NationStates Jolt Archive

A Dutch film maker, law maker actually, is going to make a film that highlights the fascist parts of the Koran. Good for him.

His colleagues are concerned that they can't prevent the ten minute movie's screening. Jeers to them.

Of course all this will end badly -- a movie called Submission which was a fictional study of abused Muslim women with scenes of near-naked women with Quranic texts engraved on their flesh. The director of Submission died after a Moslem extremist shot him and slit his throat.

So let's wait and see how bad the next round of riots are in The Netherlands and how tolerant and peaceful the religion of Islam really is.

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/11/28/europe/EU-GEN-Netherlands-Anti-Quran-Film.php

Did anyone else think that the film maker in question was Bush when they saw the thread title? :p

Did anyone else think that the film maker in question was Bush when they saw the thread title? :p

No, as its patently riduclous to suggest that the POTUS has the nessecary motor skills to commence such a project. "Crayon drawing author...." would obviously be different...

No, as its patently riduclous to suggest that the POTUS has the nessecary motor skills to commence such a project. "Crayon drawing author...." would obviously be different...

LOL

Right wing idiots baiting right wing idiots.

I think we need to send in the Mods and sort the Netherlands out.

Poking one's hand into a beehive and complaining about being stung is, I think, a suitable analogy about the inevitable reaction of people intent on provoking Islamic extremists with the likes of this.

Sounds like he's trolling to me.

So, who wants to join me in making a film for the express purpose of insulting the beliefs of Christians?

It'd have to be many days long. The longest film on record to detail the absurdities, violence, racism, and genocide promotion in that book.

So, who wants to join me in making a film for the express purpose of insulting the beliefs of Christians?

So, who wants to join me in making a film for the express purpose of insulting the beliefs of Christians?
Me. That way, everybody can equally feel that they can hate each other.

Sounds like he's trolling to me.

That is exactly what he is doing, and he is going to get the response he desires too.

I love during the cartoon thing when Ahmadenijad thought he would turn the tables and bait the Jews with the Holocaust Cartoon Contest. The Jews responded by holding their own Holocaust Cartoon Contest. We are very good at self deprecating humor. Where do you think Mel Brooks gets all of his material?

Yay! I love the Netherlands. Free speech ftw.

Does this whole thing remind anyone of "Cartoon Wars?" Too bad the South Park season is over otherwise we could have a funny follow up.

Sounds like he's trolling to me.
No more so than anyone else.

The key to this is that the Law/Film maker's colleagues had considered banning an expression of free speech.

That they considered it is a terrible reflection of the appeasement to which some people consider acceptable.

That there was no way for them to do so is a good reflection on the Netherlands and its protections of free speech.

No more so than anyone else.

The key to this is that the Law/Film maker's colleagues had considered banning an expression of free speech.

That they considered it is a terrible reflection of the appeasement to which some people consider acceptable.

That there was no way for them to do so is a good reflection on the Netherlands and its protections of free speech.

I think you may have read a different article than the rest of us, 'cause I don't see where it said that.

What I do see is where his party campaigned on the idea that Muslims are evil naziesque people. Looks to me like he's trying to get more material for his next election.

Me. That way, everybody can equally feel that they can hate each other.
We'll need films for the jews and other religions too. We can have a whole series of them. Release one DVD every Christmas, and box set of all the ones so far. The release special editions in March
No more so than anyone else.

The key to this is that the Law/Film maker's colleagues had considered banning an expression of free speech.

That they considered it is a terrible reflection of the appeasement to which some people consider acceptable.

That there was no way for them to do so is a good reflection on the Netherlands and its protections of free speech.

Yeah, it's such a terrible reflection of society to day that some people didn't think it a good idea to try to piss off millions and millions of people around the world, just because some of them moved to your country.

We'll need films for the jews and other religions too. We can have a whole series of them. Release one DVD every Christmas, and box set of all the ones so far. The release special editions in March
That's if the box set doesn't anhilliate itself first.

We'll need films for the jews and other religions too. We can have a whole series of them. Release one DVD every Christmas, and box set of all the ones so far. The release special editions in March

That's a lot of religions to cover...

Yeah, it's such a terrible reflection of society to day that some people didn't think it a good idea to try to piss off millions and millions of people around the world, just because some of them moved to your country.

I get the feeling Myrm has a problem with them trying to stop others pissing people off rather than them thinking it's a bad idea

It'd have to be many days long. The longest film on record to detail the absurdities, violence, racism, and genocide promotion in that book.

Stop acting like any single group of religious fanatics has been worse than any other. If Xian fanatics have done more through history, it is only because there have been more of them with more power.

Anyone who kills for their religion deserves whichever version of Hell to which they think they're sending their 'enemies'.

So the article says: "The interior and justice ministers said they were concerned, but believed they had no authority to prevent the lawmaker, Geert Wilders, from screening his film."

And Myrmidonisia reads this into it:
His colleagues are concerned that they can't prevent the ten minute movie's screening. Jeers to them.
Wow... finally we have concrete proof that Myrmidonisia seemingly dwells in a separate reality from the rest of us.

Stop acting like any single group of religious fanatics has been worse than any other. If Xian fanatics have done more through history, it is only because there have been more of them with more power.

Anyone who kills for their religion deserves whichever version of Hell to which they think they're sending their 'enemies'.

I'm not referring to religious fanatics, only to the books that inspire them. Kindly read prior to responding in future.

Wow... finally we have concrete proof that Myrmidonisia seemingly dwells in a separate reality from the rest of us.
Reality (prime) has a well known liberal bias.

*shrug* If the Dutch film maker wants to make a film criticizing Islam, then he should be allowed to, because I believe the Dutch has freedom of speech.

If the Islam community feels offended, then they have the right to voice their opinion, and maybe make a film about Christianity, or the Neatherlands etc.

However, voicing their opinion and objection to the film does not cover:
Rioting
Death Threats against person
Death Threats against Countries
Death Threats to Western World
Arson
Murder
Terrorist Attacks
Suicide Bombing
Regular Bombing

and any violent acts or intent for violent acts not mentioned in the above list.

That's a lot of religions to cover...
I know, we'll make millions!
So the article says: "The interior and justice ministers said they were concerned, but believed they had no authority to prevent the lawmaker, Geert Wilders, from screening his film."

And Myrmidonisia reads this into it:

Wow... finally we have concrete proof that Myrmidonisia seemingly dwells in a separate reality from the rest of us.

Reality just won't have anything to do with Myrmi.

*shrug* If the Dutch film maker wants to make a film criticizing Islam, then he should be allowed to, because I believe the Dutch has freedom of speech.

If the Islam community feels offended, then they have the right to voice their opinion, and maybe make a film about Christianity, or the Neatherlands etc.

However, voicing their opinion and objection to the film does not cover:
Rioting
Death Threats against person
Death Threats against Countries
Death Threats to Western World
Arson
Murder
Terrorist Attacks
Suicide Bombing
Regular Bombing

and any violent acts or intent for violent acts not mentioned in the above list.


Oh he should be allowed to, and there's no one suggesting otherwise (Except in Myrmi's mind), it's just really unwise. It's likely to get people killed in a cynical attempt to get votes. I find that morally reprehensible, but hey, it's his right.

I concur. He's a real life troll, and like all trolls, should be ignored until they go away. I guess we'll see if the Muslim community has learned that lesson yet.

I forsee lots of crying, men gashing their teeth, fire, death, blood.

I'm guessing, no.

