking Points mixed up. You're supposed to blame sex education for the pregnancies, because if we don't tell kids about sex then they won't have sex.


What is needed is a stern position on behalf of the schools in Denver. School is for school. Childeren have enough holidays as it is without using getting pregnant as an excuse!

Now you're more on track. Remember to emphasize that pregnancy and childbirth are endless fun, with no ill health effects or risks whatsoever, except maybe a little minor discomfort which the sluts deserve for their slutty behavior.


This is just ridiculous. What is needed is a better educational system in the first place to stop the children getting pregnant in the first place.

Solid finish. Make sure you always drive home the fact that good kids wouldn't get pregnant in the first place--because no good person ever makes a mistake--and thus any pregnant teen obviously deserves to be punished for her sin. This irrefutable logic is sure to win support from all the perfect people in the world.

"Abstinence only" as a lifestyle works just fine to prevent pregnancy.
Perhaps as a subject being taught and expecting teenagers to listen..not so much.
The thing is, "abstinence only" fails as a LIFETIME strategy.

See, the "abstinence only" movement actually expects that you will get married some day, and you'll fuck your spouse. Most abstinence-only backers are also the "pro-family" types who want everybody to be hetero and make babies.

Remember that "abstinence only" doesn't mean simply abstaining from sex. It means not only that you abstain from sex, but that you abstain from learning about sex. It means that we ONLY teach that it's good to abstain from sex. Even though, by their own admission, abstinence-only proponents expect most kids to one day get married and be having sex.

Marriage doesn't magically protect you against STDs or unplanned pregnancy. Marriage doesn't magically confer all necessary knowledge of human reproduction. Marriage doesn't magically inform you how to perform a breast exam, or how to tell if you have a genital infection, or what medical options are available if you have a problem with your reproductive system.

In short, even people who are planning to be virgins on their wedding day are still PEOPLE WHO ARE PLANNING TO HAVE SEX. Abstinence-only, as a lifestyle, means that these people will choose not to be educated about sex and reproduction, even though they will most likely be doing one or both at some point. That's why abstinence-only is shite. Abstaining from sex is one thing; abstaining from learning about sex is another.

That's why abstinence-only is shite.

No, abstinence-only is shit because it doesn't fucking work. Incidences of STDs and pregnancy between abstinence only education and more comprehensive sexual health education remain about the same.

Studies have concluded that abstience education, on average, does cause more teens to wait until marriage, and, even if tehy don't wait until marriage, the average age when those with abstience only education become sexually active is higher than those without it.

So abstience education does work, to some extent, and students exposed to it, do delay, slightly.

And those who promote abstinence only herald this as some great experiment. "Look, they're waiting!". Because to them, sex outside of marriage is an evil and horrible thing to be prevented, and if we manage to prevent that, then we're accomplishing our goal.

However us sane folks recognize that sex itself isn't the bad thing, it's all the risks that go with it. And frankly we'd prefer a 16 year old having sex and smartly using protection, than a 20 year old having sex and not using protection. The religious right looks at the 16 year old abstaining and claim victory, not recognizing that when that 16 year old finally does get to fucking, he'll have absolutly no idea how to protect himself.

Sure, we'd prefer the 16 year old wait a little while longer and then use protection, but if we had to chose, it's a no brainer

"Abstinence only" as a lifestyle works just fine to prevent pregnancy.
Perhaps as a subject being taught and expecting teenagers to listen..not so much.

abstinence only works as long as you are abstinent. once you decide to have sex, you need the information necessary to prevent pregnancy and stds.

No, abstinence-only is shit because it doesn't fucking work.

Well, that too, but I was trying to point out that abstinence only doesn't even do what they are claiming it does. In other words, even IF you are willing to accept (for the sake of argument) that all teens would be better off not having sex and that abstinence-only education achieves this, you'd STILL be forced to conclude that abstinence-only is a lousy idea in the long run.

To say no is to ignore reality -- sad as it is. The school should probably have someplace for daycare, too, if it really wants them to continue their education.

Isn't that suggesting that teenage pregnancy would be rewarded by instant daycare? I would think that there would be more pregnancies amongst schoolgirls with the baby being almost like a fashion accessory.

Plus, you'd have to fit the bill for this child's carer.

Isn't that suggesting that teenage pregnancy would be rewarded by instant daycare? I would think that there would be more pregnancies amongst schoolgirls with the baby being almost like a fashion accessory.

