NationStates Jolt Archive

Yes, once again it's time for NORAD to do it's annual Track Santa. For those of you who don't know, or care, NORAD is North America Radar Air Defense. It's a network of Radars that covers USA, & Canada. It was started back during the Cold War because the popular belief was that the USSR would shoot missiles over the North Pole.

NORAD Tracks Santa was started when many people were actually Dialing a number from an ad to see where Santa was in the world. However, either due to a misprint or misread, many people dialed NORAD and NORAD did the job, and have been doing it every year since.

This is fun for the little kids like my Nephew.

http://www.noradsanta.org/

sounds like the perfect time for the commies to attack!

How inane.

*pss* Most things for kids are inane, but they find it amusing.

Go figure.

How inane.

How inane.

Santa is still checking his list just so you know ;)

Let's make sure it's Santa and not Robot Santa. If NORAD lets that death machine through then so much for Homeland Security.

*pss* Most things for kids are inane, but they find it amusing.

Go figure.

It's not just inane because it's for kids. It's also inane because supposed adults are enabling it and wasting money (which, for instance, could be spent feeding starving children, remember those - your country alone has hundreds of thousands of them) on pseudo-religious make-believe.

Let's make sure it's Santa and not Robot Santa. If NORAD lets that death machine through then so much for Homeland Security.

Your mistletoe is no match for my tow missile!

Santa is still checking his list just so you know ;)

Such luck I am impervious to threats, imaginary as well as real.

It's not just inane because it's for kids. It's also inane because supposed adults are enabling it and wasting money (which, for instance, could feed starving children, remember those?) on pseudo-religious make-believe.

Umm we're talking about NORAD, an agency that was created to defend us against missile attacks and terrorist strikes by watching over our skies, and they were created during the Cold War. We're not exactly talking about Unicef here.

It's not just inane because it's for kids. It's also inane because supposed adults are enabling it and wasting money (which, for instance, could be spent feeding starving children, remember those - your country alone has hundreds of thousands of them) on pseudo-religious make-believe.
Starving children? BOOOOOOORING

Norad tracking Santa? Fun for all the family!

Umm we're talking about NORAD, an agency that was created to defend us against missile attacks and terrorist strikes by watching over our skies, and they were created during the Cold War. We're not exactly talking about Unicef here.

The money would actually accomplish something were it to be given Unicef instead of thrown away on this ridiculous display in stupidity.

The money would actually accomplish something were it to be given Unicef instead of thrown away on this ridiculous display in stupidity.
Yes, well, it would, but it isn't. So there we go.

The money would actually accomplish something were it to be given Unicef instead of thrown away on this ridiculous display in stupidity.

Ok umm, how much money do you actually think they wasted on creating & hosting a website, have some Third Class Privates record something about Santa, and have some cheap 3D graphics of Santa flying to famous landmarks?

Ok umm, how much money do you actually think they wasted on creating & hosting a website, have some Third Class Privates record something about Santa, and have some cheap 3D graphics of Santa flying to famous landmarks?

Why even dignify his emo attention-whoring need to feel superior to everything American? The fact that this has nothing to do with politics at all yet he has to stick his nose into the thread says it all.

Yes, well, it would, but it isn't. So there we go.

Thus, inane and reprehensible.

Ok umm, how much money do you actually think they wasted on creating & hosting a website, have some Third Class Privates record something about Santa, and have some cheap 3D graphics of Santa flying to famous landmarks?

When done by the USA government? An appalling amount, no doubt, which should bring shame to anyone privileged enough to live in the West, where we apparently are so happy to rub it in that we can afford to do imbecilic things such as these when people are wallowing in poverty. For shame!

Thus, inane and reprehensible.



When done by the USA government? An appalling amount, no doubt, which should bring shame to anyone privileged enough to live in the West, where we apparently are so happy to rub it in that we can afford to do imbecilic things such as these when people are wallowing in poverty. For shame!
http://www.littlehandsmusic.com/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/Becker_Violin.jpg

The money would actually accomplish something were it to be given Unicef instead of thrown away on this ridiculous display in stupidity.

Then give everything you are planning on gifts to Unicef and ask everyone who thinks like you to do the same.
Then the ones who want to give their kids some joy and fun can do so while you can have some relief in the thought that you saved the world.

Thus, inane and reprehensible.



When done by the USA government? An appalling amount, no doubt, which should bring shame to anyone privileged enough to live in the West, where we apparently are so happy to rub it in that we can afford to do imbecilic things such as these when people are wallowing in poverty. For shame!

You don't like to have fun do you?

http://www.littlehandsmusic.com/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/Becker_Violin.jpg

That's not small enough!

http://img324.imageshack.us/img324/4695/tinyviolin5kj.jpg

That's not small enough!

http://img324.imageshack.us/img324/4695/tinyviolin5kj.jpg
Too small.

Too small.

Yea, but it's supposed to be the world's smallest violin playing the world's saddest song. *nods*

Then give everything you are planning on gifts to Unicef and ask everyone who thinks like you to do the same.

I don't celebrate Christmas because I don't believe in imaginary people like Santa and Jesus, so I plan on spending nothing on gifts - again, nothing but a display of consumerist gluttony. It makes me blush with embarrassment when I think about how one could attempt to explain it to a street child in Calcutta or Caracas.

Then the ones who want to give their kids some joy and fun can do so while you can have some relief in the thought that you saved the world.

Or, I can point out the emptiness and idiocy of this "joy" they're purchasing for themselves out of selfishness and addiction to mindless consumption. Yeah, that works for me, too.

So that's where the US DoD budget goes to: fancy Santa graphics.

I don't celebrate Christmas because I don't believe in imaginary people like Santa and Jesus, so I plan on spending nothing on gifts - again, nothing but a display of consumerist gluttony. It makes me blush with embarrassment when I think about how one could attempt to explain it to a street child.



Or, I can point out the emptiness and idiocy of this "joy" they're purchasing for themselves out of selfishness and addiction to mindless consumption. Yeah, that works for me, too.
Right... or, you could just not be a collosal prick for once ;)

Guys, just ignore Fass. By feeding his bitterness we merely remind him that he has no family to be with and love this holiday season, and as a result we're actually being really cruel.

I don't celebrate Christmas because I don't believe in imaginary people like Santa and Jesus, so I plan on spending nothing on gifts - again, nothing but a display of consumerist gluttony. It makes me blush with embarrassment when I think about how one could attempt to explain it to a street child in Calcutta or Caracas.



Or, I can point out the emptiness and idiocy of this "joy" they're purchasing for themselves out of selfishness and addiction to mindless consumption. Yeah, that works for me, too.

Then I hope that you return every single gift you ever will get for christmas. The burden of shame would be too heavy on your shoulders.

You don't like to have fun do you?

That isn't fun. That is madness with a veneer of cretinism.

Guys, just ignore Fass. By feeding his bitterness we merely remind him that he has no family to be with and love this holiday season, and as a result we're actually being really cruel.

Fass is a gay Swedish Hugo Chavez really. All they can do is rant about how everything American is evil every chance they get to people who actually respond to them.

Then I hope that you return every single gift you ever will get for christmas.

I already decline Christmas gifts and ask that money be donated to SOS Children's Villages and Save the Children instead.

The burden of shame would be too heavy on your shoulders.

Such luck I found a way not to have to carry that burden.

That isn't fun. That is madness with a veneer of cretinism.
Madness can be fun :)
Fass is a gay Swedish Hugo Chavez really. All they can do is rant about how everything American is evil every chance they get to people who actually respond to them.
Not really, no. I don't think that Fass has ever dreamed of leading a military coup before going into politics.

Not really, no. I don't think that Fass has ever dreamed of leading a military coup before going into politics.

No, he'd be whining about the military and how it conducts coups. But you do have to admit like Good Old Hugo all he can do is scream about how everything American is unmitigatedly evil no matter how trivial it really is, like NORAD doing fictional Santa tracking for Christmas amusement.

