NationStates Jolt Archive

Fuck off, you don't get a poll. You're all spoilt and just vote "Myrth" anyway. Now, on with business. We all have morals, but its more a sliding scale sort of things. On one hand we have the Amish and on the other we have people who suck off barnyard animals on the Internet.

Well there are probably greater extremes, but putting the Amish and bestiality in the same sentence was an opportunity to good to pass up.

So, here's our Sliding Scale of Moral Depravity; 1 is the lowest and 10 is the highest. If you would have climbed on board the Mayflower and called your own mother a witch because seemed to take too much pride in hymns on a Sunday service, then you can have a 10 1/2.

Still not sure? Sister Mary will help
http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:tNYI80lEvyBLQM:http://www.rootsweb.com/~pasulliv/sullivancountyfolk/scf1/images/SisterMaryDevota.jpg

Nonsense Scale:
by Damor & Rotovia
1 Mother Theresa
2
3
4 Prostitute auctioning sex for charity
5
6
7 Brownies without chocolate-chip flavour
8
9
10 Adolf Hitler

RUBIC SCALE:
by Intangelon

1 As pure as humanly possible without being cloistered.
2 Parking tickets/library fines, all paid and accounted for, "white lies"/socially acceptable deception.
3 Speeding tickets/minor inconsideration (cutting in line, nonviolent bullying, etc.), shoplifting, with fines paid when pressed &/or with remorse.
4 Petty larceny/vandalism, "justifiable" deception, remorseless bullying of any kind.
5 Perjury (or other widespread deception), using violence to get what you want (including sex) without resorting to anything more than assault & battery, grand larceny, with remorse.
6 Use of violence including weapons without resorting to attempted murder, or 7/8 with remorse.
7 Extortion/grand larceny without defense or remorse, wrongful imprisonment/kidnapping.
8 Fraud, arson/large-scale deception or property destruction with widespread damage without defense or remorse or 9 with remorse/defense (except rape).
9 Murder, rape, torture without defense or remorse.
10 Terrorism/Genocide without defense or remorse.

3.14159

:)

morals are relative.

Me?

I'd say "fairly".

I'm sorry you're so angry. The faith issue has pissed me off more times than I can count. Is there any special need to take it out on NSG?

I'd call myself a five, give or take one. There are some things I just consider to be essentially wrong, out of whack, distorted - among those things being genocide, murder, torture, sexual assault and other things of that caliber. However, information crimes I consider not to be, per se, crimes unless they deprive someone of their livelihood.

I'm sorry you're so angry. The faith issue has pissed me off more times than I can count. Is there any special need to take it out on NSG?
Different thread. If you have a comment on that, make it there. If you want to discuss my anger, feel free to start a thread on that.

Fairly moral I guess, or at least ethical. :)

Okay, then. You need a rubric for your sliding scale. Just labeling the ends of your scale leaves too much to interpret.

Okay, then. You need a rubric for your sliding scale. Just labeling the ends of your scale leaves too much to interpret.

Who wants to help me fill the scale?

May I choose which set of morals to use myself ? Cause then the 10 1/2 would be a 1 ;)

May I choose which set of morals to use myself ? Cause then the 10 1/2 would be a 1 ;)

lol

I haven't killed my downstairs neighbour yet. And consider the anguish he causes me that makes me pretty darned moral ;)

Who wants to help me fill the scale?
I feel somewhere on the scale we need a prostitute auctioning sex for charity (http://www.reuters.com/article/oddlyEnoughNews/idUSEIC87423520071129?feedType=RSS&feedName=oddlyEnoughNews). Let's say 5 or 4; it may be loose morals, but they're fairly good.

I feel somewhere on the scale we need a prostitute auctioning sex for charity (http://www.reuters.com/article/oddlyEnoughNews/idUSEIC87423520071129?feedType=RSS&feedName=oddlyEnoughNews). Let's say 5 or 4; it may be loose morals, but they're fairly good.

Immoral activities? Yeow, the only thing immoral would be if she was a nun, 'cause she's hot!

The hooker made it on the scale. What about someone who runs over their neighbour, but they're reasoble certain their neighbour was killing local schoolgirls?

Who wants to help me fill the scale?

Here's a first draft attempt. I realize it sucks. Have at it.

