NationStates Jolt Archive

So, I was reading the "careers without a degree" thread and it seems that most NSers are rather sceptical as to the benefits of at least some degrees. I'm going off to Uni next year and I'm just thinking about what I could do afterwards.

I will be studying Philosophy and Politics (BA) at Bristol Uni and thought of my possibilities afterwards as being either joining the diplomatic corps or doing an ITT and becoming a teacher, working my way through a PhD and then moving on to University professor.

So I would ask of you to evaluate the worth of my plans and give a best case scenario (if you can see better things into my future than I can) and a worst case scenario.

PS: Inputs from people with direct experience of this degree and University would be most welcome, but others would also be appreciated

PPS: Can someone explain to me why there's 15 people/place on this particular course? I really enjoy both those subjects, but what other career options could it give that make it so desirable?

In the UK, as long as you have an academic degree (like yours), it's fairly easy to get a good high paying job, as long as you are also a somewhat employable person. A good degree is basically a foot in the door in most of Europe, but in other countries this differs somewhat. However, if you're really desperate to get a good career, I would recommend either doing a hard science or mathematics course, or a course with good transferable skills like economics or other joint honours that include joint economics (popular ones are history and economics or politics and economics). Unless it's too late to change your course.

PPS: The course is very interesting to a lot of people I would imagine, and is probably popular for people wanting to get into politics.

Can't really do Economics because I haven't done an A-Level in Maths. Not that I couldn't get an A in it in the 2 terms left of my gap year but I really should be getting a job:D (plus I'm pretty much done with the whole UCAS for this year, with the course I mentioned being the best Unconditional I've received)

Can't really do Economics because I haven't done an A-Level in Maths. Not that I couldn't get an A in it in the 2 terms left of my gap year but I really should be getting a job:D (plus I'm pretty much done with the whole UCAS for this year, with the course I mentioned being the best Unconditional I've received)

Well, you don't need maths to do economics impart from in the top top universities, but that's irrelevant anyway if you're done with UCAS. What were your other offers, were they all the same course?

The only other place to offer me a place was Exeter for International Relations.

Oxford rejected me after interviews, Warwick rejected me for applying at Oxford for the same course and LSE rejected me for an inappropriate personal statement (it was an International Relations and History BSc, but my personal statement was very heavy on politics and the course is organised by the History department:))

Darn, I thought this thread was for tarot card reading and feng shui. :(

No flaming in my thread:mad:

And no flammable topics either;)

Darn, I thought this thread was for tarot card reading and feng shui. :(

Darn, I thought this thread was for tarot card reading and feng shui. :(

So did I

The only other place to offer me a place was Exeter for International Relations.

Oxford rejected me after interviews, Warwick rejected me for applying at Oxford for the same course and LSE rejected me for an inappropriate personal statement (it was an International Relations and History BSc, but my personal statement was very heavy on politics and the course is organised by the History department:))

Well, international relations is also a very good degree, especially if you want to be a diplomat. It may be slightly more applied, making it more useful in later life, but it's not as academic, making it a slightly weaker degree. It's a tough choice I guess, but you've probably picked the best degree out of the two.

Can you switch to Law?

It complements politics and/or philosophy but the real reason is that it opens your job prospects. Any employer is impressed by a law degree regardless of whether you enjoyed or excelled at it.

It just looks good.

I should know, despite not enjoying it, and only studying it because I couldn't study straight politics, it has proven immensely useful on my CV.

Given that, simply having a degree, given it's a reasonable subject is an entry, beyond a certain point you'll need an MBA these days.

I wouldn't worry about your 'career', it's not like people work at one company and retire at 65 with a golden watch anymore anyway - time will tell as to what you end up doing and you'll probably end up doing a variety of industries.

Well, international relations is also a very good degree, especially if you want to be a diplomat. It may be slightly more applied, making it more useful in later life, but it's not as academic, making it a slightly weaker degree. It's a tough choice I guess, but you've probably picked the best degree out of the two.

There is also the fact that Bristol is of European calibre whereas Exeter less so, and the fact that you could easily specialise in International Relations if you are doing Politics or indeed do a postgraduate in IR.