No, he'd be whining about the military and how it conducts coups. But you do have to admit like Good Old Hugo all he can do is scream about how everything American is unmitigatedly evil no matter how trivial it really is, like NORAD doing fictional Santa tracking for Christmas amusement.
I've yet to hear Chavez complain about Santra tracking :p

Guys, just ignore Fass. By feeding his bitterness we merely remind him that he has no family to be with and love this holiday season, and as a result we're actually being really cruel.

Every family has a black sheep. Fass is it for NSG. Every once in awhile it is ok to throw a turnip or two his way.

Madness can be fun :)

Insanity, not jocularity.

Not really, no. I don't think that Fass has ever dreamed of leading a military coup before going into politics.

I'd be a poor anti-militarist if I did.

I've yet to hear Chavez complain about Santra tracking :p

I am sure Chavez loves Santa. At least Santa's flare for the color "red".

Insanity, not jocularity.
Fun, not tragedy :)
I'd be a poor anti-militarist if I did.
Yes, exactly.

Every family has a black sheep. Fass is it for NSG. Every once in awhile it is ok to throw a turnip or two his way.

I'm sorry but we've always saved the turnips for Baldrick.

Such luck I am impervious to threats, imaginary as well as real.

so we will have to send you three ghosts this year?

I don't celebrate Christmas because I don't believe in imaginary people like Santa and Jesus

but Christmas is tradition and also fun

Or, I can point out the emptiness and idiocy of this "joy" they're purchasing for themselves out of selfishness and addiction to mindless consumption. Yeah, that works for me, too.

its important to show you care though, lord knows I care more about the people I buy things for otherwise I wouldn't really have any friends would I?

I already decline Christmas gifts and ask that money be donated to SOS Children's Villages and Save the Children instead.

... where you don't know where the money will end up or what the employees of such organisations do with the money or how they treat the kids.
But you have a peaceful mind because you bought yourself out of responsibility.



Such luck I found a way not to have to carry that burden.

Fun, not tragedy :)

Tell it to a child prostituting itself to Westerners for survival.

Tell it to a child prostituting itself to Westerners for survival.

What the bloody hell does that have to do with NORAD's Santa Tracker?

Tell it to a child prostituting itself to Westerners for survival.
Yes, well I can't, so I don't. There we go. I give money to UNICEF, because it's a decent cause, but I also enjoy Christmas.

... where you don't know where the money will end up or what the employees of such organisations do with the money or how they treat the kids.
But you have a peaceful mind because you bought yourself out of responsibility.

Fass is not only Nietzchean Slave Morality brought to life, he's also a walking example of Lovecraftian Horror. A small, insignificant speck in the universe who realizes that nothing he really says or does matters in the face of a vast, uncaring entity of a much bigger scope than himself. In this case, instead of Cthulhu and the Great Old Ones, it's the United States of America. Being unable to affect any real geopolitical changes on his own, the sole comfort he gets out of his bitter life is posting anti-American pissrants on NSG threads every chance he gets.

What the bloody hell does that have to do with NORAD's Santa Tracker?
If the US government didn't waste $50 on tracking Santa, then there would be no child prostitution in the world.

Fact.

(note : may be lies)

... where you don't know where the money will end up or what the employees of such organisations do with the money or how they treat the kids.

Actually, I do. Both of those are overseen by the Swedish government (as they have special status) and have excellent transparency in their dealings, which are audited by outside accountants. I pick my charities very carefully, but nice try, though.

But you have a peaceful mind because you bought yourself out of responsibility.

Much more peaceful than yours deserves.

Fass is not only Nietzchean Slave Morality brought to life, he's also a walking example of Lovecraftian Horror. A small, insignificant speck in the universe who realizes that nothing he really says or does matters in the face of a vast, uncaring entity of a much bigger scope than himself. In this case, instead of Cthulhu and the Great Old Ones, it's the United States of America.
We're all a bit like that that on NSG to say the least.
Being unable to affect any real geopolitical changes on his own
You mean 'effect', before Fass says it.
the sole comfort he gets out of his bitter life is posting anti-American pissrants on NSG threads every chance he gets.
I'd imagine he also enjoys sex.

Yes, well I can't, so I don't. There we go. I give money to UNICEF, because it's a decent cause, but I also enjoy Christmas.

Enjoy your empty consumerism, then. I'm sure it's quite a light pillow of disregard you make for yourself to sleep on.

Bah, humbug!

At the risk of being attacked by you lot, I can see where Fass is coming from. If you're not a Christian, don't like the idea of imaginary characters, and despise the materialism of Chrimbo, then why see the 25th of December as different from any other day of the year? I've a close friend who feels much the same.

Anyhoo, it's only our Anglocentric selves who push such importance on the 25th. France, IIRC, celebrates on the 24th, while up here in Scotland it was Boxing Day that the big celebrations were held on, up until 25-30 years ago. Dour Presbetyrianism, you see.

For me, being brought up in a Christian household, even if I am an atheist, and with the Christmas holidays being the only time of year I see my family, the festive season is special, even with all the adverts, twee nonsense and sickening materialism all over the place.

Bah, humbug!

At the risk of being attacked by you lot, I can see where Fass is coming from. If you're not a Christian, don't like the idea of imaginary characters, and despise the materialism of Chrimbo, then why see the 25th of December as different from any other day of the year? I've a close friend who feels much the same.
Because otherwise you'll be looked upon as some bastardly miser for not being as cheery as everyone else?

Enjoy your empty consumerism, then. I'm sure it's quite a light pillow of disregard you make for yourself to sleep on.
Yes, it is.

Bah, humbug!

At the risk of being attacked by you lot, I can see where Fass is coming from. If you're not a Christian, don't like the idea of imaginary characters, and despise the materialism of Chrimbo, then why see the 25th of December as different from any other day of the year? I've a close friend who feels much the same.

Anyhoo, it's only our Anglocentric selves who push such importance on the 25th. France, IIRC, celebrates on the 24th, while up here in Scotland it was Boxing Day that the big celebrations were held on, up until 25-30 years ago. Dour Presbetyrianism, you see.

For me, being brought up in a Christian household, even if I am an atheist, and with the Christmas holidays being the only time of year I see my family, the festive season is special, even with all the adverts, twee nonsense and sickening materialism all over the place.

I'm an atheist too. I celebrate a secular version of Christmas(only called that because I don't feel like changing the name) which is basically just enjoying time with my family and exchanging gifts. It feels good, damn it, and it's been done since I was born, and after all, I wasn't ALWAYS an atheist.

Point is, though, I focus on the family get-together part. If I didn't love my family as much as I do, I might agree with you, but as I do love them...

What the bloody hell does that have to do with NORAD's Santa Tracker?It has to do with Sweden. A topic Fass most likes to talk about.

We're all a bit like that that on NSG to say the least.

Yes, but most of us have a much lighter attitude and don't get consumed by the vitriol 24/7.

You mean 'effect', before Fass says it.

Nitpicking on technicalities like spelling would be piss-poor Sophistry masquerading as a valid debate argument. Then again it's nothing new for Good Old Fass.

I'd imagine he also enjoys sex.

I don't imagine someone who actually gets a piece of ass on a regular basis being this angry and bitter.

so we will have to send you three ghosts this year?

I loathe Dickens.

but Christmas is tradition and also fun

Traditions are pointless, as is "fun" steeped in gluttony.

its important to show you care though, lord knows I care more about the people I buy things for otherwise I wouldn't really have any friends would I?

I don't know about you, but I have real friends and we have real bonds. Materialism is inconsequential to my affection for them, and they know it. They need not purchase it, nor do I need purchase theirs.

Yes, but most of us have a much lighter attitude and don't get consumed by the virtriol 24/7.
Yes, well, there we go.
Nitpicking on technicalities like spelling would be piss-poor Sophistry masquerading as a valid debate argument. Then again it's nothing new for Good Old Fass.
It's not a technicality, it's an entirely different verb, but yes.
I don't imagine someone who actually gets a piece of ass on a regular basis being this angry and bitter.
Yes, well, maybe sex makes him grumpy, who knows?

why see the 25th of December as different from any other day of the year?

you can get drunk and stuff yourself whilst receiving comments on how jolly you are?

its the only festival we have apart from new year

If Fass or anyone else wants to give their Christmas gifts to charity then I say more power to them. I think it is honorable to be honest. I give a fairly large amount to charity every year. Christmas is about giving anyway isn't it? It is also about spending time with ones family. Our family doesn't give gifts to each other minus the kids. We just all get together and enjoy the time spent. That is the true spirit of the holiday I believe. Isn't it?