It must be said that the guy who was killed actually did a lot more trolling than just make the movie with the Nekkid wimmin....However and unfortunately it will just take a small number to take the bait to this effort to land us in " JUST L00K - all muslimz...." territory once more

Oh he should be allowed to, and there's no one suggesting otherwise (Except in Myrmi's mind), it's just really unwise. It's likely to get people killed in a cynical attempt to get votes. I find that morally reprehensible, but hey, it's his right.

I concur. He's a real life troll, and like all trolls, should be ignored until they go away. I guess we'll see if the Muslim community has learned that lesson yet.

Translating from Myrmi-speak:

"YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY, someone's badly insulting the group I have a prejudice to! That means if and when one jackass that in my fantasy represents the entire group reacts badly I'll get to paint the whole group with the same brush! That's just FABULOUS!"

Now someone please sig a link to this post so if and when that happens and Myrmi inevitably posts his "all mozlems are the same evil jackasses" drivel nobody says I DIDN'T SEE THE CLUSTERFUCK COMING!

Man, I hope this trolls the hell out of them...the levels of Muslim butthurt should be pretty amusing. Nothing better than milking one of contemporary society's easiest lolcows for a good troll or two. Of course, it takes almost no effort to troll them, but still...it's worth it. Mind you, I wouldn't stop there, but if you're looking for a good place to start, the Muslims aren't too difficult. They're the Novice difficulty of the religious trolling world; personally, I'd like to see the shitstorm that happens if the guy makes a film about Judaism and Israel as a follow-up to this film.

Man, I hope this trolls the hell out of them...the levels of Muslim butthurt should be pretty amusing. Nothing better than milking one of contemporary society's easiest lolcows for a good troll or two. Of course, it takes almost no effort to troll them, but still...it's worth it.

They're not all lolcows. I was at a comedy gig today and the comedian suggesting that two muslims in the front row might be suicide bombers. :p

They're the Novice difficulty of the religious trolling world; personally, I'd like to see the shitstorm that happens if the guy makes a film about Judaism and Israel as a follow-up to this film.

Well if a short book makes Jimmy Carter = Nazi sympathiser.....

Finklesteins calling out of Dershie-boy didn't do his chances of getting tenure any favours either....

Y'know, if death threats and assassination against people who make these films is really that big a concern, I have some other ideas...

All films that are directly critical of Islam should be entirely animated. Voice actors can be used, but they cannot use their natural voices. And all proceeds have to be deposited into the Swiss bank account of the director's company and taken out under a pseudonym.

The end credits should read, "Up yours, Islamist assholes." And the prophet Muhammad's image should be part of the company's logo. Preferably wearing a cowboy hat, drinking a beer, and eating a Polish sausage.

I suppose a message like "Allah bless Israel" would just be running up the score. The asshole Islamic community would shit themselves after this, and the best part - no one would have a fucking clue who would be responsible!

Anyone here good at computer animation?

For some reason methinks that the Dutch film maker showed his intolerance first.

Edit:

Oops, this is one of Myrmidonisia's threads,... I'll just sit right there.

So, this is yet another example of how Islam is a violent barbaric religion out to crush freedom and democracy because some Muslims did something bad.

Oh wait! It isn't, because they haven't.

This is pretty desperate for Myrmidonisia. Usually he waits until something happens before trying to use it as an excuse for hate and fear mongering. Now he's only howling at the moon and trying to tell me the sun is too bright.

So, who wants to join me in making a film for the express purpose of insulting the beliefs of Christians?

Anyone want to join me in a flim making fun of atheists?

So, who wants to join me in making a film for the express purpose of insulting the beliefs of Christians?
What, you mean like Priest, The Last Temptation of Christ or Jesus Camp?

So, who wants to join me in making a film for the express purpose of insulting the beliefs of Christians?

Would it be on the lines of the "Life of Brian", "The Last Temptation of Christ", "Sin City", "V for Vendetta", "Tickle My Funny Bone", "The Da Vinci Code" etc.? All of those films either contain parts, or have their main thrust (no implication intended) against tenets of Christianity. Yet they didn't generate the violence that films judged to have a problem with Islam do.

Imagining that Muslims are being persecuted and offering them some kind of quid pro quo based on the spurious notion that no-one ever says anything derogatory about Christianity on film or otherwise is probably only going to fuel their imagined sense of persecution.

If someone wants to make a film "insulting the beliefs of Christians" they're not going to be the first by a long stretch

Oh he should be allowed to, and there's no one suggesting otherwise (Except in Myrmi's mind), it's just really unwise. It's likely to get people killed in a cynical attempt to get votes. I find that morally reprehensible, but hey, it's his right.
First, the statement that the lawmakers were unable to find a way to ban the film's screening implies that they had an interest in creating a ban.

Second, the fact that a film could incite violence and a ban is even considered speaks volumes to the instability of the Islamic world.

Let's face it, more than one person is required for a riot. Many are willing, as was shown in the great cartoon riot. If Moslems were willing to live and let live in secular nations, things would be fine. The fact that they can't understand the idea free expression, tells me that they should be back in one of those countries where sharia prevails.

So, who wants to join me in making a film for the express purpose of insulting the beliefs of Christians?

The Golden Compass - in theaters this christmas ?
Brave little girl tries to kill senile Christian god and its catholic church ;)

Seriously, he knows what's going to happen. Is he just doing this for shits and giggles?

For votes. "Islam is bad, mmm'kay" is the basis of his political success.
Well, that and his hair.

http://www.crimelibrary.com/graphics/photos/notorious_murders/famous/theo_van_gogh/4-3-Geert-Wilders.jpg

A Dutch film maker, law maker actually, is going to make a film that highlights the fascist parts of the Koran. Good for him.

His colleagues are concerned that they can't prevent the ten minute movie's screening. Jeers to them.

Of course all this will end badly -- a movie called Submission which was a fictional study of abused Muslim women with scenes of near-naked women with Quranic texts engraved on their flesh. The director of Submission died after a Moslem extremist shot him and slit his throat.

So let's wait and see how bad the next round of riots are in The Netherlands and how tolerant and peaceful the religion of Islam really is.

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/11/28/europe/EU-GEN-Netherlands-Anti-Quran-Film.php

Seriously, he knows what's going to happen. Is he just doing this for shits and giggles?

If I were a mod in the online game that is real life I would call this...flamebaiting...

First, the(,.........)prevails.

Yeah, yeah. Before a few of them blew up a load of yanks, nobody gave a crap about them, anymore than any other group. Now its "O The MUSLIMZ....". The fact is that if a bomb drops out of the sky and kills a whackload of people anytime soon, its not going to be a follower of the Prophet flying the plane. Go fund a dictatorship for yourselves, and stop acting the victim.

First, the statement that the lawmakers were unable to find a way to ban the film's screening implies that they had an interest in creating a ban. It never says that. Ever. Read it again.


Second, the fact that a film could incite violence and a ban is even considered speaks volumes to the instability of the Islamic world.Point? Do you have a point? Any point at all? There are plenty of ways to get retards to riot, all it speaks to is how fucking stupid people are.

Let's face it, more than one person is required for a riot. Many are willing, as was shown in the great cartoon riot. If Moslems were willing to live and let live in secular nations, things would be fine. The fact that they can't understand the idea free expression, tells me that they should be back in one of those countries where sharia prevails. I don't follow, but then if you started making sense I'd probably wish to have my head examined.

Would it be on the lines of the "Life of Brian", "The Last Temptation of Christ", "Sin City", "V for Vendetta", "Tickle My Funny Bone", "The Da Vinci Code" etc.? All of those films either contain parts, or have their main thrust (no implication intended) against tenets of Christianity. Yet they didn't generate the violence that films judged to have a problem with Islam do.
How many of them were created for the express purpose of insulting the beliefs of Christians? This film maker is going to try to highlight the fascism in Islam. How many films have tried to highlight the fascism in Christianity? After all, the most famous fascist in history was Christian.