Also if I'd chose IR then I would be limiting my choices of a career while P&P has more transferable skills and would give me a wider choice of postgraduates as well.

Can you switch to Law?

It complements politics and/or philosophy but the real reason is that it opens your job prospects. Any employer is impressed by a law degree regardless of whether you enjoyed or excelled at it.

It just looks good.

I should know, despite not enjoying it, and only studying it because I couldn't study straight politics, it has proven immensely useful on my CV.

Given that, simply having a degree, given it's a reasonable subject is an entry, beyond a certain point you'll need an MBA these days.

I wouldn't worry about your 'career', it's not like people work at one company and retire at 65 with a golden watch anymore anyway - time will tell as to what you end up doing and you'll probably end up doing a variety of industries.

I was thinking of doing a Law degree afterwards, maybe at the OU. And I agree completely with what you've said, and have thought about it, but Law just isn't my first choice of a subject and I think it would be a bit late to change now anyway. If only this was Cambridge and I could just take a Law tripos along the way:rolleyes:

........ LSE rejected me for an inappropriate personal statement (it was an International Relations and History BSc, but my personal statement was very heavy on politics and the course is organised by the History department:))

My curiosity has lurched out from under its rock. Would you elaborate on what this statement was?

My curiosity has lurched out from under its rock. Would you elaborate on what this statement was?

Just like it says on the tin - the statement concentrated on his political thoughts for a department dominated by historians - he's implying that if he wrote more on his views and love of history, he'd have stood a better chance.

It's not that he wrote a polemic on the need to abolish the welfare state, close the borders and bring back eugenics, for example, which might not go down too well at LSE.

Bristol is an excellent university, you'll be fine. It's only at lesser institutions that you really need to pick a marketable degree. Don't worry about it too much now, what you want to do now might not be what you want to do when you're 23.

Bristol is an excellent university, you'll be fine. It's only at lesser institutions that you really need to pick a marketable degree. Don't worry about it too much now, what you want to do now might not be what you want to do when you're 23.

I realise that, but I'd still quite like to do something in the spirit of the course, so I was wondering what other options for a career I have.

I realise that, but I'd still quite like to do something in the spirit of the course, so I was wondering what other options for a career I have.

Well, unfortunately there isn't much call for professional philosophers, historians etc. Even in politics there aren't all that many politicians.

If you want to stick with what you're doing you normally have to stay in academia. You could look into political research though.

In reality, most people I know went on to do something like a Law/Accountancy conversion course.

Just like it says on the tin - the statement concentrated on his political thoughts for a department dominated by historians - he's implying that if he wrote more on his views and love of history, he'd have stood a better chance.

It's not that he wrote a polemic on the need to abolish the welfare state, close the borders and bring back eugenics, for example, which might not go down too well at LSE.


Aha. No comedy gold here then so.....

Just like it says on the tin - the statement concentrated on his political thoughts for a department dominated by historians - he's implying that if he wrote more on his views and love of history, he'd have stood a better chance.

It's not that he wrote a polemic on the need to abolish the welfare state, close the borders and bring back eugenics, for example, which might not go down too well at LSE.

Very odd indeed, for I am for all intents and purposes a socialist (economically left-wing), very much for Globalisation and the demise of nationalism and nation states, and completely abhor the thought of eugenics.

Well, unfortunately there isn't much call for professional philosophers, historians etc. Even in politics there aren't all that many politicians.

If you want to stick with what you're doing you normally have to stay in academia. You could look into political research though.

In reality, most people I know went on to do something like a Law/Accountancy conversion course.

What would be this conversion course you speak of?:confused:

What would be this conversion course you speak of?:confused:

law (http://www.get.hobsons.co.uk/advice/law-conversion-course)

Aha. No comedy gold here then so.....

Alas no :(

Very odd indeed, for I am for all intents and purposes a socialist (economically left-wing), very much for Globalisation and the demise of nationalism and nation states, and completely abhor the thought of eugenics.

How did you end up on the right-wing fascist domain that is NSG then?

Be warned, these people are rottweilers, or as I call them...rightweilers...ah ha ha, my talents are wasted here.

:mad:

How did you end up on the right-wing fascist domain that is NSG then?