I loathe Dickens.

Well, no surprise there...


Traditions are pointless, as is "fun" steeped in gluttony.

There is nothing wrong with certain traditions. The problem is when people confuse the word tradition with the words "good idea." This, however, is a tradition that is all fine and dandy in my mind.

Furthermore, what's wrong with being a little gluttonous? After all, it's not like you think that's a sin or anything.


I don't know about you, but I have real friends and we have real bonds. Materialism is inconsequential to my affection for them, and they know it. They need not purchase it, nor do I need purchase theirs.

Well that's good. See, thing is, while lots of people do buy gifts, many don't really care about the materialistic part. They only care about the family part, which is important to us.

Because otherwise you'll be looked upon as some bastardly miser for not being as cheery as everyone else?
If you live or were born in the UK, US, Oz, and many European countries I suppose.

There's plenty of places that don't do shit all on the 25th December.

You mean 'effect', before Fass says it.
I think you can just about get away with 'affect', even if it wasn't the intended meaning.


I'm an atheist too. I celebrate a secular version of Christmas(only called that because I don't feel like changing the name) which is basically just enjoying time with my family and exchanging gifts.
I'm not saying I share Fass' view, just that I can sympathise. Christmas is often a very sickly time of year.

Actually, I do. Both of those are overseen by the Swedish government (as they have special status) and have excellent transparency in their dealings, which are audited by outside accountants. I pick my charities very carefully, but nice try, though.



Much more peaceful than yours deserves.

So you spend your money in sweden and you ignore those who really need every single bit of support?
The swedish social system is pretty good. So keeping the money in sweden doesn't really help the people who really need it. People like you are called hypocrit, and that also in the bible...

I'm an atheist too. I celebrate a secular version of Christmas(only called that because I don't feel like changing the name) which is basically just enjoying time with my family and exchanging gifts. It feels good, damn it, and it's been done since I was born, and after all, I wasn't ALWAYS an atheist.

Point is, though, I focus on the family get-together part. If I didn't love my family as much as I do, I might agree with you, but as I do love them...

Half of our family is Muslim. The other half consists of Catholics and a couple Jews. We all celebrate a secular Christmas together. Thanksgiving and Christmas are the only two holidays that our family can agree to celebrate together.

why do I as an American, have to ALWAYS bear the responsibility of the less well off in the world? What ever happened to hard work? I for one will wake up get in my gas guzzling American SUV and buy my friends and family gifts. I will feel great and I will not really think about a single solitary comment that Fass has made. Charity starts at home and I give it to my family becuase I work to be able to do it. Don't like your life? Change it by working at it. If the USA pulled out of the corrupt UN, what do you think would happen??? It would collapse because we fund a majority of the UN. I'm tired of the rest of the world being jealous that we can afford to have fun while they wallow in self pity. OH, WELL...OFF TO THE GAS STATION.

I loathe Dickens.

even A tale of two cities? Oliver twist!?

Traditions are pointless, as is "fun" steeped in gluttony.

but letting go of ones discipline is always fun? and don't you think (pointless as they may be) people rather enjoy all the fuss?

I don't know about you, but I have real friends and we have real bonds. Materialism is inconsequential to my affection for them, and they know it. They need not purchase it, nor do I need purchase theirs.

but don't you enjoy seeing the joy in there faces when they receive something nice?

I'm sorry but we've always saved the turnips for Baldrick.

'e's got one in the exact shape of a thingie!

Santa is going to open up a can on the Woodland Critters

I declare this whole thread depressing.

If you live or were born in the UK, US, Oz, and many European countries I suppose.
Yep, as well as most of Africa, Japtopia and other such places.
There's plenty of places that don't do shit all on the 25th December.
Yeah, but on a scale of one to awesome, most of those places are at about -3.
I think you can just about get away with 'affect', even if it wasn't the intended meaning.
S'true.

even A tale of two cities? Oliver twist!?

Especially Oliver Twist.

but letting go of ones discipline is always fun? and don't you think (pointless as they may be) people rather enjoy all the fuss?

They enjoy wasting money and resources for no point whatsoever. If you can't see the folly in that, well...

but don't you enjoy seeing the joy in there faces when they receive something nice?

No, because they already have everything they could possibly need. I don't find wasting of resources to be enjoyable. I find it distasteful.

you can get drunk and stuff yourself whilst receiving comments on how jolly you are?
Again, I'm not saying I dislike that part, I'm just saying I can understand why someone wouldn't.

its the only festival we have apart from new year
I suppose so. Though thinking about it, I think I party more at Hogmany than Chrimbo.

People like you are called hypocrit, and that also in the bible...
Don't get him started on religion, please. He'll start an extended phase of Fassturbation before you can say "Sverige".

I'm not saying I share Fass' view, just that I can sympathise. Christmas is often a very sickly time of year.
True. I can understand the general sentiment of his point of view.

My problem is that like always he's being a gigantic dick towards everyone else for enjoying something that brings no harm to anyone. It's like someone walking into a party and pissing in the punch bowl while the party-goers look on horrified.

Half of our family is Muslim. The other half consists of Catholics and a couple Jews. We all celebrate a secular Christmas together. Thanksgiving and Christmas are the only two holidays that our family can agree to celebrate together.

Your conservative political beliefs clashing with your family's ethnic background continues to confuse me. But it's good to know your family can celebrate it.

So you spend your money in sweden and you ignore those who really need every single bit of support?
The swedish social system is pretty good. So keeping the money in sweden doesn't really help the people who really need it. People like you are called hypocrit,

I'll let your ignorance of what Save the Children and SOS Children's Villages do in a plethora of non-Western countries speak for itself - its level is something to behold as a thing of grotesqueness.

and that also in the bible...

Who gives a fuck about the Bible?

Who gives a fuck about the Bible?

Woah! What the hell? Fass is actually ANGRY instead of faux-angry! :eek:

Your conservative political beliefs clashing with your family's ethnic background continues to confuse me. But it's good to know your family can celebrate it.

Everyone in my family is basically conservative brown, white and even the one Chinese sister in law.

Woah! What the hell? Fass is actually ANGRY instead of faux-angry! :eek:

Is there a difference? :D

Who gives a fuck about the Bible?
I'm sure I heard of this religious sect which placed some importance in it.

They kept on going on about this guy called Chris...

Especially Oliver Twist.

but why?! :eek:

They enjoy wasting money and resources for no point whatsoever. If you can't see the folly in that, well...

I wouldn't say its wasting money to make your house look nice and have some fun doing so...

if anything this is the work China needs for its summers

No, because they already have everything they could possibly need. I don't find wasting of resources to be enjoyable. I find it distasteful.

then why have a computer or the Internet then?

I suppose so. Though thinking about it, I think I party more at Hogmany than Chrimbo.

well all the clubs are open after all, I think Christmas is more a cosy private affair

Woah! What the hell? Fass is actually ANGRY instead of faux-angry! :eek:
Or who knows, maybe he's been a radical right-wing Christian apparatchik, trying to make us hate gays all along.

Don't get him started on religion, please. He'll start an extended phase of Fassturbation before you can say "Sverige".

It's a vicious cycle. Fass posts in any thread with a self-important poo-poo tone of condescension on the subject matter especially if it's American in nature, people respond to him thinking he can actually be reasoned with, then Fass gets all happy and spoogy Fasturbating to the influx of attention while continuing to sing Anti-America like he was trying to form the Three Anti-American Tenors with Hugo Chavez and Mahmoud Ahmedinejad.

Everyone in my family is basically conservative brown, white and even the one Chinese sister in law.
Still it's confusing. You should liberal more.