The Golden Compass - in theaters this christmas ?
Brave little girl tries to kill senile Christian god and its catholic church ;)

Has been watered down at the behest of various Christian groups.

First, the statement that the lawmakers were unable to find a way to ban the film's screening implies that they had an interest in creating a ban.

It could also imply that the reporter simply asked if the Dutch government had planned to ban it, and the government representative answered that they would not. In fact, the Dutch government has made it clear (http://www.reuters.com/article/filmNews/idUSL2861404320071128?pageNumber=2&virtualBrandChannel=0&sp=true)that this is a free speech issue and no official will attempt to stop him.

A justice ministry spokesman said the Justice and Foreign Ministers met with Geert Wilders to discuss with him the risks of making such a film to himself and Dutch interests abroad while also outlining his right to free speech.

Second, the fact that a film could incite violence and a ban is even considered speaks volumes to the instability of the Islamic world.

Well, a ban isn't being considered. I guess those volumes must be abridged.

Let's face it, more than one person is required for a riot. Many are willing, as was shown in the great cartoon riot. If Moslems were willing to live and let live in secular nations, things would be fine. The fact that they can't understand the idea free expression, tells me that they should be back in one of those countries where sharia prevails.

And your inablity to see Muslims as individuals instead of members of a hive mind tells me that you are a bigot.

So, who wants to join me in making a film for the express purpose of insulting the beliefs of Christians?

I'm kinda busy. Can we have a joint Islam-Christianity one?

I'm kinda busy. Can we have a joint Islam-Christianity one?

We'll just do all the Abrahamic ones in one go. They're basically the same anyway.

How many of them were created for the express purpose of insulting the beliefs of Christians? This film maker is going to try to highlight the fascism in Islam. How many films have tried to highlight the fascism in Christianity?
The Life of Brian was a satire of the New Testament, how much more express do you want? And Priest (which I've already mentioned). That boring melodrama relied entirely upon the anti-Catholic sentiment of its audience.

Poking one's hand into a beehive and complaining about being stung is, I think, a suitable analogy about the inevitable reaction of people intent on provoking Islamic extremists with the likes of this.

Exactly. Like I said to another of NSG's Brilliant Islamic Scholars, Zilam, proving that all Muslims are intolerant and violent zealots by deliberately provoking a thin-skinned extremist minority has all the scientific genius of proving all species of bears are dangerous by going up to a male grizzly during mating season and kicking him in the testicles with a steel-toed boot.

After all, the most famous fascist in history was Christian.

Franco?

Franco?

Hitler.

Hitler.

I thought he dabbled in the occult.

I thought he dabbled in the occult.

He did. He was an occultist.

So, who wants to join me in making a film for the express purpose of insulting the beliefs of Christians?

Eh, it's done quite a lot already. Muslims not as much because everyone's afraid of being bombed.

Now, if we could insult the beliefs of Christianity, Islam and Judaism all in the same film, that would be fun.

A Dutch film maker, law maker actually, is going to make a film that highlights the fascist parts of the Koran. Good for him.

His colleagues are concerned that they can't prevent the ten minute movie's screening. Jeers to them.

Of course all this will end badly -- a movie called Submission which was a fictional study of abused Muslim women with scenes of near-naked women with Quranic texts engraved on their flesh. The director of Submission died after a Moslem extremist shot him and slit his throat.

So let's wait and see how bad the next round of riots are in The Netherlands and how tolerant and peaceful the religion of Islam really is.

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/11/28/europe/EU-GEN-Netherlands-Anti-Quran-Film.php

The only ones rioting are school kids...

http://antwerpen.indymedia.org/news/2007/11/14077.php

LOLOLOL!!!!

I thought he dabbled in the occult.

The evidence is divided. Hitler was just the person I would imagine the quoted postre was refering to.

He did. He was an occultist.

Evidence?

Evidence?

A good recommended source is Satan and Swastika: The Occult and the Nazi Party; unfortunately, the book is out of print and not available online. You can usually find it on Amazon, but it's damn expensive (in the neighborhood of $150 or more).

A good recommended source is Satan Swastika: The Occult and the Nazi Party; unfortunately, the book is out of print and not available online. You can usually find it on Amazon, but it's damn expensive (in the neighborhood of $150 or more).

Are you serious?

A good recommended source is Satan Swastika: The Occult and the Nazi Party; unfortunately, the book is out of print and not available online. You can usually find it on Amazon, but it's damn expensive (in the neighborhood of $150 or more).

"Secular schools can never be tolerated because such schools have no religious instruction, and a general moral instruction without religious foundation is built on air; consequently all character training and religion must be derived from faith . . ."

Hitler 1933.

"National Socialism and religion cannot exist together....
"The heaviest blow that ever struck humanity was the coming of Christianity. Bolshevism is Christianity's illegitimate child. Both are inventions of the Jew. The deliberate lie in the matter of religion was introduced into the world by Christianity....
"Let it not be said that Christianity brought man the life of the soul, for that evolution was in the natural order of things."

Hitler 1941.

I think the only significant conclusion that can be reached about Hitler is that he was a prevariacating fuckwit.

He did. He was an occultist.

Hitler wasn't an occultist per se. He was part of the Thule Society (or Thulegesellschaft), a secret society that had a set of beliefs in, yes, the occult. A set of beliefs, mind you, that was discredited even BEFORE their time.

Not every free-mason is an occultist, not every occultist is a free-mason. And so it goes.

"Secular schools can never be tolerated because such schools have no religious instruction, and a general moral instruction without religious foundation is built on air; consequently all character training and religion must be derived from faith . . ."

Hitler 1933.

"National Socialism and religion cannot exist together....
"The heaviest blow that ever struck humanity was the coming of Christianity. Bolshevism is Christianity's illegitimate child. Both are inventions of the Jew. The deliberate lie in the matter of religion was introduced into the world by Christianity....
"Let it not be said that Christianity brought man the life of the soul, for that evolution was in the natural order of things."

Hitler 1941.

I think the only significant conclusion that can be reached about Hitler is that he was a prevariacating fuckwit.
Pretty much, yes, although the first quote could be put in the context of any religion (Buddhism, Neo-Paganism, Universalist Unitarianism, etc).

Pretty much, yes, although the first quote could be put in the context of any religion (Buddhism, Neo-Paganism, Universalist Unitarianism, etc).

True, but:

"National Socialism neither opposes the Church nor is it anti-religious, but on the contrary it stands on the ground of a real Christianity . . . For their interests cannot fail to coincide with ours alike in our fight against the symptoms of degeneracy in the world of today, in our fight against a Bolshevist culture, against atheistic movement, against criminality, and in our struggle for a consciousness of a community in our national life . . . These are not anti-Christian, these are Christian principles!"

Hitler 1934.

puts the other quote in more context.

(who would have thought an essay from a barely passed politics course would have had a real life application?)

AH's occultism is often exaggerated. As far as I recall he wasn't a member of the Thule society, but a number (two or three) of those who founded what would become the NSDAP were.

AH's occultism is often exaggerated. As far as I recall he wasn't a member of the Thule society, but a number (two or three) of those who founded what would become the NSDAP were.

Yeah, or that. I don't study much about thulegesellschaft the same way a geographer doesn't study much the maps of the Flat Earth Society.

Franco?yes Franco was a Christian and so were Hitler and Pinochet.

yes Franco was a Christian and so were Hitler and Pinochet.
Franco was a Christian. Hitler was not and in fact he and his top National-Socialists planned that National-Socialism would be the new 'religion' and tried to make a cult around Hitler. Not to mention that Hitler beleived in occultist theories about Aryan supermen and such...there's tons of Nazi mythology.