1 As pure as humanly possible without being cloistered.
2 Parking tickets/library fines, all paid and accounted for, "white lies"/socially acceptable deception.
3 Speeding tickets/minor inconsideration (cutting in line, nonviolent bullying, etc.), shoplifting, with fines paid when pressed &/or with remorse.
4 Petty larceny/vandalism, "justifiable" deception, remorseless bullying of any kind.
5 Perjury (or other widespread deception), using violence to get what you want (including sex) without resorting to anything more than assault & battery, grand larceny, with remorse.
6 Use of violence including weapons without resorting to attempted murder, or 7/8 with remorse.
7 Extortion/grand larceny without defense or remorse, wrongful imprisonment/kidnapping.
8 Fraud, arson/large-scale deception or property destruction with widespread damage without defense or remorse or 9 with remorse/defense (except rape).
9 Murder, rape, torture without defense or remorse.
10 Terrorism/Genocide without defense or remorse.

I swapped out Hitler and Mother Teresa because I'm not sure you can use people in a rubric; they're far too complex. Besides, Mother Teresa isn't exactly a paragon of virtue (consult the Penn & Teller Bullshit! episode on her, the Dalai Lama and Gandhi if you need the arguments).

Here's a first draft attempt. I realize it sucks. Have at it.

1 As pure as humanly possible without being cloistered.
2 Parking tickets/library fines, all paid and accounted for, "white lies"/socially acceptable deception.
3 Speeding tickets/minor inconsideration (cutting in line, nonviolent bullying, etc.), shoplifting, with fines paid when pressed &/or with remorse.
4 Petty larceny/vandalism, "justifiable" deception, remorseless bullying of any kind.
5 Perjury (or other widespread deception), using violence to get what you want (including sex) without resorting to anything more than assault & battery, grand larceny, with remorse.
6 Use of violence including weapons without resorting to attempted murder, or 7/8 with remorse.
7 Extortion/grand larceny without defense or remorse, wrongful imprisonment/kidnapping.
8 Fraud, arson/large-scale deception or property destruction with widespread damage without defense or remorse or 9 with remorse/defense (except rape).
9 Murder, rape, torture without defense or remorse.
10 Terrorism/Genocide without defense or remorse.

I swapped out Hitler and Mother Teresa because I'm not sure you can use people in a rubric; they're far too complex. Besides, Mother Teresa isn't exactly a paragon of virtue (consult the Penn & Teller Bullshit! episode on her, the Dalai Lama and Gandhi if you need the arguments).

Great episode actually, I forgot about.

PROPOSED SCALE:
by Intangelon

1 As pure as humanly possible without being cloistered.
2 Parking tickets/library fines, all paid and accounted for, "white lies"/socially acceptable deception.
3 Speeding tickets/minor inconsideration (cutting in line, nonviolent bullying, etc.), shoplifting, with fines paid when pressed &/or with remorse.
4 Petty larceny/vandalism, "justifiable" deception, remorseless bullying of any kind.
5 Perjury (or other widespread deception), using violence to get what you want (including sex) without resorting to anything more than assault & battery, grand larceny, with remorse.
6 Use of violence including weapons without resorting to attempted murder, or 7/8 with remorse.
7 Extortion/grand larceny without defense or remorse, wrongful imprisonment/kidnapping.
8 Fraud, arson/large-scale deception or property destruction with widespread damage without defense or remorse or 9 with remorse/defense (except rape).
9 Murder, rape, torture without defense or remorse.
10 Terrorism/Genocide without defense or remorse.

Well there are probably greater extremes, but putting the Amish and bestiality in the same sentence was an opportunity to good to pass up.


No, no, no. The sexual deviance of the Amish is incest, not bestiality.

A rubric for something so vast as morality is truly difficult and requires you to think of things not on my scale that equate to those things that are on my scale. Perhaps a separate rubric for some segments of human behavior?

One for each of the Seven Deadly Sins, perhaps?

No, no, no. The sexual deviance of the Amish is incest, not bestiality.

You forgot about the whole D/S thing.

I've leave it to you guys to work out. I'm off to bed.

I'm really not sure, my morality is self-made and doesn't fit anywhere.

- I'm a peacemaker, but if someone steps too far into my own space, I will attack back with equal force

- There is nothing sexual that I won't try, but I would never pressure someone else into doing it, or do anything with an underage or unconsenting partner.

- I'm agnostic, I'm very tolerant of any religion but very intolerant when it starts to affect the way I live

- I use profanity very often but I never do in front of young children or elderly people

- I believe intelligence is a virtue and stupidity (active ignorance) is a sin

- I lie to others only when I'm sure it makes things easier for everyone

- I have rarely and likely never felt real guilt, but conversely I don't think I have done something bad enough to feel that way

I don't know where the hell I am. By my own standards I'd give myself a 2, by society's I'm probably a 7

I'm a jan-u-wine non-prick in real life, so I guess that makes me pretty moral. I'm generally not rude to peoples' faces, and nor do I indulge in any crimes, and indeed never take advantage of drunken girls (which is A Disgrace).