Is there a difference? :D
Yes, actually. Fass's faux-anger gets people to throw themselves against him while he laughs and mocks them as much as he can. Actual anger means we've finally managed to really piss him off, which means he cares.

Or who knows, maybe he's been a radical right-wing Christian apparatchik, trying to make us hate gays all along.

That would be funny.

Yes, actually. Fass's faux-anger gets people to throw themselves against him while he laughs and mocks them as much as he can. Actual anger means we've finally managed to really piss him off, which means he cares.

Also might mean Fass is the gay black sheep of a Christian family who loathes homosexuality and either he'd hiding it from them or they know it and look at him the way any American looks at Muslims.

but why?! :eek:
I'd guess because it's a fucking awful book.

Also might mean Fass is the gay black sheep of a Christian family who loathes homosexuality and either he'd hiding it from them or they know it and look at him the way any American looks at Muslims.

Oh, he is a gay black sheep. He's admitted his parents hate him. That's why I think we should stop bugging him about Christmas because he doesn't have any family he can celebrate it with.

Woah! What the hell? Fass is actually ANGRY instead of faux-angry! :eek:

He's not angry.

He's not angry.

He sure sounds like he is. Normally he'd have responded in some elitist fashion. He never says "Who gives a fuck" or some other statement like that.

Oh, he is a gay black sheep. He's admitted his parents hate him. That's why I think we should stop bugging him about Christmas because he doesn't have any family he can celebrate it with.

Nobody was bugging him about Christmas until he stuck his ass into this thread with typical Fassturbation. If you wanna play Tony Romo with a hornet's nest don't expect the occupants to not make a fuss and sting back.

Sounds like he's subconsciously compensating for a lack of familial affection by attention-whoring on NSG with anti-American pissrants.

I think I see the problem here.... (http://www.seuss.org/seuss/mr.grinch.html)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v260/Katganistan/250px-Grinch_stole_christmas_book.jpg

I'd guess because it's a fucking awful book.

its a kids book for crying out loud and with that in mind it hardly bores you to death

Nobody was bugging him about Christmas until he stuck his ass into this thread with typical Fassturbation. If you wanna play Tony Romo with a hornet's nest don't expect the occupants to not make a fuss and sting back.

Sounds like he's subconsciously compensating for a lack of familial affection by attention-whoring on NSG with anti-American pissrants.

Still...now I feel bad about bugging him about it. Sure, he brought it on himself in a way, but I think we should take his situation into consideration. Not with pity, mind, because he'll hate that...but just trying not to be assholes back to him, that's all.

I think I see the problem here.... (http://www.seuss.org/seuss/mr.grinch.html)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v260/Katganistan/250px-Grinch_stole_christmas_book.jpg

Naw, the Grinch eventually got a big heart. Fass? Still bitter, tiny, arrogant, condescending and anti-American for years on end.

I think I see the problem here.... (http://www.seuss.org/seuss/mr.grinch.html)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v260/Katganistan/250px-Grinch_stole_christmas_book.jpg

Maybe Fass just needs someone to clean out his chimney with a sweeper?

Maybe Fass needs his stocking stuffed?

Maybe he just needs someone to wax his North Pole?

Ok I'm done.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v260/Katganistan/250px-Grinch_stole_christmas_book.jpg

best Christmas film ever (http://youtube.com/watch?v=8Dz-6l36DII)

Also might mean Fass is the gay black sheep of a Christian family who loathes homosexuality and either he'd hiding it from them or they know it and look at him the way any American looks at Muslims.

Right. Because we all hate them brown peoples.

I'm sure my students would loooove to tell you how much I hate Muslims. :rolleyes:

best Christmas film ever (http://youtube.com/watch?v=8Dz-6l36DII)

I will let Dr. Cox tell you what we (me and him) think of your "Best Christmas Film Ever" selection.

Dr. Cox, if you please. (http://youtube.com/watch?v=WrjwaqZfjIY)

Thank you Dr. Cox

Now for the Best Holiday Film Ever......

It's Santa's Slay! (http://imdb.com/title/tt0393685/)

I don't celebrate Christmas because I don't believe in imaginary people like Santa and Jesus, so I plan on spending nothing on gifts - again, nothing but a display of consumerist gluttony. It makes me blush with embarrassment when I think about how one could attempt to explain it to a street child in Calcutta or Caracas.

Or, I can point out the emptiness and idiocy of this "joy" they're purchasing for themselves out of selfishness and addiction to mindless consumption. Yeah, that works for me, too.

I'm with Fass on this one. He's acerbic, but he's right, and for more than one reason. Having not been raised in any particular tradition other than being a questioner of just about every tradition I've ever come across, I wonder why I even bother wishing people Merry Christmas.

It started with realizing that blessing someone when they sneeze is really kinda stupid. It came form a belief that you sneezed out your soul and it needed to be blessed in order to return. Fuckin' retarded, that is.

Then I thought about other things I'd taken as read, and eventually came to Christmas. Now, I'm employed at a Benedictine (Catholic) university, so I'm never going to avoid even Advent, let alone Christmas. But it occurred to me that I don't need an excuse to have a gathering, a party, some fun, whatever. I don't need a "season" to remind me that people need to be treated better than, as a whole, we tend to treat them. This is summed up best in a line from a song by The Bobs ("All I Want for Christmas"):

All I want for Christmas
is to spread a bit of cheer
to people I don't notice
ev'ry other day of the year.

I see all the ads begging us to spend and all but telling us that we're poor human beings indeed if we don't lavish our loved ones with gifts. (I briefly entertained a bit of chagrin about the whole wrapping paper industry and what a complete fucking waste that is, but I decided to deal with only one consumerist debacle at a time.) I'd hear reports on radio programs like NPR's Marketplace and hear things like the retail industry essentially depends on Christmas consumerism in order to, in some cases, just break even, let alone make a single-digit-percent profit. That strikes me as a horribly warped way to do things. 'Cause then it spreads, as it has, to Valentine's Day, Mother's/Father's Day, and on and on until it's Christmas again, and it's no wonder many people get depressed about the whole mess.

I'm nobody's Communist, but how it is possible, in a finite world, to support one nation's continued need for economic growth? My family has reduced our Christmas buying to each of us taking the lot of us out for a nice meal during the time we're all together...well, not all, my family is all over the country and aren't too chummy, but that's another thread.

So, sorry, NSG, but Fass is right. You may not agree with his presentation -- I usually don't -- but the overall idea and sentiment is right on the mark, whether you like it or not.

Every family has a black sheep. Fass is it for NSG. Every once in awhile it is ok to throw a turnip or two his way.

Especially when he's right.

its important to show you care though, lord knows I care more about the people I buy things for otherwise I wouldn't really have any friends would I?

I rest my case. What kind of friend only hangs around because you buy him things? I more appreciate a thoughtful gift that costs little or nothing, and it doesn't have to happen on Christmas. I've helped most of my friends move more than once (and one friend not at all 'cause the Army moved him, but I'd have gladly helped), for example, and all I ask is that there be a beer at the end of that particular tunnel.

If the US government didn't waste $50 on tracking Santa, then there would be no child prostitution in the world.

Fact.

(note : may be lies)

Lies indeed. Have you not heard how much US Government contractors spend on even the tiniest things? Witness this from a recent News of the Weird, which is real news collected from the mainstream press by Chuck Shepherd:

"Pentagon investigators discovered that a small South Carolina company fraudulently collected $20.5 million in shipping costs, including one invoice of $999,798 for sending two washers (cost: 19 cents each) to a base in Texas. According to Bloomberg News, the Defense Department was said to have a policy of automatically and unquestioningly paying shipping bills labeled "priority".

Woah! What the hell? Fass is actually ANGRY instead of faux-angry! :eek:

Well, when viewed objectively, crass consumerism in the face of world deprivaton is appalling. Most people are far too complacent to be shaken out of their routines and notice what's going on, and that's depressing. Anger might seem out of place, but not when you strip away the sentiment.

Hey Fass.

Merry Christmas and Happy New Years!