Also, Pinochet was not a fascist. Fascism is the merge of government and business, so that all business works for the government. Under Pinochet, most business was returned to the people and taken AWAY from the government. You know, the business that the previous socialist/communist government took away from the people, the rightful owners of said businesses.

That is exactly what he is doing, and he is going to get the response he desires too.

And then he's going to sit around and whine about how Islam's all violent when he gets it.

Tell me IDF, what do you think would happen if a skinhead in full SS regalia walked into a militant orthodox Jewish enclave yelling about the inferiority of the non-Aryans and that they'd burn?

Yes this guy has the right under freedom of speech to do this, but when a pissed off Muslim comes and slits his throat in the street, the rest of us are entitled to sigh and say 'told you so'.

Tell me IDF, what do you think would happen if a skinhead in full SS regalia walked into a militant orthodox Jewish enclave yelling about the inferiority of the non-Aryans and that they'd burn?
Militant?

Yes this guy has the right under freedom of speech to do this, but when a pissed off Muslim comes and slits his throat in the street, the rest of us are entitled to sigh and say 'told you so'.
No. Maybe you'll do that but most sane individuals would not just "sigh" and accept murder as a retaliation to insult. We are more civilized than that, animal.

Militant?
Israel: Only nation to shrine a terrorist.

Israel: Only nation to shrine a terrorist.
Hmm? No, sorry that's totally false. I beleive any nation that has an "indepence day" or fought for indepence shrines a "terrorist".

Sorry, you just sucked ass n' balls and totally lost that debate.

No. Maybe you'll do that but most sane individuals would not just "sigh" and accept murder as a retaliation to insult. We are more civilized than that, animal.
Power is power friend, and actions have consequences - just because these consequences do not conform with your 'official' liberal concept of 'rights', does not mean they are not valid.

Militant?

Extremist, whatever. Are you seriously trying to tell me that Jews have some magical lack of screwloose people that every other demographic has fielded before?

Power is power friend, and actions have consequences - just because these consequences do not conform with your 'official' liberal concept of 'rights', does not mean they are not valid.
Right or wrong? To kill in response to a simple insult is bad. Right or wrong? It's a 1 word answer.
Extremist, whatever. Are you seriously trying to tell me that Jews have some magical lack of screwloose people?
Show me an incident when Jews have rioted, killed and called for the death of certain person when someone said they don't like Judaism and think it's a bad religion.

Right or wrong? To kill in response to a simple insult is bad. Right or wrong? It's a 1 word answer.

You might be unwilling to read more than one word, but "RIGHT OR WRONG ANSWER NOW?" is not a legitimate way to frame a question because not everyone believes, as you (and Islamic terrorists, incidentally) do in things that are inherently wrong from some sort of universally objective position. (Or inherently right.)

Show me an incident when Jews have rioted, killed and called for the death of certain person when someone said they don't like Judaism and think it's a bad religion.

This didn't answer his question at all. Did you think it was a 1 word question?

Show me an incident when Jews have rioted, killed and called for the death of certain person when someone said they don't like Judaism and think it's a bad religion.

Your shifting of goalposts only goes to show just how non-existent your argument is.

Explain the torching of Israeli crematoriums. The assassination of Israel's prime minister.

Done by Jews, against Jews, for extremist views.

Jews are no better or worse than the rest of humanity. And that includes having screwloose idiots in their group.

There is no right or wrong, only power to act and the willingness to do so. If this guy gets killed it's because it could be done and it was the natural consequence of his actions.

Show me an incident when Jews have rioted, killed and called for the death of certain person when someone said they don't like Judaism and think it's a bad religion.

Well, according to certain christians there was this guy called Jesus....

Are you serious?

Yeah. Why?

Note that I made a typo when I made the thread. It's Satan and Swastika, not Satan Swastika.

Israel: Only nation to shrine a terrorist.

Most nations do.

yes Franco was a Christian and so were Hitler and Pinochet.

Franco and Pinochet were Catholics. Hitler was an occultist. And Pinochet was not a fascist. A tyrant, yes, but not a fascist.

Yeah. Why?

Note that I made a typo when I made the thread. It's Satan and Swastika, not Satan Swastika.

Because you are referencing an author who, lets face it, has about as much academic gravitas as David Irving.

Yes this guy has the right under freedom of speech to do this, but when a pissed off Muslim comes and slits his throat in the street, the rest of us are entitled to sigh and say 'told you so'.

I don't know about the credentials of this particular film maker, but the idea that one should refrain from "offending" muslims because muslims might then become violent is what is called as dhimmitude.

This "Islam means peace and Allah is most merciful and if you don't agree with that I am going to kill you" cannot go on.

I don't know about the credentials of this particular film maker, but the idea that one should refrain from "offending" muslims because muslims might then become violent is what is called as dhimmitude.

This "Islam means peace and Allah is most merciful and if you don't agree with that I am going to kill you" cannot go on.

A bit like the Christian 'thou shalt not kill'.....

Yay! I love the Netherlands. Free speech ftw.

You would actively support a film that sets out to portray Christians as worshippers of fascism and murder?

As always, I feel very sorry for ordinary, normal Muslims (particularly those I know personally). Once again they find themselves wedged between a minority of hateful religious extremist morons and a bunch of hateful Islamophobic morons too bloody stupid to understand that an extremist minority does not equate with normal Muslim behaviour.

It must be tough to be a Muslim in the West. Especially when you're a particularly intelligent person hounded by idiots on both sides. :(

On a somewhat related topic:

When Muslim-dominated states like Kano adopted Islamic law after the fall of military rule in 1999, radical clerics from the Arabian peninsula arrived in droves to preach a draconian brand of fundamentalism, and newly empowered religious judges handed down tough punishments like amputation for theft. [...]

But since then, much of the furor has died down, and the practice of Islamic law, or Shariah, which had gone on for centuries in the private sphere before becoming enshrined in public law, has settled into a distinctively Nigerian compromise between the dictates of faith and the chaotic realities of modern life in an impoverished, developing nation.

[...] Facing backlash from citizens and criticism from human rights groups at home and abroad, state governments that had swiftly enacted Shariah and embraced its harshest tenets are now shifting the emphasis from the punishments and prohibitions to a softer approach that emphasizes other tenets of Muslim law, like charity, women's rights and the duty of Muslims to keep their environment clean.

[...] New programs have sprung up to encourage parents to send their daughters to hybrid public elementary schools that offer traditional Islamic education along with math and reading, in keeping with Islamic principles that call for the education of girls. In many of these classrooms, girls outnumber boys, and the United States Agency for International Development is so impressed with the potential of these programs that one third of the schools it supports across Nigeria are integrated Islamic and secular, according to officials at the agency.

State officials are using Islamic exhortations on cleanliness to encourage recycling of the plastic bags that choke landfills and gutters. One governor, citing the Islamic duty to care for the indigent, recently instituted a monthly stipend for disabled beggars.

"Our approach is a humane Shariah, not a punitive Shariah," said Bala Muhammad, director of a state program in Kano called A Daidaita Sahu.


(link (http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/12/01/africa/01shariah.php#end_main))

Yes, there is a problem with some Muslims. Unquestionably. But that problem is fuelled, not abated, by the many idiots whose minds are too simple, limited and filled with prejudice and hate to understand that not all Muslims are the same. The media and bigots alike focus on minority extremism because it makes for sensationalist news. And that's particularly sad.

So let's wait and see how bad the next round of riots are in The Netherlands and how tolerant and peaceful the religion of Islam really is.
So during the so-called cartoon controvercy...

How many of the aprox. one million dutch muslims were out in the streets, rioting violently?