Plus, you'd have to fit the bill for this child's carer.

Nope, but it is making sure that those of a school age that do have kids are catered for. That seems fair does it not?

Isn't that suggesting that teenage pregnancy would be rewarded by instant daycare? I would think that there would be more pregnancies amongst schoolgirls with the baby being almost like a fashion accessory.

Plus, you'd have to fit the bill for this child's carer.

They could reduce the cost by tying it to a college/university programme that focuses on early childhood education. It would allow those training to work with young children while they learn. Nothing like hands on experience.

To reduce the likelihood of abuse of the system, maybe include in the deal a clause that the mother has to maintain a certain grade average of say maybe 75% in order to qualify. It sets the bar high enough that she has to keep up with her studies but doesn't leave it out of reach, and by keeping that grade average she is prepared to deal with any exams needed for the post-secondary education.

She then has to go on to get a post-secondary education in any field or vocation. As long as she has a degree in something, otherwise she has to repay in some way.

Isn't that suggesting that teenage pregnancy would be rewarded by instant daycare? I would think that there would be more pregnancies amongst schoolgirls with the baby being almost like a fashion accessory.

Hmm, what a good point! When I was a teenager, I didn't want to have a baby because I didn't want the pain and risk of pregnancy and childbirth followed by years of diaper changing, spit-up wiping, nights at home with the baby instead of getting to go out and live my life, having to give up a normal college life, and being responsible for bringing up a human being for 18 years.

But if there had been free daycare, why, I'd have gone out and gotten pregnant in a heartbeat! After all, having free daycare from 8am to 3pm each day would totally take away all the possible down-sides to being a teen mom!

It's a good thing that grown-ups were smart enough to make sure daycare wasn't available, otherwise moron teen girls like me would have been preggers all over the place!


Plus, you'd have to fit the bill for this child's carer.
Yeah, because if you provide daycare for babies, you have to pay for a child's career...

Or something...

Isn’t that suggesting that teenage pregnancy would be rewarded by instant daycare? I would think that there would be more pregnancies amongst schoolgirls with the baby being almost like a fashion accessory.
Yeah, because there’s nothing teenage girls want more than massive restrictions on their social life and/or education, spending most their money on baby products and being up to their elbows in dirty nappies.

Daycare isn’t a reward, it’s a needed service.

Not all high schools are termed. Mine, like many Ontario schools, divided into two semesters, with an optional third one in the summer. With this, I was able to finish grade 12 English. So, not all are confined to a separate system. After all, if high school is to prepare you for college, perhaps a similar system is needed to enhance the experience.

It would then help out students who have home troubles so they aren't forced to remain at home. They can move out, support themselves and study.

Why should one have to retake the class if they are able to study, do the assignment and pass the tests and exams? After all, class attendance in college is optional to pass. If your assignments, tests and exam all have the minimum required grade, you get passed.

A similar system would be good... But US schools are so underfunded, and overworked that they have moved further and further from that type of system... And it's not going to change any time soon, unfortunately. People want schooling for their kids, but won't/can't pay for it; and the ones that do, want their money pouring into the schools their kids attend... When the rich side of town gets new atheletic centers by "voting" away budget money for the poorer side of town, you know the system is broke, and it's not going to be fized any time soon.

do y'all not have any provision for students who have a temporary condition that keeps them at home or in the hospital for a month?

Great use of the stereotypical "y'all"! I obviously live on a farm (600 acres)!

Yes, however, given the fact that the question was related to providing "maternity leave", the alternative would be to provide a suitable environment for the pregnant teen to continue to thrive in the educational system. This could be provided at home, though social separation may be difficult, or in school. In cases such as mononucleosis, etc., this is always a necessity. However, I believe most teenagers would be better served to continue at the facility while possible.

The suggestion that only "sluts" or "promiscuous" students are involved is ignorant/archaic at best. The idea that these students become pregnant via accident is also sheltered, possibly more lacking of enlightenment than the idea of teaching abstinence. Are we really suggesting that children, age 14-18, in this environment, are not aware of the concerns related to sexual intercourse? I was (I'm 42), and I am not aware of any of my classmates that were not. This includes the risk of pregnancy, social disease, etc. Now, if the implication is that there is education capable of deterring this action, we should definitely be teaching it to children, as well as deadbeat parents worldwide. I'd even donate to the cause! But as a 15 year old guy, I believe the theory of risk/reward would still have prevailed.