I'll let your ignorance of what Save the Children and SOS Children's Villages do in a plethora of non-Western countries speak for itself - its level is something to behold as a thing of grotesqueness.



Who gives a fuck about the Bible?

In your anger you ignore that Sweden can just control the swedish part of an international organization that has its roots in another country than Sweden.
Once you give the money and it crosses the border it is out of your control and out of the control of the swedish government. ;-)

And I can only hope that you never will have kids. These poor things would have a sad childhood, without toys that are not necessary, without friends (because other kids think they are boring), without joy (which comes with toys) and without dreams, hopes and wishes.

Well, when viewed objectively, crass consumerism in the face of world deprivaton is appalling. Most people are far too complacent to be shaken out of their routines and notice what's going on, and that's depressing. Anger might seem out of place, but not when you strip away the sentiment.

As I said, I understand the point of view and I can even sympathize with it when it comes to the materialistic part.

But as I said, my problem is with how he reacts to the family side as well and essentially tells people they shouldn't even enjoy that!

Right. Because we all hate them brown peoples.

I'm sure my students would loooove to tell you how much I hate Muslims. :rolleyes:

Okay, that was a bad blanket statement. But it does say a lot about public perception when someone tries to smear Barack Obama's campaign chances by insinuating that he's Muslim.

its a kids book for crying out loud and with that in mind it hardly bores you to death

It's a fucking awful kid's book, then. It's a walking illustration as to why paying someone by the word is stupid.

sounds like the perfect time for the commies to attack!

Perhaps,yes, or IS THAT WHAT A COMMIE WHOULD SAY!!!!*fires gun rapidly in air screaming*

Oh, he is a gay black sheep. He's admitted his parents hate him. That's why I think we should stop bugging him about Christmas because he doesn't have any family he can celebrate it with.

Y'know, I find it sadly telling that this thread is not about homosexuality, and Fass himself didn't bring it up, and yet a couple of you can't help but mention that Fass is gay despite that it's completely irrelevant to the point at hand.

He sure sounds like he is. Normally he'd have responded in some elitist fashion. He never says "Who gives a fuck" or some other statement like that.

Well, I tend to get a bit perturbed when someone whips out the Bible as a defense for damn near anything that they can't excuse using logic or sensible arguments. As if that book somehow excuses anything it's adherents want it to excuse.

In your anger you ignore that Sweden can just control the swedish part of an international organization that has its roots in another country than Sweden.
Once you give the money and it crosses the border it is out of your control and out of the control of the swedish government. ;-)

And I can only hope that you never will have kids. These poor things would have a sad childhood, without toys that are not necessary, without friends (because other kids think they are boring), without joy (which comes with toys) and without dreams, hopes and wishes.

NEWS FLASH: He's not talking about depriving anyone of happiness or hope, he's talking about A) not making every Western kid's joy dependent upon gift-wrapping an overabundance of toys (most of which will be thrown over in favor of their packaging in the case of toddlers) and perhaps teaching them that happiness doesn't come from materialism; and B) perhaps taking some time and effort to make the attmept to aid those who TRULY have no hope.

Honestly, is it really the end of hope to not get an Xbox? Really? I'd think it'd be more hopeless and dream-crushing to not know where your next meal is coming from, but hey, I'm weird that way.

Y'know, I find it sadly telling that this thread is not about homosexuality, and Fass himself didn't bring it up, and yet a couple of you can't help but mention that Fass is gay despite that it's completely irrelevant to the point at hand.

I only brought it up because it's the reason he's a black sheep. It was a qualifier, nothing more.


Well, I tend to get a bit perturbed when someone whips out the Bible as a defense for damn near anything that they can't excuse using logic or sensible arguments. As if that book somehow excuses anything it's adherents want it to excuse.

Fair enough. I was simply shocked he was actually angry.


NEWS FLASH: He's not talking about depriving anyone of happiness or hope, he's talking about A) not making every Western kid's joy dependent upon gift-wrapping an overabundance of toys (most of which will be thrown over in favor of their packaging in the case of toddlers) and perhaps teaching them that happiness doesn't come from materialism; and B) perhaps taking some time and effort to make the attmept to aid those who TRULY have no hope.

Both of which I can agree with. But if that's his message, why can't he try, you know, not being an ass? It's his attitude that pisses me off, not his message.

Honestly, is it really the end of hope to not get an Xbox? Really? I'd think it'd be more hopeless and dream-crushing to not know where your next meal is coming from, but hey, I'm weird that way.
Agreed.

Okay, that was a bad blanket statement. But it does say a lot about public perception when someone tries to smear Barack Obama's campaign chances by insinuating that he's Muslim.

And what does all the support he's got say?

And what does all the support he's got say?

Notice I said "try." The people who would actually believe that "Muslim=Evil" crap aren't ones predisposed to vote Democrat anyways. But enough people in the GOP must have hoped that enough Democrat voters would fall for it if they even tried that bullshit in the first place.

Still, I wish there was enough support for him to topple Hellary with authority in the campaign.

As I said, I understand the point of view and I can even sympathize with it when it comes to the materialistic part.

But as I said, my problem is with how he reacts to the family side as well and essentially tells people they shouldn't even enjoy that!

Come on, he did no such thing. Once again, he's railing against materialistic opulence in the service of a celebration regarding a man who would have been appalled at the very notion.

Aren't the arguments in here bad enough without people resorting to gross, deliberate misinterpretation and hyperbole? Fass doesn't want the West to not have fun and not celebrate. He'll raost me for daring to interpret him (and perhaps justly), but he'd rather the West wake up and realize that it's utterly irresponsible to spend as much as we do when so many are completely bereft, even in our own "advanced" nations. It's ironic, but Fass is advocating a very Christ-like world view with regard to nations of plenty. Only he's asking us to look harder than dropping a few cents in the Salvation Army's red buckets, for example. The sense of entitlement to opulence and waste angers him, and I can't say as I blame him.

It's a fucking awful kid's book, then. It's a walking illustration as to why paying someone by the word is stupid.

Well, that's your opinion (mine would be that H.P. Lovecraft was a shit writer and chronically paranoid), and you're perfectly entitled to it. I disagree. Let's move on.

Come on, he did no such thing. Once again, he's railing against materialistic opulence in the service of a celebration regarding a man who would have been appalled at the very notion.

Aren't the arguments in here bad enough without people resorting to gross, deliberate misinterpretation and hyperbole? Fass doesn't want the West to not have fun and not celebrate. He'll raost me for daring to interpret him (and perhaps justly), but he'd rather the West wake up and realize that it's utterly irresponsible to spend as much as we do when so many are completely bereft, even in our own "advanced" nations. It's ironic, but Fass is advocating a very Christ-like world view with regard to nations of plenty. Only he's asking us to look harder than dropping a few cents in the Salvation Army's red buckets, for example. The sense of entitlement to opulence and waste angers him, and I can't say as I blame him.

Fine.

But if he wants more people to listen, he needs to use honey, not vinegar, in spreading his message. Justified anger or no, you know very well that anger and vitriol spit at whomever you're trying to educate on some matter or another will not only not make them listen, they'll gladly spit insults right back and strengthen their opinions.

I agree with his message. I support his message. I do not support his attitude.

How did a convesation about Santa turn into a argument? Good job you ruined Chrismas!

I only brought it up because it's the reason he's a black sheep. It was a qualifier, nothing more.

Fair enough.

Fair enough. I was simply shocked he was actually angry.

Understood.

Both of which I can agree with. But if that's his message, why can't he try, you know, not being an ass? It's his attitude that pisses me off, not his message.

I completely understand your aversion to Fass' delivery. I even share it, to a degree, but I usually get over it. Since when has the truth had to be delivered in a pleasing package? A lot of the people we consider heroes or extol for their virutes were or are acerbic, cross, and generally hard to be around. I haven't read a lot of biographies, but I know that philanthropists like Carnegie were complete bastards personally, and many people who've done much for others weren't always, or ever, pleasant company. I'm not calling Fass a hero, but at some point, don't we have to look beyond the messenger and view the message? Not to reduce to absurdity, but what if crucial information about critical turning points in the past were ignored becuase they weren't delivered in a pleasing way? It seems to me that UNICEF and other organizations have been telling the West about deprivation, poverty and hunger for decades as politely as they can. I'm just surprised that those guys don't hang up the politeness and try a different tack (I'm envious of their self-control, actually).