So thar we go. Quite moral, I suppose.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/math/e/4/f/e4fcad0d6bc0c9476b09cb7bd3b1f92d.png

1 As pure as humanly possible without being cloistered.
2 Parking tickets/library fines, all paid and accounted for, "white lies"/socially acceptable deception.
3 Speeding tickets/minor inconsideration (cutting in line, nonviolent bullying, etc.), shoplifting, with fines paid when pressed &/or with remorse.
4 Petty larceny/vandalism, "justifiable" deception, remorseless bullying of any kind.
5 Perjury (or other widespread deception), using violence to get what you want (including sex) without resorting to anything more than assault & battery, grand larceny, with remorse.
6 Use of violence including weapons without resorting to attempted murder, or 7/8 with remorse.
7 Extortion/grand larceny without defense or remorse, wrongful imprisonment/kidnapping.
8 Fraud, arson/large-scale deception or property destruction with widespread damage without defense or remorse or 9 with remorse/defense (except rape).
9 Murder, rape, torture without defense or remorse.
10 Terrorism/Genocide without defense or remorse.

What if I invented a cure to aids or some other important disease, or solved hunger or brought peace to the middle east, wouldn't I be better than your nr 1? There must be things you can do that are better than not harming anyone. And what if I did these things but also raped nuns in my free time? I also don't see how you can put perjury or grand larceny on the same hight as rape (using violence to get sex).
All you did was listing crimes, you didn't list virtues or things you can do wrong without it being a crime etc.
I also wonder what 'being moral' means. Judging the vast amounts of philosophic articles and books written on this subject I think I'm not alone, but if you ask if we are moral then that's a very hard question to answer, especially if you don't give certain guidelines.

this is all depending on what you define as good or bad morals
everyone has a different point of view

3.14159

:)

You can use your morality to calculate the ratio of a circle's circumference to diameter!

Edit: I think it is density, whoops.

You can use your morality to calculate the ratio of a circle's circumference to diameter!

Considering LG is that a surprise?

Considering LG is that a surprise?

No, in fact what surprises me is that it makes so much sense. I was expecting something with a bit more chaos in it. Oh no, my mindset is becoming like LG's :eek:

*Flees*

You forgot about the whole D/S thing.

I thought that went without saying.

I mean, I live on the edges of "Amish Country", and my grocery stores carry food with brand names like "Yoder's". I did a frickin' unit on the Amish way back in third grade, even.

There's an old joke where I live: If you slap the word Amish on anything around here, it will sell, sell, sell! I mean, somehow in the mind of a Mid-Ohioan even "Amish Chinese Food" makes sense.

2 on the Rubic Scale, but I'm more Machiavellian in the way of leadership.

Based on that scale, I'm somewhere between 2 and 3. I fit number 2, but also frequently download music. On the other hand, most of that isn't easily available in North America.

Morals are completely relative. Even selfishness is "egotism".

I abstain from any useless pleasure; sex without the desire to reproduce, eating more then a meal or so a day, TV....But I doubt you could call this "moral".

I am practical. I would kill for practical reasons, I would die for practical reasons, I would lie for practical reasons. "Practical" meaning benefiting the society as a whole, without impinging too much on the individual.

RUBIC SCALE:
by Intangelon

1 As pure as humanly possible without being cloistered.
2 Parking tickets/library fines, all paid and accounted for, "white lies"/socially acceptable deception.
3 Speeding tickets/minor inconsideration (cutting in line, nonviolent bullying, etc.), shoplifting, with fines paid when pressed &/or with remorse.
4 Petty larceny/vandalism, "justifiable" deception, remorseless bullying of any kind.
5 Perjury (or other widespread deception), using violence to get what you want (including sex) without resorting to anything more than assault & battery, grand larceny, with remorse.
6 Use of violence including weapons without resorting to attempted murder, or 7/8 with remorse.
7 Extortion/grand larceny without defense or remorse, wrongful imprisonment/kidnapping.
8 Fraud, arson/large-scale deception or property destruction with widespread damage without defense or remorse or 9 with remorse/defense (except rape).
9 Murder, rape, torture without defense or remorse.
10 Terrorism/Genocide without defense or remorse.