Having previously worked mentoring troubled youth, the truth is that some students choose to begin experiencing their adult lives early, knowing the risk. Pregnancy, smoking, drugs, alcohol, etc. are all concerns. The choice is to provide these teenagers with an environment to facilitate learning and personal growth during this time, or to encourage them to leave the educational system, and enter the work force.

Understandably, some schools, such as OKC, may not be able to provide a controlled environment on campus to facilitate this, but where it is possible, and safe for the mother, I believe it to be the best alternative.

Are we really suggesting that children, age 14-18, in this environment, are not aware of the concerns related to sexual intercourse? I was (I'm 42), and I am not aware of any of my classmates that were not. This includes the risk of pregnancy, social disease, etc.

I'm 27. I had all sorts of high school classmates who didn't have a good understanding of those concerns. I knew girls who thought you couldn't possibly get pregnant if you were menstruating, so they felt comfortable foregoing a condom during that time of the month. I knew people who thought that only dirty people or overly promiscuous people ever got STIs, and that they thus didn't really have to be all that careful with a steady.

And abstinence-only education makes these problems even bigger. Not only do most such programs often include inaccuracies, but they don't teach all of those concerns you're talking about, except as a scare tactic. The actual risks - and the fact that some behavior is riskier than other behavior - aren't part of the curriculum. In the end, this means that students in abstinence-only education will likely wait longer before their first sexual encounter. However, when they do become sexually active, they are much more likely to engage in particularly risky sexual activity.

I wonder why Christian Conservatives are so keen on abstinence education... After all, it didn't work for Jesus' mother, Mary.

Great use of the stereotypical "y'all"! I obviously live on a farm (600 acres)!

Yes, however, given the fact that the question was related to providing "maternity leave", the alternative would be to provide a suitable environment for the pregnant teen to continue to thrive in the educational system. This could be provided at home, though social separation may be difficult, or in school. In cases such as mononucleosis, etc., this is always a necessity. However, I believe most teenagers would be better served to continue at the facility while possible.

The suggestion that only "sluts" or "promiscuous" students are involved is ignorant/archaic at best. The idea that these students become pregnant via accident is also sheltered, possibly more lacking of enlightenment than the idea of teaching abstinence. Are we really suggesting that children, age 14-18, in this environment, are not aware of the concerns related to sexual intercourse? I was (I'm 42), and I am not aware of any of my classmates that were not. This includes the risk of pregnancy, social disease, etc. Now, if the implication is that there is education capable of deterring this action, we should definitely be teaching it to children, as well as deadbeat parents worldwide. I'd even donate to the cause! But as a 15 year old guy, I believe the theory of risk/reward would still have prevailed.

Having previously worked mentoring troubled youth, the truth is that some students choose to begin experiencing their adult lives early, knowing the risk. Pregnancy, smoking, drugs, alcohol, etc. are all concerns. The choice is to provide these teenagers with an environment to facilitate learning and personal growth during this time, or to encourage them to leave the educational system, and enter the work force.

Understandably, some schools, such as OKC, may not be able to provide a controlled environment on campus to facilitate this, but where it is possible, and safe for the mother, I believe it to be the best alternative.

i used "y'all" because i felt that "you" put too much of the question on you particulary instead of on the educational system you work with.

and yes, highschool parents do pose a much bigger problem than the kid with mono or leukemia does. they will have the responsiblity for a baby for entire rest of their time in highschool. its far more of a question than just a months maternity leave.

so a more long term integrated approach to highschool parenting really is necessary if you are going to keep the parents in school and their babies thriving. its a matter of HOW to do that rather than should it be done. no one benefits from forcing teen parents out of school to become a burden on society.

of course teen mothers do not all come from the ranks of the "sluts". they mostly come from the ranks of girls who have steady boyfriends and a steady(ish) sex life with that boyfriend.

teens are notorious for denial. they wont flunk algebra. they wont get caught drinking. they wont ever get into an car accident. they wont get pregnant. they engage in all sorts of risky behavior. they know that sex leads to babies but they dont think it will happen to them.

by way of example, a friend of mine sugggested to her daughter that now that she had a boyfriend she should get on the pill. the girl refused, denying that she was having sex or would ever have sex with the boy. she didnt want her mother to think she was a slut. she ended up having a baby as a senior in highschool. (she didnt live to see her baby turn 1, she died in a car accident where she was not wearing a seat belt.)