So I guess I look past the biting sarcasm as just part and parcel of Fass and read what he's written. I don't mean to admonish anyone for not enjoying his tone. I would just suggest that we're all idiosyncratic with our means of expression, and if we learn to distill the message, the mode will become less important, and perhaps such vitriol will become less and less a desirable option, so long as the point is valid.

I already decline Christmas gifts and ask that money be donated to SOS Children's Villages and Save the Children instead.


Have you even heard of overpopulation?

You fiend.

Alright, Intagelon. We've both made our points. Methinks we have said all that we can say without constantly repeating ourselves.

How did a convesation about Santa turn into a argument? Good job you ruined Chrismas!

And you can't spell it.

Look, how fragile is your sense of Christmas if it's "ruined" by a worthwhile message delivered in such a way as to make sure you've heard it? I'd be less worried about Christmas and more worried about how shallow my sentiment for it was.

Alright, Intagelon. We've both made our points. Methinks we have said all that we can say without constantly repeating ourselves.

An excellent thought.

Well then, to perhaps up the level of jolly in this thread, how are you celebrating in Colorado?

An excellent thought.

Well then, to perhaps up the level of jolly in this thread, how are you celebrating in Colorado?

Well, the usual. My sister is having her birthday party--her birthday is Christmas Eve--downstairs right now, though I think it's ending. We're sitting around at home doing our normal things while enjoying the light of our decorated tree. Come Christmas Eve we'll go out driving to stare at the lights of the houses in the neighborhood and when we come home, we drink cocao and my dad reads some story from the Bible. (Ever since I became an atheist I stopped participating in that part of our familial traditions.) Then we go to bed. My parents place the presents under the tree, fill up our stockings, that sort of thing.

Christmas morning, we open presents and sit around talking and enjoying each other's company, then we have Christmas dinner later, which for some stupid reason involves ham. (I never understood why.)

Let's hear it for Robot Santa! But, since his base is on Neptune, I think Robot Santa wouldn't appear on NORAD until it's too late. Remember, mistletoe is no defense against TOW missiles.

Let's hear it for Robot Santa! But, since his base is on Neptune, I think Robot Santa wouldn't appear on NORAD until it's too late. Remember, mistletoe is no defense against TOW missiles.

Congress should have used Robot Santa as justification for demanding our troops back home.

I, for one, welcome our new Santa Overlord.

I, for one, welcome our new Santa Overlord.

He'll just find you Naughty and shatter your atoms. :p

Ok listen up Mr. 'Make Believe' and Mr. 'Consumerist Holiday'!

I haven't a clue what you mean by "I don't have to buy their friendship". No DUH, no one has to buy anyones friendship, except in high school! But for me the whole thing about Christmas/Yule is getting 'The Reaction'.

Those who give gifts know exactly what I mean:

Gift Giver: "Happy Christmas!"
*Gift recipient opens package* O.O!!!!!!!!!!!! "OMG!! You did NOT just give me this!! OMG OMG, I have always wanted this/ Been wanting this for so long!!! Thank you thank you THANK YOU!!!!" *sometimes followed by jumping up and down Hugs of epic proportions or an urge to use item RIGHT NOW!!*

That to me is worth almost any money, because I made someone so happy, so ecstatic, that they couldn't contain their joy, and their joy and happiness was all because of ME! Talk about Good Karma!

It's not about buying the gift from the Stores and sporting the millionaires, it is about Giving the joy that makes you, even if it is just for the day, the PERFECT Daughter/Son/Sister/Brother/Cousin/etc.etc. Causing that much happiness in one moment is what I live for, and it sounds to me as if you don't really like to cause anyone joy in large amounts, which to me is very sad.


Now for you. Ok . . . sounds to me like someone hates Wiccans and other magical practitioners. Well I hate to break it to you bub, but Magic is REAL. Yes, I know that if you wave a wand and shout "Rictosempra" nothing happens. I am not talking about that kind of magic. I have yet to meet a magical practitioner who can make something come out of a wand.

However, Magic is all around us, and in us. What do you think a little old lady who prays the rosary for someone is doing? She is making Ritual Magic, usually to heal someone. Other Magical practitioners know that Prayer and ritual can be used to do other things besides healing, so long as you don't interfere with another's will.

It even says in many mainstream Religions in the world that so-ans-so caused such-and-such miracle to happen. If they had magic (sent from the Lord or whatever they claimed) Why would we not have it still today? Please, next time you label something 'Make-Believe', try and produce some hard evidence that it doesn't exist - maybe photos?

And just so you know, I believe in Santa - just not all the propaganda he made up to hide himself from the world.

I just read this entire thread. It's all just hijack about the "meaning" of Christmas and the waste of resources which is "giving presents to prove you care."

If you don't let advertising pollute your sensorium, and just give cute, funny and cheap presents for the fun of it, I really can't see the harm. As Kyronea said, what's wrong with a bit of gluttony, a feast for a day.

Plenty of people do that every day of the year, and are ... plentiful in consequence. Perhaps we should blame the fat people for the starving children ...?

So, to the subject. The US spends obscene quantities on weapons it doesn't need. This is an ant's fart of an insignificant fraction of that, and if it means that they don't shoot down Santa I say it's money well spent.

If you don't care about Santa, at least think of the flying reindeer. A Patriot missile would seriously mess them up.

Oh, and Ok listen up *snip*

tl, dnr. Too long for a first post. Did not read.

For those of you who don't know, or care, NORAD is North America Radar Air Defense.


It's North American Aerospace Defense Command (http://www.norad.mil/50/index.html). For those of you who don't know.


It was started back during the Cold War because the popular belief was that the USSR would shoot missiles over the North Pole.


It wasn't "popular belief" so much as it was "shortest distance between A and B."


When done by the USA government? An appalling amount, no doubt, which should bring shame to anyone privileged enough to live in the West, where we apparently are so happy to rub it in that we can afford to do imbecilic things such as these when people are wallowing in poverty. For shame!

"The NORAD Tracks Santa (NTS) program has been around for a long time, since 1955 to be exact! And while NORAD has the "history" and excellent technology to track Santa, NORAD cannot expend government funds on the program. Besides the short time a NTS Project Officer spends "managing" the program, NORAD spends only the minimal amount of funds on NTS.

"So, how do we do it? The NTS program is funded through generous contributions from our sponsors."

http://www.noradsanta.org/en/team.htm

"Why We Track Santa?

"For more than 50 years, NORAD and its predecessor, the Continental Air Defense Command (CONAD) have tracked Santa. The tradition began on Christmas Eve in 1955 after a Colorado Springs-based Sears Roebuck & Co. store advertisement for children to call Santa on a special 'hotline' included an inadvertently misprinted telephone number. Instead of Santa, the phone number put kids through to the CONAD Commander-in-Chief's operations 'hotline.' The Director of Operations, Colonel Harry Shoup had his staff check radar data for any indication of Santa making his way south from the North Pole. Indeed there were signs of Santa and children who called were given an update on Santa's location. Thus, the tradition was born. To listen to Colonel Shoup talk about the experience, click here (http://www.noradsanta.org/audio/shoup.mp3). In 1958, the governments of Canada and the United States created a bi-national air defense command for the North American continent called the North American Air Defense Command, known as NORAD. NORAD inherited the tradition of tracking Santa.

"Since that time, Canadian and American men and women who work at NORAD have responded to phone calls from children personally. Additionally, media from all over the world call NORAD on Christmas Eve for updates on Santa's location. Last year this Website was visited by millions of people who wanted to know Santa's whereabouts.

"NORAD relies on many volunteers to help make Santa tracking possible. Hundreds of volunteers spend part of their Christmas Eve at the Santa Tracking Operations Center answering phones and emails to provide Santa updates to thousands of inquiring children worldwide."

http://www.noradsanta.org/en/why.htm

In short, they do imbecilic things because the starving children of the world want them to. The bastards.