How many were rioting at all?

So during the so-called cartoon controvercy...

How many of the aprox. one million dutch muslims were out in the streets, rioting violently?

How many were rioting at all?

One million Schroedinger's Muslims were rioting. However, the quantum waveform is in a state of constant flux, and attempts at observation does not collapse it, leaving them as possibles rioters which to the uninitiated, or factually inhibited, appear to be solid rioters. :p

Militant?


Like the nuts with beards in Hebron. Militant.

Because you are referencing an author who, lets face it, has about as much academic gravitas as David Irving.

I just read the one book. I know nothing about the author other than that.

Anyone want to join me in a flim making fun of atheists?

Last time I checked, Atheists don't have a book where you can search for statements that sound ridiculous to a modern audience.

http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/8836/muslimfeministdz4.jpg

Just to mess up the brains of the simple-minded. :p

I just read the one book. I know nothing about the author other than that.

So you base your premise that Hitler was an occultist on a book you once read but never bothered to check for veracity...

Do you see the problem here?

You would actively support a film that sets out to portray Christians as worshippers of fascism and murder?

As always, I feel very sorry for ordinary, normal Muslims (particularly those I know personally). Once again they find themselves wedged between a minority of hateful religious extremist morons and a bunch of hateful Islamophobic morons too bloody stupid to understand that an extremist minority does not equate with normal Muslim behaviour.

It must be tough to be a Muslim in the West. Especially when you're a particularly intelligent person hounded by idiots on both sides. :(

I'll even go far as to say that mainstream polite Muslims in the 21st century are filling in the spot that used to be occupied by Jews until the late 20th century; that of the alien entity that people can bait, insult, mock, profane, threaten and do all sorts of socially haram things without any bit of guilt. Now hopefully given the advances in human society this kind of bullshit bandwagon masturbation over "t3h 3b1l m05l3mz" will stop long before it gets to the point of a Final Solution for the Muslim Question, but if it somehow manages to get to that point before people wake up I'll only be mildly surprised by it.

A Dutch film maker, law maker actually, is going to make a film that highlights the fascist parts of the Koran. Good for him.

HJopefully he'll follow up with a film to highlight the fascist parts of the Bible and the Torah, just for good measure.

So, who wants to join me in making a film for the express purpose of insulting the beliefs of Christians?

Most movies nowadays already insult the beliefs of Christians.

I'll even go far as to say that mainstream polite Muslims in the 21st century are filling in the spot that used to be occupied by Jews until the late 20th century; that of the alien entity that people can bait, insult, mock, profane, threaten and do all sorts of socially haram things without any bit of guilt. Now hopefully given the advances in human society this kind of bullshit bandwagon masturbation over "t3h 3b1l m05l3mz" will stop long before it gets to the point of a Final Solution for the Muslim Question, but if it somehow manages to get to that point before people wake up I'll only be mildly surprised by it.

What does "t3h 3b1l m05l3mz" mean?

Most movies nowadays already insult the beliefs of Christians.

Care to name a few?

So, who wants to join me in making a film for the express purpose of insulting the beliefs of Christians?

Already done many times, and I bet WAAAAY more times than movies made criticizing Islam.

Try something original MMMKAY? ;)

Already done many times, and I bet WAAAAY more times than movies made criticizing Islam.

Try something original MMMKAY? ;)

Do people here not understand the meaning of the words 'express purpose of insulting the beliefs of Christians?' or something? Seriously, how many films have been made for no other reason than to insult and anger as many Cristians as possible?

Do people here not understand the meaning of the words 'express purpose of insulting the beliefs of Christians?' or something? Seriously, how many films have been made for no other reason than to insult and anger as many Cristians as possible?

Lets see, theres the masters of horror episode about abortion, theres "The Suckling" (again about abortion), in most movies there a subtle messages making the priest or the conservative religious guy who is uptight about tradition look evil.

Seriously, its only the neurotic hypocritical Christians that cause problems anyway, the kind of Christians which Jesus said in the Bible are not really Christians but pretend to be are the only bad ones. They're the guys who blow up abortion clinics, brainwash, start weird sects like the Branch Davidians or Waco church. Why waste time and energy trying to piss off the religion in general when all the good ones are practically just normal people only with certain beleifs? More movies should be made pissing off the bad ones rather than the religion as a whole.

What does "t3h 3b1l m05l3mz" mean?

It means: The Evil Muslims..

;)

Why waste time and energy trying to piss off the religion in general when all the good ones are practically just normal people only with certain beleifs? More movies should be made pissing off the bad ones rather than the religion as a whole.

Good idea. I'm glad you believe films should focus on the minority of Muslim extremists rather than try to piss off all Muslims just for the sheer bigoted fun of it.

Why waste time and energy trying to piss off the religion in general when all the good ones are practically just normal people only with certain beleifs?

Some people believe that the core ideas of those religions are already problematic. Worship and loyalty directed at a non human lifeform ? Worship and loyalty directed at the wrong human lifeform ? Obeying the rules only because they are Gods/Allahs/G-ds rules, not because you have determined them to be the natural endresult of logical thought ? Obeying the rules of an in your eyes false God ?

The list of problems one can have with the religion as such, regardless of the actual behaviour of its followers, is quite impressive.

Compare it with childmolesters: they can be extremely decent persons, pillars of the community - yet there is that one part of them that kinda nulllifies it all. Some people have similar feelings when dealing with believers from certain religions.

I don't know about the credentials of this particular film maker, but the idea that one should refrain from "offending" muslims because muslims might then become violent is what is called as dhimmitude.

This "Islam means peace and Allah is most merciful and if you don't agree with that I am going to kill you" cannot go on.
Out of all religions (and this is saying alot), Islam is the most backward, reactionary and downright fanatically blind of all of them, this is mostly patently obvious. This does not excuse however someone from using their intelligence, no matter if it's 'right' or 'wrong'.

"The Suckling" (again about abortion),

So that's one, maybe.

So that's one, maybe.

No, that's not one. (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0140581/) It's a horror movie, about abortion. And abortion is not only a christian issue.


Hell, even Life of Brian probably wouldn't fall into the category you mentioned...

So, any massive Muslim protests yet?

Seems to have become trendy, this. And this is how it should be done:

The autobiography of outspoken Progress Party politician Carl I. Hagen "Ærlig talt" - Speaking Honestly - has offended Norwegian Muslims.

A passage where the controversial Hagen calls the prophet Mohammed a warlord, man of violence and abuser of women has, unsurprisingly, caused offense.

"That the Islamic council is disappointed and angry and furious is as expected. I had more or less counted on this to happen when I wrote that," Hagen told newspaper Vårt Land.

Norway's Islamic Council asked Norwegian Muslims to refrain from reacting to Hagen's book.

Hagen's remarks come in connection with the massive trouble linked to the publication of caricatures of the prophet Mohammed.

Hagen writes that the government's handling of the matter led to freedom of speech "taking a back seat to respect for the warlord, man of violence and woman abuser Mohammed, who murdered and accepted rape as a method of conquest".
Link (http://www.aftenposten.no/english/local/article2093629.ece)

So the vice-president of the Norwegian parliament writes this, just to rile up the muslims apparently ("More or less counted on it") and what do the Islamic council do?

They ask fellow muslims not to react to the book or its passage. The General Secretary, Shoaib Sultan, simply said that the attack on the prophet was a cheap trick to boost sales and not worth commenting on. (http://www.magazinet.no/artikkel.asp?Artid=10497)

It means: The Evil Muslims..

;)

Well, if it means "the evil muslims", then why didn't he just say "the evil muslims" instead of "t3h 3b1l m05l3mz"? I can't read 1337!