Be warned, these people are rottweilers, or as I call them...rightweilers...ah ha ha, my talents are wasted here.

:mad:

I guess my shift to the left(ish) is rather more recent. I used to be rather more libertarian. But really I think most people here have good reasons for believing what they do, and the number of so called rightweilers is rather small and very easily marginalised by the more centrist/moderate majority.

I really do enjoy it around here. Everything from debates to childish fights, and I think I might yet be around for a while;)

law (http://www.get.hobsons.co.uk/advice/law-conversion-course)

Very interesting... Thank you:D

why not go into politics? not as a holder of public office *shudder* but as one of the background lackeys who understand how politics works so they hook on to some up and coming guy with charm and follow him to the primeministership?

In the UK, as long as you have an academic degree (like yours), it's fairly easy to get a good high paying job, as long as you are also a somewhat employable person. A good degree is basically a foot in the door in most of Europe, but in other countries this differs somewhat. However, if you're really desperate to get a good career, I would recommend either doing a hard science or mathematics course, or a course with good transferable skills like economics or other joint honours that include joint economics (popular ones are history and economics or politics and economics). Unless it's too late to change your course.

PPS: The course is very interesting to a lot of people I would imagine, and is probably popular for people wanting to get into politics.

Would Biology specialising in zoology/marine biology at Durham or St.Andrews count as a hard science course?

why not go into politics? not as a holder of public office *shudder* but as one of the background lackeys who understand how politics works so they hook on to some up and coming guy with charm and follow him to the primeministership?

Well, I'm not born in the Commonwealth so I couldn't run for office even if I wanted to, but a Kissinger sort of position would appeal to me. The only problem is that I have this uncontrollable urge to stay as far as possible from political parties, so I really don't know how that'd work. I will keep this option in mind though:D

So, I was reading the "careers without a degree" thread and it seems that most NSers are rather sceptical as to the benefits of at least some degrees. I'm going off to Uni next year and I'm just thinking about what I could do afterwards.

I will be studying Philosophy and Politics (BA) at Bristol Uni and thought of my possibilities afterwards as being either joining the diplomatic corps or doing an ITT and becoming a teacher, working my way through a PhD and then moving on to University professor.

So I would ask of you to evaluate the worth of my plans and give a best case scenario (if you can see better things into my future than I can) and a worst case scenario.

PS: Inputs from people with direct experience of this degree and University would be most welcome, but others would also be appreciated

PPS: Can someone explain to me why there's 15 people/place on this particular course? I really enjoy both those subjects, but what other career options could it give that make it so desirable?

Philosophy is a crap degree...you might as well doing performing arts...I predict you working in Burger King and after 15 years of service working your way up to supervisor of the fries section ;) hahaha!

Philosophy is a crap degree...you might as well doing performing arts...I predict you working in Burger King and after 15 years of service working your way up to supervisor of the fries section ;) hahaha!

This is precisely why I added the PS. This is not the USA. And we are talking about Bristol.:)

This is precisely why I added the PS. This is not the USA. And we are talking about Bristol.:)

hehe...I know...im only playing...I got a 2.1 in english at manchester met...fat lot of good it done me though...just a world of debt haha :cool:

hehe...I know...im only playing...I got a 2.1 in english at manchester met...fat lot of good it done me though...just a world of debt haha :cool:

Well it is English... at the Met...

Where are you working now? I'd imagine journalism to be a good career after English. Or even a FE teacher.

Well, I'm not born in the Commonwealth so I couldn't run for office even if I wanted to, but a Kissinger sort of position would appeal to me. The only problem is that I have this uncontrollable urge to stay as far as possible from political parties, so I really don't know how that'd work. I will keep this option in mind though:D

public office is a bad idea unless you are an egomaniac. but the behind the scenes guys have a more secure berth plus no one cares what religion you are, how many times you have been married, if you are gay, if you (or your girlfriend) have had an abortion or any other personal issue. all you have to do is not be a convicted felon or associated with such.

i told my son that he could have a sure career in politics if he joined the republican party. (spanish surname in a party that desperately likes to pretend that it doesnt hate hispanics so he could be the token hispanic.) unfortunately he despises pretty much everything the republican party stands for.