*snip the excellent history*

In short, they do imbecilic things because the starving children of the world want them to. The bastards.

Um...I don't think that the vast majority of those children who are starving have computers or access to the internet, but hey, believe what you want. It is good to know it's all volunteer hours, though.

Um...I don't think that the vast majority of those children who are starving have computers or access to the internet...


Probably not. "For the children" is still "for the children," anyway.

Um...I don't think that the vast majority of those children who are starving have computers or access to the internet, but hey, believe what you want. It is good to know it's all volunteer hours, though.

I suppose they could walk into a public library at least in the states to check their email, look at porn and see where Santa is at.

sounds like the perfect time for the commies to attack!

Pfft. Think about it. Santa wears red. He has sole means of near infinite production without use of resources. He distributes toys for free, without cost, according to need, although behavior also counts as a factor. He never charges for anything. He also illegally enters countless homes, bypassing all manner of state of the art security systems, natural and artificial obstructions, and is capable of performing all of this completely undetected. Did I mention that he wears red?

:p

I haven't a clue what you mean by "I don't have to buy their friendship". No DUH, no one has to buy anyones friendship, except in high school! But for me the whole thing about Christmas/Yule is getting 'The Reaction'.

Those who give gifts know exactly what I mean:

Gift Giver: "Happy Christmas!"
*Gift recipient opens package* O.O!!!!!!!!!!!! "OMG!! You did NOT just give me this!! OMG OMG, I have always wanted this/ Been wanting this for so long!!! Thank you thank you THANK YOU!!!!" *sometimes followed by jumping up and down Hugs of epic proportions or an urge to use item RIGHT NOW!!*

That to me is worth almost any money, because I made someone so happy, so ecstatic, that they couldn't contain their joy, and their joy and happiness was all because of ME! Talk about Good Karma!

It's not about buying the gift from the Stores and sporting the millionaires, it is about Giving the joy that makes you, even if it is just for the day, the PERFECT Daughter/Son/Sister/Brother/Cousin/etc.etc. Causing that much happiness in one moment is what I live for, and it sounds to me as if you don't really like to cause anyone joy in large amounts, which to me is very sad.


It doesn't take ANY money to "cause anyone joy in large amounts". Your insistence that something must be spent in order to get "the reaction" is what I'm on about. The assumption that someone who dislikes conspicuous consumerism is somehow devoid of joy or doesn't like giving gifts is just plain ignorant.

Probably not. "For the children" is still "for the children," anyway.

Not when you try to ratchet up the mawkish sentimentality by adding "starving" as an adjective. If you hadn't noticed, most children not raised in utter opulence don't need much to be happy.

I suppose they could walk into a public library at least in the states to check their email, look at porn and see where Santa is at.

There are many such libraries in sub-Saharan Africa, are there?

Look, I'm not trying to be all holier than thou about this. I'm only trying to rationalize Fass' vitriol to the thread. There is too much conspicuous waste, and we could do more with less. The US simply refuses to do it.

There are many such libraries in sub-Saharan Africa, are there?

Look, I'm not trying to be all holier than thou about this. I'm only trying to rationalize Fass' vitriol to the thread. There is too much conspicuous waste, and we could do more with less. The US simply refuses to do it.


Fass does have a point to a certain extent. However one should not be made to feel guilty because they have food and drive a nice car or have a nice home. I think that is where people start getting irritated. You are correct however in there is to much waste.

The US simply refuses to do what? It is not a single entity. There are 300+ million Americans. Many do a lot in reducing waste. The US is a leading nation in recycling. Energy conservation is also a growing national concern. I have personally travelled to many places and can tell you they don't recycle in any place in Africa that I have been to. I have been to many in Africa itself. I didn't see recycling in Mexico or any other third world nation I have had the fortune or misfortune to travel to. Energy waste is also off the charts in those nations that I just referred to. So I see both sides and not going to made to feel guilty about where I live. We can do more and I believe we are. There is always more that we can do as a society. However each nation and person needs to do their own part too.

Ok listen up Mr. 'Make Believe' and Mr. 'Consumerist Holiday'!

I haven't a clue what you mean by "I don't have to buy their friendship". No DUH, no one has to buy anyones friendship, except in high school! But for me the whole thing about Christmas/Yule is getting 'The Reaction'.

Those who give gifts know exactly what I mean:

Gift Giver: "Happy Christmas!"
*Gift recipient opens package* O.O!!!!!!!!!!!! "OMG!! You did NOT just give me this!! OMG OMG, I have always wanted this/ Been wanting this for so long!!! Thank you thank you THANK YOU!!!!" *sometimes followed by jumping up and down Hugs of epic proportions or an urge to use item RIGHT NOW!!*

That to me is worth almost any money, because I made someone so happy, so ecstatic, that they couldn't contain their joy, and their joy and happiness was all because of ME! Talk about Good Karma!

It's not about buying the gift from the Stores and sporting the millionaires, it is about Giving the joy that makes you, even if it is just for the day, the PERFECT Daughter/Son/Sister/Brother/Cousin/etc.etc. Causing that much happiness in one moment is what I live for, and it sounds to me as if you don't really like to cause anyone joy in large amounts, which to me is very sad.


Now for you. Ok . . . sounds to me like someone hates Wiccans and other magical practitioners. Well I hate to break it to you bub, but Magic is REAL. Yes, I know that if you wave a wand and shout "Rictosempra" nothing happens. I am not talking about that kind of magic. I have yet to meet a magical practitioner who can make something come out of a wand.

However, Magic is all around us, and in us. What do you think a little old lady who prays the rosary for someone is doing? She is making Ritual Magic, usually to heal someone. Other Magical practitioners know that Prayer and ritual can be used to do other things besides healing, so long as you don't interfere with another's will.

It even says in many mainstream Religions in the world that so-ans-so caused such-and-such miracle to happen. If they had magic (sent from the Lord or whatever they claimed) Why would we not have it still today? Please, next time you label something 'Make-Believe', try and produce some hard evidence that it doesn't exist - maybe photos?

And just so you know, I believe in Santa - just not all the propaganda he made up to hide himself from the world.

While I may not agree with the wording you used, I understand the sentiment behind it. nice first post.

Fass does have a point to a certain extent. However one should not be made to feel guilty because they have food and drive a nice car or have a nice home. I think that is where people start getting irritated. You are correct however in their is to much waste.

The US simply refuses to do what? It is not a single entity. There are 300+ million Americans. Many do a lot in reducing waste. The US is a leading nation in recycling. Energy conservation is also a growing national concern. I have personally travelled to many places and can tell you they don't recycle in any place in Africa that I have been to. I have been to many in Africa itself. I didn't see recycling in Mexico or any other third world nation I have had the fortune or misfortune to travel to. Energy waste is also off the charts in those nations that I just referred to. So I see both sides and not going to made to feel guilty about where I live. We can do more and I believe we are. There is always more that we can do as a society. However each nation and person needs to do their own part too.

You only feel guilty if you should, 'cause you are the only person who can "make" you feel anything.

It's kinda hard to get into recycling when you live in abject poverty, especially when the nation telling you to recycle has a poor overall rate of doing it in it's own nation. It has to be something the nation agrees is worthwhile, and as of now, reducing consumption isn't terribly popular.

You only feel guilty if you should, 'cause you are the only person who can "make" you feel anything.

It's kinda hard to get into recycling when you live in abject poverty, especially when the nation telling you to recycle has a poor overall rate of doing it in it's own nation. It has to be something the nation agrees is worthwhile, and as of now, reducing consumption isn't terribly popular.

Poverty is in the eyes of the beholder really. I have spent a massive amount of time in Morocco. I will use this nation as my example. A teacher makes about $600 USD a month. That to US or European standards is poverty and we would dismiss it as those poor people. However that teacher pays no taxes, lives in a three bedroom modest apartment or what we call condo. Has a little French car and goes on vacation to the beach for a couple months out of the year. Mind you that person also has free medical care and cheap food. Even the Berbers I stayed out in the desert with probably had a net worth higher then many westerners. The ones we were with had plenty of food, water and farm animals around to be set for their particular situation. They were happy and lived a simple life. The Berbers didn't have to work 40hrs a week or more either in addition to free medical clinics in the nearest town with no tax burden.