Seems to have become trendy, this. And this is how it should be done:


Link (http://www.aftenposten.no/english/local/article2093629.ece)

So the vice-president of the Norwegian parliament writes this, just to rile up the muslims apparently ("More or less counted on it") and what do the Islamic council do?

They ask fellow muslims not to react to the book or its passage. The General Secretary, Shoaib Sultan, simply said that the attack on the prophet was a cheap trick to boost sales and not worth commenting on. (http://www.magazinet.no/artikkel.asp?Artid=10497)
I hope this gets deeply etched on to the retinas of more than a few of our fellow NSGers.

Out of all religions (and this is saying alot), Islam is the most backward, reactionary and downright fanatically blind of all of them, this is mostly patently obvious.

No, it isn't. It's not true, and it is, thus, not "obvious" either. You claim it's "obvious" as a poor attempt to prevent any questioning of your misguided statement. For the same reason that if I said "EA is obviously a pedophile" less people would stop to think about that allegation's factual value than if I simply stated - with as much proof as YOU state this about Islam, mind you - that you are one.

This is a variant of "have you stopped beating up your wife" questions. Too bad it does not work on me.

Juu nen hayaku.

Well, if it means "the evil muslims", then why didn't he just say "the evil muslims" instead of "t3h 3b1l m05l3mz"? I can't read 1337!

It's sarcasm when written in 1337.

So the vice-president of the Norwegian parliament writes this, just to rile up the muslims apparently ("More or less counted on it") and what do the Islamic council do?

They ask fellow muslims not to react to the book or its passage. The General Secretary, Shoaib Sultan, simply said that the attack on the prophet was a cheap trick to boost sales and not worth commenting on. (http://www.magazinet.no/artikkel.asp?Artid=10497)

Good on you, Mr. Sultan.

Hagen, by the way, seems to be ignoring (deliberately or not) the Christian Crusaders' rather dubious record in terms of respecting human rights. And if he's criticising what happened even longer ago...

So you base your premise that Hitler was an occultist on a book you once read but never bothered to check for veracity...

Do you see the problem here?

I don't care who wrote the book, as long as they cite credible sources. The author could be Ronald-fucking-McDonald for all I care.

I suppose those who hate all Muslims believe that Baroness Warsi and Lord Ahmed (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7123420.stm) are "evil" too?

A Dutch film maker, law maker actually, is going to make a film that highlights the fascist parts of the Koran. Good for him.

His colleagues are concerned that they can't prevent the ten minute movie's screening. Jeers to them.

Of course all this will end badly -- a movie called Submission which was a fictional study of abused Muslim women with scenes of near-naked women with Quranic texts engraved on their flesh. The director of Submission died after a Moslem extremist shot him and slit his throat.

So let's wait and see how bad the next round of riots are in The Netherlands and how tolerant and peaceful the religion of Islam really is.

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/11/28/europe/EU-GEN-Netherlands-Anti-Quran-Film.php

When's the Christian version coming out?

I suppose those who hate all Muslims believe that Baroness Warsi and Lord Ahmed (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7123420.stm) are "evil" too?

Prolly. Motivation matters after all - and doing the right thing for the wrong reasons sets a dangerous precedent. You never know what those wrong reasons will tell you to do next.

When's the Christian version coming out?

Never. Wilders just dislikes foreigners with "weird" cultures. He is a wild haired populist.

Never. Wilders just dislikes foreigners with "weird" cultures. He is a wild haired populist.

No kidding:p And I have to put up with him....*shakes Head*

Evidence?

I haven't done enough study to make a claim about this, but it would appear as though the Nazis had some occult influence. Wiki gives these as reliable online sources:


The Occult Roots of Nazism by Nicholas Goodrick-Clarke (http://www.lapismagazine.org/content/view/54/2/) - Short article at www.lapismagazine.org
Magic Realism - A book review (http://www.ewtn.com/library/NEWAGE/NAZIOCCU.TXT) by William Main of The Occult Roots of Nazism, taken from the December 1994 issue of "Fidelity" Magazine
Nationalsozialismus und Okkultismus? Die Thule-Gesellschaft (http://www.relinfo.ch/thule/info.html) (German) Article on an information page from the Swiss Reformed Church
NARA Research Room: Captured German and Related Records on Microform in the National Archives: Captured German Records Filmed at Berlin (American Historical Association, 1960). Microfilm Publication T580. 1,002 rolls (http://www.archives.gov/research/captured-german-records/foreign-records-seized.html#berlin), including among, others, files of the Ahnenerbe and the Nachlass of Walter Darré.
Hitler and the Occult: Nazism, Reincarnation, and Rock Culture (http://www.ewtn.com/library/NEWAGE/HITLEROC.TXT)
White Blood, White Gods: An Assessment of Racialist Paganism in the United States (https://kb.osu.edu/dspace/bitstream/1811/6559/1/White%2520Blood.pdf) A Senior Honors Thesis by Damon Berry in June 2006.

I don't care who wrote the book, as long as they cite credible sources. The author could be Ronald-fucking-McDonald for all I care.

What credible sources? You just quoted the title of some book as proof that Hitler was a occulist. Now you trot this out...

Nah...your position is untenable.

Had you said that there is evidence of the occult in the SS officer corp then I would be in agreement. However there is no direct evidence that Hitler was a occulist.

Out of all religions (and this is saying alot), Islam is the most backward, reactionary and downright fanatically blind of all of them, this is mostly patently obvious. This does not excuse however someone from using their intelligence, no matter if it's 'right' or 'wrong'.

No, the Koran/Qu'ran has no more violence than the Christian bible. There is nothing inherently evil about Islam anymore then other religions (whether or not there is something inherently evil about religion is a debate for another time/thread).
Historically, Islam is actually a lot better then Christianity and possibly Judism. Recent violence that is associated with Islam is due to turmoil caused by the Armistice of Mudros, the Treaty of Sèvres and the Treaty of Lausanne and just the poverty and strife that resulted from the west messing with their lives.

So, who wants to join me in making a film for the express purpose of insulting the beliefs of Christians?

Thats already been done a million times over.

There have been lots of movies saying Christianity is a load of rubbish and there haven't been any riots or murderings over it. But when someone makes a movie critasising Islam, all hell always seems to break loose. Its like those cartoons from Sweeden (I think, i dont remember) and hell broke loose. But in Islam countries such as Egypt, they are always making cartoons mocking the West and Chrisianity. They even burn the flags of Western countries.

has there been any riots over this yet?

But when someone makes a movie critasising Islam, all hell always seems to break loose.

When you say "alll hell breaks loose" you mean that Myrmidonisia started a thread to whine?

Meh, Wilders (the film maker) is just an idiot. He only wants to divide the dutch population and spread hate and fear. Besides, we (the dutch tax payer) pay for his security. If he's stupid enough to attract more death threats I think the dutch government should stop paying for his security.

Freedom of speech is important but there are limits. If you abuse freedom of speech to spead hatred and to ignite the muslem population it would be your own fault if you get killed.

Superb.

Regarding Baroness Warsi, I do not think she is evil. A tedious, banal, uninspiring politician elevated only because she is ethnic, and whose title leaves the moniker "Baroness" bereft of value, but evil? No.

I am desperate to be informed as to what Warsi has done to merit the same title as Baroness Thatcher.

A Dutch film maker, law maker actually, is going to make a film that highlights the fascist parts of the Koran. Good for him.

His colleagues are concerned that they can't prevent the ten minute movie's screening. Jeers to them.

Of course all this will end badly -- a movie called Submission which was a fictional study of abused Muslim women with scenes of near-naked women with Quranic texts engraved on their flesh. The director of Submission died after a Moslem extremist shot him and slit his throat.