What's the difference between rape at #9 and using violence to get sex at #5?

i guess i'm a 4 on intangelon's list. i have my own morals and i'm fairly good at sticking to them most of the time.

What if I invented a cure to aids or some other important disease, or solved hunger or brought peace to the middle east, wouldn't I be better than your nr 1? There must be things you can do that are better than not harming anyone. And what if I did these things but also raped nuns in my free time? I also don't see how you can put perjury or grand larceny on the same hight as rape (using violence to get sex).
All you did was listing crimes, you didn't list virtues or things you can do wrong without it being a crime etc.
I also wonder what 'being moral' means. Judging the vast amounts of philosophic articles and books written on this subject I think I'm not alone, but if you ask if we are moral then that's a very hard question to answer, especially if you don't give certain guidelines.

Fine points, all, which is why I posted this caveat (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=13321334&postcount=20), and why my scale is, as it was posted, a first draft. I don't necessarily like making the scale a scale of crimes, but it seemed like the best place to start. Perhaps a scale of benificent deeds is in order along the same lines as splitting the bad stuff into seven separate rubrics (for each of the Seven Sins)?

Also, someone far better at statistics than I could come up with a way to mesh the good list with the bad list to come up with some integer value that might mean something.

What's the difference between rape at #9 and using violence to get sex at #5?

I'm not entirely sure, but I think that at 4am I was trying to make a difference between coercion and date rape and between date rape and actual, full-on violet sexual assault.

One more time, it's a draft. Feel free to alter it.

Fine points, all, which is why I posted this caveat (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=13321334&postcount=20), and why my scale is, as it was posted, a first draft. I don't necessarily like making the scale a scale of crimes, but it seemed like the best place to start. Perhaps a scale of benificent deeds is in order along the same lines as splitting the bad stuff into seven separate rubrics (for each of the Seven Sins)?

I don't like the seven deadly sins either, because they're quite stupid tbh. To much emphasis on ordinary stuff like sex (let's face it, there's nothing wrong with sex as long as nobody gets forced or hurt and it's even good when all people having sex enjoy it). Or what's wrong with envy or pride? they're not exactly good, but I don't think they're immoral.

Personally I would suggest something like

10. My whole life is centered round bringing the maximum amount of joy, happiness to everybody.
.
.
.
.
0 I try to not hurt anybody but only because it might get me in trouble. (aka I don't do anything bad, but nothing good either, I don't really care)
.
.
.
.
-10 My whole life is centered round bringing the maximum amount of joy to my own life without regards for others. (or alternatively: I try to cause as much harm as I can, but I can't imagine people doing this, even serial rapist rape because it makes them "happy")


I'm using the word joy and happy quite liberally here because of a lack of a better alternative. If I say joy I mean stuff that have intrinsically good qualities like health or happiness, not things like for instance money which are often used to obtain health or happiness.

There probably is a lot of work on my 'list' but I thought it up in a second, hope you get what I mean.

Is kicking down a fence put up by Tesco count as vandalism?

If so, I'm probably between 3-4, although I think that is a bit harsh.

Well, it varies from day to day. Here's my own personal scale:

1) As nice and as good as humanly possible.
2)so sickeningly sweet I once gave someone diabetes just by walking by them*.
3)pleasant, but not smiling.
4)just need a vacation.
5) Silent
6) a bit of an asshole
7) looking for a fight
8) in a bar
9) somewhere unpleasant
10) Chainsaws make me smile

Today, I'm a 3.

I would put myself at about a 2.5. I've had plenty of speeding tickets, but never shoplifted.

I rank somewhere between "Parking tickets/library fines, all paid and accounted for, "white lies"/socially acceptable deception." and "As pure as humanly possible without being cloistered."

...also AOL use when you can use an alternative is at least a 5. *hides*

On your scale, 3. On the Dante's Inferno Test (http://www.4degreez.com/misc/dante-inferno-test.mv)

Second Level of Hell

You have come to a place mute of all light, where the wind bellows as the sea does in a tempest. This is the realm where the lustful spend eternity. Here, sinners are blown around endlessly by the unforgiving winds of unquenchable desire as punishment for their transgressions. The infernal hurricane that never rests hurtles the spirits onward in its rapine, whirling them round, and smiting, it molests them. You have betrayed reason at the behest of your appetite for pleasure, and so here you are doomed to remain. Cleopatra and Helen of Troy are two that share in your fate.

I'm somewhere between e and π.

On the inferno test I got Limbo. Well, I can hang out with Socrates and Virgil, so I guess it's not that bad. (My deadly sin is Sloth, and it's only about moderate.)