Philosophy is a crap degree...you might as well doing performing arts...I predict you working in Burger King and after 15 years of service working your way up to supervisor of the fries section ;) hahaha!
Actually, I've heard that Philosophy graduates are getting great jobs these days in the UK because of the transferable skills they learn. It's just hearsay, but I was rather surprised when I heard they were in such high demand.

Well it is English... at the Met...

Where are you working now? I'd imagine journalism to be a good career after English. Or even a FE teacher.

I'm actually a club promoter...which I stumbled into from my DJing...nothing to do with my degree...though I admit my degree might come in useful after I decide to grow up ;-)

So, I was reading the "careers without a degree" thread and it seems that most NSers are rather sceptical as to the benefits of at least some degrees. I'm going off to Uni next year and I'm just thinking about what I could do afterwards.

I will be studying Philosophy and Politics (BA) at Bristol Uni and thought of my possibilities afterwards as being either joining the diplomatic corps or doing an ITT and becoming a teacher, working my way through a PhD and then moving on to University professor.

So I would ask of you to evaluate the worth of my plans and give a best case scenario (if you can see better things into my future than I can) and a worst case scenario.

PS: Inputs from people with direct experience of this degree and University would be most welcome, but others would also be appreciated

PPS: Can someone explain to me why there's 15 people/place on this particular course? I really enjoy both those subjects, but what other career options could it give that make it so desirable?

A BA is not a vocational certificate. A degree in engineering or something like that is different, but most degrees aren't to show that you're trained, they're to show that you've got the discipline get an education, and to show that you're smart enough to tell your ass from your elbow.

The first job I got after graduating with a degree in History was assistant manager at a lumber yard.

public office is a bad idea unless you are an egomaniac. but the behind the scenes guys have a more secure berth plus no one cares what religion you are, how many times you have been married, if you are gay, if you (or your girlfriend) have had an abortion or any other personal issue. all you have to do is not be a convicted felon or associated with such.

i told my son that he could have a sure career in politics if he joined the republican party. (spanish surname in a party that desperately likes to pretend that it doesnt hate hispanics so he could be the token hispanic.) unfortunately he despises pretty much everything the republican party stands for.

Lib-Dem for the win for me then? lol

Actually, I've heard that Philosophy graduates are getting great jobs these days in the UK because of the transferable skills they learn. It's just hearsay, but I was rather surprised when I heard they were in such high demand.

Something to do with clearness of thought and being able to marshal arguments through anyone. Kinda makes sense but I couldn't tell you it is actual fact either.

A BA is not a vocational certificate. A degree in engineering or something like that is different, but most degrees aren't to show that you're trained, they're to show that you've got the discipline get an education, and to show that you're smart enough to tell your ass from your elbow.

The first job I got after graduating with a degree in History was assistant manager at a lumber yard.

:( I pretty much dread having to go into industry. But there's where the money are.

I'm actually a club promoter...which I stumbled into from my DJing...nothing to do with my degree...though I admit my degree might come in useful after I decide to grow up ;-)

Well technically you are working in advertising so it is pretty much grown up. Pretty cool not seeing it as such and enjoying you job. If only I was to end up so lucky.

:( I pretty much dread having to go into industry. But there's where the money are.

It's not really dread if you just throw up your arms and give in with pound signs in your eyes

It's not really dread if you just throw up your arms and give in with pound signs in your eyes

Well I'd also have to like what I'm doing. I know, I know, I simply want too much from life;)

Would Biology specialising in zoology/marine biology at Durham or St.Andrews count as a hard science course?

Probably, Durham and St.Andrews are amazing universities so it probably doesn't matter too much anyway. Is your degree a B.Sc or B.A?

Well I'd also have to like what I'm doing. I know, I know, I simply want too much from life;)

You can like what you're doing and earn lots of money. You just either have to be supremely talented or a dork.

You can like what you're doing and earn lots of money. You just either have to be supremely talented or a dork.

Oh good, seeing as I am both:D

Probably, Durham and St.Andrews are amazing universities so it probably doesn't matter too much anyway. Is your degree a B.Sc or B.A?

I think B.Sc. Bacheleour of Science? Out of interest, if a course includes the option of honours, what does that mean?