So let's wait and see how bad the next round of riots are in The Netherlands and how tolerant and peaceful the religion of Islam really is.

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/11/28/europe/EU-GEN-Netherlands-Anti-Quran-Film.php
If it's highlighting the fascist passages of the koran it will be a very long film!
:)

If it's highlighting the fascist passages of the koran it will be a very long film!
:)

By all means, prove your statement or lose the argument.

If it's highlighting the fascist passages of the koran it will be a very long film!
:)
:rolleyes:

A Dutch film maker, law maker actually, is going to make a film that highlights the fascist parts of the Koran. Good for him.

His colleagues are concerned that they can't prevent the ten minute movie's screening. Jeers to them.

Of course all this will end badly -- a movie called Submission which was a fictional study of abused Muslim women with scenes of near-naked women with Quranic texts engraved on their flesh. The director of Submission died after a Moslem extremist shot him and slit his throat.

So let's wait and see how bad the next round of riots are in The Netherlands and how tolerant and peaceful the religion of Islam really is.

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/11/28/europe/EU-GEN-Netherlands-Anti-Quran-Film.php

Interesting, and the individual is quiet on the bible too - when are we going to see a balanced film?

What credible sources? You just quoted the title of some book as proof that Hitler was a occulist. Now you trot this out...

Nah...your position is untenable.

Had you said that there is evidence of the occult in the SS officer corp then I would be in agreement. However there is no direct evidence that Hitler was a occulist.

In fact, what I've read seems to suggest that the Nazi party leaders tried to distance themselves from it as not to alienate the churches, or some such.

I hope this gets deeply etched on to the retinas of more than a few of our fellow NSGers.

I wouldn't hold my breath.

A Dutch film maker, law maker actually, is going to make a film that highlights the fascist parts of the Koran. Good for him.

His colleagues are concerned that they can't prevent the ten minute movie's screening. Jeers to them.

Of course all this will end badly -- a movie called Submission which was a fictional study of abused Muslim women with scenes of near-naked women with Quranic texts engraved on their flesh. The director of Submission died after a Moslem extremist shot him and slit his throat.

So let's wait and see how bad the next round of riots are in The Netherlands and how tolerant and peaceful the religion of Islam really is.

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/11/28/europe/EU-GEN-Netherlands-Anti-Quran-Film.php

This guy is admirable...in a wierd way. He's also going to set off a shitload of riots.

By all means, prove your statement or lose the argument.

I refer you to the koran

Here's a question:

Is it alright to provoke people who oppose freedom of expression and western cultural freedom and government to riot so that they will self-identify and break the law and then crack down on them?

I think it is.

Here's a question:

Is it alright to provoke people who oppose freedom of expression and western cultural freedom and government to riot so that they will self-identify and break the law and then crack down on them?

I think it is.

Oh, yeah. Let's cause people to commit crimes. Then we know who the criminals are! Sure, we've just increased crime, and people will die, but now we can have prosecution for crimes that wouldn't have happened had we not provoked them!

WHY DIDNT I THINK OF THAT!

Perhaps because it's STUPID? I think so.

Oh, yeah. Let's cause people to commit crimes. Then we know who the criminals are! Sure, we've just increased crime, and people will die, but now we can have prosecution for crimes that wouldn't have happened had we not provoked them!

WHY DIDNT I THINK OF THAT!

Perhaps because it's STUPID? I think so.

Provocation does not cause someone to do something, a person's volition causes him to do something.

In this case, a person's degenerate religiosity would inform their decision to lash out and break the law.

It's better to find out who these people are when they're out irate throwing rocks than after they murder film makers and plant bombs.

I don't think I need to speculate why you didnt think of that.

Just what this forum needed -- another "Myrmidonisia goes off on an anti-Islam rant" thread.:rolleyes: Nearly all religions either have or are currently committing atrocities in the name of God, including Christianity. Did you actually have a legitimate point to make, or are you just shouting into the vacuum?

I refer you to the koran

And I refer you to the Bible. What's your point?

And I refer you to the Bible. What's your point?

And I refer you both to the necronomicon (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Necronomicon). Atrocities are continuously committed in Cthulhu's name....and he approves.

Provocation does not cause someone to do something, a person's volition causes him to do something.


Yes. But, in the real world, there are influences that people have on each other. For example, if you were having a funeral ceremony for your old woman, and I crashed it with ten of my buddies all carrying placards villifying her and shouting "GOD IS HAPPY THAT THE BITCH IS DEAD" or something, you might be provoked into doing something that your volition would not, in the neat vacuum you suppose it exists in, normally do.

Or you could be a robot.

In this case, a person's degenerate religiosity would inform their decision to lash out and break the law.

It's better to find out who these people are when they're out irate throwing rocks than after they murder film makers and plant bombs.

Wait, so NOW you're saying not to provoke them to "murder film makers," but merely to "throw rocks." Such fine control you must have over people, that you can provoke them this much, but not that much, and that you know the consequences in every case.

Causing crime to stop criminals? You yourself are advocating murder, just so you can get to feel like some sort of vicarious detective for "exposing" the "degenerates." Either that or you're advocating magical superpowers that let you provoke non-harmful crimes without provoking harmful ones. And if magical superpowers are in play, then why not go the whole way and magic away the provokation AND crime with a wipe of your magic wand?

I don't think I need to speculate why you didnt think of that.

No you don't, because I've already said why.

Aaaaand the soap continues.
Our beloved filmmaker/politician/bunch of hair has proposed the Dutch constitution should be changed to allow discrimination against muslims.

To paraphrase his motivation:

"Christian and Jewish schools are fine - but Islam is not western and therefor not welcome"

Thoughts ?

Aaaaand the soap continues.
Our beloved filmmaker/politician/bunch of hair has proposed the Dutch constitution should be changed to allow discrimination against muslims.

To paraphrase his motivation:

"Christian and Jewish schools are fine - but Islam is not western and therefor not welcome"

Thoughts ?

Good grief? I thought he's just trolling for some response, not outright discrimination.

Well, seeing that they has been conquered once by a nation of militant discriminators, I should hope they remembered how much pain in the ass that was.

Aaaaand the soap continues.
Our beloved filmmaker/politician/bunch of hair has proposed the Dutch constitution should be changed to allow discrimination against muslims.

To paraphrase his motivation:

"Christian and Jewish schools are fine - but Islam is not western and therefor not welcome"

Thoughts ?

Yeah: He's an insane egomaniac that would introduce the Dutch version of the word "Führer" in their political vocabulary if possible. Furthermore, he obviously knows jack shit about the history of his own country or Europe, for that matter.

Good grief? I thought he's just trolling for some response, not outright discrimination.

Well, seeing that they has been conquered once by a nation of militant discriminators, I should hope they remembered how much pain in the ass that was.

It's abuse. People almost never learn from it without help. In fact they tend to end up committing abuses themselves.

Aaaaand the soap continues.
Our beloved filmmaker/politician/bunch of hair has proposed the Dutch constitution should be changed to allow discrimination against muslims.

To paraphrase his motivation:

"Christian and Jewish schools are fine - but Islam is not western and therefor not welcome"

Thoughts ?
I would have said it differently. Something along the lines of "As long as fathers murder (http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/toronto/archive/2007/12/11/girl-16-dies-after-hijab-dispute-with-father.aspx) their daughters for trivial acts of disobedience, practitioners of Islam are unwelcome here."

Aqsa Parvez could not be reached for comment.

I would have said it differently. Something along the lines of "As long as fathers murder (http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/toronto/archive/2007/12/11/girl-16-dies-after-hijab-dispute-with-father.aspx) their daughters for trivial acts of disobedience, practitioners of Islam are unwelcome here."