Poverty is in the eyes of the beholder really. I have spent a massive amount of time in Morocco. I will use this nation as my example. A teacher makes about $600 USD a month. That to US or European standards is poverty and we would dismiss it as those poor people. However that teacher pays no taxes, lives in a three bedroom modest apartment or what we call condo. Has a little French car and goes on vacation to the beach for a couple months out of the year. Mind you that person also has free medical care and cheap food. Even the Berbers I stayed out in the desert with probably had a net worth higher then many westerners. The ones we were with had plenty of food, water and farm animals around to be set for their particular situation. They were happy and lived a simple life. The Berbers didn't have to work 40hrs a week or more either in addition to free medical clinics in the nearest town with no tax burden.

What's your point?

Poverty is relative, and I'm not talking about people who aren't actually impoverished. The people you're describing clearly aren't. So what's your point?

Why mention people who aren't deprived, when deprivation and starvation is what we're talking about? That almost seems like you're deliberately dodging the point.

*Fass is right*
In your opinion. Personally, I feel that Christmas is a time to entirely not care. I give money to charity, but for fuck's sakes let's have one day off from the doom and gloom of the world, eh?
Lies indeed. Have you not heard how much US Government contractors spend on even the tiniest things? Witness this from a recent News of the Weird, which is real news collected from the mainstream press by Chuck Shepherd:

"Pentagon investigators discovered that a small South Carolina company fraudulently collected $20.5 million in shipping costs, including one invoice of $999,798 for sending two washers (cost: 19 cents each) to a base in Texas. According to Bloomberg News, the Defense Department was said to have a policy of automatically and unquestioningly paying shipping bills labeled "priority".
Nothing to do with the website. You don't need to get your internets priority delivered.

Gift Giver: "Happy Christmas!"
*Gift recipient opens package* O.O!!!!!!!!!!!! "OMG!! You did NOT just give me this!! OMG OMG, I have always wanted this/ Been wanting this for so long!!! Thank you thank you THANK YOU!!!!" *sometimes followed by jumping up and down Hugs of epic proportions or an urge to use item RIGHT NOW!!*

That to me is worth almost any money, because I made someone so happy, so ecstatic, that they couldn't contain their joy, and their joy and happiness was all because of ME!

Wait, this display of shallowness and materialist exuberance is supposed to make a point on your behalf? Right...

Talk about Good Karma!

There's no such thing as karma.

Now for you. Ok . . . sounds to me like someone hates Wiccans and other magical practitioners. Well I hate to break it to you bub, but Magic is REAL. Yes, I know that if you wave a wand and shout "Rictosempra" nothing happens. I am not talking about that kind of magic. I have yet to meet a magical practitioner who can make something come out of a wand.

However, Magic is all around us, and in us. What do you think a little old lady who prays the rosary for someone is doing? She is making Ritual Magic, usually to heal someone. Other Magical practitioners know that Prayer and ritual can be used to do other things besides healing, so long as you don't interfere with another's will.

It even says in many mainstream Religions in the world that so-ans-so caused such-and-such miracle to happen. If they had magic (sent from the Lord or whatever they claimed) Why would we not have it still today? Please, next time you label something 'Make-Believe', try and produce some hard evidence that it doesn't exist - maybe photos?

http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/laughing013.gif http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/laughing013.gif http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/laughing013.gif

What's your point?

Poverty is relative, and I'm not talking about people who aren't actually impoverished. The people you're describing clearly aren't. So what's your point?

Why mention people who aren't deprived, when deprivation and starvation is what we're talking about? That almost seems like you're deliberately dodging the point.

You are bringing up Africa. My point is that not everyone in Africa is starving. Just because one is poor by our standards does not mean they are starving. Where are these people that are really starving? I have yet to see one starving person in person on my travels in Africa.

The other word your tossing about is deprivation. What is the real definition of deprivation here? Are we talking about not having a car, TV, 3 bedroom place to stay? Are we talking paved roads or piped in water? Where is the line where someone is deprived?

Fass, for your Christmas present, I plan on donating $1,000 in your name to the Human Fund.

http://blog.frodolf.de/media/festivus_k.jpg

Sheesh such Grinches

Fass, for your Christmas present, I plan on donating $1,000 in your name to the Human Fund.

http://blog.frodolf.de/media/festivus_k.jpg

I laughed for ever after that episode. Lol, turns out though it is a real fund out in Cleveland. I wonder if they did it after the show.

I laughed for ever after that episode. Lol, turns out though it is a real fund out in Cleveland. I wonder if they did it after the show.OMG Ohio! get down!

We need an NS airing of grievances. Only problem is the server would explode.

"You have all disappointed me very much this past year."

We need an NS airing of grievances. Only problem is the server would explode.

"You have all disappointed me very much this past year."

Internet would go down.

Internet would go down.
Hey Marrakech, my son tells me your baked goods stink!

Hey Marrakech, my son tells me your baked goods stink!

hmmm... somewhere there is a joke. Care to elaborate?;)

Edit: My memory sometimes is crap.

Real things, not pretend crazy creepy stalker elderly men who break into houses to see children.And that run a wiretapping program that would make Bush green with envy.

I agree with Fass, the whole thing is pretty stupid.

It doesn't seem like something I want to care about really.

And that run a wiretapping program that would make Bush green with envy.

exactly.

Santa is one creepy dude. He's even a bit more scary than God.

exactly.

Santa is one creepy dude. He's even a bit more scary than God.I don't know. Santa doesn't go around having first borns killed... :p

Damnit. I did a Secret Santa cartoon for someone on this exact topic. Only they've removed it from their site and probably won't be putting it up again until Christmas...

I don't know. Santa doesn't go around having first borns killed... :p
Santa has a sweat shop where he uses the labor of little people indiscriminately to make toys for children who are "good" and not for the ones who are "bad" and he has genetically modified deer which he gets high on "magic dust" and forces them to break the laws of time and space to deliver toys to children who already have too much consumerism thrust upon them.

Santa has a sweat shop where he uses the labor of little people indiscriminately to make toys for children who are "good" and not for the ones who are "bad" and he has genetically modified deer which he gets high on "magic dust" and forces them to break the laws of time and space to deliver toys to children who already have too much consumerism thrust upon them.Yeah well, in Germany, Santa comes on Dec. 6th, when he's supposed to, and stuffs your boots with candy if you were good or coal if you were bad. And the German Christmasman lives in Heaven and has Angels working for him.

Santa has a sweat shop where he uses the labor of little people indiscriminately to make toys for children who are "good" and not for the ones who are "bad" and he has genetically modified deer which he gets high on "magic dust" and forces them to break the laws of time and space to deliver toys to children who already have too much consumerism thrust upon them.

Sounds like the real world to me.

Sounds like the real world to me.

no, it's a fictional world that people idealize, a horrible horrible fantasy, and sick people just keep passing it down year after year.

I hate Santa. *grinch*

Has this ever been challenged in court?

no, it's a fictional world that people idealize, a horrible horrible fantasy, and sick people just keep passing it down year after year.

I hate Santa. *grinch*

lol, was making fun but anyway I do side with Fass, you and people that believe it is a pile of horseshit.

Has this ever been challenged in court?

The people vs Santa Clause? Would be interesting.

The people vs Santa Clause? Would be interesting.Or is santa the people? So Santa vs (If in Canada)The Crown, Now that would be interesting!:D

hmmm... somewhere there is a joke. Care to elaborate?;)

Edit: My memory sometimes is crap.

Reference to Frank Costanza's "Airing of Grievances"

Reference to Frank Costanza's "Airing of Grievances"

Ahh yes. Damn funny.

Edit:

Doesn't this thread remind you of that Festivus tradition?

Also, anyone else think that Fass does a damn good impersonation of Squidward off Sponge Bob Square Pants?