Aqsa Parvez could not be reached for comment.

Hmmm, generalization is so unbecoming... atleast there's one more psychotic person less in society.

Hmmm, generalization is so unbecoming... atleast there's one more psychotic person less in society.
And you know what's worse than generalization? The resigned acceptance that we exhibit toward these acts is far worse than anything I can say about Islam and its followers.

And you know what's worse than generalization? The resigned acceptance that we exhibit toward these acts is far worse than anything I can say about Islam and its followers.

...ummmm, surprisingly if you ask, most of the Islams in the world doesn't condone on filicide.

Most of the even hardliners only resort to disownment rather killings.

But what do I know, I don't take polls.

And you know what's worse than generalization? The resigned acceptance that we exhibit toward these acts is far worse than anything I can say about Islam and its followers.

You do realize that Honor Killing is rooted in pre-Islamic traditions and has a lot more to do with geocultural values rather than anything specific to Islam? I also don't know what "resigned acceptance" you're talking about; the vast majority, and I mean vast, condemns such acts.

But, hey, while we're making broad generalizations about shit we really know nothing about: your sidebar says you're from Georgia. Well, I've not been there, but I've been to Tennessee and I've seen some pretty fucking bigoted behavior there so I'm entirely justified by extrapolating from this to assume that all people from the South are close-minded, uneducated and generally ignorant bigots, because I saw a number of examples of this in Tennessee which is obviously representative of the larger whole.

You see how this type of thinking is worthless and counter-productive?

You do realize that Honor Killing is rooted in pre-Islamic traditions and has a lot more to do with geocultural values rather than anything specific to Islam? I also don't know what "resigned acceptance" you're talking about; the vast majority, and I mean vast, condemns such acts.

But, hey, while we're making broad generalizations about shit we really know nothing about: your sidebar says you're from Georgia. Well, I've not been there, but I've been to Tennessee and I've seen some pretty fucking bigoted behavior there so I'm entirely justified by extrapolating from this to assume that all people from the South are close-minded, uneducated and generally ignorant bigots, because I saw a number of examples of this in Tennessee which is obviously representative of the larger whole.

You see how this type of thinking is worthless and counter-productive?
I think you pretty much pegged Tennessee correctly. Alabama and Mississippi, too. We have too many Yankees from New York, Philly, and the Boston area to be a real Southern state anymore.

I think you pretty much pegged Tennessee correctly. Alabama and Mississippi, too. We have too many Yankees from New York, Philly, and the Boston area to be a real Southern state anymore.

Since you've chosen to exercise the No True Scotsman Clause, any future posts from you to the effect of ranting about how about all Muslims are the same are devalued.

I think you pretty much pegged Tennessee correctly. Alabama and Mississippi, too. We have too many Yankees from New York, Philly, and the Boston area to be a real Southern state anymore.

Well, it seems not quite enough to me.

Well, it seems not quite enough to me.
Hell, we're as bad as Florida. Native Georgians, sadly I am not one, have been steadily displaced by the carpet-baggers from the Northeast. That's bad enough, but lately even Californians have started ruining the neighborhoods with their zero-lot lines and stucco architecture. We even have a red tile roofed house on a little lake where I have a weekend place.

Soon enough, we'll be a State populated with a majority of residents that have lived here less than a decade.

...ummmm, surprisingly if you ask, most of the Islams in the world doesn't condone on filicide.

Most of the even hardliners only resort to disownment rather killings.

But what do I know, I don't take polls.
Maybe it's not condoned. But it is sure common enough to make the news every couple weeks. That we read about these killings at all is inexcusable.

Here's a question:

Is it alright to provoke people who oppose freedom of expression and western cultural freedom and government to riot so that they will self-identify and break the law and then crack down on them?

I think it is.

Ahhh, so you support Fred Phelps and his harassment of funerals then? And of course, if anyone attacks him, you would support their arrest?

After all, anyone who attempts to limit his haranguing must oppose freedom of expression and western cultural freedom.

I would have said it differently. Something along the lines of "As long as fathers murder (http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/toronto/archive/2007/12/11/girl-16-dies-after-hijab-dispute-with-father.aspx) their daughters for trivial acts of disobedience, practitioners of Islam are unwelcome here."


Ahhh, so for the crimes of the few, everyone must be punished. Well then, let's see. The Army of God is a Christian terrorist group. All Christians should be unwelcome where terrorists are unwelcome.

Oh look, some criminals are Americans. Americans should be unwelcome everywhere.

Ludicrous isn't it? But that's exactly what you are spouting.

And you know what's worse than generalization? The resigned acceptance that we exhibit toward these acts is far worse than anything I can say about Islam and its followers.

Let me know when the murderers get off scott free on the grounds of religion.

Maybe it's not condoned. But it is sure common enough to make the news every couple weeks. That we read about these killings at all is inexcusable.

Arguing for suppression of the press now are we?

Don't be ludicrous. Murders happen all the time. This one just happens to get in the news because it feeds the Muslim paranoia and makes great controversy. Why should the murderers get any different treatment under the measure of the law because of their motives or backgrounds? The law must fall on all equally.

Ohhh, but it does feed your bigotry, so of course extra measures must be taken. Real equality is only bigots like you. Everyone else must have an extra set of suppressive laws.

Good for you film-maker, good for you.

Soon enough, we'll be a State populated with a majority of residents that have lived here less than a decade.

Xenophobe? Just asking because that sounds like you would prefer no outsiders into your state.

Click Stand;13286667']Xenophobe? Just asking because that sounds like you would prefer no outsiders into your state.

He's got more phobias than I can count. It's like Batman's Scarecrow messed with his plumbing or something. =-p

The Golden Compass - in theaters this christmas ?
Brave little girl tries to kill senile Christian god and its catholic church ;)

Has been watered down at the behest of various Christian groups.

Yet I still hear Christians saying that they are planning on protesting it on opening day.

He's got more phobias than I can count. It's like Batman's Scarecrow messed with his plumbing or something. =-p
It is fun to shake the tree a little and see what falls out sometimes...

Yet I still hear Christians saying that they are planning on protesting it on opening day.
From my experience, most accusations of the Golden Compass being watered down come from here in the UK, while most complains about it being too radical seem to be from the US.

From my experience, most accusations of the Golden Compass being watered down come from here in the UK, while most complains about it being too radical seem to be from the US.

My main complaint is that the fuckers used the US name. Northern Lights is a far better name, and is actually relevant to the story. Though I haven't had the chance to see it yet, so I might update that when I do.

You know, after 169 posts in this thread I have to ask: Why is this thread still alive? Myrmi posted something idiotic, and got called on it repeatedly by page 2. What the hell are you all still talking about?

You know, after 169 posts in this thread I have to ask: Why is this thread still alive? Myrmi posted something idiotic, and got called on it repeatedly by page 2. What the hell are you all still talking about?

The guy made another statement. And while he might be a fruitcake, he is also a politician with a seat in the Dutch cabinet.

I would have said it differently. Something along the lines of "As long as fathers murder (http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/toronto/archive/2007/12/11/girl-16-dies-after-hijab-dispute-with-father.aspx) their daughters for trivial acts of disobedience, practitioners of Islam are unwelcome here."
So... Because the acts of one man, you would say that all of the people who happened to belong to the same faith as him would be unwelcome, even if he did something that was condemned by that religion. And you would also say that the murdered girl and others like her - others who won't wear the hijab - were not welcome either.

Way to respect her memory. :rolleyes:


Aqsa Parvez could not be reached for comment.
If she could, I'm sure she would give you an earful for your vile hypocrisy.